Cynulliad Cenedlaethol CymruNational Assembly for Wales · Cyfarfod llawnPlenary sitting
Dydd Iau 15 Mawrth 2001
Thursday 15 March 2001
CynnwysContents
- 4Datganiad gan y LlywyddStatement by the Presiding Officer
- 5Cwestiynau i Ddirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu EconomaiddQuestions to the Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development
- 5Hybu Diwydiannau BrodorolPromoting Indigenous Industries
- 7Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol LlangollenLlangollen International Musical Eisteddfod
- 9Blaenau Cymoedd Tawe ac AmanUpper Swansea and Amman Valley
- 11Adolygiad y Cynulliad o Gymorth BusnesThe Assembly Review of Business Support
- 13Cynhadledd y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd ar Reolaeth Ddatganoledig y Cronfeydd StrwythurolThe European Commission Conference on the Decentralised Management of Structural Funds
- 14Cwestiynau ar Gyllid i’r Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a ChymunedauQuestions on Finance to the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities
- 14Argymhellion y Swyddfa Archwilio Genedlaethol ar Forglawdd Bae CaerdyddThe National Audit Office’s Recommendations on the Cardiff Bay Barrage
- 16Strategaeth Gyllidebol ar gyfer Treuliau AnnisgwylThe Budget Strategy for Unexpected Contingencies
- 17Setliadau Llywodraeth LeolLocal Government Settlements
- 18Amddiffynfeydd rhag LlifogyddFlood Defences
- 19Cynnal Llwybrau CyhoeddusMaintaining Public Footpaths
- 20Arian wedi’i Gario Ymlaen dan Drefniadau Hyblyg Diwedd y FlwyddynMoney Carried Forward Under End of Year Flexibility
- 22Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion
- 25Datganiad ar Effaith Clwy’r Traed a’r Genau ar FfermioStatement on the Impact of the Foot and Mouth Disease on Farming
- 50Datganiadau ar Effaith Clwy’r Traed a’r Genau ar DwristiaethStatements on the Impact of Foot and Mouth on Tourism
- 63Datganiad gan y TrefnyddStatement by the Minister for Assembly Business
- 63Datganiad ar Fenter Caffael CymruStatement on the Welsh Procurement Initiative
- 69Cynnig Cyfansawdd: Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn AddysgComposite Motion: Approval of Education Order 1 bleidlais1 vote
- 70Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion 1 bleidlais1 vote
- 71Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Drafft Plaleiddiaid (Lefelau Uchaf y Gweddillion mewn Cnydau, Bwyd a Phorthiant) (Cymru a Lloegr) 2001Approval of the Draft Pesticides (Maximum Residue Levels in Crops, Food and Feeding Stuffs) (England and Wales) Regulations 2001 1 bleidlais1 vote
- 72Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Drafft Cynhyrchion Amddiffyn Planhigion (Diwygio) 2001Approval of the Draft Plant Protection Products (Amendment) Regulations 2001 1 bleidlais1 vote
- 73Cymeradwyo Adroddiadau Blynyddol Llywodraethwyr Ysgol (Cymru) (Diwygio) 2001Approval of the School Governors’ Annual Reports (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2001 2 o bleidleisiau2 votes
- 80Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Addysg (Cofrestru Disgyblion) (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2001Approval of the Education (Pupil Registration) (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2001 2 o bleidleisiau2 votes
- 85Pwynt o DrefnPoint of Order
- 86Dirprwyo Swyddogaethau Deddf Diogelu Anifeiliaid (Diwygio) 2000 i Brif Weinidog CymruDelegation of Functions of the Protection of Animals (Amendment) Act 2000 to the First Minister 2 o bleidleisiau2 votes
- 90Dadl FerShort Debate
PleidleisiauVotes
TrafodionProceedings
Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 9.05 a.m. gyda’r Llywydd yn y Gadair
The Assembly met at 9.05 a.m.with the Presiding Officer in the Chair
Datganiad gan y Llywydd
Statement by the Presiding Officer
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 4
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh and English p. 4
Gwnaf ddatganiad cyn inni gychwyn ar ein busnes arferol.
in Welsh I will make a statement before we start our usual business.
I believe that there is an English-language version of this statement on the Chamberweb.
yn Saesneg Credaf fod fersiwn Saesneg o’r datganiad hwn ar wefan y Siambr.
Fel y crybwyllwyd ddydd Mawrth, cyfarfu’r Diprwy Lywydd a mi â rheolwyr busnes y pleidiau i ddod i ddealltwriaeth ynglŷn â hyd cyfraniadau mewn dadleuon ac ymatebion i ddatganiadau mewn Cyfarfodydd Llawn.
in Welsh As mentioned on Tuesday, the Deputy Presiding Officer and I met with the party business managers to come to an understanding concerning the length of contributions in debates and of responses to statements in Plenary.
Yr ydym wedi cytuno y bydd gan lefaryddion y Llywodraeth 15 munud i agor a chau dadleuon. Bydd modd rhannu’r amser hwn—10 munud i agor a phump i gloi, er enghraifft—ond yr oedd cydsyniad y byddai’n briodol i’r Gweinidogion roi mwy o amser i gloi’r ddadl pan fyddant yn ymateb i’r hyn a ddywedwyd. Mae’r Trefnydd hefyd wedi cytuno y bydd modd lleihau’r amser i 12 munud, os yw amser yn gyfyng.
in Welsh We have agreed that Government spokespeople will have 15 minutes to open and close debates. It will be possible to divide that time—for example, 10 minutes to open and five to close—but there was a consensus that it would be appropriate for Ministers to allow more time for winding up a debate when they respond to what has been said. The Minister for Assembly Business has also agreed that it will be possible to reduce that time to 12 minutes, if time is short.
Mewn dadleuon pleidiau lleiafrifol, ceir eto 15 munud i agor a chau’r dadleuon, yn debyg i’r amser a roddir i lefaryddion y Llywodraeth. Fodd bynnag, disgwyliwn y bydd cyfraniad y Llywodraeth, pan gyflwynir safbwynt y Cabinet mewn dadleuon pleidiau lleiafrifol, wedi ei gyfyngu i wyth munud. Eto, byddai’n well gennym pe bai’r cyfraniad hwnnw tua diwedd y ddadl er mwyn ymateb i’r pwyntiau a godwyd, yn hytrach na bod y Llywodraeth yn gwneud datganiad a baratowyd ymlaen llaw.
in Welsh In minority party debates, there will again be 15 minutes to open and close debates, similar to the time given to Government spokespeople. However, we expect that the Government’s contribution, when the Cabinet’s position is presented in minority party debates, will be restricted to eight minutes. Again, we would prefer that that contribution was made towards the end of the debate in order to respond to points raised, rather than the Government making a prepared statement.
Ym mhob dadl, yn ddiwahân, bydd gan y rhai sydd yn cynnig gwelliannau bum munud, fel a geir ar hyn o bryd yn y Rheolau Sefydlog. Mae hynny yn wir am lefarydd cyntaf pob gwrthblaid sydd heb gyfrannu’n barod, pa un ydynt yn cynnig gwelliannau ai peidio. Diben hynny yw i atal Aelodau rhag teimlo bod yn rhaid iddynt gyflwyno gwelliannau er mwyn iddynt gael siarad am bum munud. Gallai’r amser hwnnw gael ei leihau i dri neu bedwar munud drwy gytundeb, os yw amser yn pwyso.
in Welsh In every debate, without exception, those proposing amendments will have five minutes, as is currently the case in Standing Orders. That applies to the first speaker of every opposition party that has not already contributed, whether they are proposing an amendment or not. This is in order to prevent Members from feeling that they must propose amendments in order to be allowed to speak for five minutes. That time could be shortened to three or four minutes through agreement, if time is pressing.
Byddaf i neu’r Dirprwy Lywydd yn cyhoeddi’r amser ar gyfer cyfraniadau ar ddechrau pob dadl fel y bydd y siaradwyr yn gwybod ymlaen llaw am faint y cânt siarad. Pum munud yw’r hyd arferol, ac ni fyddwn yn lleihau’r un cyfraniad i lai na thri munud, gan y teimlwn y byddai hynny’n annheg. Byddaf yn caniatáu cyn lleied o amser ag sydd yn bosibl am ‘anafiadau’ os bydd Aelodau yn ildio i ymyrraethau mewn areithiau.
in Welsh The Deputy Presiding Officer or myself will announce the time available for contributions at the beginning of every debate so that speakers know in advance for how long they may speak. Five minutes is the usual time, and we will not limit any contribution to less than three minutes, as we feel that that would be unfair. I will allow as little time as possible for ‘injury time’ if Members give way to interventions during speeches.
O ran datganiadau Gweinidogion, bydd caniatâd i lefaryddion pob grŵp gwleidyddol gyflwyno rhagymadrodd byr a chryno. Ar ôl hynny, disgwylir i gwestiynau fod yn gryno. Yn yr un modd, disgwylir i gwestiynau atodol fod yn gryno yn ystod amser cwestiynau, ac i’r atebion fod mor gryno ag sydd yn bosibl.
in Welsh As regards Ministers’ statements, speakers from every political group will be permitted to present a short and succinct preamble. After that, questions are expected to be succinct. Similarly, it is expected that supplementary questions will be brief during question time, and that the answers will be as succinct as possible.
Mae gan Aelodau gyfrifoldeb i reoli hyd eu cyfraniadau. Yr wyf am i’r Cynulliad hwn weithredu yn effeithiol, i osod arfer dda ac esiampl i sefydliadau eraill, na wnaf eu henwi. Ni ddymunaf ddefnyddio fy motwm coch i dorri ar draws yn rhy aml a disgwyliaf i Aelodau arfer hunan ddisgyblaeth.
in Welsh Members have a responsibility to control the length of their contributions. I want this Assembly to operate effectively, to set good practice and example to other institutions, which I will not name. I do not wish to use my red button too frequently to interrupt and I expect Members to exercise self-discipline.
Apeliaf hefyd ar Aelodau i adael inni wybod wrth y ddesg lywyddu ymlaen llaw pan ddymunant siarad mewn dadl er mwyn inni ddod i benderfyniad call ynglŷn ag amseru a rhoi gwybod iddynt. Fodd bynnag, derbyniaf na all Aelodau roi gwybod ymlaen llaw pan fydd materion o ddiddordeb arbennig, personol, etholaethol neu ranbarthol yn codi mewn dadl. Diolch am eich cydweithrediad, a chawn weld sut y bydd hynny yn gweithio, gan ddechrau heddiw.
in Welsh I also appeal to Members to let us know in advance at the presiding desk when they wish to speak in a debate so that we can come to a sensible decision about timing and let them know. However, I accept that Members cannot give prior notice when issues of special, personal, electoral or regional interest arise in a debate. Thank you for your co-operation, and we shall see how it works, beginning today.
Cwestiynau i Ddirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd
Questions to the Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development
Hybu Diwydiannau Brodorol
Promoting Indigenous Industries
Will the Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development make a statement on any discussions he has held to promote our indigenous industries? (OAQ10340)
A wnaiff Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd ddatganiad ar unrhyw drafodaethau y mae wedi’u cael i hybu ein diwydiannau brodorol? (OAQ10340)
Michael German The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development spoken in English p. 6
Michael German Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6
Identifying and meeting the needs of indigenous industries in Wales are key priorities of the Assembly and have been the subject of much discussion with many parties. We are currently seeking views on a range of business support and economic development matters via the national economic development strategy consultation paper and the Economic Development Committee’s review of business, which has now been published for consultation. These will consider a range of issues, including the promotion of indigenous businesses with the relevant stakeholders.
Mae nodi a diwallu anghenion diwydiannau brodorol yng Nghymru yn flaenoriaethau allweddol i’r Cynulliad ac yn destun llawer o drafodaethau gyda nifer o bartïon. Yr ydym wrthi ar hyn o bryd yn gofyn am safbwyntiau ar amrywiaeth o faterion cymorth busnes a datblygu economaidd drwy bapur ymgynghorol y strategaeth datblygu economaidd genedlaethol ac arolwg busnes y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd, a gyhoeddwyd erbyn hyn i ymgynghori arno. Byddant yn ystyried amrywiaeth o faterion, gan gynnwys hybu busnesau brodorol gyda’r budd-ddeiliaid perthnasol.
Will you acknowledge that indigenous industries will benefit greatly from Objective 1 funding? Do you also agree that the events of recent days have shown that Objective 1 is in crisis and that your administration of this vital policy is a disaster?
A gydnabyddwch y bydd diwydiannau brodorol yn elwa’n fawr ar arian Amcan 1? A gytunwch hefyd bod digwyddiadau’r diwrnodau diwethaf wedi dangos bod Amcan 1 mewn argyfwng a bod eich ffordd o weinyddu’r polisi hanfodol hwn yn drychinebus?
The politicking goes on as I expected. However, over £130 million of Objective 1 money in capital and revenue projects has been paid. Recently, I opened a factory in Ynys Môn, funded through Objective 1. People are now working in that factory as a result of that funding. You fail to recognise that if a monitoring committee is to manage partnership in Wales, that committee must make its own decisions. If you wish me to take control and to manage the work of the monitoring committee by direction, perhaps you could make your views clear.
Â’r gwleidydda yn ei flaen fel y disgwyliais. Fodd bynnag, talwyd dros £130 miliwn o arian Amcan 1 i brosiectau cyfalaf a refeniw. Yn ddiweddar, agorais ffatri ar Ynys Môn, a ariannwyd drwy Amcan 1. Erbyn hyn mae pobl yn gweithio yn y ffatri honno o ganlyniad i’r arian hwnnw. Methwch â chydnabod os oes pwyllgor monitro yn rheoli partneriaeth yng Nghymru, bod yn rhaid i’r pwyllgor hwnnw wneud ei benderfyniadau ei hun. Os ydych am imi gymryd cyfrifoldeb a rheoli gwaith y pwyllgor monitro drwy gyfarwyddyd, efallai y gallech egluro eich safbwyntiau.
One major indigenous industry in Wales is under dire threat at present. Do you agree that we are faced with a fight for the existence of the steel industry in Wales and the UK? If the heavy end goes at Llanwern, for example, many informed people expect the whole works to be under threat a couple of years down the line with knock-on effects for the rest of the industry.
Mae un diwydiant brodorol pwysig yng Nghymru o dan fygythiad enbyd ar hyn o bryd. A gytunwch ein bod yn wynebu brwydr i sicrhau bodolaeth y diwydiant dur yng Nghymru a’r DU? Os aiff y pen trwm yn Llanwern, er enghraifft, mae llawer o bobl hyddysg o’r farn y bydd y gwaith cyfan o dan fygythiad ymhen ychydig flynyddoedd gyda sgîl-effeithiau i weddill y diwydiant.
If the heavy end of Llanwern disappeared, the rolling mills and the sheet steel at the far end would be under threat in future years because of the need to import slab steel from other places and to transport these heavy items around the country. That reflects a poor economic management plan. I urge Corus, even at this late stage, to consider the unions’ proposals for the protection of that business, and to recognise that even if it loses money, that is a poor reflection on management and Corus’s inability to see a way through for the future of steel making in Wales and in Britain. There is no doubt that it is shrinking the business when there is a demand for exporting steel from this country. That is no way to secure the long-term future of steel making. Corus has taken a short-sighted. The Assembly recognises that.
Pe diflannai pen trwm Llanwern, byddai bygythiad i’r melinau rholio a’r dur dalennog yn y pen pellaf o dan fygythiad yn y dyfodol oherwydd yr angen i fewnforio slabiau dur o wledydd eraill ac i gludo’r eitemau trwm hyn o amgylch y wlad. Mae hynny’n adlewyrchu cynllun rheoli economaidd gwael. Erfyniaf ar Corus, hyd yn oed mor hwyr â hyn, i ystyried cynigion yr undebau ar gyfer diogelu’r busnes hwnnw, a chydnabod hyd yn oed os bydd yn colli arian, y bydd hynny’n adlewyrchiad gwael ar y rheolwyr ac yn dangos anallu Corus i ddiogelu dyfodol cynhyrchu dur yng Nghymru ac ym Mhrydain. Nid oes unrhyw amheuaeth bod y busnes yn crebachu pan fo galw i allforio dur o’r wlad hon. Nid dyna’r ffordd i sicrhau dyfodol tymor hir cynhyrchu dur. Nid yw Corus wedi ystyried y tymor hir. Mae’r Cynulliad yn cydnabod hynny.
Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen
Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod
Will the Minister make a statement on the future of the Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod and its importance to tourism in north-east Wales? (OAQ10294)
A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar ddyfodol Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen a’i phwysigrwydd i dwristiaeth yng ngogledd-ddwyrain Cymru? (OAQ10294)
The Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod is invaluable for enriching Wales’s cultural life by allowing us to experience other cultures at first hand and by promoting Wales’s profile abroad. The Eisteddfod has great potential for generating economic activity in Llangollen and further afield. It attracts about 2,000 overseas competitors every year, and a significant number of visitors both from Wales and abroad. I understand that the Arts Council of Wales, Wales Tourist Board and the Eisteddfod have recently agreed to jointly fund a study to look at the Eisteddfod’s long-term future, for the next 10 years at least. An application for an Arts for All lottery award has also been submitted for the 2002 festival, which will be decided in May 2001.
Mae Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen yn amhrisiadwy er mwyn cyfoethogi bywyd diwylliannol Cymru drwy roi profiad uniongyrchol o ddiwylliannau eraill a thrwy hyrwyddo proffil Cymru dramor. Mae potensial mawr gan yr Eisteddfod i gynhyrchu gweithgarwch economaidd yn Llangollen a thu hwnt. Mae’n denu tua 2,000 o gystadleuwyr o dramor bob blwyddyn, a nifer sylweddol o ymwelwyr o Gymru a thramor. Deallaf fod Cyngor Celfyddydau Cymru, Bwrdd Croeso Cymru a’r Eisteddfod wedi cytuno’n ddiweddar i gydariannu astudiaeth i ystyried dyfodol tymor hir yr Eisteddfod, ar gyfer y 10 mlynedd nesaf o leiaf. Cyflwynwyd cais ar gyfer dyfarniad loteri Celfyddydau i Bawb hefyd ar gyfer gŵyl 2002. Penderfynir ar hynny ym Mai 2001.
Given the financial support announced by Edwina last week for the major football events over the next three years in Cardiff in recognition of their wider benefits to Wales’s profile, will the Minister consider direct aid to Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod in recognition of its wider benefits to the economy of north-east Wales?
O gofio’r cymorth ariannol a gyhoeddwyd gan Edwina yr wythnos diwethaf ar gyfer y digwyddiadau pêl-droed mawr dros y tair blynedd nesaf yng Nghaerdydd er mwyn cydnabod eu buddiannau ehangach i broffil Cymru, a ystyria’r Gweinidog gymorth uniongyrchol i Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen er mwyn cydnabod ei buddiannau ehangach i economi gogledd-ddwyrain Cymru?
Denbighshire County Council recently had a meeting with the Arts Council of Wales, the Wales Tourist Board and the Eisteddfod to consider the Eisteddfod’s long-term future. We want to see this event sustained in Wales. The options for all-year-round use of the field were considered because income would be maximised if the site were used more frequently. The Arts Council of Wales does not currently fund the Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod. However, the Eisteddfod has now made a direct, formal approach for revenue funding, which will be considered by the Arts Council of Wales. The Arts Council of Wales and the Wales Tourist Board are looking at this issue and the results of the feasibility study, which I talked to you about, will be known in the next few months.
Yn ddiweddar cynhaliodd Cyngor Sir Ddinbych gyfarfod gyda Chyngor Celfyddydau Cymru, Bwrdd Croeso Cymru a’r Eisteddfod i ystyried dyfodol tymor hir yr Eisteddfod. Yr ydym am weld y digwyddiad hwn yn cael ei gadw yng Nghymru. Ystyriwyd yr opsiynau ar gyfer defnyddio’r maes drwy gydol y flwyddyn gan y byddai’r incwm uchaf posibl yn cael ei sicrhau pe defnyddiwyd y safle yn amlach. Ar hyn o bryd nid yw Cyngor Celfyddydau Cymru yn ariannu Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen. Fodd bynnag, mae’r Eisteddfod yn awr wedi gwneud cais ffurfiol, uniongyrchol am arian refeniw, a gaiff ei ystyried gan Gyngor Celfyddydau Cymru. Mae Cyngor Celfyddydau Cymru a Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn ymchwilio i’r mater hwn a bydd canlyniadau’r astudiaeth dichonoldeb, y soniais amdani, yn hysbys yn ystod yr ychydig fisoedd nesaf.
Sefydlwyd Eisteddfod Gydwladol Gerddorol Llangollen yn 1947, yng nghysgod yr Ail Ryfel Byd. Yr roedd yr Eisteddfod yn ymgais gan genedl fechan i ddod â phobl y byd at ei gilydd mewn heddwch a chytgord. A gytunwch y byddai’n dangos diffyg menter a hyder pe na byddai Llywodraeth Cymru yn sicrhau dyfodol yr achlysur pwysig ac unigryw hwn?
The Llangollen International Musical Eisteddfod was established in 1947, in the shadow of the Second World War. The Eisteddfod was an attempt by a small nation to bring the people of the world together in peace and harmony. Do you agree that it would show a lack of enterprise and confidence if the Government of Wales did not ensure the future of this important and unique event?
The deeper question, which I think that you are raising, is how we should direct Assembly sponsored public bodies to invest and spend their money. Discussions between the Arts Council of Wales, the Wales Tourist Board, the local authority and the Eisteddfod itself are ongoing. I am sure that there will be a positive outcome, because, as you rightly say, this event is proudly steeped in Welsh tradition. The Eisteddfod is also a good stage for Wales to promote tourism internationally.
Y cwestiwn dyfnach, y credaf eich bod yn ei godi, yw sut y dylem gyfeirio cyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad i fuddsoddi a gwario eu harian. Mae trafodaethau yn mynd rhagddynt rhwng Cyngor Celfyddydau Cymru, Bwrdd Croeso Cymru, yr awdurdod lleol a’r Eisteddfod ei hun. Yr wyf yn siŵr y ceir canlyniad cadarnhaol, oherwydd, fel y nodwyd yn briodol gennych, mae’r digwyddiad hwn yn rhan bwysig o draddodiad Cymru. Mae’r Eisteddfod hefyd yn llwyfan da i Gymru hyrwyddo twristiaeth yn rhyngwladol.
Blaenau Cymoedd Tawe ac Aman
Upper Swansea and Amman Valley
What steps has the Minister taken with Neath Port Talbot County Borough Council and its associated bodies to make progress in the development of an effective economic strategy in the Upper Swansea and Amman Valley? (OAQ10302)
Pa gamau y mae’r Gweinidog wedi’u cymryd gyda Chyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Castell-nedd Port Talbot a’i gyrff cysylltiedig i symud ymlaen wrth ddatblygu strategaeth economaidd effeithiol ym mlaenau cymoedd Tawe ac Aman? (OAQ10302)
On 9 February I launched the consultation paper on the national economic development strategy. This important document sets out a number of policy priorities for the whole of Wales. The final document will set out a strategy for the whole of Wales, but different parts of the country should develop their own visions for their long-term future within the context of the national strategy. In terms of the Neath Port Talbot area, a greater proportion of both the Assembly’s and the WDA’s development programmes are being targeted to support companies in west Wales and the Valleys, and this, together with our Objective 1 plans, will help to foster an economic environment conducive to job creation in those areas.
Ar 9 Chwefror lansiais y papur ymgynghorol ar y strategaeth datblygu economaidd genedlaethol. Noda’r ddogfen bwysig hon nifer o flaenoriaethau polisi ar gyfer Cymru gyfan. Bydd y ddogfen derfynol yn nodi strategaeth ar gyfer Cymru gyfan, ond dylai gwahanol rannau o’r wlad ddatblygu eu gweledigaethau eu hunain ar gyfer eu dyfodol tymor hir o fewn cyd-destun y strategaeth genedlaethol. Yn nhermau ardal Castell-nedd Port Talbot, targedir cyfran fwy o raglenni datblygu’r Cynulliad a’r WDA i gynorthwyo cwmnïau yng ngorllewin Cymru a’r Cymoedd, a bydd hyn, ynghyd â’n cynlluniau Amcan 1, yn helpu i feithrin amgylchedd economaidd sydd yn debygol o greu swyddi yn yr ardaloedd hynny.
I am concerned. High unemployment, severe job losses and bank closures make the situation in these valleys worthy of the highest priority. Welcome though the current progress is, what further action will you take to encourage the WDA to develop new employment in these areas?
Yr wyf yn bryderus. Yn sgîl diweithdra uchel, colli llawer o swyddi a chau banciau, dylid rhoi’r flaenoriaeth uchaf i’r sefyllfa yn y cymoedd hyn. Er y croesawn y cynnydd cyfredol, pa gamau pellach a gymerwch i annog y WDA i ddatblygu cyflogaeth newydd yn yr ardaloedd hyn?
I understand that the WDA is active, with the local authority, in considering issues in relation to the area. The Baglan Energy Park, a crucial part of the economic profile, is being jointly developed by BP Chemicals, the WDA, and Neath Port Talbot County Borough Council. The park covers about 1,000 acres, making it one of the biggest single industrial sites in the United Kingdom, with the potential for over 6,000 jobs. Development of the energy park is progressing and it will receive Objective 1 money. The first factory has been completed and the tenant has moved in. Neath Port Talbot County Borough Council has confirmed that it will build the second factory, and the WDA will build the third. The programme is on schedule and the aim is to fill the factories with small and medium-sized enterprises in the area.
Deallaf fod rhan weithredol gan y WDA, gyda’r awdurdod lleol, wrth ystyried materion sydd yn ymwneud â’r ardal. Datblygir Parc Ynni Baglan, rhan hanfodol o’r proffil economaidd, ar y cyd gan BP Chemicals, y WDA, a Chyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Castell-nedd Port Talbot. Mae’r parc yn cwmpasu tua 1,000 o erwau, gan ei wneud yn un o’r safleoedd diwydiannol unigol mwyaf yn y Deyrnas Unedig, gyda’r potensial ar gyfer dros 6,000 o swyddi. Mae’r gwaith o ddatblygu’r parc ynni yn mynd rhagddo a bydd yn derbyn arian Amcan 1. Cwblhawyd y ffatri gyntaf ac mae’r tenant wedi ei meddiannu. Mae Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Castell-nedd Port Talbot wedi cadarnhau y bydd yn adeiladu’r ail ffatri, a bydd y WDA yn adeiladu’r drydedd. Mae’r rhaglen yn cadw at yr amserlen a’r nod yw llanw’r ffatrïoedd â busnesau bach a chanolig eu maint yn yr ardal.
The Swansea and Amman Valley communities, like all communities in Wales, depend on Objective 1 to offer them hope. Is Objective 1 not turning out to be an absolute disaster for the communities that desperately need this support? As the independent task and finish group report called for leadership, why are you seeking to abdicate responsibility? Will you show some leadership on this? Will you also make an urgent statement to Plenary in relation to the leaked letter in which the business community, including the trade unions, threatened to pull out of Objective 1? Is this not a far cry from 20 December 2000, when the Minister was quoted in The Western Mail as saying
Mae cymunedau Abertawe a Chwm Aman, fel pob cymuned yng Nghymru, yn dibynnu ar Amcan 1 i gynnig gobaith iddynt. Onid yw Amcan 1 yn profi’n drychineb llwyr i’r cymunedau sydd ag angen dybryd am y cymorth hwn? Wrth i adroddiad y grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen alw am arweinyddiaeth, pam eich bod chi yn ceisio gwrthod cyfrifoldeb? A ddangoswch rywfaint o arweinyddiaeth yn hyn o beth? A wnewch hefyd ddatganiad brys i’r Cyfarfod Llawn mewn perthynas â’r llythyr a ddatgelwyd yn nodi bygythiad y gymuned fusnes, gan gynnwys yr undebau llafur, i dynnu allan o Amcan 1? Mae hyn ymhell o’r sefyllfa ar 20 Rhagfyr 2000, lle dyfynnodd The Western Mail y Gweinidog yn datgan
‘we have cracked the Objective 1 problem’?
Is it not the case that Objective 1 is turning out to be an absolute disaster?
Onid yw’n wir bod Amcan 1 yn troi’n drychineb llwyr?
