English

Cynulliad Cenedlaethol CymruNational Assembly for Wales · Cyfarfod llawnPlenary sitting

Dydd Iau 12 Gorffennaf 2001

Thursday 12 July 2001

DechreuoddMet 09:05 · Daeth i benRose 13:00

Gweld y Cofnod (PDF)View the Record (PDF)

Heb ei wirio â llaw etoNot yet checked by hand

CynnwysContents

  1. 3Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau CymdeithasolQuestions to the Minister for Health and Social Services
    1. 3Cynlluniau Talu UniongyrcholDirect Payment Schemes
    2. 4Nifer y Nyrsys a Doctoriaid dan Hyfforddiant yng NghymruNumber of Trainee Nurses and Doctors in Wales
    3. 6Gwella’r Cyfleoedd i Gael Gofal Iechyd o Ansawdd UchelImproving Access to High Quality Healthcare
    4. 8Meddygaeth Breifat yn y Gwasanaeth IechydPrivate Medical Practice within the Health Service
    5. 9Annog Bwydo o’r Fron yng NghymruPromoting Breastfeeding in Wales
  2. 11Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol OesQuestions to the Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning
    1. 11Cwrdd â’r Alwad am Addysg drwy Gyfrwng y GymraegMeeting Demand for Welsh-medium Education
    2. 13Hyrwyddo Cyfrifon Dysgu UnigolUptake of Individual Learning Accounts
    3. 14Problemau sy’n Wynebu Addysg Uwch yng NghymruProblems Facing Higher Education in Wales
    4. 16Amddiffyn Staff YsgolionProtecting School Staff
    5. 18Gwaith ELWaProgress Made by ELWa
  3. 19Cwestiynau i Bwyllgor y TŷQuestions to the House Committee
    1. 19Darparu Ffynhonnau DwrWater Fountain Facilities
    2. 20Cynllun Iaith Swyddfa’r Llywydd
    3. 21Welsh Language Scheme for the Presiding Office
    4. 22Darparu Lleoedd Parcio ar gyfer Staff CymorthCar Parking Spaces for Support Staff
    5. 24Datblygiadau Diweddaraf wrth Godi’r Siambr Ddadlau NewyddProgress of the Construction of the New Debating Chamber
    6. 25Gwella System OSIRIS yn Swyddfeydd Etholaethol AelodauImproving the OSIRIS System in Constituency Offices
    7. 26Perfformiad Amgylcheddol Adeilad Newydd y CynulliadEnvironmental Performance of the New Assembly Building
    8. 27Ystafell ar Gyfer Myfyrio neu AddoliRoom for Reflection or Worship
    9. 28Integreiddio CynaliadwyeddIntegrating Sustainabilty
  4. 29Pwyntiau o DrefnPoints of Order
  5. 32Rheoliadau Deddf yr Iaith GymraegThe Welsh Language Act Regulations 3 o bleidleisiau3 votes
  6. 48Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Cynlluniau Iaith Gymraeg (Cyrff Cyhoeddus) 2001Approval of the Welsh Language Schemes (Public Bodies) Order 2001 2 o bleidleisiau2 votes
  7. 51Y Strategaeth Tai GenedlaetholThe National Housing Strategy 12 o bleidleisiau12 votes
  8. 90Pwynt o DrefnPoint of Order
  9. 91Diwygio’r Penderfyniad ar Gyflogau a Lwfansau AelodauRevision of the Determination on Members’ Salaries and Allowances 1 bleidlais1 vote
  10. 93Cymeradwyo Newid Canlyniadol i Gynllun Pensiwn yr AelodauApproval of a Consequential Change to the Members’ Pension Scheme 1 bleidlais1 vote
  11. 95Diwygio Rheolau SefydlogRevision of Standing Orders 1 bleidlais1 vote
  12. 98Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion 1 bleidlais1 vote
  13. 100Adroddiad y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ar Arallgyfeirio yn yr Economi WledigThe Report of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee on the Diversification of the Rural Economy 1 bleidlais1 vote
  14. 115Datganiad gan y LlywyddStatement by the Presiding Officer
  15. 115Dadl FerShort Debate
    1. 115Cyfleoedd i gael Grantiau AnableddAccess to Disability Grants

PleidleisiauVotes

PleidlaisVoteO blaidForYmatalAbstainYn erbynAgainstCanlyniadResult
Rheoliadau Deddf yr Iaith GymraegThe Welsh Language Act Regulations
Gwelliant 1Amendment 122027GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 2Amendment 213035GwrthodwydRejected
Cynnig NDM737Motion NDM7374900DerbyniwydAdopted
Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Cynlluniau Iaith Gymraeg (Cyrff Cyhoeddus) 2001Approval of the Welsh Language Schemes (Public Bodies) Order 2001
Cynnig NDM738Motion NDM7384700DerbyniwydAdopted
Cynnig NDM739Motion NDM7394800DerbyniwydAdopted
Y Strategaeth Tai GenedlaetholThe National Housing Strategy
Gwelliant 1Amendment 121024GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 2Amendment 24500DerbyniwydAdopted
Gwelliant 3Amendment 39036GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 4Amendment 421025GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 5Amendment 521024GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 6Amendment 69037GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 7Amendment 74500DerbyniwydAdopted
Gwelliant 8Amendment 834120DerbyniwydAdopted
Gwelliant 9Amendment 921025GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 10Amendment 1012925GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 11Amendment 113709DerbyniwydAdopted
Cynnig NDM740Motion NDM7404500DerbyniwydAdopted
Diwygio’r Penderfyniad ar Gyflogau a Lwfansau AelodauRevision of the Determination on Members’ Salaries and Allowances
Cynnig NDM742Motion NDM7424500DerbyniwydAdopted
Cymeradwyo Newid Canlyniadol i Gynllun Pensiwn yr AelodauApproval of a Consequential Change to the Members’ Pension Scheme
Cynnig NDM743Motion NDM7434500DerbyniwydAdopted
Diwygio Rheolau SefydlogRevision of Standing Orders
CynnigMotion4500DerbyniwydAdopted
Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion
Cynnig trefniadolProcedural motion4600DerbyniwydAdopted
Adroddiad y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ar Arallgyfeirio yn yr Economi WledigThe Report of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee on the Diversification of the Rural Economy
Cynnig NDM711Motion NDM7113500DerbyniwydAdopted

TrafodionProceedings

Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 9.05 a.m. gyda’r Llywydd yn y Gadair.

The Assembly met at 9.05 a.m. with the Presiding Officer in the Chair.

Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol

Questions to the Minister for Health and Social Services

Cynlluniau Talu Uniongyrchol

Direct Payment Schemes

C1 Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 3

Q1 Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 3

Sut y mae’r Gweinidog yn bwriadu hybu defnyddio cynlluniau talu uniongyrchol yng Nghymru? (OAQ12626)

How does the Minister intend to promote the use of direct payment schemes in Wales? (OAQ12626)

Jane Hutt The Minister for Health and Social Services spoken in English p. 3

Jane Hutt Y Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

The National Assembly continues to encourage people to exercise greater choice and control over their lives. Direct payments contribute to this approach. Over the last 12 months we have extended the eligibility of the scheme to encompass people aged over 65, carers, persons with parental responsibility for disabled children and 16 and 17-year-old disabled children.

Mae’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn parhau i annog pobl i arfer mwy o ddewis a rheolaeth dros eu bywydau. Mae taliadau uniongyrchol yn cyfrannu at yr ymagwedd hon. Dros y 12 mis diwethaf yr ydym wedi ymestyn cymhwyster y cynllun i gwmpasu pobl dros 65 oed, gofalwyr, pobl â chyfrifoldeb rhiant dros blant anabl a phlant anabl 16 ac 17 oed.

Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 3

Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 3

Er mwyn i’r cynllun hwn weithio’n effeithiol, mae angen datblygu strwythurau cryf i gefnogi’r rhai sydd yn derbyn taliadau uniongyrchol. A oes gennych gynlluniau i gyfeirio cyllid tuag at ddatblygu strwythurau o’r fath yn y sector gwirfoddol?

For this scheme to work effectively, strong structures must be developed to support those who receive direct payments. Do you have plans to direct finance towards developing such structures in the voluntary sector?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 3

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

It is important to provide policy and practice guidance to all the local authorities that will implement this scheme. That has been done and guidance has been distributed to all local authorities. Disability Wales, Cardiff and Vale Coalition of Disabled People and the Shaw Trust provide support, advice and guidance to the local authorities interested in pursuing this scheme.

Mae’n bwysig darparu arweiniad polisi ac ymarfer i’r holl awdurdodau lleol a fydd yn gweithredu’r cynllun hwn. Gwnaethpwyd hynny a dosbarthwyd arweiniad i bob awdurdod lleol. Mae Anabledd Cymru, Clymblaid Pobl Anabl Caerdydd a’r Fro ac Ymddiriedolaeth Shaw yn darparu cefnogaeth, cyngor ac arweiniad i’r awdurdodau lleol sydd â diddordeb yn y cynllun hwn.

David Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 4

David Davies spoken in Welsh p. 4

A gytunwch ei bod yn bwysig rhoi dewis i gymaint o bobl ag sydd yn bosibl ac mai dim ond estyniad yw’r polisi hwn o bolisïau’r Llywodraeth Geidwadol ddiwethaf?

Do you agree that it is important to offer choice to as many people as possible and that this policy is just an extension of the last Conservative Government’s policies?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 4

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

Mae hwnnw’n fater pwysig. I agree that we must offer choice and encourage local authorities to implement the direct payment scheme. We must also encourage organisations representing disabled and young people to provide support and guidance.

That is an important matter. Cytunaf y dylem gynnig dewis ac annog awdurdodau lleol i weithredu’r cynllun talu uniongyrchol. Rhaid inni hefyd annog sefydliadau sydd yn cynrychioli pobl anabl a phobl ifanc i ddarparu cefnogaeth ac arweiniad.

Nifer y Nyrsys a Doctoriaid dan Hyfforddiant yng Nghymru

Number of Trainee Nurses and Doctors in Wales

Q2 Rosemary Butler spoken in English p. 4

C2 Rosemary Butler siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

How many trainee nurses and trainee doctors are there in Wales at present in comparison with previous years? (OAQ12518)

Faint o nyrsys a doctoriaid dan hyfforddiant sydd yng Nghymru heddiw o’i gymharu â’r blynyddoedd a fu? (OAQ12518)

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 4

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

The total number of contracted nurse training places in Wales in 1999-2000 was 2,664. With the recurrent increases in funding in the following two years, this figure was increased to 2,897 in 2000-01 and then to 3,216 in 2001-02. There were 966 registered medical students at the University of Wales College of Medicine in 1999-2000, 1,031 in 2000-01 and an estimated 1,127 in 2001-02.

Cyfanswm y lleoedd a gontractwyd i hyfforddi nyrsys yng Nghymru yn 1999-2000 oedd 2,664. Gyda’r cynnydd cyson mewn cyllid dros y ddwy flynedd ganlynol, cynyddwyd y ffigur hwn i 2,897 yn 2000-01 ac yna i 3,216 yn 2001-02. Yr oedd 966 o fyfyrwyr meddygol cofrestredig yng Ngholeg Meddygol Prifysgol Cymru yn 1999-2000, 1,031 yn 2000-01 ac amcangyfrif o 1,127 yn 2001-02.

Rosemary Butler spoken in English p. 4

Rosemary Butler siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

The trend in terms of the numbers being recruited is going in the right direction. However, do you agree that it is not only good training and salaries, but career opportunities and job satisfaction that will keep people in the nursing profession? How will the new primary care strategy allow nurses to develop expertise? The nurses in my local general practice are popular and do an extremely good job. How can we develop that expertise?

Mae’r duedd o ran y niferoedd a gaiff eu recriwtio yn dilyn y llwybr cywir. Fodd bynnag, a gytunwch nad hyfforddiant a chyflogau da yn unig a fydd yn cadw pobl yn y proffesiwn nyrsio, ond cyfleoedd gyrfa a boddhad swydd? Sut y bydd y strategaeth gofal sylfaenol newydd yn galluogi nyrsys i ddatblygu arbenigedd? Mae’r nyrsys yn fy mhractis cyffredinol lleol yn boblogaidd ac yn gwneud gwaith eithriadol o dda. Sut y gallwn ddatblygu’r arbenigedd hwnnw?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 4

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

I launched the primary care strategy on Monday at a new medical centre in New Tredegar and met with practice nurses, midwives, health visitors and district nurses. Nurses are key to new developments in primary care. They are an essential part of the team, working alongside other healthcare professionals. Nurse-led initiatives will play a major role, and form part of the career opportunities that we offer to the nursing profession for the future.

Lansiais y strategaeth gofal sylfaenol ddydd Llun mewn canolfan feddygol newydd yn Nhredegar Newydd a chyfarfûm â nyrsys practis, bydwragedd, ymwelwyr iechyd a nyrsys bro. Mae nyrsys yn allweddol i ddatblygiadau newydd mewn gofal sylfaenol. Maent yn rhan hanfodol o’r tîm, gan weithio ochr yn ochr â gweithwyr gofal iechyd eraill. Bydd mentrau dan arweiniad nyrsys yn chwarae rhan bwysig, ac yn ffurfio rhan o’r cyfleoedd gyrfa a gynigiwn i’r proffesiwn nyrsio yn y dyfodol.

Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 5

Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

I declare an interest as a pharmacist. An increase in the number of doctors in Wales is important, but where those doctors are based is equally important. The primary care strategy mentions pilot schemes, but does the Minister accept that radical proposals will have to be implemented swiftly in certain areas, including the Valleys, to ensure that they are not denuded of primary healthcare facilities?

Datganaf fuddiant fel fferyllydd. Mae cynnydd yn nifer y doctoriaid yng Nghymru yn bwysig, ond mae lleoliad y doctoriaid hynny yr un mor bwysig. Mae’r strategaeth gofal sylfaenol yn sôn am gynlluniau peilot, ond a dderbynia’r Gweinidog y bydd angen gweithredu argymhellion radical ar fyrder mewn rhai ardaloedd, gan gynnwys y Cymoedd, i sicrhau na chânt eu hamddifadu o gyfleusterau gofal sylfaenol?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 5

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

That is the aim and objective of the primary care strategy. We are shifting resources, particularly into under-doctored and deprived areas, including the south Wales valleys, in several ways. That includes addressing the need for support for equipment and premises, which is a key issue. It also includes ensuring that salaried options are available through the personal medical services scheme and through the general medical services scheme. That will be part of the rollout of the primary care strategy.

Dyna yw nod ac amcanion y strategaeth gofal sylfaenol. Yr ydym yn symud adnoddau, yn arbennig i mewn i ardaloedd difreintiedig lle nad oes digon o ddoctoriaid, gan gynnwys cymoedd de Cymru, mewn sawl ffordd. Mae hynny’n cynnwys mynd i’r afael â’r angen am gymorth i gael offer ac adeiladau, sydd yn fater allweddol. Mae hefyd yn cynnwys sicrhau bod dewisiadau cyflog ar gael drwy’r cynllun gwasanaethau meddygol personol a thrwy’r cynllun gwasanaethau meddygol cyffredinol. Bydd hynny’n rhan o’r gwaith o gyflwyno’r strategaeth gofal sylfaenol.

David Melding spoken in English p. 5

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

It is important that we set targets for increasing the number of nurses and doctors trained. However, do you also agree that it is crucial that we set targets for the number of national health service staff in place, and targets for increasing the number of staff employed by the service? Compared to England, we have been dilatory in that respect. Can you assure us that in future we will have commensurate targets for training and front-line staff increases?

Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn gosod targedau ar gyfer cynyddu nifer y nyrsys a doctoriaid a hyfforddir. Fodd bynnag, a gytunwch hefyd ei bod yn holl bwysig inni osod targedau ar gyfer nifer staff y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol sydd ar gael, a thargedau ar gyfer cynyddu nifer y staff a gyflogir gan y gwasanaeth? O gymharu â Lloegr, buom yn araf yn hynny o beth. A allwch ein sicrhau y bydd gennym dargedau cymesurol yn y dyfodol ar gyfer hyfforddiant a chynyddu nifer staff y rheng flaen?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 5

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

As you know, we have a workforce planning arrangement in the NHS for the first time. It will enable us to see what our future needs will be. It is already being developed by the service, and will help inform training targets and workforce needs across all the health professions.

Fel y gwyddoch, mae gennym drefniant cynllunio gweithlu am y tro cyntaf yn yr NHS. Bydd yn ein galluogi i weld beth fydd ein hanghenion yn y dyfodol. Mae’n cael ei ddatblygu eisoes gan y gwasanaeth, a bydd yn helpu wrth lywio targedau hyfforddi ac anghenion gweithlu ar draws yr holl broffesiynau iechyd.

Gwella’r Cyfleoedd i Gael Gofal Iechyd o Ansawdd Uchel

Improving Access to High Quality Healthcare

C3 David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 6

Q3 David Lloyd spoken in Welsh p. 6

Pa gamau sydd wedi’u cymryd i wella’r cyfleoedd i gael gofal iechyd o ansawdd uchel yng Nghymru? (OAQ12614)

What progress has been made towards improving access to high quality healthcare in Wales? (OAQ12614)

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 6

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

I am firmly committed to ensuring that the people of Wales have access to high quality healthcare to meet their needs, as set out in ‘Improving Health in Wales: a plan for the NHS with its partners’. The provision of high quality services will be driven by national service frameworks. These will be supported by the work of the National Institute for Clinical Excellence and subject to inspection by the Commission for Health Improvement, and thus present an integrated package that will continue to drive up standards of care.

Yr wyf yn llwyr ymrwymedig i sicrhau bod gan bobl Cymru fynediad i ofal iechyd o ansawdd uchel sydd yn ateb eu gofynion, fel a nodwyd yn ‘Gwella Iechyd yng Nghymru: cynllun i’r GIG ynghyd â’i bartneriaid’. Caiff darpariaeth gwasanaethau o ansawdd uchel ei llywio gan fframweithiau gwasanaeth cenedlaethol. Caiff y rhain eu cefnogi gan waith y Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth Glinigol ac fe’u harchwilir gan y Comisiwn Gwella Iechyd, ac felly cyflwynant becyn integredig a fydd yn parhau i wella’r safonau gofal.

David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 6

David Lloyd spoken in Welsh p. 6

Datganaf fuddiant fel meddyg teulu. Mae ysbytai cymunedol yn aml dan fygythiad neu’n cau. Sut y mae’r Gweinidog yn bwriadu cynyddu a datblygu mynediad i ofal clinigol o’r safon uchaf yn ein cymunedau?

I declare an interest as a general practitioner. Community hospitals are often under threat or closing. How does the Minister intend to increase and develop access to clinical care of the highest standard in our communities?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 6

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

Today, an important conference on innovation in care will be held; it recognises innovation in Wales. Yesterday, I presented 15 certificates for nurse-led initiatives, which are driving up standards. On development, we have proposals for 10 new hospitals in the next decade through health service investment. I am confident that that will be at community hospital level as well as at district general hospital level.

Heddiw, cynhelir cynhadledd bwysig ar ddyfeisgarwch mewn gofal; mae’n cydnabod dyfeisgarwch yng Nghymru. Ddoe, cyflwynais 15 tystysgrif am fentrau dan arweiniad nyrsys, sydd yn gwella safonau. O ran datblygiad, mae gennym gynigion ar gyfer 10 ysbyty newydd dros y degawd nesaf drwy fuddsoddiad yn y gwasanaeth iechyd. Yr wyf yn hyderus y bydd hynny ar lefel ysbytai cymunedol yn ogystal â lefel ysbytai cyffredinol dosbarth.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 6

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

The £3.1 million cash injection for primary healthcare in Wales, which was announced two months ago in my constituency of Cynon Valley, includes money for GP and nurse retention and recruitment, and pilot schemes to introduce welfare rights advice in primary care. Do you agree that that will improve the provision of high quality healthcare in our communities? Do you also agree that improving access to high quality healthcare is not just about more doctors and nurses, but about attracting more doctors and nurses to our most deprived communities?

Mae’r £3.1 miliwn o hwb ariannol i ofal iechyd sylfaenol yng Nghymru, a gyhoeddwyd ddau fis yn ôl yn fy etholaeth, sef Cwm Cynon, yn cynnwys arian ar gyfer cadw a recriwtio meddygon teulu a nyrsys, a chynlluniau peilot i gyflwyno cyngor ar hawliau lles mewn gofal sylfaenol. A gytunwch y bydd hynny’n gwella’r ddarpariaeth gofal iechyd o ansawdd uchel yn ein cymunedau? A gytunwch hefyd nad mwy o ddoctoriaid a nyrsys yn unig y mae gofal iechyd o ansawdd uchel yn ei olygu, ond denu mwy o ddoctoriaid a nyrsys i’n cymunedau mwyaf difreintiedig.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 7

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

I visited your community, and met with salaried GPs who have come to work in the Cynon Valley as part of a primary healthcare team. That is now rolling out to the Rhondda Valley. That will be of interest to colleagues from that area. Young doctors are taking the opportunity to come to work in the Valleys as salaried GPs. We must ensure that our primary care strategy opens up those opportunities, as we are seeing in the Cynon and Rhondda valleys.

Ymwelais â’ch cymuned, a chyfarfûm â meddygon teulu cyflogedig sydd wedi dod i weithio yng Nghwm Cynon fel rhan o dîm gofal iechyd sylfaenol. Mae hynny bellach yn digwydd yng Nghwm Rhondda. Bydd hynny o ddiddordeb i gyd-Aelodau o’r ardal honno. Mae doctoriaid ifanc yn manteisio ar y cyfle i ddod i weithio yn y Cymoedd fel meddygon teulu cyflogedig. Rhaid inni sicrhau bod ein strategaeth gofal sylfaenol yn ehangu’r cyfleoedd hynny, fel y gwelwn yng nghymoedd Cynon a Rhondda.

Nick Bourne The Leader of the Welsh Conservatives spoken in English p. 7

Nick Bourne Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

I congratulate the Minister on dumping the waiting lists strategy and adopting a waiting times strategy, as argued for by the Conservatives for some time. It is good to see you coming round to that view latterly.

Llongyfarchaf y Gweinidog ar roi’r gorau i’r strategaeth rhestrau aros a mabwysiadu strategaeth amserau aros, fel y bu’r Ceidwadwyr yn dadlau drosti ers peth amser. Mae’n dda eich gweld yn mabwysiadu’r safbwynt hwnnw o’r diwedd.

Are we conducting any comparative studies with regard to healthcare spending in mainland Europe, to see how we can lever more money into the health service? We could then adopt practices to ensure more resources for healthcare in Wales.

A ydym yn cynnal unrhyw astudiaethau cymharol mewn perthynas â gwariant gofal iechyd ar dir mawr Ewrop, i weld sut y gallwn wthio mwy o arian i’r gwasanaeth iechyd? Gallem wedyn fabwysiadu arferion i sicrhau mwy o adnoddau ar gyfer gofal iechyd yng Nghymru.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 7

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

We have moved to a waiting times strategy, which I am announcing today. It was endorsed by the Health and Social Services Committee after much useful discussion and hard work by the groups that advised us. The health service is spending an extra £1 billion over the next three years in Wales. That extra £1 billion will improve patient care and tackle health inequality in the ways described in our primary healthcare strategy, ‘Improving Health in Wales’. That will increase our expenditure in line with increases across the United Kingdom, and will stand us in good stead in the European league table.

Cyhoeddaf heddiw ein bod wedi symud i strategaeth amserau aros. Fe’i cymeradwywyd gan y Pwyllgor Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ar ôl llawer o drafod defnyddiol a gwaith caled gan y grwpiau â’n cynghorodd. Bydd y gwasanaeth iechyd yn gwario £1 biliwn yn ychwanegol dros y tair blynedd nesaf yng Nghymru. Bydd y £1 biliwn hwnnw yn gwella gofal cleifion ac yn mynd i’r afael ag anghyfartaledd iechyd yn y ffyrdd a ddisgrifiwyd yn ein strategaeth gofal iechyd sylfaenol, ‘Gwella Iechyd yng Nghymru’. Bydd hynny’n cynyddu ein gwariant yn unol â chynnydd ledled y Deyrnas Unedig, ac yn ein rhoi mewn sefyllfa dda yn nhabl cynghrair Ewrop.

Meddygaeth Breifat yn y Gwasanaeth Iechyd

Private Medical Practice within the Health Service

Q4 Richard Edwards spoken in English p. 8

C4 Richard Edwards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

Can the Minister make a statement on private medical practice within the health service in Wales? (OAQ12516)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar feddygaeth breifat o fewn y gwasanaeth iechyd yng Nghymru? (OAQ12516)

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 8

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

NHS trusts may only undertake private practice if there is no significant disadvantage to their obligations under any NHS contract, and there is at least a full recovery of costs, including an appropriate return on capital employed. Within these constraints, NHS trusts have autonomy to determine the scope of any private practice conducted and to which clinical specialities their financial expenditure is allocated.

Dim ond os nad oes anfantais sylweddol i’w rhwymedigaethau o dan unrhyw gontract NHS, ac yr adenillir costau yn llawn o leiaf, gan gynnwys enillion priodol ar y cyfalaf a ddefnyddir, y gall ymddiriedolaethau NHS ymgymryd â meddygaeth breifat. O fewn y cyfyngiadau hyn, mae gan ymddiriedolaethau NHS yr annibyniaeth i benderfynu ar gwmpas unrhyw feddygaeth breifat a gynhelir ac i ba arbenigedd glinigol y dyrennir eu gwariant ariannol.

Richard Edwards spoken in English p. 8

Richard Edwards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

You are aware that some of us not only oppose the principle of having private finance initiatives in the health service, but deplore how private medicine is a parasite on the NHS. Do you not think that it is outrageous that one of my constituents, who has life-threatening angina and requires a multiple bypass operation, was told by an NHS consultant in Morriston Hospital that he has two options: the first is to have an operation next weekend, if he pays him £12,000, and the other is to wait up to 140 weeks if he cannot pay? I understand that waiting times in Cardiff are 12 to 70 weeks. Do you not think that this disparity reflects the avarice and callousness of some consultants, who abuse the health service that employs them, and who are prepared, in effect, to sacrifice life in order to line their own pockets?

Yr ydych yn ymwybodol bod rhai ohonom nid yn unig yn gwrthwynebu’r egwyddor o gael mentrau cyllid preifat yn y gwasanaeth iechyd, ond yn casáu’r modd y mae meddygaeth breifat yn byw ar gefn yr NHS. Oni chredwch ei bod yn warthus bod un o’m hetholwyr, sydd ag angina sydd yn fygythiad i’w fywyd ac sydd angen llawdriniaeth aml-ddargyfeiriol, wedi cael gwybod gan ymgynghorydd NHS yn Ysbyty Treforus bod ganddo ddau ddewis: y cyntaf yw cael llawdriniaeth y penwythnos nesaf, os bydd yn fodlon talu £12,000 iddo, a’r dewis arall yw aros am hyd at 140 wythnos os na all dalu? Deallaf mai’r amserau aros yng Ngaherdydd yw 12 i 70 wythnos. A gredwch fod yr anghysondeb hwn yn adlewyrchu ariangarwch a chreulondeb rhai ymgynghorwyr, sydd yn camddefnyddio’r gwasanaeth iechyd sydd yn eu cyflogi, ac sydd yn fodlon, i bob pwrpas, aberthu bywyd er mwyn llenwi eu pocedi eu hunain?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 8

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

There are several parts to your question. NHS consultants must not recommend that private consultation is necessary, or preferable, because of the urgency of the case. All NHS patients are prioritised according to clinical need. That is why I am pleased to launch the waiting times strategy, which makes our expectations clear in terms of the clinical priority need of patients suffering from heart disease. We will abide by that steer and clinical priority need.

Mae sawl rhan i’ch cwestiwn. Ni ddylai ymgynghorwyr yr NHS argymell fod ymgynghoriad preifat yn angenrheidiol, nac yn fwy dymunol, oherwydd brys yr achos. Caiff pob claf NHS ei flaenoriaethu yn ôl anghenion clinigol. Dyna pam fy mod yn falch o lansio’r strategaeth amserau aros, sydd yn nodi ein disgwyliadau yn eglur yn nhermau anghenion blaenoriaeth glinigol cleifion sydd yn dioddef o afiechyd y galon. Byddwn yn cadw at y pwyslais hwnnw a’r flaenoriaeth o ran angen clinigol.

Also, I assure you that private practice in Wales is on a small scale. Income generated by private practice in NHS hospitals in Wales is approximately 1 per cent of total NHS income. However, it is vital that we have adequate services for providing—and the expectation of—health treatment that is free at the point of need, and that consultants do not impose an approach such as that you mentioned.

Hefyd, fe’ch sicrhaf fod meddygaeth breifat yng Nghymru ar raddfa fechan. Mae’r incwm a gynhyrchir gan feddygaeth breifat mewn ysbytai NHS yng Nghymru tua 1 y cant o gyfanswm incwm yr NHS. Fodd bynnag, mae’n holl bwysig bod gennym wasanaethau digonol i ddarparu––a disgwyl––triniaeth iechyd am ddim lle bydd ei angen, ac nad yw ymgynghorwyr yn dangos ymagwedd fel yr un a grybwyllasoch.

Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 9

Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

Do you agree that Alan Milburn’s recent efforts to involve the private sector are welcome in Wales as a positive measure? Do you endorse your colleague’s approach?

A gytunwch fod croeso yng Nghymru i ymdrechion diweddar Alan Milburn i gynnwys y sector preifat fel mesur cadarnhaol? A gymeradwywch ymagwedd eich cydweithiwr?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 9

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

My colleague—the Secretary of State for Health—and I have much the same approach to how we develop and invest in the national health service. The private sector has played a role and is a partner in schemes in Wales. However, we intend to ensure that we have the resources, finance and commitment for our national health service in Wales to be a public service, which is free at the point of need.

Mae gan fy nghydweithiwr––yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Iechyd––a minnau ymagwedd debyg tuag at y modd y datblygwn y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol a buddsoddi ynddo. Mae’r sector preifat wedi chwarae rhan mewn cynlluniau yng Nghymru ac mae’n bartner ynddynt. Fodd bynnag, bwriadwn sicrhau bod gennym yr adnoddau, y cyllid a’r ymrwymiad i wneud y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol yng Nghymru yn wasanaeth cyhoeddus, sydd am ddim lle bydd ei angen.

Annog Bwydo o’r Fron yng Nghymru

Promoting Breastfeeding in Wales

Q5 Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 9

C5 Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

How does the Minister intend to promote breastfeeding in Wales? (OAQ12593)

Sut y mae’r Gweinidog yn bwriadu annog mwy o famau yng Nghymru i fwydo o’r fron? (OAQ12593)

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 9

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

On 9 March, I launched the breastfeeding strategy ‘Investing in a Better Start: Promoting Breastfeeding in Wales.’ The strategy aims to increase breastfeeding rates in Wales through encouraging health professionals and volunteer support workers to work together with mothers. We have recently consulted on the strategy’s action plan and training packages have been developed. I recently announced additional funding of £25,000 for breastfeeding support in the community.

Ar 9 Mawrth, lansiais y strategaeth bwydo o’r fron ‘Buddsoddi mewn Gwell Cychwyn: Hybu Bwydo ar y Fron yng Nghymru’. Nod y strategaeth yw cynyddu cyfraddau bwydo o’r fron yng Nghymru drwy annog gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol a gweithwyr cynorthwyol gwirfoddol i gydweithio â mamau. Yr ydym wedi ymgynghori yn ddiweddar ar gynllun gweithredu’r strategaeth a datblygwyd pecynnau hyfforddi. Cyhoeddais yn ddiweddar y rhoddir £25,000 yn ychwanegol tuag at gynorthwyo bwydo o’r fron yn y gymuned.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 10

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

Will that £25,000 for breastfeeding support in the community help to develop the specialist health visitor and midwife’s role in relation to breastfeeding, or the strategy’s recommendation that mothers have 24-hour access to breastfeeding support in the four months after the birth?

A fydd y £25,000 hwnnw ar gyfer cynorthwyo bwydo o’r fron yn y gymuned yn helpu wrth ddatblygu swyddogaeth yr ymwelydd iechyd arbenigol neu’r fydwraig mewn perthynas â bwydo o’r fron, neu argymhelliad y strategaeth y dylai mamau gael mynediad 24 awr i gymorth bwydo o’r fron yn ystod y pedwar mis ar ôl rhoi genedigaeth?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 10

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

This is an important strategy. We have funded a training package to provide opportunities for 60 breastfeeding specialists, including midwives, health visitors and volunteers, to help promote and improve ways of facilitating breastfeeding. We must also ensure that we enable women to breastfeed in the critical four months following birth. I was pleased that the Presiding Officer, Dafydd Elis-Thomas, and the First Minister, Rhodri Morgan, welcomed the national breastfeeding strategy, because the Assembly must take a lead on this to show that this is a breastfeeding-friendly place.

Mae hon yn strategaeth bwysig. Yr ydym wedi cyllido pecyn hyfforddi er mwyn darparu cyfleoedd i 60 o arbenigwyr bwydo o’r fron, gan gynnwys bydwragedd, ymwelwyr iechyd a gwirfoddolwyr, i helpu wrth hyrwyddo a gwella ffyrdd o hwyluso bwydo o’r fron. Rhaid inni hefyd sicrhau ein bod yn galluogi merched i fwydo o’r fron yn ystod y pedwar mis holl bwysig ar ôl rhoi genedigaeth. Yr oeddwn yn falch bod y Llywydd, Dafydd Elis-Thomas, a Phrif Weinidog Cymru, Rhodri Morgan yn croesawu’r strategaeth bwydo o’r fron genedlaethol, gan fod yn rhaid i’r Cynulliad arwain ar hyn er mwyn dangos fod y lle hwn yn cefnogi bwydo o’r fron.

William Graham spoken in English p. 10

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

When my children were young, the maxims at that time were ‘breast is best’—with which I am sure we would all heartily concur—as well as ‘little and often’ and ‘feeding on demand’. Will you ensure that those perhaps old-fashioned, but straightforward, recommendations form part of the advice given to young nursing mothers?

Pan oedd fy mhlant yn ifanc, y dywediadau ar y pryd oedd ‘breast is best’—yr wyf yn siŵr y byddem i gyd yn cytuno’n galonnog â hynny—yn ogystal â ‘little and often’ a ‘feeding on demand’. A sicrhewch fod yr argymhellion hynny, sydd efallai yn hen ffasiwn ond sydd yn syml, yn ffurfio rhan o’r cyngor a roddir i famau ifanc sydd yn magu?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 10

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

I am pleased that a male Assembly Member has spoken about breastfeeding. We should see it as a natural part of life; it is vital to the future health of our children. I am sure that Members, who have perhaps benefited from being breastfed as babies, would agree that we must ensure that the practice continues and is part of our culture in Wales.

Yr wyf yn falch bod Aelod gwrywaidd o’r Cynulliad wedi siarad am fwydo o’r fron. Dylem ei ystyried fel rhan naturiol o fywyd; mae’n hanfodol ar gyfer dyfodol iach ein plant. Yr wyf yn siŵr y byddai Aelodau, a gafodd y fantais o gael eu bwydo o’r fron pan oeddent yn fabanod efallai, yn cytuno y dylem sicrhau y bydd yr arfer yn parhau a’i fod yn rhan o’n diwylliant yng Nghymru.

Rod Richards spoken in English p. 11

Rod Richards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

While the Minister is promoting breastfeeding, will she also promote private medical practice? Does she agree that the private sector can help alleviate the pressures on the national health service in Wales and, if so, will she encourage—

Tra bod y Gweinidog yn hyrwyddo bwydo o’r fron, a wnaiff hi hefyd hyrwyddo meddygaeth breifat? A gytuna y gall y sector preifat helpu i leddfu’r pwysau ar y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol yng Nghymru ac, os felly, a wnaiff hi annog—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 11

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Order. This question is not about the private sector.

Trefn. Nid cwestiwn ar y sector preifat yw hwn.

Rod Richards spoken in English p. 11

Rod Richards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Breastfeeding is private.

Mae bwydo o’r fron yn breifat.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 11

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Breastfeeding is a natural activity that requires no payment. [Laughter.]

Mae bwydo o’r fron yn weithgaredd naturiol nad oes angen taliad amdano. [Chwerthin.]

Rod Richards spoken in English p. 11

Rod Richards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

I defer to your experience, Llywydd. Will the Minister encourage her colleague, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, to offer tax concessions to companies that wish to purchase health insurance for their employees?

Ildiaf i’ch profiad, Lywydd. A wnaiff y Gweinidog annog ei chyd-aelod, Canghellor y Trysorlys, i gynnig gostyngiadau treth i gwmnïau sydd yn dymuno prynu yswiriant iechyd ar gyfer eu cyflogeion?

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 11

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Order. That question is not in order and the Minister need not answer it.

Trefn. Nid yw’r cwestiwn hwnnw mewn trefn ac nid oes angen i’r Gweinidog ei ateb.

Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes

Questions to the Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning

Cwrdd â’r Alwad am Addysg drwy Gyfrwng y Gymraeg

Meeting Demand for Welsh-medium Education

C1 Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 11

Q1 Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 11

Pa gamau y mae’r Gweinidog yn eu cymryd i gwrdd â’r alwad am addysg drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg? (OAQ12582)

What action is the Minister taking to meet the demand for Welsh-medium education? (OAQ12582)

Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 12

Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning spoken in Welsh p. 12

Cyfrifoldeb yr awdurdodau addysg lleol yw trefnu bod darpariaeth ar gael ar gyfer addysg drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg. Y targed yn ‘Gwellcymru.com’ yw y dylai darpariaeth o’r fath fod yn gydnaws â’r galw. Yr wyf yn disgwyl i’r awdurdodau addysg lleol nodi’r galw a ragwelir yn eu cynlluniau blynyddol ar gyfer trefniadaeth ysgolion ac, yng nghyd-destun ehangach rheoli nifer y lleoedd sydd ar gael mewn ysgolion, nodi a oes angen iddynt drefnu bod mwy o leoedd cyfrwng Cymraeg ar gael.

Responsibility for making provision for Welsh-medium education lies with local education authorities. The target in ‘Betterwales.com’ is that such provision should meet demand. I expect LEAs to forecast demand in their annual school organisation plans and, within the wider context of managing the supply of school places, to indicate whether they need to make additional Welsh-medium places available.

Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 12

Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 12

Fe wyddoch fod gan rai o ysgolion uwchradd dwyieithog Cymru yr adeiladau ysgol gwaethaf yn y wlad. Mae’n debyg mai’r fenter cyllid preifat yw unig opsiwn Llywodraeth San Steffan ar gyfer cyllido adeiladau newydd. Mae Ysgol Gyfun Penweddig yn fy etholaeth i yn un enghraifft o hynny. A ydych yn croesawu’r dyfarniad cyfreithiol i ganiatáu parhad y broses gynllunio ar gyfer adeiladau newydd Ysgol Gyfun Rhydfelen yn Gartholwg, ac, os felly, a fyddwch yn cefnogi hynny yn awr?

You will know that some of Wales’s Welsh-medium secondary schools have the worst school buildings in the country. It seems that the private finance initiative is the Westminster Government’s only option for funding new buildings. Ysgol Gyfun Penweddig in my constituency is an example of that. Do you welcome the legal ruling to allow the planning process for Ysgol Gyfun Rhydfelen’s new buildings at Gartholwg to proceed and, if so, will you now give your support to that?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 12

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 12

Mae’n bwysig codi adeilad newydd yng Ngartholwg i gymryd lle adeiladau presennol Ysgol Gyfun Rhydfelen. Yr wyf bob amser wedi cefnogi hynny.

It is important to have a new building at Gartholwg to replace Ysgol Gyfun Rhydfelen’s present buildings. I have always supported that.

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 12

Eleanor Burnham spoken in Welsh p. 12

Sut yr ydych yn bwriadu cynorthwyo teuluoedd nad ydynt yn gallu fforddio costau trafnidiaeth i’w plant deithio i’r ysgol Gymraeg agosaf?

How do you intend to help families who cannot afford transport costs for their children to travel to the nearest Welsh-medium school?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 12

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 12

Mater i’r awdurdodau addysg lleol yw trafnidiaeth.

Transport is a matter for local education authorities.

Glyn Davies spoken in English p. 12

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

Do you accept that, as a result of longstanding Conservative policy, there is a growing demand for Welsh-medium education in Wales, notably in the Swansea area? Will you commit today to ensuring that a second Welsh-medium school is opened in Wales’s second city, so that there is competition in Welsh-medium education?

A gytunwch fod galw cynyddol am addysg drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg yng Nghymru, yn arbennig yn ardal Abertawe, a hynny o ganlyniad i bolisi Ceidwadol hirsefydlog? A wnewch chi ymrwymo heddiw i sicrhau yr agorir ail ysgol Gymraeg yn ail ddinas Cymru, fel bod cystadleuaeth mewn addysg drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 13

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 13

Yr wyf yn ymwybodol o’r cynlluniau i agor tair ysgol gynradd Gymraeg newydd ym Mhowys, Caerdydd a Mynwy y flwyddyn nesaf. Mater i awdurdodau addysg lleol yw safle ysgolion, boed yn ysgolion cyfrwng Cymraeg neu gyfrwng Saesneg.

I am aware of the plans to open three new Welsh-medium primary schools in Powys, Cardiff and Monmouth next year. The location of schools is a matter for local education authorities, whether Welsh-medium or English-medium schools.

Hyrwyddo Cyfrifon Dysgu Unigol

Uptake of Individual Learning Accounts

Q2 Brian Gibbons spoken in English p. 13

C2 Brian Gibbons siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

What roles does the Minister see for the trade unions in promoting the uptake of individual learning accounts? (OAQ12483) [R]

Beth, ym marn y Gweinidog, fydd rhan yr undebau llafur yn y dasg o hyrwyddo cyfrifon dysgu unigol? (OAQ12483) [R]

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 13

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 13

Mae TUC Cymru eisoes yn chwarae rhan weithgar wrth annog pobl yn y gweithle sydd ag ond ychydig o sgiliau ac sydd ar incwm isel i gymryd y camau cyntaf yn ôl at ddysgu drwy ddefnyddio cyfrifon dysgu unigol. Mae ELWa, sydd yn gweinyddu’r cyfrifon dysgu unigol ar ran y Cynulliad, wedi datblygu blaenoriaethau polisi gyda TUC Cymru er mwyn hyrwyddo’r defnydd o gyfrifon dysgu unigol yng Nghymru. Mae cynrychiolwyr dysgu TUC Cymru, sydd wedi cael y dasg o sicrhau bod cyfrifon dysgu ar gael i gymaint o bobl â phosibl, yn gweithio’n agos â chydlynwyr y cyfrifon dysgu unigol yn swyddfeydd rhanbarthol ELWa.

Wales TUC already plays an active role in encouraging people in the workplace who have few skills and are on a low income to take the first steps back into learning by using individual learning accounts. ELWa, which administers individual learning accounts on behalf of the Assembly, has developed policy priorities with Wales TUC to promote the use of individual learning accounts in Wales. Learning representatives from Wales TUC, tasked with promoting access for as many people as possible to individual learning accounts, are working closely with individual learning accounts co-ordinators in the ELWa regional offices.

Brian Gibbons spoken in English p. 13

Brian Gibbons siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

I think that everybody would agree that the trade union movement is able to secure training opportunities for people who would otherwise not consider accessing them. Do you agree that employers also have an important role in facilitating this, and should allow their employees to undertake training activities for vocational and personal development, in partnership with trade unions and organisations such as the Workers’ Education Association? This is happening at the Burton biscuit factory in Cwmbran, which is giving an excellent example in this area.

Credaf y cytuna pawb y gall mudiad yr undebau llafur sicrhau cyfleoedd hyfforddi ar gyfer pobl na fyddai fel arall wedi eu hystyried. A gytunwch fod gan gyflogwyr hefyd ran bwysig i’w chwarae wrth hwyluso hyn, a dylent alluogi eu gweithwyr i ymgymryd â gweithgareddau hyfforddi ar gyfer datblygiad galwedigaethol a phersonol, mewn partneriaeth ag undebau llafur a sefydliadau megis Cymdeithas Addysg y Gweithwyr? Mae hyn yn digwydd yn ffatri fisgedi Burton yng Nghwmbrân, sydd yn gosod esiampl ardderchog yn yr ardal hon.

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 13

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 13

Mae honno’n enghraifft dda. Cytunaf â chi. Mae gan gyflogwyr ran werthfawr i’w chwarae i annog eu staff i wella’u sgiliau drwy ddysgu. Mae’n bwysig i gyflogwyr sylweddoli bod dysgu’n fanteisiol, nid yn unig i’r gweithiwr ond i’r gweithlu’n gyffredinol. Dylai’r cyfrifon dysgu unigol fod yn bartneriaeth driphlyg—rhwng yr unigolyn, y Llywodraeth a’r cyflogwr, er mwyn buddsoddi mwy mewn dysgu. Mae ELWa a’r undebau yn helpu i sicrhau bod cyflogwyr yng Nghymru, boed yn fawr neu’n fach, yn ymwybodol o werth cyfrifon dysgu unigol i’r gweithwyr. Er enghraifft, yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru, agorodd 430 o bobl gyfrif dysgu unigol o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i ymyrraeth yr undeb. Amcangyfrifir bod tua 500 o gyfrifon dysgu unigol ychwanegol wedi cael eu hagor yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru o ganlyniad i waith hyrwyddo’r TUC yn y gweithle.

That is a good example. I agree with you. Employers have a valuable role to play in encouraging their staff to increase their skills through learning. It is important that employers recognise the benefits of learning, not just for the employee but for the workforce in general. Individual learning accounts should be a three-way partnership—between the individual, Government and the employer, to increase investment in learning. ELWa and the unions are helping to ensure that employers in Wales, both large and small, are aware of the value to an employee of an individual learning account. For example, in south-east Wales, 430 people opened an individual learning account as a direct result of union intervention. It is estimated that a further 500 or so individual learning accounts have been accessed in south-east Wales as a result of TUC promotional work in the workplace.

Ieuan Wyn Jones Arweinydd yr Wrthblaid siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 14

Ieuan Wyn Jones The Leader of the Opposition spoken in Welsh p. 14

A dderbyniwch fod meithrin perthynas adeiladol gydag undebau llafur yn rhan bwysig o waith y Llywodraeth? A deimlwch, felly, ei bod yn briodol eich bod wedi ymosod yn gyhoeddus yn ddiweddar ar un o’r undebau athrawon blaenllaw, sef Undeb Cenedlaethol yr Athrawon? Oni ystyriwch, wedi gweld ymddygiad o’r fath, y byddai’n well o lawer pe baech wedi ymateb yn fwy ystyrlon, i sicrhau bod undebau athrawon yn teimlo bod ganddynt yr hawl i wneud eu pwyntiau mor gryf ag y gallant?

Do you accept that nurturing a constructive relationship with trade unions is an important part of the Government’s work? Do you feel that it was appropriate, therefore, for you recently to publicly attack one of the foremost teachers’ unions, namely the National Union of Teachers? Do you not consider, having seen this kind of behaviour, that it would be far better had you given a more reasoned answer, to ensure that teaching unions feel that they have the right to make their points as emphatically as they can?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 14

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 14

Credaf fod yr undebau yn teimlo y gallant siarad â fi pan y dymunant. Gwneuthum drefniadau newydd yn y Cynulliad i gwrdd â hwy bedair gwaith y flwyddyn: ddwywaith yn unigol, a dwywaith gyda’r holl undebau eraill. Gobeithiaf y gallaf greu perthynas gref drwy’r trefniadau hyn.

I believe that the unions feel that they can talk to me whenever they wish. I have made new arrangements in the Assembly to meet them four times a year: twice individually and twice with all other unions. I hope that I can forge strong relations through these arrangements.

Problemau sy’n Wynebu Addysg Uwch yng Nghymru

Problems Facing Higher Education in Wales

Q3 Kirsty Williams spoken in English p. 14

C3 Kirsty Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

When did the Minister last meet with the UK Minister for Education to discuss problems facing higher education in Wales? (OAQ12574)

Pryd y gwnaeth y Gweinidog gwrdd â Gweinidog Addysg y DU ddiwethaf i drafod y problemau sy’n wynebu addysg uwch yng Nghymru? (OAQ12574)

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 14

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 14

Diolch yn fawr am eich cwestiwn, Kirsty. Mae cyllido a pholisi addysg uwch yn swyddogaethau sydd wedi’u datganoli.

Thank you for your question, Kirsty. Higher education funding and policy are devolved functions.

Er hynny, byddaf yn cyfarfod â Margaret Hodge, Gweinidog Dysgu Gydol Oes ac Addysg Uwch San Steffan, ar 17 Gorffennaf i drafod set gyntaf o argymhellion adroddiad diweddar yr ymchwiliad annibynnol i galedi ac ariannu myfyrwyr yng Nghymru, sydd yn ymwneud â benthyciadau i fyfyrwyr a ffïoedd dysgu.

However, I will meet the Westminster Minister for Lifelong Learning and Higher Education, Margaret Hodge, on 17 July to discuss the first set of recommendations made in the recently published report of the independent investigation into student hardship and funding in Wales, concerning student loans and tuition fees.

Kirsty Williams spoken in English p. 15

Kirsty Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 15

Thank you for that commitment to discuss the Rees Report with your colleague in London. Will you impress upon her the need to move swiftly to abolish student tuition fees in Wales to ensure that every young person in Wales has the opportunity to study at a higher level, and is not deterred by increasing debts?