Alun Cairns is like a cracked disk that goes click, click, click and endlessly round in circles. The issue is simple. As a partnership in Wales is running the show, we cannot send in a person from outside to direct everyone as to what should happen. I am sure that the last thing that Alun would want me to do is to direct the private sector, the voluntary sector and local authorities. The partnership is responsible for its own affairs. The letter that Alun chose to leak to the media was not the correct letter sent by the Confederation of British Industry. The CBI is angry that an incorrect letter has been leaked. Alun is faced with the difficulty that people now have the right to determine matters for themselves. He does not like that and wants to return to some form of direction of the economy. I am impressed by the turnaround between the far right and the extreme left, in deciding that they want a command economy in Wales.
Mae Alun Cairns yn canu’r un hen diwn gron. Mae’r mater yn syml. Gan mai partneriaeth sydd wrth y llyw yng Nghymru, ni allwn anfon person o’r tu allan i roi cyfarwyddyd i bawb ynghylch yr hyn a ddylai ddigwydd. Yr wyf yn siŵr mai’r peth olaf y byddai Alun am imi ei wneud fyddai rhoi cyfarwyddyd i’r sector preifat, y sector gwirfoddol a’r awdurdodau lleol. Mae’r bartneriaeth yn gyfrifol am ei busnes ei hun. Nid y llythyr cywir a anfonwyd gan Gydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain oedd y llythyr a ddatgelodd Alun i’r cyfryngau. Mae’r Gydffederasiwn yn ddig am fod llythyr anghywir wedi’i ddatgelu. Mae Alun yn wynebu’r anhawster bod gan bobl erbyn hyn yr hawl i benderfynu ar faterion drostynt eu hunain. Nid yw’n hoff o hynny a hoffai ddychwelyd i ryw ffurf ar gyfarwyddo’r economi. Fe’m synnwyd gan y newid safbwynt rhwng y dde eithaf a’r chwith eithaf, wrth benderfynu eu bod am weld economi wedi’i gorchymyn yng Nghymru.
Adolygiad y Cynulliad o Gymorth Busnes
The Assembly Review of Business Support
Will the Minister make a statement on the Assembly’s review of business support, and how its findings will be implemented? (OAQ10291)
A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar adolygiad y Cynulliad o gymorth busnes, a sut y caiff ei ddarganfyddiadau eu gweithredu? (OAQ10291)
By the way, Mike is wrong to say that all unions are on the extreme left. I only wish they were.
Gyda llaw, mae Mike yn anghywir pan ddywed bod pob undeb i’r chwith eithaf. Trueni nad ydynt felly.
The consultation on the review of business support and development services was launched on 4 February and is due to end on 9 May 2001. The review has been distributed to over 350 businesses, agencies and business representative bodies, and is available on the Assembly’s website. We are setting up meetings in each of the four economic regions of Wales to discuss the review. I intend to work quickly, in consultation with the Economic Development Committee, to implement the review and the findings of the consultation.
Lansiwyd yr ymgynghoriad ar yr adolygiad o gymorth busnes a gwasanaethau datblygu ar 4 Chwefror a bwriedir iddo ddod i ben ar 9 Mai 2001. Dosbarthwyd yr adolygiad i dros 350 o fusnesau, asiantaethau a chyrff sydd yn cynrychioli busnesau ac mae ar gael ar wefan y Cynulliad. Yr ydym yn trefnu cyfarfodydd ymhob un o’r pedwar rhanbarth economaidd yng Nghymru i drafod yr adolygiad. Bwriadaf weithio’n gyflym, drwy ymgynghori â’r Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd, i weithredu’r adolygiad a chanfyddiadau’r ymgynghoriad.
We have recently heard that the Wales Tourist Board is providing 12 business support managers throughout Wales. I welcome that, as it is important that we support tourism as well as regulate it. How will tourism business support fit into the common gateway of business support? In light of the current foot and mouth disease crisis, how do you intend to step up support for tourism, particularly in west Wales, where the local economy is heavily dependent on the success of each tourist season?
Clywsom yn ddiweddar fod Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn darparu 12 o reolwyr cymorth busnes ledled Cymru. Croesawaf hynny, gan ei bod yn bwysig inni gynorthwyo twristiaeth yn ogystal â’i reoleiddio. Sut bydd cymorth busnes twristiaeth yn cydweddu â’r porth cymorth busnes cyffredin? Yng ngoleuni’r argyfwng presennol gyda chlwy’r traed a’r genau, sut y bwriadwch gynyddu’r cymorth i dwristiaeth, yn arbennig yng ngorllewin Cymru, lle y mae’r economi leol yn dibynnu’n fawr ar lwyddiant pob tymor twristiaeth?
I will make a statement on the foot and mouth emergency, which will cover tourism support, later in today’s Plenary. This involves short term and longer-term issues. In the longer term, as many tourism businesses are businesses like any other, tourism support will require matched support by other bodies. The Economic Development Committee’s report proposes that there should be a single portal or gateway for initial diagnosis. However, the nature of the support will vary according to the nature of the business. The Wales Tourist Board will need to be closely involved in providing that hands-on support. I welcome the fact that the tourist board now has people in the field offering hands-on support for tourism businesses. We need to improve the quality of the product across Wales. The Wales Tourist Board is aware of the support it must provide in the short term. As I said, I will make a statement later this morning, which I hope will reassure you that this matter is being dealt with expediently.
Gwnaf ddatganiad ar yr argyfwng traed a’r genau, a fydd yn cwmpasu cymorth i dwristiaeth, yn ddiweddarach yn y Cyfarfod Llawn heddiw. Mae hyn yn cynnwys materion tymor byr a thymor hwy. Yn y tymor hwy, gan mai busnesau fel unrhyw fusnes arall yw busnesau twristiaeth, bydd angen cymorth cyfatebol gan gyrff eraill ar gymorth twristiaeth. Cynigia adroddiad y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd y dylid creu un porth ar gyfer diagnosis cychwynnol. Fodd bynnag, bydd natur y cymorth yn amrywio yn ôl natur y busnes. Bydd rhan fawr gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru i’w chwarae wrth ddarparu’r cymorth ymarferol hwnnw. Croesawaf y ffaith bod gan y bwrdd croeso erbyn hyn bobl yn y maes sydd yn cynnig cymorth ymarferol i fusnesau twristiaeth. Mae angen inni wella ansawdd y cynnyrch ledled Cymru. Mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn ymwybodol o’r cymorth y mae’n rhaid iddo ei ddarparu yn y tymor byr. Fel y dywedais, gwnaf ddatganiad yn ddiweddarach y bore yma, gan obeithio y bydd yn rhoi sicrwydd ichi ein bod yn delio’n briodol â’r mater hwn.
Minister, your answer to William Graham’s question 1 did not seem to take sufficient account of the letter to which Alun referred, from the Confederation of British Industry, Chamber Wales, the Federation of Small Businesses, and the Trade Union Congress, and its clear warning on their involvement in Objective 1 and the slow speed in which things are progressing. What steps have you already taken as Minister for Economic Development to convince small businesses and the business sector in general of the importance of the involvement and the voice of businesses in influencing and implementing Objective 1 and the whole economic programme?
Weinidog, yn fy marn i, ni roddodd eich ateb i gwestiwn 1 William Graham ddigon o ystyriaeth i’r llythyr y cyfeiriodd Alun ato, gan Gydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain, Siambr Cymru, y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach, a Chynghrair yr Undebau Llafur a’i rybudd clir ynghylch eu cyfranogiad yn Amcan 1 ac arafwch y cynnydd. Pa gamau yr ydych eisoes wedi’u cymryd fel y Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd i argyhoeddi busnesau bach a’r sector busnes yn gyffredinol o bwysigrwydd cyfranogiad a llais busnesau wrth ddylanwadu a gweithredu Amcan 1 a’r rhaglen economaidd gyfan?
I am sure, Brian, that you will have read the task and finish group report and noted that the private sector has accepted it and now has a seat at all the relevant tables. The key matter in the letter is one that has to be addressed by the Programme Monitoring Committee. It has not met to consider the letter. It would be inappropriate for me to take away the authority of that Programme Monitoring Committee and say that it does not have any power and authority to make determinations for itself. What is the purpose of having a Programme Monitoring Committee if it cannot investigate the matters for which it is responsible?
Yr wyf yn siŵr, Brian, eich bod wedi darllen adroddiad y grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen a’ch bod wedi nodi bod y sector preifat wedi’i dderbyn a bod ganddo bellach sedd ar yr holl fyrddau perthnasol. Rhaid i’r Pwyllgor Monitro Rhaglenni ymdrin â’r mater allweddol yn y llythyr. Ni chynhaliwyd cyfarfod eto i ystyried y llythyr. Byddai’n amhriodol imi ddiddymu awdurdod y Pwyllgor Monitro Rhaglenni a dweud nad oes ganddo unrhyw bŵer ac awdurdod i wneud penderfyniadau drosto’i hun. Beth yw pwrpas cael Pwyllgor Monitro Rhaglenni os na all ymchwilio i’r materion y mae’n gyfrifol amdanynt?
The wider issue of how the private sector engages with the Assembly is a matter that has been taken on board by the review of the National Assembly’s procedure. The private sector gave a presentation to that review, which the Presiding Officer chairs. As you know, at that meeting I raised the issue and informed it of the proposal for a private sector office. That will allow the private sector to engage with Government in Wales at all levels. That matter is being progressed and discussed with all the relevant partners and will come to fruition in the near future.
Mae mater ehangach cysylltiad rhwng y sector preifat a’r Cynulliad yn fater a ystyriwyd gan adolygiad o weithdrefn y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol. Rhoddodd y sector preifat gyflwyniad i’r adolygiad hwnnw, y mae’r Llywydd yn gadeirydd arno. Fel y gwyddoch, yn y cyfarfod hwnnw codais y mater a’i hysbysu o’r bwriad i gael swyddfa sector preifat. Bydd hynny’n caniatáu i’r sector preifat gysylltu â’r Llywodraeth yng Nghymru ar bob lefel. Caiff y mater hwnnw ei ddatblygu a’i drafod gyda’r holl bartneriaid perthnasol a bydd yn dwyn ffrwyth yn y dyfodol agos.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 13
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13
In view of the time taken to respond to these questions, I will only allow one supplementary question on question 5.
O ystyried yr amser a gymerwyd i ymateb i’r cwestiynau hyn, dim ond un cwestiwn atodol a ganiateir gennyf ar gwestiwn 5.
Cynhadledd y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd ar Reolaeth Ddatganoledig y Cronfeydd Strwythurol
The European Commission Conference on the Decentralised Management of Structural Funds
Was the National Assembly represented at the European Commission conference on ‘The sharing of responsibilities in the decentralised management of the structural funds’ and will the Minister report on its relevance for Wales? (OAQ10350)
A gynrychiolwyd y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yng nghynhadledd y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd ar ‘Rhannu cyfrifoldebau yn rheolaeth ddatganoledig y cronfeydd strwythurol’ ac a wnaiff y Gweinidog roi adroddiad ar ei phwysigrwydd i Gymru? (OAQ10350)
Officials from the Welsh European Funding Office attended the European Conference on ‘The sharing of responsibilities for the decentralised management of the structural funds’. The head of the European regional development fund division, the head of corporate planning and services division and the head of the financial control branch were present. It was important for those directly responsible for implementing the programmes in Wales to be well-informed about the implications of the new regulations.
Mynychodd swyddogion o Swyddfa Cyllid Ewropeaidd Cymru y Gynhadledd Ewropeaidd ar ‘Rhannu cyfrifoldebau yn rheolaeth ddatganoledig y cronfeydd strwythurol’. Yr oedd pennaeth is-adran y gronfa datblygu rhanbarthol Ewropeaidd, pennaeth yr is-adran cynllunio a gwasanaethau corfforaethol a phennaeth y gangen rheolaeth ariannol yn bresennol. Yr oedd yn bwysig i’r rheini â chyfrifoldeb uniongyrchol dros weithredu’r rhaglenni yng Nghymru fod yn hyddysg am oblygiadau’r rheoliadau newydd.
What lessons should we learn from that conference and how do you intend those lessons to trickle down to the people who are trying to implement the structural funds on the ground?
Pa wersi y dylem eu dysgu o’r gynhadledd honno a sut y bwriadwch ledaenu’r gwersi hynny i’r bobl sydd yn ceisio gweithredu’r cronfeydd strwythurol ar lawr gwlad?
The issues discussed at that conference were the respective responsibilities of the European Commission and the member states in terms of monitoring and financial management of community assistance, the system of financial controls, the evaluation of performance and the legal and financial rules surrounding the projects. The conference also reflected on best practice. All those matters will be reported to the monitoring committees, of which there will be eight when we are fully geared up, by the Welsh European Funding Office.
Cyfrifoldebau perthnasol y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd a’r aelod-wladwriaethau yn nhermau monitro a rheolaeth ariannol cymorth cymunedol, y system o reolaethau ariannol, arfarnu perfformiad a’r rheolau cyfreithiol ac ariannol sydd ynghlwm wrth y prosiectau a drafodwyd yn y gynhadledd honno. Ystyriodd y gynhadledd hefyd arfer gorau. Cyflwynir adroddiad ar y materion hynny i’r pwyllgorau monitro—wyth ohonynt pan fyddwn yn gwbl weithredol—gan Swyddfa Cyllid Ewropeaidd Cymru.
Cwestiynau ar Gyllid i’r Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau
Questions on Finance to the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities
Argymhellion y Swyddfa Archwilio Genedlaethol ar Forglawdd Bae Caerdydd
The National Audit Office’s Recommendations on the Cardiff Bay Barrage
Does the Minister intend to review the Assembly’s approach to risk management strategies to take on board the recommendations in the recent National Audit Office report on the Cardiff Bay Barrage? (OAQ10313)
A yw’r Gweinidog yn bwriadu adolygu’r modd y mae’r Cynulliad yn ymdrin â strategaethau rheoli risg gyda golwg ar weithredu’r argymhellion yn adroddiad diweddar y Swyddfa Archwilio Genedlaethol ar Forglawdd Bae Caerdydd? (OAQ10313)
Edwina Hart The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities spoken in English p. 14
Edwina Hart Y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14
The Cabinet has carefully considered the Audit Committee’s report on the Cardiff Bay Barrage, which was published on 15 February 2001, and, under Standing Order No. 12, has responded to the Committee today. The Cabinet response will be available on the intranet and it will be for the Audit Committee to consider the full response. On the general issue of risk management, following the issue of the Turnbull report, the Parliament in England and the devolved administrations are committed to the development of risk management strategies by 31 March 2003 at the latest.
Ystyriodd y Cabinet adroddiad y Pwyllgor Archwilio ar Forglawdd Bae Caerdydd, a gyhoeddwyd ar 15 Chwefror 2001, yn ofalus, ac, o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 12, ymatebodd i’r Pwyllgor heddiw. Bydd ymateb y Cabinet ar gael ar y fewnrwyd a chyfrifoldeb y Pwyllgor Archwilio fydd ystyried yr ymateb llawn. O ran y mater cyffredinol o reoli risgiau, yn dilyn cyhoeddi adroddiad Turnbull, mae’r Senedd yn Lloegr a’r gweinyddiaethau datganoledig yn ymrwymedig i ddatblygu strategaethau rheoli risgiau erbyn 31 Mawrth 2003 fan bellaf.
As the report indicates, the present in-house system of financing such large-scale projects as the Wales Millennium Centre does not give us sufficient guarantee of staying within budget and on time. Will you urgently consider an alternative, such as employing expert private firms with proven track records, to save millions of taxpayers’ money?
Fel y noda’r adroddiad, ni rydd y system fewnol bresennol o ariannu prosiectau mawr fel Canolfan Mileniwm Cymru ddigon o sicrwydd y byddwn yn aros o fewn y gyllideb ac yn ei gwblhau ar amser. A ystyriwch, ar fyrder, ddewis amgen, megis cyflogi cwmnïau preifat arbenigol ag enw da, i arbed miliynau o arian trethdalwyr?
I will answer your question in two parts. As for the projects in which the Assembly is directly involved, arrangements are in place in many areas to address identified risks and the Assembly is developing a comprehensive risk management strategy framework. As for Wales Millennium Centre Limited, which is a private company that is looking to the public sector for support in its development, you will know that Jenny Randerson, as the Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language, is trying to get some clarity on the capital costs and on the concerns raised by all parties about the revenue implications for the centre.
Atebaf eich cwestiwn mewn dwy ran. O ran y prosiectau y mae’r Cynulliad yn ymwneud yn uniongyrchol â hwy, mae trefniadau ar waith mewn sawl maes i ymdrin â risgiau a nodwyd ac mae’r Cynulliad wrthi’n datblygu fframwaith strategaeth cynhwysfawr i reoli risgiau. O ran Canolfan Mileniwm Cymru Cyfyngedig, sydd yn gwmni preifat sydd yn edrych am gymorth i’w datblygu gan y sector cyhoeddus, gwyddoch fod Jenny Randerson, fel y Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg, yn ceisio cael rhywfaint o eglurder ynglŷn â’r costau cyfalaf a’r pryderon a godwyd gan bob plaid ynghylch y goblygiadau refeniw ar gyfer y ganolfan.
Given that the target to achieve fresh water impoundment in Cardiff Bay, 1 April, is only two weeks away, what news do you have on that? As Cardiff City and County Council, rather than Thames Water, was appointed to maintain the barrage in the bay, can you confirm that the expected £3 million saving will be made and that the work involved is largely benefiting local firms and their staff?
O gofio mai dim ond pythefnos sydd tan ddyddiad y targed ar gyfer cronni dŵr croyw ym Morglawdd Caerdydd, sef 1 Ebrill, pa newyddion sydd gennych ar hynny? Gan mai Cyngor Dinas a Sir Caerdydd, yn hytrach na Thames Water, a benodwyd i gynnal a chadw’r morglawdd yn y bae, a allwch gadarnhau y gwneir yr arbediad disgwyliedig o £3 miliwn a bod cwmnïau lleol a’u staff yn elwa’n fawr ar y gwaith cysylltiedig?
I am responsible for matters related to risk management. I do not have detail on the framework regarding Cardiff Bay, as it is not within my portfolio.
Yr wyf yn gyfrifol am faterion sydd yn ymwneud â rheoli risgiau. Nid oes gennyf fanylion am y fframwaith sydd yn gysylltiedig â Bae Caerdydd, gan nad yw’n rhan o’m portffolio.
Do you agree that the Cardiff Bay Barrage project has been successful for the whole of Wales and do you believe that for the whole of Wales to benefit one of the Welsh Development Agency’s strategic objectives should be to target Cardiff Bay and use it as a magnet to attract inward investment to benefit all of Wales?
A gytunwch y bu prosiect Morglawdd Bae Caerdydd yn llwyddiant i Gymru gyfan, ac a ydych o’r farn, er mwyn i Gymru gyfan elwa, y dylai amcanion strategol Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru gynnwys gwneud Bae Caerdydd yn darged a’i ddefnyddio fel magned i ddenu mewnfuddsoddiad er budd Cymru gyfan?
I do not want to stray into the portfolio of the Minister for Economic Development in responding to Alun’s comments on the WDA. However, I agree that the development of Cardiff Bay has been an excellent example of marketing Wales to the world; the Assembly is located in the bay and if the Wales Millennium Centre project were established, it would be useful in boosting Cardiff’s image. There is no doubt that there has been a revamp in the bay that will directly benefit Wales in the long term.
Nid wyf am grwydro i bortffolio’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd wrth ymateb i sylwadau Alun Cairns ar y WDA. Fodd bynnag, cytunaf y bu datblygu Bae Caerdydd yn enghraifft ardderchog o farchnata Cymru i’r byd; lleolir y Cynulliad yn y bae a phe sefydlwyd prosiect Canolfan Mileniwm Cymru, byddai’n ddefnyddiol wrth hybu delwedd Caerdydd. Nid oes unrhyw amheuaeth y bydd y gweddnewidiad yn y bae o fudd uniongyrchol i Gymru yn y tymor hir.
Strategaeth Gyllidebol ar gyfer Treuliau Annisgwyl
The Budget Strategy for Unexpected Contingencies
What budget strategy is followed to cater for unexpected contingencies? (OAQ10328)
Pa strategaeth gyllidebol a ddilynir ar gyfer ymdrin â threuliau annisgwyl? (OAQ10328)
The Assembly has made provision for a reserve in 2002-03 and 2003-04 that can be drawn on to meet unplanned pressures.
Mae gan y Cynulliad gronfa wrth gefn ar gyfer 2002-03 a 2003-04 y gellir ei defnyddio i gwrdd â phwysau na chynlluniwyd ar eu cyfer.
Is it not the case that the Assembly’s budget is too limited to adequately deal with crises in Wales such as the grave situation facing agriculture and tourism and the future position of steel, if Corus continues with its present stance, and that substantial UK Treasury funding will be required?
Onid yw’n wir bod cyllideb y Cynulliad yn rhy gyfyngedig i ymdrin yn ddigonol ag argyfyngau yng Nghymru fel y sefyllfa ddifrifol sydd yn wynebu amaethyddiaeth a thwristiaeth a sefyllfa’r diwydiant dur yn y dyfodol—os glyna Corus at ei safbwynt presennol—ac y bydd angen swm sylweddol o arian gan Drysorlys y DU?
In terms of the massive agricultural crisis affecting the whole of the United Kingdom, I am sure that the UK Government will deal with that and that if measures are brought forward, it would be a matter for the Treasury to fund them. I do not want to comment on the steel crisis in advance of the discussions that trade unions may have on what might happen in the future. We will make the provision that we are able to make in Wales. It is a matter for central Government if it intends to add to that provision.
Yn nhermau’r argyfwng amaethyddol enfawr sydd yn effeithio ar y Deyrnas Unedig gyfan, yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd Llywodraeth y DU yn delio â hynny ac os cyflwynir mesurau, mater i’r Trysorlys y byddai eu hariannu. Nid wyf am wneud sylwadau ar yr argyfwng dur cyn y trafodaethau y gallai’r undebau llafur eu cynnal ar yr hyn a allai ddigwydd yn y dyfodol. Byddwn yn darparu’r hyn a allwn yng Nghymru. Cyfrifoldeb y Llywodraeth ganolog yw penderfynu a yw’n bwriadu ychwanegu at y ddarpariaeth honno.
Yn dilyn ymlaen o hynny, a wnewch chi sicrhau os a phan y bydd galw am arian ar gael i gwrdd â goblygiadau clwy’r traed a’r genau yng Nghymru y byddwch yn gweithio gyda Mike German a Carwyn Jones i sicrhau bod yr arian i ddigolleu a rhoi hwb i’r economi wledig yn ychwanegol i’r bloc Cymreig? A fyddwch yn pwyso am hynny oddi wrth Trysorlys y Deyrnas Gyfunol?
Following on from that, will you ensure that, if and when money is called for to deal with the implications of foot and mouth disease in Wales, you will work with Mike German and Carwyn Jones to ensure that money to compensate and stimulate the rural economy will be additional to the Welsh block? Will you press for that from the UK Treasury?
The issues of the implications of the outbreak for tourism and agriculture are being discussed. I will certainly support my colleagues, Mike German and Carwyn Jones, in any representations that they make.
Yr ydym wrthi’n trafod goblygiadau’r sefyllfa i dwristiaeth ac amaethyddiaeth. Byddaf yn sicr yn cefnogi fy nghyd-Aelodau, Mike German a Carwyn Jones, o ran unrhyw sylwadau a wneir ganddynt.
Nick Bourne The Leader of the Welsh Conservatives spoken in English p. 17
Nick Bourne Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17
In relation to the foot and mouth outbreak, it is vital that we receive additional funds. Can you tell us how ‘observer status’, or second-class status, as it seems to me, on the rural taskforce will translate into action? Who will represent us on the taskforce? What case will be put for the National Assembly for extra funds for tourism and farming, not just for compensation but to promote both sectors when this virus is under control?
O ran clwy’r traed a’r genau, mae’n hanfodol ein bod yn derbyn arian ychwanegol. A allwch ddweud wrthym sut y bydd ‘statws arsylwr’, neu statws ail ddosbarth, fel yr ymddengys i mi, ar y tasglu gwledig yn troi’n gamau gweithredu? Pwy fydd yn ein cynrychioli ar y tasglu? Pa achos a gyflwynir ar ran y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol er mwyn cael arian ychwanegol ar gyfer twristiaeth a ffermio, nid yn unig ar gyfer iawndal ond i hyrwyddo’r ddau sector pan fydd y firws dan reolaeth?
I am not involved with this taskforce’s arrangements, but I understand that it was convened for England and that other Whitehall departments are represented on it. I also understand that the Assembly’s Minister for Rural Affairs is considering issues in this context with rural groups.
Nid wyf yn ymwneud â threfniadau’r tasglu hwn, ond deallaf iddo gael ei drefnu ar gyfer Lloegr ac y cynrychiolir adrannau eraill Whitehall arno. Deallaf hefyd fod Gweinidog y Cynulliad dros Faterion Gwledig wrthi’n ystyried materion yn y cyd-destun hwn gyda grwpiau gwledig.
Setliadau Llywodraeth Leol
Local Government Settlements
Will the Minister make a statement on comparisons in this year’s local government settlements in Wales with the settlements of the preceding five years? (OAQ10285)
A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar y cymariaethau rhwng setliadau eleni ar gyfer llywodraeth leol yng Nghymru a setliadau y pum mlynedd diwethaf? (OAQ10285)
The approval of the Local Government Finance Report for 2001-02 enables us to pay over £3.2 billion in unhypothecated revenue funding to local government. When added to specific grants, Assembly support is to increase by 8 per cent, with an increase in general revenue support of 5.9 per cent. This is the largest increase for 10 years, let alone five.
Mae cymeradwyo’r Adroddiad Cyllid Llywodraeth Leol ar gyfer 2001-02 yn ein galluogi i dalu dros £3.2 biliwn mewn refeniw heb ei bridiannu i lywodraeth leol. O’i ychwanegu at grantiau penodol, bydd cymorth y Cynulliad yn cynyddu 8 y cant, gyda chynnydd mewn cymorth refeniw cyffredinol o 5.9 y cant. Dyma’r cynnydd mwyaf ers 10 mlynedd, heb sôn am bump.
Do you agree that these record increases for local government, combined with the new formula that gives a fairer share to the most needy local authorities in Wales, is evidence of this administration’s commitment to tackling inequality in Wales? Do you agree that only this administration is prepared to vote for such a settlement, unlike the opposition parties, which have consistently not supported it?
A gytunwch fod y cynnydd hanesyddol hwn ar gyfer llywodraeth leol, wedi’i gyfuno â’r fformwla newydd sydd yn rhoi cyfran decach i’r awdurdodau lleol mwyaf anghenus yng Nghymru, yn dystiolaeth o ymrwymiad y weinyddiaeth hon i fynd i’r afael ag anghydraddoldeb yng Nghymru? A gytunwch mai dim ond y weinyddiaeth hon sydd yn barod i bleidleisio o blaid setliad o’r fath, yn wahanol i’r gwrthbleidiau, sydd wedi ei wrthwynebu’n gyson?
The administration is committed to ensuring equality of treatment across Wales and to drive against poverty in particular areas. I hope that the formula will help to tackle social deprivation.
Mae’r weinyddiaeth wedi ymrwymo i sicrhau triniaeth gyfartal ledled Cymru ac i ymgyrchu yn erbyn tlodi mewn ardaloedd penodol. Gobeithiaf y bydd y fformwla yn helpu i fynd i’r afael ag amddifadedd cymdeithasol.
Will you join me in congratulating Rhondda Cynon Taff and Caerphilly County Borough Councils on offering their residents the lowest council tax rise for many years, in stark contrast to some of their neighbouring authorities, which find it difficult to keep their increases to below 5 per cent? Do you agree that the real answer to the Valleys’ problems is to elect Plaid Cymru-controlled county borough councils?
A ymunwch â mi wrth longyfarch Cynghorau Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf a Chaerffili am gynnig y cynnydd isaf yn y dreth gyngor i’w trigolion ers sawl blwyddyn, mewn cyferbyniad llwyr â rhai o’u hawdurdodau cyfagos, sydd yn ei chael hi’n anodd cadw eu cynnydd yn is na 5 y cant? A gytunwch mai’r ateb gwirioneddol i broblemau’r Cymoedd fyddai ethol cynghorau bwrdeistref sirol a reolir gan Blaid Cymru?
Somebody asked me the same question last week, and I am happy to accept everyone’s congratulations for the extra local government settlement that I have allowed Plaid authorities. It is gracious of me to do so in the run-up to the general election.
Gofynnwyd yr un cwestiwn imi yr wythnos diwethaf, ac yr wyf yn fwy na pharod i dderbyn llongyfarchiadau gan bawb am y setliad ychwanegol ar gyfer llywodraeth leol a roddais i awdurdodau Plaid. Mae’n haelionus fy mod yn gwneud hynny ar drothwy’r etholiad cyffredinol.
Can you look again at business rates relief, particularly in rural areas in relation to the foot and mouth crisis?
A ystyriwch ryddhad ardrethi busnes unwaith eto, yn arbennig mewn ardaloedd gwledig yng nghyswllt argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau?
I know that this issue concerns Members. There are rules and regulations on hardship funds, and, if it would help Members, I will prepare a note on what is currently available and make some further inquiries myself.
Gwn fod y mater hwn yn achosi pryder i’r Aelodau. Mae rheolau a rheoliadau yn ymwneud â chronfeydd caledi, a, phe byddai o gymorth i Aelodau, paratof nodyn ar yr hyn sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd a gwnaf rai ymholiadau pellach.
Amddiffynfeydd rhag Llifogydd
Flood Defences
What progress has been made in securing additional one-off funding for flood defences in Wales? (OAQ10308)
Pa gynnydd a wanethpwyd wrth sicrhau arian untro ychwanegol ar gyfer amddiffynfeydd rhag llifogydd yng Nghymru? (OAQ10308)
Nothing has changed since Sue Essex’s statement to the Assembly on 14 November 2000.
Ni fu unrhyw newid ers datganiad Sue Essex i’r Cynulliad ar 14 Tachwedd 2000.
Are you aware that, according to Franz Fischler, European funding is available for flood defence under the terms of the European agricultural guidance and guarantee fund? Despite the recent flooding in Wales, no money has been applied for under this scheme. Can you tell us, as Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities, how much money has been applied for for Wales under this scheme and in what areas will that money be spent?
A ydych yn ymwybodol bod arian Ewropeaidd ar gael ar gyfer atal rhag llifogydd o dan dermau cronfa gyfarwyddo a gwarantu amaethyddol Ewrop, yn ôl Franz Fischler? Er gwaethaf y llifogydd diweddar yng Nghymru, ni wnaethpwyd cais am unrhyw arian o dan y cynllun hwn. A allwch ddweud wrthym, fel y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau, faint o arian y gwnaethpwyd cais amdano i Gymru o dan y cynllun hwn ac ym mha ardaloedd y caiff yr arian hwnnw ei wario?
I will provide a written answer for you later.
Darparaf ateb ysgrifenedig ichi yn nes ymlaen.
I am concerned that there has been no progress since Sue’s last statement on this. It is urgent in some areas. Can you assure us that, when new flood defence developments will be funded, other vital budgets will not be raided, particularly those that are put aside for Objective 1 match funding?
Yr wyf yn pryderu na fu unrhyw gynnydd yn hyn o beth ers datganiad diwethaf Sue arno. Mae’n fater brys mewn rhai ardaloedd. A allwch ein sicrhau, pan gaiff datblygiadau newydd ar gyfer atal rhag llifogydd eu hariannu, na fydd hynny ar draul cyllidebau hanfodol eraill, yn arbennig y rheini sydd wedi’u neilltuo ar gyfer arian cyfatebol Amcan 1?
There has been progress and money is now in the system to meet the needs. Sue has reported that to the Environment, Planning and Transport Committee, which will discuss the questions that have arisen today. We have looked at the position in light of the flooding and have made the necessary changes. There is no question of raiding anything, Helen.
Bu rhywfaint o gynnydd ac mae arian yn y system erbyn hyn i gwrdd â’r anghenion. Rhoddodd Sue wybod i Bwyllgor yr Amgylchedd, Cynllunio a Thrafnidiaeth am hyn, a bydd y Pwyllgor yn trafod y cwestiynau a godwyd heddiw. Ystyriwyd y sefyllfa yng ngoleuni’r llifogydd a gwnaethpwyd y newidiadau angenrheidiol. Ni fydd unrhyw gyllidebau eraill yn dioddef, Helen.
Cynnal Llwybrau Cyhoeddus
Maintaining Public Footpaths
Will the Minister make a statement about the role of local authorities in maintaining public footpaths? (OAQ10325)
A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar rôl llywodraeth leol o ran cynnal llwybrau cyhoeddus? (OAQ10325)
The allocation of funding for maintaining public footpaths is the responsibility of local authorities from within their overall settlement.
Cyfrifoldeb awdurdodau lleol yw dyrannu arian i gynnal llwybrau cyhoeddus o’u setliad cyffredinol.
Some local authorities have not kept their public footpaths open over many years. A huge percentage of them are now closed. Will you guarantee that local authorities will have the funding they need to open the full network of footpaths, together with the millions of pounds needed as a result of the right to roam legislation?
Nid yw rhai awdurdodau lleol wedi cadw eu llwybrau cyheoddus ar agor ers sawl blwyddyn. Mae canran enfawr ohonynt bellach wedi’u cau. A wnewch chi sicrhau y caiff awdurdodau lleol yr arian sydd ei angen arnynt i agor y rhwydwaith llwybrau llawn, ynghyd â’r miliynau o bunnoedd sydd eu hangen o ganlyniad i’r ddeddfwriaeth hawl i grwydro?
I would be grateful if Glyn could give me examples of the failure of local authorities to maintain footpaths. The settlement is sufficient to enable local government to undertake its responsibilities fully in all areas.
Byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe gallai Glyn roi enghreifftiau o fethiant awdurdodau lleol i gynnal llwybrau. Mae’r setliad yn ddigonol i alluogi llywodraeth leol i gyflawni ei gyfrifoldebau yn llawn ymhob maes.
Arian wedi’i Gario Ymlaen dan Drefniadau Hyblyg Diwedd y Flwyddyn
Money Carried Forward Under End of Year Flexibility
Will the Minister make a statement on the total amounts carried forward under end of year flexibility in 1999-2000 and 2000-01 in Wales? (OAQ10284)
A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ar y cyfansymiau a gariwyd ymlaen o dan y trefniadau hyblyg diwedd blwyddyn yn 1999-2000 a 2000-01 yng Nghymru? (OAQ10284)
Total carry-forward into 1999-2000 and 2000-2001 was £188,719 million and £233,813 million respectively.
Y cyfanswm a gariwyd ymlaen yn 1999-2000 a 2000-2001 oedd £188,719 miliwn a £233,813 miliwn yn y drefn honno.
What is your estimate of how much money is likely to be available in end of year flexibility this year, to deal with some of the crises facing Wales in terms of tourism and the effect of foot and mouth disease on rural areas?
Beth yw eich amcangyfrif o faint o arian sydd yn debygol o fod ar gael o dan drefniadau hyblyg diwedd y flwyddyn eleni, i ymdrin â rhai o’r argyfyngau sydd yn wynebu Cymru yn nhermau twristiaeth ac effaith clwy’r traed a’r genau ar ardaloedd gwledig?
I am unable to make a statement at this stage. We have not completed the analysis, because we are not at the end of the final quarter. However, when people talk of underspend, you must look at it as a percentage of the large budgets involved. Anything in the region of two per cent across the board in budgets would be acceptable, because it largely refers to capital projects and overhangs. I will make my usual statement on underspends in due course.
Ni allaf wneud datganiad ar hyn o bryd. Ni chwblhawyd y dadansoddiad, oherwydd nid ydym ar ddiwedd y chwarter olaf. Fodd bynnag, wrth sôn am danwario, rhaid ei ystyried fel canran o’r cyllidebau mawr dan sylw. Byddai unrhyw beth yn agos at ddau y cant yn gyffredinol mewn cyllidebau yn dderbyniol, gan ei fod yn cyfeirio’n bennaf at brosiectau cyfalaf a bargodiadau. Cyflwynaf fy natganiad arferol ar danwariant maes o law.
You would agree, Edwina, that the underspend last year was 3 per cent rather than 2 per cent. By normal standards, in business or in large government agencies, 3 per cent is excessive on a routine, ongoing budget, especially bearing in mind the acute needs in every sector. Will you implement tighter financial monitoring so that any slippage in a major project can be balanced by an advance in the start date of another? That would make better use of our resources.
Fe gytunech, Edwina, mai 3 y cant oedd y tanwariant y llynedd yn hytrach na 2 y cant. Yn ôl safonau cyffredin, mewn busnes neu asiantaethau mawr y llywodraeth, mae 3 y cant yn ormod mewn cyllideb arferol, barhaus, yn arbennig o gofio’r anghenion dwys ymhob sector. A wnewch chi roi gwaith monitro ariannol llymach ar waith fel y gellir cydbwyso unrhyw lithro mewn prosiect mawr drwy ddwyn dyddiad dechrau prosiect arall ymlaen? Byddai hynny’n gwneud gwell defnydd o’n hadnoddau.
Thank you for those helpful comments, Phil. I am concerned to ensure that we manage budgets properly. There are concerns about underspends, even though they are relatively small in certain areas. I am undertaking a root and branch examination of all underlying budgets, so there is no historical rationale on the baselines. They will actually go down to a zero base so that we can build the budgets upwards. That is a part of my budget process this year. I hope that it will help with the situation.
Diolch am eich sylwadau defnyddiol, Phil. Yr wyf yn awyddus i sicrhau ein bod yn rheoli ein cyllidebau yn briodol. Mae pryderon am danwariant, er bod hynny’n gymharol fach mewn rhai meysydd. Yr wyf wrthi’n cynnal archwiliad cynhwysfawr o’r holl gyllidebau sylfaenol, fel na fydd unrhyw resymeg hanesyddol ar y gwaelodlinau. Byddant mewn gwirionedd yn cyrraedd sylfaen sero fel y gallwn gynyddu’r cyllidebau. Mae hynny’n rhan o’m proses gyllidebol eleni. Gobeithiaf y bydd yn helpu’r sefyllfa.
You are aware, Edwina, of the press publicity regarding Plaid Cymru’s suggestion that £41 million, I think, was handed back to central Government. Will you confirm that it would not have been possible for any elderly people or housing benefit claimants to claim that money? Will you also comment on a letter in last night’s South Wales Evening Post in which the Plaid Cymru candidate for Swansea West claimed that housing benefit claimants and elderly people should have been advised to claim under—
Yr ydych yn ymwybodol, Edwina, o’r cyhoeddusrwydd yn y wasg ynghylch awgrym Plaid Cymru y dychwelwyd £41 miliwn, fe gredaf, i’r Llywodraeth ganolog. A wnewch chi gadarnhau na fyddai wedi bod yn bosibl i unrhyw berson mewn oed neu geisydd budd-dâl tai wneud cais am yr arian hwnnw? A wnewch chi hefyd sylwadau ar lythyr yn y South Wales Evening Post neithiwr lle yr honnodd ymgeisydd Plaid Cymru dros Abertawe y dylai ceiswyr budd-dâl tai a phobl mewn oed fod wedi cael eu cynghori i wneud cais am yr arian hwnnw o dan—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 21
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21
Order. This question is not about Plaid Cymru. It is about the total amounts carried forward under end of year flexibility. The Minister need not answer that question.
Trefn. Nid yw’r cwestiwn hwn yn ymwneud â Phlaid Cymru. Mae’n ymwneud â’r cyfansymiau a gariwyd ymlaen o dan drefniadau hyblyg diwedd y flwyddyn. Nid oes angen i’r Gweinidog ateb y cwestiwn hwnnw.
Money for schools is important. Recently, we heard that schools in England will receive direct special payments of between £13,000 and £63,000 for primary schools and between £68,000 and £115,000 for secondary schools. Will similar payments be made to schools in Wales? If not, why not?
Mae arian i ysgolion yn bwysig. Yn ddiweddar, clywsom y bydd ysgolion yn Lloegr yn derbyn taliadau arbennig uniongyrchol o rhwng £13,000 a £63,000 ar gyfer ysgolion cynradd a rhwng £68,000 a £115,000 ar gyfer ysgolion uwchradd. A wneir taliadau tebyg i ysgolion yng Nghymru? Os na wneir, pam?
You are, of course, referring to the £100 million in additional money that has come to Wales as a result of the Chancellor’s budget. The decision on which priorities to spend that money is a matter for the National Assembly. I hope that, in years two and three, it would be part of the budget process. In year one, I am having discussions with my ministerial colleagues on which priorities to spend additional money, taking into account the needs and pressures in Wales. In my view, it is much more satisfactory to use the well-tried system of local education authorities and Welsh local government in distributing education funding.
Yr ydych, wrth gwrs, yn cyfeirio at y £100 miliwn o arian ychwanegol a ddaeth i Gymru o ganlyniad i gyllideb y Canghellor. Y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol fydd yn penderfynu pa flaenoriaethau i wario’r arian hwnnw arnynt. Gobeithiaf, ym mlynyddoedd dau a thri, y byddai’n rhan o’r broses gyllidebol. Ym mlwyddyn un, yr wyf wrthi’n trafod â’m cyd-Aelodau gweinidogol pa flaenoriaethau y dylid gwario arian ychwanegol arnynt, gan ystyried yr anghenion a’r pwysau yng Nghymru. Yn fy marn i, mae’n llawer mwy boddhaol defnyddio’r system sefydledig o awdurdodau addysg lleol a llywodraeth leol yng Nghymru wrth ddosbarthu arian i addysg.
Cynnig Trefniadol
Procedural Motion
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 22
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22
Yesterday, I received a request from the Leader of the Welsh Conservatives to propose that the Assembly, under Standing Order No. 6.9, hold a debate on a matter of urgent public importance. I have given my permission for him to do so.
Ddoe, derbyniais gais gan Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru i gynnig y dylai’r Cynulliad, o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.9, gynnal dadl ar fater sydd o bwys mawr i’r cyhoedd. Rhoddais ganiatâd iddo wneud hynny.
It is high time that we had a full and urgent debate on the situation regarding foot and mouth disease in Wales. It affects all sectors in Wales, not just agriculture. I am pleased that the First Minister has arrived in the Chamber, and I hope that he will respond to this personally. We heard yesterday about the rural taskforce, but the administration seems to have changed its mind many times on our role in it. It is unclear. I understood that we were not represented. Then I understood that the Wales Office would represent us. Now I understand that the National Assembly for Wales has observer status. This is unsatisfactory. We are being treated as second class. We must have full representation. I also understand that a rural taskforce for Wales was ruled out at the start because the nation is too small. I do not understand that reasoning. That policy has changed. However, we must have clarification on this. We should have a full debate on the remit of this taskforce, on Wales’s input and how we will be represented. Yesterday’s proposals treat us like a Victorian child: the National Assembly would be seen but not heard on this taskforce. I hope that the First Minister will address this in an urgent debate on the crisis.
Mae’n hen bryd inni gynnal dadl lawn ar fyrder ar y sefyllfa o ran clwy’r traed a’r genau yng Nghymru. Mae’n effeithio ar bob sector yng Nghymru, nid dim ond amaethyddiaeth. Yr wyf yn falch fod y Prif Weinidog wedi cyrraedd y Siambr, a gobeithiaf y bydd yn ymateb yn bersonol i hyn. Clywsom ddoe am y tasglu gwledig, ond ymddengys fod y weinyddiaeth wedi newid ei meddwl sawl gwaith o ran pa ran y dylem ei chwarae. Nid yw’n glir. Deallais nad oeddem wedi’n cynrychioli ar y tasglu. Yna deallais y byddai Swyddfa Cymru yn ein cynrychioli. Yn awr deallaf fod gan Gynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru statws arsylwr. Mae hynny’n anfoddhaol. Cawn ein trin fel sefydliad ail ddosbarth. Rhaid inni gael cynrychiolaeth lawn. Deallaf hefyd y penderfynwyd peidio ag ystyried tasglu gwledig i Gymru gan fod y wlad yn rhy fach. Ni ddeallaf y rhesymeg honno. Mae’r polisi hwnnw wedi newid. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni gael eglurhad ar hyn. Dylem gael dadl lawn ar gylch gwaith y tasglu hwn, ar fewnbwn Cymru ac ar sut y cawn ein cynrychioli. Mae’r cynigion ddoe yn ein trin fel plentyn o oes Fictoria: byddai’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn cael ei weld ond nid ei glywed ar y tasglu hwn. Gobeithiaf y bydd Prif Weinidog Cymru yn ymdrin â hyn mewn dadl frys ar yr argyfwng.
The foot and mouth disease outbreak has implications for many sectors. I applaud Carwyn Jones’s role in tackling the disease and the good statements he has made in Plenary. The crisis is now far more wide-ranging in its effects. It not only affects agriculture, but also involves tourism. The Minister for Culture, Sport and the Welsh Language should make a statement on sporting fixtures and the Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning should make a statement on the implications for rural schools, and so on. Members of all parties should have the opportunity to debate this issue. I gave the administration notice of my request for a debate on this subject yesterday. I ask the First Minister to consider my request favourably. I am sure that it has cross-party support.
Mae clwy’r traed a’r genau yn effeithio ar lawer o sectorau. Cymeradwyaf rôl Carwyn Jones wrth fynd i’r afael â’r afiechyd a’r datganiadau da a wnaethpwyd ganddo yn y Cyfarfodydd Llawn. Erbyn hyn mae effeithiau’r argyfwng yn llawer ehangach. Mae’n effeithio nid yn unig ar amaethyddiaeth, ond ar dwristiaeth hefyd. Dylai’r Gweinidog dros Ddiwylliant, Chwaraeon a’r Gymraeg wneud datganiad ar ddigwyddiadau chwaraeon a dylai’r Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes wneud datganiad ar y goblygiadau i ysgolion gwledig, ac ati. Dylid rhoi cyfle i Aelodau pob plaid ddadlau’r mater hwn. Hysbysais y weinyddiaeth o’m cais am ddadl ar y pwnc hwn ddoe. Gofynnais i Brif Weinidog Cymru ystyried fy nghais yn ffafriol. Yr wyf yn siŵr bod cefnogaeth drawsbleidiol iddo.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 23
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23
I am satisfied that, under Standing Order No. 6.9, this matter merits the Assembly’s immediate attention. I will put the proposition to the vote, but will allow an Assembly Minister to reply first.
Yr wyf yn fodlon, o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.9, bod y mater hwn yn haeddu sylw brys y Cynulliad. Cynhaliaf bleidlais ar y cynnig, ond caniatâf i un o Weinidogion y Cynulliad ymateb yn gyntaf.
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 23
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23
Nick made the case for an urgent debate. Both he and the Leader of the Opposition raised this in their comments on my business statement on Tuesday. I made a commitment to schedule a debate as early as possible. I also gave that commitment to the Business Committee. As Members and the Presiding Officer will know, under the terms of the no-named day motion that I have tabled, I have rearranged business for next Tuesday to allow a debate on this issue. Under the provisions of Standing Order No. 6.9, we can debate this issue now. I would strongly resist that a motion has not been tabled for such a debate today and Members have had insufficient time to prepare for such an important debate. Alternatively, the Presiding Officer could rule that the debate be held during next Tuesday’s Plenary. I understand that he intends to do that. I therefore see no reason to vote to debate this matter now. I have given an undertaking, in private and public, that this issue will be discussed on Tuesday under a motion that will give Members an opportunity to debate this issue in its widest possible terms, which is what Nick Bourne has asked for. I see no merit in wasting time on this procedural device this morning. We should proceed with the scheduled business, which includes a statement by my colleague, Carwyn Jones, the Minister for Rural Affairs. He has given a commitment to continually update Members on the latest position in respect of agriculture. Carwyn’s statement will be followed by a statement by the Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development on the wider economic implications of the crisis. I urge Members to reject the call for a debate today, given that this matter will be debated on Tuesday, as I have promised.
Cyflwynodd Nick yr achos dros ddadl frys. Codwyd y mater ganddo ef a chan Arweinydd yr Wrthblaid yn eu sylwadau ar fy natganiad busnes ddydd Mawrth. Addewais drefnu dadl cyn gynted â phosibl. Addewais hynny hefyd i’r Pwyllgor Busnes. Fel y gŵyr yr Aelodau a’r Llywydd, o dan dermau’r cynnig heb ddyddiad trafod a gyflwynais, yr wyf wedi ad-drefnu’r busnes ar gyfer dydd Mawrth nesaf i ganiatáu dadl ar y mater hwn. O dan ddarpariaethau Rheol Sefydlog Rhif 6.9, gallwn ddadlau’r mater hwn yn awr. Byddwn yn gwrthod yn gryf yr honiad na chyflwynwyd cynnig ar gyfer dadl o’r fath heddiw ac na roddwyd digon o amser i’r Aelodau baratoi ar gyfer dadl mor bwysig. Fel arall, gallai’r Llywydd benderfynu y dylid cynnal y ddadl yn ystod y Cyfarfod Llawn ddydd Mawrth nesaf. Deallaf ei fod yn bwriadu gwneud hynny. Felly ni welaf unrhyw reswm dros gynnal pleidlais i gynnal dadl ar y mater hwn yn awr. Addewais, yn breifat ac yn gyhoeddus, y trafodir y mater hwn ddydd Mawrth o dan gynnig a fydd yn rhoi’r cyfle i’r Aelodau ddadlau’r mater hwn mor eang â phosibl, sydd yn unol â chais Nick Bourne. Ni welaf unrhyw werth gwastraffu amser ar y ddyfais drefniadol hon y bore yma. Dylem fwrw ati gyda’r busnes a drefnwyd, sydd yn cynnwys datganiad gan fy nghyd-Aelod, Carwyn Jones, y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig. Addawodd hysbysu’r Aelodau yn rheolaidd o’r sefyllfa ddiweddaraf o ran amaethyddiaeth. Yn dilyn datganiad Carwyn, ceir datganiad gan y Dirprwy Brif Weinidog a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd ar oblygiadau economaidd ehangach yr argyfwng. Erfyniaf ar yr Aelodau i wrthod y cais am ddadl heddiw, o gofio y cynhelir dadl ar y mater hwn ddydd Mawrth, fel yr addewais.
Point of order. Under Standing Order No. 6.9, as the Minister for Assembly Business mentioned, you have the discretion to hold this debate today or on Tuesday—
Pwynt o drefn. O dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.9, fel y soniodd y Trefnydd, mae’r disgresiwn gennych i gynnal y ddadl hon heddiw neu ddydd Mawrth—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 24
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24
Indeed. I am well aware of the content of Standing Orders.
Yn wir. Yr wyf yn llwyr ymwybodol o gynnwys y Rheolau Sefydlog.
I was ensuring—
Yr oeddwn yn sicrhau—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 24
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24
Ensuring? I am well aware of the content of Standing Orders. What is your point of order?
Y Llywydd; Sicrhau? Yr wyf yn llwyr ymwybodol o gynnwys y Rheolau Sefydlog. Beth yw eich pwynt o drefn?
What will happen to today’s business, which includes a vital statement on the implications for tourism of this crisis, if the request for this debate is granted?
Beth fydd yn digwydd i fusnes heddiw, sydd yn cynnwys datganiad hanfodol ar oblygiadau’r argyfwng i dwristiaeth, os caniateir y cais i gynnal y ddadl hon?
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 24
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24
If the motion were to be adopted and I were to rule to hold the debate today—although my preference would be to discuss this on Tuesday, as the Minister for Assembly Business indicated—it would follow the statements. Statements have priority over debates in the order of Assembly business.
Pe câi’r cynnig ei dderbyn a phe bawn yn penderfynu cynnal y ddadl heddiw—er mai fy newis i fyddai trafod hyn ddydd Mawrth, fel y nododd y Trefnydd—byddai’n dilyn y datganiadau. Rhoddir blaenoriaeth i ddatganiadau dros ddadleuon yn nhrefn busnes y Cynulliad.
Further to that point of order, in view of the Minister for Assembly Business’s reasonable reply, will the Leader of the Welsh Conservatives indicate that he is prepared to withdraw the proposition?
Ymhellach i’r pwynt hwnnw o drefn, o ystyried ymateb rhesymol y Trefnydd, a wnaiff Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru nodi ei fod yn barod i dynnu’r cynnig yn ôl?
Ymhellach i’r pwynt hwnnw, cefnogwn yn llawn yr egwyddorion sydd yn sail i gynnig Nick Bourne ar y mater pwysig hwn, ond gan fod dau ddatganiad ar y mater heddiw a dadl lawn ddydd Mawrth nesaf, a yw’n fodlon derbyn sylwadau’r Trefnydd, gan gofio bod swyddogion Adran Amaethyddiaeth y Cynulliad o dan bwysau sylweddol ar hyn o bryd? Yr ydym eisiau cefnogi eu gwaith yn hytrach nag ychwanegu ato. Gobeithiaf fod y Blaid Geidwadol yn fodlon ystyried hynny.
Further to that point, we fully support the principles on which Nick Bourne’s motion on this important matter is based, but given that there are two statements on the subject today and a full debate next Tuesday, is he willing to accept the Minister for Assembly Business’s comments, bearing in mind that officials from the Assembly’s Agriculture Department are currently under great pressure? We want to support their work rather than add to it. I hope that the Conservative Party is prepared to consider that.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 25
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 25
Mater i Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru yw tynnu’r cynnig yn ôl, os yw’n dymuno gwneud hynny.
It is a matter for the Leader of the Welsh Conservatives to withdraw the motion, if he so wishes.
I tabled this motion yesterday, because there was not a scheduled date for a debate on the foot and mouth outbreak. I believe that it is in response to my motion that a date for such a debate has now been set. However, given that spirit, and in line with what Ron Davies and Elin Jones said, I will withdraw my motion, and hope that we will hear from the First Minister on Tuesday on what is a national crisis for Wales.
Cyflwynais y cynnig hwn ddoe, gan nad oedd dyddiad wedi’i drefnu ar gyfer dadl ar glwy’r traed a’r genau. Credaf i’r dyddiad ar gyfer dadl o’r fath gael ei drefnu mewn ymateb i’m cynnig. Fodd bynnag, o ystyried yr ysbryd hwnnw, ac yn unol â’r hyn a ddywedodd Ron Davies ac Elin Jones, tynnaf fy nghynnig yn ôl, gan obeithio y clywn gan y Prif Weinidog ddydd Mawrth ar yr hyn sydd yn argyfwng cenedlaethol i Gymru.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 25
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25
I am grateful to the Leader of the Welsh Conservatives, who is exercising his right under Standing Orders. It is appropriate for Members to do that, if they so wish, therefore no aspersions should be cast on Members’ desire to use our Standing Orders on such urgent matters.
Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru, sydd yn arfer ei hawl o dan y Rheolau Sefydlog. Mae’n briodol i Aelodau wneud hynny, os dymunant, felly ni ddylid bwrw unrhyw amheuon ar awydd yr Aelodau i ddefnyddio ein Rheolau Sefydlog ar faterion brys o’r fath.
Datganiad ar Effaith Clwy’r Traed a’r Genau ar Ffermio
Statement on the Impact of the Foot and Mouth Disease on Farming
Carwyn Jones The Minister for Rural Affairs spoken in English p. 25
Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25
First, I thank you, Llywydd, for your indulgence last week, in allowing me not to read a statment when I had lost my voice. It has now returned, and I will be able to read my statement today. This is a report on the current situation of foot and mouth disease. At close of day yesterday, there were 12 confirmed cases of the disease in Wales, and 11 suspected cases. The geographical pattern remains substantially the same as last week except for a suspected case near Carmarthen, which arose after tracing back to a contact in England. We await laboratory results on that. The developing pattern of cases along the border, especially in north-east Montgomeryshire, is of particular concern.
Yn gyntaf, diolch ichi, Lywydd, am fod mor garedig yr wythnos diwethaf â pheidio â gofyn imi ddarllen datganiad pan oeddwn wedi colli fy llais. Mae wedi dychwelyd erbyn hyn a gallaf ddarllen fy natganiad heddiw. Adroddiad yw hwn ar sefyllfa bresennol clwy’r traed a’r genau. Ar ddiwedd y dydd ddoe, yr oedd 12 o achosion o’r clwyf wedi eu cadarnhau yng Nghymru, ac 11 o achosion posibl. Erys y patrwm daearyddol yr un peth ag yr oedd yr wythnos diwethaf yn y bôn, ar wahân i achos posibl ger Caerfyrddin, a gododd ar ôl olrhain cysylltiad yn ôl i Loegr. Arhoswn am ganlyniadau labordy ar hynny. Mae’r patrwm o achosion sydd yn datblygu ar hyd y gororau, yn arbennig yng ngogledd-ddwyrain Sir Drefaldwyn, yn achos pryder mawr.