Diolch ichi am yr ymrwymiad hwnnw i drafod Adroddiad Rees gyda’ch cyd-Weinidog yn Llundain. A wnewch chi bwysleisio’r angen i symud yn gyflym i ddiddymu ffioedd dysgu myfyrwyr yng Nghymru er mwyn sicrhau y caiff pob person ifanc yng Nghymru gyfle i astudio ar lefel uwch, ac na chânt eu rhwystro gan ddyledion cynyddol?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 15

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 15

Byddaf. Cyhoeddais hefyd ar ddydd Llun 9 Gorffennaf fod Cabinet y Cynulliad yn cymryd camau brys i fynd i’r afael â chaledi ymhlith myfyrwyr, drwy gynyddu cronfeydd mynediad a chaledi myfyrwyr ar gyfer y flwyddyn academaidd nesaf i £20 miliwn, fel yr argymhellwyd yn adroddiad y grŵp annibynnol ar galedi ymhlith myfyrwyr.

I will. I also announced on Monday 9 July that the Assembly Cabinet is taking immediate action to tackle student hardship, by increasing student access and hardship funds for the next academic year to £20 million, as recommended in the report of the independent group on student hardship.

Y mae’r arian yn ymateb uniongyrchol i gais y grŵp am gynnydd yn y cronfeydd mynediad a chaledi yn ystod y flwyddyn ariannol hon. Dyma’r argymhelliad cyntaf i gael ei gyflawni gan y Cynulliad.

The money comes as a direct response to the group’s call for an increase in access and hardship funds this financial year. This is the first recommendation to be carried through by the Assembly.

Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 15

Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 15

When you last met with the Secretary of State for Education and Skills, did you obtain any useful information about setting delegation targets and target rates for Welsh local education authorities? As you are aware, in England, they have a delegation rate of approximately 87 per cent, fastly approaching 90 per cent. In Wales, it is somewhere in the region of 81 per cent.

Pan gyfarfuoch ddiwethaf â’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Addysg a Sgiliau, a gawsoch unrhyw wybodaeth ddefnyddiol ynglŷn â phennu targedau dirprwyo a chyfraddau targedau ar gyfer awdurdodau addysg lleol Cymru? Fel y gwyddoch, yn Lloegr, mae ganddynt gyfradd ddirprwyo o tua 87 y cant, sydd yn prysur gyrraedd 90 y cant. Yng Nghymru, tuag 81 y cant ydyw.

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 15

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 15

Nid yw’r cwestiwn yn ymwneud ag addysg uwchradd. Fel y dywedais yn y Pwyllgor Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes ddoe, byddaf yn trafod y fformiwlâu gyda’r awdurdodau addysg lleol eleni.

This question does not relate to higher education. As I said in the Education and Lifelong Learning Committee yesterday, I will discuss these formulae with the local education authorities this year.

John Griffiths spoken in English p. 16

John Griffiths siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Jane, will you join me in praising higher education institutions in Wales that have been proactive in widening access, particularly in relation to community crises? The University of Wales College, Newport, supported by ELWa and university funding for available courses, has organised an open information evening tonight for those adversely affected by Corus cutbacks.

Jane, a wnewch chi ymuno â mi i ganmol sefydliadau addysg uwch yng Nghymru a fu’n rhagweithiol wrth ehangu mynediad, yn arbennig mewn perthynas ag argyfyngau cymunedol? Mae Coleg Prifysgol Cymru Casnewydd, gyda chefnogaeth ELWa ac arian y brifysgol ar gyfer cyrsiau, wedi trefnu noson wybodaeth agored heno ar gyfer y rheini yr effeithiodd toriadau Corus arnynt yn ddirfawr.

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 16

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 16

Llongyfarchiadau i’r brifysgol yng Nghasnewydd am wneud hynny. Yr wyf wedi trafod hyn â’r brifysgol, ac y mae’n syniad da.

Congratulations to the university in Newport for arranging that event. I have discussed this with the university, and it is an excellent idea.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 16

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Question 4 is withdrawn.

Tynnwyd cwestiwn 4 yn ôl.

Amddiffyn Staff Ysgolion

Protecting School Staff

Q5 David Davies spoken in Welsh and English p. 16

C5 David Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 16

What new measures is the Minister proposing to introduce to protect school staff from abusive pupils and relatives of pupils? (OAQ12481)

yn Saesneg Pa fesurau newydd y mae’r Gweinidog yn bwriadau eu cyflwyno i amddiffyn staff ysgolion rhag disgyblion a pherthnasau disgyblion treisgar? (OAQ12481)

Llongyfarchiadau i’r Gweinidog ar ei Chymraeg.

in Welsh Congratulations to the Minister on her Welsh.

However, I hope that it is alright that I asked my question in English.

yn Saesneg Fodd bynnag, gobeithiaf ei bod yn iawn imi ofyn fy nghwestiwn yn Saesneg.

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 16

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 16

Mae eich Cymraeg chi yn well na fy Nghymraeg i.

Your Welsh is better than mine.

David Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 16

David Davies spoken in Welsh p. 16

Dim o gwbl, Weinidog.

Not at all, Minister.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 16

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Order. We may applaud the Minister’s brave choice this morning, but Members are free to choose which language they wish to use in the Assembly.

Trefn. Gallwn gymeradwyo dewis dewr y Gweinidog y bore yma, ond mae rhyddid i Weinidogion ddewis pa bynnag iaith y dymunant ei defnyddio yn y Cynulliad.

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 17

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 17

Mae eich cwestiwn yn bwysig. Yng Nghymru, nid ydym yn barod i oddef ymddygiad o’r fath yn ein hysgolion. Yr wyf ar hyn o bryd yn adolygu’r canllawiau sydd ar gael i athrawon ar reoli disgyblion, ac yr wyf hefyd yn ystyried a ddylwn geisio estyniad ar y pwerau sydd ar gael o dan Ddeddf Trosedd ac Anrhefn 1998 i orfodi gorchmynion bod yn rhiant pan fo plant yn mynnu ymddwyn mewn ffordd aflonyddgar neu dreisgar byth a hefyd.

Your question is important. In Wales, we are not prepared to tolerate such behaviour in our schools. I am currently reviewing the guidelines provided to teachers on controlling pupils and I am also considering whether I should seek an extension of the powers available under the Crime and Disorder Act 1998 to impose parenting orders where children persistently act disruptively or violently.

David Davies spoken in English p. 17

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

I welcome that, Minister. You will be aware that the NHS automatically prosecutes anybody who threatens a member of hospital staff. Do you agree that local education authorities should be doing the same?

Croesawaf hynny, Weinidog. Fe wyddoch fod yr NHS yn awtomatig yn erlyn unrhyw un sydd yn bygwth aelod o staff ysbyty. A gytunwch y dylai awdurdodau addysg lleol wneud yr un peth?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 17

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 17

Cyhoeddodd y Swyddfa Gymreig ganllawiau a chyngor ar reoli disgyblion, sef cylchlythyr 37/98 sydd yn dwyn y teitl ‘Defnyddio Grym Rhesymol i Reoli neu Ffrwyno Disgyblion’. Ar hyn o bryd yr ydym yn y broses o’i ail-ddosbarthu ledled yr adran yn sgîl digwyddiadau diweddar mewn ysgolion ac yn enwedig wedi achos Marjorie Evans.

The Welsh Office issued guidelines and advice on controlling pupils entitled ‘The Use of Reasonable Force to Control or Restrain Pupils’ circular 37/98. We are currently in the process of redistributing it throughout the department in light of recent events in schools, and in particular, the Marjorie Evans case.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 17

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Is it not the case that, as well as protecting staff from any danger, we must also consider tackling the root causes of abusive pupils in the social context? Would you say that, sometimes, such behaviour is symptomatic of the wrongs—which I see in my community daily—that this Government has had to put right after 18 years of Conservative government? Do you agree that initiatives such as Communities First will help break—[CONSERVATIVE ASSEMBLY MEMBERS: ‘Rubbish.’]

Yn ogystal â diogelu staff rhag peryglon, onid yw’n wir y dylem hefyd ystyried mynd at wraidd ymddygiad disgyblion difrïol yn y cyd-destun cymdeithasol? A fyddech yn dweud bod ymddygiad o’r fath weithiau yn deillio o’r camweddau—a welaf yn ddyddiol yn fy nghymuned i—y mae’r Llywodraeth hon yn gorfod eu hunioni ar ôl 18 mlynedd o lywodraeth Geidwadol? Oni chytunwch y bydd mentrau fel Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn helpu i dorri––[AELODAU CEIDWADOL Y CYNULLIAD: ‘Lol.’]

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 17

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Order. What is exciting Members this morning? I am perfectly relaxed myself.

Trefn. Beth sydd yn cyffroi yr Aelodau y bore yma? Yr wyf yn hollol ddigynnwrf fy hun.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 17

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Do you agree that initiatives such as Communities First along with other measures to tackle social exclusion will help to break the cycle of deprivation that leads to such behaviour?

A gytunwch y bydd mentrau fel Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf ynghyd â mesurau eraill i fynd i’r afael ag allgáu cymdeithasol yn helpu i dorri’r cylch o amddifadedd sydd yn arwain at ymddygiad o’r fath?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 18

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 18

Mae’n rhaid i athrawon a chymuned yr ysgol amddiffyn eu hunain rhag tresmaswyr a disgyblion treisgar. Cytunaf fod Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn strategaeth a pholisi pwysig i’r Cynulliad i helpu holl gymunedau Cymru.

Teachers and the school community have to defend themselves from trespassers and violent pupils. I agree that Communities First is an important strategy and policy for the Assembly to assist all the communities in Wales.

Gwaith ELWa

Progress Made by ELWa

Q6 Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 18

C6 Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

Could the Minister update the Assembly on the progress made by Education and Learning Wales since its launch on 1 April this year? (OAQ12513)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddweud wrth y Cynulliad beth fu hynt gwaith Dysgu ac Addysgu Cymru ers ei lansio ar Ebrill 1 eleni? (OAQ112593)

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 18

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 18

Cyfuniad yw ELWa o Gyngor Cenedlaethol Cymru dros Addysg a Hyfforddiant a Chyngor Cyllido Addysg Uwch Cymru. Mae’r cyngor cenedlaethol wedi dechrau arni’n dda yn ystod ei dri mis cyntaf. Mae llawer o waith ar y gweill, gan gynnwys datblygu ei gynllun corfforaethol cyntaf. Mae’n ymgynghori’n eang ar draws Cymru drwy gyfrwng trafodaethau cyhoeddus a gynhelir gan ELWa, a thrwy ddulliau eraill. Mae sylwadau budd-ddeiliaid, a sylwadau’r cyhoedd, yn helpu i lywio ymateb strategol y Cyngor i’w gylch gwaith eang ac ymestynnol.

ELWa is an amalgamation of the National Council for Education and Training for Wales and the Higher Education Funding Council for Wales. The national council has made an encouraging start during its first three months. A great deal of work is already in hand, including the development of its first corporate plan. It is consulting widely across Wales through the ELWa public debates and other fora. Feedback from the stakeholder organisations and the public is helping to inform and shape the council’s strategic response to its wide-ranging and challenging remit.

Mae’r cyngor wrthi eisoes yn adeiladu ar yr ymgyrch dros sgiliau a dysgu ar y cyd â mudiadau eraill, megis NIACE Dysgu Cymru ac ystod eang o ddarparwyr addysg a busnesau, i godi proffil dysgu gydol oes ledled Cymru drwy gyfrwng mentrau megis y diploma sgiliau modern i oedolion, a lansiwyd ar 28 Mehefin. Mae hefyd yn dechrau ehangu’r ystod cyfleoedd sydd ar gael i ddysgwyr.

The council is already building on the campaign for skills and learning in conjunction with other organisations such as the National Institute of Adult Continuing Education and a wide range of learning providers and businesses to raise the profile of lifelong learning throughout Wales through initiatives such as the new modern skills diploma for adults, which was launched on 28 June. It is also beginning to broaden the range of opportunities available to learners.

Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 18

Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

You are correct to say that ELWa has a challenging remit. Will you assure me that its policies on social exclusion will be closely monitored to ensure that it is tackling these issues and delivering for people in socially disadvantaged areas?

Yr ydych yn gywir i ddweud fod gan ELWa gylch gwaith heriol. A roddwch sicrwydd imi y caiff ei bolisïau ar allgáu cymdeithasol eu monitro’n fanwl i sicrhau ei fod yn mynd i’r afael â’r materion hyn ac yn cynnig darpariaeth ar gyfer pobl mewn ardaloedd dan anfantais gymdeithasol?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 18

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 18

Mae hwnnw’n gwestiwn pwysig. Mae mynd i’r afael â phroblem allgáu cymdeithasol yn un o brif flaenoriaethau Cyngor Cenedlaethol Cymru dros Addysg a Hyffordiant. Yn ei lythyr gorchwyl, cyfeiriais at y cyfraniad sylweddol y disgwyliwn iddo ei wneud. Yr ydym am weld cynnydd yn lefelau sgiliau sylfaenol, mwy o bobl yn cyfranogi o ddysgu, yn arbennig mewn cymunedau difreintiedig, a mwy o fynediad i ddysgu fel y gall pawb gyflawni eu potensial llawn. Yn ddi-amau, addysg yw’r allwedd i hyrwyddo cynhwysedd cymdeithasol.

That is an important question. Tackling social exclusion is one of the highest priorities of the National Council for Education and Training for Wales. In its remit letter, I referred to the considerable contribution that we expect it to make. We want to see progress in the levels of basic skills, more people participating in education, in disadvantaged communities in particular, and more access to learning so that everyone can achieve their full potential. Without a doubt, learning is the key to promoting social inclusion.

Phil Williams siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 19

Phil Williams spoken in Welsh p. 19

Mae llwyddiant byrddau rhanbarthol ELWa yn dibynnu’n gryf ar yr aelodau o’r sector diwydiannol a busnes. A rannwch fy siom o weld cyn lleied o gynrychiolwyr y sector busnes ar y byrddau hynny, yn arbennig yn y de-ddwyrain, lle y mae’r mwyafrif o ddiwydiant Cymru?

The success of ELWa’s regional boards depends greatly on members from the business and industry sector. Do you share my disappointment at seeing so few representatives from the business sector on those boards, particularly in the south-east, where the majority of Wales’s industry is located?

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 19

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 19

Ni chredaf fod cynrychiolaeth y sector busnes ar y byrddau yn broblem. Llanwodd Pwyllgor Rhanbarthol y De-ddwyrain y lleoedd â phobl eraill i sicrhau bod gan bob sector gynrychiolaeth ar y byrddau drwy Gymru gyfan.

I do not think that representation of the business sector on the boards is a problem. The South East Wales Regional Committee filled the places with other people to ensure that every sector was represented on the boards throughout Wales.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 19

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 19

Diolch i’r Gweinidog am ateb y cwestiynau ac am y ffordd y’u hatebodd. [Cymeradwyaeth.]

I thank the Minister for answering the questions and for the manner in which she answered them. [Applause.]

Jane Davidson siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 19

Jane Davidson spoken in Welsh p. 19

Diolchaf i’r bobl a’m helpodd.

I thank the people who helped me.

Cwestiynau i Bwyllgor y Tŷ

Questions to the House Committee

Darparu Ffynhonnau Dwr

Water Fountain Facilities

Q1 Christine Gwyther spoken in English p. 19

C1 Christine Gwyther siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

Are there any plans to provide additional water fountain facilities on each floor of the Assembly building? (OAQ12585)

A oes unrhyw gynlluniau i ddarparu ffynhonnau dŵr ychwanegol ar bob llawr o adeilad y Cynulliad? (OAQ12585)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 19

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

There are no plans to do so.

Nid oes cynlluniau i wneud hynny.

Christine Gwyther spoken in English p. 19

Christine Gwyther siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

Thank you for that succinct answer. We are told constantly that water is good for you and at the moment we can access water for boiling to drink tea, coffee and cup-a-soups until it comes out of our ears. However, we do not have easy access to drinking water. That is a situation where a minimum outlay would reap maximum health benefits. Can this matter be reconsidered?

Diolch am yr ateb cryno hwnnw. Dywedir wrthym yn aml bod dŵr yn dda inni ac ar hyn o bryd gallwn gael dŵr i’w ferwi ar gyfer yfed te, coffi a chawl mewn cwpan nes y daw allan o’n clustiau. Fodd bynnag, nid yw’n hawdd inni gael gafael ar ddŵr yfed. Mae honno’n sefyllfa lle byddai’r gwariant lleiaf yn dwyn y budd mwyaf i iechyd. A ellir ailystyried y mater hwn?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 20

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

I will ensure that it is on the agenda for the House Committee’s next meeting. However, drinking water is available; it comes from a tap and is available at the tea-points in each block of every floor. Refrigerators are also installed, so it should be relatively easy for those Members who wish to have drinking water to obtain it.

Sicrhaf ei fod ar yr agenda ar gyfer cyfarfod nesaf Pwyllgor y Tŷ. Fodd bynnag, mae dŵr yfed ar gael; daw o dap ac mae ar gael mewn mannau te ym mhob bloc ar bob llawr. Mae oergelloedd hefyd ar gael, felly dylai fod yn weddol hawdd i’r Aelodau hynny sydd am gael dŵr i’w yfed i wneud hynny.

Rod Richards spoken in English p. 20

Rod Richards siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

In considering the provision of water fountains, will you also consider acquiring four stone lions and some pigeons to encircle a column headed by Lord Nelson, so that those of us who wish to celebrate Trafalgar day may do so in style?

Wrth ystyried darparu ffynhonnau dŵr, a ystyriwch hefyd gael pedwar llew carreg ac ychydig o golomennod o amgylch colofn â’r Arglwydd Nelson arni, fel y gall y rhai ohonom sydd am ddathlu dydd Trafalgar wneud hynny mewn steil?

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 20

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

Order. That was not to your usual standard of attempting to ask a supplementary. That question is not in order.

Trefn. Nid oedd hynny yn cyrraedd eich safon arferol o geisio gofyn cwestiwn atodol. Nid oedd y cwestiwn hwnnw mewn trefn.

Kirsty Williams spoken in English p. 20

Kirsty Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

Given the responsibility of the House Committee and the Presiding Office for additional facilities within this building, will you ensure that Members who are eager to blame the administration for changes—such as the new porch and security doors at the rear of this building—accept that their own parties, through their involvement with the House Committee, share some responsibility for such decisions, whatever facilities it adds to the building?

Wrth ystyried cyfrifoldeb Pwyllgor y Tŷ a Swyddfa’r Llywydd dros gyfleusterau ychwanegol o fewn yr adeilad hwn, a sicrhewch fod yr Aelodau sydd yn awyddus i weld bai ar y weinyddiaeth am newidiadau—megis y porth a’r drysau diogelwch newydd yng nghefn yr adeilad hwn—yn derbyn fod eu pleidiau hwy eu hunain, drwy fod yn aelodau o Bwyllgor y Tŷ, yn rhannu peth cyfrifoldeb am benderfyniadau o’r fath, pa bynnag gyfleusterau yr ychwanega i’r adeilad?

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh and English p. 20

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 20

Order. That question has no relevance to the supply of water fountains.

yn Saesneg Trefn. Nid oes gan y cwestiwn hwnnw unrhyw gysylltiad â’r cyflenwad o ffynhonnau dŵr.

Hoffwn gael cwestiynau atodol sydd ar bwnc y cwestiwn cyntaf.

in Welsh I would like to have supplementary questions that are on the subject of the first question.

Cynllun Iaith Swyddfa’r Llywydd

Welsh Language Scheme for the Presiding Office

C2 Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 21

Q2 Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 21

Pa gamau ymlaen sydd wedi cael eu cymryd ar gynllun iaith Swyddfa’r Llywydd? (OAQ12588)

What progress has been made on the Welsh language scheme for the Presiding Office? (OAQ12588)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 21

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

A thorough audit is being conducted of the use of the Welsh language in the services offered by the Presiding Office to the public, Members and their staff and Assembly staff. A questionnaire, designed specifically for the purpose, has been distributed to every branch within the Presiding Office. Information gathered has been collated and is now being used to prepare a report. The report will be presented to the House Committee in the next session. It will be used to develop a policy that will set out how the Presiding Office will deliver services in both languages.

Cynhelir archwiliad trylwyr o’r defnydd o’r iaith Gymraeg yn y gwasanaethau a gynigir gan Swyddfa’r Llywydd i’r cyhoedd, yr Aelodau a’u staff a staff y Cynulliad. Dosbarthwyd holiadur, a gynlluniwyd yn arbennig at y pwrpas, i holl ganghennau Swyddfa’r Llywydd. Mae’r wybodaeth a gasglwyd wedi ei choladu ac yn cael ei defnyddio i baratoi adroddiad. Cyflwynir yr adroddiad i Bwyllgor y Tŷ yn ystod y sesiwn nesaf. Caiff ei ddefnyddio i ddatblygu polisi fydd yn nodi sut y bydd y Llywydd yn cyflwyno gwasanaethau yn y ddwy iaith.

Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 21

Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 21

Tua’r adeg hon y llynedd, bu John Griffiths, Christine Humphreys a minnau mewn cyfarfod i drafod drafft cyntaf cynllun iaith i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol cyfan. Fodd bynnag, nid oes dal gennym gynllun iaith ar gyfer y Cynulliad na Swyddfa’r Llywydd. Heddiw pleidleisiwn ar orfodi 25 o gyrff newydd i gyflwyno cynlluniau iaith. Dylem deimlo rhywfaint o embaras wrth wneud hynny. A wnewch chi bwyso ar Swyddfa’r Llywydd ac ar y Weithrediaeth, dan arweiniad y Gweinidog sydd â chyfrifoldeb dros yr iaith Gymraeg, Jenny Randerson, i gyflwyno cynlluniau iaith ar gyfer y corff hwn yn ei gyfanrwydd?

At about this time last year, John Griffiths, Christine Humphreys and I attended a meeting to discuss the first draft of a language scheme for the whole of the National Assembly. However, we still do not have a language scheme for the Assembly or the Presiding Office. Today, we will vote on compelling 25 new organisations to introduce Welsh language schemes. We should feel a certain degreee of embarrassment in doing so. Will you press the Presiding Office and the Executive, under the guidance of the Minister with responsibility for the Welsh language, Jenny Randerson, to introduce Welsh language schemes for this entire organisation?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 21

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

The House Committee is not responsible for the actions of the Executive. You must ask Jenny that question. As a member of the House Committee, Elin, please join me in ensuring that the results of this survey are presented to the Committee. The House Committee has been reconstituted and has different terms of reference. I am confident that this matter will progress.

Nid yw Pwyllgor y Tŷ yn gyfrifol am weithredoedd y Weithrediaeth. Rhaid ichi ofyn y cwestiwn hwnnw i Jenny. Fel aelod o Bwyllgor y Tŷ, Elin, gofynnaf ichi ymuno â mi i sicrhau y caiff canlyniadau’r arolwg hwn ei gyflwyno i’r Pwyllgor. Mae Pwyllgor y Tŷ ar ei newydd wedd ac mae ganddo gylch gorchwyl gwahanol. Yr wyf yn hyderus y gwneir cynnydd ar y mater hwn.

Rosemary Butler spoken in English p. 21

Rosemary Butler siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

I am sure that all Members look forward to the implementation of the Welsh language scheme as soon as possible. Is there any progress—for those of us who choose not to speak Welsh, or who are unable to do so—on the use of new headphones? The ones we use in the Chamber are quite comfortable; however, the ones in the Committee rooms are like instruments of torture. They are very uncomfortable. I notice that the Clerk and other officials have good one-ear headphones. Why must those of us who like to keep our hairstyle tidy use these sets? Those without hair also have difficulty with them. It is a serious issue—

Yr wyf yn siŵr bod yr holl Aelodau’n edrych ymlaen at weithredu cynllun yr iaith Gymraeg cyn gynted â phosibl. A wnaethpwyd unrhyw gynnydd—ar gyfer y rhai hynny ohonom sydd yn dewis peidio â siarad Cymraeg, neu nad ydynt yn gallu gwneud hynny—o ran y defnydd o glustffonau newydd? Mae’r rhai a ddefnyddiwn yn y Siambr yn weddol gyffyrddus; fodd bynnag, mae’r rhai yn yr ystafelloedd Pwyllgora fel offer arteithio. Maent yn anghyfforddus iawn. Sylwaf fod gan y Clerc a swyddogion eraill glustffonau un glust da. Pam bod rhaid i’r rhai hynny ohonom sydd yn hoffi cadw ein gwallt yn daclus ddefnyddio’r clustffonau hyn? Mae’r rheini heb wallt hefyd yn cael anhawster. Mae’n fater difrifol—

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 22

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

Your hair looks fine.

Mae eich gwallt yn edrych yn iawn.

Rosemary Butler spoken in English p. 22

Rosemary Butler siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

Thank you, it is nice of you to say so. There is now more use of the Welsh language in Committees by Members, and some Committee Chairs conduct the Committee’s business through the medium of Welsh, and the headphones that we have are very uncomfortable. Will you ensure that Members will have the same headphones as officials by the autumn?

Diolch, chwarae teg ichi am ddweud hynny. Erbyn hyn, mae’r Aelodau’n defnyddio mwy o’r Gymraeg mewn Pwyllgorau, ac mae Cadeiryddion rhai Pwyllgorau’n cynnal busnes y Pwyllgor drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg, ac mae’r clustffonau sydd gennym yn anghyfforddus iawn. A wnewch chi sicrhau y bydd gan yr Aelodau yr un clustffonau â’r swyddogion erbyn yr hydref?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 22

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

This issue has been raised. Different types of headphones are available and are being tested. There is no satisfactory conclusion as yet. In Committee, the headphones are not placed over the head but under the chin. That causes problems. The House Committee understands that this is a problem and efforts are being made to resolve it.

Codwyd y mater hwn. Mae mathau gwahanol o glustffonau ar gael ac yn cael eu profi. Ni chafwyd canlyniad boddhaol hyd yma. Yn y Pwyllgor, nid dros y pen y caiff y clustffonau eu gosod ond o dan yr ên. Mae hynny’n peri problemau. Mae Pwyllgor y Tŷ yn deall fod hyn yn broblem ac mae ymdrechion yn cael eu gwneud i’w datrys.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 22

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

Question 3 has been withdrawn.

Tynnwyd cwestiwn 3 yn ôl.

Darparu Lleoedd Parcio ar gyfer Staff Cymorth

Car Parking Spaces for Support Staff

Q4 Nick Bourne spoken in English p. 22

C4 Nick Bourne siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

What progress has been made on the provision of car parking spaces for support staff? (OAQ112532)

Pa gynnydd a wnaethpwyd o ran darparu lleoedd parcio ar gyfer staff cymorth? (OAQ12532)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 22

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

The House Committee discussed a contingency plan yesterday, should the overflow car park be closed. We will do everything to protect the interests of Members and staff. At present, we are considering our rights in respect of the existing overflow car park.

Trafododd Pwyllgor y Tŷ gynllun wrth gefn ddoe, os caiff y maes parcio ychwanegol ei gau. Gwnawn bopeth i ddiogelu buddiannau’r Aelodau a’r staff. Ar hyn o bryd, yr ydym yn ystyried ein hawliau mewn perthynas â’r maes parcio ychwanegol presennol.

Nick Bourne spoken in English p. 23

Nick Bourne siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

You and Members are aware that there is great concern about a proposal to open a park and ride facility, which will have cost and convenience implications for support staff. It will cost £3 per day. How are we objecting to this? Clearly, it will have implications for Assembly salary levels and budgets, and convenience is also an issue.

Yr ydych chi a’r Aelodau yn ymwybodol bod pryder mawr ynghylch cynnig i agor cyfleuster parcio a theithio, a fydd â goblygiadau o ran cost a chyfleuster i staff cymorth. Bydd yn costio £3 y dydd. Sut yr ydym yn gwrthwynebu hyn? Yn amlwg, bydd goblygiadau i lefelau cyflog a chyllidebau’r Cynulliad, ac mae cyfleustra hefyd yn fater i’w ystyried.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 23

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

We intend to protect the interests of Members and staff. The existing agreements between the Assembly and its landlord, Grosvenor Waterside, are complex. They involve licences in the agreements for having the overflow car park. They also involve planning permission and various conditions. It would be inappropriate for me to comment at this stage, because it is possible that the matter may come before the courts. We hope that it will not. Under those circumstances, I do not wish to comment further. However, there are contingency proposals if we must abandon the overflow car park. We will protect the interests of all staff and Members.

Yr ydym yn bwriadu diogelu buddiannau’r Aelodau a’r staff. Mae’r trefniadau presennol rhwng y Cynulliad a’i landlord, Grosvenor Waterside, yn gymhleth. Maent yn cynnwys trwyddedau yn y cytundebau ar gyfer cael y maes parcio ychwanegol. Maent hefyd yn cynnwys caniatâd cynllunio ac amodau amrywiol. Byddai’n amhriodol imi wneud sylwadau ar hyn o bryd, oherwydd mae’n bosibl y caiff yr achos ei glywed gerbron y llysoedd. Gobeithiwn na fydd hyn yn digwydd. O dan yr amgylchiadau hynny, nid wyf yn dymuno gwneud sylwadau pellach. Fodd bynnag, mae gennym gynigion wrth gefn os bydd rhaid inni roi’r gorau i ddefnyddio’r maes parcio ychwanegol. Byddwn yn diogelu buddiannau’r holl staff a’r Aelodau.

Alun Pugh spoken in English p. 23

Alun Pugh siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

Ken Livingstone in London has devised an ambitious plan to reduce congestion by promoting public transport. Do you agree that pouring concrete to create ever-more car-parking space for the National Assembly is not the answer?

Mae Ken Livingstone yn Llundain wedi dyfeisio cynllun uchelgeisiol i leihau tagfeydd drwy hybu trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. A gytunwch nad tywallt concrid i greu hyd yn oed mwy o leoedd parcio ceir i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yw’r ateb?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 23

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

Yes. We have a green transport plan, which is now being prepared by the Executive Committee. I agree that congestion charging is a matter for the city council, not the Assembly.

Cytunaf. Mae gennym gynllun trafnidiaeth gwyrdd, sydd yn cael ei baratoi gan y Pwyllgor Gweithredol ar hyn o bryd. Cytunaf mai cyfrifoldeb cyngor y ddinas, nid y Cynulliad, yw mynd i’r afael â thagfeydd.

Jocelyn Davies spoken in English p. 23

Jocelyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

Are you aware that the provision of a parking space may be considered non-taxable, and will you investigate the possibility of staff being able to claim back any tax that they may have to pay on any future charges that they may face?

A ydych yn ymwybodol y gellir ystyried darparu lle parcio fel rhywbeth nad yw’n drethadwy, ac a ymchwiliwch i’r posibilrwydd y gall staff wneud cais am ad-daliad o unrhyw dreth y gallai fod yn rhaid iddynt ei thalu ar unrhyw daliadau y gallant eu hwynebu yn y dyfodol?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 24

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

If it is necessary—and we are doing our best to protect the interests of all staff and Members so that it will not be—we will consider that.

Os oes angen—ac fe wnawn ein gorau i ddiogelu buddiannau yr holl staff a’r Aelodau fel na fydd hynny’n digwydd—fe ystyriwn hynny.

Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 24

Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

As you know, the House Committee yesterday spent considerable time discussing this issue and gives great weight to protecting the parking provision for staff. However, will you join me in urging Assembly Members to be responsible in the use of their allotted car-parking spaces and to ensure that if they do not use them, they allocate their spaces to support staff or civil servants and do so before we go into recess?

Fel y gwyddoch, treuliodd Pwyllgor y Tŷ gryn amser ddoe yn trafod y mater hwn a rhydd bwyslais mawr ar ddiogelu’r ddarpariaeth parcio i staff. Fodd bynnag, a ymunwch â mi i roi pwysau ar Aelodau’r Cynulliad i fod yn gyfrifol wrth ddefnyddio’r lleoedd parcio ceir a neilltuwyd ar eu cyfer ac i sicrhau eu bod yn dyrannu eu lleoedd i staff cymorth neu weision sifil pan na fyddant yn eu defnyddio, ac yn gwneud hynny cyn y toriad?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 24

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

That is an important point and has been made known to Members. At the moment, every Member has a parking place assigned to them. I ask Members to arrange for your staff to be able to use your parking place should you not be here during the summer. I know that Members will be coming in over the summer, as happened last year. However, it is important that, where possible, Members and staff should travel by public transport. Public transport is not always good—the Valley Lines trains are awful—so I understand that people must travel here by car. When they do so, can they possibly car share? If they cannot, can they use public transport on some days and travel here by car on others? The green transport strategy being produced by the Executive will at least be able to help us when it is produced. Meanwhile, I ask for Members’ forbearance and help on this matter.

Mae hynny’n bwynt pwysig ac fe’i pwysleisiwyd i’r Aelodau. Ar hyn o bryd, mae lle parcio wedi’i neilltuo ar gyfer pob Aelod. Gofynnaf i’r Aelodau drefnu i’ch staff allu defnyddio eich lle parcio os na fyddwch yma dros yr haf. Gwn y bydd yr Aelodau yn dod i mewn dros yr haf, fel y gwnaethant y llynedd. Fodd bynnag, mae’n bwysig i’r Aelodau a’r staff, lle y bo’n bosibl, deithio ar drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Nid yw trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn dda bob amser—mae trenau Valley Lines yn warthus—felly deallaf pam bod rhaid i bobl deithio yma yn eu ceir. Pan wnânt hynny, a fyddai’n bosibl iddynt rannu ceir? Os nad yw hynny’n bosibl, a allant ddefnyddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ar rai dyddiau a theithio yma yn eu ceir ar ddyddiau eraill? O leiaf bydd y strategaeth drafnidiaeth werdd a gynhyrchir gan y Weithrediaeth yn gallu ein helpu pan gaiff ei chynhyrchu. Yn y cyfamser, gofynnaf am amynedd a chymorth yr Aelodau ar y mater hwn.

Datblygiadau Diweddaraf wrth Godi’r Siambr Ddadlau Newydd

Progress of the Construction of the New Debating Chamber

Q5 Owen John Thomas spoken in English p. 24

C5 Owen John Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

Is the Committee in a position to keep us updated on progress on the construction of the new debating chamber? (OAQ12519)

A yw’r Pwyllgor yn gallu rhoi adroddiad ar y datblygiadau diweddaraf wrth godi’r siambr ddadlau newydd? (OAQ12519)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 25

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

It is the role of the House Committee to ensure that individual Assembly Members’ views are taken into account in the design of the building. However, the responsibility for reporting to the Assembly on progress on the construction of the new Assembly debating chamber rests with the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities. Party groups are kept informed of progress and consulted through the policy steering group.

Rôl Pwyllgor y Tŷ yw sicrhau y caiff barn Aelodau unigol y Cynulliad ei hystyried wrth gynllunio’r adeilad. Fodd bynnag, y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau sydd yn gyfrifol am gyflwyno adroddiadau i’r Cynulliad ar y cynnydd a wneir ar siambr ddadlau newydd y Cynulliad. Hysbysir grwpiau’r pleidiau o’r cynnydd ac ymgynghorir â hwy drwy’r grŵp llywio polisi.

Owen John Thomas spoken in English p. 25

Owen John Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

As well as doing all in your power to keep the costs under control, will you also promise to safeguard the architectural integrity of the project, because it is crucial that we have a focal point for democracy of which we can all be proud?

Yn ogystal â gwneud popeth o fewn eich gallu i gadw rheolaeth ar y costau, a roddwch addewid hefyd i ddiogelu integredd pensaernïol y prosiect, oherwydd mae’n hanfodol bod gennym ganolbwynt ar gyfer democratiaeth y gall pawb ohonom ymfalchïo ynddo?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 25

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

There are members of the Government present who will have heard your question. Finance is a matter for the Executive, and I am sure it will bear in mind the other points that you made. As far as the debating chamber is concerned, I am sure that the House Committee will be presented with proposals and be allowed to comment on them, and will ensure that all Assembly Members can comment on them before they are finalised.

Mae aelodau o’r Llywodraeth yn bresennol a fydd wedi clywed eich cwestiwn. Mater i’r Weithrediaeth yw cyllid, ac yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd yn ystyried y pwyntiau eraill a wnaethoch. O ran y siambr ddadlau, yr wyf yn siŵr y cyflwynir cynigion i Bwyllgor y Tŷ ac y caiff wneud sylwadau arnynt, a bydd yn sicrhau y gall holl Aelodau’r Cynulliad wneud sylwadau arnynt cyn iddynt gael eu cyflwyno’n derfynol.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 25

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

Question 6 has been transferred for written answer.

Trosglwyddwyd cwestiwn 6 i’w ateb yn ysgrifenedig.

Gwella System OSIRIS yn Swyddfeydd Etholaethol Aelodau

Improving the OSIRIS System in Constituency Offices

Q7 Peter Law spoken in English p. 25

C7 Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

What plans are there to improve the OSIRIS system in constituency offices of Members? (OAQ12520)

Pa gynlluniau sydd i wella’r system OSIRIS yn swyddfeydd etholaethol Aelodau? (OAQ12520)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 25

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

A significant improvement in the speed and efficiency of the OSIRIS network for remote access users will not be seen until there is an extensive broadband communications network in place across Wales. That is a policy matter for the Assembly Cabinet and any detailed questions on progress should be directed to the Minister for Assembly Business, as the Minister with responsibility for e-commerce.

Ni welir gwelliant sylweddol yng nghyflymder ac effeithlonrwydd y rhwydwaith OSIRIS ar gyfer defnyddwyr mynediad o bell nes y bydd rhwydwaith cyfathrebu band llydan helaeth wedi’i sefydlu ledled Cymru. Mae hynny’n fater polisi ar gyfer Cabinet y Cynulliad a dylid cyfeirio unrhyw gwestiynau manwl ar gynnydd i’r Trefnydd, fel y Gweinidog sydd â chyfrifoldeb dros e-fasnach.

Peter Law spoken in English p. 26

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

I thank you and the members of the House Committee for the positive way in which you approach your work for Assembly Members. Can you do all that is possible to advise the Minister of the need for action to improve what Members and their support staff see as a steam-powered system in our constituency offices, which affects how efficiently we can serve our constituents?

Diolch i chi ac aelodau Pwyllgor y Tŷ am y ffordd gadarnhaol yr ydych yn mynd i’r afael â’ch gwaith ar ran Aelodau’r Cynulliad. A allwch wneud popeth o fewn gallu i hysbysu’r Gweinidog o’r angen i weithredu er mwyn gwella yr hyn y gwêl yr Aelodau a’u staff cymorth fel system hen ffasiwn yn ein swyddfeydd etholaethol, sydd yn effeithio ar ba mor effeithlon y gallwn wasanaethu ein hetholwyr?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 26

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

I agree that the systems are slow. Options were presented to the July meeting of the House Committee’s information technology sub-group, and that group has asked to be informed of progress at its next meeting.

Cytunaf fod y systemau yn araf. Cyflwynwyd opsiynau i gyfarfod is-grŵp technoleg gwybodaeth Pwyllgor y Tŷ ym mis Gorffennaf, ac mae’r grŵp hwnnw wedi gofyn i gael ei hysbysu o’r cynnydd yn ei gyfarfod nesaf.

Perfformiad Amgylcheddol Adeilad Newydd y Cynulliad

Environmental Performance of the New Assembly Building

Q8 Brian Hancock spoken in English p. 26

C8 Brian Hancock siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

What recent discussions has the Committee had with the new building project steering group regarding the environmental performance of the new Assembly building? (OAQ12586)

Pa drafodaethau diweddar y mae’r Pwyllgor wedi’u cael gyda grŵp llywio prosiect yr adeilad newydd o ran perfformiad amgylcheddol adeilad newydd y Cynulliad? (OAQ12586)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 26

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

The House Committee has been consulted by the policy steering group on several issues relating to the design and use of the new building, but not on its environmental performance. The House Committee will ensure that Members’ views are considered in the design of the building as a place where they will do business. More general issues of procurement or construction policy are the responsibility of the policy steering group.

Ymgynghorodd y grŵp llywio polisi â Phwyllgor y Tŷ ar sawl mater yn ymwneud â chynllun a defnydd yr adeilad newydd, ond nid ar ei berfformiad amgylcheddol. Bydd Pwyllgor y Tŷ yn sicrhau y caiff safbwyntiau yr Aelodau eu hystyried wrth gynllunio’r adeilad fel lle y byddant yn cynnal eu busnes. Cyfrifoldeb y grŵp llywio polisi yw materion mwy cyffredinol ynglŷn â pholisi caffael neu adeiladu.

Brian Hancock spoken in English p. 26

Brian Hancock siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

I am surprised to hear that, bearing in mind that most buildings today have some sort of environmental impact. For example, heat efficiency, recovery and regeneration, emissivity of glass and insulation must be considered. Measures to prevent sick building syndrome are also extremely important, as are measures to prevent flooding, which we are experiencing in the basement car park today.

Synnaf wrth glywed hynny, o gofio y caiff y rhan fwyaf o adeiladau heddiw ryw fath o effaith amgylcheddol. Er enghraifft, rhaid ystyried effeithlonrwydd gwres, adfer ac ailddefnyddio, allyrredd gwydr ac inswleiddio. Mae mesurau i atal syndrom adeilad afiach hefyd yn bwysig iawn, ac hefyd fesurau i atal llifogydd, fel y rhai yn y maes parcio ar yr is-lawr heddiw.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 27

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

Many of the issues that you raised are being taken into account in the construction of the new building. In terms of environmental performance generally, I understand that, from the early days of the design brief for the building project, it was required to achieve at least a very good certification under the Building Research Establishment’s environmental assessment method, as I mentioned in a previous answer. The design team has established that. The scheme easily achieves a very good green rating and is close to achieving an excellent rating.

Ystyrir llawer o’r materion a godwyd gennych wrth adeiladu’r adeilad newydd. O ran perfformiad amgylcheddol yn gyffredinol, deallaf, o ddyddiau cynnar y brîff cynllunio ar gyfer y prosiect adeiladu, ei bod yn ofynnol cyflawni ardystiad da iawn o leiaf o dan ddull asesu amgylcheddol y Sefydliad Ymchwil Adeiladu, fel y nodais mewn ateb blaenorol. Mae’r tîm cynllunio wedi sefydlu hynny. Mae’r cynllun yn cyrraedd safon werdd dda iawn ac mae’n agos at gyrraedd safon wych.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 27

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

I call William Graham to ask question 9.

Galwaf ar William Graham i ofyn cwestiwn 9.

William Graham spoken in English p. 27

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

I withdraw my question as it has been answered by the response to question 4.

Tynnaf fy nghwestiwn yn ôl, oherwydd fe’i hatebwyd yn yr ymateb i gwestiwn 4.

Ystafell ar Gyfer Myfyrio neu Addoli

Room for Reflection or Worship

Q10 David Melding spoken in English p. 27

C10 David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

When will a room for reflection or worship be established in the National Assembly with regard to OAQ1997JS answered on 16 November 1999? (OAQ12531)

Pryd y bydd ystafell ar gyfer myfyrio neu addoli yn cael ei sefydlu yn y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol mewn perthynas ag OAQ1997JS a atebwyd ar 16 Tachwedd 1999? (OAQ12531)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 27

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

I appreciate the value of a room for quiet contemplation for Members and staff. The House Committee considered this matter and accepted, in principle, that such a room should be set aside. Current space pressures within the building are such that there is no vacant space. Consideration will be given in due course to making space available once the new building is open. I propose that this issue be reconsidered as a part of that process.

Gwerthfawrogaf werth ystafell ar gyfer myfyrdod tawel i Aelodau a staff. Ystyriodd Pwyllgor y Tŷ y mater hwn a derbyniodd, mewn egwyddor, y dylid neilltuo ystafell o’r fath. Mae’r pwysau presennol o ran lle o fewn yr adeilad yn golygu nad oes lle gwag ar gael. Rhoddir ystyriaeth maes o law i neilltuo lle unwaith y bydd yr adeilad newydd ar agor. Cynigiaf y dylid ailystyried y mater hwn fel rhan o’r broses honno.

David Melding spoken in English p. 27

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

Although this decision has been made in principle, it is disappointing that, after two years, there is still no progress. We are now told that we must wait until the new building has been constructed. Will you at least assure us that, as soon as that building is in use, a room will be made available immediately, not in principle but in practice?

Er y gwnaethpwyd y penderfyniad hwn mewn egwyddor, mae’n siomedig, ar ôl dwy flynedd, nad oes unrhyw gynnydd o hyd. Dywedir wrthym bellach bod rhaid inni aros nes bydd yr adeilad newydd wedi’i adeiladu. A roddwch sicrwydd inni o leiaf, cyn gynted ag y bydd yr adeilad hwnnw’n cael ei ddefnyddio, y bydd ystafell ar gael ar unwaith, nid mewn egwyddor ond mewn gwirionedd?

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 28

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 28

There is every prospect of that. If you could identify a suitable room in this building and get your colleagues to accept that it should be a room for contemplation, then I am sure that we could have it much earlier.

Mae hynny’n debygol iawn. Os gallech nodi ystafell addas yn yr adeilad hwn a chael eich cyd-Aelodau i dderbyn y dylai fod yn ystafell ar gyfer myfyrdod, yna yr wyf yn siŵr y gallem gael ystafell yn llawer cynharach.

Lorraine Barrett spoken in English p. 28

Lorraine Barrett siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 28

As someone who does not need a room for reflection or worship, I remind Members and staff that the invitation from Reverend Michael Rees of the Lightship 2000 remains open. Anyone is welcome over there. If people need a quiet corner, either on their own or with Michael Rees, they are more than welcome.

Fel rhywun nad oes angen ystafell i fyfyrio nac addoli, hoffwn atgoffa’r Aelodau a’r staff fod y gwahoddiad gan y Parchedig Michael Rees o Lightship 2000 yn dal i sefyll. Mae croeso i unrhyw un fynd yno. Os oes angen cornel dawel ar unrhyw un, naill ai ar eu pen eu hunain neu gyda Michael Rees, mae croeso cynnes iddynt.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 28

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 28

I hope that that is helpful to you, David.

Gobeithio bod hynny’n ddefnyddiol ichi, David.

Integreiddio Cynaliadwyedd

Integrating Sustainabilty

C11 Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 28

Q11 Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 28

Pa gamau sydd wedi’u cymryd i integreiddio cynaliadwyedd i weithrediadau mewnol y Cynulliad? (OAQ12587)

What steps have been taken to integrate sustainability into the Assembly’s internal operations? (OAQ12587)

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 28

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 28

Green housekeeping, energy efficiency and environmentally-friendly measures are already in place and will be maintained and increased where possible. Steps have been taken to increase the amount of recycling and reduce the amount of waste going to landfill.

Mae cynnal a chadw gwyrdd, effeithlonrwydd ynni a mesurau sydd yn llesol i’r amgylchedd mewn grym eisoes a chânt eu cynnal a’u cynyddu lle y bo’n bosibl. Cymerwyd camau i gynyddu maint yr ailgylchu a lleihau maint y gwastraff sydd yn mynd i safleoedd tirlenwi.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 28

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 28

Gobeithiaf fod yr addewid honno yn fwy nag addewid eiriol ac y bydd yr holl weithgareddau yn y Siambr newydd yn seiliedig ar gynaliadwyedd, yn unol ag ymrwymiad y sefydliad hwn i ddatblygu cynaliadwy.

I hope that that commitment is more than a verbal commitment and that all activities in the new Chamber will be based on sustainability, in line with this institution’s commitment to sustainable development.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 28

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 28

Once the new building is operational, I am sure that we will be pleased with how it operates in relation to the environment. However, there will always be room for improvement and, once it is open, you will no doubt ask further questions to secure that improvement.

Unwaith y bydd yr adeilad newydd yn weithredol, yr wyf yn siŵr y byddwn yn fodlon â’r modd y bydd yn gweithredu mewn perthynas â’r amgylchedd. Fodd bynnag, bydd lle i wella o hyd ac, unwaith y bydd ar agor, mae’n siŵr y gofynnwch ragor o gwestiynau i sicrhau’r gwelliant hwnnw.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 29

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 29

Question 12 has been withdrawn.

Tynnwyd cwestiwn 12 yn ôl.

Pwyntiau o Drefn

Points of Order

David Melding spoken in English p. 29

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 29

Point of order. I raise this under Standing Order No. 6, particularly Standing Order No. 6.8, which makes provision for statements by Assembly Ministers. Standing Orders make no provision for written Cabinet statements. It is instructive, however, that provision is made in Standing Orders for written answers to questions. I refer you to Standing Order No. 6.33 to Standing Order No. 6.34(A). I therefore contend that, if it was intended that the Assembly would receive written Cabinet statements, provision would have been made in Standing Orders. Today, the Minister for Health and Social Services issued a written Cabinet statement on the new waiting times strategy. This is highly significant and is a major change in policy. The written statement concludes—and this is instructive:

Pwynt o drefn. Codaf hwn o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6, yn enwedig Rheol Sefydlog Rhif 6.8, sydd yn gwneud darpariaeth ar gyfer datganiadau gan Weinidogion y Cynulliad. Ni wna’r Rheolau Sefydlog unrhyw ddarpariaeth ar gyfer datganiadau ysgrifenedig gan y Cabinet. Mae’n addysgiadol, fodd bynnag, y gwneir darpariaeth mewn Rheolau Sefydlog ar gyfer atebion ysgrifenedig i gwestiynau. Fe’ch cyfeiriaf at Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.33 i Reol Rhif 6.34(A). Honnaf felly, os bwriadwyd i’r Cynulliad dderbyn datganiadau ysgrifenedig gan y Cabinet, y byddai darpariaeth ar gyfer hynny yn y Rheolau Sefydlog. Heddiw, cyhoeddodd y Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ddatganiad ysgrifenedig gan y Cabinet ar y strategaeth amseroedd aros newydd. Mae hyn yn arwyddocaol iawn ac mae’n newid mawr mewn polisi. Daw’r datganiad ysgrifenedig i ben—ac mae hyn yn addysgiadol—fel hyn:

‘Patients will be the beneficiaries of the strategy that I have announced today and I commend it to the Assembly.’