Yesterday, I discussed and agreed with Nick Brown a range of steps to intensify action to eradicate the disease. Nick Brown will make a statement to Parliament later today on those actions. I will now outline the main points affecting Wales. First, the State Veterinary Service will divide the country into areas assessed according to their risk of having the disease. Movement of animals from potentially infected areas into uninfected ones will not be allowed. It is important to reinforce our action to ensure that west Wales remains free of the disease. Secondly, a radical approach will be taken to slaughter defined groups of animals that are at risk of having been exposed to the virus. In Wales, that will involve the tracing and compulsory slaughter of sheep that were traded through Welshpool market after 19 February and of any animals with which they subsequently came into contact. That is a major undertaking, and I appeal to farmers to help the State Veterinary Service to complete its work. It is vital that those animals are traced. In addition, where necessary, livestock within a three-kilometre radius of confirmed cases will be inspected every other day. Farmers will receive compensation for the full value of any animal compulsorily slaughtered under these arrangements. Steps are being taken to speed up compensation by simplifying the valuation process. Members will be acutely aware of the difficult problems that the restriction of livestock movements has caused in terms of animal welfare. Last week, a licensing system was introduced to allow controlled local movement of livestock to alleviate some of these problems. Yesterday, 1,108 occupational licenses had been issued for regular movements of up to 0.5 kilometres and 571 local movements for one-off movements of up to 10 kilometres. I am grateful for the work that the Agriculture Department’s divisional offices put in to get this system up and running so quickly and at short notice last weekend.
Ddoe, trafodais a chytunais â Nick Brown ar amrywiaeth o gamau i ddwysáu’r hyn a wneir i ddileu’r afiechyd. Bydd Nick Brown yn gwneud datganiad i’r Senedd yn ddiweddarach heddiw ar y camau hynny. Yn awr, amlinellaf y prif bwyntiau sydd yn effeithio ar Gymru. Yn gyntaf, bydd y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol yn rhannu’r wlad yn ardaloedd a asesir yn ôl y risg o gael y clwyf. Ni chaniateir i anifeiliaid o ardaloedd sydd o bosibl wedi eu heintio symud i ardaloedd nas heintiwyd. Mae’n bwysig atgyfnerthu’r camau a gymerwn er mwyn sicrhau bod gorllewin Cymru yn parhau i fod yn rhydd o’r clwyf. Yn ail, byddwn yn gweithredu’n radical i ladd grwpiau penodedig o anifeiliaid sydd mewn perygl o fod wedi cael eu hamlygu i’r firws. Yng Nghymru, bydd hynny’n golygu olrhain a lladd defaid a gafodd eu gwerthu drwy farchnad y Trallwng ar ôl 19 Chwefror ac unrhyw anifeiliaid y daethant i gysylltiad â hwy ar ôl hynny. Mae hynny’n ymrwymiad mawr, ac apeliaf ar ffermwyr i helpu’r Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol i gwblhau ei waith. Mae’n holl bwysig y caiff yr anifeiliaid hynny eu holrhain. Yn ogystal, pan fo angen, caiff da byw o fewn radiws tri chilomedr o achosion wedi eu cadarnhau eu harchwilio bob yn ail ddydd. Caiff ffermwyr iawndal am werth llawn unrhyw anifail a leddir yn orfodol o dan y trefniadau hyn. Cymerir camau i gyflymu iawndal drwy symleiddio’r broses brisio. Bydd Aelodau yn ymwybodol iawn o’r problemau anodd y mae cyfyngu ar symudiadau da byw wedi eu hachosi o ran lles anifeiliaid. Yr wythnos diwethaf, cyflwynwyd system drwyddedu i ganiatáu i dda byw gael eu symud yn lleol o dan reolaeth er mwyn lleddfu rhai o’r problemau hyn. Ddoe, yr oedd 1,108 o drwyddedau galwedigaethol wedi eu cyhoeddi ar gyfer symudiadau rheolaidd hyd at 0.5 cilomedr a 571 o symudiadau lleol ar gyfer symudiadau unigol hyd at 10 cilomedr. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am y gwaith a wnaeth swyddfeydd rhanbarthol yr Adran Amaethyddiaeth er mwyn gweithredu’r system hon mor gyflym ac ar fyr rybudd y penwythnos diwethaf.
I said in my statement last week that I was pursuing a twin-track approach to animal welfare problems. Allowing local movement was the first track. Following discussions with Nick Brown yesterday, arrangements are being put in place across the UK on the second track. That will allow licences to be issued for animals away on tack to return to their home farms where that is consistent with the control of the disease. The detailed conditions will be published today. I stress that the need to guard against spreading the disease will mean that many animals will not be able to return at this stage. It is particularly important to ensure that animals returning from tack are not released onto shared grazing land. We cannot allow the disease to become established on the hills. Where tack animals are unable to return, farmers will be given the option of submitting them for slaughter on animal welfare grounds. I pressed Nick Brown yesterday for farmers to be given an adequate rate of compensation, but I emphasise that the scheme will be voluntary. Farmers will be able—if they wish—to make arrangements to keep their animals away on tack so that they can return at a later stage. In animal welfare terms, that may be a viable option for ewe lambs in particular. In my statement last week I also said that I intended to review restrictions on access to the countryside if the geographical pattern of the disease remained stable. I discussed that with the farming unions last Friday and stated in my press conference that I intended to start the review process on 16 March, that date being 21 days after the introduction of the ban on livestock movements. I will take that process forward, based on the professional advice of the State Veterinary Service, which is important.
Dywedais yn fy natganiad yr wythnos diwethaf fy mod yn mabwysiadu ymagwedd ddeuol tuag at broblemau lles anifeiliaid. Caniatáu symud anifeiliaid yn lleol oedd yr elfen gyntaf. O ran yr ail elfen, yn dilyn trafodaethau â Nick Brown ddoe, caiff trefniadau eu gwneud ledled y DU. Bydd hynny’n caniatáu i drwyddedau gael eu cyhoeddi i anifeiliaid sydd ar dac ddychwelyd i’w ffermydd cartref pan fydd hynny’n gyson â’r modd y rheolir y clwyf. Caiff yr amodau manwl eu cyhoeddi heddiw. Pwysleisiaf y bydd yr angen i wylio rhag lledaenu’r clwyf yn golygu na fydd llawer o anifeiliaid yn gallu dychwelyd yn ystod y cam hwn. Mae sicrhau na chaiff anifeiliaid tac sydd yn dychwelyd eu rhyddhau ar dir pori cyffredin yn arbennig o bwysig. Ni allwn ganiatáu i’r clwyf ledaenu ar y bryniau. Pan na fydd anifeiliaid tac yn gallu dychwelyd, rhoddir yr opsiwn i ffermwyr eu lladd er lles yr anifeiliaid. Pwysais ar Nick Brown ddoe am gyfradd iawndal ddigonol i ffermwyr ond pwysleisiaf mai gwirfoddol fydd y cynllun. Bydd ffermwyr—os dymunant—yn gallu gwneud trefniadau i gadw eu hanifeiliaid ar dac fel y gallant ddychwelyd yn ddiweddarach. Yn nhermau lles anifeiliaid, gallai hynny fod yn opsiwn dichonol ar gyfer ŵyn benyw yn arbennig. Yn fy natganiad yr wythnos diwethaf dywedais hefyd fy mod yn bwriadu adolygu’r cyfyngiadau ar fynediad i gefn gwlad pe bai patrwm daearyddol y clwyf yn parhau yn sefydlog. Trafodais hynny ag undebau’r ffermwyr ddydd Gwener diwethaf a nodais yn fy nghynhadledd i’r wasg fy mod yn bwriadu dechrau ar y broses adolygu ar 16 Mawrth, sef 21 diwrnod ar ôl cyflwyno’r gwaharddiad ar symud da byw. Gweithredaf ar y broses honno yn seiliedig ar gyngor proffesiynol y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol, sydd yn bwysig.
We all want to ease the severe impact that the crisis is having on tourism, and I recognise that. However, we need to proceed with care, given the nature of the disease. In addition, the State Veterinary Service is preparing further guidance for organisations on the opening of attractions, on meetings and travel. These guidelines will be published as soon as possible. The rural taskforce is considering issues in England. As I indicated, the taskforce’s work is already in hand in Wales. Mike German will explain in his statement how the Assembly has been working on the issues affecting tourism more generally. We are keeping in touch with the taskforce’s work in London and an Assembly official attended its first meeting yesterday. As part of this process the Assembly will discuss with the UK Government the range of problems that the crisis is causing for rural businesses. Mike German and I are keen to work with relevant interests in Wales in addition to working with Westminster to prepare a rural recovery plan to help the rural economy recover as quickly as possible once the disease abates. Mike German and I will convene a working group drawn from the organisations represented on the Wales Rural Partnership to help us prepare this plan. We will make arrangements for the group to meet urgently.
Mae pob un ohonom am leddfu’r effaith ddifrifol a gaiff yr argyfwng ar dwristiaeth, a chydnabyddaf hynny. Fodd bynnag, mae angen inni symud ymlaen yn ofalus, o gofio natur y clwyf. Yn ogystal, mae’r Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol yn paratoi canllawiau pellach i sefydliadau ar agor atyniadau, ar gyfarfodydd ac ar deithio. Cyhoeddir y canllawiau hyn cyn gynted â phosibl. Mae’r tasglu gwledig yn ystyried materion yn Lloegr. Fel y nodais, mae gwaith y tasglu eisoes ar waith yng Nghymru. Bydd Mike German yn egluro yn ei ddatganiad sut y bu’r Cynulliad yn gweithio ar y materion sydd yn effeithio ar dwristiaeth yn fwy cyffredinol. Cadwn mewn cysylltiad â gwaith y tasglu yn Llundain a mynychodd un o swyddogion y Cynulliad y cyfarfod cyntaf ddoe. Fel rhan o’r broses hon bydd y Cynulliad a Llywodraeth y DU yn trafod yr ystod o broblemau y mae’r argyfwng yn eu hachosi i fusnesau gwledig. Mae Mike German a minnau yn awyddus i weithio gyda phobl a sefydliadau perthnasol yng Nghymru sydd â diddordeb yn ogystal â gweithio gyda San Steffan i baratoi cynllun adfer gwledig i helpu’r economi wledig i wella cyn gynted â phosibl unwaith y bydd y clwyf yn cilio. Bydd Mike German a minnau yn galw gweithgor ynghyd o blith sefydliadau a gynrychiolir ar Bartneriaeth Wledig Cymru i’n helpu i baratoi’r cynllun hwn. Gwnawn drefniadau i’r grŵp gyfarfod ar fyrder.
Dechreuaf gyda rhagymadrodd byr yn unol â chanllawiau newydd y Llywydd. Pan wnaethoch eich datganiad cyntaf ar glwy’r traed a’r genau, Weinidog, cawsoch gefnogaeth drawsbleidiol ar sail y ffaith bod y mesurau a gymerasoch yn deillio o gyngor milfeddygol. Mae newid sylweddol yn rheolaeth y clwyf erbyn hyn, fel a amlinellwyd gennych heddiw. Dair wythnos yn ôl, yr oedd y milfeddygon yn rhwym o ddweud mai dim ond ar ffermydd lle’r oedd clwy’r traed a’r genau wedi’i gadarnhau yr oedd yr angen i ddifa’r anifeiliaid. Fodd bynnag, dywedasoch yn eich datganiad heddiw y bydd anifeiliaid sydd wedi bod mewn cysylltiad posibl; â’r haint yn cael eu difa hefyd, yng nghyd-destun marchnad y Trallwng yn benodol. A wnewch egluro’r newid meddwl hwn yn fwy manwl? Ai ar sail cyngor milfeddygol yn unig neu fympwy gwleidyddol y gwnaethpwyd hynny? A ydych yn cydnabod na chymerwyd camau digonol yn ddigon cyflym er mwyn rheoli lledaenu’r afiechyd hwn?
in Welsh I will begin with a brief preamble in accordance with the Presiding Officer’s new guidelines. When you made your first statement on foot and mouth disease, Minister, you received cross-party support based on the fact that the measures you took derived from veterinary advice. There is now a substantial change in the control of the disease, as you outlined today. Three weeks ago, the veterinarians were firmly saying that only on farms where foot and mouth disease had been confirmed was there a need to cull the animals. However, you said in your statement today that animals that have been in possible contact with the disease will also be culled, in the context of the Welshpool market in particular. Will you explain this change of mind in greater detail? Was it done on the basis of vetenerinary advice alone or on a political whim? Do you concede that adequate steps were not taken swiftly enough to control the spread of this disease?
Dychwelaf at fater a godais ar sawl achlysur erbyn hyn sef yr anifeiliaid ar dac. Yr wyf yn falch y bydd cyhoeddiad yn cael ei wneud i ystyried symud anifeiliaid o fewn ardaloedd penodol. Croesawaf hynny, o fewn yr ardaloedd penodol hynny, a’r ymdrech i gychwyn ar broses o symud anifeiliaid yn ôl i’w ffermydd. Pe bai goblygiadau i les anifeiliaid o beidio â symud anifeiliaid yn ôl i’w ffermydd, a oes modd defnyddio’r fyddin i gynorthwyo gydag ŵyna a bwydo anifeiliaid sydd ymhell oddi wrth ofal eu ffermwyr? Byddai’n well gennyf ddefnyddio milwyr i helpu defaid i ŵyna ac i godi twnneli plastig ac yn y blaen, na’u defnyddio i saethu cannoedd o anifeiliaid sydd, i bob pwrpas, yn iach.
in Welsh I return to a matter that I have now raised on a number of occasions, which is the issue of animals on tack. I am pleased that there will be an announcement that the movement of animals within specific areas is being considered. I welcome that, within those specific areas, and the attempt to begin the process of moving animals back to their farms. If there were animal welfare implications in not moving animals back to their farms, could the army be used to assist with lambing and feeding animals far from the care of their farmers? I would prefer to see soldiers used to assist sheep in lambing and to erect poly-tunnels and so on, rather than used to shoot hundreds of animals that are, to all intents and purposes, healthy.
Mae gennyf gyfres o gwestiynau byr. A adolygir y cynllun fferm-i-ladd-dy, o gofio’r digwyddiad yn Lladd-dy Rhyngwladol Edward Hamer Cyf ddechrau’r wythnos? Dylem ystyried o ddifrif ei gwneud yn orfodol i filfeddyg ymweld â’r anifeiliaid cyn iddynt gael eu symud gan fod yr haint yn anodd i ffermwyr ei adnabod.
in Welsh I have a series of brief questions. Will the farm-to-abattoir scheme be reviewed, given the incident at Edward Hamer International Abattoir Limited at the beginning of the week? We should seriously consider requiring a veterinarian to visit the animals before they are moved, as the infection is difficult for farmers to identify.
Ar hyn o bryd, caniateir cludo anifeiliaid dros filltiroedd lawer i ladd-dai, hyd yn oed drwy ardaloedd heintiedig. A ddylem ystyried cyfyngu’r fath deithiau i Gymru, er enghraifft, a lladd cynnyrch Cymru yn unig yn lladd-dai Cymru? Gallem ei farchnata felly yng nghyd-destun yr argyfwng hwn.
in Welsh At the moment, the transport of animals over very long distances, even through infected areas, is permitted. Should we consider restricting such journeys to Wales, for example, and having Welsh abattoirs slaughter produce from Wales only? We could then market it as such in the context of this crisis.
Will the Minister also clarify whether Wales is a full player in the rural taskforce announced by Tony Blair and led by Michael Meacher? Yesterday it seemed as if Wales was the extension on the extension, with the interests of rural Wales to be represented in an observer’s capacity by that well-known rural affairs expert, David Hanson. We are confused about the rural taskforce in Wales. Earlier this week, Minister, you denied that one was needed in Wales. Your Deputy Minister reiterated that yesterday in the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee. Now you have stated that a sub-committee of the Rural Partnership will be formed. I request that that Committee be a full Committee, which will meet urgently and often, and work with the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee across party lines to devise a fully-costed action plan to compensate and kick-start the rural economy. I also seek your assurance that the money needed to fund an action plan would be additional to the Welsh budget and sourced from Gordon Brown’s £20 billion war chest.
yn Saesneg A wnaiff y Gweinidog egluro hefyd a yw Cymru yn chwarae rhan lawn yn y tasglu gwledig a gyhoeddwyd gan Tony Blair ac a arweinir gan Michael Meacher? Ddoe ymddangosai mai Cymru oedd yr estyniad ar yr estyniad, gyda buddiannau Cymru wledig yn cael eu cynrychioli ar sail sylwedydd gan yr arbenigwr adnabyddus hwnnw ar faterion gwledig, David Hanson. Yr ydym wedi drysu ynglŷn â’r tasglu gwledig yng Nghymru. Eisoes yr wythnos hon, Weinidog, yr ydych wedi gwadu fod angen un yng Nghymru. Ailadroddodd eich Dirprwy Weinidog hynny ddoe yn y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig. Yn awr yr ydych wedi nodi y caiff is-bwyllgor o’r Bartneriaeth Wledig ei ffurfio. Gwnaf gais ar i’r Pwyllgor hwnnw fod yn Bwyllgor llawn, a fydd yn cyfarfod ar frys ac yn aml, gan weithio gyda’r Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ar draws pob plaid i ddyfeisio cynllun gweithredu wedi ei gostio’n llawn i ddigolledu’r economi wledig a rhoi cychwyn pendant iddi. Gofynnaf hefyd am eich sicrwydd y byddai’r arian sydd ei angen i ariannu cynllun gweithredu yn ychwanegol at gyllideb Cymru ac yn deillio o gist ryfel £20 biliwn Gordon Brown.
Yr ydych wedi rhoi cryn bwysigrwydd ar yfory fel diwrnod i asesu hyd a lled y clwyf. A fyddwch yn gwneud datganiad pellach yfory? Os felly, a fyddech mor garedig â rhannu’r datganiad gyda’r gwrthbleidiau yn ogystal â’r wasg?
in Welsh You have placed considerable importance on tomorrow being the day to assess the spread of the disease. Will you make a further statement tomorrow? If so, would you be so kind as to share it with the opposition parties as well as the press?
Ar ehangu’r polisi o ladd anifeiliaid, mae hynny yn digwydd yn sgîl cyngor milfeddygon. Nid yw’n benderfyniad gwleidyddol. Pan siaradais â milfeddygon ar y cychwyn, nid oeddent am ladd anifeiliaid yn y modd hwn. Fodd bynnag, wrth i’r amgylchiadau newid, mae eu barn wedi newid hefyd. Nid oes penderfyniad gwleidyddol wedi ei wneud. Barn a chyngor y milfeddygon yn unig sydd wedi ein harwain i estyn y lladd.
in Welsh On extending the slaughter of animals, that is occurring on the advice of veterinarians. It is not a political decision. When I spoke to veterinarians at the beginning, they did not wish to slaughter animals in this way. However, as circumstances have changed, so has their opinion. It is not a political decision. The opinion and advice of veterinarians alone has led us to extend the slaughter.
Ar ddefnyddio’r fyddin, yr ydym yn edrych ar bob posibilrwydd. Pe bai’r amgylchiadau yn golygu bod rhaid inni ei defnyddio, byddwn yn ystyried gwneud hynny. Nid yw hynny’n cael ei ystyried ar hyn o bryd ond efallai y bydd pe bai amgylchiadau’n newid. Nid yw’r syniad wedi’i ddiystyru’n llwyr, fel petai.
in Welsh On using the army, we are looking at every possibility. If circumstances are such that we need to use it, we will consider doing so. It is not being considered at the moment, but it may be if circumstances change. The idea has not been dismissed out of hand, as it were.
Ar symud anifeiliaid o ffermydd i ladd-dai, mae problem ymarferol o gael archwiliad gan filfeddyg ar bob fferm, oherwydd nid oes digon o filfeddygon i wneud hynny. Byddai system o’r fath yn cymryd llawer o amser. Mae’r hyn a ddigwyddodd yn Lladd-dy Rhyngwladol Edward Hamer Cyf yn anffodus. Dengys hynny pa mor bwysig ydyw i ffermwyr fwrw golwg dros eu hanifeiliaid cyn iddynt fynd i’r lladd-dy. Ni ddisgwylia neb i ffermwyr roi diagnosis o’r clwyf yn y fan a’r lle. Gofynnwn yn unig iddynt edrych i weld a yw’r anifeiliaid yn cloffi.
in Welsh On moving animals from farms to abattoirs, there is a practical problem in conducting an examination by a veterinarian on every farm, in that there are insufficient vets to do that. Such a system would therefore take up a lot of time. What happened at Edward Hamer International Abattoir Limited was unfortunate. It shows how important it is for farmers to check their animals before they are sent to the slaughterhouse. Nobody expects farmers to diagnose the disease on the spot. We only ask them to check whether the animals are lame.
Nid yw’r ffaith fod hyn wedi digwydd unwaith yn rheswm dros newid y system yn llwyr. Pe digwyddai eto, byddai ffydd y cyhoedd yn y system yn cael ei siglo. Mae’n bwysig bod ffermwyr yn bwrw golwg dros eu hanifeiliaid er mwyn inni barhau â’r system. Ni ddisgwyliwn i ffermwyr roi diagnosis ond i gadw llygad ar eu hanifeiliaid, yn enwedig eu defaid. Os ydynt yn cloffi, dylent alw milfeddyg i edrych arnynt.
in Welsh The fact that this has happened once is not a reason to completely change the system. If this were to recur, the public’s faith in the system would be shaken. It is important that farmers check their animals so that we can continue with this system. We do not expect farmers to give a diagnosis, but to keep an eye on their animals, especially their sheep. If they become lame, they should call a vet to examine them.
O ran y gynhadledd i’r wasg, yr wyf bob amser yn ceisio trosglwyddo’r manylion i’r pleidiau. Nid yw hynny bob amser yn bosibl, ac fel y dywedais yn y Pwyllgor bythefnos yn ôl, mae gwybodaeth weithiau yn gorfod mynd allan i’r cyhoedd cyn fy mod yn gallu trosglwyddo’r manylion i’r pleidiau. Pan fo’n bosibl imi roi’r wybodaeth i’r pleidiau, ceisiaf wneud hynny.
in Welsh As regards the press conference, I always endeavour to pass on the details to the parties. That is not always possible, and as I said in Committee a fortnight ago, information sometimes has to go out to the public before I can get the details to the parties. Where it is possible for me to pass on the information to the parties, I will endeavour to do so.
There was a question in English about the rural taskforce. We had an observer at the meeting yesterday. It is currently an England-only body. However, its expansion into a UK body is being considered. It is important that Wales has an observer there to pick up ideas. There is no reason for us to stay away and say that it has nothing to do with us. If ideas are discussed there that can usefully be implemented in Wales, we are interested in them. I have examined the membership of the rural taskforce in England and it is more or less a replica of our own rural partnership. Therefore, setting up a separate taskforce would not make sense given that we have a structure already in place to deal with the situation. As I said previously, a formal structure for a taskforce is more appropriate for England because England is much bigger and has departments that must be co-ordinated, whereas in Wales it is much easier to get in touch with people. Nevertheless, now that the rural partnership is there, I intend to form a sub-group of the rural partnership, in addition to Ministers and officials, to consider the medium-term future for the rural economy in Wales. The next meeting of the rural partnership was scheduled for June, but it will be brought forward. We will organise the meeting as soon as possible. The rural partnership is a little too big, with more than 30 people, to do the kind of work that we would want it to do, therefore I suggest taking some of the people out of the rural partnership in order to help to create a rural recovery plan.
yn Saesneg Yr oedd cwestiwn yn Saesneg ynglŷn â’r tasglu gwledig. Yr oedd gennym sylwedydd yn y cyfarfod ddoe. Corff ar gyfer Lloegr yn unig ydyw ar hyn o bryd. Fodd bynnag, rhoddir ystyriaeth i’w ehangu yn gorff ar gyfer y DU. Mae’n bwysig bod gan Gymru sylwedydd yno i wrando ar syniadau. Nid oes unrhyw reswm inni gadw draw a dweud na wnelo ddim â ni. Os trafodir syniadau yno y gellir eu gweithredu’n ddefnyddiol yng Nghymru, mae gennym ddiddordeb ynddynt. Astudiais aelodaeth y tasglu gwledig yn Lloegr ac mae fwy neu lai yr un peth â’n partneriaeth wledig ni ein hunain. Felly, ni fyddai sefydlu tasglu ar wahân yn gwneud synnwyr o gofio bod gennym strwythur eisoes yn ei le i ddelio â’r sefyllfa. Fel y dywedais o’r blaen, mae strwythur ffurfiol ar gyfer tasglu yn fwy priodol i Loegr gan fod Lloegr yn fwy o faint ac mae ganddi adrannau y mae’n rhaid eu cydlynu, tra ei bod yn llawer haws yng Nghymru inni gysylltu â phobl. Serch hynny, gan fod y bartneriaeth wledig wedi’i sefydlu, bwriadaf ffurfio is-grŵp o’r bartneriaeth wledig yn ogystal â’r Gweinidogion a’r swyddogion, i ystyried dyfodol tymor canolig yr economi wledig yng Nghymru. Trefnwyd cyfarfod nesaf y bartneriaeth wledig ar gyfer Mehefin, ond caiff ei gynnal yn gynharach. Byddwn yn trefnu’r cyfarfod cyn gynted â phosibl. Mae’r bartneriaeth wledig ychydig yn rhy fawr, gyda mwy na 30 o bobl, i wneud y math o waith y byddem am iddi ei wneud, felly awgrymaf ein bod yn tynnu rhai o’r bobl allan o’r bartneriaeth wledig er mwyn helpu i greu cynllun adfer gwledig.
I welcome Carwyn’s statement, which struck the right balance between being vigilant and robust with what we now know and trying to ensure that we get ahead of the game to ensure that the disease is controlled. I am sure that it is the right strategy. I have one question with two aspects. First, Carwyn mentioned that attempts will be made to trace stock that was sold through the two suspect markets. If such stock is identified, will the area in which it is held, regardless of whether or not it is showing signs of the infection, be automatically classed as an infected area? Secondly, in the first part of his statement, Carwyn talked about Wales being divided into infected and non-infected areas. On what basis will that definition be made? Will it be made, for example, on the basis of a geographical radius or holding or on the basis of local authority boundaries? That is important for people who are trying to decide how they should respond in their own workplace.
Croesawaf ddatganiad Carwyn, a oedd yn taro’r cydbwysedd cywir rhwng bod yn wyliadwrus a chadarn yng ngoleuni’r hyn a wyddom yn awr a cheisio sicrhau ein bod ar y blaen er mwyn rheoli’r clwyf. Yr wyf yn siŵr mai dyna’r strategaeth gywir. Mae gennyf un cwestiwn gyda dwy elfen iddo. Yn gyntaf, soniodd Carwyn y caiff ymdrechion eu gwneud i olrhain da byw a werthwyd drwy’r ddwy farchnad lle y darganfuwyd y clwyf. Os canfyddir stoc o’r fath, a gaiff yr ardal lle y cedwir y da byw, pa un a welir arwyddion o’r haint ai peidio, ei phennu’n awtomatig yn ardal heintus? Yn ail, yn rhan gyntaf ei ddatganiad, soniodd Carwyn am Gymru yn cael ei rhannu yn ardaloedd heintus ac ardaloedd nad ydynt yn heintus. Ar ba sail y gwneir y diffiniad hwnnw? A gaiff ei wneud, er enghraifft, ar sail radiws daearyddol neu ddeiliadaeth neu ar sail ffiniau awdurdodau lleol? Mae hynny’n bwysig i’r bobl sydd yn ceisio penderfynu sut y dylent ymateb yn eu gweithle eu hunain.
There is no question of Welshpool livestock market being in any way at fault. I saw the reports yesterday and I understand the feelings of the owners of Welshpool livestock market, but there is no question of anybody blaming Welshpool market. It is a successful market that could not have prevented this in any way. I want that message to be heard. The finger is not in any way being pointed at Welshpool market.
Yn sicr, nid yw marchnad da byw y Trallwng ar fai mewn unrhyw ffordd. Gwelais yr adroddiadau ddoe a deallaf deimladau perchnogion marchnad da byw y Trallwng, ond nid oes unrhyw un yn beio marchnad y Trallwng. Mae’n farchnad lwyddiannus na allai fod wedi atal hyn mewn unrhyw ffordd. Yr wyf am i’r neges honno gael ei chlywed. Ni chyhuddir marchnad y Trallwng mewn unrhyw ffordd.