How can the Minister commend something to the Assembly without making an oral statement? A statement is well beyond the scrutiny of the Assembly and I regard that as most unsatisfactory and a breach of Standing Orders.

Sut y gall y Gweinidog gymeradwyo rhywbeth i’r Cynulliad heb wneud datganiad llafar? Mae datganiad ymhell y tu hwnt i graffu manwl y Cynulliad ac yr wyf yn ystyried bod hynny yn anfoddhaol iawn ac yn groes i’n Rheolau Sefydlog.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 29

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 29

Order. I will call the Minister for Assembly Business to respond. However, my view—and I have taken advice on this—is that this is not a breach of our Standing Orders. Using our intranet, the Government and any other Member can communicate information at anytime. The Government might wish to consider making a category of information available in the form of a written statement or, indeed, such a statement might appear in our official record in answer to a written question. That is not an unknown practice in Westminster and other places. It is known as the ‘planted question’, whereby a written question is tabled and, suddenly, a substantial statement emerges. We have not followed that practice, but it is a matter for the Government to consider. This would ensure that any statement would appear in the record of proceedings in the form of a written question.

Trefn. Galwaf ar y Trefnydd i ymateb. Fodd bynnag, fy marn i—ac yr wyf wedi derbyn cyngor ar hyn—yw nad yw hyn yn groes i’n Rheolau Sefydlog. Gan ddefnyddio ein mewnrwyd, gall y Llywodraeth ac unrhyw Aelod arall gyfathrebu gwybodaeth ar unrhyw adeg. Efallai y bydd y Llywodraeth hefyd am ystyried darparu categori o wybodaeth ar ffurf datganiad ysgrifenedig neu, yn wir, gallai datganiad o’r fath ymddangos yn ein cofnod swyddogol fel ateb i gwestiwn ysgrifenedig. Mae hyn yn arfer cyffredin yn San Steffan ac mewn mannau eraill. Caiff ei alw’n ‘gwestiwn cudd’, lle caiff cwestiwn ysgrifenedig ei gyflwyno ac, yn sydyn, bydd datganiad sylweddol yn ymddangos. Nid ydym wedi dilyn yr arfer hwnnw, ond mae’n fater i’r Llywodraeth ei ystyried. Byddai hyn yn sicrhau bod unrhyw ddatganiad yn ymddangos yng nghofnod y trafodion ar ffurf cwestiwn ysgrifenedig.

Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 30

Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 30

I welcome your ruling and guidance on this. No disrespect is intended in how this has been handled. I understand from my colleague, Jane Hutt, that she made this announcement to the Health and Social Services Committee last week. She intended to make this statement in Plenary this week. She distributed a written statement and I understand that the policy change, which she announced, was discussed at great length in the Committee and represents its views. The other aspect of this is the sheer volume of business that we need to cover in Plenary this week and next. I am coming under increasing pressure from Members to limit the amount of business, because it is likely that we must extend today’s session and the session a week today. In light of those considerations, my colleague decided to make the announcement in this way.

Croesawaf eich dyfarniad a’ch arweiniad ar hyn. Ni fwriadwyd unrhyw amharch yn y modd yr ymdriniwyd â hyn. Deallaf gan fy nghyd-Aelod, Jane Hutt, ei bod wedi gwneud y datganiad hwn i’r Pwyllgor Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol yr wythnos diwethaf. Yr oedd wedi bwriadu gwneud y datganiad hwn yn y Cyfarfod Llawn yr wythnos hon. Dosbarthodd ddatganiad ysgrifenedig a deallaf y trafodwyd y newid mewn polisi, a gyhoeddwyd ganddi, yn fanwl yn y Pwyllgor a’i fod yn cynrychioli ei farn. Yr agwedd arall i hyn yw maint y busnes y mae angen i ni ymdrin ag ef yn y Cyfarfod Llawn yr wythnos hon a’r wythnos nesaf. Rhydd yr Aelodau bwysau cynyddol arnaf i gyfyngu ar faint y busnes, oherwydd mae’n debygol y bydd rhaid inni ymestyn y sesiwn heddiw a’r cyfarfod wythnos i heddiw. Yng ngoleuni’r ystyriaethau hynny, penderfynodd fy nghyd-Aelod wneud y cyhoeddiad yn y modd hwn.

David Melding spoken in English p. 30

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 30

What will offend many Assembly Members is that this statement concludes with the Minister saying:

Yr hyn a fydd yn digio llawer o Aelodau’r Cynulliad yw fod y datganiad hwn yn gorffen gyda’r Gweinidog yn dweud:

‘I commend it to the Assembly.’

Are we now in a position where policies can be commended to the Assembly outside Plenary sessions? It sets a grave precedent that a written Cabinet statement can be made on major policy changes. You are right that in other places they make such statements in answer to written questions, which is, at least, a transparent process. However, this is a different mechanism, which does not pretend to be open to active scrutiny and that is why we are here.

A ydym bellach mewn sefyllfa lle gellir cymeradwyo polisïau i’r Cynulliad y tu allan i Gyfarfodydd Llawn? Mae’n gosod cynsail wael y gall y Cabinet wneud datganiad ysgrifenedig ar newidiadau o bwys i bolisïau. Yr ydych yn gywir i ddweud eu bod yn gwneud datganiadau o’r fath fel ateb i gwestiynau ysgrifenedig mewn lleoedd eraill sydd, o leiaf, yn broses eglur. Fodd bynnag, mae hwn yn ddull gwahanol, nad yw’n esgus bod yn agored i graffu manwl gweithredol a dyna pam ein bod yma.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 31

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

The Minister for Assembly Business indicated that this matter has been fully debated in Committee. Therefore, the matter has been brought into the open in, at least, part of the Assembly. We are pressed for time. I understand that. However, I want to encourage making major statements in Plenary and allowing questions on those statements. Perhaps we should discuss that further. It may mean compromising the amount of time allowed for making statements, resulting in shorter statements and subsequent questions. However, I would be happy for that matter to be discussed in Business Committee, when the new session begins. I see Members nodding in agreement.

Nododd y Trefnydd y cafwyd dadl lawn ar y mater hwn yn y Pwyllgor. Felly, daethpwyd â’r mater i’r amlwg mewn rhan o’r Cynulliad o leiaf. Nid oes gennym lawer o amser. Deallaf hynny. Fodd bynnag, hoffwn annog gwneud datganiadau o bwys mewn Cyfarfodydd Llawn a chaniatáu cwestiynau ar y datganiadau hynny. Efallai y dylem drafod hynny ymhellach. Gallai olygu cyfaddawdu o ran faint o amser a ganiateir ar gyfer gwneud datganiadau, gan arwain at ddatganiadau byrrach a chwestiynau i ddilyn. Fodd bynnag, byddwn yn fodlon i’r mater hwnnw gael ei drafod yn y Pwyllgor Busnes, pan fydd y sesiwn newydd yn cychwyn. Gwelaf fod yr Aelodau yn cytuno.

Alun Pugh spoken in English p. 31

Alun Pugh siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

Further to that point of order, the Chamberweb is limited. Will you consider asking for an upgrade so that such statements and, indeed, the full record of proceedings can be accessed on our screens?

Ymhellach i’r pwynt hwnnw o drefn, mae gwe’r Siambr yn gyfyngedig. A ystyriwch ofyn am ei huwchraddio fel y gellir cael mynediad i ddatganiadau o’r fath ac, yn wir, gofnod llawn y trafodion ar ein sgriniau?

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 31

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

We must consider the operation of the Chamberweb in the context of the present Chamber and the new building. I will ask for further technical advice on whether we can increase the amount of information available on the system as it currently stands.

Rhaid inni ystyried gweithredu gwe’r Siambr yng nghyd-destun y Siambr bresennol a’r adeilad newydd. Gofynnaf am ragor o gyngor technegol ar pa un ai a allwn gynyddu maint yr wybodaeth sydd ar gael ar y system fel y mae ar hyn o bryd.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 31

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

I raise a point of order under Standing Order No. 2.4 and No. 6.33, which relate to the accountability of Ministers to the Assembly. On 3 July, the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities met officials and members of the Isle of Anglesey County Council. Colleagues may be familiar with this council; it is almost unique in Wales in its inability to efficiently manage its internal affairs. The Minister for Rural Affairs—

Codaf bwynt o drefn o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 2.4 a Rhif 6.33, sydd yn ymwneud ag atebolrwydd Gweinidogion i’r Cynulliad. Ar 3 Gorffennaf, cyfarfu’r Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau â swyddogion ac aelodau Cyngor Sir Ynys Môn. Efallai bod fy nghyd-Aelodau yn gyfarwydd â’r cyngor hwn; mae bron yn unigryw yng Nghymru o ran ei anallu i reoli ei faterion mewnol yn effeithlon. Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 31

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

Order. Whether or not a local authority in Wales is able to manage its affairs is not a matter for me. It is certainly not a matter for public debate on a point of order. Will you address your point of order to a relevant issue on which I can rule?

Trefn. Nid mater i mi yw pa un ai a all awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru reoli ei faterion. Yn sicr, nid yw’n fater ar gyfer dadl gyhoeddus ar bwynt o drefn. A gyfeiriwch eich pwynt o drefn at fater perthnasol y gallaf ddyfarnu arno?

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 32

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

In the last 10 days, I have tabled six questions to the Minister asking her to make a statement on the nature and purpose of her visit to the Isle of Anglesey County Council. She has refused to answer those questions as she says that the discussions were held in confidence. Given the council’s recent history, she may well have visited to sort out some of the council’s problems. However, she has refused to make any statement about the nature and purpose of her visit. I ask you to rule on the accountability—according to Standing Orders— of Ministers who make official visits on behalf of the Assembly and then refuse to answer questions about those visits.

Dros y 10 diwrnod diwethaf, yr wyf wedi cyflwyno chwe chwestiwn i’r Gweinidog yn gofyn iddi wneud datganiad ar natur a phwrpas ei hymweliad â Chyngor Sir Ynys Môn. Gwrthododd ateb y cwestiynau hynny gan ddweud y cynhaliwyd y trafodaethau yn gyfrinachol. O ystyried hanes diweddar y cyngor, efallai ei bod wedi ymweld er mwyn datrys rhai o broblemau’r cyngor. Fodd bynnag, gwrthododd wneud unrhyw ddatganiad ar natur a phwrpas ei hymweliad. Gofynnaf ichi ddyfarnu ar atebolrwydd—yn ôl y Rheolau Sefydlog—Gweinidogion sydd yn gwneud ymweliadau swyddogol ar ran y Cynulliad ac yna’n gwrthod ateb cwestiynau ynghylch yr ymweliadau hynny.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 32

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

Ministers and members of the executive in all jurisdictions have private meetings with other bodies, some of which might be public bodies. It is a matter for the Minister if she wishes to make a statement on that visit at this time. I am afraid that I cannot help you. If the Minister is not prepared to make a statement—for good reason in this case, I am sure—it is a matter that you should pursue through your connections. I am sure that there are members of the Isle of Anglesey County Council who are members of your party’s persuasion—in fact, I know that there are. You could discuss this matter with them, in confidence. However, it is not a point of order as far as this Chamber is concerned.

Mae Gweinidogion ac aelodau’r weithrediaeth ym mhob awdurdodaeth yn cael cyfarfodydd preifat â chyrff eraill, a gallai rhai ohonynt fod yn gyrff cyhoeddus. Mater i’r Gweinidog yw pa un ai a yw’n dymuno gwneud datganiad ar yr ymweliad hwnnw ar hyn o bryd. Mae arnaf ofn na allaf eich helpu. Os nad yw’r Gweinidog yn barod i wneud datganiad—a hynny am reswm da yn yr achos hwn, mae’n siŵr—mae’n fater y dylech fynd ar ei drywydd drwy eich cysylltiadau. Yr wyf yn siŵr bod aelodau o Gyngor Sir Ynys Môn sydd yn aelodau o’ch plaid chi—yn wir, gwn fod hynny’n wir. Gallech drafod y mater hwn gyda hwy, yn gyfrinachol. Fodd bynnag, nid yw’n bwynt o drefn mewn perthynas â’r Siambr hon.

Rheoliadau Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg

The Welsh Language Act Regulations

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 32

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

I have selected amendments 1 and 2 in the name of Jocelyn Davies.

Yr wyf wedi dethol gwelliannau 1 a 2 yn enw Jocelyn Davies.

Jenny Randerson The Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language spoken in English p. 32

Jenny Randerson Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Jenny Randerson The Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language (continued) spoken in English p. 33

Jenny Randerson Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 33

I begin by offering my thanks to the Minister for Assembly Business for allocating time for discussion of this Order today.

Dechreuaf drwy gynnig fy niolch i’r Trefnydd am ddyrannu amser ar gyfer trafod y Gorchymyn hwn heddiw.

In bringing this legislation forward, I propose to extend the coverage of the public sector using the powers that we have under the Welsh Language Act 1993. The Act embodies the principle of equality between the English and Welsh languages, a vital principle to me, to the partnership Government and to the whole Assembly. It has been said on a number of occasions that there is plenty of mileage left in the Welsh Language Act 1993. I ask you to agree today that we should press further ahead down that road. By extending the coverage of the Act, we are extending the provision for a real language choice. That is a legitimate expectation for all the people of Wales. Some of the bodies named here today already have voluntary language schemes, but others will be starting afresh on the provision of bilingual services. That will make a real difference to the people who deal with those bodies.

Wrth gyflwyno’r ddeddfwriaeth hon, cynigiaf ymestyn cwmpas y sector cyhoeddus gan ddefnyddio ein pwerau o dan Ddeddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993. Mae’r Ddeddf yn ymgorffori’r egwyddor o gydraddoldeb rhwng y Gymraeg a’r Saesneg, egwyddor hanfodol i mi, i’r Llywodraeth bartneriaeth ac i’r Cynulliad cyfan. Dywedwyd ar sawl achlysur bod gan Ddeddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993 ddigon o ffordd i fynd eto. Gofynnaf ichi gytuno heddiw y dylem fynd ymhellach i lawr y llwybr hwnnw. Drwy ymestyn cwmpas y Ddeddf, yr ydym yn ymestyn y ddarpariaeth ar gyfer dewis iaith gwirioneddol. Mae hynny’n deg i bawb yng Nghymru ei ddisgwyl. Mae gan rai o’r cyrff a enwyd yma heddiw gynlluniau iaith gwirfoddol eisoes, ond bydd eraill yn cychwyn o’r newydd o ran darparu gwasanaethau dwyieithog. Bydd hynny’n gwneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol i’r bobl sydd yn ymdrin â’r cyrff hynny.

When the Welsh Language Act was drafted, section 6 was drawn up to give maximum scope to apply the principles of the Act to public life in Wales. During the passage of the Welsh Language Bill, the Government at the time made clear that the provisions contained within the Act would extend in due course to all branches of the public sector that provide services to and on behalf of the public in Wales. That was the reasoning behind the drafting of section 6(1)(o). In addition to the specific bodies named in section 6 of the Act, section 6(1)(o) allows the National Assembly to designate any additional body that it considers to be exercising functions of a public nature in Wales. Bodies so named can be notified by the Welsh Language Board that they must prepare a language scheme.

Pan ddrafftiwyd Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg, lluniwyd adran 6 er mwyn rhoi’r cyfle gorau posibl i gymhwyso egwyddorion y Ddeddf i fywyd cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Yn ystod taith Mesur yr Iaith Gymraeg, fe’i gwnaethpwyd yn eglur gan y Llywodraeth ar y pryd y byddai’r darpariaethau a gynhwyswyd o fewn y Ddeddf yn ymestyn ymhen amser i bob cangen o’r sector cyhoeddus sydd yn darparu gwasanaethau ar gyfer ac ar ran y cyhoedd yng Nghymru. Dyna oedd y rhesymeg y tu ôl i ddrafftio adran 6(1)(o). Yn ogystal â’r cyrff penodol a enwyd yn adran 6 y Ddeddf, mae adran 6(1)(o) yn caniatáu’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol i benodi unrhyw gorff ychwanegol yr ystyrir ei fod yn gwneud swyddogaethau o natur gyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Gall cyrff a enwir yn y modd hwn gael eu hysbysu gan Fwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg bod rhaid iddynt baratoi cynllun iaith.

So far, the board has approved 159 public sector Welsh language schemes. They include schemes from all kinds of bodies, from councils and health bodies, colleges and courts, to Government departments and agencies. A significant number of those bodies, such as the Benefits Agency, are based outside Wales and are funded by Whitehall departments and not by the Assembly. This is a considerable achievement by the board. It recognises the goodwill that now exists towards the Welsh language, as well as the needs of the population for whom Welsh is their mother tongue. The approval of this number of schemes since 1996, when the first scheme was approved, is a tremendous achievement by the board and the bodies concerned. From the experience of the ongoing review and development of the Assembly’s scheme, I know how complex these schemes can be. I also know how much consultation is necessary across organisations to ensure that all who are involved are signed up to the best way of implementing the principle that the Welsh and English languages should be treated equally in providing services to the public.

Hyd yma, cymeradwyodd y bwrdd 159 o gynlluniau iaith Gymraeg sector cyhoeddus. Maent yn cynnwys cynlluniau gan bob math o gyrff, gan gynghorau a chyrff iechyd, colegau a llysoedd, i adrannau ac asiantaethau’r Llywodraeth. Mae nifer sylweddol o’r cyrff hynny, megis yr Asiantaeth Budd-daliadau, wedi eu lleoli y tu allan i Gymru ac wedi’u hariannu gan adrannau Whitehall ac nid gan y Cynulliad. Mae hwn yn gamp sylweddol gan y bwrdd. Mae’n cydnabod yr ewyllys da sydd yn bodoli bellach tuag at yr iaith Gymraeg, yn ogystal ag anghenion y boblogaeth y mae’r Gymraeg yn famiaith iddynt. Mae cymeradwyo’r nifer hwn o gynlluniau ers 1996, pan gymeradwywyd y cynllun cyntaf, yn gamp aruthrol gan y bwrdd a’r cyrff dan sylw. Gwn pa mor gymhleth y gall y cynlluniau hyn fod, o brofiad yr adolygiad parhaus a datblygiad cynllun y Cynulliad. Gwn hefyd faint o ymgynghori sydd yn angenrheidiol ar draws sefydliadau er mwyn sicrhau bod pawb sy’n gysylltiedig â’r cynllun yn coleddu’r ffordd orau o weithredu’r egwyddor y dylai’r iaith Gymraeg a’r Saesneg gael eu trin yn gyfartal wrth ddarparu gwasanaethau i’r cyhoedd.

Language schemes are the practical effect of the Welsh Language Act 1993. The implementation of the schemes enables the Welsh-speaking public in Wales to access services in the language of their choice. This is the principle that guides the development of schemes, and bodies are asked to aspire to this principle so far as is appropriate in the circumstances and reasonably practicable.

Cynlluniau iaith yw gweithrediad ymarferol Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993. Mae gweithredu’r cynlluniau yn sicrhau bod gwasanaethau ar gael i’r cyhoedd Cymraeg eu hiaith yng Nghymru drwy gyfrwng eu dewis iaith. Dyma egwyddor sydd yn llywio datblygiad y cynlluniau, a gofynnir i gyrff anelu at ddilyn yr egwyddor hon cyhyd ag y bo’n ymarferol yn yr amgylchiadau ac yn rhesymol ymarferol.

I do not support Jocelyn Davies’s amendment 1, which relates to funding for the Welsh Language Board. That is not because I want the board to do anything less than a full job in monitoring language schemes. Additional staffing resources were allocated to the board in 2001-02, and its draft corporate plan proposed giving priority to support work on language schemes. In the event, it invested some of the money into other purposes. It has again this year identified work on language schemes as a top priority for the next budget planning round. However, I cannot prejudge today what decisions will be made on that. Decisions on Assembly spending will, as always, be made through the budget process.

Nid wyf yn cefnogi gwelliant 1 Jocelyn Davies, sydd yn ymwneud ag ariannu Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg. Nid yw hynny oherwydd fy mod am weld y bwrdd yn gwneud unrhyw beth llai na monitro’r cynlluniau iaith yn llawn. Dyrannwyd adnoddau staffio ychwanegol i’r bwrdd yn 2001-02, a chynigiodd ei gynllun corfforaethol drafft roi blaenoriaeth i gefnogi gwaith ar gynlluniau iaith. Fel y digwyddodd, buddsoddodd rywfaint o’r arian mewn dibenion eraill. Mae unwaith eto eleni wedi nodi gwaith ar gynlluniau iaith fel prif flaenoriaeth ar gyfer y cylch cynllunio’r gyllideb nesaf. Fodd bynnag, ni allaf ragfarnu pa benderfyniadau a wneir ar hynny. Gwneir penderfyniadau ar wariant y Cynulliad, fel sydd yn arferol, drwy’r broses gyllidebol.

The list of bodies included in the proposed legislation has been drawn up following consultation within the Assembly, with other Government departments, with the Welsh Language Board and with the bodies involved. I am grateful to the Culture Committee for warmly welcoming the draft Order at its meeting on 7 February. Some of the bodies included in the draft Order are of a higher profile than others as far as the public in Wales is concerned. Some of the bodies on the list already provide bilingual services. This is particularly true of those funded by the Assembly.

Lluniwyd y rhestr o gyrff sydd wedi eu cynnwys yn y ddedfwriaeth arfaethedig yn dilyn ymgynghori o fewn y Cynulliad, gydag adrannau eraill o’r llywodraeth, gyda Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg a gyda’r cyrff sydd yn gysylltiedig. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i’r Pwyllgor Diwylliant am groesawu’r Gorchymyn drafft yn gynnes yn ei gyfarfod ar 7 Chwefror. Mae gan rai o’r cyrff a gynhwysir yn y Gorchymyn drafft broffil uwch nag eraill yng ngolwg cyhoedd Cymru. Mae rhai o’r cyrff ar y rhestr eisoes yn darparu gwasanaethau dwyieithog. Mae hyn yn arbennig o wir am y rhai a ariennir gan y Cynulliad.

Some of the bodies are UK bodies that, nonetheless, provide services on behalf of the public in Wales. I am pleased that it has been possible to include bodies with which students from Wales have contact during their academic careers. In including the Student Loans Company and the Universities and Colleges Admissions Service in the regulations, we can ensure that these organisations give due regard to the requirement to provide a service that meets the needs of Welsh speaking students, particularly those who receive their education entirely through the medium of Welsh. Following the initial response of my colleague, Jane Davidson, to the report of the Rees commission on student hardship and the announcement of additional resources earlier this week, I am delighted that not only will students’ dependence on loans be lessened, but also that such services will be bilingual in future. UCAS and the Student Loans Company have made significant progress in providing a service in Welsh in advance of this legislation. They should be congratulated for that. If we want to reach the targets set in ‘Betterwales.com’—that a greater proportion of the Welsh population should speak Welsh—it is important that, on leaving school, students can still use their first language at every opportunity. I am keen to secure the place of the Welsh language in the post-16 education sector, and I hope that the relevant bodies will be high on the Welsh Language Board’s list of priorities in terms of notification to prepare schemes in future.

Y mae rhai o’r cyrff yn gyrff y DU sydd, er gwaethaf hynny, yn darparu gwasanaethau ar ran y cyhoedd yng Nghymru. Yr wyf yn falch y bu’n bosibl cynnwys cyrff y bu gan fyfyrwyr yng Nghymru gyswllt â hwy yn ystod eu gyrfaoedd academaidd. Wrth gynnwys y Cwmni Benthyciadau Myfyrwyr a Gwasanaeth Mynediad Canolog y Prifysgolion yn y rheoliadau, gallwn sicrhau bod y sefydliadau hyn yn rhoi sylw dyledus i’r gofyniad i ddarparu gwasanaeth sydd yn diwallu anghenion myfyrwyr Cymraeg eu hiaith, yn arbennig y rhai hynny sydd yn derbyn eu haddysg yn gyfangwbl drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg. Yn dilyn ymateb cychwynnol fy nghyd-Aelod, Jane Davidson, i adroddiad comisiwn Rees ar galedi myfyrwyr a chyhoeddi’r adnoddau ychwanegol yn gynharach yr wythnos hon, yr wyf yn hynod falch ar un llaw y bydd dibyniaeth myfyrwyr ar fenthyciadau yn lleihau, ac ar y llaw arall y bydd gwasanaethau o’r fath ar gael yn ddwyieithog yn y dyfodol. Gwnaeth UCAS a’r Cwmni Benthyciadau Myfyrwyr gynnydd sylweddol er mwyn darparu gwasanaeth yn yr iaith Gymraeg cyn y ddeddfwriaeth hon. Dylid eu llongyfarch am hynny. Os ydym am gyrraedd targedau ‘Gwellcymru.com’—sef y dylai cyfran fwy o boblogaeth Cymru siarad Cymraeg—mae’n bwysig y gall myfyrwyr, ar ôl gadael ysgol, barhau i ddefnyddio eu hiaith gyntaf ar bob cyfle. Yr wyf yn awyddus i sicrhau lle yr iaith Gymraeg yn y sector addysg ôl-16, a gobeithiaf y bydd y cyrff perthnasol yn uchel ar restr blaenoriaethau Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg o ran eu hysbysu ar gyfer paratoi cynlluniau yn y dyfodol.

In including the lottery distributors, we allow the Welsh Language Board to ensure that not only will the distributors give a bilingual service to applicants in Wales, but that they will also give due regard to linguistic aspects of applications for funding. The National Lottery Charities Board, which is now known as the Community Fund, already has a voluntary scheme in operation. The other distributors have welcomed the move to include them in this legislation. Other bodies named in this Order include new bodies such as the General Teaching Council for Wales, the local probation boards and the Commission for Health Improvement.

Wrth gynnwys dosbarthwyr y loteri, caniatawn i Fwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg sicrhau y bydd y dosbarthwyr nid yn unig yn rhoi gwasanaeth dwyieithog i ymgeiswyr yng Nghymru, ond eu bod hefyd yn rhoi sylw dyledus i’r agweddau ieithyddol ar geisiadau am arian. Mae Bwrdd Elusennau’r Loteri Cenedlaethol, a adwaenir bellach fel y Gronfa Gymunedol, eisoes yn gweithredu cynllun gwirfoddol. Croesawodd y dosbarthwyr eraill y cam i’w cynnwys yn y ddeddfwriaeth hon. Mae cyrff eraill a enwir yn y Gorchymyn yn cynnwys cyrff newydd megis Cyngor Addysgu Cyffredinol Cymru, y byrddau prawf lleol a’r Comisiwn Gwella Iechyd.

If you agree with my proposals in this draft legislation, the way will be open for the Welsh Language Board to ask these bodies to prepare schemes. The board will have its own priorities and ideas regarding when to make these approaches. It welcomes this legislation, and the further scope that it will be given to ensure that the principle embodied in the Welsh Language Act 1993 is extended, as far as possible, to public bodies in Wales.

Os cytunwch â’m cynigion yn y ddeddfwriaeth ddrafft hon, bydd hyn yn agor y ffordd i Fwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg ofyn i’r cyrff hyn baratoi cynlluniau. Bydd gan y bwrdd ei flaenoriaethau a’i syniadau ei hun o ran pa bryd y dylid gwneud hyn. Croesawa’r ddeddfwriaeth hon, a’r cyfle pellach a roddir iddo i sicrhau bod yr egwyddor a ymgorfforir yn Neddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993 yn cael ei hymestyn, cyn belled ag y bo modd, i gyrff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru.

I would like to bring forward more legislation of this kind in future, to which I will refer again when I reply to this debate. There is plenty of scope to bring forward further bodies for consideration. Officials are already working on a new round of consultation. I welcome the views of Members on other bodies that should be included as candidates in further legislation.

Hoffwn gyflwyno rhagor o ddeddfwriaeth o’r math hwn yn y dyfodol, a chyfeiriaf ato eto pan fyddaf yn ateb y ddadl hon. Mae digon o gyfle i gyflwyno rhagor o gyrff i’w hystyried. Mae swyddogion eisoes yn gweithio ar gylch newydd o ymgynghori. Croesawaf sylwadau’r Aelodau ynglŷn â chyrff eraill y dylid eu cynnwys fel ymgeiswyr mewn deddfwriaeth bellach.

Jocelyn Davies’s amendment 2 questions whether the Assembly has the power to bring former public utilities within the scope of the Welsh Language Act 1993. This has been raised before. I sympathise with the view that former public utilities that continue to provide services in Wales should have full language schemes. Manweb, Dŵr Cymru, British Gas and SWALEC already have full language schemes in place. These have been prepared on a voluntary basis, and credit should be given to those companies for their willingness to operate within the spirit of the Act. I am willing to seek definitive advice from the Counsel General on the Assembly’s powers in this respect. I will bring such advice to the attention of the Culture Committee. However, as I do not have this advice to hand, and as our powers are unclear, I cannot support this amendment today. We could undertake future consultation on the basis of the advice that I receive. I ask you, therefore, to support the motion as it stands.

Y mae gwelliant 2 Jocelyn Davies yn holi a oes gan y Cynulliad y pŵer i ddod â chyn-wasanaethau cyhoeddus o fewn cwmpas Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993. Codwyd y mater hwn o’r blaen. Cydymdeimlaf â’r farn y dylai cyn-gyfleustodau cyhoeddus sydd yn parhau i ddarparu gwasanaethau yng Nghymru fod â chynlluniau iaith llawn. Mae gan Manweb, Dŵr Cymru, Nwy Prydain a SWALEC gynlluniau iaith llawn eisoes. Paratowyd y rhain yn wirfoddol, a dylid rhoi clod i’r cwmnïau hynny am eu parodrwydd i weithredu o fewn ysbryd y Ddeddf. Yr wyf yn fodlon ceisio cyngor penodol gan y Cwnsler Cyffredinol o ran pwerau’r Cynulliad yn y cyd-destun hwn. Byddaf yn tynnu sylw’r Pwyllgor Diwylliant at gyngor o’r fath. Fodd bynnag, gan nad yw’r cyngor wrth law, a chan fod ein pwerau’n aneglur, ni allaf gefnogi’r gwelliant hwn heddiw. Gallem gynnal ymgynghoriad yn y dyfodol ar sail y cyngor a dderbyniaf. Gofynnaf ichi, felly, gefnogi’r cynnig fel y saif.

Owen John Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 37

Owen John Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 37

Cynigiaf y gwelliannau canlynol yn enw Jocelyn Davies. Gwelliant 1: Ychwanegwch bwynt newydd ar ddiwedd y cynnig:

I propose the following amendments in the name of Jocelyn Davies. Amendment 1: Add as new point at the end of the motion:

Owen John Thomas (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 37

Owen John Thomas (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 37

Cynigiaf welliant 2. Ychwanegwch bwynt newydd ar ddiwedd y cynnig:

I propose amendment 2. Add as new point at the end of the motion:

Owen John Thomas (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 38

Owen John Thomas (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 38

Yr wyf yn croesawu’r cynnig hwn, ond mae’n eironig, yn sicr, os nad yn rhagrithiol, ein bod yn rhoi sêl bendith ar gynnig sydd yn cynnwys rhestr o gyrff cyhoeddus i sicrhau eu bod yn paratoi cynlluniau iaith yn unol â Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993. Bydd rhai ohonoch yn gofyn beth sydd yn eironig neu’n rhagrithiol ynglŷn â hynny. Fe ddywedaf wrthych. Pan osodwyd y gwelliannau i’r cynnig hwn yn Swyddfa Gyflwyno Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru, gofynnwyd am gyfieithiad Saesneg, gan nad oes aelod staff bellach yn y swyddfa a all siarad y ddwy iaith. Mae’r Ddeddf yn cyfeirio at statws cyfartal i’r Gymraeg a’r Saesneg, ond yr ydym oll yn gwybod bod rhai ieithoedd yn fwy cyfartal nag eraill. Felly, rhag ofn i gyrff cyhoeddus ledled Cymru ddechrau anwybyddu gorchmynion y Cynulliad pan fydd y Gymraeg dan sylw, mae’n rhaid i ni fynnu eu bod yn gwneud yr hyn yr ydym yn ei ddweud yn hytrach na’r hyn yr ydym yn ei wneud.

I welcome this motion, but it is certainly ironic, if not hypocritical, that we are approving a motion that includes a list of public bodies to ensure that they prepare Welsh language schemes in compliance with the Welsh Language Act 1993. Some of you will ask what is ironic or hypocritical about that. I will tell you. When the amendments to this motion were laid in the Table Office of the National Assembly for Wales, an English translation was requested, as there is now no member of staff there who is able to speak both languages. The Act refers to equal status for Welsh and English, but we all know that some languages are more equal than others. Therefore, in case public bodies across Wales start ignoring the orders of the Assembly in relation to the Welsh language, we must insist that they do what we say rather than what we do.

Y mae tair rhan y cynnig hwn yn gofyn i ni nodi, croesawu neu ymestyn rôl Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg i dderbyn cynlluniau iaith gan gyrff y sector cyhoeddus. Mae’n briodol bod y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn gwneud hynny, ond mae hefyd yn bwysig nad ydym yn eistedd yn ôl, gan gredu ein bod wedi gwneud popeth i sicrhau bod yr heniaith yn ffynnu. Mae’n wir bod gwaith da yn cael ei wneud yn y maes hwn, gan beri i gyrff cyhoeddus ddefnyddio cynlluniau i wella sefyllfa’r iaith. Ond os na chaiff y cynlluniau hynny eu monitro yn rheolaidd ac yn drylwyr, byddant yn addewidion papur yn unig.

The three parts of this motion ask us to note, welcome or extend the role of the Welsh Language Board in receiving Welsh language schemes from public sector bodies. It is appropriate for the National Assembly to do so, but it is also important that we do not rest on our laurels in the belief that we have done everything within our power to ensure that the language flourishes. It is true that good work is undertaken in this field, in making public bodies use schemes to improve the standing of the language. However, if those schemes are not monitored regularly and thoroughly, they will remain empty promises.

Ar hyn o bryd, fel y nodir yn y cynnig, 159 o gynlluniau iaith yn unig sydd wedi eu cymeradwyo gan Fwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg, o gyfanswm o 3,000 o gyrff cyhoeddus. Mae Bwrdd yr Iaith, wrth gwrs, yn blaenoriaethu ei waith, ac yn anelu yn gyntaf at y cyrff pwysicaf, fel awdurdodau addysg lleol. Wrth ystyried bod y Comisiwn Archwilio yn cyflogi 20 o aelodau staff i fonitro 22 o awdurdodau lleol a thri pharc cenedlaethol, fe welwch fod disgwyl i bum aelod o staff Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg fonitro 159 o gyrff cyhoeddus yn dasg afresymol a dweud y lleiaf. Gofynnaf ichi gefnogi gwelliant 1, er mwyn hybu a helpu gwireddu’r gwaith y cyfeiriwyd ato yn nhri chymal y cynnig gwreiddiol.

To date, as the motion states, the Welsh Language Board has approved only 159 language schemes from a total of 3,000 public bodies. The Language Board, of course, prioritises its work, aiming first at the most important bodies, such as local education authorities. When you consider that the Audit Commission employs 20 members of staff to monitor 22 local authorities and three national parks, you see that it is unreasonable, to say the least, to expect five Welsh Language Board staff members to monitor 159 public bodies. I ask you to support amendment 1, in order to promote and help to implement the work referred to in the three clauses of the original motion.

Y mae gwelliant 2 yn gofyn i’r Gweinidog gynnwys y cyn-gyfleustodau, megis dŵr, trydan, nwy, Telecom Prydeinig a chwmnïau rheilffyrdd, yng nghwmpas Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993. Mae adran 6(1)(o) y Ddeddf yn ein galluogi i gynnwys yn ei chylch gorchwyl gwmnïau a oedd yn arfer bod yn gyrff cyhoeddus a reolai’r cyfleustodau. Er bod gan y cwmnïau hyn bolisïau iaith gweddol barchus, mae natur a pherchnogaeth y cwmnïau yn newid cymaint fel bod angen eu cynnwys yng nghylch gorchwyl y Ddeddf, fel bod yn rhaid iddynt ddarparu cynlluniau iaith swyddogol a fyddai’n derbyn cymeradwyaeth statudol Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg. Mae’n rhaid i’r cyhoedd ymwneud â’r cwmnïau hyn yn aml ac yn rheolaidd ac, felly, mae statws yr iaith yn y cwmnïau yn flaenoriaeth uchel ac o bwys mawr. Gofynnaf ichi gefnogi gwelliant 2 fel cam bach arall tuag at wireddu nod y Cynulliad i greu Cymru ddwyieithog.

Amendment 2 asks the Minister to include the former utilities, such as water, electricity, gas, British Telecom and rail companies, within the remit of the Welsh Language Act 1993. Section 6(1)(o) of the Act enables us to include within its remit, utility companies that were formerly public bodies. Although these companies have fairly respectable language policies, the nature and ownership of these companies change so much that they need to be included within the remit of the Act, so that they must provide official language policies for the statutory approval of the Welsh Language Board. The public must deal with these companies frequently and regularly and, therefore, the status of the language within the companies is a high priority and of great importance. I ask you to support amendment 2 as another small step towards realising the Assembly’s aim of creating a bilingual Wales.

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 39

Eleanor Burnham spoken in Welsh p. 39

Croesawaf y cynnig, y datblygiadau a’r ymrwymiad i ddarparu mwy o arian, am fod yr angen am fwy o welliannau yn parhau. Yr wyf hefyd yn croesawu’r ffaith fod ffurflenni cais ar gyfer mynediad i brifysgolion a benthyciadau i fyfyrwyr bellach ar gael yn Gymraeg.

I welcome the motion, the developments and the commitment to providing more money, as there is still a need for further improvements. I also welcome the fact that application forms for university entrance and student loans are now available in Welsh.

Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 39

Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39

On behalf of the Welsh Conservative party, I welcome the opportunity to approve these regulations and, in particular, the inclusion of an additional 25 organisations. We endorse wholeheartedly the views expressed by the Minister in her opening statement. This is an appropriate measure under the Welsh Language Act 1993, and we are aware that people should be able to communicate with these public organisations through the medium of Welsh if they so wish. These regulations will extend the principle of equality between the two national languages of Wales.

Ar ran plaid Geidwadol Cymru, croesawaf y cyfle i gymeradwyo’r rheoliadau hyn ac, yn arbennig, i gynnwys 25 o sefydliadau ychwanegol. Yr ydym yn cymeradwyo’r sylwadau a fynegwyd gan y Gweinidog yn ei datganiad agoriadol yn llwyr. Dyma fesur priodol o dan Ddeddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993, ac yr ydym yn ymwybodol y dylai pobl allu cyfathrebu â’r sefydliadau cyhoeddus hyn drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg pe dymunent wneud hynny. Bydd y rheoliadau hyn yn ymestyn yr egwyddor o gydraddoldeb rhwng dwy iaith genedlaethol Cymru.

We will support amendment 1, as it is necessary that we recognise the importance of the Welsh Language Board and its role in securing the future of the language. We see this amendment as an extension of that principle. We will not support amendment 2, as we endorse the view expressed by the Minister that the former utilities are not public organisations within the scope of the Welsh Language Act 1993, and we do not have the power to do what the amendment asks. We will await further legal guidance, but that is my view at the minute. We are in the middle of an exciting and thought-provoking Welsh language review, which, I am sure, will provide interesting and exciting recommendations for the future of the language. We would not wish to do anything to pre-empt the outcome of that review.

Cefnogwn welliant 1, gan ei fod yn angenrheidiol ein bod yn cydnabod pwysigrwydd Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg a’i rôl wrth sicrhau dyfodol yr iaith. Gwelwn y gwelliant hwn fel estyniad o’r egwyddor honno. Ni chefnogwn welliant 2, gan ein bod yn cefnogi’r farn a fynegwyd gan y Gweinidog nad yw’r cyn-gyfleustodau yn sefydliadau cyhoeddus o fewn cwmpas Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993, ac nid yw’r pŵer gennym i wneud yr hyn y mae’r gwelliant yn ei ofyn. Disgwyliwn am arweiniad cyfreithiol pellach, ond dyna yw fy marn ar hyn o bryd. Yr ydym ynghanol adolygiad cyffrous o’r iaith Gymraeg sy’n procio’r meddwl, ac mae’n siŵr, a fydd yn darparu argymhellion diddorol a chyffrous ar gyfer dyfodol yr iaith. Ni fyddem am wneud unrhyw beth i ragfynegi canlyniad yr adolygiad hwnnw.

Alun Pugh spoken in Welsh and English p. 40

Alun Pugh siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 40

The Welsh language is under potential threat. The threat exists because the process of economic globalisation is mirrored by linguistic globalisation. Increasing international trade, the growth in the movement of people and the internet all serve to reinforce the dominance of languages such as Spanish and English. The fact that we all speak the international business language is a source of competitive advantage to the Welsh economy. I do not want to see Wales become an inward-looking bilingual nation obsessed with its own affairs, but rather an outward-looking multilingual nation. That is why Welsh should be a compulsory part of our national curriculum for pupils up to the age of 16. That is also why it is worth spending millions of pounds of public money to support the language and why I will vote in favour of the Government motion this morning.

yn Saesneg Mae’r iaith Gymraeg o dan fygythiad posibl. Bodola’r bygythiad gan yr adlewyrchir y twf economaidd byd-eang gan y twf ieithyddol byd-eang. Mae’r cynnydd mewn masnach ryngwladol, y cynnydd yn nifer y bobl sydd yn symud a’r rhyngrwyd oll yn elfennau sydd yn atgyfnerthu uchafiaeth ieithoedd megis Sbaeneg a Saesneg. Mae’r ffaith ein bod yn siarad yr iaith fusnes ryngwladol o fantais gystadleuol i economi Cymru. Nid wyf am weld Cymru yn dod yn genedl ddwyieithog fewnblyg gydag obsesiwn â’i materion ei hun, ond yn yn hytrach yn genedl amlieithog allblyg. Dyna pam y dylai’r Gymraeg fod yn rhan orfodol o’n cwricwlwm cenedlaethol ar gyfer disgyblion hyd at 16 oed. Dyna pam ei bod hefyd yn werth gwario miliynau o bunnoedd o arian cyhoeddus er mwyn cefnogi’r iaith a dyna pam y byddaf yn pleidleisio o blaid cynnig y Llywodraeth y bore yma.

The majority of the Welsh population does not speak Welsh, and we are nonetheless Welsh for that reason. People who do not speak Welsh have a huge amount of goodwill towards the language. However, the move to bilingualism must be at a pace that builds on this support without triggering a backlash from the non Welsh-speaking majority. If people feel unfairly excluded, that backlash will be triggered. Many Plaid Cymru members understand this. It was interesting to see in the Daily Post today that Simon Thomas MP is of the same opinion. Many members of Plaid Cymru have excellent and outstanding records on equal opportunities. However, there are extremist elements in Plaid Cymru—which the charitable would call xenophobic—that do not want English speakers living in certain parts of our land or English pensioners living in Wales at all. Of course, its leader could sort this out.

yn Saesneg Nid yw mwyafrif poblogaeth Cymru yn siarad Cymraeg, ond nid ydym yn llai Cymreig am y rheswm hwnnw. Mae gan bobl nad ydynt yn siarad Cymraeg lawer iawn o ewyllys da tuag at yr iaith. Fodd bynnag, rhaid i’r cam tuag at ddwyieithrwydd fod ar gyflymder sydd yn adeiladu ar y gefnogaeth hon heb sbarduno adlach gan y mwyafrif di-Gymraeg. Os teimla pobl iddynt gael eu hallgáu yn annheg, bydd yr adlach hwnnw’n cael ei sbarduno. Bydd nifer o aelodau Plaid Cymru yn deall hyn. Yr oedd yn ddiddorol gweld yn y Daily Post heddiw bod Simon Thomas AS o’r un farn. Mae gan nifer o aelodau Plaid Cymru hanesion rhagorol a disglair o ran cyfle cyfartal. Fodd bynnag, ceir elfennau eithafol ym Mhlaid Cymru—y byddai’r caredig yn eu galw’n senoffobig—nad ydynt am weld siaradwyr Saesneg yn byw mewn rhannau arbennig o’n tir neu bensiynwyr Saesneg yn byw yng Nghymru o gwbl. Wrth gwrs, gallai ei harweinydd ddatrys hyn.

Ni chytunaf â Simon Glyn ar lawer o faterion ond cytunaf ag ef fod arweinydd Plaid Cymru yn arweinydd gwan.

in Welsh I do not agree with Simon Glyn on many issues, but I agree with him that the leader of Plaid Cymru—The Party of Wales is a weak leader.

Cynog Dafis a gododd—

Cynog Dafis rose—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 41

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 41

Ni chredaf fod Alun am ildio i chi. Mae wedi eistedd.

I do not believe that Alun is giving way to you. He has just sat down.

Cynog Dafis siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 41

Cynog Dafis spoken in Welsh p. 41

Mae hynny llawn cystal.

That is just as well.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 41

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 41

Cytunaf â llawer o’r hyn a ddywedodd Alun Pugh. Yr oedd ei gyfraniad ar y dechrau yn un meddylgar ac ystyrlon. Mae’n drueni iddo ddewis gwneud pwynt gwleidyddol ar y diwedd, a dynnodd oddi wrth ei gyfraniad. Cododd nifer o bwyntiau pwysig y dylid rhoi ystyriaeth lawn iddynt o fewn cyd-destun y drafodaeth hon ar yr iaith Gymraeg. Pan drafodwn y Gymraeg, gobeithiaf na fydd Aelodau’n defnyddio’r cyfle i wneud pwyntiau gwleidyddol anffodus a thynnu oddi wrth y ddadl bwysig hon. Y tro nesaf, gobeithiaf y ceidw Alun at destun y drafodaeth.

I agree with much of what Alun Pugh said. His contribution at the start was thoughtful and meaningful. It is a shame that he chose to make a political point at the end, which detracted from his contribution. He raised many important points and full consideration should be given to them within the context of this debate on the Welsh language. When discussing the Welsh language, I hope that Members will not use the opportunity to score unfortunate political points and to detract from this important debate. Next time, I hope that Alun will adhere to the subject of discussion.

Anogaf Ddirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg i ailystyried ei phenderfyniad ar welliant 1. Esboniaf pam fod y gwelliant hwn mor bwysig. Mae’n hanfodol bod Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg yn derbyn yr adnoddau angenrheidiol i fonitro’r gwaith a wneir ar gynlluniau iaith gan gyrff allanol. Mae perygl yn y sefyllfa sydd ohoni ar hyn o bryd. Cred rhai eu bod wedi cyflawni eu dyletswydd tuag at yr iaith Gymraeg os ydynt yn cyfieithu dogfennau ar bapur. Mae perygl i hynny ddigwydd yn y sefydliad hwn er fy mod yn cydnabod y gwelliannau a gafwyd yn y Swyddfa Gyflwyno ac yn y dderbynfa. Ymdrechwyd i sicrhau bod y rhai sydd yn ceisio ymwneud â’r sefydliad hwn yn y Gymraeg bellach yn cael eu cydnabod yn y Gymraeg.

I urge the Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language to reconsider her decision on amendment 1. I will explain why this amendment is so important. It is essential that the Welsh Language Board receives the necessary resources to monitor work on language schemes by external bodies. There is a danger in the existing situation. Some believe that if they translate written documents then they have done their duty towards the Welsh language. There is a risk of that occurring in this institution even though I acknowledge the improvements that have been made in the Table Office and at the reception. An effort has been made to ensure that those who wish to deal with this institution through the medium of Welsh are acknowledged in Welsh.

Er hynny, mae llawer o waith i’w wneud eto. Gobeithiaf, Jenny, y gallwch ailystyried eich penderfyniad ar welliant 1. Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn edrych ar y sefyllfa o ran cyfieithu. Nid yw cyfieithu ar bapur yn golygu bod cyrff yn cyflawni eu dyletswydd tuag at yr iaith Gymraeg. Mae’r iaith Gymraeg yn fyw ac yn hyfyw a rhaid i bobl gael y cyfle i’w defnyddio. Byddwn yn gwerthfawrogi pe bai llai o bwyslais yn y sefydliad hwn ar gyfieithu ar bapur. Dylai’r cyrff a’r unigolion a ddaw i’r Cynulliad gael y cyfle i gynnal cyfarfodydd yn y Gymraeg drwy gael darpariaeth cyfieithu ar y pryd. Byddwn hefyd yn gwerthfawrogi pe bai Aelodau’r Cynulliad sydd yn cael anhawster i gyfathrebu ar bapur â phobl yn y Gymraeg yn cael y gefnogaeth i wneud hynny, yn hytrach na chyfieithu dogfennau nad oes neb yn eu darllen.

However, there is still a long way to go. I hope, Jenny, that you will reconsider your decision on amendment 1. It is important that we look at the situation as regards translation. Providing written translation does not mean that organisations are fulfilling their duties towards the Welsh language. The Welsh language is alive and viable and people must be given the opportunity to use it. I would appreciate if there was less emphasis in this institution on written translation. Organisations and individuals that come to the Assembly should have the opportunity to conduct meetings through the medium of Welsh by having simultaneous translation available to them. I would also appreciate it if Assembly Members who have difficulty in communicating in writing with people in Welsh be given support to do that rather than translating documents that no-one ever reads.

Hoffwn atgoffa’r Gweinidog bod cadeirydd Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg wedi cynnig gwasanaeth y bwrdd er mwyn edrych yn feirniadol ar sut y gweithredir polisi iaith y Cynulliad. Gobeithiaf y derbyniwyd y cynnig hwn ac y bydd arian ar gael i sicrhau bod Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg yn gallu cyflawni’r gwasanaeth hwnnw i gyrff allanol hefyd.

I remind the Minister that the chair of the Welsh Language Board has offered the board’s services to examine critically how the Assembly’s language policy is implemented. I hope that that offer was accepted and I hope that the funding will be made available to ensure that the Welsh Language Board can also provide that service to outside bodies.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 42

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 42

Cyn galw ar y Gweinidog i ymateb, credaf ei bod yn briodol i mi gywiro camargraff a wnaethpwyd gan un Aelod, sef Owen John Thomas, ynglŷn â chyflwyno cwestiynau neu welliannau yn y Cynulliad yn Gymraeg neu yn Saesneg. Gellir cyflwyno gwelliannau yn Gymraeg neu yn Saesneg. Fodd bynnag, gall Aelodau hefyd gyflwyno gwelliannau yn ddwyieithog. Nid yw’n wir dweud na ellir cyflwyno gwelliannau a chwestiynau yn y Gymraeg.

Before I call the Minister to reply, it is appropriate for me to correct the misconception of one Member, Owen John Thomas, regarding the tabling of questions and amendments in the Assembly in Welsh or English. Amendments can be tabled in Welsh or English. However, Members can also table amendments bilingually. It is not true to say that amendments and questions cannot be tabled in Welsh.

Owen John Thomas a gododd—

Owen John Thomas rose—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 43

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 43

Trefn. Nid oes rhagor i’w ddweud ar y mater.

Order. There is nothing more to say on the issue.

Owen John Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 43

Owen John Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 43

Pwynt o drefn. Os yw Aelodau’n cyflwyno eitem tua 4.45 p.m., dywedir wrthynt fod y Swyddfa Gyflwyno’n cau am 5 p.m. ac na ellir ei gyfieithu i’r Saesneg cyn hynny. Mae honno’n sefyllfa anodd. Yr oedd gan y Swyddfa Gyflwyno aelod o staff a oedd yn siarad Cymraeg am tua mis, ond bellach nid oes aelod o staff dwyieithog yno.

Point of order. If Members table an item at about 4.45 p.m., they are told that the Table Office closes at 5 p.m. and that it cannot be translated into English within that time. That is a difficult situation. The Table Office had a Welsh-speaking member of staff for about a month, but now it does not have a bilingual member of staff.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 43

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 43

Trefn. Nid wyf eisiau trafod ein gweithdrefnau mewnol yn y Siambr. Os ydych eisiau codi mater o’r fath, dylech wneud hynny drwy aelod Plaid Cymru o Bwyllgor y Tŷ, sef Elin Jones neu’n uniongyrchol gyda’r Swyddfa Gyflwyno. Gallwch hefyd godi’r mater â’r clerc neu â mi. Gwastraff o amser y Cynulliad yw gwneud pwyntiau o drefn ynglŷn â’n gweithdrefnau, yn enwedig os oes rhesymau gwleidyddol dros wneud hynny.

Order. I do not want to discuss our internal procedures in the Chamber. If you want to raise such an issue, you should do so through Plaid Cymru’s member of the House Committee, Elin Jones, or directly with the Table Office. You can also raise the issue with the clerk or myself. It is a waste of Assembly time to make points of order on our procedures, particularly if that is done for political reasons.

Jenny Randerson The Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language spoken in English p. 43

Jenny Randerson Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 43

I emphasise that two previous Orders have been made under this section of the Welsh Language Act 1993, one in 1996 and another in 1999. Those statutory instruments were made in Westminster. This Order is the first to be introduced since the establishment of the Assembly. As a Minister, I am proud to be responsible for that. This is the main legislation that the Assembly can make in terms of the Welsh language.

Pwysleisiaf fod y ddau Orchymyn blaenorol wedi eu gwneud o dan yr adran hon o Ddeddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1993, un ohonynt yn 1996 a’r llall yn 1999. Gwnaethpwyd yr offerynau statudol hynny yn San Steffan. Y Gorchymyn hwn yw’r cyntaf i gael ei gyflwyno ers sefydlu’r Cynulliad. Fel Gweinidog, yr wyf yn falch o fod yn gyfrifol am hynny. Dyma yw’r brif ddeddfwriaeth y gall y Cynulliad ei gwneud o ran yr iaith Gymraeg.

Helen Mary Jones spoken in English p. 43

Helen Mary Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 43

I welcome the inclusion of the Commission for Health Improvement in this Order. As the Minister for Health and Social Services is aware, the commission caused much distress when it published its first report on a Welsh hospital—a hospital in my constituency—in London. The Welsh language version of the report was eventually published several weeks later. The hospital’s staff, many of whom are Welsh speakers, were upset by this. By making this legislation today, you are helping to rectify the situation.

Croesawaf y ffaith fod y Comisiwn Gwella Iechyd wedi ei gynnwys yn y Gorchymyn hwn. Fel y mae’r Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol yn ymwybodol, achosodd y comisiwn lawer o ofid pan gyhoeddodd ei adroddiad cyntaf ar ysbyty o Gymru—ysbyty yn fy etholaeth i—yn Llundain. Yn y pen draw, cyhoeddwyd fersiwn Cymraeg sawl wythnos yn ddiweddarach. Yr oedd hyn yn destun gofid i staff yr ysbyty, sydd â nifer o siaradwyr Cymraeg yn eu mysg. Drwy wneud y ddeddfwriaeth hon heddiw, yr ydych yn helpu i unioni’r sefyllfa.

Organisations such as the Disability Rights Commission will welcome this Order, as it gives them an opportunity to put pressure on their central offices to give them more resources for the Welsh language work that they are already doing.

Bydd sefydliadau megis Comisiwn Hawliau’r Anabl yn croesawu’r Gorchymyn hwn, gan ei fod yn rhoi cyfle iddynt roi pwysau ar eu swyddfeydd canolog i roi mwy o adnoddau i’r gwaith Cymraeg y maent yn ei wneud eisoes.

Jenny Randerson spoken in English p. 44

Jenny Randerson siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 44

Helen has raised two important points. People should be able to receive health services through the medium of Welsh if that is their choice. There is nothing worse when you are feeling ill than having to use a language that does not necessarily come easily to you. That is an important principle.

Cododd Helen ddau bwynt pwysig. Dylai pobl allu derbyn gwasanaethau iechyd drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg os mai dyna yw eu dewis. Nid oes dim yn waeth pan deimlwch yn sâl na gorfod defnyddio iaith nad yw o anghenraid yn dod yn hawdd ichi. Mae hynny’n egwyddor bwysig.

On Helen’s second point, not all of the bodies named in the Order have come naturally to this position. There has been an element of persuasion in some cases.

O ran ail bwynt Helen, nid yw’r holl gyrff a enwyd yn y Gorchymyn hwn wedi cyrraedd y sefyllfa hon yn naturiol. Bu elfen o berswâd mewn rhai achosion.

Gwenda Thomas spoken in English p. 44

Gwenda Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 44

Will you seek to ensure that reports are not published in monoglot Welsh only, and that organisations such as mentrau iaith produce their reports in English as well? That is important, as many English speakers support those reports.

A wnewch chi geisio sicrhau na chaiff adroddiadau eu cyhoeddi’n uniaith Gymraeg, a bod sefydliadau fel y mentrau iaith yn cynhyrchu eu hadroddiadau yn Saesneg hefyd? Mae hynny’n bwysig, gan fod nifer o siaradwyr Saesneg yn cefnogi’r adroddiadau hynny.

Jenny Randerson spoken in English p. 44

Jenny Randerson siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 44

I agree that, if we are to maintain goodwill towards the Welsh language, we must apply the rules evenly. If we expect publications to be bilingual, we mean bilingual.

Os ydym am gynnal ewyllys da tuag at yr iaith Gymraeg, cytunaf y dylem gymhwyso’r rheolau’n gyfartal. Os disgwyliwn i gyhoeddiadau fod yn ddwyieithog, yr ydym yn golygu dwyieithog.

This legislation is unique to Wales. It is the first legislation of its kind to be considered by the Assembly and, according to Members’ comments today, it will not be the last.

Mae’r ddeddfwriaeth hon yn unigryw i Gymru. Dyma’r ddeddfwriaeth gyntaf o’i bath i gael ei hystyried gan y Cynulliad ac, yn ôl sylwadau’r Aelodau heddiw, nid dyma fydd yr olaf.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 45

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 45

Os dehonglaf eich ateb i gwestiwn Gwenda Thomas yn gywir, mae’n bwynt pellgyrhaeddol. Mae llawer o gyrff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru yn gwneud eu gwaith drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg yn unig. Mae 28 o’r cynghorau cymuned yn fy etholaeth yn gweithio drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg yn unig. Gwnant hynny dan ddarpariaethau cyfreithiol Deddf yr Iaith Gymraeg 1967, a sefydlodd ddilysrwydd cyfartal i’r naill iaith a’r llall. Os dywedwch yn awr y dylai polisi cyhoeddus fod yn ddwyieithrwydd llawn yn hytrach na dilysrwydd cyfartal, mae hynny yn newid yr agenda a hoffwn wybod a oes deddfwriaeth ar fin ymddangos i sicrhau hynny.

If I interpret your response to Gwenda Thomas’s question correctly, it is a far-reaching point. Many public bodies in Wales work solely through the medium of Welsh. Twenty-eight of the community councils in my constituency work solely through the medium of Welsh. They do so under the legal provisions of the 1967 Welsh Language Act, which established equal validity for both languages. If you now say that public policy should be full bilingualism rather than equal validity, that changes the agenda and I would like to know if there is legislation forthcoming to ensure that.

Jenny Randerson spoken in English p. 45

Jenny Randerson siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 45

I clearly alluded to the commitment in ‘Betterwales.com’ to move toward a bilingual Wales. We must take that issue on board as part of a rolling programme. I have been aware of this for some time and we should be discussing it properly, in depth, in the Culture Committee’s review of the Welsh language. It is interesting that we are aware of several of the issues raised today from our Welsh language review. I am anxious that we do not confuse this review with the Assembly’s Welsh language scheme, which comes before the Committee next week. I stress the fact that we do have a Welsh language scheme; it is the former Welsh Office’s scheme, which we inherited in full. We are not without a scheme, but we are well on the way to producing a new one.

Cyfeiriais yn amlwg at yr ymrwymiad yn ‘Gwellcymru.com’ i symud tuag at Gymru ddwyieithog. Rhaid inni ystyried y mater hwnnw fel rhan o raglen dreigl. Bûm yn ymwybodol o hyn ers peth amser a dylem fod yn ei drafod yn briodol, ac yn fanwl, yn adolygiad y Pwyllgor Diwylliant o’r iaith Gymraeg. Mae’n ddiddorol ein bod yn ymwybodol o nifer o’r materion a godwyd heddiw o’n hadolygiad o’r iaith Gymraeg. Yr wyf yn awyddus nad ydym yn drysu’r adolygiad hwn â chynllun iaith Gymraeg y Cynulliad, sydd yn dod gerbron y Pwyllgor yr wythnos nesaf. Pwysleisiaf y ffaith fod gennym gynllun iaith Gymraeg; cynllun yr hen Swyddfa Gymreig ydyw, a etifeddasom yn llawn. Nid ydym heb gynllun, ond yr ydym wedi mynd ati i gynhyrchu un newydd.

In answer to Owen John, in relation to the issues not dealt with by the Presiding Officer, the Culture Committee will be considering the quinquennial review of the Welsh Language Board. The Welsh language review is also examining the Board’s priorities. Amendment 1 cuts across our budget process and our review. It is important to get those things in perspective before passing such an amendment. Also, the terms of the amendment are vague. What do the terms—

Mewn ateb i Owen John, o ran y materion nad ymdrinir â hwy gan y Llywydd, bydd y Pwyllgor Diwylliant yn ystyried adolygiad pum mlynedd o Fwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg. Mae’r adolygiad o’r iaith Gymraeg hefyd yn archwilio blaenoriaethau’r Bwrdd. Mae Gwelliant 1 yn torri ar draws ein proses gyllidebol a’n hadolygiad. Mae’n bwysig rhoi’r pethau hynny mewn perspectif cyn cytuno ar welliant o’r fath. Hefyd, mae termau’r gwelliant yn anneglur. Beth mae’r termau—

Owen John Thomas a gododd—

Owen John Thomas rose—

Jenny Randerson spoken in English p. 46

Jenny Randerson siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 46

I cannot give way again; I will run out of time.

Ni allaf ildio eto; ni fydd gennyf ddigon o amser.

What do the terms ‘sufficiently’ and ‘monitor properly’ mean? We cannot measure those. However, you have my strong support for the concept that the Welsh Language Board should be adequately funded to undertake its monitoring role. Next week, the Culture Committee will be able to decide if that is its top priority for the Welsh Language Board. Rhodri Glyn Thomas raised similar issues. I can assure him that we work closely with the Welsh Language Board.

Beth yw ystyr y termau ‘digonol’ a ‘monitro’n briodol’? Ni allwn fesur y rheini. Fodd bynnag, cefnogaf yn gryf y cysyniad y dylid ariannu Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg yn ddigonol er mwyn iddo ymgymryd â’i rôl fonitro. Yr wythnos nesaf, gall y Pwyllgor Diwylliant benderfynu os mai dyma yw ei brif flaenoriaeth ar gyfer Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg. Cododd Rhodri Glyn Thomas faterion tebyg. Gallaf ei sicrhau ein bod yn gweithio’n agos â Bwrdd yr Iaith Gymraeg.

New bodies are constantly being established, and they develop and change. We must regard this as an ongoing process. For example, the Care Council for Wales and the Children’s Commissioner for Wales are the sort of bodies that will be considered in future for coverage by this Act. I already anticipate bringing the next piece of Assembly legislation forward as soon as is reasonably practicable. As I have already said, we are consulting on the next rollout of bodies, and I welcome comments.

Mae cyrff newydd yn cael eu sefydlu’n barhaus, ac maent yn datblygu a newid. Ystyriwn hyn fel proses barhaus. Er enghraifft, mae Cyngor Gofal Cymru a Chomisiynydd Plant Cymru yn enghreifftiau o gyrff a ystyrir yn y dyfodol i’w cwmpasu gan y Ddeddf hon. Yr wyf eisoes yn rhagweld cyflwyno’r darn nesaf o ddeddfwriaeth y Cynulliad ymlaen cyn gynted ag y bydd yn rhesymol o ymarferol. Fel y dywedais eisoes, yr ydym yn ymgynghori ar y cyrff nesaf i’w cyflwyno, a chroesawaf sylwadau.

Gwelliant 1 Owen John Thomas t. 46

Amendment 1 Owen John Thomas p. 46

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 22 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 27

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (22)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • William Graham
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (27)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 2 Owen John Thomas t. 47

Amendment 2 Owen John Thomas p. 47

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 13 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 35

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (13)
  • Cynog Dafis
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (35)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Cynnig NDM737 Jenny Randerson t. 47

Motion NDM737 Jenny Randerson p. 47

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 49 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (49)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Cynog Dafis
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Cynlluniau Iaith Gymraeg (Cyrff Cyhoeddus) 2001

Approval of the Welsh Language Schemes (Public Bodies) Order 2001

Jenny Randerson The Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language spoken in English p. 48

Jenny Randerson Y Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 48

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Jenny Randerson The Acting Deputy First Minister and Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language (continued) spoken in English p. 49

Jenny Randerson Y Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Gweithredol a’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 49

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 49

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 49

Pleidleisiwn yn awr ar egwyddor y Gorchymyn.

We will now vote on the principle of the Order.

Cynnig NDM738 Jenny Randerson t. 49

Motion NDM738 Jenny Randerson p. 49

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 47 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (47)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 50

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 50

Pleidleisiwn yn awr ar y cynnig i gymeradwyo’r Gorchymyn.

We will now vote on the motion to approve the Order.

Cynnig NDM739 Jenny Randerson t. 50

Motion NDM739 Jenny Randerson p. 50

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 48 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (48)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd i’r Gadair am 10.41 a.m.

The Deputy Presiding Officer took the Chair at 10.41 a.m.

Y Strategaeth Tai Genedlaethol

The National Housing Strategy

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 51

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 51

I have selected amendments 1, 4, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11 and 12 in the name of Jocelyn Davies and amendments 2, 3, 6 and 8 in the name of William Graham.

Yr wyf wedi dethol gwelliannau 1, 4, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11 a 12 yn enw Jocelyn Davies a gwelliannau 2, 3, 6 ac 8 yn enw William Graham.

Edwina Hart The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities spoken in English p. 51

Edwina Hart Y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 51

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Edwina Hart The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities (continued) spoken in English p. 52

Edwina Hart Y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 52

My speech today will not reflect the comments made in The Western Mail yesterday. It will be an official statement on Government policy in this area.

Ni fydd fy araith heddiw yn adlewyrchu’r sylwadau a wnaethpwyd yn The Western Mail ddoe. Bydd yn ddatganiad swyddogol ar bolisi’r Llywodraeth yn y maes hwn.

This motion is the culmination of two years of hard work by many people. ‘Better Homes for People in Wales’ sets out our final proposals for the national housing strategy for Wales. It is the result of the most ambitious and wide-ranging process of policy development ever undertaken in Wales. It demonstrates how the National Assembly, working closely with its partners, can develop policy that reflects Welsh needs.

Mae’r cynnig hwn yn ben llanw i ddwy flynedd o waith caled gan lawer o bobl. Noda ‘Better Homes for People in Wales’ ein cynigion terfynol ar gyfer strategaeth tai genedlaethol Cymru. Mae’n ganlyniad i’r broses fwyaf uchelgeisiol ac eang ei hystod o ddatblygu polisi yr ymgymerwyd â hi erioed yng Nghymru. Dengys sut y gall y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol, drwy gydweithio’n agos â’i bartneriaid, ddatblygu polisi sydd yn adlewyrchu anghenion Cymru.

The strategy was initially developed from the framework document presented to us by the National Consultative Forum on Housing in Wales. Then we received the detailed reports of the four housing task groups. Finally, we widely consulted on draft proposals earlier in the year.

Datblygwyd y strategaeth yn wreiddiol o’r ddogfen fframwaith a gyflwynwyd inni gan y Fforwm Ymgynghorol Cenedlaethol ar Dai yng Nghymru. Yna derbyniasom adroddiadau manwl y pedwar grŵp gorchwyl tai. Yn olaf, buom yn ymgynghori’n eang ar gynigion drafft yn gynharach eleni.

I record my thanks to all those who contributed to the development of the strategy and to those who responded to our consultation paper, ‘Better Homes for People in Wales’, which sets out its clear and unequivocal vision for housing in Wales in these words:

Cofnodaf fy niolch i bawb a gyfrannodd at ddatblygu’r strategaeth ac i’r rheini a ymatebodd i’n papur ymgynghorol, sef ‘Cartrefi Gwell i Bobl Cymru’, sydd yn nodi ei weledigaeth glir a digamsyniol ar gyfer tai yng Nghymru gan ddefnyddio’r geiriau hyn:

‘We want everyone in Wales to have the opportunity to live in good quality, affordable housing and choose where they live and whether buying or renting is best for them and their families.’

‘Yr ydym am i holl bobl Cymru gael y cyfle i fyw mewn tai fforddiadwy, o safon a dewis ble y maent yn byw, a dewis p’un ai prynu neu rentu sydd orau iddynt hwy a’u teuluoedd.’

William Graham’s amendment 2 brings these words into motion. I support this amendment as it provides an effective summary of the purpose of this strategy. Social disadvantage and inequality can sometimes be hidden. Housing, however, provides us with vivid images of inequality, the most graphic of which are of those who sleep rough on our streets.

Mae gwelliant 2 William Graham yn ychwanegu’r geiriau hyn at y cynnig. Cefnogaf y gwelliant hwn gan ei fod yn darparu crynodeb effeithiol o ddiben y strategaeth hon. Gall amddifadedd ac anghydraddoldeb cymdeithasol fod yn guddiedig weithiau. Mae tai, fodd bynnag, yn rhoi delweddau byw inni o anghydraddoldeb, a’r rhai mwyaf graffig ohonynt yn dangos y rheini sydd yn cysgu ar ein strydoedd.

High quality housing is not just a matter of bricks and mortar. We want homes that are in good condition in safe, non-threatening neighbourhoods. We want better housing services and a greater choice of housing. That is why I am not prepared to support Jocelyn Davies’s amendments 1 and 4. I am not prepared to be lukewarm about our vision or strategy. To ‘receive’ and ‘accept’ rather than to ‘endorse’ and ‘support’ is to undermine the commitment to improvement that is central to this report.

Nid mater o friciau a morter yn unig yw tai o ansawdd da. Yr ydym am gael cartrefi sydd mewn cyflwr da mewn cymdogaethau diogel, difygythiol. Yr ydym am wasanaethau tai gwell a dewis helaethach o dai. Dyna pam nad wyf yn barod i gefnogi gwelliannau 1 a 4 Jocelyn Davies. Nid wyf yn barod i fod yn glaear ynglŷn â’n gweledigaeth na’n strategaeth. Mae ‘derbyn’ yn hytrach na ‘chymeradwyo’ a ‘chefnogi’ yn gyfystyr â thanseilio’r ymrwymiad i wella sydd yn ganolog i’r adroddiad hwn.

Overall, there has been a steady improvement in the condition of Welsh housing, but much remains to be done. The Assembly and its partners have an important role to play in providing support to vulnerable and low-income households living in unfit housing. That is vital given the profound negative impact of poor housing on people’s physical and mental health and wellbeing.

Ar y cyfan, bu gwelliant cyson yng nghyflwr tai Cymru, ond mae llawer i’w wneud o hyd. Mae gan y Cynulliad a’i bartneriaid rôl bwysig i’w chwarae wrth ddarparu cymorth i deuluoedd diamddiffyn, incwm isel sydd yn byw mewn tai anaddas. Mae hynny’n hanfodol o gofio effaith negyddol ddofn tai gwael ar iechyd a lles corfforol a meddyliol pobl.

The people of Wales should have the opportunity to live in homes that are in a good state of repair and safe and secure. They must be adequately heated and fuel efficient, and have modern facilities. Achieving this aim requires the development of an effective partnership at all levels in Wales. It also needs the support of the United Kingdom Government, in ensuring that we have at our disposal tools, such as the proposed legislation on licensing houses in multiple occupation, and the new health and safety rating system.

Dylai pobl Cymru gael y cyfle i fyw mewn cartrefi sydd mewn cyflwr da ac sydd yn ddiogel. Dylent gael eu gwresogi’n ddigonol, bod yn effeithlon o ran tanwydd, a meddu ar gyfleusterau modern. Mae cyflawni’r nod hwn yn galw am ddatblygu partneriaeth effeithiol ar bob lefel yng Nghymru. Mae angen cefnogaeth Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig arno hefyd, wrth sicrhau bod arfau ar gael inni, fel y ddeddfwriaeth arfaethedig ar drwyddedu tai amlbreswyliaeth, a’r system graddio iechyd a diogelwch newydd.

The Government has already presented a Homelessness Bill to the new Parliament. When passed, it will give greater statutory recognition to the needs of homeless people in Wales, and will ensure that local authorities put in place effective local homelessness strategies. However, I have written to the Secretary of State for Wales expressing my concern that, once again, the long-promised legislation on the licensing of the private sector and changes to the fitness rating system did not feature in the Queen’s Speech. I have asked the Secretary of State when we can expect this legislation to be brought forward, because there is consensus in this Assembly that that legislation must be brought forward.

Mae’r Llywodraeth eisoes wedi cyflwyno Mesur Digartrefedd i’r Senedd newydd. Ar ôl ei basio, rhydd gydnabyddiaeth statudol fwy i anghenion pobl ddigartref yng Nghymru, a bydd yn sicrhau bod awdurdodau lleol yn sefydlu strategaethau lleol effeithiol i ddelio â digartrefedd. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf wedi ysgrifennu at Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru yn mynegi fy mhryder na chynhwyswyd y ddeddfwriaeth hir-addawedig ar drwyddedu’r sector preifat a newidiadau i’r system graddio addasrwydd, unwaith eto, yn Araith y Frenhines. Yr wyf wedi gofyn i’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol pryd y gallwn ddisgwyl i’r ddeddfwriaeth hon gael ei chyflwyno, gan fod consensws o fewn y Cynulliad hwn bod yn rhaid cyflwyno’r ddeddfwriaeth honno.

Several responses to our consultation paper call for additional funding for housing. The call is heard and understood. I was pleased to be able to reverse the downward funding trend of recent years in this year’s budget. However, we must recognise the constraints imposed by the limited financial resources available to us. One problem that we cannot hope to tackle solely through public funds, is the condition of our council housing stock. Consultation has been, and continues to be, essential. That is why I cannot support William Graham’s amendment 6, which seeks to reduce the number of those consulted. Local partnerships are the foundation for planning, developing and delivering effective local policies and services. Neither can I support Jocelyn Davies’s amendment 5, which seems not to accept the common sense reality that when you consult, you cannot accept every point of view. The majority of recommendations are being acted upon.

Mae sawl ymateb i’n papur ymgynghorol yn galw am arian ychwanegol ar gyfer tai. Clywyd yr alwad ac fe’i deallwyd. Yr oeddwn yn falch o allu gwrthdroi’r duedd ariannu tuag i lawr a welwyd yn ystod y blynyddoedd diwethaf yng nghyllideb eleni. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni gydnabod y cyfyngiadau a geir yn sgîl yr adnoddau ariannol cyfyngedig sydd ar gael inni. Un broblem na allwn obeithio mynd i’r afael â hi drwy arian cyhoeddus yn unig, yw cyflwr ein stoc tai cyngor. Bu ymgynghori yn hanfodol, a pharha felly. Dyna pam na allaf gefnogi gwelliant 6 William Graham, sydd yn ceisio lleihau nifer y rheini yr ymgynghorir â hwy. Mae partneriaethau lleol yn sylfaen ar gyfer cynllunio, datblygu a chyflwyno polisïau a gwasanaethau lleol effeithiol. Ni allaf ychwaith gefnogi gwelliant 5 Jocelyn Davies, nad yw, ymddengys, yn derbyn y realiti synnwyr cyffredin sydd yn datgan, wrth ymgynghori, na allwch dderbyn pob safbwynt. Mae’r mwyafrif o’r argymhellion wrthi’n cael eu gweithredu.

As I said when we debated the Local Government and Housing Committee’s report on housing stock transfer, the scale of the problem is growing. It is not just about dealing with repairs and modernising stock; improving the neighbourhoods in which these houses are located is equally important. Assessment suggests that that will cost well in excess of £1 billion. The Committee’s report urged us to bring pressure to bear on the Government to change the rules for local government borrowing so that local authorities are free to borrow on the same terms as registered social landlords. I have written to the Treasury urging it to make this change. I had hoped to bring you news of a positive response today, but I am afraid that the Treasury remains unswayed.

Fel y dywedais pan gawsom ddadl ar adroddiad y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai ar drosglwyddo stoc tai, mae graddfa’r broblem yn tyfu. Nid mater o ddelio ag atgyweiriadau a moderneiddio stoc yn unig ydyw; mae gwella’r cymdogaethau lle y lleolir y tai hyn yr un mor bwysig. Awgryma asesiadau y bydd hynny’n costio ymhell dros £1 biliwn. Erfyniodd adroddiad y Pwyllgor arnom i roi pwysau ar y Llywodraeth i newid rheolau benthyca llywodraeth leol er mwyn rhoi rhyddid i awdurdodau lleol fenthyg ar yr un telerau â landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig. Yr wyf wedi ysgrifennu at y Trysorlys yn ei annog i weithredu’r newid hwn. Yr oeddwn wedi gobeithio dod â newyddion ichi am ymateb cadarnhaol heddiw, ond mae arnaf ofn na lwyddwyd i ddarbwyllo’r Trysorlys.

Although we have been able to make some modest increases in housing capital provision, that is not enough. Local authorities need to examine all credible options to secure investment for improvements in their housing stock. All local authorities in Wales are to be required to quantify the extent of the repair and improvement liabilities of their stock, and to produce plans that demonstrate how the stock will be regenerated within the next 10 years. To do that, it will be necessary for some local authorities to consider transferring their stock to landlords who are able to obtain private sector investment. There may be circumstances whereby communities can enjoy economic benefits as a result of large-scale investment. However, whenever stock transfer is considered, it needs to be seen as more than a means of gaining extra capital finance. Any transfer proposal should take account of the need for regeneration of the community in which the stock is located as a whole.

Er inni allu gwneud rhywfaint o gynnydd yn y ddarpariaeth cyfalaf tai, nid yw hynny’n ddigon. Mae angen i awdurdodau lleol ystyried pob opsiwn credadwy er mwyn sicrhau buddsoddiad ar gyfer gwelliannau yn eu stoc tai. Bydd yn ofynnol i bob awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru feintioli graddau rhwymedigaethau atgyweirio a gwella eu stoc, a chynhyrchu cynlluniau sydd yn dangos sut yr adnewyddir y stoc o fewn y 10 mlynedd nesaf. Er mwyn gwneud hynny, bydd yn ofynnol i rai awdurdodau lleol ystyried trosglwyddo eu stoc i landlordiaid a all ddenu buddsoddiad gan y sector preifat. Gallai fod amgylchiadau lle y gall cymunedau fwynhau buddiannau economaidd o ganlyniad i fuddsoddi ar raddfa fawr. Fodd bynnag, pryd bynnag yr ystyrir trosglwyddo stoc, dylid ei weld fel mwy na chyfrwng o gasglu arian cyfalaf ychwanegol. Dylai unrhyw gynnig i drosglwyddo ystyried yr angen i adnewyddu’r gymuned gyfan lle y lleolir y stoc.

Proposals will need to ensure that tenants are empowered to have real involvement in the future management of their homes and communities. Transfer of ownership to distant landlords who do not have a commitment to local communities will not be the way forward. There are several potential stock transfer models. To date, community ownership has been the model most widely used for transfers that have taken place elsewhere in the UK. Deciding the most appropriate way forward must be a matter for local authorities and their tenants. However, I would like to see consideration of an emerging structure that gives far greater responsibility and ownership to tenants: that is the community mutual model, whereby ownership of local authority stock transfers to the tenants. Ward composition of the new ward largely follows the traditional a third: a third: a third structure, but potentially provides greater opportunity for tenants to select the composition of each third. The only shareholders in the transferred organisation would be its tenants. Under existing models, not only is the business conducted for the benefit of the community, but the organisation is also owned by the community. That provides a sense of ownership and encourages tenant participation and involvement. There could also be smaller management units under the umbrella of the transferring organisation.

Bydd angen i gynigion sicrhau bod gan denantiaid y pŵer i wneud cyfraniad gwirioneddol wrth reoli eu cartrefi a’u cymunedau yn y dyfodol. Nid trosglwyddo perchenogaeth i landlordiaid pellennig nad ydynt wedi’u hymrwymo i gymunedau lleol fydd y ffordd ymlaen. Mae sawl model trosglwyddo stoc posibl. Hyd yn hyn, perchenogaeth gymunedol fu’r model a ddefnyddiwyd fwyaf ar gyfer achosion o drosglwyddo mewn mannau eraill o fewn y DU. Rhaid i benderfyniadau ar y ffordd fwyaf priodol ymlaen fod yn fater i’r awdurdodau lleol a’u tenantiaid. Fodd bynnag, hoffwn weld strwythur yn datblygu, a hwnnw’n cael ei ystyried, a fydd yn rhoi cyfrifoldeb a pherchenogaeth lawer mwy i denantiaid: dyna’r cydfodel cymunedol, lle y byddai perchenogaeth stoc awdurdod lleol yn cael ei throsglwyddo i’r tenantiaid. I raddau helaeth mae cyfansoddiad ward y ward newydd yn dilyn y strwythur traean: traean: traean traddodiadol ond mae’n darparu’r posibilrwydd o gyfle mwy i denantiaid ddethol cyfansoddiad pob traean. Yr unig gyfranddeiliaid yn y sefydliad a drosglwyddir fyddai ei denantiaid. O dan fodelau presennol, nid yn unig y cynhelir y busnes er budd y gymuned, ond mae’r sefydliad hefyd yn eiddo i’r gymuned. Mae hynny’n cynnig ymdeimlad o berchenogaeth ac yn annog tenantiaid i gymryd rhan a chyfranogi. Gellid cael unedau rheoli llai hefyd o dan ymbarél y sefydliad sydd yn trosglwyddo.

Empowering tenants through the creation of community businesses will further encourage the regeneration of these communities. That, in turn, will allow access to additional funding sources for wider community initiatives. I will provide more detail on those proposals in the near future. I am therefore happy to support Jocelyn’s amendment 7, which, positively, proposes adding the word ‘sustainability’ after ‘equality of opportunity’.

Bydd rhoi pŵer i denantiaid drwy greu busnesau cymunedol yn annog y broses o adfywio cymunedau ymhellach. Bydd hynny, yn ei dro, yn ei gwneud yn bosibl cael gafael ar ffynonellau arian ychwanegol ar gyfer mentrau cymunedol ehangach. Darparaf ragor o fanylion am y cynigion hyn yn y dyfodol agos. Y mae’n bleser gennyf felly gefnogi gwelliant 7 Jocelyn, sydd, mewn ffordd gadarnhaol, yn cynnig ychwanegu’r gair ‘cynaliadwyedd’ ar ôl ‘cyfle cyfartal’.

Turning to the other amendments, I will support amendment 8, tabled by William Graham. What it proposes is consistent with the strategy that promotes effective partnerships between sectors. I will not support amendment 3, because it assumes that the Assembly will impose an old-style Tory privatisation of council housing; we will not. We are developing a range of options for local people and local authorities, all of which have the non-Tory objectives of community regeneration and empowerment.

Gan droi at y gwelliannau eraill, cefnogaf welliant 8, a gyflwynwyd gan William Graham. Mae’r hyn a gynigia yn gyson â’r strategaeth sydd yn hyrwyddo partneriaethau effeithiol rhwng sectorau. Ni chefnogaf welliant 3, gan ei fod yn cymryd yn ganiataol y bydd y Cynulliad yn gorfodi hen ddull y Torïaid o breifateiddio tai cyngor; ni wnawn hynny. Yr ydym yn datblygu ystod o opsiynau ar gyfer pobl leol ac awdurdodau lleol, y mae gan bob un ohonynt yr amcanion annhorïaidd o adfywio cymunedau a rhoi pŵer iddynt.

We will not support amendment 9. Our proposals for developing a detailed picture of housing need at the national and local levels are appropriate, relevant and cost-effective. They will also provide a wide range of information on matters such as social, economic and health circumstances.

Ni chefnogwn welliant 9. Mae ein cynigion ar gyfer datblygu darlun manwl o angen o ran tai ar lefelau cenedlaethol a lleol yn briodol, yn berthnasol ac yn gost-effeithiol. Byddant hefyd yn darparu amrywiaeth eang o wybodaeth ar faterion fel amgylchiadau cymdeithasol, economaidd ac iechyd.

I sympathise with the sentiment behind Jocelyn’s amendment 10. However, the word ‘right’ could put us in an untenable situation. I must, therefore, reject it.

Cydymdeimlaf â’r teimlad sy’n sail i welliant 10 Jocelyn. Fodd bynnag, gallai’r gair ‘hawl’ ein rhoi mewn sefyllfa anodd ei rheoli. Rhaid imi, felly, ei wrthod.

Amendment 11 repeats the motion adopted by the National Assembly in Plenary, when we debated the consultation paper on the draft housing strategy last autumn. The First Minister subsequently conveyed the Assembly’s views to the Secretary of State for Wales. However, I am prepared to make further representations on this matter and, therefore, I will support the amendment.

Mae gwelliant 11 yn ailadrodd y cynnig a fabwysiadwyd gan y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn y Cyfarfod Llawn, lle y cynhaliwyd dadl ar y papur ymgynghorol ar y strategaeth tai ddrafft hydref diwethaf. Mynegodd Prif Weinidog Cymru safbwyntiau’r Cynulliad i Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru wedi hynny. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf yn barod i wneud sylwadau pellach ar y mater hwn ac, felly, cefnogaf y gwelliant.

I also have sympathy with the intent behind amendment 12. However, it contains a factual error. The building regulations advisory committee does not have any powers; it advises the Secretary of State, who exercises the powers. I am willing to propose the transfer of those powers to the Assembly, but I would need to be sure that such a transfer of responsibilities would be accompanied by a full transfer of resources. Therefore, I will not support that amendment and I ask that it be withdrawn in the light of what I have said.

Cydymdeimlaf hefyd â’r bwriad sydd yn sail i welliant 12. Fodd bynnag, mae’n cynnwys camgymeriad ffeithiol. Nid oes gan y pwyllgor ymgynghorol ar reoliadau adeiladu unrhyw bwerau; rhoi cyngor i’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol a wna, sydd yn gweithredu’r pwerau. Yr wyf yn fodlon cynnig y dylid trosglwyddo’r pwerau hynny i’r Cynulliad, ond byddai angen imi fod yn siŵr y byddai trosglwyddo cyfrifoldebau o’r fath yn golygu y trosglwyddid yr adnoddau yn llawn hefyd. Felly, ni chefnogaf y gwelliant hwnnw a gofynnaf iddo gael ei dynnu’n ôl yng ngoleuni’r hyn a ddywedais.

I have concentrated today on the problems of council housing stock. However, our strategy is not just about social housing, but about housing across all sectors and tenures. It aims to provide a real choice in housing. We do not favour one sector over another. We will always support home ownership where it is sustainable. We want a thriving, well-managed, private rented sector, with good-quality accommodation. We also want high-quality social housing. ‘Better Homes for the People of Wales’ is designed to provide our partners at a local level with a clear policy framework that will help to make these aims a reality.

Yr wyf wedi canolbwyntio heddiw ar broblemau stoc tai cyngor. Fodd bynnag, nid ymwneud â thai cymdeithasol yn unig a wna ein strategaeth, ond â thai ar draws pob sector a daliadaeth. Mae’n anelu at ddarparu dewis gwirioneddol o ran tai. Ni roddwn ffafriaeth i un sector dros un arall. Byddwn yn cefnogi system lle mae pobl yn berchen ar eu cartrefi bob amser lle y bo’n gynaliadwy. Yr ydym am weld sector rhentu preifat sydd yn llewyrchus, ac a reolir yn dda, gyda thai o ansawdd da. Yr ydym hefyd am weld tai cymdeithasol o safon uchel. Mae ‘Better Homes for the People of Wales’ wedi’i gynllunio i ddarparu fframwaith polisi clir i’n partneriaid ar lefel leol a fydd o gymorth wrth droi’r nodau hyn yn realiti.

Janet Davies spoken in English p. 57

Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 57

I propose the following amendments in the name of Jocelyn Davies. Amendment 1: in point 1 replace ‘endorses’ with ‘receives’.

Cynigiaf y gwelliannau canlynol yn enw Jocelyn Davies. Gwelliant 1: ym mhwynt 1 rhodder ‘derbyn’ yn lle ‘cymeradwyo’.

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 57

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 57

I propose amendment 4. In point 2 replace ‘supports’ with ‘accepts’.

Cynigiaf welliant 4. Ym mhwynt 2 rhodder ‘derbyn y’ yn lle ‘cefnogi’r’.

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 57

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 57

I propose amendment 5. Delete full stop and add at the end of point 2:

Cynigiaf welliant 5. Dileer yr atalnod llawn ac ychwaneger ar ddiwedd pwynt 2:

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I propose amendment 7. In point 3 insert after ‘equality of opportunity’ ‘and sustainability’.

Cynigiaf welliant 7. Ym mhwynt 3 ychwaneger ‘a chynaliadwyedd’ ar ôl ‘cyfle cyfartal’.

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I propose amendment 9. Add as new point at the end of the motion:

Cynigiaf welliant 9. Ychwaneger ar ddiwedd y cynnig fel pwynt newydd:

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I propose amendment 10. Add as new point at the end of the motion:

Cynigiaf welliant 10. Ychwaneger fel pwynt newydd ar ddiwedd y cynnig:

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I propose amendment 11. Add as new point at the end of the motion:

Cynigiaf welliant 11. Ychwaneger fel pwynt newydd ar ddiwedd y cynnig:

Janet Davies (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I will withdraw amendment 12. The Minister has left the Chamber, but I accept her point about there being a factual problem with its wording. However, we still support the transfer of powers on building regulations to the National Assembly.

Tynnaf welliant 12 yn ôl. Mae’r Gweinidog wedi gadael y Siambr, ond derbyniaf ei phwynt bod problem ffeithiol gyda’i eiriad. Fodd bynnag, yr ydym o blaid trosglwyddo pwerau ar reoliadau adeiladu i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol o hyd.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 58

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

Amendment 12 has therefore been formally withdrawn.

Tynnwyd gwelliant 12 yn ôl yn ffurfiol felly.

Janet Davies spoken in English p. 58

Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

The Minister requested that we withdraw the amendment for technical reasons, but that does not mean that we have changed our minds on the ideas behind it.

Gofynnodd y Gweinidog inni dynnu’r gwelliant yn ôl am resymau technegol, ond nid yw hynny’n golygu ein bod wedi newid ein meddyliau am y syniadau sydd yn sail iddo.

Plaid Cymru—The Party of Wales has participated in the development of this strategy in Committee and considered the four taskforce reports upon which the strategy is based. We regret that some of the taskforces’ more radical ideas have been diluted by the Government of Wales. However, there are principles in this document that we endorse, particularly the comments in paragraphs 3.1 and 3.2 concerning the need for access for all to decent and affordable housing, and the harmful effects resulting from its not being available to all. We endorse tenants’ participation in the management of the areas in which they live, and protection for all tenants through the establishment of clear, properly-monitored rules.

Mae Plaid Cymru wedi cymryd rhan yn y gwaith o ddatblygu’r strategaeth hon yn y Pwyllgor ac wedi ystyried y pedwar adroddiad tasglu y mae’r strategaeth yn seiliedig arnynt. Gresynwn fod rhai o syniadau mwy radical y tasgluoedd wedi’u glastwreiddio gan Lywodraeth Cymru. Fodd bynnag, cymeradwywn rai o egwyddorion y ddogfen hon, yn arbennig y sylwadau ym mharagraffau 3.1 a 3.2 ynglŷn â’r angen i dai da a fforddiadwy fod ar gael i bawb, a’r effeithiau andwyol sydd yn deillio o’r ffaith nad ydynt ar gael i bawb. Cymeradwywn gyfranogiad tenantiaid yn y gwaith o reoli’r ardaloedd y maent yn byw ynddynt, a’r nod o ddiogelu pob tenant drwy sefydlu rheolau clir gyda dulliau monitro priodol.

Plaid Cymru supports the need for sustainable housing, and we are glad that the Minister will support our amendment 7. Sustainable housing means housing that is affordable, can be maintained at a reasonable cost, is adaptable to changing lifestyles and has regard for the environment.

Cefnoga Plaid Cymru yr angen am dai cynaliadwy, ac yr ydym yn falch y bydd y Gweinidog yn cefnogi ein gwelliant 7. Golyga tai cynaliadwy dai y gellir eu fforddio, y gellir eu cynnal am gost resymol, y gellir eu haddasu i ffyrdd o fyw cyfnewidiol ac sydd yn parchu’r amgylchedd.

Much new housing is built for the open market and planning control is important. We support the use of brownfield sites whenever possible and the primacy of local need. However, social housing remains important to many people. It is the only way to meet their needs. A civilised society does not allow people to live in degrading squalor or to roam the streets without a home. The Government of Wales sets out the national strategy and local government sets local strategy within that context. Both must act within the financial strategies of the British state.

Adeiledir llawer o dai newydd ar gyfer y farchnad agored ac mae rheolaeth gynllunio yn bwysig. Cefnogwn y defnydd o dir llwyd lle bynnag y bo’n bosibl ynghyd â rhoi blaenoriaeth i angen lleol. Fodd bynnag, parha tai cymdeithasol yn bwysig i lawer o bobl. Dyma’r unig ffordd o ddiwallu eu hanghenion. Ni chaniatâ cymdeithas wâr i bobl fyw mewn budreddi diraddiol neu grwydro’r strydoedd heb gartref. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn nodi’r strategaeth genedlaethol ac mae llywodraeth leol yn pennu’r strategaeth leol o fewn y cyd-destun hwnnw. Rhaid i’r ddwy weithredu o fewn strategaethau ariannol gwladwriaeth Prydain.

National and local strategies must be appropriate and creative in meeting twenty-first century aspirations. Housing for frail, disabled and elderly people must change to meet new aspirations. The private sector is leading the way in this. Social housing must catch up. Standardised, utilitarian accommodation must be changed to give people privacy, ownership in the broad sense of the word, companionship and care.

Rhaid i strategaethau cenedlaethol a lleol fod yn briodol ac yn greadigol wrth wireddu dyheadau’r unfed ganrif ar hugain. Rhaid i dai ar gyfer pobl fregus, anabl ac oedrannus newid er mwyn gwireddu dyheadau newydd. Mae’r sector preifat ar flaen y gad yn hyn o beth. Rhaid i dai cymdeithasol ddatblygu i’r un graddau. Rhaid newid tai iwtilitaraidd, wedi’u safoni, er mwyn rhoi preifatrwydd, perchenogaeth yn ystyr ehangaf y gair, cwmnïaeth a gofal i bobl.

Existing housing owned by local authorities is—as the Minister has said—in a variable condition and worsening because investment has been drastically reduced for some years. At the time of local government reorganisation in 1996, local authorities became increasingly concerned as public investment in housing was cut back by the Conservative Government. No-one expected that policy to be continued by New Labour, but it was. From 1996 to 1997, spending on housing in Wales was cut by 75 per cent, compared with an increase of 80 per cent in England.

Mae’r tai presennol sydd yn eiddo i awdurdodau lleol—fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog—yn amrywio o ran cyflwr ac maent yn gwaethygu gan fod buddsoddiad ynddynt wedi lleihau’n ddramatig ers rhai blynyddoedd. Ar adeg ad-drefnu llywodraeth leol ym 1996, dechreuodd awdurdodau lleol bryderu fwyfwy wrth i Lywodraeth y Ceidwadwyr gwtogi’r buddsoddiad cyhoeddus mewn tai. Ni ddisgwyliai unrhyw un i Lafur Newydd barhau â’r polisi hwnnw, ond dyna a ddigwyddodd. O 1996 i 1997, cwtogwyd gwariant ar dai yng Nghymru 75 y cant, o gymharu â chynnydd o 80 y cant yn Lloegr.

The National Assembly has worked out options for the future of local authority housing, and for working together in communities, but however good community work may be, and however high-flying our desires for good housing, without investment in bricks and mortar it will all be wasted. The Government of Wales’s accepted thinking has been that that can only be achieved through the transfer of stock to registered social landlords, or through public-private partnerships or private finance initiatives. Major, difficult issues, such as negative equity, have been skated over.

Mae’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol wedi penderfynu ar opsiynau ar gyfer dyfodol tai awdurdodau lleol, ac ar gyfer cydweithio mewn cymunedau, ond pa mor dda bynnag y bo gwaith cymunedol, a pha mor uchel bynnag y bo ein hawydd am dai da, heb fuddsoddi mewn briciau a morter, caiff y cyfan ei wastraffu. Safbwynt cyffredin Llywodraeth Cymru fu mai dim ond trwy drosglwyddo stoc i landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig, neu drwy bartneriaethau cyhoeddus-preifat neu fentrau cyllid preifat y gellir cyflawni hynny. Prin y cyffyrddwyd â materion anodd, pwysig, fel ecwiti negyddol.

The possibility of funding through a bond, such as with the London underground proposals, which would leave ownership with local government, has also been shelved. However the finance is raised, there is an unavoidable truth: to finance a loan, revenue income is needed. That can come from rents or from public subsidy and rents. Rents are in any case largely met from public subsidy in the form of housing benefit. The payment of housing benefit, as our amendment 11 proposes, should be equitable; it should be paid regardless of the age of the tenant. If rents rise to a high level, housing benefit will increase until only those receiving benefit can afford to live in social housing. They will then be unable to afford to get a job that would make them ineligible for benefit. That is not a recipe for social stability.