With regard to which areas would be classed as infected areas, the plan is that where there are confirmed cases animals will be checked within a three kilometre radius. I do not know if the State Veterinary Service will extend the boundary of the infected areas to include those in which traced animals are being slaughtered. Until now, there has been a difference between what is done in areas with confirmed cases and those with suspected ones. However, the matter is in the hands of the State Veterinary Service, and as I have said on many occasions, politicians should not interfere in scientific advice, although I know that you were not suggesting that.
O ran pa ardaloedd a fyddai’n cael eu pennu yn ardaloedd heintus, y bwriad yw, pan fydd achosion wedi eu cadarnhau, y caiff yr anifeiliaid o fewn radiws o dri chilomedr eu harchwilio. Ni wn a fydd y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol yn ymestyn ffin yr ardaloedd heintus i gynnwys y rheini lle y caiff anifeiliaid a gafodd eu holrhain eu lladd. Hyd yn hyn, bu gwahaniaeth rhwng yr hyn a wneir mewn ardaloedd lle y cadarnhawyd achosion a’r rheini lle y mae achosion tybiedig. Fodd bynnag, mae’r mater yn nwylo’r Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol, ac fel y dywedais ar sawl achlysur, ni ddylai gwleidyddion ymyrryd â chyngor gwyddonol, er y gwn nad ydych yn awgrymu hynny.
Wales will have to be divided according to geographical areas and local authority boundaries because they are more easily identifiable. We are looking at a system that will categorise areas according to high, medium and low-risk. Clearly, it will be difficult to sanction movements from, for example, high to medium or medium to low-risk areas. However, trying to control the situation on the basis of holding would confuse people. Therefore, local authority boundaries will be the boundaries of the risk areas.
Bydd yn rhaid i Gymru gael ei rhannu yn ôl ardaloedd daearyddol a ffiniau awdurdodau lleol gan eu bod yn haws eu hadnabod. Edrychwn ar system a fydd yn categoreiddio ardaloedd yn ôl risg uchel, canolig ac isel. Yn amlwg, bydd yn anodd cymeradwyo symudiadau o ardaloedd risg uchel i ganolig, er enghraifft, neu risg ganolig i isel. Fodd bynnag, byddai ceisio rheoli’r sefyllfa ar sail deiliadaeth yn drysu pobl. Felly ffiniau awdurdodau lleol fydd ffiniau’r ardaloedd risg.
The entire local authority boundary?
Ffin gyfan yr awdurdod lleol?
Yes, it will have to include the whole boundary.
Ie, bydd yn rhaid iddo gynnwys y ffin gyfan.
The review of the current situation begins on Friday, and I stress that that date is without prejudice. Veterinary advice on Friday may indicate that we cannot do anything about the situation for the time being. Nevertheless, we have to keep it under review, and I appreciate the difficulties facing tourism. However, restrictions can only be lifted on a county basis. Powys may be different because it includes three distinct districts, therefore I will consider that separately. However, there is no question of excluding certain wards, because that would confuse people. Matters would have to be controlled according to county boundaries, with the exception of Powys.
Bydd yr adolygiad o’r sefyllfa gyfredol yn dechrau ddydd Gwener a phwysleisiaf fod y dyddiad hwnnw heb ragfarn. Efallai mai cyngor y milfeddygon ddydd Gwener fydd na allwn wneud unrhyw beth ynglŷn â’r sefyllfa am y tro. Serch hynny, rhaid inni ei hadolygu’n gyson, a gwerthfawrogaf yr anawsterau a wynebir gan dwristiaeth. Fodd bynnag, dim ond ar sail sirol y gellir codi’r cyfyngiadau. Efallai bod Powys yn wahanol oherwydd mae’n cynnwys tair ardal ar wahân, felly fe ystyriaf hynny ar wahân. Fodd bynnag, yn sicr, ni chaiff wardiau penodol eu heithrio, oherwydd byddai hynny’n drysu pobl. Byddai’n rhaid rheoli materion yn ôl ffiniau sirol, ac eithrio Powys.
I thank the Minister for his statement. Our main priority must be to control and eradicate this dreadful virus. We support the measure that you announced today on sheep traded through Welshpool market and we welcome your statement that the market was not at fault. It is important to put that on record. I also welcome the measures that you announced regarding animals on tack, which are consistent with the control and eradication of the virus. That must continue to be of paramount importance.
Diolchaf i’r Gweinidog am ei ddatganiad. Rheoli a dileu’r firws ofnadwy hwn yw ein prif flaenoriaeth. Cefnogwn y mesur a gyhoeddwyd gennych heddiw ar ddefaid a werthwyd ym marchnad y Trallwng a chroesawn eich datganiad nad oedd y farchnad ar fai. Mae’n bwysig cofnodi hynny. Croesawaf hefyd y mesurau a gyhoeddwyd gennych o ran anifeiliaid ar dac sydd yn gyson â rheoli a dileu’r firws. Rhaid i hynny barhau i fod o’r pwys mwyaf.
I am still unclear about our role on the Westminster taskforce—I prefer that name to the English taskforce. It has implications for Wales, therefore why is the Assembly not directly represented on it? David Hanson does not represent us, because he is not a part of this body. The observer status seems to be at civil service level and that is not what is needed. We are being treated as second-class members of the UK in relation to this taskforce. I know that we have a rural partnership, and I agree that it functions as our taskforce, but, as you rightly said, it is too large. I urge you to consider a separate body made up of people with the executive responsibility to act on this matter and to help to control this dreadful virus. For example, we still do not know what is happening with sporting fixtures held in infected areas. Will you comment on that, because it concerns people in infected areas?
Yr wyf yn aneglur o hyd ynglŷn â’n rôl ar dasglu San Steffan—mae’n well gennyf yr enw hwnnw na thasglu Lloegr. Mae iddo oblygiadau i Gymru, felly pam na chynrychiolir y Cynulliad yn uniongyrchol arno? Nid yw David Hanson yn ein cynrychioli, oherwydd nid yw’n rhan o’r corff hwn. Ymddengys fod y statws sylwedydd ar lefel y gwasanaeth sifil ac nid dyna beth sydd ei angen. Cawn ein trin fel aelodau eilradd o’r DU mewn perthynas â’r tasglu hwn. Gwn fod gennym bartneriaeth wledig, a chytunaf ei bod yn gweithredu fel ein tasglu, ond fel y dywedasoch, a hynny’n gywir, mae’n rhy fawr. Fe’ch anogaf i ystyried corff ar wahân yn cynnwys pobl â chyfrifoldeb gweithredol i weithredu ar y mater hwn a helpu i reoli’r firws ofnadwy hwn. Er enghraifft, ni wyddom o hyd beth sydd yn digwydd o ran digwyddiadau chwaraeon a gynhelir mewn ardaloedd heintus. A wnewch chi roi eich sylwadau ar hynny, oherwydd mae’n gofidio pobl mewn ardaloedd heintus?
I also raise issues that farmers have raised with me. First, on communication, at the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee yesterday, I understand that your officials said that 30,000 letters would be delivered to farmers in Wales. If that is the case, it is a volte-face from your previous statement, when you indicated that delivering letters was a way of spreading the virus. We need clarification on that because it understandably caused concern yesterday.
Codaf faterion hefyd y mae ffermwyr wedi’i codi â mi. Yn gyntaf, o ran cyfathrebu, yn y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig ddoe, deallaf fod eich swyddogion wedi dweud y byddai 30,000 o lythyrau yn cael eu hanfon at ffermwyr yng Nghymru. Os felly, mae hyn yn newid llwyr ers eich datganiad blaenorol, pan awgrymasoch fod llythyrau yn ffordd o ledaenu’r firws. Mae angen eglurhad ar hynny oherwydd yn ddealladwy, achosodd hyn bryder ddoe.
Secondly, on a seemingly minor issue, which is not minor to the farmers and families concerned, there is no provision for families to be moved from farmhouses where slaughtering is taking place on the farm, which is particularly dreadful for farmers and their young children especially. I hope that actions will be taken on that. I echo Elin Jones’s point on the movement of animals from Scotland and northern England through infected areas, which is causing concern and I welcome what the Minister said on that. I acknowledge the shortage of vets, but I wonder whether you would consider our proposal to bring recently retired vets back into service? I am sure that many of them would be happy to assist and that would help to crack this problem to some extent. I would be grateful if you could address those issues.
Yn ail, ar fater cymharol ddibwys, nad yw’n ddibwys i’r ffermwyr a’u teuluoedd, nid oes unrhyw ddarpariaeth i symud teuluoedd o ffermdai pan gaiff yr anifeiliaid eu lladd ar y fferm, sydd yn brofiad dychrynllyd i ffermwyr a’u plant bach yn arbennig. Gobeithiaf y caiff camau eu cymryd mewn perthynas â hyn. Ategaf bwynt Elin Jones ar symud anifeiliaid o’r Alban a gogledd Lloegr drwy ardaloedd heintus, sydd yn achosi pryder a chroesawaf yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog ar hynny. Cydnabyddaf fod prinder milfeddygon, ond tybed a fyddech yn ystyried ein cynnig i ailgyflogi milfeddygon sydd wedi ymddeol? Yr wyf yn siŵr y byddai llawer ohonynt yn barod i gynorthwyo a byddai hynny’n helpu i ddatrys y broblem hon i ryw raddau. Byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe gallech ymdrin â’r materion hynny.
I have one further issue that I would like you to address, which was raised by farmers yesterday. During the 1967 outbreak, an agricultural advisory committee, made up of people with experience of this disease, worked alongside officials and Ministers. If such people are available, it may be useful to tap into their expertise in the interest of controlling this virus. We support the measures that you are taking. We are not critical of your actions, but the response to this disease needs to be ratcheted up. It is becoming a crisis that is spiralling out of control. We must look at this holistically across all aspects of the governance of Wales.
Mae gennyf un mater pellach yr hoffwn ichi ymdrin ag ef, sef mater a godwyd gan ffermwyr ddoe. Pan fu achosion o’r clwyf yn 1967, cydweithiodd pwyllgor ymgynghorol amaethyddol, yn cynnwys pobl â phrofiad o’r clwyf hwn, â swyddogion a Gweinidogion. Os yw pobl o’r fath ar gael, efallai y byddai’n ddefnyddiol manteisio ar eu harbenigedd er mwyn ceisio rheoli’r firws hwn. Cefnogwn y camau a gymerwch. Nid ydym yn feirniadol ohonynt, ond mae angen cyflymu’r ymateb i’r clwyf hwn. Mae’n dod yn argyfwng sydd yn prysur fynd allan o reolaeth. Rhaid inni edrych ar hyn yn ei gyfanrwydd ar draws pob agwedd ar lywodraethu Cymru.
On your point about the taskforce, as I said, the role of the rural taskforce in Westminster might expand as time goes on. It currently deals with matters in England. Wales has an observer status as does Scotland and Northern Ireland. We must wait and see whether its work is expanded, because there are clearly matters that are UK-wide in their application. The First Minister is meeting with the relevant Ministers in London this afternoon to take matters forward.
Ynglŷn â’ch pwynt am y tasglu, fel y dywedais, efallai y bydd rôl y tasglu gwledig yn San Steffan yn ehangu gydag amser. Ar hyn o bryd mae’n ymdrin â materion yn Lloegr. Mae gan Gymru statws sylwedydd fel sydd gan yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon. Rhaid inni aros a gweld a fydd ei waith yn ehangu, oherwydd yn amlwg ceir materion sydd yn berthnasol i’r DU gyfan. Mae Prif Weinidog Cymru yn cyfarfod â’r Gweinidogion perthnasol yn Llundain y prynhawn yma i weithredu ar faterion.
On the rural partnership, we must have a smaller body to deal with this. That is why I said that we must consider forming a group that is more able to make decisions. Over 30 people is far too many to do that. It is important that the executive responsibility, for better or for worse, lies with me as Minister for Rural Affairs, because, ultimately, I must take the decisions following the advice given. I am responsible to the National Assembly and, subsequently, to the people of Wales for the decisions taken. I agree that the body should be able to advise and that it could, for example, consider ways of devising a plan for the recovery of the rural economy. However, the buck must stop with me.
Ar fater y bartneriaeth wledig, rhaid inni gael corff llai o faint i ymdrin â hyn. Dyna pam y dywedais fod yn rhaid inni ystyried ffurfio grŵp sydd yn fwy abl i wneud penderfyniadau. Mae dros 30 o bobl yn ormod o lawer i wneud hynny. Mae’n bwysig mai fi, fel y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig, sydd â’r cyfrifoldeb gweithredol dros hyn, oherwydd, yn y pen draw, rhaid imi wneud y penderfyniadau gan ddilyn y cyngor a roddir. Yr wyf yn atebol i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol ac, wedi hynny, i bobl Cymru am y penderfyniadau a wneir. Cytunaf y dylai’r corff fod yn gallu cynghori ac y dylai, er enghraifft, ystyried ffyrdd o ddyfeisio cynllun i adfer yr economi wledig. Fodd bynnag, rhaid imi ysgwyddo’r cyfrifoldeb am hyn.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 35
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 35
I call Mick Bates.
Galwaf ar Mick Bates.
I have other points to make.
Mae gennyf bwyntiau eraill i’w gwneud.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 36
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36
Sorry, Minister, you may continue.
Mae’n ddrwg gennyf, Weinidog, cewch barhau.
In terms of communications, three weeks ago we did not know where the disease was and we only had a sheet of paper to distribute. At the time, it was felt—and I believe that this was right—that the best way of communicating information was by electronic means and radio broadcast. We also provide information to local vets, animal health officers and to divisional offices. We are currently sending out an information pack rather than a letter. Now that we have a better idea—although not a full idea—of where the disease is, we can take appropriate precautions in delivering these packs. The need to distribute this information pack now outweighs the risk of spreading the disease, whereas the balance was the other way around three weeks ago. We have given guidance to the Post Office, which it should follow when delivering to infected areas and farms. That guidance has been issued by us, in addition to the guidance issued by MAFF. We expect the Post Office to follow it.
O ran cyfathrebu, ni wyddom dair wythnos yn ôl ble yr oedd y clwyf a dim ond un ddalen oedd gennym i’w dosbarthu. Ar y pryd, teimlwyd mai’r ffordd orau o gyfathrebu gwybodaeth—a chredaf fod hynny’n iawn—oedd drwy gyfrwng electronig a darllediadau radio. Darparwn wybodaeth hefyd i filfeddygon lleol, swyddogion iechyd anifeiliaid a swyddfeydd rhanbarthol. Ar hyn o bryd anfonwn becyn gwybodaeth yn hytrach na llythyr. Gan fod bellach gwell syniad—er nad syniad llawn—o ble y mae’r clwyf, gallwn gymryd y camau diogelu priodol wrth ddosbarthu’r pecynnau hyn. Mae’r angen i ddosbarthu’r pecyn gwybodaeth hwn yn drech na’r risg o ledaenu’r clwyf, tra yr oedd y cydbwysedd y ffordd arall tua thair wythnos yn ôl. Rhoddasom ganllawiau i Swyddfa’r Post ei ddilyn wrth ddosbarthu i ardaloedd a ffermydd heintus. Cyhoeddwyd y canllawiau hynny gennym ni, yn ychwanegol at y canllawiau a gyhoeddwyd gan MAFF. Disgwyliwn i Swyddfa’r Post eu dilyn.
I am happy to take up the issue of moving people away from farmhouses. I understand the great stress that families undergo when they see what is, quite often, a lifetime’s work literally go up in flames. I also understand the stress that people feel when the disease has been identified nearby and they do not know what will happen next. It is important that people understand that the National Assembly will do all it can to resolve matters as quickly as possible. I recognise and understand what is happening at the moment.
Yr wyf yn fodlon ystyried symud pobl o ffermdai. Deallaf fod teuluoedd o dan bwysau mawr pan welant yr hyn sydd, yn aml, yn waith oes yn wenfflam. Deallaf hefyd fod pobl yn teimlo dan bwysau pan fydd y clwyf wedi ei ddarganfod gerllaw ac ni wyddant beth fydd yn digwydd nesaf. Mae’n bwysig bod pobl yn deall y gwnaiff y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol bopeth o fewn ei allu i ddatrys pethau cyn gynted â phosibl. Cydnabyddaf a deallaf yr hyn sydd yn digwydd ar hyn o bryd.
With regard to movement through infected areas, the movement of animals is done strictly in accordance with veterinary advice. If the vets feel that it is no longer safe to do something, they will advise me and Nick Brown and appropriate action will be taken.
O ran symud anifeiliaid drwy ardaloedd heintus, gwneir hynny yn unol â chyngor milfeddygol. Os teimla’r milfeddygon nad yw bellach yn ddiogel gwneud rhywbeth, byddant yn fy nghynghori i a Nick Brown a chaiff y camau priodol eu cymryd.
Retired vets have already been brought in. Vets have also been brought in from other countries and there has been a concerted campaign to bring in vets from the private sector. Everything possible is being done to bring in as many as vets as possible.
Eisoes defnyddiwyd milfeddygon sydd wedi ymddeol. Defnyddiwyd milfeddygon hefyd o wledydd eraill a bu ymgyrch ar y cyd i ddefnyddio milfeddygon o’r sector preifat. Mae popeth posibl yn cael ei wneud i ddefnyddio cymaint o filfeddygon â phosibl.
There are people with experience of the 1967 outbreak of foot and mouth, some of whom are in this Chamber. The difficulty is that there are not many of them. Cases of foot and mouth disease had occurred not long before the 1967 outbreak, therefore, more people had experience of the disease. Everyone’s experience is valuable, although how the disease was dealt with in 1967 is not necessarily the same as how it is dealt with in 2001, particularly with regard to disposal of carcasses and controlling the disease. For example, we no longer want to bury animals on site, which was widely practised in 1967. There are clearly environmental problems with that, but I also know many farmers who can point to areas on their land and say, ‘That is where the animals were buried in 1967’. I do not want people to be reminded of their misfortune every day of the week.
Mae rhai pobl yn cofio’r achosion o glwy’r traed a’r genau yn 1967, ac mae rhai ohonynt yn y Siambr hon. Yr anhawster yw nad oes llawer ohonynt. Bu achosion unigol o glwy’r traed a’r genau ychydig cyn yr argyfwng yn 1967, felly, yr oedd mwy o bobl yn gyfarwydd â’r clwyf. Mae profiad pawb yn werthfawr, er nad yw’r ffordd yr ymdriniwyd â’r clwyf yn 1967 o reidrwydd yn briodol ar gyfer 2001, yn arbennig o ran gwaredu’r carcasau a rheoli’r afiechyd. Er enghraifft, nid ydym bellach am gladdu anifeiliaid ar y safle sef rhywbeth a oedd yn arfer cyffredin yn 1967. Yn amlwg, mae hyn yn creu problemau amgylcheddol, ond gwn y gall llawer o ffermwyr nodi ardaloedd ar eu tir a dweud, ‘Dyna ble y claddwyd yr anifeiliaid yn 1967’. Nid wyf am i bobl gael eu hatgoffa o’u hanffawd bob diwrnod o’r wythnos.
What about sports fixtures?
Beth am ddigwyddiadau chwaraeon?
Guidance is being prepared on sports fixtures and we hope that it will be issued tomorrow.
Paratoir canllawiau ar ddigwyddiadau chwaraeon a gobeithiwn eu cyhoeddi yfory.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 37
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37
I apologise for interrupting earlier. I am keen that all Members who want to contribute can do so, therefore, I will briefly extend the time for questions on this statement.
Ymddiheuraf am ymyrryd yn gynharach. Yr wyf yn awyddus i bob Aelod sydd yn dymuno cyfrannu wneud hynny, felly, rhoddaf ychydig mwy o amser ar gyfer cwestiynau ar y datganiad hwn.
We all welcome certain steps that have been taken. However, the circumstances are grave in my constituency of Montgomeryshire, which is not only suffering from this foot and mouth outbreak, but also, as you may know, one of its towns has suffered 200 job losses. The impact of that is equivalent to the impact of the job losses at Corus in Llanwern.
Mae pob un ohonom yn croesawu rhai camau penodol a gymerwyd. Fodd bynnag, mae’r amgylchiadau’n ddifrifol yn fy etholaeth i yn Sir Drefaldwyn, sydd nid yn unig yn dioddef o’r achosion hyn o glwy’r traed a’r genau, ond hefyd, fel y gwyddoch efallai, mae un o’i threfi wedi colli 200 o swyddi. Mae effaith hynny yn cyfateb ag effaith colli swyddi Corus yn Llanwern.
I will refer to some of the immediate problems that you dealt with in your statement. I will also refer to some that we must address for the future. I am still gravely concerned about the process that has been put in place for high, medium and low-risk areas. What are your contingency plans, if, for example, there is suddenly an outbreak in a low risk area? That would call the whole process into question. Secondly, I would like more information on how Welshpool market was identified on 19 February as a centre that spread the disease. I have been contacted by many people who have serious doubts about the tracing system, which has given rise to some rather rash statements—if I may say so—by the Chief Veterinary Officer. Your attitude and that of our veterinary service has been exemplary in Wales.
Cyfeiriaf at rai o’r problemau uniongyrchol yr ydych wedi ymdrin â hwy yn eich datganiad. Cyfeiriaf hefyd at rai y mae’n rhaid inni fynd i’r afael â hwy yn y dyfodol. Gofidiaf lawer o hyd am y broses a roddwyd ar waith ar gyfer ardaloedd risg uchel, canolig ac isel. Beth yw eich cynlluniau wrth gefn os ceir, er enghraifft, nifer fawr o achosion yn sydyn mewn ardal risg isel? Yn ail, hoffwn gael rhagor o wybodaeth am sut yr enwyd marchnad y Trallwng ar 19 Chwefror fel canolfan a ledaenodd y clwyf. Mae llawer o bobl wedi cysylltu â mi gydag amheuon difrifol ynglŷn â’r system olrhain a arweiniodd at rai datganiadau braidd yn fyrbwyll—os gallaf ddweud hynny—gan y Prif Swyddog Milfeddygol. Bu eich agwedd ac agwedd ein gwasanaeth milfeddygol yn rhagorol yng Nghymru.
Can you confirm that the first blood test currently administered for foot and mouth disease is 100 per cent reliable? That way, when suspect cases are tested on farms, we will know that the test is 100 per cent reliable. What procedures are in place to confirm that there are clinical signs on farms and that blood tests are taken from those farms to ensure that, when it is decided that stock should be slaughtered, the farmer has good and full reasons for accepting that decision?
A allwch gadarnhau fod y prawf gwaed cyntaf a weinyddir ar hyn o bryd ar gyfer clwy’r traed a’r genau 100 y cant yn ddibynadwy? Fel hyn, pan brofir achosion posibl ar ffermydd, byddwn yn gwybod bod y prawf 100 y cant yn ddibynadwy. Pa weithdrefnau sydd ar waith i gadarnhau bod arwyddion clinigol ar ffermydd ac y gwneir profion gwaed ar y ffermydd hynny er mwyn sicrhau, pan benderfynir y dylid lladd yr anifeiliaid, bod gan y ffermwr resymau da a llawn dros dderbyn y penderfyniad hwnnw?
I am pleased that so many licences have been issued. I am sure that they are most welcome. However, in the context of local movements, you will also be aware—as I am painfully aware—that many farmers need licences to cover greater distances than 0.5 kilometres. That is wonderful if you want to take stock across the road but so many farms are suffering severe welfare problems, because their flocks are on the hills, which could be two miles away from the home holding. Consequently, those sheep must lamb on the hill where there are no buildings or provision. I urge you to talk to MAFF to ensure that those farmers can also move their stock back to the home holding.
Yr wyf yn falch y cyhoeddwyd cymaint o drwyddedau. Yr wyf yn siŵr bod croeso mawr iddynt. Fodd bynnag, yng nghyd-destun symudiadau lleol, byddwch yn ymwybodol—fel yr wyf innau yn ymwybodol iawn—bod angen trwyddedau ar lawer o ffermwyr ar gyfer pellter o fwy na 0.5 cilomedr. Mae hynny’n wych os ydych am symud da byw ar draws y ffordd ond mae cymaint o ffermydd yn dioddef o broblemau lles difrifol, am fod eu preiddiau ar y bryniau, a allai fod ddwy filltir i ffwrdd o’u deiliadaeth gartref. O ganlyniad, rhaid i’r defaid hynny fwrw’u hŵyn ar y bryniau lle nad oes unrhyw adeiladau na darpariaeth. Fe’ch anogaf i siarad â MAFF er mwyn sicrhau y gall y ffermwyr hynny symud eu da byw yn ôl i’r ddeiliadaeth gartref hefyd.
On compensation, I welcomed Michael Meacher’s announcement on Newsnight last night that there will be a hardship fund to extend compensation beyond the agricultural industry. I look forward to hearing any comments that you have on that and to the next statement. However, many farmers whose stock is on their holdings are also suffering. There are farmers who are currently in possession of lambs and cattle, which, it appears, are being fattened for no good reason. Have you investigated how these farmers can be compensated? The Easter lamb market is imminent. Many producers have spent much money producing top-quality stock and are now unable to sell it. Do you have any news for these producers? Can they also be compensated for the stock that they are unable to sell?
O ran iawndal, croesewais gyhoeddiad Michael Meacher ar Newsnight neithiwr pan ddywedodd y bydd cronfa caledi ar gael i ymestyn iawndal y tu hwnt i’r diwydiant amaethyddiaeth. Edrychaf ymlaen at glywed unrhyw sylwadau sydd gennych ar hynny ac at y datganiad nesaf. Fodd bynnag, mae llawer o ffermwyr y mae eu da byw ar eu deiliadaethau yn dioddef hefyd. Mae ffermwyr yn berchen ar ŵyn a gwartheg ar hyn o bryd sydd, mae’n ymddangos, yn cael eu pesgi heb reswm yn y byd. A ydych wedi ymchwilio i’r modd y gellir digolledu’r ffermwyr hyn? Mae’r farchnad ŵyn y Pasg ar ddigwydd. Gwariodd llawer o gynhyrchwyr lawer o arian yn cynhyrchu anifeiliaid da na allant eu gwerthu bellach. A oes gennych unrhyw newyddion ar gyfer y cynhyrchwyr hyn? A ellir eu digolledu hefyd am yr anifeiliaid na allant eu gwerthu?
With regard to the closure of the abattoir in Montgomeryshire, can it be right, Minister, for stock to be transported across the country into Montgomeryshire, when local farmers cannot sell their stock? Can it also be right that these lorries pass within a mile of infected farms as they travel on motorways? Is it not possible to introduce a system whereby stock must be slaughtered at the nearest abattoir, as opposed to this complex transport system, which is unfair on many producers in Wales?
O ran cau’r lladd-dy yn Sir Drefaldwyn, a yw hi’n iawn, Weinidog, gludo anifeiliaid ar draws y wlad i Sir Drefaldwyn, pan na all ffermwyr lleol werthu eu hanifeiliaid? A yw hi’n iawn hefyd fod y lorïau hyn yn mynd o fewn milltir i’r ffermydd heintus wrth iddynt deithio ar draffyrdd? Onid yw hi’n bosibl cyflwyno system lle y mae’n rhaid lladd anifeiliaid yn y lladd-dy agosaf, yn lle’r system gludo gymhleth hon sydd mor annheg â llawer o gynhyrchwyr yng Nghymru?
On future issues, we all know that the autumn market will be greatly depressed as there will be no exports. We must advertise the home market more. Have you had any discussions to ensure that New Zealand lamb is not imported into this country? It amounts to 20 per cent of the market, and if it were diverted to other countries instead, a reasonable market might be left for our producers.
O ran materion y dyfodol, gŵyr pob un ohonom y bydd marchnad yr hydref yn ddirwasgedig iawn gan na fydd unrhyw allforion. Mae’n rhaid inni hysbysebu’r farchnad gartref yn ehangach. A gawsoch unrhyw drafodaethau i sicrhau na fewnforir cig oen o Seland Newydd i’r wlad hon? Mae’n cyfrif am 20 y cant o’r farchnad, a phe bai’n cael ei arallgyfeirio i wledydd eraill, gallai hyn adael marchnad resymol i’n cynhyrchwyr ni.