Mae’r posibilrwydd o ariannu drwy fond, fel gyda chynigion system danddaearol Llundain, lle byddai llywodraeth leol yn parhau fel perchennog, hefyd wedi’i roi i’r neilltu. Sut bynnag y codir yr arian, mae gwirionedd na ellir ei osgoi: er mwyn ariannu benthyciad, mae angen incwm refeniw. Gall hwnnw ddod o renti neu o gymhorthdal cyhoeddus a rhenti. Mewn gwirionedd, telir rhenti i raddau helaeth drwy gymhorthdal cyhoeddus ar ffurf budd-dâl tai beth bynnag. Dylai’r ffordd y telir budd-dâl tai, fel y cynigia ein gwelliant 11, fod yn deg; dylid ei dalu waeth beth fo oedran y tenant. Os bydd rhenti yn codi i lefel uchel, bydd budd-dâl tai yn cynyddu gan olygu mai dim ond y rheini sydd yn cael budd-dâl a all fforddio byw mewn tai cymdeithasol. Yna ni fyddent yn gallu fforddio cael gwaith a fyddai’n eu gwneud yn anghymwys am fudd-dâl. Nid yw hynny’n gydnaws â sefydlogrwydd cymdeithasol.

Until now, the Local Government and Housing Committee and the Minister have respected each other’s views on the future of local government housing and options for the way forward that were available for local government. I do not believe that the Minister wants to proceed along the lines that she is suggesting. I do not believe that she wants to dictate to local government. I believe that it is the UK Treasury’s rules that dictate the Minister’s behaviour on housing. I have come to suspect that she is Gordon Brown’s glove puppet and, despite her displays of strength, the iron hand lies outside Wales.

Hyd yn hyn, mae’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai a’r Gweinidog wedi parchu eu safbwyntiau ei gilydd ar ddyfodol tai llywodraeth leol a’r opsiynau o ran y ffordd ymlaen a oedd ar gael i lywodraeth leol. Ni chredaf fod y Gweinidog am fwrw ati ar hyd y llinellau a awgrymir ganddi. Ni chredaf ei bod am roi gorchmynion i lywodraeth leol. Credaf mai rheolau Trysorlys y DU sydd yn pennu ymddygiad y Gweinidog o ran tai. Yr wyf wedi dechrau amau ei bod yn byped llaw i Gordon Brown ac, er gwaethaf ei chryfder ymddangosiadol, mai’r tu allan i Gymru y mae’r llaw haearn.

William Graham spoken in English p. 61

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61

I propose amendment 2. In point 1, delete ‘and the vision it contains for housing in Wales’, and replace with:

Cynigiaf welliant 2. Ym mhwynt 1, dileer ‘a’r weledigaeth a geir ynddo ar gyfer tai yng Nghymru’ a rhodder yn ei le:

William Graham (continued) spoken in English p. 61

William Graham (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61

I propose amendment 3. Insert as a new point after point 1:

Cynigiaf welliant 3. Ychwaneger pwynt newydd ar ôl pwynt 1:

William Graham (continued) spoken in English p. 61

William Graham (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61

I propose amendment 6. In point 3, insert ‘whilst’ between ‘recognises that’ and ‘delivering’, then add to the end of the sentence:

Cynigiaf welliant 6. Ym mhwynt 3, rhodder ‘tra’n’ yn lle ‘yn’, ac yna ychwaneger y frawddeg ganlynol ar y diwedd:

William Graham (continued) spoken in English p. 61

William Graham (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61

I propose amendment 8. Add as a new point 4:

Cynigiaf welliant 8. Ychwaneger pwynt 4 newydd:

William Graham (continued) spoken in English p. 62

William Graham (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 62

We are all familiar with the statistics describing the 1.27 million dwellings that make up the housing stock in Wales. They are that 72 per cent are owner-occupied, 35 per cent were built before 1919, and 15 per cent are rented from local authorities. The national housing strategy for Wales must address many challenges. These include the problems associated with the high number of owner-occupied homes, the high percentage of houses over 80 years old, and the diminishing number of properties that can be rented from local authorities, together with the changing demographic characteristics in Wales.

Yr ydym oll yn gyfarwydd â’r ystadegau sydd yn disgrifio’r 1.27 miliwn o anheddau sydd yn ffurfio’r stoc tai yng Nghymru, sef bod perchennog-ddeiliad i 72 y cant ohonynt, yr adeiladwyd 35 y cant ohonynt cyn 1919, a bod 15 y cant wedi’u rhentu gan awdurdodau lleol. Rhaid i strategaeth tai genedlaethol Cymru ymdrin â llawer o heriau. Yn eu plith mae’r problemau sydd yn gysylltiedig â nifer uchel y cartrefi â pherchennog-ddeiliad, canran uchel y tai sydd dros 80 mlwydd oed, a’r nifer ostyngol o eiddo y gellir eu rhentu gan awdurdodau lleol, ynghyd â’r nodweddion demograffig cyfnewidiol yng Nghymru.

If it is to be a strategy for the people, it must respect the aspirations of the people. The most telling factor with regard to the future of housing provision in Wales is highlighted in a recent survey for the Council of Mortgage Lenders on homeowners with low incomes. It established that almost 80 per cent of adults possessed a medium-range aspiration to own their own home.

Er mwyn iddi fod yn strategaeth ar gyfer y bobl, rhaid iddi barchu dyheadau’r bobl. Amlygir y ffactor mwyaf trawiadol o ran dyfodol y ddarpariaeth dai yng Nghymru mewn arolwg diweddar ar gyfer y Cyngor Benthycwyr Morgeisi ar berchenogion tai ag incwm isel. Canfu fod gan bron i 80 y cant o oedolion ddyhead canolig o fod yn berchen ar eu cartref eu hunain.

An underlying assumption in ‘Betterwales.com’ is that local authorities are best placed to determine and identify local housing needs. The Welsh Conservative group believes that the independent sector is also geared to identify and meet the needs of the community. It considers local amenities, transport networks and employment opportunities. It will invest in the requisite construction and renovation to improve local housing. It has the flexibility in resources and development, together with management expertise, to ensure that projects are executed efficiently and within budget limits.

Un o ragdybiaethau sylfaenol ‘Gwellcymru.com’ yw mai awdurdodau lleol sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i benderfynu ar anghenion tai lleol a’u nodi. Cred grŵp Ceidwadwyr Cymru fod y sector annibynnol hefyd mewn sefyllfa dda i nodi a diwallu anghenion y gymuned. Ystyria amwynderau lleol, rhwydweithiau trafnidiaeth a chyfleoedd cyflogaeth. Bydd yn buddsoddi yn y gwaith adeiladu ac adnewyddu angenrheidiol er mwyn gwella tai lleol. Mae ganddo’r hyblygrwydd o ran adnoddau a datblygiad, ynghyd ag arbenigedd rheoli, i sicrhau y cyflawnir prosiectau yn effeithlon ac o fewn terfynau cyllidebol.

In addition to the over-reliance on local authorities, achieving the objectives of ‘Betterwales.com’ involves relying on consulting with and receiving input from too many sources—an increased membership of the housing research advisory panel, local housing strategy groups, housing and strategy task groups and the national consultative forum on housing in Wales. We sympathise with Plaid Cymru in its search for certain recommendations from the housing task groups. We wonder how many more recommendations will be forgotten in the consultation and inputs for which this strategy calls. This over-reliance may hinder the progress of many of the strategy’s objectives. When this strategy faces up to dealing with the realities and challenges that it needs to address, some of its initiatives for solving housing problems in Wales will have some credibility.

Yn ogystal â gorddibynnu ar awdurdodau lleol, mae cyflawni amcanion ‘Gwellcymru.com’ yn golygu dibynnu ar ymgynghori â gormod o ffynonellau a chael mewnbwn ganddynt—aelodaeth fwy o’r panel ymgynghorol ar ymchwil tai, grwpiau strategaeth tai lleol, grwpiau gorchwyl tai a strategaeth a’r fforwm ymgynghorol cenedlaethol ar dai yng Nghymru. Cydymdeimlwn â Phlaid Cymru wrth iddi chwilio am argymhellion arbennig gan y grwpiau gorchwyl tai. Meddyliwn tybed faint yn fwy o argymhellion a gaiff eu hanghofio yn y broses ymgynghori a’r mewnbynnau y geilw’r strategaeth hon amdanynt. Gallai’r orddibyniaeth hon rwystro cynnydd llawer o amcanion y strategaeth. Pan wyneba’r strategaeth hon y broblem o ddelio â’r realiti a’r heriau y mae angen iddi ymdrin â hwy, bydd gan rai o’i mentrau ar gyfer datrys problemau tai yng Nghymru rywfaint o hygrededd.

We support the initiatives, particularly on fuel poverty and addressing energy efficiency, which can provide significant improvement to the quality of life of those living in pre-1919 homes and the elderly. We also support the provision of accommodation to those who genuinely fear or are threatened with domestic violence and for the homeless. The reason for suggesting that local authorities are not solely best placed to identify and provide local housing requirements is illustrated by many Welsh local authorities and registered social landlords are reporting falling demand for some types of dwellings. To some extent, changes in demography and in expectations may be moving at a faster pace so that social housing providers can respond. However, the complex needs of the housing market are being met by the independent sector, through their flexibility on planning, development and management skills to interpret market demand. Already, they have responded to the expectations of those seeking new homes; they must, or they will not survive. They do not have the ratepayers’ safety net to sustain inefficient practices.

Cefnogwn y mentrau, yn arbennig ar dlodi tanwydd ac ymdrin ag effeithlonrwydd ynni, a all ddarparu gwelliant sylweddol i ansawdd bywyd y rheini sydd yn byw mewn cartrefi a adeiladwyd cyn 1919 a’r henoed. Cefnogwn hefyd y llety a ddarperir i’r rheini sydd yn wirioneddol ofni trais yn y cartref neu sydd dan fygythiad ohono ac i’r digartref. Mae’r rheswm dros awgrymu nad awdurdodau lleol ar eu pennau eu hunain sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i nodi a darparu gofynion tai lleol i’w weld yn y ffaith bod llawer o awdurdodau lleol a landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig yng Nghymru yn cofnodi bod y galw am rai mathau o anheddau yn gostwng. I ryw raddau, mae’n bosibl bod newidiadau o ran demograffeg a disgwyliadau yn digwydd yn gyflymach fel y gall darparwyr tai cymdeithasol ymateb. Fodd bynnag, diwellir anghenion cymhleth y farchnad dai gan y sector annibynnol, drwy eu hyblygrwydd o ran sgiliau cynllunio, datblygu a rheoli i ddehongli’r galw yn y farchnad. Eisoes, maent wedi ymateb i ddisgwyliadau’r rheini sydd am gael cartrefi newydd; rhaid iddynt wneud hynny, neu ni oroesant. Nid oes ganddynt rwyd ddiogelwch trethdalwyr i gynnal arferion aneffeithlon.

We welcome the recognition of the diminishing number of properties under local authority control, whether through a stock transfer to registered social landlords or moving into private ownership via the right to buy scheme. We also acknowledge the acceptance, within the strategy, of private finance initiatives that will ensure that many of the objectives are achieved. It has long been claimed that the right to buy policy has left local authorities with the undesirable homes. If that is true, why were the right to buy sales in 2000 higher than in any year since 1991, despite the steadily declining stock? The signs are that sales will continue at that level.

Croesawn y gydnabyddiaeth i’r ffaith bod nifer yr eiddo o dan reolaeth awdurdodau lleol yn gostwng, boed drwy drosglwyddo stoc i landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig neu symud i berchenogaeth breifat drwy gyfrwng y cynllun hawl i brynu. Cydnabyddwn hefyd y ffaith bod mentrau cyllid preifat wedi eu derbyn, o fewn y strategaeth, a fydd yn sicrhau y cyflawnir llawer o’r amcanion. Honnwyd ers tro bod y polisi hawl i brynu wedi golygu mai’r cartrefi annymunol sydd yn weddill i awdurdodau lleol. Os felly, pam oedd y gwerthiannau hawl i brynu yn 2000 yn uwch nag mewn unrhyw flwyddyn ers 1991, er gwaethaf y stoc sydd yn dirywio’n gyson? Dengys yr arwyddion y bydd gwerthiannau yn parhau ar y lefel honno.

The reality for local authorities is that the percentage of their housing stock that was vacant in 2000 reached the highest level since records began in 1981. The number of properties vacant and available for letting almost doubled between 1997 and 2000. Those that were vacant for more than six months rose more than six times over the same period. For providers of social housing, it is now less a question of allocating a scarce resource and more one of devising and supplying products that will attract tenants.

Y realiti ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol yw y cyrhaeddodd canran eu stoc tai a oedd yn wag yn ystod 2000 y lefel uchaf ers i gofnodion ddechrau yn 1981. Bu bron i nifer yr eiddo gwag a oedd ar gael i’w gosod ddyblu rhwng 1997 a 2000. Cododd y rheini a oedd yn wag am fwy na chwe mis fwy na chwe gwaith dros yr un cyfnod. I ddarparwyr tai cymdeithasol, nid mater o ddyrannu adnodd brin ydyw bellach yn gymaint ag o ddyfeisio a chyflenwi cynnyrch i ddenu tenantiaid.

We understand the need to provide quality, low cost homes as well as the need to ensure that people can afford the costs of buying and maintaining them. We recognise that people aspire to become homeowners and that there may be a fear about being committed to a mortgage. However, people must be made aware that in many parts of Wales, the sound economic case for buying and the cost of a mortgage are less than, or similar to, the cost of renting certain properties. The real factors that determine good quality housing will be lost in the many consultative forums. For that reason, I ask you to support the amendments, and I am grateful to the Minister for indicating that she will do so.

Deallwn yr angen i ddarparu cartrefi rhad o ansawdd, yn ogystal â’r angen i sicrhau y gall pobl fforddio costau eu prynu a’u cadw a’u cynnal. Cydnabyddwn fod pobl yn dymuno bod yn berchen ar eu cartrefi a bod pryder efallai ynglŷn ag ymrwymo i forgais. Fodd bynnag, rhaid i bobl fod yn ymwybodol, mewn sawl rhan o Gymru, bod y ddadl economaidd gall dros brynu a chost morgais yn llai na’r gost o rentu rhai eiddo, neu’n debyg. Collir y ffactorau gwirioneddol sydd yn pennu tai da o ansawdd yn y fforymau ymgynghorol lu. Oherwydd hynny, gofynnaf ichi gefnogi’r gwelliannau, ac yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i’r Gweinidog am nodi y gwnaiff hynny.

The real factors that determine good quality housing go beyond bricks and mortar. They include the freedom of having no fear of crime, police presence on our streets, not being harassed by bad neighbours, access to a doctor’s surgery and wider community services, and living in a clean, well-kept environment. It is more to do with neighbourhood management than housing policies.

Aiff y ffactorau sydd yn pennu tai da o ansawdd y tu hwnt i friciau a morter. Yn eu plith mae’r rhyddid o beidio ag ofni troseddau, presenoldeb heddlu ar ein strydoedd, peidio â dioddef aflonyddu gan gymdogion gwael, mynediad i feddygfa a gwasanaethau cymunedol ehangach, a byw mewn amgylchedd glân a gedwir yn dda. Mae’n ymwneud yn fwy â rheoli cymdogaethau na pholisïau tai.

Peter Law spoken in English p. 65

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 65

I am grateful for the opportunity to speak in this debate. The strategy is a beacon of commitment to the people of Wales. It is interesting to see Mike German back in the Chamber—although I am sorry that he has just left—because he asked recently what the Assembly’s first administration achieved. The first administration worked hard to bring this document to fruition so that it was consulted on just as the partnership Government was being established. That was not so much to do with Ministers or civil servants but with a raft of people who gave of their time freely, to whom the Ministers pay tribute. Whether they were tenants, mortgage lenders, landlords or representatives from housing associations or local authorities, they all came together on the national housing forum’s four working parties to make this happen. That is why we have this beacon of commitment today. That is why we do things differently in Wales and we can be pleased about that. It was set up during the first administration. I am delighted that this strategy has been brought before us today, and I thank those people for their work. This is a chance for us to show that we will do things positively and differently for the people of Wales. It is about providing decent living conditions for people, homes in good condition and reasonable repair, to ensure social inclusion. Sadly, there are so many estates where that is not the case. There are many in my constituency.

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am y cyfle i siarad yn y ddadl hon. Mae’r strategaeth yn symbol o ymrwymiad i bobl Cymru. Mae’n ddiddorol gweld Mike German yn ôl yn y Siambr—er y gresynnaf ei fod newydd adael—oherwydd gofynnodd yn ddiweddar beth a lwyddodd gweinyddiaeth gyntaf y Cynulliad i’w gyflawni. Gweithiodd y weinyddiaeth gyntaf yn galed i sicrhau bod y ddogfen hon yn dwyn ffrwyth fel ei bod yn destun ymgynghoriad ar yr un adeg ag y cafodd y Llywodraeth bartneriaeth ei sefydlu. Nid oedd hynny yn ymwneud gymaint â Gweinidogion neu weision sifil ond â llu o bobl a roddodd mor hael o’u hamser, y bobl hynny y mae’r Gweinidogion yn talu teyrnged iddynt. Pa un a oeddent yn denantiaid, benthycwyr morgeisi, landlordiaid neu gynrychiolwyr cymdeithasau tai neu awdurdodau lleol, daethant i gyd ynghyd ar bedwar gweithgor y fforwm tai cenedlaethol i ysbarduno hyn. Dyna pam bod gennym y symbol hwn o ymrwymiad heddiw. Dyna pam y gwnawn bethau yn wahanol yng Nghymru a gallwn ymfalchïo yn hynny. Sefydlwyd hyn yn ystod y weinyddiaeth gyntaf. Yr wyf yn hynod falch y cyflwynwyd y strategaeth hon ger ein bron heddiw a diolchaf i’r bobl hynny am eu gwaith. Mae hwn yn gyfle inni brofi y gwnawn bethau yn gadarnhaol ac yn wahanol ar gyfer pobl Cymru. Mae’n ymwneud â darparu amodau byw gweddus i bobl, cartrefi mewn cyflwr da a rhesymol, a sicrhau cynhwysedd cymdeithasol. Yn anffodus, mae cymaint o ystadau lle nad yw hynny’n wir. Mae llawer yn fy etholaeth i.

I am not pleased that we could not increase the budget when the Assembly came into being two years ago, because we worked on comprehensive spending review figures. However, the Minister has recognised that and we are increasing the budget under the new CSR. It will never be enough, but it is a move forward to give our local authorities more funding to tackle housing needs in their areas. There are still many estates where conditions are poor and, with £1 billion backlog of outstanding repairs, we will never be able to do the job properly. Our resources are insufficient. Stock transfer is not the be all and end all, but it is an option. When people live in poor conditions, you must, in reality, consider all the options. Stock transfer has been seriously considered by the Committee and the Government. It has a place for future consideration. It is important that we do all that we can to ensure that the local authority control companies—

Nid wyf yn falch na allem gynyddu’r gyllideb pan ddaeth y Cynulliad i fodolaeth ddwy flynedd yn ôl, oherwydd yr oeddem yn gweithredu ar ffigurau’r adolygiad cynhwysfawr o wariant. Fodd bynnag, cydnabu’r Gweinidog hynny ac yr ydym yn cynyddu’r gyllideb o dan yr adolygiad cynhwysfawr o wariant newydd. Ni fydd byth yn ddigon, ond mae’n gam ymlaen i roi mwy o nawdd i’n hawdurdodau lleol i fynd i’r afael ag anghenion tai yn eu hardaloedd. Ceir llawer o ystadau o hyd lle mae’r amodau’n wael a chydag ôl-groniad gwerth £1 biliwn o atgyweiriadau, ni fyddwn byth yn gallu gwneud y gwaith yn iawn. Mae ein hadnoddau yn annigonol. Nid trosglwyddo stoc yw’r unig fater o bwys, ond mae’n opsiwn. Pan fo pobl yn byw mewn amodau gwael, rhaid ichi, mewn gwirionedd, ystyried yr holl opsiynau. Ystyriwyd trosglwyddo stoc o ddifrif gan y Pwyllgor a’r Llywodraeth. Mae’n haeddu cael ei ystyried yn y dyfodol. Mae’n bwysig inni wneud popeth o fewn ein gallu i sicrhau y gall yr awdurdodau lleol reoli cwmnïau—

Glyn Davies spoken in English p. 66

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 66

I listened to Peter’s comments. There is a wonderful example of how stock transfer has worked in Welshpool, where a depressed estate at Oldford was transferred under stock transfer about 10 years ago. It is a magnificent example of what can be achieved.

Gwrandawais ar sylwadau Peter. Ceir enghraifft wych o sut y gweithiodd trosglwyddo stoc yn y Trallwng, lle y trawsnewidiwyd ystad ddirwasgedig yn Oldford o dan y system trosglwyddo stoc tua 10 mlynedd yn ôl. Mae’n enghraifft wych o’r hyn y gellir ei gyflawni.

Peter Law spoken in English p. 66

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 66

That may be the case, but there are differing opinions on that. I need to research that further. However, there are few examples in Wales. A prime cause of the problem was the under-investment of Conservative Governments over many years. The Tories were anti-local government. They still are. You heard William Graham’s speech earlier. They must answer for a lot—

Efallai bod hynny’n wir, ond ceir safbwyntiau gwahanol ynglŷn â hynny. Mae angen imi ymchwilio ymhellach i hynny. Fodd bynnag, prin yw’r enghreifftiau yng Nghymru. Un o brif achosion y broblem oedd tanfuddsoddiad Llywodraethau Ceidwadol dros nifer o flynyddoedd. Yr oedd y Torïaid yn gwrthwynebu llywodraeth leol. Parhânt i wneud hynny. Clywsoch araith William Graham yn gynharach. Maent yn atebol dros lawer—

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 66

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 66

Whatever you say about the Conservatives, the Labour Party inherited a tremendous economy from them. Is it not true that housing is one of the most important aspects of Welsh life? You heard William Graham refer to the age of our houses. Therefore, should you not invest some of that extra money to ensure decent housing in Wales?

Beth bynnag a ddywedwch am y Ceidwadwyr, etifeddodd y Blaid Lafur economi aruthrol ganddynt. Onid yw’n wir mai tai yw un o’r agweddau pwysicaf ar fywyd yng Nghymru? Clywsoch William Graham yn cyfeirio at oedran rhai o’n tai. Felly, oni ddylech fuddsoddi peth o’r arian ychwanegol hwnnw i sicrhau bod tai gweddus yng Nghymru?

Peter Law spoken in English p. 66

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 66

That is most touching coming from the party that even denies that there is any homelessness in Cardiff. If you spent as much time lobbying for housing facilities as you do for the fuel lobby, then many people would live in safer conditions. That is what it is about. We are dealing with a legacy from the Tory days. There have been four years of a Labour Government, but it has been paying back the deficits and tackling the problems that it inherited from you. Do not ask me, but ask people outside. They will say that what the Assembly has done already is refreshing.

Mae hynny’n deimladwy iawn o ystyried ei fod yn deillio o blaid sydd hyd yn oed yn gwadu bod unrhyw ddigartrefedd yng Nghaerdydd. Pe baech yn treulio cymaint o amser yn lobïo am gyfleusterau tai ag y treuliwch yn lobïo ar danwydd, yna byddai llawer o bobl yn byw mewn amodau mwy diogel. Dyna wraidd y mater. Yr ydym yn ymdrin ag etifeddiaeth o ddyddiau’r Torïaid. Cafwyd pedair blynedd o Lywodraeth Lafur, ond bu’n unioni’r diffygion ac yn mynd i’r afael â’r problemau a etifeddodd oddi wrthych chi. Peidiwch â gofyn imi, gofynnwch i’r bobl y tu allan. Dywedant fod yr hyn y mae’r Cynulliad eisoes wedi’i wneud fel chwa o awyr iach.

David Davies spoken in English p. 67

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 67

Are you aware that a parliamentary question asked about two years ago revealed that the number of homeless people had risen since your Government took office?

A ydych yn ymwybodol bod cwestiwn seneddol a ofynnwyd tua dwy flynedd yn ôl wedi datgelu bod nifer y bobl ddigartref wedi cynyddu ers i’ch Llywodraeth ddod i rym?

Peter Law spoken in English p. 67

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 67

A parliamentary question is nothing to do with me, because this is the National Assembly for Wales. The number of homeless people has decreased in Wales. If you speak to the organisations that are authoritative on this, which, hitherto, you never recognised—such as Shelter, the Wallich Clifford Community and the Big Issue, which carry out great work—they will say that this National Assembly is making a difference. That is where I come back to what I said earlier about—

Nid oes â wnelo cwestiwn seneddol unrhyw beth â mi, am mai Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru yw hwn. Mae nifer y bobl ddigartref yng Nghymru wedi gostwng. Os siaradwch â’r sefydliadau sydd yn awdurdod ar hyn, nad ydych erioed wedi eu cydnabod hyd yn hyn—megis Shelter, Cymuned Wallich Clifford a’r Big Issue, sydd yn gwneud gwaith ardderchog—dywedant wrthych fod y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol hwn yn gwneud gwahaniaeth. Dyma lle y cyfeiriaf yn ôl at yr hyn a ddywedais yn gynharach ynglŷn â—

David Davies a gododd—

David Davies rose—

Peter Law spoken in English p. 67

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 67

I am not giving way again, because it is a waste of time talking to the Tories.

Nid ildiaf eto, gan fod siarad â’r Torïaid yn wastraff amser.

I want to refer briefly to stock transfer. No stock transfer can happen without the support of the tenants, who must be balloted, or the local authorities. Most importantly, we must take into account and consult the frontline workers who deal with the administrative and maintenance work for these estates and, without whom, we could not manage those estates. They are important and that is why I support the trade union’s concerns in this.

Dymunaf gyfeirio yn fyr at drosglwyddo stoc. Ni ellir trosglwyddo unrhyw stoc heb gefnogaeth tenantiaid, sydd yn gorfod bwrw pleidlais, neu’r awdurdodau lleol. Yn bwysicach, rhaid inni ystyried ac ymgynghori â’r gweithwyr rheng flaen sydd yn ymdrin â’r gwaith gweinyddol a chynnal a chadw ar gyfer yr ystadau hyn, a hebddynt ni allem reoli’r ystadau hynny. Maent yn bwysig a dyna pam y cefnogaf bryderon yr undebau llafur ynglŷn â hyn.

I am delighted with how Care and Repair Cymru has been extended throughout Wales and is to be totally funded by the National Assembly for Wales. It is a wonderful organisation that does good work for our elderly and disabled people. The Homeless Commission is an important body that is working with all homeless bodies to make a difference on a day to day basis. We have seen a great increase in the resources available for them to tackle those problems. There is no doubt that the Minister is a realist and she wants to see the best for our people. I compliment her on how she has approached the Treasury once again to ask for these restrictions to be relaxed. Having said that, at the end of the day, the responsibility under the legislation that we have rests with us. We cannot ignore the fact that people need help. We must develop houses in communities where people want to live and where the errors of the past are not repeated. We must go for sustainable development where our people can enjoy good quality, social housing in a safe, pleasant and healthy environment. That is what this document is about and that is why I am pleased to support it.

Yr wyf yn hynod falch o’r ffordd yr estynnwyd Gofal a Thrwsio Cymru ledled Cymru ac y bwriedir iddo gael ei ariannu yn gyfan gwbl bellach gan Gynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru. Mae’n sefydliad gwych sydd yn gwneud gwaith da ar gyfer ein henoed a phobl anabl. Mae’r Comisiwn Digartrefedd yn gorff pwysig sydd yn gweithio â’r holl gyrff digartrefedd i wneud gwahaniaeth o ddydd i ddydd. Gwelsom gynnydd mawr yn yr adnoddau sydd ar gael iddynt fynd i’r afael â’r problemau hynny. Nid oes unrhyw amheuaeth fod y Gweinidog yn realydd a’i bod yn dymuno gweld y gorau i’n pobl i gyd. Fe’i canmolaf am y ffordd y gofynnodd i’r Trysorlys unwaith eto i lacio’r cyfyngiadau hyn. Ar ôl dweud hynny, yn y pen draw, ar ein hysgwyddau ni y mae’r cyfrifoldeb o dan y ddeddfwriaeth sydd gennym. Ni allwn anwybyddu’r ffaith bod angen help ar bobl. Rhaid inni ddatblygu tai mewn cymunedau lle y mae pobl yn dymuno byw a lle na chaiff camgymeriadau’r gorffennol eu hailadrodd. Rhaid inni anelu at ddatblygu cynaliadwy lle y gall ein pobl fwynhau tai cymdeithasol o ansawdd da, mewn amgylchedd diogel, dymunol ac iach. Dyna yw byrdwn y ddogfen hon a dyna pam mae’n bleser gennyf ei chefnogi.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 68

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 68

Yr wyf yn falch o’r cyfle i siarad yn fyr ar rai agweddau penodol ar y materion ger ein bron, ac yn arbennig, yr agweddau hynny sydd yn ymwneud â thai gwledig. Fel y gŵyr Aelodau, bûm yn cadeirio gweithgor ar y pwnc hwn, ac awgrymais nifer o argymhellion. Yr wyf yn falch fod ymateb y Llywodraeth i’r rhan fwyaf o’n hargymhellion wedi bod yn weddol bositif.

I am pleased to have the opportunity to speak briefly on some specific aspects of the issues before us, and particularly, those aspects concerning rural housing. As Members know, I chaired a working group on this issue and I suggested many recommendations. I am pleased that the Government’s response to the majority of our recommendations has been quite positive.

Cyfeiriaf yn arbennig at dudalennau 27 i 29. Mae’r strategaeth yn cydnabod y problemau sydd yn wynebu cymunedau lleol, o safbwynt gwasanaethau hanfodol, megis siopau, swyddfeydd post, bysus, ac yn y blaen. Mae strategaeth y Llywodraeth hefyd yn cadarnhau—ac mae’n werth i Aelodau nodi hyn—bod mewnfudiad a phrynu ail gartrefi yn un o’r ffactorau mwyaf dylanwadol o safbwynt strwythur cymunedau mewn ardaloedd gwledig, ac felly’n cael effaith uniongyrchol ar ddyfodol yr iaith Gymraeg. Mae hynny’n ffactor, beth bynnag a deimlwn yw’r ateb i’r broblem honno.

I refer particularly to pages 27 to 29. The strategy recognises the problems that local communities face, with regard to essential services, such as shops, post offices, buses, and so on. The Government strategy also confirms—and Members should note this—that inward migration and buying second homes is one of the most influential factors as far as the structure of communities in rural areas is concerned, and therefore has a direct impact on the future of the Welsh language. That is a factor, whatever we feel the solution to the problem should be.

Nid yw’r strategaeth yn mynd yn ddigon pell o safbwynt ateb problem tai mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Cofiwch fod unigolion di-Gymraeg yn wynebu’r broblem honno gymaint ag unigolion Cymraeg eu hiaith. Mae’r broblem yn bodoli mewn ardaloedd fel Powys, Mynwy a Sir Benfro fel yng Ngheredigion neu Wynedd. Rhaid edrych o ddifrif ar y cynllun prynu cartref a gyflwynwyd gan y Gweinidog ym mis Chwefror. Mae’r cynllun hwnnw wedi cynyddu’r cyfran o arian cyhoeddus sydd ar gael fel cymorth i brynu tŷ i 50 y cant. Croesawn hynny. Mae’n gam sylweddol ymlaen a fydd yn galluogi rhywun a all fforddio morgais o £35,000 i brynu tŷ gwerth £70,000.

The strategy does not go far enough to solve the problem of houses in rural areas. Remember that non-Welsh speaking individuals face that problem just as much as Welsh-speaking individuals. The problem exists in areas such as Powys, Monmouth and Pembrokeshire as in Ceredigion or Gwynedd. We need to seriously consider the homebuy scheme that the Minister introduced in February. That scheme has increased the proportion of public sector funding available as assistance to buy a house to 50 per cent. We welcome that. It is a substantial step forward that will enable somebody who can afford a mortgage of £35,000 to buy a house worth £70,000.

Fodd bynnag, nid yw’r bobl sydd yn chwilio am dai yn gwybod digon am y cynllun. Ni fu digon o arweiniad i sicrhau bod awdurdodau lleol a chymdeithasau tai yn ei weithredu. Os yw’r cynllun am wneud gwahaniaeth sylweddol i’r rhagolygon yn y Gymru wledig, amcangyfrifwn fod angen rhyw 500 o dai y flwyddyn. Ar hyn o bryd, rhyw 130 o dai a geir. Mae angen pedair gwaith cymaint â hynny. Mae angen yn nes at £10 miliwn yn hytrach na £3 miliwn. Mater o fanylion yw hynny. Os yw’r Llywodraeth yn ymrwymo i’w chynllun, a groesawn, awgrymwn i’r Llywodraeth roi arian digonol i ddangos ei bod o ddifrif ynglŷn â’r mater.

However, people who are looking for homes do not know enough about this scheme. There was not enough leadership to ensure that local authorities and housing associations implemented it. If the scheme is to make a substantial difference to the prospects for rural Wales, we estimate that some 500 houses will be needed annually. At present, there are around 130 houses. We need four times that amount. We need closer to £10 million rather than £3 million. That is a matter of detail. If the Government commits to its scheme, which we welcome, we suggest that it provides adequate funding to indicate that it is serious about the issue.

Problem arall i bobl yw ceisio rhentu tai mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Caiff llawer o’r tai naill ai eu prynu fel ail gartrefi neu yn cael eu defnyddio fel tai yn y sector preifat. Nid yw pobl ar gyflogau isel yn gallu cystadlu yn y sector hwnnw. Mae angen i gymdeithasau tai allu prynu tai mewn ardaloedd gwledig yn rhwyddach a’u gosod ar rent teg i bobl sydd ar incwm isel yn yr ardaloedd hynny. Gellid gwneud hyn—

Another problem for people is trying to rent houses in rural areas. Many of the houses are bought as second homes, or are used as houses in the private sector. People on low incomes cannot compete in that sector. Housing associations need to be able to buy houses more easily in rural areas and let them at an affordable rent to people on low incomes in those areas. This can be achieved—

Peter Rogers a gododd—

Peter Rogers rose—

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 69

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 69

Fe ildiaf ymhen munud.

I will give way in a minute.

Mae’r arweiniad a gawsom yng nghyfarfod diweddar Pwyllgor Rhanbarth y Gogledd yn y Rhyl yn dweud nad oes problem. Serch hynny, wrth siarad â chymdeithasau tai, mae’n amlwg bod problemau o ran gwerth y tai, y canllawiau gorfodol a’r safonau

The guidance that we received at the recent meeting of the North Wales Regional Committee in Rhyl states that there is no problem. However, having spoken with housing associations, it is obvious that there are problems in terms of the value of houses, the mandatory guidelines and the standards.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 70

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 70

In my area, a housing association recently gazumped a young couple who had intended to buy a property. That caused considerable problems but, after I had intervened, the association was persuaded to withdraw its offer. I am worried, therefore, about the way in which housing associations purchase properties.

Yn fy ardal i, yn ddiweddar gasympiodd cymdeithas dai bâr ifanc a oedd wedi bwriadu prynu eiddo. Achosodd hynny gryn broblemau ond, ar ôl imi ymyrryd, darbwyllwyd y gymdeithas i dynnu ei chynnig yn ôl. Yr wyf yn bryderus, felly, ynghylch y ffordd y mae cymdeithasau tai yn prynu eiddo.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 70

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 70

Dylai fod gan gymdeithasau tai yr adnoddau a’r rhwyddineb i weithio’n gyflym heb gael eu clymu gan ormod o ganllawiau, fel y gallant brynu’r tai sydd ar gael er mwyn diwallu anghenion lleol. Byddai hynny’n gwneud gwahaniaeth sylweddol.

Housing associations should have the resources and facility to work quickly without being tied down by too many guidelines, so that they can buy the available houses in order to meet local needs. That would make a significant difference.

Problem arall yw ail gartrefi a thai haf. Mae pawb yn derbyn bod tai haf yn angenrheidiol i’n diwydiant twristiaeth. Fodd bynnag, pan fod 20 y cant neu 30 y cant o eiddo cymuned yn dai haf, gall hynny chwalu bywyd y pentref ac annog pobl leol i symud o’r pentref i chwilio am y gwasanaethau sydd yn diflannu o’r ardal. Dyna paham y mae Plaid Cymru’n teimlo y dylid gwneud caniatâd cynllunio yn orfodol cyn y gellid troi eiddo a fu’n dŷ annedd llawn yn dŷ haf, yn enwedig os oes cyfran sylweddol o dai haf yn y gymuned eisoes.

Another problem is second homes and holiday homes. Everyone accepts that holiday homes are vital to our tourist industry. However, when 20 per cent or 30 per cent of properties within a community are holiday homes, it can destroy village life and encourage local people to move away to look for the services that are disappearing from the area. That is why Plaid Cymru feels that, to turn a residential property into a holiday home, particularly if there are numerous holiday homes in the community already, planning permission should be mandatory.

Pobl leol a ŵyr beth yw sefyllfa’r eiddo yn eu cymuned, a byddai caniatâd cynllunio gorfodol yn eu galluogi i reoli’r sefyllfa honno. Er enghraifft, derbyniol fyddai troi tŷ gwag ar ben mynydd, nad oedd neb yn y gymuned yn dymuno ei brynu, yn ail gartref. Pe bai’r tŷ hwnnw yng nghanol pentref â bron i draean yr eiddo yn dai haf eisoes, dylai fod gan bobl leol y gallu i ddweud ‘na’. Nid yw hynny’n syniad chwyldroadol, ond yn hytrach mae’n rhywbeth rhesymol y mae gan y Cynulliad y pŵer i’w weithredu. Erfyniaf ar Sue Essex, yn hytrach nag ar Edwina Hart yn yr achos hwn, i ystyried y mater hwn eto. Gwn ei bod wedi derbyn rhywfaint o gyngor negyddol, ond pe bai modd caniatáu rheolaeth i gymunedau, byddai’n dangos bod y Cynulliad yn ymateb mewn modd sensitif ac yn ceisio datrys y broblem. Gobeithiaf y bydd y Llywodraeth yn ystyried hynny.

It is local people who understand the property situation in their community, and mandatory planning permission would enable them to control that situation. For example, it would be acceptable to turn an empty house on top of a mountain, which no local people wanted to buy, into a second home. Were that house to be in the middle of a village where almost a third of its properties are already holiday homes, local people should have the ability to say ‘no’. It is a reasonable, not revolutionary, idea that the Assembly has the power to implement. I implore Sue Essex, rather than Edwina Hart in this instance, to reconsider this issue. I know that she has received some negative advice but, were it possible to empower communities in this respect, it would demonstrate that the Assembly is reacting in a sensitive manner and is trying to resolve the problem. I hope that the Government will consider that.

Lorraine Barrett spoken in English p. 71

Lorraine Barrett siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71

I declare an interest as a member of the Co-operative Party. I welcome the Minister’s warm statement on the option of community mutuals. I am delighted that she has embraced this option. I chair the Assembly’s Labour Co-operative Party group, which met this week with representatives of the Co-operative Union to discuss community mutuals. The group will be more than happy to help take this option forward.

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o’r Blaid Gydweithredol. Croesawaf ddatganiad cynnes y Gweinidog ar opsiwn cwmnïau cymunedol cydfuddiannol. Yr wyf yn falch ei bod wedi dewis coleddu’r opsiwn hwn. Cadeiriaf grŵp Plaid Gydweithredol Lafur y Cynulliad, a gyfarfu yr wythnos hon â chynrychiolwyr yr Undeb Cydweithredol i drafod cwmnïau cydfuddiannol cymunedol. Bydd y grŵp yn fwy na pharod i ddatblygu’r opsiwn hwn.

The Minister mentioned the article in The Western Mail. I had numerous phone calls yesterday from concerned people, whom I told not to worry about Edwina Hart’s commitment to local authorities and their continued involvement in social housing and stock transfer. I wish that Clive Betts had read the whole report, rather than cherry-pick the odd word here and there.

Crybwyllodd y Gweinidog yr erthygl yn The Western Mail. Cefais alwadau ffôn di-rif ddoe gan bobl bryderus, a dywedais wrthynt i beidio â phoeni am ymrwymiad Edwina Hart i awdurdodau lleol a’u rhan barhaus mewn tai cymdeithasol a throsglwyddo stoc. Hoffwn pe bai Clive Betts wedi darllen yr adroddiad cyfan yn hytrach na chodi ambell air fan hyn fan draw.

The right to buy has appealed to thousands of former council tenants. I do not blame them for that, given the preferential discounts to enable them to buy their properties. However, it has left local authorities with poorer housing stocks, as the better properties were sold. There are many good housing associations that work closely with local authorities throughout Wales, but there is still a large number of people who want to be council tenants. I am not sure what the answer could be. I would not be brave enough to withdraw the right to buy, but perhaps it should be made more equitable to those who want to buy private houses. We should consider what we can do to protect existing council housing and to encourage people who can afford it to buy private housing rather than continuing to eat up the council housing stock.

Apeliodd yr hawl i brynu at filoedd o gyn denantiaid tai cyngor. Nid wyf yn eu beio am hynny, gan fod y gostyngiadau ffafriol wedi’u galluogi i brynu eu heiddo. Fodd bynnag, gadawodd hynny awdurdodau lleol â stoc tai gwael, gan fod yr eiddo gwell wedi’i werthu. Ceir nifer o gymdeithasau tai da sydd yn cydweithio’n agos ag awdurdodau lleol ledled Cymru, ond mae nifer sylweddol o bobl o hyd sydd yn dymuno bod yn denantiaid cyngor. Nid wyf yn siŵr beth allai’r ateb fod. Ni fyddwn yn ddigon dewr i dynnu’r hawl i brynu yn ôl, ond efallai y dylid ei wneud yn fwy teg i’r rheini sydd yn dymuno prynu tai preifat. Dylem ystyried yr hyn y gallwn ei wneud i ddiogelu tai cyngor presennol ac i annog y rheini sydd yn gallu ei fforddio i brynu tai preifat yn hytrach na pharhau i lyncu’r stoc tai cyngor.

I welcome the Minister’s continued commitment to local authority involvement in whichever scheme they deem best for their communities.

Croesawaf ymrwymiad parhaus y Gweinidog i gynnwys yr awdurdodau lleol ym mha bynnag gynllun y credant sydd orau i’w cymunedau.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 71

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71

There is not enough investment in housing in Wales. Wales has the highest proportion of owner-occupiers in Great Britain and the highest percentage of old housing. Those houses require considerable expenditure to bring them up to liveable standards. Far too many houses fall below the standards that we expect of a modern society. We need more money, which must be used more effectively. One way forward would be to involve the independent sector more actively in managing and delivering projects. I agree with Peter Law’s comments about care and repair. It is a tremendous example of how social services’ money can be saved. One county has already saved over £1 million through its investment in care and repair, as fewer people have to go to residential homes. We should develop that work.

Nid oes digon o fuddsoddiad mewn tai yng Nghymru. Mae gan Gymru’r gyfran uchaf o berchenogion-breswylwyr ym Mhrydain a’r gyfran uchaf o hen dai. Mae angen cryn wariant ar y tai hynny i sicrhau eu bod o safon addas i fyw ynddynt. Mae llawer gormod o dai yn is na’r safonau a ddisgwyliwn mewn cymdeithas fodern. Mae angen mwy o arian arnom, ac mae’n rhaid ei ddefnyddio’n fwy effeithiol. Un ffordd ymlaen fyddai cynnwys y sector annibynnol yn fwy gweithredol wrth reoli a chyflwyno prosiectau. Cytunaf â sylwadau Peter Law ynglŷn â gofal a thrwsio. Mae’n enghraifft wych o’r modd y gellid arbed arian gwasanaethau cymdeithasol. Arbedodd un sir eisoes dros £1 miliwn drwy ei fuddsoddiad mewn gofal a thrwsio, gan fod llai o bobl yn gorfod symud i dai preswyl. Dylem ddatblygu’r gwaith hwnnw.

However, administering care and repair schemes is costly. Figures show that one county spends £90,000 on administering the scheme, which means almost £900 for every job that was carried out. In another county, the figure is £600 per job. Therefore, making more money available for care and repair and ensuring that more people have fit homes, so that they do not have to go into residential care, is one way of saving money. Such schemes can make an enormous difference to those people who need help. I congratulate the counties that have made tremendous efforts. However, are we getting a proper return for our money? We must consider how we manage these schemes. Could the private sector deliver more cost-efficiently? What do we mean by the word ‘need’?

Fodd bynnag, mae gweinyddu cynlluniau gofal a thrwsio yn gostus. Dengys ffigurau fod un sir yn gwario £90,000 ar weinyddu’r cynllun, sydd yn golygu bron i £900 ar gyfer pob darn o waith a wnaethpwyd. Mewn sir arall, £600 yw’r ffigur fesul darn o waith. Felly, mae rhoi mwy o arian ar gyfer gofal a thrwsio a sicrhau bod gan bobl dai gweddus, fel nad oes yn rhaid iddynt droi at ofal preswyl, yn un ffordd o arbed arian. Gall cynlluniau o’r fath wneud gwahaniaeth mawr i’r bobl hynny y mae angen help arnynt. Llongyfarchaf y siroedd a wnaeth ymdrechion taer. Fodd bynnag, a ydym yn cael gwerth ein harian? Rhaid inni ystyried sut y rheolwn y cynlluniau hyn. A allai’r sector preifat weithredu yn fwy cost effeithlon? Beth a olygwn wrth ddefnyddio’r gair ‘angen’?

Pauline Jarman spoken in English p. 72

Pauline Jarman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 72

I declare an interest as a member of Rhondda Cynon Taff County Borough Council. Peter mentioned the cost per job of care and repair. Does he agree that the combination of continued and historical under-investment and compulsory competitive tendering played a major part in reducing the effectiveness of housing maintenance programmes on council estates? This led to the appalling legacy of housing repairs and maintenance that has forced us to consider stock transfer options.

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf. Crybwyllodd Peter y gost fesul pob darn o waith gofal a thrwsio. A gytuna fod y cyfuniad o danfuddsoddiad parhaus a hanesyddol a thendro gorfodol cystadleuol wedi chwarae rhan fawr mewn lleihau effeithiolrwydd y rhaglenni cynnal tai ar ystadau cyngor? Arweiniodd hyn at etifeddiaeth warthus o waith atgyweirio a chynnal a chadw tai sydd wedi ein gorfodi i ystyried opsiynau trosglwyddo stoc.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 73

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 73

As Government money is now available, we must address the problems in Wales and move forward.

Gan fod arian bellach ar gael gan y Llywodraeth, rhaid inni fynd i’r afael â’r problemau yng Nghymru a symud ymlaen.

In many counties, the home improvement grants deny access to young, local couples who need to get onto the housing ladder. As they are not categorised, they are placed towards the bottom of the waiting list for home improvement grants. Quite rightly, those in the top categories include elderly people, people in need and the unemployed. However, we must give some encouragement to young people. Part of the budget should be allocated to young, first-time buyers, so that they have money to improve their homes to a decent standard.

Mewn nifer o siroedd, mae’r grantiau gwella tai yn amharu ar fynediad i barau ifanc, lleol y mae angen iddynt gamu ar yr ysgol dai. Gan na chânt eu categoreiddio, fe’u rhoddir ar waelod y rhestrau aros am grantiau gwella tai. Yn hollol briodol, mae’r rheini sydd yn y categorïau uchaf yn cynnwys yr henoed, pobl anghenus a’r di-waith. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni roi peth anogaeth i bobl ifanc. Dylid dyrannu peth o’r gyllideb i bobl ifanc sydd yn prynu tai am y tro cyntaf, fel bod ganddynt yr arian i wella’u tai i safon weddus.

Elderly people have access in many other areas—

Mae gan yr henoed fynediad mewn nifer o ardaloedd eraill—

Glyn Davies spoken in English p. 73

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 73

I congratulate Peter on his outstanding contribution. Does he agree that this is typical of the Conservative Party today? It makes people like Peter Law, who makes ridiculous contributions about history, rather than today’s modern Conservative Party, sound old-fashioned. Our policies are far better for the honourable people of this country than anything that he will ever do.

Llongyfarchaf Peter ar ei gyfraniad rhagorol. A gytuna fod hyn yn nodweddiadol o’r Blaid Geidwadol heddiw? Gwna i bobl fel Peter Law, sydd yn gwneud cyfraniadau ffôl ynglŷn â hanes, yn hytrach na Phlaid Geidwadol fodern heddiw, swnio’n henffasiwn. Mae’n polisïau yn llawer gwell ar gyfer pobl anrhydeddus y wlad hon nag unrhyw beth a wna ef byth.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 73

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 73

Although Labour has been in control in Peter Law’s constituency for a long time, conditions have still not improved.

Er bod Llafur wedi bod mewn grym yn etholaeth Peter Law am gyfnod hir, nid yw’r amodau wedi gwella o hyd.

If we extend access to a variety of grant schemes for home improvement, we can foster a sense of pride and participation in communities that are in desperate need of a greater sense of civic pride. If we have a vision to make a start on this now, we will ultimately encourage young people to recognise the benefits of getting onto the housing ladder. That would be beneficial to the economic and social development of Wales, which go hand in hand.

Pe baem yn ymestyn mynediad i amrywiaeth o gynlluniau grantiau, gallwn feithrin ymdeimlad o falchder a chyfranogiad mewn cymunedau y mae angen dirfawr arnynt am fwy o falchder dinesig. Pe bai gennym weledigaeth i ddechrau ar hyn yn awr, byddwn yn y pen draw yn annog pobl ifanc i gydnabod manteision camu ar yr ysgol dai. Byddai hynny o fudd i ddatblygiad economaidd a chymdeithasol Cymru, sydd yn mynd law yn llaw.

Rosemary Butler spoken in English p. 73

Rosemary Butler siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 73

I welcome the report and the fact that the Minister distanced herself from the appalling article published in The Western Mail yesterday. This report is about options and choices, and that is why it is important.

Croesawaf yr adroddiad a’r ffaith i’r Gweinidog ymbellhau oddi wrth yr erthygl warthus a gyhoeddwyd yn The Western Mail ddoe. Mae’r adroddiad hwn yn ymwneud ag opsiynau a dewisiadau, a dyna pam ei fod yn bwysig.

I will concentrate on stock transfer, which should be a tool for local authorities if they choose to use it as part of their housing stock improvement strategy. The term ‘housing stock’ refers to people’s homes. Local authorities must have a choice about whether or not to transfer their stock. Stock transfer is not always financially beneficial. Councils that have chosen not to invest, or those that cannot afford it, have older properties and smaller debts. Progressive councils, such as Newport County Borough Council, which has invested in newer stock, will have larger debts. Therefore, stock transfer may not always be financially beneficial to councils or, importantly, their tenants.

Canolbwyntiaf ar drosglwyddo stoc, a ddylai fod yn arf i awdurdodau lleol os dewisant ei ddefnyddio fel rhan o’u strategaeth gwella stoc tai. Cyfeiria’r term ‘stoc tai’ at gartrefi pobl. Rhaid i awdurdodau lleol gael dewis ynglŷn â throsglwyddo eu stoc ai peidio. Nid yw trosglwyddo stoc bob amser o fudd ariannol. Mae gan y cynghorau hynny a ddewisodd beidio â buddsoddi, neu’r rheini na allant ei fforddio, eiddo hŷn a dyledion llai. Bydd gan gynghorau blaengar, megis Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Casnewydd, a fuddsoddodd mewn stoc mwy newydd, ddyledion mwy. Felly, mae’n bosibl na fydd trosglwyddo stoc bob amser o fudd ariannol i gynghorau neu, yn bwysicach, i’w tenantiaid.

Tenants in Newport have voted against stock transfer several times, as they prefer to have the council as their landlord. However, if stock transfer is to take place, the ensuing high staff costs must be considered. Newport council is in the middle of a stock transfer project involving hundreds of prefabricated houses, which were built as homes for heroes following the second world war. The huge cost of replacing these old and draughty, but much loved, prefabs meant that stock transfer was the only affordable option. It took nearly a year to persuade councillors, and a further year to persuade tenants, that stock transfer was the only way forward.

Pleidleisiodd tenantiaid yng Nghasnewydd yn erbyn trosglwyddo stoc sawl gwaith, gan fod yn well ganddynt gael y cyngor fel eu perchennog. Fodd bynnag, os trosglwyddir stoc, rhaid ystyried y costau staff uchel dilynol. Mae cyngor Casnewydd yng nghanol prosiect trosglwyddo stoc yn cynnwys cannoedd o dai parod, a adeiladwyd fel cartrefi ar gyfer arwyr yn dilyn yr ail ryfel byd. Golygodd y gost enfawr o adeiladu tai newydd yn lle’r hen dai parod, drafftiog ond hoffus hyn, mai trosglwyddo stoc oedd yr unig opsiwn fforddiadwy. Treuliwyd bron i flwyddyn yn darbwyllo cynghorwyr, a blwyddyn arall yn darbwyllo tenantiaid mai trosglwyddo stoc oedd yr unig ffordd ymlaen.

I pay tribute to Newport council for the sensitive way in which it handled a difficult, and often fraught, situation. Its tenants are fully involved in the trust board but have needed, and continue to need, support from the council. If an authority chooses the stock transfer option, it must be given additional up-front financial assistance to allow it to appoint additional support staff to help with the smooth running of the project. If this report is approved, councils will be given choices. If they work in partnership with the National Assembly, we will ensure better housing stock throughout Wales.

Talaf deyrnged i gyngor Casnewydd am y ffordd sensitif yr ymdriniodd â sefyllfa anodd, a oedd yn aml yn llawn pryderon. Mae ei denantiaid yn cymryd rhan weithredol ar fwrdd yr ymddiriedolaeth, ond yr oedd angen cymorth arnynt gan y cyngor, ac maent yn parhau i fod angen cymorth. Os bydd awdurdod yn dewis yr opsiwn trosglwyddo stoc, bydd angen rhoi cymorth ariannol ychwanegol ymlaen llaw iddo i’w ganiatáu i benodi staff cymorth ychwanegol i’w helpu i weithredu’r prosiect yn ddidrafferth. Os cymeradwyir yr adroddiad hwn, rhoddir dewisiadau i gynghorau. Os gweithiant mewn partneriaeth â’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol, fe sicrhawn stoc well o dai ledled Cymru.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 75

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 75

I will correct a point about the withdrawn amendment. We changed the wording of that amendment on the advice of the Table Office. It originally read ‘UK Government’ but the Table Office advised us to change that to the ‘Building Regulations Advisory Committee’. I wish to clarify that and ask you to look into that matter, Deputy Presiding Officer. We used the right wording originally, but were advised to change it.

Cywiraf bwynt ynglŷn â’r gwelliant a dynnwyd yn ôl. Newidiasom eiriad y gwelliant hwnnw ar ôl derbyn cyngor gan y Swyddfa Gyflwyno. Yn wreiddiol defnyddiwyd ‘Llywodraeth y DU’ ond fe’n cynghorwyd gan y Swyddfa Gyflwyno i newid hynny i ‘Bwyllgor Ymgynghorol Rheoliadau Adeiladu’. Hoffwn egluro hynny a gofyn ichi ymchwilio i’r mater hwnnw, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Defnyddiasom y geiriad cywir yn wreiddiol, ond fe’n cynghorwyd i’w newid.

It will come as no surprise to Members that we are calling again for a housing needs and conditions survey. Despite what the Minister said, the present policy of giving grants to each local authority to carry out its own survey does not give a national picture of conditions throughout Wales. The strategy states that many of our policies will involve taking stock of the current situation. However, without a clear picture of the situation, how on earth can we take stock?

Ni fydd yn syndod i’r Aelodau ein bod yn galw unwaith eto am arolwg o anghenion ac amodau. Er gwaethaf yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog, nid yw’r polisi presennol o roi grantiau i bob awdurdod lleol i gynnal ei arolwg ei hun yn rhoi darlun cenedlaethol o amodau ledled Cymru. Noda’r strategaeth y bydd nifer o’n polisïau yn ymwneud â chyfrif y stoc bresennol. Fodd bynnag, heb ddarlun clir o’r sefyllfa, sut ar y ddaear y gallwn gyfrif y stoc?

You must look again at a national housing needs survey. The current practice of asking local authorities to carry out those surveys is not working. Not all of them have carried out the surveys as yet. A survey would highlight present and potential need and indicate the number of housing units needed. It would also highlight the type of accommodation required and the support needed to maintain placements. All that has budgetary implications and, without the information that a national survey would provide, it is difficult to set budgets nationally.

Rhaid ichi edrych unwaith eto ar strategaeth anghenion tai genedlaethol. Nid yw’r arfer presennol o ofyn i awdurdodau lleol gynnal yr arolygon hynny yn gweithio. Nid yw pob un ohonynt wedi cynnal yr arolygon eto. Byddai arolwg yn tanlinellu’r angen presennol a phosibl ac yn nodi’r nifer o unedau tai sydd eu hangen. Byddai hefyd yn amlygu’r math o lety sydd ei angen a’r cymorth sydd ei angen i gynnal lleoliadau. Mae gan yr holl bethau hynny oblygiadau o ran y gyllideb ac, heb yr wybodaeth y byddai arolwg cenedlaethol yn ei darparu, mae’n anodd pennu cyllidebau yn genedlaethol.

Funding is available in the housing budget for 2002-03 for a national survey. However, from what the Minister and officials have said, it does not sound as though it will be anything other than what we have at present, namely a unitary authority by unitary authority survey. We need a national survey now.

Mae cyllid ar gael yn y gyllideb tai ar gyfer 2002-03 ar gyfer arolwg cenedlaethol. Fodd bynnag, ar sail yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog a’r swyddogion, nid yw’n swnio’n debygol y bydd yn fwy na’r hyn sydd gennym ar hyn o bryd, sef arolwg o bob awdurdod unedol. Mae angen arolwg cenedlaethol arnom yn awr.

This strategy needs to show more clearly how it links into other strategies that the Assembly is developing. As all Members have acknowledged, good housing is fundamental to healthy living, creating social inclusion and building better communities. The strategy, therefore, has implications for the Health and Social Services Committee, the Economic Development Committee and probably for the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee.

Mae angen i’r strategaeth hon ddangos yn gliriach sut y cysyllta â strategaethau eraill y mae’r Cynulliad yn eu datblygu. Fel y cydnabu’r holl Aelodau, mae tai da yn hanfodol ar gyfer bywyd iach, creu cynhwysedd cymdeithasol ac adeiladu cymunedau gwell. Mae gan y strategaeth, felly, oblygiadau ar gyfer y Pwyllgor Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol, y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd a, mwy na thebyg, y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig.

However, it is not clear from this document how the strategy will fit into other strategies under development and into the work of other Committees. Perhaps the strategy’s progress should be monitored by other Subject Committees as well as by the Local Government and Housing Committee. How does the Minister intend to monitor this strategy, because it is not clear from the document before us? If—as most people agree—the policy is one of the cornerstones on which the Assembly intends to build, would it be too much to ask for an annual progress report to come back to Plenary, with an assessment, when the budget is discussed, on the change in priorities and their implications for the budget? On a closely-related point, will the Minister draw up an action plan? The strategy proposed a myriad of action points. However, they are not drawn together in one coherent action plan with dates set against them. That would certainly help with monitoring.

Fodd bynnag, nid yw’n glir yn y ddogfen hon sut y bydd y strategaeth yn cydweddu â strategaethau eraill sydd yn cael eu datblygu a gwaith Pwyllgorau eraill. Efallai y dylid monitro cynnydd y strategaeth gan Bwyllgorau Pwnc eraill yn ogystal â chan y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai. Sut y bwriada’r Gweinidog fonitro’r strategaeth hon, oherwydd nid yw hynny’n glir o’r ddogfen sydd ger ein bron? Os—fel y cytuna’r rhan fwyaf o bobl—yw’r polisi yn un o’r conglfeini y bwriada’r Cynulliad adeiladu arno, a fyddai’n ormod i ofyn am adroddiad cynnydd blynyddol ar gyfer y Cyfarfod Llawn, gydag asesiad, pan drafodir y gyllideb, ar y newid mewn blaenoriaethau a’u goblygiadau ar gyfer y gyllideb? Ar bwynt tebyg, a wnaiff y Gweinidog lunio cynllun gweithredu? Cynigiodd y strategaeth bwyntiau gweithredu di-rif. Fodd bynnag, ni chânt eu tynnu ynghyd mewn un cynllun gweithredu cydlynol â dyddiadau penodol ar eu cyfer. Byddai hynny yn sicr o gymorth gyda monitro.

Much of the document discusses tenant participation and we welcome that. However, there is no clear strategy on how to build tenants’ capacity, especially in deprived communities. We must establish a training centre in Wales because, at the moment, the nearest training provision is in Chester. With the advent of stock transfer, we need to build confidence among tenants for them to be able to play an increasing role in running the new housing associations that will be created. However, we are not clearly providing that training for them.

Trafoda llawer o’r ddogfen gyfranogiad tenantiaid a chroesawn hynny. Fodd bynnag, nid oes unrhyw strategaeth glir ar sut i adeiladu ar allu tenantiaid, yn arbennig mewn cymunedau difreintiedig. Rhaid inni sefydlu canolfan hyfforddi yng Nghymru oherwydd, ar hyn o bryd, mae’r ddarpariaeth hyfforddi agosaf yng Nghaer. Gyda dyfodiad trosglwyddo stoc, mae angen inni feithrin hyder ymhlith tenantiaid er mwyn iddynt allu chwarae rôl gynyddol wrth redeg y cymdeithasau tai newydd a gaiff eu creu. Fodd bynnag, nid ydym yn darparu’r hyfforddiant hwnnw iddynt yn glir.

In conclusion, we need a national housing needs survey. We must show clearly how the strategy will link with other Assembly strategies. We must draw up an action plan and establish a monitoring system—hopefully through an annual report—and we must consider carefully how we can develop tenants’ ability to participate.

I gloi, mae angen arolwg anghenion tai cenedlaethol arnom. Rhaid inni ddangos yn glir sut y bydd y strategaeth yn cysylltu â holl strategaethau eraill y Cynulliad. Rhaid inni lunio cynllun gweithredu a sefydlu system fonitro—drwy gyfrwng adroddiad blynyddol gobeithio—a rhaid inni ystyried yn ofalus sut y gallwn ddatblygu gallu’r tenantiaid i gymryd rhan.

Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 77

Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 77

I welcome the Minister’s comments that all local authorities need to examine all credible options for the future of their housing stock. While I was a member of the Local Government and Housing Committee we considered that issue in great detail, and I pay tribute to the Committee for its work since then in compiling the policy review of housing stock transfers. However, I want to see further exploration of options where tenants are empowered to become more involved in managing their homes and communities. The Minister and Lorraine Barrett referred to the community mutual model. As a member of the Co-operative Party I declare an interest and welcome the reference to the community mutual model and ask that further, serious consideration be given to it.

Croesawaf sylwadau’r Gweinidog bod angen i bob awdurdod lleol archwilio’r holl opsiynau credadwy ar gyfer dyfodol eu stoc tai. Tra yr oeddwn yn aelod o’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai ystyriasom y mater hwnnw yn fanwl iawn, a thalaf deyrnged i’r Pwyllgor am ei waith ers hynny wrth lunio’r adolygiad polisi ar drosglwyddiadau stoc tai. Fodd bynnag, dymunaf weld ymchwiliad pellach o opsiynau lle y rhoddir pŵer i denantiaid gymryd mwy o ran wrth reoli eu cartrefi a’u cymunedau. Cyfeiriodd y Gweinidog a Lorraine Barrett at y model cydfuddiannol cymunedol. Fel aelod o’r Blaid Gydweithredol datganaf fuddiant a chroesawaf y cyfeiriad at y model cydfuddiannol cymunedol a gofynnaf iddo gael ystyriaeth ddifrifol, bellach.

Those who have read up on this know that the community mutual model provides a greater opportunity for tenant participation and leadership and focuses control within the community itself. The organisation is not only run for the benefit of the community but is also owned by the community. As a Member who represents deprived areas, I know how important it is to the residents of those areas. The tenants, therefore, make the decisions on matters that directly affect them, creating a sense of ownership and participation. The community mutual model would address the ownership deficit that occurs where there is no feeling of local empowerment, which is a likely result of inaccessible, unaccountable and distant ownership. I welcome the Minister’s reference in her statement to the fact that distant ownership, which is likely to lead to lack of responsibility and care, would not be an option.

Bydd y rheini sydd wedi ymchwilio i hyn yn gwybod bod y model cydfuddiannol cymunedol yn darparu cyfle gwell i denantiaid gyfranogi ac arwain, ac mae’n canolbwyntio rheolaeth o fewn y gymuned ei hun. Nid dim ond er budd y gymuned y caiff y sefydliad ei redeg ond mae hefyd yn eiddo i’r gymuned. Fel Aelod sydd yn cynrychioli ardaloedd difreintiedig, gwn pa mor bwysig yw hynny i breswylwyr yr ardaloedd hynny. Y tenantiaid, felly, sydd yn gwneud penderfyniadau ar faterion sydd yn effeithio arnynt yn uniongyrchol, gan greu ymdeimlad o berchenogaeth a chyfranogiad. Byddai’r model cydfuddiannol cymunedol yn mynd i’r afael â’r diffyg perchenogaeth sydd yn digwydd pan na cheir ymdeimlad o awdurdod lleol, sef canlyniad tebygol perchenogaeth anhygyrch, anatebol a phell. Croesawaf gyfeiriad y Gweinidog yn ei datganiad at y ffaith na fyddai perchenogaeth bell, sydd yn debygol o arwain at ddiffyg cyfrifoldeb a gofal, yn opsiwn.

The community mutual model means that tenants are members and owners and that the local community is truly involved. Nobody else owns the organisation—either in a profit-making or decision-making sense—to serve some other purpose other than to benefit the community. It also brings a sense of accountability, as the representatives on the community mutual board can be held accountable by the community it serves.

Golyga’r model cydfuddiannol cymunedol fod tenantiaid yn aelodau a pherchenogion a bod y gymuned leol yn cymryd rhan wirioneddol. Nid oes unrhyw un arall yn berchen ar y sefydliad—naill ai o ran gwneud elw na gwneud penderfyniadau—at ddiben arall ar wahân i fod o fudd i’r gymuned. Daw hefyd ag ymdeimlad o atebolrwydd, oherwydd gellid dwyn y cynrychiolwyr ar y bwrdd cydfuddiannol cymunedol i gyfrif gan y gymuned a wasanaetha.

Again, I welcome the Minister’s reference to this model and I hope that it will be pursued to fruition in the future.

Unwaith eto, croesawaf gyfeiriad y Gweinidog at y model hwn a gobeithiaf y caiff ei ddilyn i’r pen yn y dyfodol.

Peter Black The Deputy Minister for Local Government spoken in English p. 78

Peter Black Y Diprwy Weinidog dros Lywodraeth Leol siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 78

The process that we embarked upon in developing this national housing strategy has brought together a wealth of expertise and knowledge from across the housing spectrum in Wales and beyond. It has been an open and inclusive approach to policy development and has provided the foundation and model for taking forward more specific aspects of housing policy. The Homelessness Commission, which I chair, is one such example. We should again acknowledge the work of Peter Law in setting this process in motion.

Daeth y broses y dechreusom arni wrth ddatblygu’r strategaeth tai genedlaethol hon gyfoeth o arbenigedd a gwybodaeth ynghyd ar draws y sbectrwm tai yng Nghymru a thu hwnt. Bu’n ymagwedd agored a chynhwysol tuag at ddatblygu polisi tai a darparodd y sail a’r model ar gyfer datblygu agweddau mwy penodol ar y polisi tai. Mae’r Comisiwn Digartrefedd, a gadeiriaf, yn un enghraifft o’r fath. Dylem gydnabod unwaith eto waith Peter Law wrth roi’r broses hon ar waith.

We are also beginning to see the first results of the recently-established housing research programme, which will help us to obtain a strong evidence base to support and improve our policy-making. However, the publication of the national housing strategy is not the end of the process. We will continue to develop and refine the strategy to reflect changing needs and circumstances. We will work with our partners to monitor and review progress, and will report annually on progress to the Local Government and Housing Committee

Yr ydym hefyd yn dechrau gweld canlyniadau cyntaf y rhaglen ymchwil tai a sefydlwyd yn ddiweddar, a fydd o help inni gael sail o dystiolaeth gadarn i gefnogi a gwella ein proses o lunio polisïau. Fodd bynnag, nid yw cyhoeddi’r strategaeth tai genedlaethol yn ddiwedd ar y broses. Byddwn yn parhau i ddatblygu a mireinio’r strategaeth i adlewyrchu newid o ran anghenion ac amgylchiadau. Byddwn yn gweithio â’n partneriaid i fonitro ac adolygu cynnydd, ac adrodd yn ôl yn flynyddol ar gynnydd i’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai.

Several points have been raised in this debate and I will run through them briefly in the limited time available. Janet Davies rightly raised the issue of housing for frail, elderly people. We must acknowledge the importance of that issue, given the ageing profile of our society. We are promoting lifetime homes and our aspiration is that that should be carried forward into the private sector. Care and Repair has been mentioned. It is an important development and we hope to put it on a better-funded basis soon. We have also recently announced a rapid response disabled facilities programme, which will help people to stay in their own homes.

Codwyd nifer o bwyntiau yn y ddadl hon ac af drwyddynt yn gyflym yn yr amser cyfyngedig sydd ar gael. Yr oedd Janet Davies yn iawn i godi pwnc tai ar gyfer henoed eiddil. Rhaid inni gydnabod pwysigrwydd y pwnc hwnnw, o ystyried bod proffil ein cymdeithas yn heneiddio. Yr ydym yn hyrwyddo cartrefi am oes a’n dyhead yw y dylai hynny gael ei drosglwyddo i’r sector preifat. Crybwyllwyd Gofal a Thrwsio. Mae’n ddatblygiad pwysig a gobeithiwn ei ariannu’n well yn fuan. Cyhoeddasom yn ddiweddar hefyd raglen ymateb cyflym ar gyfer cyfleusterau anabledd, a fydd o gymorth i bobl aros yn eu cartrefi eu hunain.

Investment in bricks and mortar is important and goes to the heart of the whole strategy. I am pleased that we have reversed the year-on-year decline in spending in housing capital investment. We are considering other ways of bringing in money. For example, we are talking to the Treasury about overhanging debt, in terms of housing stock transfer.

Mae buddsoddi mewn briciau a morter yn bwysig ac aiff i galon y strategaeth gyfan. Yr wyf yn falch inni wyrdroi’r gostyngiad o flwyddyn i flwyddyn ar wariant mewn buddsoddiad cyfalaf ar dai. Yr ydym yn ystyried ffyrdd eraill o ddod ag arian i mewn. Er enghraifft, yr ydym yn siarad â’r Trysorlys am ddyled fargodol, o ran trosglwyddo stoc tai.

In response to William Graham and Peter Rogers, we must make it clear that local housing authorities are best placed to fulfil the strategic role. Although the private sector has a role to play, we cannot hand this to them. Partnerships with registered social landlords, the private sector, tenants and others are needed. We must have joint strategies to deliver this, because that is how it is in the real world. William Graham’s amendment 8, which we will support, acknowledges that. The solution must be in the hands of local councils, tenants and the owners of housing. Our role is to facilitate local solutions, not to dictate them.

Mewn ymateb i William Graham a Peter Rogers, rhaid inni egluro mai awdurdodau tai lleol sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i gyflawni’r rôl strategol. Er bod gan y sector preifat rôl i’w chwarae, ni allwn roi hyn yn eu dwylo. Mae angen partneriaethau â landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig, y sector preifat, tenantiaid ac eraill. Rhaid wrth strategaethau ar y cyd i gyflwyno hyn, oherwydd gwn mai dyna yw’r sefyllfa yn y byd go-iawn. Mae gwelliant 8 William Graham, y byddwn yn ei gefnogi, yn cydnabod hynny. Rhaid i’r ateb fod yn nwylo’r cynghorau lleol, tenantiaid a pherchnogion tai. Ein rôl yw hwyluso atebion lleol, yn hytrach na’u gorfodi.

Rosemary Butler, in discussing these matters, asked whether we can provide up-front funding for stock transfer. Bids for assistance can be made for strategic funding from supplementary credit approvals.

Gofynnodd Rosemary Butler, wrth drafod y materion hyn, a allwn ddarparu arian ymlaen llaw ar gyfer trosglwyddo stoc. Gellir gwneud ceisiadau am gymorth ar gyfer arian strategol o gymeradwyaethau credyd atodol.

Dafydd Wigley raised the issue of rural housing, which has had a high profile in recent months. The National Assembly is doing a great deal on this. The homebuy scheme is starting to bite, and the important changes that we introduced have led to the greater uptake of that scheme. We are consulting on restrictions on the right to buy and the right to acquire. We are consulting on relaxing the regulations for housing associations on converting disused buildings into homes in rural areas. The initial result of that consultation indicates that councils and registered social landlords are opposed to the relaxation of standards. However, we know that there is scope to meet the higher costs that they face and we will do everything possible to try to help. We are also undertaking research on the impact of second homes.

Cododd Dafydd Wigley fater tai gwledig, a fu’n uchel ei broffeil yn y misoedd diwethaf. Mae’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn gwneud llawer ynglŷn â hyn. Mae’r cynllun prynu cartrefi yn dechrau cydio, ac arweiniodd y newidiadau pwysig a gyflwynasom at fwy o bobl yn cymryd rhan yn y cynllun. Yr ydym yn ymgynghori ar gyfyngiadau ar yr hawl i brynu a’r hawl i gaffael. Yr ydym yn ymgynghori ar lacio’r rheoliadau ar gyfer cymdeithasau tai ar addasu adeiladau nas defnyddir yn gartrefi mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Awgryma canlyniad cychwynnol yr ymgynghoriad hwnnw fod cynghorau a landlordiaid cymdeithasol cofrestredig yn gwrthwynebu llacio’r safonau. Fodd bynnag, gwyddom fod modd talu am y costau uwch a wynebant a gwnawn bopeth o fewn ein gallu i geisio helpu. Yr ydym hefyd yn ymgymryd ag ymchwil ar effaith ail gartrefi.

The issue of funding the homebuy scheme is also important. It is funded from the social housing grant, and money is already available. We are promoting it more widely, but it is up to local councils to take this on board and to use the resources that they currently have available. That is not yet happening in every local council.

Mae ariannu’r cynllun prynu cartrefi hefyd yn bwysig. Fe’i hariennir gan y grant tai cymdeithasol, ac mae’r arian eisoes ar gael. Yr ydym yn ei hyrwyddo yn ehangach, ond cyfrifoldeb cynghorau lleol fydd ystyried hyn a defnyddio’r adnoddau sydd ganddynt ar hyn o bryd. Nid yw hynny’n digwydd eto ym mhob cyngor lleol.

The national housing needs survey has been raised several times in the Local Government and Housing Committee. We cannot be too prescriptive or dictate from the centre. Local councils have a duty towards, and are best placed to identify, the housing needs in their areas. A Welsh household interview survey will begin in 2002, linked to a stock condition survey and supplemented by the 2001 census. That survey will provide a detailed picture of many aspects of housing need.

Codwyd yr arolwg anghenion tai cenedlaethol sawl gwaith yn y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai. Ni allwn fod yn rhy gyfarwyddol na gorchymynol o’r canol. Mae gan gynghorau lleol ddyletswydd am anghenion tai eu hardaloedd, ac hwy sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i nodi’r anghenion hynny. Bydd arolwg i gyfweld â deiliaid tai yng Nghymru yn dechrau yn 2002, yn gysylltiedig â’r arolwg cyflwr stoc ac yn atodol i gyfrifiad 2001. Bydd yr arolwg hwnnw yn darparu darlun manwl o sawl agwedd ar anghenion tai.

Finally, the national housing strategy is an opportunity for all levels of government and all sectors to take up with renewed vigour the challenge of delivering our exciting but achievable vision for housing, in which everyone in Wales has the opportunity of living in a good quality, affordable home, in a thriving, safe and welcoming community. It is an opportunity for us to enable people to make choices about where they live and whether they rent or buy. Quality and choice should be the right of the many, not the preserve of the few.

I gloi, mae’r strategaeth tai genedlaethol yn gyfle i bob lefel o’r llywodraeth a phob sector i fynd i’r afael â’r her o wireddu ein gweledigaeth gyffrous ond cyflawnadwy ar gyfer tai gyda brwdfrydedd newydd, lle y bydd gan bawb yng Nghymru’r cyfle i fyw mewn cartref fforddiadwy o ansawdd da, mewn cymuned ffyniannus, ddiogel a chroesawgar. Mae’n gyfle inni alluogi pobl i allu dewis lle y byddant yn byw ac a ydynt yn dymuno rhentu neu brynu. Dylai ansawdd a dewis fod yn hawl y mwyafrif yn hytrach na braint y lleiafrif.

Gwelliant 1 Janet Davies t. 80

Amendment 1 Janet Davies p. 80

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 21 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 24

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (21)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • William Graham
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (24)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 2 William Graham t. 81

Amendment 2 William Graham p. 81

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Gwelliant 3 William Graham t. 82

Amendment 3 William Graham p. 82

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 9 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 36

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (9)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
Yn erbynAgainst (36)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Gwelliant 4 Janet Davies t. 83

Amendment 4 Janet Davies p. 83

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 21 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 25

Gwrthodwyd gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (21)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • William Graham
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (25)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 5 Janet Davies t. 83

Amendment 5 Janet Davies p. 83

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 21 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 24

Gwrthodwyd gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (21)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • William Graham
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (24)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 6 William Graham t. 84

Amendment 6 William Graham p. 84

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 9 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 37

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (9)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
Yn erbynAgainst (37)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Gwelliant 7 Janet Davies t. 84

Amendment 7 Janet Davies p. 84

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Gwelliant 8 William Graham t. 85

Amendment 8 William Graham p. 85

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 34 YmatalAbstain 12 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (34)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams
YmatalAbstain (12)
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams

Gwelliant 9 Janet Davies t. 86

Amendment 9 Janet Davies p. 86

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 21 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 25

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (21)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • William Graham
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (25)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 10 Janet Davies t. 87

Amendment 10 Janet Davies p. 87

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 12 YmatalAbstain 9 Yn erbynAgainst 25

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (12)
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
YmatalAbstain (9)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
Yn erbynAgainst (25)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 11 Janet Davies t. 88

Amendment 11 Janet Davies p. 88

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 37 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 9

Derbyniwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (37)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (9)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers

Tynnwyd gwelliant 12 yn ôl.

Amendment 12 withdrawn.

Cynnig NDM740 Edwina Hart t. 89

Motion NDM740 Edwina Hart p. 89

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Daeth y Llywydd yn ôl i’r Gadair am 11.48 a.m.

The Presiding Officer returned to the Chair at 11.48 a.m.

Pwynt o Drefn

Point of Order

Gwenda Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 90

Gwenda Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 90

Pwynt o drefn. Rhoddwyd fy enw gerbron yn gynnar y bore yma i siarad yn y ddadl ddiwethaf. Fe’m cynghorwyd i roi fy enw i Alun Gruffudd, Ysgrifennydd Preifat y Dirprwy Lywydd. Ni chefais fy ngalw i siarad, ond carwn ddweud imi gymryd y ddadl o ddifrif. A minnau’n Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai, nid wyf yn hapus na chefais gyfle i gyfrannu.

Point of order. My name was put forward early this morning to speak in the last debate. I was advised to give my name to Alun Gruffudd, Private Secretary to the Deputy Presiding Officer. I was not called to speak, but I want to point out that I took the debate seriously. As Chair of the Local Government and Housing Committee, I am not happy that I did not have an opportunity to contribute.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 90

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 90

Nid pwynt o drefn yw hynny, mewn gwirionedd, gan nad yw’n ymwneud â’r Rheolau Sefydlog. Y Llywydd neu’r Dirprwy Lywydd sy’n galw ar Aelodau i siarad, a’n bwriad bob amser yw ceisio sicrhau bod yr Aelodau sydd am gyfrannu yn gallu gwneud hynny. Fodd bynnag, dan bwysau amser, yr ydym naill ai’n cyfyngu ar hyd areithiau, neu’n ceisio dewis yn gytbwys rhwng pob grŵp gwleidyddol yn y Cynulliad, yn enwedig ar hyn o bryd, o gofio bod gennym Lywodraeth a dwy wrthblaid. Yr ydym hefyd bob amser yn ceisio cynnwys Cadeiryddion Pwyllgorau am fod ganddynt ddiddordeb arbennig yn y pwnc. Fodd bynnag, gwnaf ymholiadau a thrafodaf hyn ymhellach â’r Dirprwy Lywydd.

That is not really a point of order, because it does not pertain to Standing Orders. The Presiding Officer or the Deputy Presiding Officer call Members to speak and our aim is always to try to ensure that those Members who want to contribute can do so. However, due to time pressures, we either restrict the length of speeches, or we try to strike a balance between all the political groups in the Assembly, especially at the moment, given that we have a Government and two opposition parties. We also always strive to include Committee Chairs as they have a special interest in the subject. However, I will make inquiries and will discuss this further with the Deputy Presiding Officer.

Apeliaf ar Aelodau i fod yn fwy cryno wrth gyfrannu at ddadlau, i sicrhau bod digon o amser i alw ar Aelodau eraill. Hefyd, apeliaf ar Aelodau i gadw at y cyfyngiadau statudol yn y Rheoliadau Sefydlog ynglŷn â hyd areithiau. Ni allaf eich helpu yn fwy na hynny, Gwenda, ond pwysleisiaf ein bod bob amser yn ceisio sicrhau bod cynrychiolaeth deg yn ein dadleuon.

I appeal to Members to be more succinct when contributing to debates, to ensure that there is sufficient time to call other Members. I also appeal to Members to keep to the statutory limitations in Standing Orders concerning the length of speeches. I cannot help you more than that, Gwenda, but I emphasise that we always seek to ensure fair representation in our debates.

Diwygio’r Penderfyniad ar Gyflogau a Lwfansau Aelodau

Revision of the Determination on Members’ Salaries and Allowances

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 91

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

David Melding spoken in English p. 91

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

I support the measures before us. There are legitimate reasons why the allowances that Members claim will vary, and that must be recognised. As a Member from a constituency close to the Assembly I have less call on the public purse. However, I want to take this opportunity to call for our allowance claims to be published annually. That would be transparent and would recognise the public’s right to scrutinise this information. It would also copy the best practice of the Scottish Parliament and local authorities. I tabled a statement of opinion today, calling for the Presiding Office to publish these figures. I urge all Members to sign this statement of opinion if they are able to do so and are not members of the Cabinet. Meanwhile, I will provide a summary of my claims to any constituent who requests it.

Cefnogaf y mesurau ger ein bron. Mae rhesymau cyfreithlon pam y bydd y lwfansau y bydd yr Aelodau yn eu hawlio yn amrywio, a rhaid cydnabod hynny. Fel Aelod o etholaeth sydd yn agos i’r Cynulliad mae gennyf lai o alw ar bwrs y wlad. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf am fanteisio ar y cyfle hwn i fynnu i’n ceisiadau am lwfansau gael eu cyhoeddi’n flynyddol. Byddai hynny’n eglur ac yn cydnabod hawl y cyhoedd i archwilio’r wybodaeth hon. Byddai hefyd yn efelychu arfer gorau Senedd yr Alban ac awdurdodau lleol. Cyflwynais ddatganiad barn heddiw, yn galw ar Swyddfa’r Llywydd i gyhoeddi’r ffigurau hyn. Anogaf pob Aelod i lofnodi’r datganiad barn hwn os gallant wneud hynny ac nad ydynt yn aelodau o’r Cabinet. Yn y cyfamser, darparaf grynodeb o’m ceisiadau i unrhyw etholwr sydd yn gofyn amdano.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 92

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 92

I welcome your statement of opinion, David, and that you support the revised determination. It is a moderate statement of opinion. On your point about the disclosure of the actual amounts claimed, as you know, we can only claim against invoices. This is in contrast to procedures elsewhere at the other end of the railway line from here in London, where I, as a Member of Parliament for over 18 years, claimed additional costs allowance. I was not once asked for a receipted invoice. That House of Commons allowance was increased from some £13,000 to nearly £20,000 last week. Our allowance remains at about £10,000 and is not increased in this determination. Its scope will be slightly widened, because, quite frankly, we do not want Assembly Members travelling up and down the M4, or wherever, risking themselves in doing so more than necessary.

Croesawaf eich datganiad barn, David, a’r ffaith eich bod yn cefnogi’r penderfyniad diwygiedig. Mae’n ddatganiad barn cymhedrol. O ran eich pwynt ynglŷn â datgelu’r symiau gwirioneddol a hawlir, fel y gwyddoch, dim ond yn ôl anfonebau y gallwn hawlio. Mae hwn yn wahanol i weithdrefnau mewn mannau eraill ar ben arall y rheilffordd yn Llundain, lle yr hawliais i, fel Aelod Seneddol am dros 18 mlynedd, lwfans costau ychwanegol. Ni ofynnwyd imi erioed am anfoneb wedi ei derbynebu. Cynyddwyd y lwfans hwnnw gan Dŷ’r Cyffredin o tua £13,000 i bron £20,000 yr wythnos diwethaf. Tua £10,000 yw’n lwfans ni o hyd ac ni chaiff ei gynyddu yn y penderfyniad hwn. Caiff ei gwmpas ei ehangu ychydig, oherwydd, a dweud y gwir, nad ydym am i Aelodau’r Cynulliad deithio i fyny ac i lawr yr M4, neu ble bynnag, yn peryglu eu hunain wrth wneud mwy nag sydd angen.

The public should know that all our claims must be against receipted invoices. They are scrutinised by the National Audit Office, and are subject to maximum sums. However, David, you are perfectly right and at liberty to disclose your allowance, because it is your allowance. It is your personal intention to do that, and I have no objection whatsoever. Having said that, I recommend this revised determination. It is moderate, it is sensible, and I am sure that it is seen as such by the Assembly. I hope that it will also be reported by the responsible press as such.

Dylai’r cyhoedd wybod bod yn rhaid inni hawlio yn ôl anfonebau wedi eu derbynebu. Cânt eu craffu gan y Swyddfa Archwilio Genedlaethol a phennir cyfyngiad ar yr uchafsymiau. Fodd bynnag, David, yr ydych yn eithaf cywir ac yn rhydd i ddatgelu eich lwfans, am mai eich lwfans chi ydyw. Eich bwriad personol chi yw gwneud hynny, ac nid oes gennyf wrthwynebiad o gwbl. Ar ôl dweud hynny, argymhellaf y penderfyniad diwygiedig hwn. Mae’n gymhedrol, yn synhwyrol, ac yr wyf yn siŵr y caiff ei ystyried felly gan y Cynulliad. Gobeithiaf y cofnodir hyn hefyd gan y wasg gyfrifol.

Cynnig NDM742 John Marek t. 92

Motion NDM742 John Marek p. 92

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Cymeradwyo Newid Canlyniadol i Gynllun Pensiwn yr Aelodau

Approval of a Consequential Change to the Members’ Pension Scheme

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 93

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 93

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Diwygio Rheolau Sefydlog

Revision of Standing Orders

Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 95

Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 95

I propose that the National Assembly

Cynigiaf fod

y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol

Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business (continued) spoken in English p. 95

Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 95

Standing Order No. 23, section 3

Rheol Sefydlog Rhif 23, adran 3.

At the start of paragraph 23.9 insert,

Ar ddechrau paragraff 23.9 ychwanegu,

‘Subject to paragraphs 23.11A to 23.11E,’

‘Yn amodol ar baragraffau 23.11A i 23.11E,’

After paragraph 23.11 insert,

Ar ôl paragraff 23.11 ychwanegu,

23.11A. Subject to paragraph 23.11E, the Assembly Cabinet may determine that, in the particular circumstances, it is not reasonably practicable for a draft to be laid before the Assembly under paragraph 23.9 and in that case paragraphs 23.11B to 23.11D shall apply.

23.11A. Yn amodol ar baragraff 23.11E, caiff Cabinet y Cynulliad benderfynu, o dan yr amgylchiadau penodol, nad yw’n rhesymol ymarferol i ddrafft gael ei osod gerbron y Cynulliad o dan baragraff 23.9 ac yn yr achos hwnnw bydd paragraffau 23.11B i 23.11D yn gymwys.

23.11B. The draft shall be signed on behalf of the Assembly in accordance with paragraph 22.26(iii).

23.11B. Bydd y drafft yn cael ei lofnodi ar ran y Cynulliad yn unol â pharagraff 22.26(iii).

23.11C. The relevant Assembly Secretary shall as soon as reasonably practicable after the draft has been signed under paragraph 23.11B lay before the Assembly a memorandum notifying the Assembly that the subordinate legislation has been signed on behalf of the Assembly and explaining its intended effect and likely financial implications.

23.11C. Cyn gynted ag y bo’n rhesymol ymarferol ar ôl i’r drafft gael ei lofnodi o dan baragraff 23.11B bydd yr Ysgrifennydd Cynulliad perthnasol yn gosod memorandwm gerbron y Cynulliad yn hysbysu’r Cynulliad fod yr is-ddeddfwriaeth wedi’i llofnodi ar ran y Cynulliad ac yn esbonio ei heffaith arfaethedig a’r goblygiadau ariannol tebygol.

23.11D. Whenever a memorandum is laid before the Assembly under paragraph 23.11C, a Member may, within the period of 40 working days beginning with the date on which the memorandum is laid, table a motion instructing the relevant Assembly Secretary -

23.11D. Pryd bynnag y bydd memorandwm yn cael ei osod gerbron y Cynulliad o dan baragraff 23.11C, caiff Aelod, o fewn y cyfnod o 40 diwrnod gwaith gan ddechrau ar y dyddiad y gosodir y memorandwm gerbron y Cynulliad, gyflwyno cynnig yn cyfarwyddo’r Ysgrifennydd Cynulliad perthnasol -

(a) to consider the possibility of the subordinate legislation being revoked in relation to Wales; and

(a) i ystyried y posibilrwydd o ddiddymu’r is-ddeddfwriaeth mewn perthynas â Chymru; a

(b) to lay before the Assembly as soon as possible a report stating what action the Assembly Secretary has taken or proposes to take in that respect.

(b) i osod gerbron y Cynulliad cyn gynted â phosibl adroddiad yn datgan pa gamau y mae’r Ysgrifennydd Cynulliad wedi eu cymryd neu yn bwriadu eu cymryd yn y cyswllt hwnnw.

23.11E. Paragraphs 23.11A to 23.11E and, in paragraph 23.9, the words ‘subject to paragraphs 23.11A to 23.11E’, shall cease to have effect on 26 October 2001.

23.11E. Bydd effaith paragraffau 23.11A i 23.11E ac, ym mharagraff 23.9, effaith y geiriau ‘Yn amodol ar baragraffau 23.11A i 23.11E,’ yn peidio ar 26 Hydref 2001.

3. For paragraph 23.12 substitute:

3. Yn lle paragraff 23.12 rhoi:

23.12. Where subordinate legislation to which this section applies would, if the legislation were made by the Assembly alone, fall within section 1 or section 2 of this Standing Order, the provisions of that section or those sections shall also apply to it except that:

23.12. Pan fyddai is-ddeddfwriaeth y mae’r adran hon yn gymwys iddi, pe câi’r ddeddfwriaeth ei gwneud gan y Cynulliad yn unig, yn dod o fewn adran 1 neu adran 2 o’r rheol sefydlog hon, bydd darpariaethau’r adran honno neu’r adrannau hynny yn gymwys iddi hefyd ac eithrio:

(a) the reference in paragraphs 23.1 and 23.5 to the provisions of paragraphs 22.2 to 22.30 shall be replaced by references to paragraphs 23.9 to 23.11E; and

(a) y bydd y cyfeiriad ym mharagraffau 23.1 a 23.5 at ddarpariaethau paragraffau 22.2 i 22.30 yn cael eu disodli gan gyfeiriadau at baragraffau 23.9 i 23.11E; a

(b) in a case to which paragraphs 23.11A to 23.11E apply, paragraph 23.2 shall have effect as if for ‘after the Assembly has been notified’ there were substituted ‘after that Assembly Secretary has been notified’.

(b) mewn achos lle y mae paragraffau 23.11A i 23.11E yn gymwys, bydd paragraff 23.2 yn cael effaith fel pe bai ‘ar ôl i’r Ysgrifennydd Cynulliad gael ei hysbysu’ yn cael ei roi yno yn lle ‘ar ôl i’r Cynulliad gael ei hysbysu’.

Provided that, on and after 26 October 2001, for sub-paragraphs (a) and (b) of paragraph 23.12, substitute:

Ar yr amod, ar neu ar ôl 26 Hydref 2001, yn lle is-baragraffau (a) a (b) o baragraff 23.12, y rhoddir yn eu lle:

the references in paragraphs 23.1 and 23.5 to the provisions of paragraphs 22.2 to 22.30 shall be replaced by references to paragraphs 23.9 to 23.11. (NDM741)

y bydd y cyfeiriadau ym mharagraffau 23.1 a 23.5 at ddarpariaethau paragraffau 22.2 i 22.30 yn cael eu disodli gan gyfeiriadau at baragraffau 23.9 i 23.11. (NDM741)

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 97

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 97

Atgoffaf yr Aelodau fod angen mwyafrif o ddwy ran o dair i ddiwygio’r Rheolau Sefydlog.

I remind Members that a two-thirds majority is needed to revise Standing Orders.

Cynnig Andrew Davies t. 97

Motion Andrew Davies p. 97

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 45 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (45)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Cynnig Trefniadol

Procedural Motion

Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 98

Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 98

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

Is the Chair of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee happy with this arrangement?

A yw Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig yn fodlon ar y trefniant hwn?

Glyn Davies spoken in English p. 98

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

I am happy.

Yr wyf yn fodlon.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 98

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

Point of order. I am more than happy to support this procedural motion. However, I believe that it is the third procedural motion that has come before the Assembly in two weeks. I would ask that the Minister for Assembly Business accepts the responsibility that is placed on him to schedule debates properly so that Assembly Members get adequate time to prepare for such debates.

Pwynt o drefn. Yr wyf yn fwy na bodlon i gefnogi’r cynnig trefniadol hwn. Fodd bynnag, credaf mai dyma’r trydydd cynnig gweithdrefnol a ddaeth gerbron y Cynulliad mewn pythefnos. Gofynnaf i’r Trefnydd dderbyn y cyfrifoldeb a roddwyd arno i restru dadleuon yn gywir fel y caiff Aelodau’r Cynulliad ddigon o amser i baratoi ar gyfer dadleuon o’r fath.

Andrew Davies spoken in English p. 98

Andrew Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

I will take that as a criticism. This matter was raised in Business Committee and I discussed with Alun’s party’s business manager when this could be rescheduled and tabled. It was mentioned in my business statement on Tuesday. If you need more than two days to prepare for a debate, then you have problems.

Cymeraf hynny fel beirniadaeth. Codwyd y mater hwn yn y Pwyllgor Busnes a thrafodais â rheolwr busnes plaid Alun pryd y gellid ad-drefnu hyn a’i gyflwyno. Soniwyd amdano yn fy natganiad busnes ddydd Mawrth. Os bydd angen mwy na dau ddiwrnod i baratoi ar gyfer dadl, yna mae gennych broblemau.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 98

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

The allowing of a debate under procedural motions under Standing Order No. 6.16 includes a determination by the Presiding Officer that such a procedural motion is in order. I am called upon to rule on such procedural motions rather more often than I would like. However, had I not allowed a debate on agriculture and rural development, I would hardly have been able to return to my constituency for the weekend, let alone for the recess.

Mae caniatáu dadl o dan gynigion trefniadol o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.16 yn cynnwys penderfyniad gan y Llywydd bod cynnig trefniadol o’r fath mewn trefn. Gelwir arnaf i ddyfarnu ar gynigion trefniadol o’r fath braidd yn amlach nag y byddwn yn ei ddymuno. Fodd bynnag, pe na bawn wedi caniatáu dadl ar amaethyddiaeth a datblygu gwledig, o’r braidd y byddem wedi gallu dychwelyd i’m hetholaeth dros y penwythnos, heb sôn am yn ystod y toriad.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 99

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 99

I indicated that I would support the procedural motion, but I wished to fly a flag to express concern that this is becoming a frequent practice.

Nodais y byddwn yn cefnogi’r cynnig trefniadol, ond dymunais nodi fy mod yn mynegi pryder bod hyn yn mynd yn beth eithaf arferol.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 99

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 99

The flag was flown, and it was observed.

Nodwyd hynny.

Cynnig trefniadol Andrew Davies t. 99

Procedural motion Andrew Davies p. 99

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 46 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (46)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Huw Lewis
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Lynne Neagle
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Adroddiad y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ar Arallgyfeirio yn yr Economi Wledig

The Report of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee on the Diversification of the Rural Economy

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 100

Glyn Davies spoken in Welsh p. 100

Cynigiaf fod

I propose that

Glyn Davies (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 100

Glyn Davies (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 100

Yr wyf yn falch o gael y cyfle i gyflwyno adroddiad y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ar arallgyfeirio’r economi wledig. Mae economi wledig Cymru yn gosod her ac yn cynnig cyfleoedd. Mae ganddi nifer o rinweddau cryf: ansawdd yr amgylchedd, yr ymdeimlad o hunaniaeth gymunedol a diwylliannol, gweithlu hyblyg â’r gallu i gynhyrchu cynnyrch amaethyddol o ansawdd uchel. Fodd bynnag, mae ganddi wendidau hefyd megis dibyniaeth ar ddiwydiannau traddodiadol yn aml â gwerth ychwanegol isel, sector ffermio sydd yn dirywio ac yn ddibynnol ar gymorthdaliadau, sylfaen economaidd cul a hawdd ei niweidio a seilwaith trafnidiaeth a gwasanaethau gwael.

I am pleased to have the opportunity to present the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee’s report on diversifying the rural economy. Wales’s rural economy provides a challenge and opportunities. It has many strong virtues: the quality of the environment, the sense of community and cultural identity, a flexible workforce with the ability to produce agricultural produce of high quality. However, it also has its weaknesses such as a dependence on traditional industries that often have low added value, a deteriorating farming sector that is dependent on subsidies, a narrow economic foundation that is easily damaged and a poor services and transport infrastructure.

Yr her i Gymru wledig yw mynd i’r afael â’i gwendidau ac adeiladu ar ei chryfderau lu er mwyn manteisio ar y cyfleoedd a roddwyd i lawer o ardaloedd gwledig Ewrop yn sgîl ffurfiau newydd o dwf economaidd.

The challenge for rural Wales is to tackle its weaknesses and build on its many strengths in order to benefit from the opportunities afforded many of Europe’s rural areas following new forms of economic growth.