On the taskforce, we need to create a perception in Wales that we are taking the lead and that there is hope that we can get over this crisis. Is it possible to put in place measures that were used in 1967, such as placing disinfectant mats on most main roads? That would raise the profile and show that we are attempting to reduce the risk. Everyone could then see that they are playing their part in reducing and stopping the spread of this terrible disease.
O ran y tasglu, mae angen inni roi’r argraff yng Nghymru ein bod yn arwain y ffordd a bod gobaith y gallwn oresgyn yr argyfwng hwn. A ydyw’n bosibl rhoi mesurau a ddefnyddiwyd yn 1967 ar waith, megis rhoi matiau diheintio ar y rhan fwyaf o’r priffyrdd? Byddai hynny’n codi’r proffil ac yn dangos ein bod yn ceisio lleihau’r risg. Yna gallai pawb weld eu bod yn chwarae eu rhan wrth leihau ac atal y clwyf ofnadwy hwn rhag lledaenu.
It will take some time to deal with all of those questions.
Fe gymer beth amser i ymdrin â’r holl gwestiynau hynny.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 39
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39
I have extended the time allocated for questions on the statement by 10 minutes.
Yr wyf wedi ychwanegu 10 munud at yr amser a ganiateir ar gyfer cwestiynau ar y datganiad.
I appreciate the positions of Mick, Kirsty and Ieuan, as Assembly Members for areas in which there are many outbreaks. It is particularly poignant for Mick, as his farm is close to one of the confirmed outbreaks. I would be grateful if you could communicate the National Assembly’s sympathies to farmers in your area, and tell them that work is being done to alleviate the situation.
Gwerthfawrogaf sefyllfa Mick, Kirsty ac Ieuan fel Aelodau’r Cynulliad ar gyfer ardaloedd lle y mae llawer o achosion. Mae’n arbennig o drist i Mick, gan fod ei fferm mor agos at un o’r achosion a gadarnhawyd. Byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe gallech gyfleu cydymdeimlad y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol i ffermwyr yn eich ardal, gan ddweud wrthynt fod gwaith yn cael ei wneud i leddfu’r sefyllfa.
The veterinary surgeons will determine the high, medium and low-risk areas. We are awaiting the State Veterinary Service’s final advice on that. The decision to start a selective slaughter policy at Welshpool rested with the SVS. I am not prepared to gainsay what it says. If it believes that slaughter is necessary to control the disease, we must follow that order. However, this is not a reflection on Welshpool livestock market. Full value compensation will be available for farmers; they will not lose their animals and get nothing in return.
Y milfeddygon a fydd yn penderfynu ar yr ardaloedd risg uchel, canolig ac isel. Yr ydym yn aros am gyngor terfynol gan y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol ar hynny. Cyfrifoldeb y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol oedd penderfynu dechrau polisi lladd dethol yn y Trallwng. Nid wyf yn barod i wadu’r hyn a ddywed. Os cred fod angen lladd er mwyn rheoli’r clwyf, rhaid inni ddilyn y gorchymyn hwnnw. Fodd bynnag, nid yw hyn yn bwrw amheuaeth ar farchnad da byw y Trallwng. Bydd iawndal gwerth llawn ar gael i’r ffermwyr; ni fyddant yn colli eu hanifeiliaid ac yn cael dim yn eu lle.
I do not want to enter into a discussion on whether or not the tests are reliable. As you know, form C is served where there is a suspect animal. That form determines that there is serious concern. A blood test is carried out and taken to the laboratory. The test confirms immediately if the amount of virus within the animal is high and there is no need for further confirmation. If the amount of virus is such that the test is either inconclusive or negative, that does not necessarily mean that the disease is not present. A further batch of tests is undertaken to be certain. Also, farms are visited every other day to see whether other animals exhibit the same clinical symptoms, in which case the veterinary surgeons are empowered to make a diagnosis on the spot. That is why it unfortunately takes longer to confirm a negative case than a positive one. We have seen many suspect cases declared clear after a week. It is an encouraging sign if the test is not positive at the outset, although we cannot be a 100 per cent certain that the animals are clear of the disease. That is how the tests operate.
Nid wyf am drafod a yw’r profion yn ddibynadwy ai peidio. Fel y gwyddoch, cyflwynir ffurflen C pan fydd amheuaeth ynglŷn ag anifail. Bydd y ffurflen honno yn nodi bod pryder difrifol. Caiff prawf gwaed ei wneud a’i anfon i’r labordy. Bydd y prawf yn cadarnhau ar unwaith a oes llawer o’r firws yn yr anifail ac ni fydd angen cadarnhad pellach. Os yw’r firws sydd yn yr anifail yn golygu na ellir dod i gasgliad neu bod y prawf yn negyddol, nid yw hynny o reidrwydd yn golygu nad yw’r clwyf yn bresennol. Ymgymerir â phrofion pellach er mwyn bod yn siŵr. Hefyd, ymwelir â ffermydd am yn ail ddydd i weld a yw anifeiliaid eraill yn arddangos yr un symptomau clinigol, ac os ydynt, bydd gan y milfeddygon yr hawl i wneud diagnosis yn y fan a’r lle. Dyna pam y mae’n cymryd mwy o amser yn anffodus i gadarnhau achos negyddol nag achos cadarnhaol. Gwelsom lawer o achosion posibl yn cael canlyniad clir ar ôl wythnos. Os nad yw’r prawf yn gadarnhaol o’r cychwyn cyntaf, mae hyn yn arwydd calonogol, er na allwn fod 100 y cant yn sicr bod yr anifeiliaid yn rhydd o’r clwyf. Dyna sut y gweithreda’r profion.
It is possible for farmers to move animals up to 10km. There is a 0.5km licence, but there is also a licence available from divisional offices to move stock up to 10km. The guidelines for the licence are tighter, in terms of taking veterinary advice and so on. However, it is possible to move animals further than 0.5km with another licence. If people are experiencing difficulties in that, I would be happy to assist.
Mae’n bosibl i ffermwyr symud anifeiliaid hyd at 10km. Mae trwydded 0.5km ar gael, ond mae trwydded ar gael hefyd oddi wrth swyddfeydd rhanbarthol i symud anifeiliaid hyd at 10km. Mae’r canllawiau ar gyfer y drwydded yn dynnach, o ran cael cyngor milfeddygol ac yn y blaen. Fodd bynnag, mae’n bosibl symud anifeiliaid ymhellach na 0.5km gyda thrwydded arall. Os caiff pobl anhawster ynglŷn â hynny, byddwn yn fodlon helpu.
The hardship fund was announced by Michael Meacher. As I said yesterday, it would be inappropriate if England received extra money and Wales did not. It is only right that, as foot and mouth disease is affecting the whole of the UK, it is treated at UK level and that a UK approach is taken. I do not want to see a situation where extra money is available in England that is not available in Wales. My understanding is that that will not be the case, but we wait to see what the hardship fund entails.
Cyhoeddwyd y gronfa caledi gan Michael Meacher. Fel y dywedais ddoe, byddai’n amhriodol pe bai Lloegr yn cael arian ychwanegol ond nid Cymru. Mae ond yn briodol, gan fod clwy’r traed a’r genau yn effeithio ar y DU yn gyfan gwbl, y caiff ei drin ar lefel y DU ac y cymerir ymagwedd y DU gyfan. Nid wyf am weld sefyllfa lle y mae arian ychwanegol ar gael yn Lloegr ac nid yng Nghymru. Fy nealltwriaeth i ydyw nad felly y bydd pethau, ond arhoswn i weld beth fydd cynnwys y gronfa caledi.
The question on the lamb crisis was a good point. I have met with Welsh Lamb and Beef Promotions Limited, which is bullish about the situation. It intends to market strongly within the home market to try to make up for the loss within the export market. As I have said before, it would be wrong of me to give the impression that we will have access to the export market much before Christmas. It may take some time for the disease to be finally eradicated. It is only right that we work on that basis. In the meantime, it is important that we market strongly. Welsh Lamb and Beef Promotions Limited will market the brand of Welsh lamb and work as hard as possible to try to keep the price of lamb at the same level as before the foot and mouth crisis began.
Yr oedd y cwestiwn ar yr argyfwng cig oen yn bwynt da. Yr wyf wedi cyfarfod â Hybu Cig Oen ac Eidion Cymru Cyfyngedig, sydd yn ffyddiog ynglŷn â’r sefyllfa. Bwriada farchnata’n gryf o fewn y farchnad gartref er mwyn ceisio gwneud iawn am y golled o fewn y farchnad allforio. Fel y dywedais o’r blaen, ni fyddai’n briodol imi roi’r argraff y gallwn fanteisio ar y farchnad allforio cyn y Nadolig o leiaf. Efallai y cymer beth amser i’r clwyf gael ei ddileu’n llwyr. Mae ond yn briodol ein bod yn gweithio ar y sail honno. Yn y cyfamser, mae’n bwysig ein bod yn marchnata’n gryf. Bydd Hybu Cig Oen ac Eidion Cymru Cyfyngedig yn gweithio mor galed â phosibl i geisio cadw pris cig oen ar yr un lefel ag yr oedd cyn i argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau ddechrau.
On the movement of animals, there is a wider debate whether animals should be moved these distances. I welcome that debate because it is relevant and of benefit to us in Wales that animals are not moved great distances. The decision to accept animals is a commercial decision by the abattoirs. I appeal to abattoirs to play fair with local farmers and ensure that those who have fewer animals to slaughter also have access to the abattoirs. What is happening is that the stock of existing large customers is slaughtered. However, in the present circumstances, I ask the abattoirs to examine their normal working practices and help out the smaller farmers with fewer animals to help them to gain access to the market.
O ran symudiadau anifeiliaid, mae dadl ehangach o ran a ddylid symud anifeiliaid dros y pellteroedd hyn. Croesawaf y ddadl honno gan ei bod yn berthnasol ac o fudd i bob un ohonom yng Nghymru na symudir anifeiliaid bellteroedd mawr. Mae’r penderfyniad i dderbyn anifeiliaid yn benderfyniad masnachol gan y lladd-dai. Apeliaf ar y lladd-dai i roi chwarae teg i ffermwyr lleol a sicrhau y gall y rheini sydd â llai o anfeiliaid i’w lladd ddefnyddio’r lladd-dai hefyd. Yr hyn sydd yn digwydd yw y caiff anifeiliaid cwsmeriaid mawr presennol eu lladd. Fodd bynnag, o dan yr amgylchiadau presennol, gofynnaf i’r lladd-dai archwilio eu harferion gwaith arferol a helpu’r ffermwyr llai sydd â llai o anifeiliaid i werthu yn y farchnad.
What about New Zealand lamb?
Beth am gig oen Seland Newydd?
According to Welsh Lamb and Beef Promotions Limited, the New Zealand season will come to an end in April. It is hopeful that it can market Welsh lamb as strongly as possible, particularly fresh produce, as New Zealand lamb tends to be frozen. As far as fresh Welsh lamb is concerned, we aim to target that market strongly to ensure that people understand the situation. At present, the public wants to be able to trace where their meat has come from and be sure that what they eat is fresh. We are in a position to take advantage of that. Others can do the same but we must ensure that we are first.
Yn ôl Hybu Cig Oen ac Eidion Cymru Cyfyngedig, daw tymor Seland Newydd i ben ym mis Ebrill. Y gobaith yw y gall farchnata cig oen Cymru gymaint â phosibl, yn arbennig cynnyrch ffres, gan fod cig oen Seland Newydd yn tueddu i gael ei rewi. O ran cig oen Cymru, anelwn at dargedu’r farchnad honno yn gryf er mwyn sicrhau bod pobl yn deall y sefyllfa. Ar hyn o bryd, mae’r cyhoedd eisiau gwybod o ble y daeth eu cig ac am fod yn siŵr bod yr hyn a fwytânt yn ffres. Yr ydym mewn sefyllfa i fanteisio ar hynny. Gall eraill wneud yr un peth, ond rhaid inni sicrhau mai ni yw’r cyntaf.
You also mentioned disinfectant mats. Our experience with disinfectant mats on the bridges over the Menai straits to Anglesey is such that they are not viable, because they break up quickly. The sheer amount of traffic on the roads and the speed of vehicles compared with 1967 means that the mats are ineffective. Anglesey is different to other areas as only two roads lead there. Trying to disinfect every road is practically impossible compared with the risk of spreading the disease. The mats no longer work.
Gwnaethoch sôn hefyd am fatiau diheintio. Dengys ein profiad o fatiau diheintio ar y pontydd dros Afon Menai i Ynys Môn nad ydynt yn ymarferol, gan eu bod yn torri’n gyflym. Mae cymaint o draffig ar y ffyrdd a chyflymder y cerbydau o’u cymharu â 1967 yn golygu nad yw’r matiau yn effeithiol. Mae Ynys Môn yn wahanol i ardaloedd eraill gan mai dim ond dwy ffordd sydd yn arwain yno. Mae ceisio diheintio pob ffordd bron yn amhosibl o’i gymharu â’r risg o ledaenu’r clwy. Nid yw’r matiau bellach yn gweithio.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 42
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 42
Oherwydd pwysigrwydd y mater hwn, mae tri Aelod arall yr effeithiwyd ar eu hetholaethau yn uniongyrchol gan yr argyfwng hwn, yn dymuno siarad. Gofynnaf iddynt fod yn gryno gan ein bod wedi cael datganiadau a chwestiynau gan lefaryddion y pleidiau eisioes.
Because of the importance of this matter, three other Members whose constituencies have been directly affected by the crisis wish to speak. I ask them to be brief as we have already had statements and questions from the parties’ spokespeople.
Ieuan Wyn Jones Arweinydd yr Wrthblaid siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 42
Ieuan Wyn Jones The Leader of the Opposition spoken in Welsh p. 42
Hoffwn ddiolch i Carwyn am ei ddatganiad ac am ei barodrwydd i rannu gwybodaeth ag Aelodau pan fo hynny’n angenrheidiol. Croesawaf y ffordd agored y mae wedi gwneud hynny. Byddwch yn ymwybodol bod nifer o achosion wedi cael eu cadarnhau yn Ynys Môn y penwythnos diwethaf a bod hynny, yn naturiol, wedi achosi pryder i ffermwyr a’r gymuned gyfan. Mae cryn rwystredigaeth a dicter hefyd ynglŷn â’r amser a gymerir i sefydlu a yw’r clwy’n bresennol, edrych ar y diagnosis, lladd yr anifeiliaid a’u difa drwy eu llosgi neu eu symud oddi ar y fferm. Mae’r ffaith bod anifeiliaid marw yn aros ar ffermydd am ddyddiau yn peri cymaint o loes i deuluoedd ffermio, ac mae’n gwbl anfoddhaol yn yr oes hon. A oes modd inni gael system a fyddai’n caniatáu difa anifeiliaid yn gynt na’r system bresennol? A wnewch edrych ar hyn a sicrhau bod cyrff anifeiliaid yn cael eu difa o fewn 48 awr, fan bellaf? Byddai hynny’n lleddfu pryder llawer o deuluoedd ffermydd Ynys Môn.
I thank Carwyn for his statement and for his willingness to share information with Members when necessary. I welcome the open way in which he has done so. You will be aware that several cases were confirmed on Anglesey last weekend and that that, naturally, has caused concern to farmers and the whole community. There is also some frustration and anger on the time it takes to establish whether the disease is present, look at the diagnosis, cull the animals and destroy them either through burning or removing them from the farm. The fact that dead animals stay on farms for days is causing a great deal of anguish to farming families, and it is completely unsatisfactory in this day and age. Is it possible for us to have a system that would allow the culling of animals faster than the current system? Will you look at this and ensure that animals are culled within 48 hours at the most? That would alleviate the concern of many Anglesey farming families.
Gwnaf ddau bwynt byr am daliadau. A wnewch gadarnhau y bydd taliadau cynllun premiwm blynyddol defaid yn cael eu gwneud yn llawn i ffermwyr cyn gynted ag y bo modd? Effeithir yn andwyol ar lif arian ar hyn o bryd. A wnewch chi roi unrhyw wybodaeth bellach inni ynglŷn â gwartheg dros 30 mis, lle y mae ffermwyr wedi methu â mynd â’u hanifeiliaid i farchnad yn ystod yr argyfwng? Mae gwerth anifeiliaid dros 30 mis oed yn haneru.
I will make two brief points about payments. Will you confirm that sheep annual premium scheme payments will be made in full to farmers as soon as possible? Cashflow is being adversely affected at the moment. Can you give us any further information about cattle over 30 months, where farmers have been unable to take their animals to market during the crisis? The value of animals over 30-months’ old reduces by a half.
Gwnaf bwynt ynglŷn â’r tasglu. Beth bynnag fo’r rheswm pam nad oedd neb o Gymru yn ei gyfarfod cyntaf, y canfyddiad a roddid oedd nad yw Cymru’n bwysig. Nid yw’r ffaith bod David Hanson wedi mynychu’r cyfarfod cyntaf yn ddigon da. Derbyniaf eich pwynt eich bod am dynnu popeth at ei gilydd yng Nghymru. Derbyniaf fod angen ichi gydweithio â’r Gweinidogion eraill. Fodd bynnag, pwy fydd yn rheoli’r sefyllfa—ai chi, Mike German neu Brif Weinidog Cymru? Pwy sydd yn gyfrifol?
I will make a point about the taskforce. Whatever the reason for there not being anyone from Wales at its first meeting, the perception that that gave was that Wales is not important. The fact that David Hanson attended the first meeting is not good enough. I accept your point that you want to co-ordinate everything in Wales. I accept that you need to work with the other Ministers. However, who will oversee the situation—you, Mike German or the First Minister? Who is responsible?
O ran pwy fydd yn gyfrifol am y cynllun, trafodir hynny rhwng Mike German, y Cabinet a fi. Deallaf ei bod yn bwysig bod rhywun yn gyfrifol; edrychir ar hynny.
As regards who will be responsible for the scheme, that will be discussed between Mike German, the Cabinet and myself. I understand that it is important that someone is responsible; it will be considered.
Mae’r cynllun dros-30-mis yn cael ei ystyried ar hyn o bryd. Deallaf broblemau ffermwyr a chanddynt anifeiliaid hŷn na 30 mis. Mae hynny’n cael ei ystyried.
The over-30-months scheme is currently being considered. I understand the problems of farmers who have animals older than 30 months. That is under consideration.
Codwyd mater taliadau cynllun premiwm blynyddol defaid yn y cyfarfod ddoe. Ein pwynt ni yng Nghymru yw y dylid gwneud y taliadau mewn ffordd sydd o fantais i ffermwyr Cymru. Yr ydym yn edrych ar hynny ar hyn o bryd, er mwyn inni ei drafod â’r Comisiwn Ewropeaidd.
The issue of sheep annual premium scheme payments was raised in yesterday’s meeting. Our point in Wales is that those payments should be made in a way that benefits Welsh farmers. We are examining this currently, so that we can discuss it with the European Commission.
Ynglŷn â’r amser a gymerir i wneud diagnosis, y cwbl y gallaf ei ddweud yw ei bod yn cymryd amser. Deallaf fod hyn yn poeni llawer o deuluoedd. Mae gennym rywun sydd yn ffonio Purbright bob dydd er mwyn sicrhau y cawn y canlyniadau cyn gynted ag y bo modd. Mae Purbright yn gweithio’n galed, bron 24 awr y dydd ar hyn o bryd. Yr ydym yn rhagweithiol wrth gysylltu; nid ydym yn sefyll yn aros i Purbright gysylltu â ni.
As regards the time it takes to make a diagnosis, all I can say is that it takes time. I understand that this is a worry for many families. We have someone who phones Purbright every day to ensure that we have the results as soon as possible. Purbright is working hard, almost 24 hours a day at the moment. We are proactive in making contact; we are not standing still waiting for Purbright to contact us.
Deallaf y sefyllfa yn Ynys Môn dros y penwythnos pan gymerwyd peth amser i losgi anifeiliaid. Gwyddoch, Ieuan, fod cynllun yn bodoli i symud cyrff anifeiliaid yn ddiogel i Swydd Gaer i ffatri rendro sydd yn ymdrin â’r cyrff. Lle y mae’n bosibl i lorïau symud y cyrff, fe’i gwneir. Nid yw’n bosibl ym mhob achos. Mae’r milfeddygon ar y ffermydd yn gweithio mor gyflym ag y gallent i sicrhau bod yr anifeiliaid yn cael eu llosgi, lle bo rhaid. Yr ydym i gyd yn deall beth mae’r teuluoedd ffermio yn ei wynebu am eu bod yn gorfod edrych ar yr anifeiliaid ddydd ar ôl dydd. Felly, clywaf yr hyn yr ydych yn ei ddweud a bydd y neges yn cael ei rhoi i’r milfeddygon, ond maent yn gweithio mor gyflym ag y gallent.
I understand the situation on Anglesey over the weekend when it took some time to burn animals. You know, Ieuan, that there is a scheme in place to move animal carcasses safely to Cheshire where there is a rendering plant dealing with the bodies. Where it is possible for lorries to move the bodies, it will be done. It is not always possible. The veterinary surgeons on farms are working as rapidly as they can to ensure that animals are burned, where necessary. We all understand what farming families are going through, having to look at the animals day after day. Therefore, I hear what you say and the message will be passed on to the veterinary surgeons, but they are working as quickly as they can.
As you stated, this disease is causing a huge amount of stress, including in my constituency of Brecon and Radnorshire at the moment. Will you alleviate some of this stress by making information on suspected cases available on a parish basis? Breconshire and Radnorshire are large areas and, on hearing of suspected cases there, many families are unnecessarily concerned that it is close to them, when it could be as far away as the upper Swansea Valley, the Carmarthenshire or Herefordshire borders. Will you therefore consider making information available on a parish basis?
Fel y dywedasoch, mae’r clwyf hwn yn rhoi pwysau mawr ar bobl, gan gynnwys pobl yn fy etholaeth i ym Mrycheiniog a Sir Faesyfed ar hyn o bryd. A leddfwch rywfaint o’r pwysau hyn drwy roi gwybodaeth am achosion posibl fesul plwyf? Mae Brycheiniog a Sir Faesyfed yn ardaloedd mawr ac, wrth glywed am achosion tybiedig yno, mae llawer o deuluoedd yn pryderu’n ddiangen fod y clwyf yn agos atynt, ond gallai fod mor bell i ffwrdd â Blaenau Cwm Tawe, neu ffiniau Sir Gaerfyrddin neu Swydd Henffordd. A ystyriwch felly roi gwybodaeth fesul plwyf?
What discussions have you had with banks in Wales? As you know, many agricultural businesses currently have significant cashflow problems. Barclays bank has been proactive, especially in my constituency, in telephoning customers who are farmers. What discussions have you had with other banks about what help they can give to farming businesses?
Pa drafodaethau a gawsoch â banciau yng Nghymru? Fel y gwyddoch, mae gan lawer o fusnesau amaethyddol broblemau llif arian sylweddol ar hyn o bryd. Bu banc Barclays yn rhagweithiol bob amser, yn arbennig yn fy etholaeth i, drwy ffonio cwsmeriaid sydd yn ffermwyr. Pa drafodaethau a gawsoch â banciau eraill ynglŷn â pha help y gallant ei roi i fusnesau ffermio?
A large area of Powys is currently a restricted area, with restrictions based on road and railway divisions. This has led to some farms being placed within a restricted area when they are a considerable distance from a confirmed case. This causes farmers great problems in terms of their ability to move and sell stock.
Mae rhan fawr o Bowys yn ardal gyfyngedig ar hyn o bryd, gyda chyfyngiadau yn seiliedig ar raniadau ffyrdd a rheilffyrdd. Arweiniodd hyn at osod rhai ffermydd o fewn ardal gyfyngedig er eu bod cryn bellter o achos sydd wedi ei gadarnhau. Mae hyn yn achosi problemau mawr i ffermwyr o ran eu gallu i symud a gwerthu anifeiliaid.
You failed to respond to Mick’s point on stock in restricted areas that cannot be sold. I know of a young farming couple who have 1,000 fat lambs in a shed in Llandrindod Wells. They cannot sell or move them. Every week, it costs about £1,500 to feed the lambs and every week they are worth less and less. At this time of year, the shed should be empty to allow pregnant ewes to come in for lambing. There are welfare issues in terms of how the family can continue to feed the stock and in terms of lambing. What news can I give to constituents who cannot sell their stock because they are in a restricted area, yet are finding it increasingly difficult to house and feed that stock?
Methasoch ag ymateb i bwynt Mick ar anifeiliaid mewn ardaloedd cyfyngedig na ellir eu gwerthu. Gwn am bâr ifanc sydd yn ffermio 1,000 o ŵyn tew mewn sied yn Llandrindod. Ni allant eu gwerthu na’u symud. Bob wythnos, mae’n costio tua £1,500 i fwydo’r ŵyn a phob wythnos maent yn werth llai a llai. Ar yr adeg hon o’r flwyddyn, dylai’r sied fod yn wag er mwyn i ddefaid cyfoen fwrw eu hŵyn. Mae materion lles yn gysylltiedig â sut y gall y teulu barhau i fwydo’r anifeiliaid ac o ran ŵyna. Pa newydd y gallaf ei roi i etholwyr na allant werthu eu hanifeiliaid gan eu bod mewn ardal gyfyngedig, ac eto yn ei chael hi’n gynyddol anodd i roi anifeiliaid dan do a’u bwydo?
I decided that we should not identify precisely where suspected cases were. At that time, there were many more suspected cases than confirmed cases, and I did not want the media trampling around every farm in Wales. There is also a legal difficulty in identifying suspected cases. We are currently seeking legal advice, as we are not legally entitled to reveal the names of farms where there are suspected cases. I will investigate whether that extends to naming wards. I heard farmers on the news last night complaining that they were not given precise indication of where suspected cases are. There are legal reasons for that at present. Although the press has identified farms, we did not give it that information. We are currently seeking legal clarification on this.
Penderfynais na ddylem nodi’n union ble yr oedd yr achosion tybiedig. Ar yr adeg honno, yr oedd llawer mwy o achosion tybiedig nag achosion wedi eu cadarnhau, ac nid oeddwn am i’r cyfryngau grwydro ar draws pob fferm yng Nghymru. Mae anhawster cyfreithiol hefyd wrth nodi achosion tybiedig. Yr ydym ar hyn o bryd yn ceisio cyngor cyfreithiol, gan nad oes hawl cyfreithiol gennym i ddatgelu enwau ffermydd lle y mae achosion tybiedig. Ymchwiliaf i weld a yw hynny’n ymestyn i enwi wardiau. Clywais ffermwyr ar y newyddion neithiwr yn cwyno na chawsant wybod yn union ble y mae’r achosion tybiedig. Mae rhesymau cyfreithiol dros hynny ar hyn o bryd. Er bod y wasg wedi enwi ffermydd, nid ni sydd wedi rhoi’r wybodaeth honno. Yr ydym yn ceisio eglurhad cyfreithiol am hyn ar hyn o bryd.
I welcome the actions of Barclays. I met HSBC bank this week and it indicated that it was adopting a similar policy, whereby it wanted to be of as much help as possible to farmers. I am not aware of statements by any other banks. I am not saying that banks have not made statements, only that I am not aware of any. Banks have much custom from farmers. At a time like this, it is exceptionally important that banks are seen to be sympathetic to their customers. I welcome what has been done so far. This ties in with Kirsty’s comments about the problems facing a family within a restricted area. They cannot move stock to the market. In effect, they are in suspense. Banks should consider such cases and put matters on hold for a few months until normal farming can resume. It is difficult, as we cannot tell such a family that they can sell their stock next week; we appreciate the problems. I ask banks to recognise that farmers are in suspense and that they do not have the required cashflow. Banks should take a sympathetic view and suspend bank payments by the family mentioned by Kirsty and all others in similar situations. That would be of enormous help. We must then ensure that, when restrictions are lifted, as much work as is humanly possible goes into lifting lamb prices to help these families. As Minister for Rural Affairs, I call on banks to adopt a sympathetic stance as regards families, such as the one Kirsty mentioned. I welcome the fact that some banks have already made statements on that. Once the crisis is over, no effort will be spared in assisting them to get a fair price for their stock.
Croesawaf weithredoedd Barclays. Cyfarfûm â banc HSBC yr wythnos hon a nododd ei fod yn mabwysiadu polisi tebyg, lle yr oedd yn dymuno bod o gymorth i ffermwyr gymaint â phosibl. Nid wyf yn ymwybodol o ddatganiadau gan unrhyw fanciau eraill. Ni ddywedaf nad yw banciau wedi gwneud datganiadau, dim ond nad wyf yn ymwybodol o unrhyw rai. Gwna ffermwyr lawer o fusnes gyda banciau. Ar adeg fel hon, mae’n eithriadol o bwysig bod banciau yn dangos cydymdeimlad tuag at eu cwsmeriaid. Croesawaf yr hyn a wnaethpwyd hyd yn hyn. Mae hyn yn cysylltu â sylwadau Kirsty ynglŷn â’r problemau sydd yn wynebu teulu o fewn ardal gyfyngedig. Ni allant symud anifeiliaid i’r farchnad. Mewn gwirionedd, mae pethau’n ansicr iawn. Dylai banciau ystyried achosion o’r fath a gohirio materion am ychydig o fisoedd nes y bydd gwaith ffermio arferol wedi ailddechrau. Mae’n anodd, gan na allwn ddweud wrth deulu o’r fath y gallant werthu eu hanifeiliaid yr wythnos nesaf; gwerthfawrogwn y problemau. Gofynnaf i’r banciau gydnabod bod y dyfodol yn ansicr i ffermwyr ac nad oes ganddynt y llif arian sydd yn ofynnol. Dylai’r banciau gydymdeimlo ac atal taliadau banc y teulu y soniodd Kirsty amdanynt a phob un arall mewn sefyllfa debyg. Byddai hynny o gymorth mawr. Rhaid inni sicrhau wedyn, pan godir y cyfyngiadau, y caiff cymaint o waith â phosibl ei wneud i godi prisiau cig oen er mwyn helpu’r teuluoedd hyn. Fel y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig, galwaf ar fanciau i fabwysiadu agwedd gydymdeimladol tuag at deuluoedd, fel yr un y soniodd Kirsty amdani. Croesawaf y ffaith fod rhai banciau eisoes wedi gwneud datganiadau ar hynny. Unwaith y daw’r argyfwng i ben, gwneir pob ymdrech i’w helpu i gael pris teg am eu hanifeiliaid.
On the divisions, whenever there is a restricted area, the State Veterinary Service looks for physical boundaries to confine an area. Otherwise, it is sometimes faced with a situation where the farmhouse is outside the confined area and the land is within, and so forth. Therefore, it must have physical boundaries so that people understand where the restricted area is. That means that there are some farms within the confined area that would not be within it as the crow flies, but it makes it easier to control the disease within that boundary. It can also work the other way. Where a physical boundary comes within a restricted area, there may be a farm on the other side of the boundary that is technically within the area, which also works for the State Veterinary Service. It does it deliberately to try to control the disease.
O ran mater y rhaniadau, pryd bynnag y bydd ardal gyfyngedig, bydd y Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol yn edrych am ffiniau ffisegol i gyfyngu ardal. Fel arall, fe’i hwynebir weithiau â sefyllfa lle y mae’r ffermdy y tu allan i’r ardal gyfyngedig a’r tir y tu mewn iddi, ac yn y blaen. Felly, rhaid cael ffiniau ffisegol fel bod pobl yn deall ymhle mae’r ardal gyfyngedig. Golyga hynny fod rhai ffermydd o fewn yr ardal gyfyngedig na fyddent o’i mewn fel yr hêd y frân, ond mae’n haws rheoli’r clwyf o fewn y ffin honno. Gall weithio’r ffordd arall hefyd. Pan ddaw ffin ffisegol o fewn ardal gyfyngedig, efallai bod fferm ar ochr arall y ffin sydd yn dechnegol o fewn yr ardal, sydd hefyd yn gweithio i’r Gwasanaeth Milfeddygol Gwladol. Gwna hyn yn fwriadol er mwyn ceisio rheoli’r clwyf.
Most of my questions have already been asked. However, I have three specific questions. Your statement today is a shock to me. For generations, my family and I have used Welshpool livestock market. There will be a significant slaughter of lambs in Montgomeryshire as a consequence of your decision. Many of us will find it difficult to come to terms with that over the next few days. It is a huge shock. I agree that the market that was held on 19 February may have been instrumental in spreading the disease. That is a possibility. That is why, despite the shock, I agree with your decision.
Gofynnwyd y rhan fwyaf o’m cwestiynau eisoes. Fodd bynnag, mae gennyf dri chwestiwn penodol. Mae eich datganiad heddiw wedi’m synnu. Ers cenedlaethau, mae fy nheulu a minnau wedi defnyddio marchad da byw’r Trallwng. Caiff nifer sylweddol o ŵyn eu lladd yn Sir Drefaldwyn o ganlyniad i’ch penderfyniad. Bydd llawer ohonom yn ei chael hi’n anodd dod i delerau â hynny dros yr ychydig ddyddiau nesaf. Mae’n sioc enfawr. Cytunaf y bu’r farchnad a gynhaliwyd ar 19 Chwefror yn gyfrwng i ledaenu’r clwyf o bosibl. Mae hynny’n bosibilrwydd. Dyna pam, er gwaetha’r sioc, y cytunaf â’ch penderfyniad.
I also agree with your comments on dealing with welfare cases out on tack. However, I want to return to an aspect of the question raised by Mick Bates and Kirsty Williams that you have not addressed. I received a fax marked ‘urgent’ this morning, which included the comment
Cytunaf hefyd â’ch sylwadau ar ymdrin ag achosion lles ar dir tac. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf am ddychwelyd at un agwedd ar y cwestiwn a godwyd gan Mick Bates a Kirsty Williams nad ymdriniasoch ag ef. Derbyniais ffacs ‘brys’ y bore yma, a oedd yn cynnwys y sylw
‘I am approaching the point of desperation and am at my wit’s end over what we will do with all these unsaleable animals.’
‘Yr wyf bron â digalonnu’n llwyr ac wn i ddim ble i droi wrth feddwl beth i’w wneud â’r holl anifeiliaid anwerthadwy yma.’
This fax is from a pig farmer who cannot keep his pigs. The only place for them as they reach a certain age is on top of each other, which is a huge welfare issue. It has nothing to do with cost anymore. It is to do with where these animals will go. In those special circumstances, I hope that you can deal with that.
Daw’r ffacs hwn oddi wrth ffermwr moch na all gadw ei foch. Yr unig le iddynt wrth iddynt gyrraedd oedran penodol yw ar ben ei gilydd, sydd yn fater lles anferth. Nid oes a wnelo ddim â chost rhagor. Mae’n ymwneud â ble yr aiff yr anifeiliaid hyn. O dan yr amgylchiadau arbennig hynny, gobeithiaf y gallwch ymdrin â hynny.
I want to address a few points that have arisen from the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee. On the decision that you made in a discussion, although not in your statement, that information will go to all farmers in Wales, there was not, perhaps, a meeting of minds between Committee members and you when this was discussed a fortnight ago. I welcome that, as I believe the Committee will. You are disseminating information as far as you can.
Yr wyf am ymdrin â rhai pwyntiau a gododd o’r Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig. O ran y penderfyniad a wnaethoch wrth drafod, er nad oedd yn eich datganiad, y bydd yr wybodaeth honno yn mynd at bob ffermwr yng Nghymru, nid oedd cytundeb efallai, rhwng aelodau’r Pwyllgor a chi pan drafodwyd hyn bythefnos yn ôl. Croesawaf hynny, fel y credaf y gwnaiff y Pwyllgor. Yr ydych yn dosbarthu gwybodaeth mor bell ag y gallwch.
On your announcement that there will be regular visits to farms within 3km of outbreaks. I declare an interest, as my farm will almost certainly fall within this. People who are worried that the inspectors, whoever they might be, are in danger of carrying the virus on to their farms have contacted me. I accept that these inspectors have not been on other farms beforehand, but they may have been in contact with people who have been on other farms, and people are worried that human beings are acting as carriers to each other, and then on to subsequent farms.
O ran eich cyhoeddiad y bydd ymweliadau rheolaidd â ffermydd o fewn 3km i achosion, datganaf fuddiant, gan y bydd fy fferm bron yn sicr yn disgyn i’r categori hwn. Mae pobl sydd yn gofidio y bydd yr arolygwyr, pwy bynnag y bônt, mewn perygl o gario’r firws ar eu ffermydd wedi cysylltu â mi. Derbyniaf nad yw’r arolygwyr hyn wedi bod ar ffermydd eraill cyn hyn, ond efallai y byddant wedi dod i gysylltiad â phobl sydd wedi bod ar ffermydd eraill, ac mae pobl yn gofidio bod pobl yn gweithredu fel cludwyr i’w gilydd, ac yna i ffermydd dilynol.
Finally, on the taskforce. Whatever you decide to do on this issue, whether it be a specific taskforce for Wales, as you described, or whether it is an extension of the London taskforce, the two discussions that we have had in the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee—yesterday and a fortnight ago—were effective. All the concerns that people have throughout Wales found a way into that debate. It was a good debate, and I hope that you ensure that whatever you do relates closely to the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee. In a political institution like this, there can be no better way to hold a detailed discussion on such an important issue.
Yn olaf, ar fater y tasglu. Beth bynnag y penderfynwch ei wneud ar y mater hwn, boed yn dasglu penodol i Gymru ai peidio, fel y disgrifiasoch, neu’n estyniad ar dasglu Llundain, yr oedd y ddwy drafodaeth a gawsom yn y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig—ddoe a phythefnos yn ôl—yn effeithiol. Mae’r holl bryderon sydd gan bobl ledled Cymru wedi treiddio i’r ddadl honno. Yr oedd yn ddadl dda, a gobeithiaf y sicrhewch fod gan beth bynnag a wnewch gysylltiad agos â’r Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig. Mewn sefydliad gwleidyddol fel hwn, nid oes ffordd well o gynnal trafodaeth fanwl ar fater mor bwysig â hyn.
On the case that you referred to, provision is being made for slaughter on welfare grounds where animals are away on tack. I understand the difficulties that are faced by some farmers who have stock that they cannot shift. Every effort is being made in order to resolve that. In many ways, it echoes the point made by Kirsty about the sheep farm in her constituency. Slaughter may be the only option available to the farmers whose animals are away. It is not a decision that is taken lightly by any farmer, but it must be brought to the attention of many farmers. I suggest that farmers, or those who have problems in infected areas, should seek advice, if they want, through the animal health office or the National Assembly helplines, where advice is given as to what action can be taken.
O ran yr achos y cyfeiriasoch ato, gwneir darpariaeth i ladd am resymau lles pan fydd anifeiliaid ar dir tac. Deallaf yr anawsterau a wynebir gan rai ffermwyr sydd ag anifeiliaid na allant eu symud. Gwneir pob ymdrech i ddatrys hynny. Mewn sawl ffordd, mae’n ategu’r pwynt a wnaeth Kirsty ynglŷn â’r fferm ddefaid yn ei hetholaeth hi. Efallai mai lladd yw’r unig opsiwn sydd ar gael i ffermwyr y mae eu hanifeiliaid oddi ar y fferm. Nid ar chwarae bach y gwneir y penderfyniad hwn gan unrhyw ffermwr, ond rhaid ei ddwyn i sylw llawer o ffermwyr. Awgrymaf y dylai ffermwyr, neu’r rheini sydd â phroblemau mewn ardaloedd heintus, ofyn am gyngor, os dymunant, drwy’r swyddfa iechyd anifeiliaid neu linellau cymorth y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol, lle y rhoddir cyngor ar ba gamau y gellir eu cymryd.
On distributing information to farmers, I have explained the initial stance that was taken. The farming unions have agreed—the NFU agreed and the FUW did not disagree—that there was no need to send out advice on paper at that stage. We now have a wodge of information that we need to send out. We will send out the information regarding animals on tack, if we can. I cannot guarantee it, but we will try. We have the information on the licensing system for the abattoirs and the movement of animals for welfare reasons. In my view, as we now have a rough idea of where the disease’s hot spots are located, and that the extra guidance that has been distributed to the post office, the balance swings the other way. I am prepared to do that.
Wrth ddosbarthu gwybodaeth i ffermwyr, eglurais y safbwynt cychwynnol a gymerwyd. Mae undebau’r ffermwyr wedi cytuno—cytunodd Undeb Cenedlaethol Ffermwyr ac nid anghytunodd Undeb Amaethwyr Cymru—nad oedd angen rhoi cyngor ar bapur bryd hynny. Bellach mae gennym dalp o wybodaeth y mae angen inni ei ddosbarthu. Byddwn yn anfon yr wybodaeth o ran anifeiliaid ar dir tac, os gallwn. Mae’r wybodaeth gennym am y system drwyddedu ar gyfer y lladd-dai ac am symudiadau anifeiliaid am resymau lles. Yn fy marn i, gan fod gennym syniad bras yn awr o ble y lleolir yr achosion mwyaf o’r clwy, a bod y canllawiau ychwanegol wedi’u ddosbarthu i swyddfa’r post, mae’r cydbwysedd yn newid i’r ffordd arall. Yr wyf yn barod i wneud hynny.
As I understand, the point about inspectors is that the same vet will go to a suspect farm until that farm is cleared. If the vet has been on a farm where a case has been confirmed, he or she is not allowed to visit another farm until seven days have elapsed. In other words, when a case is under investigation, it is not a problem if the same vet goes to the farm until the case is cleared. If the case is confirmed, a seven day period must elapse before the vet can visit another farm; it is not just a case of ‘wash your boots and off you go.’ This is regarded as safe practice by the vets concerned. I assure you that the vets are aware of the possibility of spreading the disease, and appropriate precautions are in place to ensure that that does not happen.
Fel y deallaf, y pwynt ynglŷn ag arolygwyr yw y bydd yr un milfeddyg yn mynd i fferm lle y mae achos tybiedig o’r clwyf hyd nes y bydd y fferm honno wedi ei chlirio. Os bydd milfeddyg wedi bod ar fferm lle y cadarnhawyd achos, ni chaiff ef neu hi ymweld â fferm arall nes bod saith diwrnod wedi mynd heibio. Mewn geiriau eraill, pan ymchwilir i achos, nid yw’n broblem os aiff yr un milfeddyg i’r fferm hyd nes y caiff yr achos ei glirio. Os cadarnheir yr achos, rhaid i gyfnod o saith diwrnod fynd heibio cyn y gall y milfeddyg ymweld â fferm arall; nid mater o ‘olchi eich esgidiau ac i ffwrdd â chi’ ydyw. Ystyrir hyn yn arfer diogel gan y milfeddygon dan sylw. Rhoddaf sicrwydd ichi fod y milfeddygon yn ymwybodol o’r posibilrwydd o ledaenu’r clwyf, a chymerir camau priodol i sicrhau nad yw hynny’n digwydd.
As far as the taskforce is concerned, I do not exclude anyone from what goes on. I am aware that party politics has not played a part in the situation so far. My view is that, in order for that situation to continue for the time being, it is important that people feel part of the process, and I am keen to involve the Committee wherever possible.
O ran y tasglu, nid wyf yn eithrio unrhyw un o’r hyn sydd yn digwydd. Yr wyf yn ymwybodol nad yw gwleidyddiaeth pleidiau wedi chwarae rhan yn y sefyllfa hyd yn hyn. Yn fy marn i, er mwyn i’r sefyllfa honno barhau am y tro, mae’n bwysig bod pobl yn teimlo’n rhan o’r broses, ac yr wyf yn awyddus i gynnwys y Pwyllgor lle bo hynny’n bosibl.
Datganiadau ar Effaith Clwy’r Traed a’r Genau ar Dwristiaeth
Statements on the Impact of Foot and Mouth on Tourism
Michael German The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Economic Development spoken in English p. 50
Michael German Y Dirprwy Brif Weinidog a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 50
I inform the Assembly about the actions that I am taking, with Carwyn Jones and other Cabinet colleagues, in relation to the impact of foot and mouth disease on tourism and tourism businesses in Wales. I fully agree with Carwyn that the priority must be to contain and eradicate the disease. From tomorrow onwards, I will give daily briefings to the press alongside Carwyn.
Hysbysaf y Cynulliad am y camau a gymeraf, gyda Carwyn Jones a chyd-Aelodau eraill yn y Cabinet, mewn perthynas ag effaith clwy’r traed a’r genau ar dwristiaeth a busnesau twristiaeth yng Nghymru. Cytunaf yn llwyr â Carwyn mai’r flaenoriaeth yw atal a dileu’r clwyf. O yfory ymlaen byddaf i a Carwyn yn rhoi gwybodaeth i’r wasg yn feunyddiol.
I am in daily contact with the Wales Tourist Board and met Philip Evans, the board’s chairman, and Jonathan Jones, its chief executive, yesterday evening to discuss this matter. I receive daily written reports based on information from around Wales. These reports reflect the news emerging in the media that the effects of the disease are having an immediate and serious impact.
Yr wyf yn cysylltu’n feunyddiol â Bwrdd Croeso Cymru a chyfarfûm â Philip Evans, cadeirydd y bwrdd, a Jonathan Jones, ei brif weithredwr, neithiwr i drafod y mater hwn. Derbyniaf adroddiadau ysgrifenedig beunyddiol yn seiliedig ar wybodaeth o amgylch Cymru. Adlewyrcha’r adroddiadau hyn y newyddion sydd yn ymddangos yn y cyfryngau bod effeithiau’r clwyf yn cael effaith uniongyrchol a difrifol.
It is too early to gain a full picture of the overall effect of foot and mouth disease on tourism businesses. However, it is already clear that incomes have fallen significantly, advance bookings are way below normal and are being cancelled, and workers are being laid off. This situation is affecting businesses throughout the tourism and hospitality industry in Wales, from bed and breakfasts and specialist operators, to other businesses such as petrol stations and village shops. We must also include museums and sports organisations.
Mae’n rhy gynnar i gael darlun llawn o effaith lawn clwy’r traed a’r genau ar fusnesau twristiaeth. Fodd bynnag, mae eisoes yn glir fod incwm wedi gostwng yn sylweddol, mae nifer yr archebion yn llawer is na’r arfer a chânt eu canslo, ac mae gweithwyr yn cael eu diswyddo. Mae’r sefyllfa’n effeithio ar fusnesau drwy’r diwydiant twristiaeth a chroeso yng Nghymru, o wely a brecwast i weithredwyr arbenigol, i fusnesau eraill fel gorsafoedd petrol a siopau pentref. Rhaid inni hefyd gynnwys amgueddfeydd a sefydliadau chwaraeon.
I emphasise that, despite the restrictions, Wales is open for business. A large number of attractions are open throughout Wales, such as the castles at Caernarfon, Conwy and Beaumaris, Llechwedd Slate caverns, the Ffestiniog Railway, the Centre for Alternative Technology in Machynlleth, the Dylan Thomas Boathouse in Laugharne, the Swansea Maritime and Industrial Museum and Techniquest in Cardiff. Most beaches are also open. The Wales Tourist Board is actively seeking to reinforce this message.
Pwysleisiaf, er gwaethaf y cyfyngiadau, fod Cymru ar agor ar gyfer busnes. Mae nifer fawr o atyniadau ar agor ledled Cymru, fel y cestyll yng Nghaernarfon, Conwy a Biwmares, ceudyllau Llechi Llechwedd, Rheilffordd Ffestiniog, y Ganolfan Dechnoleg Amgen ym Machynlleth, Tŷ Cwch Dylan Thomas yn Nhalacharn, Amgueddfa Forwrol a Diwydiannol Abertawe a Techniquest yng Nghaerdydd. Mae’r rhan fwyaf o’r traethau ar agor hefyd. Mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn ceisio atgyfnerthu’r neges hon.
I will outline some of the current work being undertaken by the Wales Tourist Board. The chairman has already visited operators throughout Wales and I intend to join him at meetings next week. The board has set up an intelligence service to obtain accurate information on the position on the ground, and it is using this to monitor the position closely.
Amlinellaf rywfaint o’r gwaith a wneir ar hyn o bryd gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru. Mae’r cadeirydd eisoes wedi ymweld â gweithredwyr ledled Cymru a bwriadaf ymuno ag ef mewn cyfarfodydd yr wythnos nesaf. Mae’r bwrdd wedi sefydlu gwasanaeth gwybodaeth i gael gwybodaeth gywir am y sefyllfa ar lawr gwlad, ac mae’n defnyddio hyn i fonitro’r sefyllfa’n agos.
The board has already launched a new communications campaign, costing some £100,000, with the aim of getting clear, factual and up-to-date information about the position in Wales into the marketplace. That includes hotlines for the public with information on what is open and places where people can stay. The board is taking action to reassure the American market following recent examples of blatant misinformation of the situation here.
Mae’r bwrdd eisoes wedi lansio ymgyrch gyfathrebu newydd, sydd yn costio tua £100,000, â’i nod yw cael gwybodaeth glir, ffeithiol a’r newyddion diweddaraf am y sefyllfa yng Nghymru i’r farchnad. Mae hynny’n cynnwys llinellau cymorth i’r cyhoedd gyda gwybodaeth ar beth sydd ar agor a lleoedd lle gall pobl aros. Mae’r bwrdd yn cymryd camau i roi sicrwydd i farchnad America yn dilyn enghreifftiau diweddar o gamhysbysrwydd amlwg ynglŷn â’r sefyllfa yma.
The Wales Tourist Board has decided to defer its planned general television advertising campaign, which was due to start in April, until such time as it is more appropriate and effective to do so. It will, however, continue with its planned poster campaign, which is scheduled for the second half of April. The board’s direct marketing campaign will also continue as planned, but there may be some changes to publication titles and messages. It will continue with its ‘Advantage’ initiative that provides Welsh tourism businesses with low-cost advertising opportunities in the UK marketplace.
Penderfynodd Bwrdd Croeso Cymru ohirio ei ymgyrch hysbysebu teledu gyffredinol, a oedd i fod i ddechrau ym mis Ebrill, hyd nes y bydd yn fwy priodol ac effeithiol i wneud hynny. Fodd bynnag, bydd yn parhau â’i ymgyrch posteri arfaethedig, a drefnwyd ar gyfer ail hanner mis Ebrill. Bydd ymgyrch farchnata uniongyrchol y bwrdd hefyd yn parhau fel y cynlluniwyd, ond efallai y bydd rhai newidiadau i deitlau cyhoeddiadau a negeseuon. Bydd yn parhau â’i fenter ‘Mantais’ sydd yn rhoi cyfleoedd hysbysebu rhad i fusnesau twristiaeth Cymru ym marchnad y DU.
I have also asked the board to consider what it could do in addition to promote tourism and tourism businesses in Wales when the situation here becomes clearer. It has already come forward with a number of proposals, which I am considering. This work by the Wales Tourist Board will be co-ordinated with the review, which will start tomorrow, of access restrictions, which Carwyn has already announced. Further guidance on venues, travel and so on, is being prepared.
Gofynnais hefyd i’r bwrdd ystyried beth y gallai ei wneud yn ychwanegol at hyrwyddo twristiaeth a busnesau twristiaeth yng Nghymru pan ddaw’r sefyllfa yma’n gliriach. Mae eisoes wedi cyflwyno nifer o gynigion, yr wyf yn eu hystyried. Caiff y gwaith hwn gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru ei gydlynu gyda’r arolwg, a fydd yn cychwyn yfory, o gyfyngiadau mynediad, y mae Carwyn eisoes wedi’u cyhoeddi. Mae canllawiau pellach ar leoliadau, teithio ac ati, yn cael ei baratoi.
The Wales Tourist Board is also acting in conjunction with the British Tourist Authority and other tourism bodies to ensure that a consistent message is given out. The board’s chief executive is attending, as an observer, the Tourism Summit hosted by the Minister for Tourism, Film and Broadcasting, Janet Anderson MP, this afternoon. I shall meet with the British Tourist Authority shortly. I also intend to communicate directly with the tourist trade in Wales to reassure operators that we are mindful of their situation and are taking steps to alleviate the position.
Mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru hefyd yn gweithredu mewn cydweithrediad ag Awdurdod Twristiaeth Prydain a chyrff twristiaeth eraill i sicrhau y caiff neges gyson ei chyfleu. Bydd prif weithredwr y bwrdd yn bresennol, fel sylwedydd, yr Uwch-Gynhadledd Dwristiaeth a drefnir gan y Gweinidog dros Dwristiaeth, Ffilm a Darlledu, Janet Anderson AS, y prynhawn yma. Byddaf yn cwrdd ag Awdurdod Twristiaeth Prydain yn fuan. Hefyd bwriadaf gyfathrebu’n uniongyrchol â’r fasnach dwristiaeth yng Nghymru i sicrhau gweithredwyr ein bod yn ymwybodol o’u sefyllfa ac yn cymryd camau i leddfu’r sefyllfa.
More widely, I have asked the Welsh Development Agency to consider urgently what additional support it can provide through its regional offices and through its business support arrangements. The WDA will also consider, in conjunction with the Assembly’s Agriculture Department and Welsh Food Promotions, what more can be done to further promote Welsh food and produce. I have also asked Finance Wales to consider the feasibility of setting up a hardship fund.
Yn fwy cyffredinol, yr wyf wedi gofyn i Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru ystyried ar frys pa gymorth ychwanegol y gall ei ddarparu drwy ei swyddfeydd rhanbarthol a thrwy ei drefniadau cymorth i fusnesau. Bydd yr Awdurdod hefyd yn ystyried, mewn cydweithrediad ag Adran Amaethyddiaeth y Cynulliad a Hybu Bwyd Cymru, beth yn fwy y gellir ei wneud i hyrwyddo bwyd a chynnyrch o Gymru ymhellach. Gofynnais hefyd i Gyllid Cymru ystyried y posibilrwydd o sefydlu cronfa caledi.
I shall also be writing to local authorities asking them to consider, urgently and sympathetically, how they could help businesses and communities. The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities, jointly with the Minister for Rural Affairs, will shortly meet with local authority leaders to consider the next steps.
Byddaf hefyd yn ysgrifennu at awdurdodau lleol gan ofyn iddynt ystyried, ar frys ac yn gydymdeimladol, sut y gallant helpu busnesau a chymunedau. Bydd y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau, ar y cyd â’r Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig, yn cyfarfod ag arweinwyr awdurdodau lleol cyn bo hir i ystyried y camau nesaf.
I am acutely aware that many businesses in Wales are experiencing severe financial difficulties. I have already written to the major banks in Wales to ask them to be as considerate as possible of their business clients in these exceptional and difficult times. Yesterday, the First Minister and I met with the Bank of England’s agent to ask it to encourage lending banks in Wales to be considerate and to enrol the banks with its support.
Yr wyf yn dra ymwybodol bod sawl busnes yng Nghymru yn wynebu anawsterau ariannol difrifol. Yr wyf eisoes wedi ysgrifennu at y prif fanciau yng Nghymru i ofyn iddynt fod mor ystyrlon â phosibl o’u clientau busnes yn ystod y cyfnod eithriadol ac anodd hwn. Ddoe, cyfarfu Prif Weinidog Cymru a minnau ag asiant o Fanc Lloegr i ofyn iddo annog banciau benthyca yng Nghymru i fod yn ystyrlon ac i roi cymorth i’r banciau.
We are also exploring what other flexibilities are possible to help businesses affected by the current situation. Businesses themselves can, for example, apply to the Valuation Office Agency for a change in rateable value, due to a material change in circumstances. The agency agrees that applications can be made for businesses in areas physically affected by foot and mouth disease.
Ystyriwn hefyd y dulliau hyblyg eraill sydd yn bosibl i helpu busnesau y mae’r sefyllfa bresennol yn effeithio arnynt. Gall y busnesau eu hunain, er enghraifft, wneud cais i Asiantaeth y Swyddfa Brisio am newid mewn gwerth trethiannol, oherwydd newid perthnasol mewn amgylchiadau. Cytuna’r asiantaeth y gellir gwneud ceisiadau ar gyfer busnesau mewn ardaloedd yr effeithir yn uniongyrchol arnynt gan glwy’r traed a’r genau.
Carwyn will describe the arrangements we are putting in place in Wales to co-ordinate our activities. These are some of the actions that we are taking. I am pleased that we are having a wide-ranging debate on all aspects of the situation on Tuesday, when I hope that I will be able to provide updated information to the Assembly.
Bydd Carwyn yn disgrifio’r trefniadau a wnawn yng Nghymru i gydlynu ein gweithgareddau. Dyma rai o’r camau a gymerwn. Yr wyf yn falch ein bod yn cael dadl eang ar bob agwedd ar y sefyllfa ddydd Mawrth, pan fyddaf gobeithio yn gallu rhoi’r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i’r Cynulliad.