Fel cydnabyddiaeth o hynny, un o flaenoriaethau cyntaf y Pwyllgor oedd cynnal adolygiad trylwyr o’r polisïau a rhaglenni i gefnogi mwy o arallgyfeirio economaidd yng Nghymru wledig. Ymgymerwyd â hynny’n drylwyr dros 18 mis ac yr oedd yn cynnwys proses eang o gasglu tystiolaeth o bob rhan o Gymru. Mae’r adroddiad hwn yn cyflwyno canlyniadau ac argymhellion yr adolygiad ac yn amlinellu gweledigaeth eang ar gyfer economi wledig Cymru. Yn bwysicach, mae’n ymdrechu i fynd ymhellach na nodi’r problemau’n unig.

In recognition of that, one of the Committee’s first priorities was to hold a thorough review of the policies and programmes to support more economic diversification in rural Wales. That was undertaken thoroughly over 18 months and included a wide-ranging process of evidence gathering from all parts of Wales. This report presents the review’s results and recommendations and outlines a wide-ranging vision for the rural economy of Wales. More imporantly, it tries to go further than simply noting the problems.

O’r cychwyn cyntaf, bu’r Pwyllgor yn benderfynol o gynhyrchu cyfres o argymhellion ymarferol a chyraeddadwy ar gyfer y Cynulliad, ei asiantaethau a’i bartneriaid. Gobeithiwn y bydd y rhain yn cael eu rhoi ar waith o fewn fframwaith glir ar gyfer datblygu economaidd gwledig ac yn cael eu hasesu’n rheolaidd i nodi cynnydd a chyflawniad. Felly, argymhellwn fod y Cynulliad yn rhoi arweiniad strategol clir i gydlynu a rhoi canolbwynt i’r polisi datblygu gwledig. Mae’r Pwyllgor yn dymuno gweld hyn yn cael ei seilio ac argymhellion yr adroddiad hwn, gydag atodiadau dilynol lle bo angen, yn dilyn cyflawni gwaith ychwanegol ar faterion nas ymdriniwyd â hwy yn fanwl yn yr adolygiad hwn.

From the outset, the Committee was determined to produce a series of practical and achievable recommendations for the Assembly, its agencies and partners. We hope that those will be implemented within a clear framework for rural economic development and will be regularly assessed to note progress and achievement. Therefore, we recommend that the Assembly provides clear, strategic leadership in order to co-ordinate and give a focus to rural development policy. The Committee wants that to be based on the report’s recommendations, with subsequent annexes where necessary, following the undertaking of further work on matters not dealt with in detail in this review.

Ceir naw o argymhellion yn yr adolygiad, sef: nodi cyfrifoldebau asiantaethau gwledig yn glir; gwella’r ddarpariaeth gyllid a chyngor i fusnesau gwledig; gwella gwerthusiad a pherfformiad asiantaethau a pholisïau; gwella datblygu sgiliau a chysylltiadau addysg a busnes; meithrin mentrau lleol a lledaenu arferion da; gwella’r ddarpariaeth gweithleoedd a datblygiadau busnes; marchnata ac ychwanegu gwerth at gynnyrch gwledig; datblygu economaidd cymunedol a chynllunio defnydd tir yn rhagweithiol fel rhan o adfywio gwledig.

The report sets out nine recommendations, which are: to note clearly the responsibilities of rural agencies; to improve financial provision and advice to rural businesses; to improve the evaluation and performance of agencies and policies; to improve the development of skills and links with education and business; to nurture local enterprises and disseminate good practice; to improve workplace provision and business development; to market and add value to rural produce; community based economic development and planning land use proactively as part of rural regeneration.

Mae argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau, a ddaeth ar ôl sawl cwymp mewn incwm i ffermydd a chynnydd yn y peryglon i fusnesau nad ydynt yn amaethyddol yng Nghymru wledig, wedi gwneud gweithredu argymhellion a chynigion yr adroddiad hwn yn fater o frys. Mae’r argyfwng hwnnw, yn fwy na rhai eraill, wedi dangos bod ardaloedd sydd â busnesau gwledig yn rhan annatod o’r economi ehangach.

The foot and mouth disease crisis, which struck after a number of slumps in farm income and an increase in dangers for non-agricultural businesses in rural Wales, has made implementing the report’s recommendations and proposals a matter of urgency. That crisis, more than any other, has shown that districts with rural businesses are an integral part of the wider economy.

Er bod problemau unigryw gan Gymru wledig, mae’n rhaid iddi ei hystyried ei hun yn rhan o’r economi ehangach ac arddangos ei chyfraniad nodweddiadol a phwysig ei hun. Dyna’r rheswm dros gysylltu ein hargymhellion ar gyfer ardaloedd gwledig ag amcanion polisi ehangach y Cynulliad. Dyna pam ein bod yn gobeithio y bydd ein hargymhellion o werth i holl Weinidogion a Phwyllgorau’r Cynulliad.

Although rural Wales has unique problems, it must consider itself as part of the wider economy and exhibit its own characteristic and important contribution. That is the reason for linking our recommendations for rural areas with the Assembly’s wider policy aims. That is why we hope that our recommendations will be of value to all Assembly Ministers and Committees.

Mae’r adroddiad hwn yn ganlyniad i ymdrechion tîm o bobl. Hoffwn ddiolch yn benodol i gyn-Gadeiryddion y Pwyllgor, Ieuan Wyn Jones a Rhodri Glyn Thomas, am arwain yn ystod cyfnod cynnar yr adolygiad. Diolchaf hefyd i aelodau a chyn-aelodau’r Pwyllgor am eu gwaith ar yr adolygiad hwn. Aelodau’r Pwyllgor ar hyn o bryd yw Mick Bates, Jocelyn Davies, Delyth Evans, John Griffiths, Carwyn Jones, Elin Jones, Huw Lewis, Peter Rogers a Janet Ryder. Hoffwn ddiolch hefyd i’r Athro Terry Marsden, ymgynghorydd arbenigol y Pwyllgor, ac i’r Ysgrifenyddiaeth a phawb sydd wedi cyflwyno tystiolaeth neu wedi cyfrannu mewn unrhyw fodd at yr adolygiad.

This report is the result of the efforts of a team of people. I wish to thank the former Chairs of the Committee, Ieuan Wyn Jones and Rhodri Glyn Thomas, for their leadership during the early part of this review. I also thank present and former Committee members for their work on this review. The present Committee members are Mick Bates, Jocelyn Davies, Delyth Evans, John Griffiths, Carwyn Jones, Elin Jones, Huw Lewis, Peter Rogers, and Janet Ryder. I would also like to thank Professor Terry Marsden, the Committee’s special adviser, the Secreteriat and everyone who has presented evidence or contributed in any way to the review.

Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 102

Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 102

Diolchaf i Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig am gyflwyno’r adroddiad mewn modd mor raenus. Diolch hefyd i bawb sydd wedi cyfrannu at lywio’r adroddiad hwn yn ystod y 18 mis diwethaf. Nid yw’r broses o greu’r adroddiad wedi bod yn hawdd o ystyried y ffaith—fel y cyfeiriodd y Cadeirydd—fod aelodau newydd wedi ymuno â’r Pwyllgor, cyn-aelodau wedi gadael, Cadeiryddion newydd wedi’u penodi a’r agenda’n cael ei herwgipio gan faterion y dydd, yn enwedig yn ddiweddar. Fodd bynnag, o ddarllen yr adroddiad 18 mis yn ddiweddarach, â i’r afael â nifer o’r materion sydd yn llunio’r economi wledig a gallwn fod yn falch ohono. Wrth gwrs, dim ond cyfres o eiriau ar bapur neu ar ddisg yw’r adroddiad ynddo’i hun. Ceir gwerth ynddo, dim ond os cyfyd gweithgaredd ohono. Yn hyn o beth, mae ymateb y Gweinidog a’r Cabinet ehangach i’r argymhellion yn hollbwysig.

I thank the Chair of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee for such an accomplished presentation of the report. I also thank everyone who has contributed to the task of steering this report over the past 18 months. The process of creating the report has not been easy considering that—as the Chair mentioned—new members have joined the Committee, many former members have left, new Chairs have been appointed and the agenda has been hijacked by the issues of the day, especially recently. However, reading the report 18 months later, it tackles a number of issues that shape the rural economy and we can be proud of it. Of course, the report itself is no more than a series of words on a page or disk. It will only be of value if actions arise from it. In this respect, the response of the Minster and the wider Cabinet to its recommendations is crucial.

Pwysleisiaf yr angen i’r Cabinet cyfan ymateb i’r adroddiad hwn, gan fod rhan helaeth ohono’n torri ar draws cyfrifoldebau’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd. Mae rhannau ohono hefyd yn ymwneud ag addysg, hyfforddiant a chynllunio.

I emphasise the need for the whole Cabinet to respond to this report, because a large part of it cuts across the Minister for Economic Development’s responsibilities. Parts of it also relate to education, training and planning.

Wrth ystyried yr adroddiad a gwaith y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig a’r Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd, mae’n amlwg ein bod mewn perygl yn y Cynulliad hwn o wahanu materion y dylent fod yn rhedeg law yn llaw, ac hefyd, o anwybyddu rhai materion. Efallai bod y diffyg cyfeiriad at faterion ac anghenion gwledig yn y strategaeth datblygu economaidd genedlaethol yn arwydd arall o hynny. Mae’n bwysig, felly, fod y Cabinet cyfan yn ymateb i’r adroddiad hwn yn y dyfodol agos.

In considering the report and the work of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee and the Economic Development Committee, it is clear that we run a risk in this Assembly of separating issues that should be linked and also of ignoring some issues. Perhaps the lack of reference to rural issues and needs in the national economic development strategy is another sign of that. It is important, therefore, that the entire Cabinet responds to this report in the near future.

Cyfeiriaf yn benodol at dystiolaeth Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru i’r Pwyllgor. Mae’n amlwg bod gan yr WDA rôl mewn datblygu’r economi mewn ardaloedd gwledig a, chyda cholli Bwrdd Datblygu Cymru Gwledig, nid oedd cyfeiriad penodol ar gyfer datblygu gwledig yn ein cyrff cyhoeddus. Yn y Pwyllgor, dywedodd y prif weithredwr ar y pryd, nad oedd gan yr WDA raglenni penodol ar gyfer ardaloedd gwledig. Nid yw arian yn cael ei dargedu’n benodol ar gyfer yr ardaloedd hynny ac nid yw gwariant yn cael ei fonitro. Mae hynny’n ddiffygiol. Croesawaf argymhellion y Pwyllgor sydd yn nodi y dylai fod gan yr WDA ffocws gwledig mwy penodol. Dylid datblygu diffiniad cyson o Gymru wledig y gellid monitro allbynnau gwledig yn ei erbyn. Gobeithiaf y bydd y Cabinet yn cymeradwyo’r argymhellion hyn ac yn gweithredu arnynt.

I refer specifically to the Welsh Development Agency’s evidence to the Committee. The WDA clearly has a role in developing the economy in rural areas and, with the loss of the Development Board for Rural Wales, there was no specific direction for rural development in our public bodies. The chief executive at the time stated in Committee that the WDA did not have specific programmes for rural areas. Funding is not being specifically targeted for those areas and expenditure is not monitored. That is a weakness. I welcome the Committee’s recommendations, which note that the WDA should have a more specific rural focus. A consistent definition of rural Wales should be developed, against which rural outputs could be monitored. I hope that the Cabinet will approve these recommendations and act on them.

Datblygwyd yr adroddiad hwn cyn i argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau fwrw’r economi a chymunedau gwledig. Mae’n argyfwng dwfn, fel yr ydym i gyd yn ei gydnabod, ac mae ei effeithiau ond newydd ddechrau bwrw ein heconomi wledig. Ni fydd y Cabinet na’r Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig yn cyflwyno cynlluniau i’r Cynulliad ar ran y partneriaeth wledig. Ni chyflwynir unrhyw gynlluniau i adfywio’r economi wledig yn sgîl argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau, cyn toriad yr haf. Mae hynny’n annerbyniol. Gobeithiaf y bydd y Gweinidog yn ailystyried trafod pecyn adfywio’r Llywodraeth cyn toriad yr haf ac yn parchu rôl ddemocratig y Cynulliad yn hynny. Deallaf fod yn rhaid i hynny ddigwydd yr wythnos nesaf pe bai hynny i’w gael ei wireddu. Os na, mae posibilrwydd cryf y byddaf yn galw ar Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig i gynnal cyfarfod, yn dilyn cyhoeddiad y Gweinidog ar y pecyn adfywio ar gyfer yr economi wledig, gan ei fod mor bwysig i hyrwyddo adfywiad yn yr economi wledig ac yn y sectorau hynny sydd wedi dioddef mor enbyd yn ystod argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau.

This report was developed before the foot and mouth disease crisis struck the rural economy and communities. It is a deep crisis, as we all acknowledge, and its effects have only just begun to hit our rural economy. Neither the Cabinet nor the Minister for Rural Affairs will present schemes to the Assembly on behalf of the rural partnership. No schemes on regenerating the rural economy in the wake of the foot and mouth disease crisis will be presented before the summer recess. That is unacceptable. I hope that the Minister will reconsider discussing the Government’s regeneration package before the summer recess and respects the Assembly’s democratic role in that. I understand that that must happen next week, if that is to be realised. If not, there is a strong possibility that I will call on the Chair of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee to hold a meeting, following the Minister’s announcement on the regeneration package for the rural economy, as it is so important to promoting regeneration in the rural economy and in those sectors that have suffered so terribly during the foot and mouth disease crisis.

I gloi, derbyniasom dystiolaeth gan grwpiau LEADER wrth lunio’r adroddiad hwn. Cyhoeddodd y Gweinidog yr wythnos hon na fyddai rhai grwpiau LEADER yn derbyn arian o dan y trydydd cynllun LEADER, sef LEADER+. Mae un o’r grwpiau hynny yn fy etholaeth i ac yn etholaeth Rhodri Glyn Thomas, sef Antur Teifi. Ni fydd yn derbyn unrhyw arian o dan LEADER+. Mae’r grŵp wedi cynhyrchu gwaith clodwiw ac arloesol mewn cymunedau gwledig yn ystod y 10 i 15 mlynedd diwethaf, yn enwedig yn y sector bwyd a thechnoleg newydd; dau sector pwysig i hyrwyddo datblygu gwledig. Mae’n bwysig nad yw’r gwaith hwn yn dod i ben oherwydd na fydd y grŵp yn derbyn arian. Gobeithiaf, felly, y bydd y Gweinidog, yn sgîl cyhoeddiad yr wythnos hon, yn cynnig argymhellion ar sut y gall grwpiau cymunedol o’r math hwn barhau â’u gorchwyl pwysig o adfywio economi ar lefel gymunedol. Cymeradwyaf yr adroddiad.

To conclude, we received evidence from LEADER groups in drawing up this report. The Minister announced this week that some LEADER groups would not receive funding under the third LEADER scheme, namely LEADER+. One of those groups is in my constituency and Rhodri Glyn Thomas’s constituency, namely Antur Teifi. It will not receive any funding under LEADER+. The group has produced commendable and pioneering work in rural communities during the last 10 to 15 years, in the food and new technology sector in particular; two important sectors in promoting rural development. It is important that this work does not come to an end because the group will not receive funding. I hope, therefore, that following this week’s announcement, the Minister will bring forward recommendations on how such community groups can continue with their important remit of regenerating the economy at a community level. I commend the report.

Kirsty Williams spoken in English p. 104

Kirsty Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 104

I thank the Chair and other members of the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee for producing this report. Although I am not a member of the Committee, I represent a large rural constituency. I welcome the report’s recommendations.

Diolchaf i’r Cadeirydd ac aelodau eraill y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig am gynhyrchu’r adroddiad hwn. Er nad wyf yn aelod o’r Pwyllgor, cynrychiolaf etholaeth wledig fawr. Croesawaf argymhellion yr adroddiad.

Part of the challenge of representing a rural area is conveying to the Assembly the pressing needs of rural communities. Unfortunately, due to the foot and mouth disease crisis, it has been slightly easier since February to illustrate the crisis in rural areas. Before February, people looked at us living in a beautiful environment without the social problems faced in inner cities and thought that there were no problems in rural Wales. Although we do not suffer from high levels of unemployment, our wage levels are low. Our businesses are truly micro-businesses. We hear news headlines about the devastating effects of plant closures, such as that at Corus in Ebbw Vale, on communities. However, we do not hear about the potential closure of a factory in Rhayader that employs 18 people. Yet, for that community, it would be equally as devastating as the massive job losses that we have seen in communities in the south Wales valleys.

Rhan o’r her o gynrychioli ardal wledig yw cyfleu anghenion enbyd cymunedau gwledig i’r Cynulliad. Yn anffodus, oherwydd argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau, bu ychydig yn haws ers mis Chwefror i ddangos yr argyfwng mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Cyn Chwefror, yr oedd pobl yn edrych arnom yn byw mewn amgylchedd hardd heb y problemau cymdeithasol a wynebir ynghanol dinasoedd ac yn credu nad oedd unrhyw broblemau yng Nghymru wledig. Er na ddioddefwn lefelau uchel o ddiweithdra, mae ein lefelau cyflogau yn isel. Micro-fusnesau go iawn yw ein busnesau ni. Clywn am benawdau newyddion ynglŷn ag effeithiau dinistriol gweithfeydd yn cau, fel yn Corus yng Nglynebwy, ar gymunedau. Fodd bynnag, nid ydym am glywed am y posibilrwydd o gau ffatri yn Rhaeadr Gwy sydd yn cyflogi 18 o bobl. Ac eto, i’r gymuned honno, byddai yr un mor ddinistriol â’r nifer enfawr o swyddi a welsom yn cael eu colli mewn cymunedau yng nghymoedd de Cymru.

The report outlines positive ways in which we can make a difference to Wales’s rural economy. I will focus, first, on tier 3 funding. That is vital to enable organisations such as the WDA to place a new focus on rural Wales and distribute hard cash that will make a difference to Welsh rural businesses. That is particularly relevant to Powys. At present, we are squeezed by Objective 1 status on one side and the aid that is available to counties such as Shropshire and Herefordshire on the other side. Those areas have resources to attract business. Powys does not have that help at present. It is therefore vital that we receive tier 3 funding, which will enable bodies such as the WDA to make a difference to rural businesses.

Mae’r adroddiad yn amlinellu ffyrdd cadarnhaol lle y gallwn wneud gwahaniaeth i economi wledig Cymru. Canolbwyntiaf, yn gyntaf, ar arian haen 3. Mae hynny’n holl bwysig i alluogi sefydliadau fel y WDA i osod ffocws newydd ar Gymru wledig a dosbarthu arian sychion a fydd yn gwneud gwahaniaeth i fusnesau Cymru wledig. Mae hynny’n arbennig o berthnasol i Bowys. Ar hyn o bryd, cawn ein gwasgu gan statws Amcan 1 ar y naill llaw a’r cymorth sydd ar gael i siroedd fel Swydd Amwythig a Swydd Henffordd ar y llaw arall. Mae gan yr ardaloedd hynny adnoddau i ddenu busnesau. Nid oes gan Bowys hynny ar hyn o bryd. Felly mae’n holl bwysig ein bod yn cael arian haen 3 a fydd yn galluogi cyrff fel y WDA i wneud gwahaniaeth i fusnesau gwledig.

The report states that Business Connect does not have a positive image in rural communities. That is true. However, I pay tribute to the creative way in which Business Connect, the training and enterprise councils and, now, Education and Learning Wales, have tried to respond to the foot and mouth disease crisis. They have bent over backwards to try to use the resources available to them creatively—even bending the rules at times, perhaps—to keep people in jobs. They have also offered training opportunities so that people can diversify, as is called for in this report. The development of Farming Connect, with expertise in agriculture, will make a difference to those people who ring up to access the services. Inevitably, following the crisis, a greater number of farmers and farming businesses will enlist Farming Connect’s assistance in trying to find ways of making their businesses more profitable.

Noda’r adroddiad nad oes gan Cyswllt Busnes ddelwedd gadarnhaol mewn cymunedau gwledig. Mae hynny’n wir. Fodd bynnag, talaf deyrnged i’r ffordd greadigol y mae Cyswllt Busnes, y cynghorau hyfforddiant a menter ac, erbyn hyn, Addysg a Dysgu Cymru, wedi ceisio ymateb i argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau. Gwnaethant eu gorau glas i geisio defnyddio’r adnoddau sydd ar gael iddynt mewn ffordd greadigol—gan blygu’r rheolau hyd yn oed ar adegau, efallai—i gadw pobl mewn swyddi. Maent wedi cynnig cyfleoedd hyfforddi hefyd fel y gall pobl arallgyfeirio, fel y gelwir amdano yn yr adroddiad hwn. Bydd datblygu Cyswllt Ffermio, gydag arbenigedd mewn amaethyddiaeth, yn gwneud gwahaniaeth i’r bobl hynny sydd yn ffonio i gael gafael ar y gwasanaethau. Yn anochel, yn dilyn yr argyfwng, bydd nifer fwy o ffermwyr a busnesau ffermio yn gofyn am gymorth Cyswllt Ffermio wrth geisio dod o hyd i ffyrdd o wneud eu busnesau yn fwy proffidiol.

However, it is often difficult for individual agricultural businesses to diversify. It is easy to tell businesses to diversify; the question is, into what can they diversify? For instance, if you live in a national park, it could be difficult to obtain planning permission to convert your old barns into tourism facilities. It is also difficult to diversify when you are halfway up a mountain and you do not have flat fields on which to open a caravan site or a golf course. Agricultural businesses face practical difficulties in trying to diversify.

Fodd bynnag, mae’n anodd i fusnesau amaethyddol unigol arallgyfeirio yn aml. Mae’n hawdd dweud wrth fusnesau i arallgyfeirio; y cwestiwn yw, i beth y gallant arallgyfeirio? Er enghraifft, os ydych yn byw mewn parc cenedlaethol, gallai fod yn anodd cael caniatâd cynllunio i droi eich hen ysguboriau yn gyfleusterau i dwristiaid. Mae’n anodd arallgyfeirio hefyd pan fyddwch hanner ffordd i fyny mynydd ac nid oes gennych gaeau gwastad i agor safle carafanau neu gwrs golff arnynt. Wyneba busnesau amaethyddol anawsterau ymarferol wrth geisio arallgyfeirio.

The most devastating difficulty that businesses face when trying to diversify is the need for capital and investment. I do not know of one agricultural holding in my constituency that currently has the capital that it needs to plough into a project and diversify. We must find ways of assisting individual farm businesses to secure loans, through Finance Wales perhaps. We must provide capital support to farming businesses that want to diversify into other activities to keep their businesses alive.

Yr anhawster mwyaf difaol a wynebir gan fusnesau wrth geisio arallgyfeirio yw’r angen am gyfalaf a buddsoddiad. Ni wn am un ddeiliadaeth amaethyddol yn fy etholaeth sydd â’r cyfalaf sydd ei angen arni ar hyn o bryd i ailfuddsoddi mewn prosiect ac arallgyfeirio. Rhaid inni ddod o hyd i ffyrdd o gynorthwyo busnesau ffermio unigol i sicrhau benthyciadau, drwy Cyllid Cymru efallai. Rhaid inni ddarparu cymorth cyfalaf i fusnesau ffermio sydd am arallgyfeirio i weithgareddau eraill er mwyn cadw eu busnesau yn fyw.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 106

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 106

I declare an interest as a farmer. I concur with Kirsty’s final point. I was present at a meeting in mid Wales last night, and the message that was conveyed was that money is not available to support diversification. Rural businesses in mid Wales are facing a dire crisis.

Datganaf fuddiant fel ffermwr. Cytunaf â phwynt olaf Kirsty. Yr oeddwn yn bresennol mewn cyfarfod yng nghanolbarth Cymru neithiwr, a’r neges a gyflëwyd oedd nad oedd arian ar gael i gefnogi arallgyfeirio. Mae busnesau gwledig yng nghanolbarth Cymru yn wynebu argyfwng dybryd.

I welcome the report, in which there is much to commend. It outlines practical steps towards achieving strategic goals. The report notes a variety of important ways in which rural diversification can be encouraged, and describes the Welsh Development Agency’s role and the scope of the planning system.

Croesawaf yr adroddiad, ac mae llawer i’w gymeradwyo ynddo. Mae’n amlinellu camau ymarferol tuag at gyflawni nodau strategol. Noda’r adroddiad amrywiaeth o ffyrdd pwysig lle y gellir annog arallgyfeirio gwledig, a disgrifia rôl Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru a chwmpas y system gynllunio.

The report’s comments on education and training through Education and Learning Wales were significant. We have had much discussion about how we can encourage young entrants into farming, but that should not happen at any cost. We need skills first. Proper funding is needed to create a rich skills base among young farmers, which will reap rewards in years to come. That is why we must make formal agricultural training the norm. That is extremely important. We frequently hear about the need to promote a knowledge economy, which we usually associate with service-related industries. However, we should think about the knowledge economy in a slightly different way—in terms of the quality and depth of the knowledge base in rural economy sectors. By investing now, we will create a high quality knowledge base, which will be the basis of our future competitive advantage.

Yr oedd sylwadau’r adroddiad ar addysg a hyfforddiant drwy Addysg a Dysgu Cymru yn arwyddocaol. Buom yn trafod llawer ynglŷn â sut y gallwn annog pobl ifanc i ffermio, ond ni ddylai hynny ddigwydd ar unrhyw gyfrif. Mae angen sgiliau yn gyntaf arnom. Mae angen arian priodol i greu sylfaen sgiliau cyfoethog ymhlith ffermwyr ifanc, a fydd yn talu ar ei ganfed mewn blynyddoedd i ddod. Dyna pam y mae’n rhaid inni wneud hyfforddiant amaethyddol ffurfiol yn gyffredin. Mae hynny’n eithriadol o bwysig. Clywn yn aml am yr angen i hyrwyddo economi gwybodaeth, a gysylltwn fel arfer â diwydiannau sydd yn gysylltiedig â gwasanaethau. Fodd bynnag, dylem feddwl am yr economi gwybodaeth mewn ffordd ychydig yn wahanol—o ran ansawdd a dwysedd y sylfaen gwybodaeth yn y sectorau economi wledig. Drwy fuddsoddi yn awr, byddwn yn creu sylfaen gwybodaeth o ansawdd uchel, a fydd yn sail i’n mantais gystadleuol yn y dyfodol.

It is also important that we put in place structures that will encourage farmers to think about the range of options most appropriate to their own needs. I question whether we should always think of diversification as a change of business activity into uncharted territory. Perhaps we should be equally concerned about diversification in terms of deepening existing areas of competence. For example, we cannot afford to send out the message that organic farming is the only way forward.

Mae hefyd yn bwysig ein bod yn rhoi strwythurau ar waith a fydd yn annog ffermwyr i feddwl am yr amrywiaeth o opsiynau sydd fwyaf priodol i’w hanghenion eu hunain. Ni thybiaf y dylem ystyried arallgyfeirio bob tro fel newid gweithgaredd busnes i faes newydd nas profwyd. Efallai y dylem fod yr un mor bryderus ynglŷn ag arallgyfeirio o ran dyfnhau meysydd cymhwyster presennol. Er enghraifft, ni allwn fforddio cyfleu’r neges mai ffermio organig yw’r unig ffordd ymlaen.

The report is right to point out that we need to conduct more research into the nature and extent of farm diversification in Wales. That is why I wholeheartedly support the report’s call for local planning authorities to undertake local audits of their farm diversification policies and the local farm economy. If we do that, we will be better equipped to identify the needs of localities. In the long run, we will be able to drawn upon and learn from the best examples of change.

Mae’r adroddiad yn iawn i nodi bod angen inni ymchwilio mwy i natur a graddau arallgyfeirio ar ffermydd yng Nghymru. Dyna pam y cefnogaf alwad yr adroddiad ar i awdurdodau cynllunio lleol gynnal archwiliadau lleol o’u polisïau arallgyfeirio ar ffermydd a’r economi ffermio leol. Os gwnawn hynny, byddwn mewn sefyllfa well i nodi anghenion ardaloedd. Yn yr hirdymor, gallwn ddefnyddio a dysgu oddi wrth yr enghreifftiau gorau o newid.

In terms of operating the scheme, clustering could be important. That involves proximity and means that people can work together and feed off each other’s experiences. It would also mean lower overall project costs.

O ran gweithredu’r cynllun, gallai clystyru fod yn bwysig. Mae hynny’n golygu agosrwydd ac yn golygu y gall pobl gydweithio a manteisio ar brofiadau eraill. Byddai hefyd yn golygu costau prosiect is yn gyffredinol.

Finally, I emphasise the need for the Assembly to look at how Assembly sponsored public bodies’ procurement policies can work in favour of Welsh products, within the Best Value framework. For example, we could promote timber much more than we do at present. A massive amount of construction work is going on in Cardiff Bay, including the construction of the new Assembly building. How much Welsh timber is being used in those jobs? Welsh timber cannot compete on cost alone, but Best Value should mean more than just cost. For example, Welsh timber is subject to better treatment processes than imported timber, which means that it could well last longer.

Yn olaf, pwysleisiaf fod angen i’r Cynulliad edrych ar sut y gall polisïau caffael cyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad weithio o blaid cynnyrch Cymreig, o fewn y fframwaith Gwerth Gorau. Er enghraifft, gallem hyrwyddo coed llawer mwy nag a wnawn ar hyn o bryd. Mae llawer iawn o waith adeiladu yn mynd rhagddo ym Mae Caerdydd, gan gynnwys adeiladu adeilad newydd y Cynulliad. Faint o goed Cymru a gaiff eu defnyddio yn y gwaith hwnnw? Ni all coed Cymru gystadlu ar bris yn unig, ond dylai Gwerth Gorau olygu mwy na chost yn unig. Er enghraifft, mae prosesau trin coed Cymru yn well na’r rhai a ddefnyddir ar gyfer coed a fewnforir, a olyga y gallai barhau am fwy o amser.

I welcome the report and urge the Government to act upon it. I assure the Minister that the Welsh Conservatives will monitor this work closely.

Croesawaf yr adroddiad ac anogaf y Llywodraeth i weithredu arno. Sicrhaf y Gweinidog y bydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru yn monitro’r gwaith hwn yn ofalus.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 108

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 108

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am y cyfle i gymryd rhan yn y ddadl hon a chroesawaf yr adroddiad.

I am grateful for the opportunity to participate in this debate and I welcome the report.

Llongyfarchaf Glyn ar ei gyflwyniad drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg. Mae’n nodedig bod Jane Davidson a Glyn wedi siarad drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg heddiw. Dengys hynny sut y mae’r Cynulliad yn cyfrannu at ddyfodol yr iaith.

I congratulate Glyn on his presentation through the medium of Welsh. It is noteable that Jane Davidson and Glyn have spoken through the medium of Welsh today. That shows how the Assembly is contributing to the future of the language.

Mae’r materion ger ein bron yn hynod bwysig ac mae argyfwng yng nghefn gwlad. Fodd bynnag, peidied neb â meddwl bod yr argyfwng yn dinistrio popeth. Nos Wener diwethaf, croesewais Carwyn i gyfarfod blynyddol Hufenfa De Arfon, lle yr oeddwn yn llywyddu. Llwyddodd yr hufenfa honno, a sefydlwyd gan amaethwyr, i wneud elw o £1.4 miliwn, tra’n talu ffermwyr y pris uchaf ond un ym Mhrydain am laeth.

The matters before us are extremely important and there is a crisis in rural areas. However, let us not believe that the crisis is destroying everything. Last Friday evening, I welcomed Carwyn to South Caernarfon Creameries’ annual meeting, which I chaired. That creamery, which was established by farmers, succeeded in making a profit of £1.4 million, while paying farmers the second highest price in Britain for milk.

Dengys hynny ei bod yn bosibl cael gwerth ychwanegol am ein cynnyrch yng Nghymru. Mae angen system a fydd yn sicrhau y digwydd hynny ym mhob rhan o Gymru wledig. Cefnogaf alwad Peter i gyrff cyhoeddus ac awdurdodau lleol brynu llawer mwy o nwyddau gan gynhyrchwyr yng Nghymru.

That shows that it is possible to get added value for our produce in Wales. A system is needed to ensure that that happens in all parts of rural Wales. I support Peter’s call for public bodies and local authorities to purchase far more goods from producers in Wales.

Fodd bynnag, tarodd argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau yn eithriadol o galed ar wasanaethau i’r sector amaethyddol a’r diwydiant arall y mae ffermwyr yn aml yn arallgyfeirio iddo, sef twristiaeth. Mae angen adnoddau ychwanegol ar frys. Nid yw’n ddigon i ailgylchu gweddill y £12 miliwn a ddosbarthwyd, sef yr hyn y soniodd Edwina amdano. Mae angen arian, ac mae angen datganiad ar y mater cyn toriad yr haf. Gobeithiaf y cawn ddatganiad o’r fath.

However, the foot and mouth disease crisis has hit services for the agricultural sector particularly hard, as well as the other industry to which farmers often diversify, namely tourism. Additional resources are needed urgently. It is not enough to recycle the remainder of the £12 million already distributed, which Edwina referred to. Money is needed, and we need a statement on this matter before the summer recess. I hope that we will hear such a statement.

O safbwynt trefniadol, yr wyf yn poeni am ddatblygu busnesau a’r economi wledig. Y mae Glyn yn ymwybodol o gyn-Fwrdd Datblygu Cymru Wledig. Llyncwyd ei gyfrifoldebau gan Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf yn bell o fod yn argyhoeddedig bod yr awdurdod datblygu yn rhoi’r sylw angenrheidiol i’r dimensiwn gwledig. Mae perygl mawr i’r mater fod yn ymylol. Rhaid datblygu strategaethau ar gyfer cefn gwlad os ydym am ail-godi’r economi yn llwyddiannus.

From an organisational standpoint, I am concerned about the development of rural businesses and the rural economy. Glyn is aware of the former Development Board for Rural Wales. Its responsibilities were subsumed by the Welsh Development Agency. However, I am far from convinced that the development agency pays the necessary attention to the rural dimension. There is a great danger that the matter is peripheral. We must develop strategies for rural areas if we are to rebuild the economy successfully.

A gyflwynir strategaeth ddatblygu wledig ochr-yn-ochr â strategaeth datblygu economaidd genedlaethol y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd? Ychydig iawn sydd yn y strategaeth datblygu economaidd genedlaethol o safbwynt y dimensiwn gwledig. Efallai y dylem sicrhau nad yw’r mater hwn yn disgyn rhwng dwy stôl.

Will a strategy for rural development be presented in parallel with the Economic Development Committee’s national economic development strategy? There is not much on the rural dimension in the national economic development strategy. We should perhaps ensure that this matter does not fall between two stools.

Fel y gwyddom, mae angen rhoi cyfle i bobl arallgyfeirio, ac nid yn unig o safbwynt amaethyddol yng nghefn gwlad. Yn aml, mae gan bobl sydd yn gweithio i gyflogwyr—weithiau yn y sector cyhoeddus—y gallu i sefydlu eu busnesau eu hunain. Mae angen rhoi mwy o anogaeth iddynt wneud hynny, drwy gynllun tebyg i’r lwfans menter blaenorol, neu gynllun i ryddhau pobl yn rhan-amser o’u swyddi hyd yn oed, os ydynt am sefydlu mentrau newydd. Rhaid inni fod yn greadigol a gweld beth sydd yn bosibl.

As we know, we must give people an opportunity to diversify, and not only in terms of agriculture in rural areas. Often, people who work for employers—sometimes in the public sector—have the ability to start up their own businesses. More encouragement is needed for them to do that, through a scheme similar to the previous enterprise allowance, or even a scheme to release people on a part-time basis from their employment, if they wish to establish new initiatives. We must be creative and see what is possible.

Os ceir gwasanaeth cynghori amaethyddol ochr-yn-ochr â’r ddarpariaeth cynghori busnes sydd yn gyfrifoldeb i’r awdurdod datblygu, rhaid sicrhau cydweithio heb ddyblygu gwaith. Mae’n rhaid i’r system fod yn agored ac yn un y gall pawb ei deall.

If there is to be an agricultural advisory service side-by-side with the business support provision that is the responsibility of the development agency, we must ensure collaboration without duplication of work. The system must be open and understood by all.

Yn olaf, cyfeiriaf at yr angen i sicrhau bod y gwasanaethau lleol a gynhelir gan awdurdodau lleol yn derbyn yr arian a’r adnoddau angenrheidiol. Mae hynny’n aml yn tanseilio cefn gwlad. Er mwyn datblygu o’r newydd, mae’n rhaid cael adnoddau.

Finally, I refer to the need to ensure that the local services supported by local authorities receive the necessary funding and resources. That often undermines rural areas. If we are to have new development, we must have resources.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 110

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 110

Yn gyntaf, ymunaf â Dafydd Wigley i gydnabod cyflwyniad meistrolgar Glyn yn y Gymraeg, a hefyd gyfraniad Jane Davidson yn gynharach. Y mae’n dda gweld bod yr Aelodau hyn, ac eraill, wedi mynd i’r ymdrech—

First, I join Dafydd Wigley in acknowledging Glyn’s masterful presentation in Welsh, as well as Jane Davidson’s earlier contribution. It is good to see that these Members, and others, have made the effort—

David Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 110

David Davies spoken in Welsh p. 110

Fel y gwyddoch, mae mwyafrif Aelodau’r Blaid Geidwadol yn siarad ychydig o’r iaith yn awr. Credaf mai ni yw’r Plaid Cymru newydd.

As you know, the majority of the Conservative Party Members now speak a little of the language. I believe that we are the new Party of Wales.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 110

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 110

Dywedaf yn syml nad mater i geisio sgorio pwyntiau gwleidyddol arno yw’r iaith Gymraeg. Gwerthfawrogaf yr ymdrech a wnaethoch chi a nifer o bobl eraill i ddysgu’r iaith.

I simply say that the Welsh language is not an issue on which to try to score political points. I appreciate the effort that you and several others have made to learn the language.

Caniata’r Llywydd amser byr imi gyfrannu i’r drafodaeth hon. Gwerthfawrogaf yr adroddiad hwn. Cefais gyfle, fel aelod o’r Pwyllgor, ac yna fel ei Gadeirydd, i fod yn rhan o’r ymgynghoriad pwysig hwn.

The Presiding Officer has allowed me a brief contribution to this debate. I appreciate this report. I had the opportunity, first as a member of the Committee, and then as its Chair, to be a part of this important consultation.

Y pwynt creiddiol a nodwyd yw’r wasgfa eithriadol ar yr economi wledig. Mae’r diwydiant amaethyddol yn enwedig wedi bod o dan wasgfa ariannol. Nid oes arian yn y diwydiant ar hyn o bryd. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi ymrwymiad inni heddiw, bod y weinyddiaeth hon, nid yn unig yn cynnig cyfleoedd i amaethyddiaeth arallgyfeirio—mewn gwirionedd, gofynnwn i’r diwydiant cyfan arallgyfeirio—ond hefyd yn cefnogi’r diwydiant? Mae’n hollbwysig i’r economi wledig y gwneir yr ymrwymiad nid yn unig â geiriau, ond â buddsoddiad economaidd.

The central point noted is that the rural economy has been under extreme pressure. The agricultural industry especially, has been under financial pressure. There is no money in the industry at present. Can the Minister give us a commitment today, that this administration not only provides opportunities for agriculture to diversify—in truth, we are asking the whole industry to diversify—but also supports the industry? It is essential for the rural economy that the commitment is made not only with words, but with economic investment.

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 111

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Rural Affairs spoken in Welsh p. 111

Diolchaf innau i Glyn a chyn-Gadeiryddion y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig a wnaeth gymaint o waith ar y cynllun hwn. Mae’r cynllun arallgyfeirio yn hollbwysig, nid yn unig i’r Cynulliad ond hefyd i’r diwydiant ei hun. Rhaid inni gofio na chawn droi’r cloc yn ôl i’r hen ddyddiau. Rhaid inni edrych i’r dyfodol. Mae llawer o gyfleoedd ar gael i ffermwyr Cymru. Mae llawer wedi eu nodi yn yr adroddiad, er enghraifft, cynlluniau organig a physgodfeydd. Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn ei wneud yn haws i ffermwyr arallgyfeirio. Un enghraifft yw edrych ar ffyrdd newydd o dalu taliadau premiwm coedwigoedd yn y dyfodol i helpu ffermwyr ar y mynyddoedd sydd am arallgyfeirio. Mae hynny’n hollbwysig.

I also thank Glyn and the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee’s former Chairs who put so much work into this scheme. The diversification scheme is crucial, not only for the Assembly but also for the industry itself. We must remember that we cannot turn the clock back to the good old days. We must look to the future. There are many opportunities available to the farmers of Wales. Many of them have been stated in the report, for example, organic schemes and fisheries. It is important that we make it easier for farmers to diversify. One example is to consider new ways of paying the forestry premium in the future to help hill farmers who wish to diversify. That is essential.

Rhaid, wrth gwrs, inni gefnogi ffermwyr a chefn gwlad. Yr hyn na allwn ei wneud yw dosbarthu arian i bobl; mae hynny’n hollol anghyfreithlon dan gyfraith yr Undeb Ewropeaidd. Rhaid bod yn gyfrwysach na hynny gan ystyried dulliau eraill ddenu buddsoddiad yng nghefn gwlad. Mae sawl mesur ar y gweill: codwyd Cyswllt Ffermio sawl gwaith yn y ddadl heddiw a bydd hynny yn dechrau ym Medi. Mae’r cynllun yn hollbwysig i ffermwyr ac i ffermio oherwydd y gefnogaeth, yr hwb a’r cyngor y bydd yn ei roi. Hefyd, mewn pythefnos, caiff cynllun adfywio gwledig ei gyhoeddi. Mae’r gwaith yn mynd rhagddo ar hyn o bryd. Gŵyr yr Aelodau i is-grŵp y bartneriaeth wledig weithio ar hwnnw ac mae’n fater o gwrteisi mai’r barneriaeth a ddylai gael y cyfle i edrych ar y cynllun hwn er mwyn cynnig sylwadau ar yr hyn a ddylai fod yn y cynllun yn y pen draw. Bydd cyhoeddiad gan y weinyddiaeth ar hynny.

We must, of course, support farmers and the countryside. What we cannot do is distribute money away to people; that is totally illegal under European Union law. We must be cleverer than that and consider other means of attracting investment to rural areas. Several measures are imminent: Farming Connect was raised several times in the debate today and that will begin in September. That scheme is essential for farmers and for farming because of the support, the boost and the advice that it will give. Also, in a fortnight, a rural regeneration scheme will be announced. The work on that is currently being undertaken. Members know that the rural partnership sub-group has worked on that and it is a matter of courtesy that the partnership should have the opportunity to view that scheme in order to comment on what should eventually be included in the scheme. The administration will make an announcement on that.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 111

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 111

Derbyniaf yr hyn a ddywedwch a chydnabod mai’r bartneriaeth wledig a ddylai gyflwyno’r argymhellion hynny. Fodd bynnag, a dderbyniwch ein bod yn gofyn i’r diwydiant amaethyddiaeth fynd drwy gyfnod o drosglwyddo enfawr ar hyn o bryd? Soniasoch ar nifer o achlysuron am y cyfleoedd sydd i ffermwyr, ond ceir cyfnod o drosglwyddo. A ydych, fel Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig, yn ymrwymo’r Weithrediaeth hon i gefnogi amaethyddiaeth drwy’r cyfnod o drosglwyddo i sicrhau’r cyfleoedd hynny a nodwyd gan lawer ar gyfer ei dyfodol?

I accept what you say and acknowledge that the rural partnership should present those recommendations. However, do you accept that we are asking agriculture industry to endure a period of enormous transformation at present? You have mentioned on a number of occasions the opportunities for farmers, but there will be a transition period. Do you, as Minister for Rural Affairs, commit the Executive to supporting agriculture through this transition period to ensure those opportunities that many people have noted for its future?

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 112

Carwyn Jones spoken in Welsh p. 112

Derbyniaf hynny. Dyna pam y caiff y cynllun adfywio ei gyhoeddi, nid mewn perthynas â ffermio yn unig ond pob rhan o’r economi wledig. Mae hynny’n bwysig. Rhaid edrych ar y problemau tymor byr sydd gennym. Er enghraifft, beth fydd yn digwydd i’r ŵyn yn yr hydref? Yr ydym yn gweithio ar hynny ar hyn o bryd a gobeithiaf y bydd mwy o fanylion gennyf ar hynny yr wythnos nesaf, ar ôl cyfarfod â’n cymdogion ym Mhrydain Fawr. Gwyddom beth fydd yn digwydd pe na roddid rhyw fath o system ymyrraeth ar waith, a beth fydd yn digwydd i brisiau ŵyn y mynyddoedd o ganlyniad. Dyna pam ei bod mor bwysig bod gennym gynllun effeithiol a bod pobl yn gwybod beth sydd yn digwydd.

I accept that. That is why the regeneration scheme will be announced, not only in relation to farming but every part of the rural economy. That is important. We must consider our short-term problems. For example, what will happen to the lambs in the autumn? That is currently being worked on and I hope that I will have more details on that next week, following a meeting with our neighbours in Great Britain. We know what will happen if some sort of intervention system is not put in place, and what will happen to mountain lamb prices as a consequence. That is why it is so important that we have an effective scheme and that people know what is happening.

Wrth ystyried hynny, ac wrth gofio bod yn rhaid inni helpu’r ffermwyr a’r economi wledig yn y tymor byr, mae’n rhaid inni ystyried—fel mae’r adroddiad yn ei gwneud—y marchnadoedd newydd. Ni allwn geisio cystadlu â Seland Newydd yn y dyfodol. Gwlad Pŵyl yw cystadleuaeth y dyfodol a gwledydd sydd â llawer o dir a chostau llawer is na Chymru. Felly y bu pethau erioed, oherwydd pris tir, y tymor tyfu ac yn y blaen. Felly, mae’n rhaid inni edrych am y marchnadoedd bach, newydd.

In considering that, and bearing in mind that we must help the farmers and the rural economy in the short term, we must consider—as the report does—the new markets. We cannot attempt to compete with New Zealand in the future. Poland is the competition of the future, and countries that have plenty of land and much lower costs than Wales. That is how it has always been, because of the price of land, the growing season and so on. Therefore, we must look for the new, small markets.

Wrth wneud hynny, gallwn gystadlu’n dda â gwledydd eraill ac ymuno â marchnadoedd lle mae llawer o arian a lle na fydd y prisiau’n cael eu torri am fod costau gwledydd eraill yn llawer is na’n costau ni. Dyna yw nod arallgyfeirio. Nid dweud wrth ffermwyr bod yn rhaid iddynt newid yn gyfan gwbl o un peth i’r llall yw’r pwrpas, ond awgrymu eu bod yn gwneud rhywbeth arall yn ychwanegol at yr hyn y maent yn ei wneud ar hyn o bryd i ddod â mwy o arian i’r fferm. Dyna lle mae Cyswllt Ffermio yn chwarae ei ran. Bydd yn rhoi cyngor i ffermwyr ac yn egluro bod sawl peth y gallant ei wneud i sicrhau mwy o arian i’r fferm. Bydd Cyswllt Ffermio yn rhoi cyngor, a bydd cymorth ariannol hefyd ar gael.

In doing so, we can compete well with other countries and enter into markets where there is a great deal of money and where the prices will not be cut because the costs of other countries are much lower than ours. That is the aim of diversification. Its purpose is not to tell farmers that they must change completely from one thing to another, but to suggest that they do something else in addition to what they are doing at present to bring in extra income for the farm. That is where Farming Connect plays its part. It will give farmers advice and will explain that there are several things that they can do to secure more money for the farm. Farming Connect will give advice, and financial support will also be available.

Mae dyletswydd ar y Cynulliad—mae pawb yn gwybod hynny—ac mae’r gwaith a wnaethpwyd gan y Pwyllgor yn hollbwysig wrth roi nod i weithio tuag ato. Mae’n dangos hefyd bod gwaith yn cael ei wneud yn y Cynulliad er mwyn paratoi ffermwyr ar gyfer y dyfodol a’u galluogi i arallgyfeirio a darganfod ffyrdd eraill o wneud mwy o arian drwy ffermio.

The Assembly has a responsibility—we all know that—and the Committee’s work is vital in providing an objective to work towards. It also demonstrates that work is being done in the Assembly to prepare farmers for the future and to enable them to diversify and to find other ways of making money from farming.

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 113

Glyn Davies spoken in Welsh p. 113

Yn gyntaf, nodaf fy mod wedi anghofio datgan buddiant cyn dechrau fy araith.

First, I note that I forgot to declare an interest before beginning my speech.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 113

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 113

Mae pawb yn gwybod am eich buddiant, Glyn.

Everyone is aware of your interest, Glyn.

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 113

Glyn Davies spoken in Welsh p. 113

Yr wyf yn bartner mewn busnes amaethyddiaeth.

I am a partner in an agricultural business.

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i Aelodau sydd wedi cyfrannu at y ddadl heddiw, ac am eu cefnogaeth i argymhellion y Pwyllgor. Nid oes amser i ymateb i bob pwynt a godwyd ond addawaf ddarllen pob cyfraniad yn fanwl yn ystod toriad yr haf.

I am grateful to Members who have contributed to today’s debate, and for their support for the Committee’s recommendations. There is no time to respond to all the points that were raised, but I promise to read every contribution thoroughly in the summer recess.

Cyfeiriaf at un pwynt a godwyd gan Elin Jones, Dafydd Wigley ac un Aelod arall am waith Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru. Fe’i codwyd hefyd yn y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd ddoe. Cytunaf na weithiodd y WDA yn ddigon caled yn ardaloedd gwledig Cymru dros y pum mlynedd diwethaf. Fodd bynnag, yr oeddwn yn falch o glywed Graham Hawker yn cytuno â mi ddoe. Yn y dyfodol, bydd y WDA yn fwy sensitif i’n gofynion ni.

I refer to one point raised by Elin Jones, Dafydd Wigley and another Member about the Welsh Development Agency’s work. It was also raised yesterday in the Economic Development Committee. I agree that the WDA has not worked hard enough in the rural Wales over the past five years. However, I was pleased to hear Graham Hawker agreeing with me yesterday. In future, the WDA will be more sensitive to our needs.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 113

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 113

I have a brief point. [ASSEMBLY MEMBERS: ‘Cymraeg.’]

‘I have a brief point’. [AELODAU’R CYNULLIAD: ‘Cymraeg.’]

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 113

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 113

Trefn. Mae hwn yn fater difrifol. Gwerthfawrogwn fod Aelodau wedi dewis siarad Cymraeg, ond nid oes gorfodaeth arnynt i wneud hynny. Mae’n fater o egwyddor bod Aelodau’r Cynulliad yn cael dewis siarad yn Gymraeg neu yn Saesneg. Yr ydym yn Gynulliad dwyieithog ac felly y bydd tra byddaf i yn y Gadair.

Order. This is a serious matter. We appreciate the fact that Members have chosen to speak Welsh, but they are not obliged to do so. It is a matter of principle that Assembly Members have the choice of speaking in English or Welsh. We are a bilingual Assembly and that is how it will remain while I am in the Chair.

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 114

Alun Cairns spoken in Welsh and English p. 114

Mae rheswm pam yr wyf am siarad yn Saesneg. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar eich bod wedi tanlinellu fy hawl i wneud hynny.

in Welsh There is a reason why I want to speak English. I am grateful to you for underlining my right to do so.

I appreciate the problems of rural Wales as someone who comes from a relatively urban area. However, I am not sure if urban areas in general also understand the crisis in rural Wales. Do you believe that it is important that we engage with people from urban areas to win them over, particularly people such as Jeff Chapman?

yn Saesneg Gwerthfawrogaf broblemau Cymru wledig fel rhywun a ddaw o ardal gymharol drefol. Fodd bynnag, nid wyf yn siŵr a yw’r ardaloedd trefol yn gyffredinol yn deall argyfwng Cymru wledig. A gredwch ei bod yn bwysig ein bod yn ymddiddan â phobl o ardaloedd trefol er mwyn ennill eu cefnogaeth hwy, yn arbennig pobl fel Jeff Chapman?

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 114

Glyn Davies spoken in Welsh p. 114

Yr oeddwn yn eich cwmni mewn tŷ bwyta yr wythnos diwethaf pan siaradais â Mrs Jeff Chapman. Cytunaf ei bod yn wraig ddymunol. Gwn ei bod yn hwyr ac nad oes amser i ymateb i bob pwynt. Diolchaf i bawb sydd wedi siarad yn y ddadl.

I was in your company in a restaurant last week when I spoke to Mrs Jeff Chapman. I agree that she is a pleasant lady. I know that it is late and there is no time to respond to every point. I thank everyone who has spoken in this debate.

Cynnig NDM711 Glyn Davies t. 114

Motion NDM711 Glyn Davies p. 114

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 35 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (35)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Rosemary Butler
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Andrew Davies
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Richard Edwards
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Jane Hutt
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Peter Law
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Rod Richards
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Karen Sinclair
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Datganiad gan y Llywydd

Statement by the Presiding Officer

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 115

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 115

Cyn imi alw Janet Ryder i gyflwyno’r ddadl fer, hoffwn gyfeirio at y pwynt o drefn a gododd Gwenda Thomas yn gynharach heddiw. Wedi ymchwilio i’r mater, esboniais wrth Gwenda na dderbyniwyd ei neges e-bost gan y person cywir. Cysylltaf â’r Aelodau i gyd i’w hatgoffa y dylent anfon neges at sedd 01 o chwarter awr cyn dechrau’r Cyfarfod Llawn ymlaen er mwyn nodi eu dymuniad i gyfrannu. Bydd y neges wedyn yn fy nghyrraedd, yn ogystal â chyrraedd fy ysgrifenyddion. Gall Aelodau hefyd ddenu fy sylw drwy godi llaw os ydynt yn dymuno siarad yn ystod dadl ac, os oes amser yn weddill, cânt ganiatâd i gyfrannu. Fodd bynnag, beiwn y system electronig y tro hwn.

Before I call Janet Ryder to propose the short debate, I would like to refer to the point of order raised earlier today by Gwenda Thomas. Having investigated the matter, I explained to Gwenda that the intended recipient did not receive her e-mail message. I will contact all Members to remind them that, in order to indicate their desire to contribute, they should send a message to seat 01 from a quarter of an hour before Plenary is due to start onwards. The message will then reach me, as well as my secretaries. Members may also draw my attention by raising a hand if they wish to speak during a debate and, if time allows, they will be permitted to contribute. However, we will blame the electronic system this time.

Dadl Fer

Short Debate

Cyfleoedd i gael Grantiau Anabledd

Access to Disability Grants

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 115

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 115

David Melding has asked to contribute to this debate.

Mae David Melding wedi gofyn am gael cyfrannu at y ddadl hon.

I have chosen a topic that forms a large part of my constituency work, namely the problems that people face in trying to access disabled facilities grants. There are several reasons for those problems. I will concentrate mainly on the problems faced by children, and offer the Minister a suggestion about a possible way forward. However, it does not appear that a Minister is present to respond to this debate.

Yr wyf wedi dewis pwnc sydd yn rhan fawr o’m gwaith etholaethol, sef y problemau a wynebir gan bobl sydd yn ceisio cael gafael ar grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Mae sawl rheswm dros y problemau hyn. Canolbwyntiaf yn bennaf ar y problemau a wynebir gan blant, a chynigiaf awgrym i’r Gweinidog ynglŷn â ffordd bosibl ymlaen. Fodd bynnag, nid yw’n ymddangos bod Gweinidog yn bresennol i ymateb i’r ddadl hon.

Disabled facilities grants are applied for through, and administered by, local authorities. The application is usually made to housing departments and passed on to social services for an assessment by occupational therapists. That is the first problem. Delays occur in the transfer of applications and there are tremendous backlogs of people waiting for assessment by occupational therapists. Waiting lists for disabled facilities grants differ from one local authority to another, and waiting times are connected to the different practices within those authorities, such as the level of co-operation between housing and social services departments, and access to occupational therapists to evaluate the property in question. Generally, the larger the adaptation, the longer it will take to process the application. Normally, the client must wait three months for an application to come through. The client must then wait for the building work to be started. However, for larger adaptations and renovations, the processing of applications can take up to six months.

Gwneir cais am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl drwy awdurdodau lleol, ac fe’u gweinyddir ganddynt. Gwneir y cais fel arfer i adrannau tai a’i drosglwyddo i’r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol ar gyfer asesiad gan therapyddion galwedigaethol. Dyna’r broblem gyntaf. Mae oedi’n digwydd wrth drosglwyddo ceisiadau ac mae ôl-groniadau enfawr o bobl yn aros i gael eu hasesu gan therapyddion galwedigaethol. Mae rhestrau aros ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn gwahaniaethu o un awdurdod lleol i’r llall, a chysylltir amserau aros â’r arferion gwahanol o fewn yr awdurdodau hynny, megis lefel y cydweithio rhwng adrannau tai a gwasanaethau cymdeithasol, a mynediad at therapyddion galwedigaethol i werthuso’r eiddo dan sylw. Yn gyffredinol, po fwyaf yw’r addasiad, po hwyaf a gymer i brosesu’r cais. Fel arfer, rhaid i’r cleient aros tri mis i gais ddod trwodd. Yna rhaid i’r cleient aros i’r gwaith adeiladu ddechrau. Fodd bynnag, ar gyfer addasiadau a gwaith adnewyddu mwy o faint, gall y gwaith o brosesu ceisiadau gymryd hyd at chwe mis.

The current system is fragmented, confusing and unwieldy for users and providers. New housing association tenants who require an adaptation to their property can access physical adaptations grants from the National Assembly. Existing disabled tenants cannot, and they must apply to the local authorities for disabled facilities grants. Huge delays are reported, with some local authorities unsure of their own policy and with enormous waiting lists. There is discrimination between council tenants and owner-occupiers or housing association tenants. Disabled facilities work for council tenants tends to be delayed, sometimes for up to as much as a year. There must be equity of provision, regardless of whether the client is a tenant or an owner-occupier.

Mae’r system bresennol yn fratiog, yn ddryslyd ac yn anhylaw i ddefnyddwyr a darparwyr. Gall tenantiaid cymdeithasau tai newydd y mae angen addasu eu heiddo gael grantiau addasiadau corfforol gan y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol. Ni all tenantiaid anabl presennol wneud hynny, a rhaid iddynt wneud cais i’r awdurdodau lleol am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Cofnodir achosion o oedi enfawr, ac mae rhai awdurdodau lleol yn ansicr o’u polisi eu hunain ac mae ganddynt restrau aros anferth. Gwahaniaethir rhwng tenantiaid tai cyngor a deiliaid-berchnogion neu denantiaid cymdeithasau tai. Tueddir i oedi gwaith ar gyfleusterau i’r anabl, weithiau hyd at flwyddyn. Rhaid i’r ddarpariaeth fod yn gyfartal, ni waeth a yw’r cleient yn denant neu’n ddeiliad-berchennog.

Each local authority also operates different standards for the minimum income required to receive a disabled facilities grant. There is evidence of a family being denied a grant on the grounds that the parental income was £18,000 a year. Social services and voluntary organisations had to find the money so that the family could have the necessary adaptations done. That is where organisations such as Care and Repair Cymru play such a vital role by helping people to access extra funding. However, the fact that some people are unable to have facilities installed because they cannot meet their contribution is discriminatory and should be reassessed, especially given the high level of poverty among disabled people.

Mae pob awdurdod lleol yn gweithredu safonau gwahanol hefyd ar gyfer yr isafswm incwm sydd yn ofynnol i gael grant cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Mae tystiolaeth y gwrthodwyd grant i deulu am y rheswm bod incwm y rhieni yn £18,000 y flwyddyn. Bu’n rhaid i’r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol a’r sefydliadau gwirfoddol ddod o hyd i’r arian fel y gallai’r teulu wneud yr addasiadau angenrheidiol. Dyna lle y mae sefydliadau fel Asiantaeth Gofal a Thrwsio Cymru yn chwarae rhan mor bwysig drwy helpu pobl i gael gafael ar arian ychwanegol. Fodd bynnag, mae’r ffaith na all rhai pobl gael cyfleusterau gan na allant dalu eu cyfraniad yn achos o wahaniaethu a dylid eu hailasesu, yn enwedig o gofio’r lefel uchel o dlodi ymhlith pobl anabl.

The assessment of the physical surroundings and the financial situation cause problems. The assessment should be made on the basis of the need of the individual in relation to the property in which he or she lives. However, that is open to interpretation by each authority, and some authorities interpret it in significantly different ways.

Mae asesu’r amgylchiadau yn gorfforol a’r sefyllfa ariannol yn achosi problemau. Dylid asesu ar sail angen yr unigolyn mewn perthynas â’r eiddo lle mae ef neu hi yn byw. Fodd bynnag, mae hynny’n agored i ddehongliad gan bob awdurdod, ac mae rhai awdurdodau yn ei ddehongli mewn ffyrdd sylweddol wahanol.

In some cases, the property in which people live may not be suitable for the adaptations needed or may be in need of renovation. However, there is not an automatic tie-up between being granted a disabled facilities grant and being granted a renovation grant. In some cases, people may even need to find new properties. Some of those problems could be solved by the development of a national register of housing that is suitable for adaptation or has already been adapted. The move towards building lifetime homes will help to correct the situation for new stock.

Mewn rhai achosion, efallai na fydd yr eiddo y mae pobl yn byw ynddynt yn addas ar gyfer yr addasiadau sydd eu hangen neu efallai bod angen eu hadnewyddu. Fodd bynnag, nid oes cyswllt awtomatig rhwng caniatáu grant ar gyfer cyfleusterau i’r anabl a chael grant adnewyddu. Mewn rhai achosion, efallai y bydd angen i bobl ddod o hyd i eiddo newydd. Gellid datrys rhai o’r problemau hynny drwy ddatblygu cofrestr genedlaethol o dai sydd yn addas i’w haddasu neu sydd eisoes wedi eu haddasu. Bydd symud tuag at adeiladu cartrefi am oes yn helpu i unioni’r sefyllfa ar gyfer stoc newydd.

However, even after all those hoops have been negotiated, children still have a further hurdle to jump. Like everyone else, they are subject to delays in processing grants because grants applications are passed from one department to another. They have to wait for occupational therapy assessments, and then they have to agree the facilities that are being offered to them. Sometimes that causes disputes, which take time to resolve. Even then, they may not eventually get the facilities that they so badly need, because their parents cannot afford them.

Fodd bynnag, hyd yn oed ar ôl mynd drwy bob cylch, mae gan blant un rhwystr arall i’w oresgyn. Fel pob un arall, wynebant oedi wrth brosesu grantiau gan fod ceisiadau am grant yn cael eu trosglwyddo o un adran i’r llall. Rhaid iddynt aros am asesiadau therapi galwedigaethol, ac yna rhaid iddynt gytuno ar y cyfleusterau a gynigir iddynt. Weithiau mae hynny’n achosi anghydfod, sydd yn cymryd amser i’w ddatrys. Hyd yn oed wedyn, efallai na chânt yn y pen draw y cyfleusterau y mae mawr angen amdanynt, gan na all eu rhieni eu fforddio.

Children who are in need of disabled facilities grants are currently subjected to means testing of parental income. That process must be changed, so that parental income does not determine what facilities can be offered to children to ensure that they are treated more equitably. Parents’ financial status should not determine the provision and opportunities for their children.

Mae plant y mae angen grantiau arnynt ar gyfer cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn agored ar hyn o bryd i brawf modd o incwm y rhieni. Rhaid i’r broses honno newid, fel nad yw incwm rhieni yn penderfynu pa gyfleusterau y gellir eu cynnig i blant er mwyn sicrhau y cânt eu trin yn fwy cyfartal. Ni ddylai statws ariannol rhieni benderfynu ar y ddarpariaeth a’r cyfleoedd i’w plant.

There are several problems with the means-testing requirement for disabled facilities grants. The minimum income requirement excludes many who are in need of grants, and is unfair to single parents, who suffer from having only one income. There is an upper limit of £24,000 for the grants, and additional funding must be applied for separately. That takes time and complicates the process for applicants. Often, voluntary groups and organisations such as Care and Repair Cymru provide, or help to find, funding. However, the person has to retrieve the sum, which is sometimes as little as £2,000 or £3,000. Those whose houses need large-scale adaptations sometimes face bills of up to £50,000. As a result, some people cannot make the adaptations because of their financial circumstances. That means that poor people, who are often poor as a result of their disability, cannot make the changes in facilities that could enable them to improve their financial situation through employment and so on. It also renders children particularly vulnerable because of parental income. People are increasingly unable to meet their contributions to the grant works. That delays the works, as organisations such as Care and Repair then have to search for extra money.

Mae sawl problem gyda’r gofyniad o ran prawf modd ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Mae’r gofyniad isafswm incwm yn eithrio llawer y mae angen grantiau arnynt, ac mae’n annheg i rieni sengl, sydd yn dioddef am mai dim ond un incwm sydd ganddynt. Mae terfyn uchaf o £24,000 ar gyfer y grantiau, a rhaid gwneud cais ar wahân am arian ychwanegol. Cymer hynny amser ac mae’n cymhlethu’r broses i ymgeiswyr. Yn aml, darperir arian gan grwpiau gwirfoddol a sefydliadau fel Gofal a Thrwsio Cymru, neu helpant i ddarparu arian. Fodd bynnag, rhaid i’r person adennill y swm, sydd weithiau mor fach â £2,000 neu £3,000. Weithiau bydd y rheini, y mae angen addasu eu tai ar raddfa fawr, yn wynebu biliau o hyd at £50,000. O ganlyniad, ni all rhai pobl wneud yr addasiadau oherwydd eu hamgylchiadau ariannol. Golyga hynny na all pobl dlawd, sydd yn aml yn dlawd o ganlyniad i’w hanabledd, wneud y newidiadau i gyfleusterau a allai eu galluogi i wella eu sefyllfa ariannol drwy gyflogaeth ac yn y blaen. Mae hefyd yn gwneud plant yn arbennig o ddiamddiffyn oherwydd incwm y rhieni. Yn gynyddol, nid yw pobl yn gallu talu eu cyfraniadau i’r gwaith grant. Mae hynny’n oedi’r gwaith, gan fod sefydliadau fel Gofal a Thrwsio yn gorfod chwilio wedyn am arian ychwanegol.

There is also anecdotal evidence that the rate of marriage break-up for families in which there is a disabled child is higher than the already-high national average. Those families receive little support, which must put much strain on the relationship. Therefore, it is important that means tests for disabled facilities grants and other benefits take into account any payments to the Child Support Agency. The parent who has the care of a disabled child may want to re-marry and, if the new partner has children for whom he or she is financially responsible, this should be taken into account in the assessment for the grant. It must not be forgotten that the grants are intended to benefit the child, not the parent.

Mae tystiolaeth anecdotaidd hefyd fod cyfradd y priodasau sydd yn chwalu mewn teuluoedd sydd â phlentyn anabl yn uwch na’r cyfartaledd cenedlaethol sydd eisoes yn uchel. Ni chaiff y teuluoedd hynny fawr ddim cefnogaeth, ac mae’n rhaid bod hynny’n rhoi straen ar y berthynas. Felly, mae’n bwysig bod prawf modd ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl a budd-daliadau eraill yn ystyried unrhyw daliadau i’r Asiantaeth Cynnal Plant. Efallai y bydd y rhiant sydd yn gofalu am blentyn anabl yn dymuno ailbriodi ac, os bydd gan y partner newydd blant y mae ef neu hi yn gyfrifol amdanynt yn ariannol, dylid ystyried hyn wrth asesu’r grant. Ni ddylid anghofio mai bwriad y grantiau yw bod o fudd i’r plentyn, nid y rhiant.

I currently have a case of a severely disabled child whose home needs a host of adaptations, ranging from a ramp to the front door to bath hoists. However, having been assessed as needing those facilities, the child cannot have them because one of the partners makes payments to the Child Support Agency, which are not being classed as disregarded income. When financial assessments are made, mortgage payments, gas, electricity and CSA payments should be classed as disregarded income. At present, they are not.

Mae gennyf achos o blentyn anabl iawn ar hyn o bryd y mae angen gwneud llu o addasiadau i’w gartref, yn amrywio o ramp i’r drws ffrynt i beiriant codi uwch y bath. Fodd bynnag, ar ôl ei asesu fel rhywun y mae angen y cyfleusterau hynny arno, ni all y plentyn eu cael gan fod un o’r partneriaid yn gwneud taliadau i’r Asiantaeth Cynnal Plant, taliadau na chânt eu hystyried yn incwm a ddiystyrir. Pan wneir asesiadau ariannol, dylai taliadau morgais, taliadau nwy, trydan a thaliadau’r ACP gael eu dosbarthu yn incwm a ddiystyrir. Ar hyn o bryd, ni chânt eu dosbarthu felly.

Therefore, what can be done? The consultation paper on private sector renewal proposes to give local authorities power to grant preferential loans to disabled people to cover their contributions to the cost of adaptations. That would enable the poorest people in need of facilities to access funds to make such alterations. What is being done about that recommendation?

Felly, beth y gellir ei wneud? Mae’r papur ymgynghorol ar adnewyddu’r sector preifat yn cynnig rhoi pŵer i awdurdodau lleol i ganiatáu benthyciadau ffafriol i bobl anabl i dalu eu cyfraniadau tuag at gost yr addasiadau. Byddai hynny’n galluogi’r bobl dlotaf y mae angen cyfleusterau arnynt i gael gafael ar yr arian i wneud newidiadau o’r fath. Beth sydd yn digwydd ynglŷn â’r argymhelliad hwnnw?

There are limits on the type of buildings that are eligible for disabled facilities grants in terms of age and standards. The National Assembly can change those requirements. The limits mean that poor people living in old and low-standard accommodation are often excluded from receiving improved facilities.

Mae terfynau ar y math o adeiladau sydd yn gymwys ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl o ran oedran a safonau. Gall y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol newid y gofynion hynny. Golyga’r terfynau y caiff pobl dlawd sydd yn byw mewn hen adeiladau o safon isel eu heithrio’n aml rhag cael cyfleusterau gwell.

There must be more flexibility across Wales in offering the necessary facilities for the disabled, in order to ensure that these people are mobile. For instance, when someone goes to a university, he or she should be able to transfer equipment and facilities to their new dwelling. The current lack of such opportunities has stopped people from taking up university places. Also, the assistance that councils offer needs to be standardised throughout Wales; there should be equitable standards and interpretations of the orders. Treatment of children’s applications for grants needs to be prioritised; if processing their applications takes a long time, the children’s needs may change. They may need different equipment.

Rhaid cael mwy o hyblygrwydd ledled Cymru wrth gynnig y cyfleusterau angenrheidiol i’r anabl, er mwyn sicrhau bod y bobl hyn yn gallu symud. Er enghraifft, pan aiff rhywun i brifysgol, dylai ef neu hi fod yn gallu trosglwyddo cyfarpar a chyfleusterau i’w cartref newydd. Mae prinder cyfleoedd o’r fath ar hyn o bryd wedi atal pobl rhag derbyn lleoedd mewn prifysgol. Hefyd, mae angen safoni’r cymorth a gynigir gan gynghorau ledled Cymru; dylai safonau a dehongliadau o’r gorchmynion fod yn deg. Mae angen blaenoriaethu’r ffordd y caiff ceisiadau plant am grantiau eu trin; os cymer amser hir i brosesu eu ceisiadau, efallai y bydd anghenion y plant yn newid. Efallai y bydd angen cyfarpar gwahanol arnynt.

We must establish the possibility of fast-tracking the process of applying for and granting funding, as some applicants have rapidly progressive diseases, such as muscular sclerosis. It is fundamentally important that there is flexibility in fast-tracking procedures. The point of fast-tracking is lost if rigid procedures and requirements, such as specifications of conditions and diseases, hinder access to grants.

Rhaid inni sefydlu’r posibilrwydd o ddefnyddio’r broses dull carlam o wneud cais am arian a’i ganiatáu, gan fod gan rai ymgeiswyr afiechydon sydd yn gwaethygu’n gyflym, fel sglerosis y cyhyrau. Yn y bôn, mae’n bwysig bod hyblygrwydd mewn gweithdrefnau dull carlam. Caiff diben dull carlam ei golli os bydd gweithdrefnau a gofynion caeth, fel manylebau cyflyrau ac afiechydon, yn rhwystro’r hawl i gael grantiau.

General guidance frameworks should be issued at a national level, which would help to create equity across Wales, and guide local housing authorities in making their decisions. That would ensure equity and flexibility at a local level, and would speed up the processing of applications.

Dylid cyhoeddi fframweithiau arweiniad cyffredinol ar lefel genedlaethol, a fyddai’n helpu i greu tegwch ledled Cymru, ac arwain awdurdodau tai lleol wrth wneud eu penderfyniadau. Byddai hynny’n sicrhau tegwch a hyblygrwydd ar lefel leol, ac yn cyflymu’r gwaith o brosesu ceisiadau.

What powers does the Minister have to alter the administration of disabled facilities grants to allow financial assessment of the child and not the parents? Local authorities make and administer these grants. However, the Minister has the power to define the guidelines for local authorities in terms of determining eligibility for disabled facilities grant, and the specification of the purposes for which a grant may be given. The Assembly can modify how the provisions for grants are set down in the Housing Grant, Construction and Regeneration Act 1996, and select provisions that will not be applicable in certain circumstances.

Pa bwerau sydd gan y Gweinidog i newid y ffordd y gweinyddir grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl i ganiatáu i’r plentyn gael ei asesu’n ariannol ac nid y rhieni? Yr awdurdodau lleol sydd yn gwneud ac yn gweinyddu’r grantiau hyn. Fodd bynnag, mae gan y Gweinidog y pŵer i ddiffinio’r canllawiau ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol o ran penderfynu ar gymhwyster ar gyfer grant cyfleusterau i’r anabl, a manyleb y dibenion y gellir rhoi grant mewn perthynas â hwy. Gall y Cynulliad newid y ffordd y cofnodir y darpariaethau ar gyfer grantiau yn Neddf Grant Tai, Adeiladu ac Adfywio 1996, a dethol darpariaethau na fydd yn berthnasol dan amgylchiadau penodol.

The Assembly can, by regulation, make provisions on how applications to these schemes should be made, how they should be dealt with in procedural terms, and how consideration should be given to the applicant’s financial status. These regulations establish that the National Assembly can modify or make regulations on how housing authorities conduct the disabled facilities grant. Regulations may be made generally or for specific housing authorities. In light of that, I call on the Minister to change the way assessments are made, especially with regard to children, to ensure that the financial assessment is made of the child, not the parent. Obviously that will have major financial implications and so I ask the Minister to agree to establish a study to assess the financial implications of changing the financial assessment so that the child, not the parent, is assessed. A report would then come before the appropriate committee for this change in emphasis from parent to child to be considered and implemented.

Gall y Cynulliad, drwy reoliad, wneud darpariaethau ar sut y dylid gwneud ceisiadau i’r cynlluniau hyn, sut y dylid eu trin yn drefniadol a pha ystyriaeth y dylid ei rhoi i statws ariannol yr ymgeisydd. Mae’r rheoliadau hyn yn sefydlu y gall y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol newid neu wneud rheoliadau ar sut y mae awdurdodau tai yn cynnal y grant cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Gellir gwneud rheoliadau yn gyffredinol neu ar gyfer awdurdodau tai penodol. Yng ngoleuni hynny, galwaf ar y Gweinidog i newid y ffordd y gwneir asesiadau, yn enwedig o ran plant, er mwyn sicrhau mai asesiad ariannol o’r plentyn a wneir ac nid y rhiant. Yn amlwg bydd goblygiadau ariannol mawr i hynny ac felly gofynnaf i’r Gweinidog gytuno i lunio astudiaeth i asesu goblygiadau ariannol newid yr asesiad ariannol, fel yr asesir y plentyn, ac nid y rhiant. Yna byddai adroddiad yn dod gerbron y pwyllgor priodol ar y newid hwn mewn pwyslais o’r rhiant i’r plentyn er mwyn ei ystyried a’i weithredu.

David Melding spoken in English p. 121

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 121

I thank Janet Ryder for raising this most important debate on a subject that is close to many of our hearts. The current situation creates difficulties. Let us spell out that final point: what happens at the moment when parents unexpectedly find that they have a child with very special needs? Instead of getting extra support from the community when they make a commitment of great love and caring to look after that child, they are assessed on their income to meet the needs that that child has generated in their home. That is not a fair basis. It is questionable in law that carers can be assessed for their income, and not the income of the cared-for individual. However, I believe that our society could respond more generously in this area by excluding parents from the assessment of their income when their child’s needs are being addressed for these important adaptations, which can run into tens of thousands of pounds. We need to sort this out because, at the moment, children are kept waiting through no fault of their own. We are not doing our bit.

Diolchaf i Janet Ryder am godi’r ddadl holl bwysig hon ar bwnc sydd yn agos at galonnau llawer ohonom. Mae’r sefyllfa gyfredol yn creu anawsterau. Gadewch inni egluro’n fanwl y pwynt olaf hwnnw: beth sydd yn digwydd ar yr adeg pan fydd rhieni yn canfod yn annisgwyl bod ganddynt blentyn ag anghenion arbennig iawn? Yn lle cael cymorth ychwanegol gan y gymuned pan wnânt ymrwymiad i garu a gofalu am y plentyn hwnnw, fe’u hasesir ar eu hincwm i ddiwallu’r anghenion y mae’r plentyn hwnnw wedi eu cynhyrchu yn eu cartref. Nid yw hynny’n sail deg. Mae’n ddadleuol yn gyfreithiol y gellir asesu gofalwyr ar gyfer eu hincwm, ac nid incwm yr unigolyn y gofelir amdano. Fodd bynnag, credaf y gallai ein cymdeithas ymateb yn fwy hael yn y maes hwn drwy eithrio rhieni o’r asesiad o’u hincwm pan ymdrinnir ag anghenion eu plentyn ar gyfer yr addasiadau pwysig hyn, a all olygu degau o filoedd o bunnoedd. Mae angen inni roi trefn ar hyn oherwydd, ar hyn o bryd, cedwir plant i aros ac nid eu bai hwy yw hynny. Nid ydym yn gwneud ein rhan.

Peter Black The Deputy Minister for Local Government spoken in English p. 121

Peter Black Y Dirprwy Weinidog dros Lywodraeth Leol siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 121

I am pleased to reply to this debate on an issue of great importance for those who are disabled, and those who care for disabled people. I am grateful to Janet Ryder for raising these issues and for the comments and constructive discussion we have had. We all recognise the importance of helping people to remain in their own homes, in familiar surroundings and with the help of not only support services, but also family, friends and neighbours. That is an essential element of supporting people in our communities and it should not be underestimated.

Yr wyf yn falch o ymateb i’r ddadl hon ar fater sydd yn bwysig iawn i’r rheini sydd yn anabl, a’r rheini sydd yn gofalu am bobl anabl. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i Janet Ryder am godi’r materion hyn ac am y sylwadau a’r drafodaeth adeiladol a gawsom. Mae pob un ohonom yn cydnabod pwysigrwydd helpu pobl i aros yn eu cartrefi eu hunain, mewn awyrgylch cyfarwydd ac nid yn unig gyda chymorth gwasanaethau cymorth, ond teulu, ffrindiau a chymdogion hefyd. Mae hynny’n elfen hanfodol o roi cymorth i bobl yn ein cymunedau ac ni ddylid ei thanbrisio.

To enable disabled people to continue to enjoy the benefit, comfort and convenience of their own homes, it is essential that those homes are suitable for their needs and properly adapted, to ensure that they can move around them easily and have access to the facilities that we take for granted. It is important that the disabled people in greatest need receive help with the cost of such essential adaptations. It is also important that they know where to turn for that assistance. Disabled facilities grants are often the main source of help and are an essential part of the services that local authorities can make available.

Er mwyn galluogi pobl anabl i barhau i fwynhau’r fantais o fod yn eu cartref eu hunain, gyda’r cysur a’r cyfleustra, mae’n hanfodol bod y cartrefi hynny yn addas ar gyfer eu hanghenion ac wedi eu haddasu’n briodol, er mwyn sicrhau y gallant symud o amgylch yn hawdd ac y gallant ddefnyddio’r cyfleusterau a gymerwn yn ganiataol. Mae’n bwysig bod y bobl anabl sydd â’r angen mwyaf yn cael help gyda chost addasiadau hanfodol o’r fath. Mae hefyd yn bwysig eu bod yn gwybod i ble i droi am y cymorth hwnnw. Grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn aml yw’r brif ffynhonnell help ac maent yn rhan hanfodol o’r gwasanaethau y gall awdurdodau lleol eu cynnig.

DFGs are mandatory grants. They are currently the only mandatory housing grants available from local authorities. They can provide help with the cost of essential adaptations, which enable disabled people to continue to live in their own homes. In addition to providing help for younger disabled people, they are an essential lifeline to elderly people. Demand for DFGs has risen steadily in recent years and the amount of assistance given is currently in the region of £25 million to £30 million a year. That is a significant amount.

Mae grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn grantiau gorfodol. Ar hyn o bryd dyma’r unig grantiau tai gorfodol sydd ar gael oddi wrth awdurdodau lleol. Gallant ddarparu help gyda chost addasiadau hanfodol, sydd yn galluogi pobl anabl i barhau i fyw yn eu cartrefi eu hunain. Yn ogystal â darparu cymorth i bobl anabl iau, maent yn rhaff achub hanfodol i bobl oedrannus. Mae’r galw am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl wedi cynyddu’n sylweddol yn ystod y blynyddoedd diwethaf ac mae swm y cymorth a roddir ar hyn o bryd oddeutu £25 miliwn i £30 miliwn y flwyddyn. Mae hynny’n swm sylweddol.

The National Assembly remains firmly committed to supporting DFGs. The guidance given to local authorities stresses the importance of authorities allocating such grants in line with local priorities. It also emphasises the importance of close working between housing and social services departments. That is essential to ensure that adaptation work meets the needs of disabled people and is suitable for their homes.

Mae’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn parhau yn ymrwymedig iawn i gefnogi grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Mae’r arweiniad a roddir i awdurdodau lleol yn pwysleisio pa mor bwysig ydyw i awdurdodau ddyrannu grantiau o’r fath yn unol â blaenoriaethau lleol. Mae hefyd yn pwysleisio pwysigrwydd cydweithio agos rhwng yr adran tai a’r adran gwasanaethau cymdeithasol. Mae hynny’n hanfodol i sicrhau bod y gwaith addasu yn diwallu anghenion pobl anabl a’i fod yn addas ar gyfer eu cartrefi.

DFGs are not only about the physical adaptation of homes, but about meeting the wider needs of disabled people with properly adapted homes and effective, sensitive support. The Assembly has made almost £200 million available for local authority housing budgets this year. Around £150 million of those resources, along with the other general capital funding available to local authorities, has not been hypothecated by the National Assembly. That gives authorities scope to decide how those resources should be committed in light of local priorities. Authorities can decide on the level of support that they feel is appropriate for DFGs to meet local demand.

Mae grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl nid yn unig yn ymwneud ag addasu cartrefi yn gorfforol ond â diwallu anghenion ehangach pobl anabl sydd â chartrefi wedi eu haddasu’n gywir ac â chefnogaeth effeithiol, sensitif. Sicrhaodd y Cynulliad bron £200 miliwn ar gyfer cyllidebau tai awdurdodau lleol eleni. Ni chafodd tua £150 miliwn o’r adnoddau hynny, ynghyd â’r arian cyfalaf cyffredinol arall sydd ar gael i awdurdodau lleol, ei bridiannu gan y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol. Rhydd hynny’r cyfle i awdurdodau benderfynu sut y dylid ymrwymo’r adnoddau hynny yng ngoleuni blaenoriaethau lleol. Gall awdurdodau benderfynu ar lefel y gefnogaeth y teimlant sydd yn briodol ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl i fodloni’r galw yn lleol.

We recognise that there can be pressures in some areas and have provided additional resources from within the £50 million available for strategic housing schemes, specifically to support projects involving DFGs and home repairs assistance. This year, more that £7.7 million has been made available to support such schemes. The National Assembly has further recognised the importance of housing by increasing the overall housing budget in Wales by £40 million over the next three years. That underlines our commitment and will give local authorities even further scope to meet local demand for DFGs, providing much needed support for the disabled people in their areas.

Cydnabyddwn fod pwysau mewn rhai ardaloedd efallai ac yr ydym wedi darparu adnoddau ychwanegol o fewn y £50 miliwn sydd ar gael ar gyfer cynlluniau tai strategol, yn benodol i gefnogi prosiectau sydd yn ymwneud â grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl a chymorth o ran atgyweiriadau tai. Eleni, sicrhawyd bod mwy na £7.7 miliwn ar gael i gefnogi cynlluniau o’r fath. Mae’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol wedi cydnabod hefyd bwysigrwydd tai drwy gynyddu’r gyllideb tai gyffredinol yng Nghymru £40 miliwn dros y tair blynedd nesaf. Mae hynny’n tanlinellu ein hymrwymiad a bydd yn rhoi hyd yn oed fwy o gyfle i awdurdodau lleol fodloni’r galw yn lleol am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl, gan ddarparu cymorth sydd ei angen yn fawr ar gyfer pobl anabl yn eu hardaloedd.

Demand for DFGs is growing yearly. The new rapid response disabled facilities programme is intended to provide an immediate response to specific needs. It will provide adaptations, such as ramps, stair lifts, hand rails and, possibly, showers, to people who require them, either to sustain occupancy in their homes or so that they can be released from hospital or temporary nursing home care. A bid will be made in the forthcoming budget round for £2.5 million over three years for this programme. Local councils already have flexibility to fast-track and re-prioritise DFGs.

Mae’r galw am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn cynyddu bob blwyddyn. Bwriedir i’r rhaglen ymateb cyflym newydd ar gyfer cyfleusterau i’r anabl ddarparu ymateb ar unwaith i anghenion penodol. Bydd yn darparu addasiadau, fel rampiau, lifftiau grisiau, canllawiau ac o bosibl, cawodydd, i bobl sydd eu hangen, naill ai i sicrhau y gallant aros yn eu cartrefi neu y gellir eu rhyddhau o’r ysbyty neu ofal cartref nyrsio. Caiff cynnig ei wneud yn y cylch cyllideb arfaethedig am £2.5 miliwn dros dair blynedd ar gyfer y rhaglen hon. Mae gan gynghorau lleol eisoes yr hyblygrwydd i ddefnyddio’r dull carlam ac ailflaenoriaethu grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl.

I have mentioned the importance of effective joint working between local authority housing and social services departments. I accept Janet’s point about occupational therapists, although local authorities have the scope to bring in private occupational therapists to deal with this issue. It is also essential that authorities work closely with other organisations, such as Care and Repair Cymru, which can provide help and links for disabled people.

Soniais am bwysigrwydd cydweithio effeithiol rhwng adran tai ac adran gwasanaethau cymdeithasol yr awdurdodau lleol. Derbyniaf bwynt Janet ynglŷn â therapyddion galwedigaethol, er bod gan awdurdodau lleol y cyfle i ddefnyddio therapyddion galwedigaethol preifat i ddelio â’r mater hwn. Mae’n hanfodol hefyd bod awdurdodau yn cydweithio’n agos â sefydliadau eraill, fel Gofal a Thrwsio Cymru, a all ddarparu help a chysylltiadau i bobl anabl.

The demand for DFGs is high and, to ensure that the available resources are used effectively and appropriately, it is imperative that they are targeted towards those who can least afford the adaptations. Although there is a limit of £24,000 on mandatory DFGs, as Janet pointed out, costs above this can be met by a discretionary DFG. Therefore, these problems are not insurmountable, and local authorities have the resources and power to give grant aid where adaptations cost more than the £24,000 limit on the mandatory grant.

Mae’r galw am grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn uchel, ac er mwyn sicrhau y defnyddir yr adnoddau sydd ar gael yn effeithiol a phriodol, mae’n angenrheidiol eu bod yn cael eu targedu tuag at y rheini sydd yn y sefyllfa waethaf i dalu am yr addasiadau. Er bod terfyn o £24,000 ar grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl gorfodol, fel y nododd Janet, gellir talu’r costau sydd yn uwch na hyn drwy grant cyfleusterau i’r anabl dewisol. Felly, nid yw’r problemau hyn yn anorchfygol, ac mae gan awdurdodau lleol yr adnoddau a’r pŵer i roi cymorth grant pan fydd addasiadau yn costio mwy na’r terfyn o £24,000 ar y grant gorfodol.

David Melding spoken in English p. 124

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 124

On the point that Janet Ryder and I made, is it right to effectively tax parents on this sum of money by assessing their income? They are already having to deal with the challenge of raising children with special needs. Why should they be paying rather than the public purse, which could spread the insurance risk of these events occurring?

O ran y pwynt a wnaeth Janet Ryder a minnau, a yw’n iawn, i bob diben, i drethu rhieni ar y swm hwn o arian drwy asesu eu hincwm? Eisoes maent yn gorfod delio â’r her o fagu plant ag anghenion arbennig. Pam y dylent hwy fod yn talu yn hytrach na phwrs y wlad, a allai ledaenu’r risg o ddigwyddiadau fel hyn yn codi o ran yswiriant?

Peter Black spoken in English p. 124

Peter Black siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 124

I will deal with that point shortly. Our arrangements for assessing the cost of applicants’ contributions are consistent with other housing-related benefits. We are convinced that the current arrangements that use standard allowances are a much fairer way of distributing resources than taking account of applicants’ actual expenditure. These are the sound principles used in other income-related benefits. It would be inequitable to adopt a different approach for DFGs. There are no proposals to change the current arrangements on DFGs although we consider regularly whether current arrangements and allowances within the test of resources are appropriate. Indeed, allowances are updated regularly.

Byddaf yn delio â’r pwynt hwnnw yn fuan. Mae ein trefniadau ar gyfer asesu a yw cost cyfraniadau ymgeiswyr yn gyson â budd-daliadau eraill sydd yn gysylltiedig â thai. Yr ydym yn argyhoeddedig bod y trefniadau cyfredol sydd yn defnyddio lwfansau safonol yn ffordd decach o lawer o ddosbarthu adnoddau yn hytrach nag ystyried gwariant gwirioneddol ymgeiswyr. Dyma’r egwyddorion cadarn a ddefnyddir mewn budd-daliadau eraill sydd yn gysylltiedig ag incwm. Byddai’n annheg mabwysiadu ymagwedd wahanol ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl. Nid oes unrhyw fwriad i newid y trefniadau cyfredol ar gyfer grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl er ein bod yn ystyried yn gyson a yw’r trefniadau a’r lwfansau cyfredol o fewn prawf yr adnoddau yn briodol. Yn wir, caiff lwfansau eu diweddaru’n gyson.

On David’s point, means-testing parents rather than their children is consistent with other housing-related benefits. Given that disabled children cannot be expected to have resources of their own, means-testing them rather than their parents would mean giving them adaptations for free, regardless of their parents’ financial situation. That would put the parents in a more privileged position than other grant applicants, which is a reason why we do not currently want to go down that road. However, to make adaptations more affordable to parents of disabled children, a change to the assessment of grants was introduced, namely the allocation of a new housing allowance of £65 for applicants on behalf of a disabled child. The change, which came into force in April 2000, has meant significant savings for parents. In some cases, several thousands of pounds were saved, and the allowance increased on 2 April 2001 to £67.08. We are trying to deal with—

O ran pwynt David, mae cynnal prawf modd ar rieni yn hytrach na’u plant yn gyson â budd-daliadau eraill sydd yn gysylltiedig â thai. O gofio na ellir disgwyl i blant anabl fod ag adnoddau eu hunain, byddai cynnal prawf modd arnynt hwy yn hytrach na’u rhieni yn golygu rhoi addasiadau am ddim iddynt, waeth beth fo sefyllfa ariannol eu rhieni. Byddai hynny’n rhoi’r rhieni mewn sefyllfa fwy breintiedig nag ymgeiswyr eraill am grantiau, ac mae hynny’n rheswm pam nad ydym, ar hyn o bryd, am ddilyn y trywydd hwnnw. Fodd bynnag, er mwyn gwneud addasiadau yn fwy fforddiadwy i rieni plant anabl, cyflwynwyd newid i’r dull asesu grantiau, sef dyrannu lwfans tai newydd o £65 i ymgeiswyr ar ran plentyn anabl. Mae’r newid, a ddaeth i rym ym mis Ebrill 2000, wedi golygu arbedion sylweddol i rieni. Mewn rhai achosion, arbedwyd miloedd o bunnoedd, a chynyddwyd y lwfans ar 2 Ebrill 2001 i £67.08. Yr ydym yn ceisio delio â—

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 125

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 125

In light of that, will you consider looking at the factors that are disregarded and include more items in that category, such as gas, electricity, mortgage payments and child support payments?

Yng ngoleuni hynny, a ystyriwch edrych ar y ffactorau a ddiystyrir a chynnwys rhagor o eitemau yn y categori hwnnw, megis taliadau nwy, trydan, morgais a thaliadau cynnal plant?

Peter Black spoken in English p. 125

Peter Black siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 125

I have said that we are always reviewing the arrangements and allowances and how those are calculated. Any issue that comes to us will be included in that review. Although, we do not have proposals to change the current system of DFGs, we are consulting on major reforms of the private sector renewal system, which will impact on the help that local authorities are able to provide for disabled people.

Yr wyf wedi dweud ein bod yn adolygu’r trefniadau a’r lwfansau a sut y cânt eu cyfrifo yn rheolaidd. Caiff unrhyw fater a ddaw ger ein bron ei gynnwys yn yr arolwg hwnnw. Er nad oes gennym fwriad i newid system bresennol grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl, yr ydym yn ymgynghori ar ddiwygiadau mawr i system adnewyddu’r sector preifat, a fydd yn effeithio ar y cymorth y gall awdurdodau lleol ei ddarparu ar gyfer pobl anabl.

The proposed reforms to private sector renewal were outlined in the Assembly’s consultation paper ‘Better Homes for People in Wales’, to which Janet alluded. It will give local authorities much more flexibility in the range of help and assistance that they are able to provide for home repair and improvement. The proposed changes will enable local authorities not only to provide grants, but also preferential loans for home improvement. That will give authorities the scope to provide additional assistance to disabled people and the parents of disabled children to help them meet the cost of their contribution towards adaptations that may not be covered by grants. Once again, responsibility will rightly rest with individual local authorities to decide how such a system should be provided in line with their local priorities.

Amlinellwyd y diwygiadau arfaethedig i adnewyddu’r sector preifat ym mhapur ymgynghorol y Cynulliad ‘Cartrefi Gwell i Bobl yng Nghymru’, y cyfeiriodd Janet ato. Rhydd fwy o hyblygrwydd o lawer i awdurdodau lleol yn yr ystod o help a chymorth y gallant ei darparu ar gyfer atgyweirio a gwella cartrefi. Bydd y cynigion arfaethedig yn galluogi awdurdodau lleol nid yn unig i ddarparu grantiau, ond benthyciadau ffafriol hefyd i wella cartrefi. Rhydd hynny’r cyfle i awdurdodau ddarparu cymorth ychwanegol i bobl anabl a rhieni plant anabl i’w helpu i dalu cost eu cyfraniad tuag at addasiadau na chwmpesir efallai gan grantiau. Unwaith eto, cyfrifoldeb yr awdurdodau lleol unigol fydd penderfynu sut y dylid darparu system o’r fath yn unol â’u blaenoriaethau lleol.

Although, the responsibility for administering and allocating DFGs squarely, and indeed properly, rests with local authorities, the Assembly is sensitive to the comments on, and criticisms of, delays in the system and is keen to ensure that those are minimised as far as possible. Practice in dealing with DFGs will vary from local authority to local authority. We are keen to ensure that best practice is adopted by all Welsh local authorities. That is why the Assembly supports a disabled facilities grant benchmarking group, which is being led by Welsh local authorities with membership from a wide range of organisations that provide help and support for disabled people.

Er mai cyfrifoldeb awdurdodau lleol yw gweinyddu a dyrannu grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn deg, ac yn wir yn gywir, mae’r Cynulliad yn sensitif i’r sylwadau ar oedi yn y system a beirniadaethau ohoni ac mae’n awyddus i sicrhau y cânt eu cadw i’r nifer lleiaf posibl. Bydd arfer wrth ddelio â grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl yn amrywio o un awdurdod lleol i’r llall. Yr ydym yn awyddus i sicrhau y mabwysiedir arfer gorau gan bob awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru. Dyna pam y mae’r Cynulliad yn cefnogi grŵp meincnodi grantiau cyfleusterau i’r anabl, o dan arweiniad awdurdodau lleol Cymru gydag aelodau o ystod eang o sefydliadau sydd yn darparu cymorth a chefnogaeth i bobl anabl.

I look forward to seeing the report of the benchmarking group and the good practice guidance notes that will flow from the exercise and be available to all local authorities. I understand that the group expects to report in the autumn. I assure you that the National Assembly will endorse any good practice that leads to improvement in the service of providing and adapting homes for disabled people. We have already set out the Assembly’s vision for providing and adapting suitable housing for disabled people in ‘Better Homes for People in Wales’. However, it is vital that local authorities develop effective strategies to ensure that grants are targeted effectively, that local demand is met and that those in greatest need are awarded priority and equity.

Edrychaf ymlaen at weld adroddiad y grŵp meincnodi a’r nodiadau arweiniad ar arfer da a fydd yn deillio o’r ymarfer ac a fydd ar gael i bob awdurdod lleol. Deallaf fod y grŵp yn disgwyl cyflwyno adroddiad yn yr hydref. Rhoddaf sicrwydd ichi y bydd y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn cymeradwyo unrhyw arfer da sydd yn arwain at welliant yn y gwasanaeth o ddarparu ac addasu cartrefi i bobl anabl. Eisoes nodwyd gweledigaeth y Cynulliad gennym ar gyfer darparu ac addasu tai addas i bobl anabl yn ‘Cartrefi Gwell i Bobl yng Nghymru’. Fodd bynnag, mae’n holl bwysig bod awdurdodau lleol yn datblygu strategaethau effeithiol i sicrhau y targedir grantiau yn effeithiol, y bodlonir y galw yn lleol a bod y rheini sydd â’r angen mwyaf yn cael blaenoriaeth a thegwch.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 127

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 127

Daw hynny â chyfarfod heddiw i ben. Diolchaf i’r Aelodau a gyfrannodd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg.

That brings today’s proceedings to a close. I thank all Members who contributed in Welsh and in English.

Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 1.00 p.m.

The session ended at 1.00 p.m.