I am pleased to hear you reaffirm that many attractions are still open for business. I hope that people will take the opportunity to visit them. I also welcome the fact that you will collect accurate information. That is necessary because there is a great deal of anecdotal information flying around. We need accurate information. I am also pleased to hear that the Wales Tourist Board is addressing the problems of relaunching and supporting tourism. I have raised several times—as have many other people—the need for a recovery strategy not only from the WTB, but also the Welsh Development Agency. I therefore fully support Elin Jones’s calls for a taskforce to co-ordinate recovery plans. However, all businesses in rural areas need immediate help. At the end of your statement you touched on the help that can be given now. I would have liked to have heard you talk more definitely about that because the Assembly can help businesses in rural areas now.
Yr wyf yn falch o’ch clywed yn ailddatgan bod sawl atyniad ar agor o hyd ar gyfer busnes. Gobeithio y bydd pobl yn manteisio ar y cyfle i ymweld â hwy. Hefyd croesawaf y ffaith y byddwch yn casglu gwybodaeth gywir. Mae hynny’n angenrheidiol gan fod llawer o wybodaeth anecdotaidd ar led. Mae angen gwybodaeth gywir arnom. Yr wyf hefyd yn falch o glywed bod Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn mynd i’r afael â phroblemau ail-lansio a chefnogi twristiaeth. Codais y pwynt sawl gwaith—fel llawer o bobl eraill—bod angen strategaeth adfer nid yn unig gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru, ond hefyd gan Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru. Felly cefnogaf geisiadau Elin Jones yn llawn am dasglu i gydlynu cynlluniau adfer. Fodd bynnag, mae angen help ar unwaith ar bob busnes mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Ar ddiwedd eich datganiad soniasoch am yr help y gellir ei roi yn awr. Byddwn wedi hoffi eich clywed yn siarad yn fwy pendant ynglŷn â hynny oherwydd gall y Cynulliad helpu busnesau mewn ardaloedd gwledig yn awr.
Perhaps we need to look slightly wider afield, at the old rural Objective 5b areas. Local authorities can use the hardship relief fund to grant up to 100 per cent rate relief to businesses that are experiencing difficulties in paying their bills. I would have liked to have heard you say today that you were moving ahead with that in conjunction with your partners in local government. Seventy-five per cent of that is funded from the non-domestic rating pool and 25 per cent from local government. Local government will need help in providing that 25 per cent. Perhaps we could consider a scheme similar to Bellwin where businesses would receive 100 per cent refunding. However, that 100 per cent rate relief must be implemented immediately. I would have liked to have heard a more concrete statement on that. I appreciate that the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities will speak to local government soon and I hope that that measure will be seriously considered. It would bring a great deal of relief and comfort to all the rural businesses that are suffering now.
Efallai fod angen inni edrych ychydig ymhellach, ar hen ardaloedd gwledig Amcan 5b. Gall awdurdodau lleol ddefnyddio’r gronfa lleddfu caledi i roi cyfradd gymorth hyd at 100 y cant i fusnesau sydd yn cael anhawster i dalu eu biliau. Byddwn wedi hoffi eich clywed yn dweud heddiw eich bod yn symud ymlaen ar hynny mewn cydweithrediad â’ch partneriaid mewn llywodraeth leol. Ariennir saith deg pump y cant o hynny gan y gronfa trethi busnes a 25 y cant gan lywodraeth leol. Bydd angen help ar lywodraeth leol wrth ddarparu’r 25 y cant hwnnw. Efallai y gallem ystyried cynllun tebyg i Bellwin lle y byddai busnesau’n derbyn ad-daliad o 100 y cant. Fodd bynnag, rhaid gweithredu’r gyfradd gymorth o 100 y cant ar unwaith. Byddwn wedi hoffi clywed datganiad mwy cadarn ar hynny. Gwerthfawrogaf y bydd y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau yn siarad â llywodraeth leol yn fuan a gobeithiaf yr ystyrir y mesur hwnnw’n ddifrifol. Byddai’n rhoi llawer o gymorth a chysur i’r holl fusnesau gwledig sydd yn dioddef yn awr.
I will address the last issue first, which is actively under consideration at the moment. It is not always as simple as it looks because we have to avoid contravening state aid rules, which must also be considered. That is one element that we must investigate in this situation. However, in terms of what can be done immediately—and I raised this issue—people can make a case for rate revaluation on the basis that their businesses are suffering at present. I hope that many businesses will do that. Both of those strategies are being pursued. On relaunching, it is essential that we have a campaign ready to ensure that when the all-clear is given, we are able to redouble our efforts and get more visitors into Wales than we have ever had before. That work has begun and the WTB is working with me on a detailed proposal. I will continue to inform the Assembly of that development as time passes. The WDA’s involvement is crucial. Most tourism businesses are businesses in their own right and will need support as such. I am assured that the arrangements announced by Carwyn this morning will include the WTB and the WDA.
Ymdriniaf â’r mater olaf yn gyntaf, sydd yn cael ei ystyried ar hyn o bryd. Nid yw mor syml ag yr ymddengys weithiau am fod rhaid inni osgoi torri rheolau cymorth y wladwriaeth, y mae’n rhaid eu hystyried hefyd. Mae hynny’n un elfen y mae’n rhaid i ni ei hystyried yn y sefyllfa hon. Fodd bynnag, o ran yr hyn y gellir ei wneud ar unwaith—a chodais y mater hwn—gall pobl ddadlau dros adbrisio trethi ar y sail bod eu busnesau’n dioddef ar hyn o bryd. Gobeithio y bydd sawl busnes yn gwneud hynny. Dilynir y ddwy strategaeth. Wrth ail-lansio, mae’n hanfodol bod gennym ymgyrch yn barod i sicrhau, pan ddywedir fod popeth yn iawn, y gallwn ymdrechu’n galetach a chael mwy o bobl i ymweld â Chymru nag erioed o’r blaen. Mae’r gwaith hwnnw wedi cychwyn ac mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru’n gweithio gyda mi ar gynnig manwl. Byddaf yn parhau i hysbysu’r Cynulliad o’r datblygiad hwnnw fel yr â amser yn ei flaen. Mae cyfranogiad y WDA yn hanfodol. Mae’r rhan fwyaf o fusnesau twristiaeth yn fusnesau ynddynt eu hunain a bydd angen cymorth arnynt. Rhoddwyd sicrwydd imi y bydd y trefniadau a gyhoeddwyd gan Carwyn y bore yma yn cynnwys y Bwrdd Croeso ac Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru.
I realise, as do other Members, that you are in a difficult position. As Minister for Economic Development you must play the hand that is dealt to you. I know that you will not lead the rural taskforce, but your input is key. The input of the Wales Office when we start to put together our application for any extra funding will also be key. That is why Elin Jones’s cheap jibe about David Hanson was so unfortunate and ill-advised. I would like her to retract that. We need to start telling people where they can go in the countryside—and we have had this discussion before, Mike—as well as where they cannot. I am glad to see that that is being sharpened up. I am particularly glad that you mentioned the Dylan Thomas Boathouse. You could also have mentioned Pembroke Castle and all of the west Wales beaches that can be reached by road. However, we must be robust about those areas that have to be reached by footpaths and which people cannot visit. We cannot relax the controls that the vets have asked us to impose.
Sylweddolaf, fel yr Aelodau eraill, eich bod mewn sefyllfa anodd. Fel y Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Economaidd rhaid i chi gymryd yr hyn a ddaw. Gobeithio na fyddwch yn arwain y tasglu gwledig, ond mae eich mewnbwn yn allweddol. Bydd mewnbwn Swyddfa Cymru pan fyddwn yn dechrau paratoi ein cais am unrhyw arian ychwanegol yn allweddol hefyd. Dyna pam yr oedd gwawd Elin Jones am David Hanson mor anffodus ac annoeth. Hoffwn iddi dynnu ei geiriau yn ôl. Mae angen inni ddechrau dweud wrth bobl ble y gallant fynd yng nghefn gwlad—ac yr ydym wedi cael y drafodaeth hon o’r blaen, Mike—yn ogystal â dweud wrthynt ble na chânt fynd. Yr wyf yn falch o weld bod canllaw mwy pendant ar gael. Yr wyf yn arbennig o falch i chi sôn am Dŷ Cwch Dylan Thomas. Gallech hefyd fod wedi sôn am Gastell Penfro a holl draethau gorllewin Cymru y gellir eu cyrraedd o’r ffordd. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni fod yn gadarn am yr ardaloedd hynny y mae’n rhaid eu cyrraedd ar hyd llwybrau troed ac na all pobl ymweld â hwy. Ni allwn lacio’r rheolau y mae’r milfeddygon wedi gofyn inni eu gosod.
You said that the Valuation Office Agency agreed that applications can be made for businesses in areas physically affected by foot and mouth disease. What exactly does that mean, because foot and mouth disease affects all rural Wales? Carwyn has mentioned a three-tier table of risk assessment. That might be valid for the farming community but I am not sure that it is adequate for tourism and other related rural businesses that are facing difficult times. Our marketing drive is for Wales as a tourist destination, not for the bits of Wales that are not in a restricted area. How will the Valuation Office Agency deal with those businesses that are not in a restricted area but which are nevertheless facing disaster?
Dywedasoch fod Asiantaeth y Swyddfa Brisio wedi cytuno y gellir gwneud ceisiadau ar gyfer busnesau mewn ardaloedd yr effeithir arnynt yn uniongyrchol gan glwy’r traed a’r genau. Beth yn union yw ystyr hynny, oherwydd mae clwy’r traed a’r genau yn effeithio ar Gymru wledig i gyd? Nododd Carwyn dabl tair haen o asesiad risg. Gallai hynny fod yn ddilys ar gyfer y gymuned ffermio ond nid wyf yn siŵr a yw’n ddigonol ar gyfer twristiaeth a busnesau gwledig cysylltiedig eraill sydd yn wynebu cyfnod anodd. Mae ein hymgyrch farchnata ar gyfer Cymru fel cyrchfan i dwristiaid, nid ar gyfer y rhannau o Gymru nad ydynt o fewn ardal gyfyngedig. Sut y bydd Asiantaeth y Swyddfa Brisio’n ymdrin â’r busnesau hynny nad ydynt mewn ardal gyfyngedig ond sydd serch hynny, yn wynebu trychineb?
There is an extensive list of the attractions, beaches and places that are open to visitors in Wales. That can be added to. However, our task is to ensure that people are aware of that list and are appreciative of the fact that we market it strongly. It is an extensive rather than a small list.
Mae rhestr hirfaith o’r atyniadau, y traethau a’r lleoedd sydd ar agor i ymwelwyr yng Nghymru. Gellir ychwanegu ati. Fodd bynnag, ein tasg ni yw sicrhau bod pobl yn ymwybodol o’r rhestr honno ac yn gwerthfawrogi’r ffaith ein bod yn ei marchnata’n gryf. Mae’n rhestr hir yn hytrach nag un fer.
I agree that we need further clarity on the Valuation Office Agency issue. I will hopefully be able to respond in further statements to the Assembly. It is clear that people could argue that their businesses have been affected even though they are a considerable distance from the outbreak, because of the restrictions that have been put in place. This will all become clearer when we reach the end of the 21-day incubation period tomorrow. We will then have a much clearer picture of the longer-term consequences, and be able to distinguish between those businesses that have a short-term or those that have a long-term problem. I hope to obtain a clearer view on that when I talk to the Valuation Office Agency.
Cytunaf fod angen eglurhad pellach arnom ar fater Asiantaeth y Swyddfa Brisio. Gobeithio y byddaf yn gallu ymateb mewn datganiadau pellach i’r Cynulliad. Mae’n glir y gallai pobl ddadlau yr effeithiwyd ar eu busnesau er eu bod cryn bellter o’r achosion, oherwydd y cyfyngiadau a osodwyd. Daw hyn oll yn glir pan ddown i ddiwedd y cyfnod heintus 21 diwrnod yfory. Bydd gennym wedyn ddarlun llawer cliriach wedyn o’r canlyniadau tymor hwy, a gallwn wahaniaethu rhwng y busnesau hynny sydd â phroblem tymor byr neu’r rhai hynny sydd â phroblem tymor hir. Gobeithio y bydd darlun cliriach gennyf ar hynny pan siaradaf ag Asiantaeth y Swyddfa Brisio.
On marketing across the United Kingdom, Members must recognise that our market place is not Wales. We are not marketing tourism to the people of Wales. Our market place is outside Wales and much of it is outside the United Kingdom, so we rely heavily on the British Tourist Authority. It is important that we are linked in with what is being done across the board in the United Kingdom. Relations with the UK Government will become clearer today when both the First Minister and I meet with Michael Meacher to discuss the arrangements that we want to see in place. We need to be able to provide Welsh solutions but we must work in partnership because our market place and the people that we are seeking to influence are largely outside the United Kingdom.
Wrth farchnata ledled y Deyrnas Unedig, rhaid i’r Aelodau gydnabod nad Cymru yw ein marchnad. Nid ydym yn marchnata twristiaeth i bobl Cymru. Mae ein marchnad y tu allan i Gymru ac mae llawer ohoni y tu allan i’r Deyrnas Unedig, felly dibynnwn lawer ar Awdurdod Twristiaeth Prydain. Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn gysylltiedig â’r hyn a gaiff ei wneud ledled y Deyrnas Unedig. Daw cysylltiadau â Llywodraeth y DU yn gliriach heddiw pan fydd Prif Weinidog Cymru a minnau’n cyfarfod â Michael Meacher i drafod y trefniadau y dymunwm eu gweld ar waith. Mae angen inni allu darparu atebion i Gymru ond rhaid inni weithio mewn partneriaeth gan fod ein marchnad a’r bobl yr ydym yn ceisio dylanwadu arnynt yn bennaf y tu allan i’r Deyrnas Unedig.
I am grateful to the Minister for his statement and welcome the press briefing that he proposes to give jointly with the Minister for Rural Affairs. We welcome the information that will be provided in the Daily Post, The Western Mail and other local papers about those press briefings. However, it is a challenge to cascade information throughout the rest of the United Kingdom, and beyond into Europe, towards the tourism market. I am grateful that you mentioned specific attractions in your statement, but as has been said since, there is a much longer list of open attractions and I ask that that be publicised wherever possible. This could be an opportunity for us to inform people of attractions in Wales, of which they would not otherwise have been made aware in the normal course of the tourism advertising programme.
Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i’r Gweinidog am ei ddatganiad a chroesawaf y cyfarfod i’r wasg y bwriada ei gynnal ar y cyd â’r Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig. Croesawn yr wybodaeth a ddarperir yn y Daily Post, The Western Mail a phapurau lleol eraill am y cyfarfodydd hyn i’r wasg. Fodd bynnag, mae’n her rhaeadru gwybodaeth drwy weddill y Deyrnas Unedig, ac ymhellach i Ewrop, tuag at y farchnad dwristiaid. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar ichi am sôn am atyniadau penodol yn eich datganiad, ond fel y dywedwyd ers hynny, mae rhestr llawer hwy o atyniadau sydd ar agor a gofynnaf am i honno gael ei chyhoeddi lle bynnag y bo’n bosibl. Gallai hwn fod yn gyfle inni hysbysu pobl o atyniadau yng Nghymru, na fyddent wedi bod yn ymwybodol ohonynt fel arall yn ystod hynt arferol y rhaglen hysbysebu twristiaeth.
The rural taskforce has received much coverage in the press, for various reasons. I was interested to hear in your statement about the English tourism summit, which the chief executive of the Wales Tourist Board will attend. Would you give us further details on that, if not now, perhaps in writing to explain the purpose of the summit and what input Wales will have into it? Would you reassure me that we will not be seen as second-class citizens in this summit?
Cafodd y tasglu gwledig lawer o sylw gan y wasg, am resymau amrywiol. Yr oedd gennyf ddiddordeb clywed yn eich datganiad am yr uwch-gynhadledd dwristiaeth yn Lloegr, y bydd prif weithredwr Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn ei mynychu. A allech roi manylion pellach inni am hynny, os nad yn awr, efallai yn ysgrifenedig i esbonio pwrpas y gynhadledd a pha fewnbwn fydd gan Gymru iddi? A allech fy sicrhau na chawn ein hystyried yn ddinasyddion eilradd yn yr uwch-gynhadledd hon?
Rate relief has already been raised. I echo the points made. With that in mind, will you condemn the comments made by Russell Goodway in the press today who calls for a tourism tax? That is not helpful. Any tax is unhelpful to business but given the crisis that tourism is facing at the moment, those comments are particularly unwelcome.
Codwyd mater cymorth trethi. Ategaf y pwyntiau a wnaethpwyd. O gofio hynny, a gondemniwch y sylwadau a wnaethpwyd gan Russell Goodway yn y wasg heddiw sydd yn galw am dreth twristiaeth? Nid yw hynny’n ddefnyddiol. Nid yw unrhyw dreth yn ddefnyddiol i fusnes ond o ystyried yr argyfwng y mae twristiaeth yn ei wynebu ar hyn o bryd, ni chroesewir y sylwadau hynny o gwbl.
I have not seen the report to which you refer, so I cannot comment on it. The purpose of the tourism summit, as I understand it, is to allow Janet Anderson, the Minister for Tourism, Film and Broadcasting, to hear about the current position from representatives of the tourism industry in England. I felt that it was appropriate to have an observer present in that summit so that we know exactly what is happening in England. England might equally want to be aware of what is happening in Wales. Co-ordinating our responses will be an issue for ongoing debate. It will presumably form part of our discussions this afternoon with Michael Meacher. I will also meet Janet Anderson and will report back to the Assembly on those discussions.
Ni welais yr adroddiad y cyfeiriwch ato, felly ni allaf roi sylwadau arno. Pwrpas y gynhadledd dwristiaeth, fel y deallaf, yw galluogi Janet Anderson, y Gweinidog dros Dwristiaeth, Ffilm a Darlledu, i glywed am y sefyllfa bresennol gan gynrychiolwyr o’r diwydiant twristiaeth yn Lloegr. Teimlais ei bod yn briodol cael sylwedydd yn bresennol yn y gynhadledd honno fel ein bod yn gwybod yn union beth sydd yn digwydd yn Lloegr. Efallai y bydd Lloegr yn yr un modd am fod yn ymwybodol o’r hyn sydd yn digwydd yng Nghymru. Bydd cydlynu ein hymatebion yn fater ar gyfer trafodaeth barhaus. Mae’n debyg y bydd yn ffurfio rhan o’n trafodaethau y prynhawn yma â Michael Meacher. Hefyd byddaf yn cyfarfod â Janet Anderson ac yn adrodd yn ôl i’r Cynulliad ar y trafodaethau hyn.
You are right that our task is to ensure that this list is widely known outside Wales. I will ensure that all Assembly Members know how to access this list. It will never be a perfect list, but it is, as far as we can judge, an up-to-date if those attractions that we have been informed are currently open. The Wales Tourist Board is trying to ensure that it is reactive to people so that the attractions that remain open are included in this list and communicated to the board. I will ensure that the maximum information possible is circulated to Members. It is crucial to ensure that this information is marketed outside Wales. I mentioned in my statement the marketing campaign in which the Wales Tourist Board is currently engaged.
Yr ydych yn iawn mai ein tasg yw sicrhau bod eich rhestr yn hysbys yn gyffredinol y tu allan i Gymru. Byddaf yn sicrhau bod pob Aelod Cynulliad yn gwybod sut i gael gafael ar y rhestr hon. Ni fydd byth yn rhestr berffaith, ond, hyd y gwelwn, mae’n cynnwys yr wybodaeth ddiweddaraf os yw’r atyniadau y dywedwyd wrthym amdanynt ar agor ar hyn o bryd. Mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru yn ceisio sicrhau ei fod yn ymateb i bobl fel y caiff yr atyniadau sydd yn parhau i fod ar agor eu cynnwys ar y rhestr hon a’u mynegi i’r bwrdd. Byddaf yn sicrhau y dosberthir cymaint â phosibl o wybodaeth i’r Aelodau. Mae’n hanfodol sicrhau y caiff yr wybodaeth hon ei marchnata y tu allan i Gymru. Soniais yn fy natganiad am yr ymgyrch farchnata y mae Bwrdd Croeso Cymru’n ymgymryd â hi ar hyn o bryd.
Colwyn Bay Welsh Mountain Zoo in my constituency employs up to 50 people in the summer. However, it is closed and it is in danger of closing permanently. The fact that it employs 50 people makes it a big employer in my constituency and it is a major attraction for visitors in north Wales. I encourage you to examine the possibility for compensation where there are definable and clearly provable losses. I encourage you to find and earmark a major Wales Tourist Board promotional campaign when we finally are clear of this dreadful disease. Also, will you liaise with Carwyn to get scientific officers to advise the zoo on the possibility of re-opening?
Mae Sŵ Fynydd Gymreig Bae Colwyn yn fy etholaeth i yn cyflogi hyd at 50 o bobl yn yr haf. Fodd bynnag, mae wedi cau ac mae mewn perygl o fod ar gau am byth. Mae’r ffaith ei fod yn cyflogi 50 o bobl yn ei wneud yn gyflogwr mawr yn fy etholaeth ac mae’n atyniad mawr i ymwelwyr yng ngogledd Cymru. Fe’ch anogaf i archwilio’r posibilrwydd o iawndal lle ceir colledion y gellir eu profi’n bendant a chlir. Fe’ch anogaf i ganfod a chlustnodi ymgyrch hyrwyddo fawr gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru pan fyddwn yn y pen draw yn rhydd o’r clwyf ofnadwy hwn. Hefyd, a gysylltwch â Carwyn i gael swyddogion gwyddonol i roi cyngor i’r sŵ ar y posibilrwydd o ailagor?
Certain areas of Scotland have been re-opened to the public so as to restart its tourist industry. Of course, there are no farm animals in some of the highland areas, such as Corrie an t-Sneachda and in certain areas of Aonach Mor. Will you liase with the Minister for Rural Affairs to examine the possibility of clearing all animals from, perhaps, one ‘honey pot’ area so that non-agricultural activities, which are worth far more in economic terms, can resume?
Ailagorwyd rhai ardaloedd o’r Alban i’r cyhoedd er mwyn ailgychwyn ei diwydiant twristiaeth. Wrth gwrs, nid oes unrhyw anifeiliaid fferm yn rhai o ardaloedd yr ucheldir, fel Corrie an t-Sneachda ac mewn rhai ardaloedd o Aonach Mor. A gysylltwch â’r Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig i archwilio’r posibilrwydd o symud yr holl anifeiliaid o un ardal boblogaidd iawn efallai fel y gellir parhau â gweithgareddau anamaethyddol, sydd yn werth llawer mwy yn economaidd?
The electronic signs on the A55 state that Snowdonia national park is closed. Could you liase with the Minister for Environment to amend these signs to inform people that the footpaths only are closed? Last Sunday, I could not go mountaineering, but I had a good time in the national park riding my mountain bike on the public highways. However, the roads, cafes and shops were empty and need not have been so.
Noda’r arwyddion electronig ar yr A55 fod parc cenedlaethol Eryri wedi cau. A allech gysylltu â’r Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd i ddiwygio’r arwyddion hynny i hysbysu pobl mai’r llwybrau troed yn unig sydd wedi cau? Ddydd Sul diwethaf, ni allwn fynd i fynydda, ond cefais amser da yn y parc cenedlaethol yn mynd ar fy meic mynydd ar y priffyrdd cyhoeddus. Fodd bynnag, roedd y ffyrdd, y caffis a’r siopau’n wag ac ni ddylent fod yn wag.
Part of the problem is informing the public. We must ensure that we inform people accurately. I welcome your support for the campaign that must follow the eradication of this dreadful disease. I will, of course, liaise with the Minister for Environment about the A55 signs. I heard about them last night. At the moment, no one can tell me whether those signs are still switched on. However, I hope that we can change those signs as rapidly as possible, because only the footpaths are closed, not the whole of the national park.
Rhan o’r broblem yw hysbysu’r cyhoedd. Rhaid inni sicrhau ein bod yn hysbysu pobl yn gywir. Croesawaf eich cefnogaeth am yr ymgyrch a ddaw o reidrwydd yn sgîl dileu’r clwyf ofnadwy hwn. Byddaf, wrth gwrs, yn cysylltu â’r Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd ynglŷn ag arwyddion yr A55. Clywais amdanynt neithiwr. Ar hyn o bryd, ni all unrhyw un ddweud wrthyf a yw’r arwyddion hynny ymlaen ai peidio. Fodd bynnag, gobeithio y gallwn newid yr arwyddion hynny cyn gynted â phosibl, oherwydd dim ond y llwybrau troed sydd ar gau, nid y parc cenedlaethol cyfan.
Colwyn Bay zoo must follow veterinary advice. I will ask Carwyn to ask the vets to investigate that matter. I will also ask officials from the Welsh Development Agency to approach the company to see if it can offer any assistance in short-term business planning and hold back, in terms of the banking situation to which I referred earlier, it that can be held back.
Rhaid i sŵ Bae Colwyn gael cyngor milfeddygol. Gofynnaf i Carwyn ofyn i’r milfeddygon ymchwilio i’r mater hwnnw. Hefyd gofynnaf i swyddogion o Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru gysylltu â’r cwmni i weld a all gynnig unrhyw gymorth o ran cynllunio busnes tymor byr a dal yn ôl, o ran y sefyllfa bancio y cyfeiriais ati’n gynharach, os gellir dal yn ôl.
The recovery of tourism is crucial. That is why we need to plan in advance. It may be a released planning in the sense that as more parts of Wales re-open for business, we must take progressive steps. However, that will not become clear for several days yet.
Mae adfer twristiaeth yn holl bwysig. Dyna pam y mae angen inni gynllunio ymlaen llaw. Gallai fod yn gynllunio a ryddheir yn yr ystyr bod rhaid inni yn raddol gymryd camau wrth i fwy o rannau o Gymru ailagor ar gyfer busnes. Fodd bynnag, ni ddaw hynny’n glir am sawl diwrnod arall.
We have a massive crisis threatening a tourist industry that provides 8 per cent of our GDP, on top of a crisis in steel and a long-standing crisis in agriculture. I listened carefully to your statement and most of it points to provisions that are already in place under fixed budgets to meet normal circumstances.
Mae gennym argyfwng enfawr sydd yn bygwth diwydiant twristiaeth sydd yn darparu 8 y cant o’n CMC, yn ogystal ag argyfwng yn y diwydiant dur ac argyfwng hirsefydlog mewn amaethyddiaeth. Gwrandewais yn ofalus ar eich datganiad ac mae’r rhan fwyaf ohono’n cyfeirio at ddarpariaethau sydd ar waith eisoes o dan gyllidebau sefydlog i fodloni amgylchiadau arferol.
You referred to a communications campaign—
Cyfeiriasoch at ymgyrch gyfathrebu—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 59
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 59
Order. Phil, I made it clear earlier that the lead speakers from all groups could have preambles. I need succinct questions from other speakers.
Trefn. Phil, eglurais yn gynharach y gallai prif lefarydd pob grŵp ragymadroddi. Mae arnaf angen cwestiynau cryno gan bob llefarydd arall.
The Wales Tourist Board has a communications campaign. This will be a massive campaign, especially to counter recent misinformation advertised in the United States. How much extra budget did the tourist board suggest that it would need? According to your statement, the WDA will give additional support. Will you have procedures to give them the additional budget? You propose a hardship fund for Finance Wales. Its budget is already less than originally intended, so will it have additional provision? The most important issue is that local authorities are being asked to help businesses and communities but, at the same time, you advise affected businesses to apply for rate reduction. We have the power to give substantial rate relief—
Mae gan Fwrdd Croeso Cymru ymgyrch gyfathrebu. Bydd hon yn ymgyrch enfawr, yn enwedig i wrthsefyll y camhysbysrwydd diweddar a hysbysebwyd yn yr Unol Daleithiau. Faint o gyllid ychwanegol a awgrymodd y bwrdd twristiaeth y byddai ei angen arno? Yn ôl eich datganiad bydd Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru yn rhoi cymorth ychwanegol. A fydd gennych weithdrefnau i roi’r gyllideb ychwanegol iddynt? Yr ydych yn cynnig cronfa caledi ar gyfer Cyllid Cymru. Mae ei gyllideb eisoes yn llai nag a fwriadwyd yn wreiddiol, felly a gaiff ddarpariaeth ychwanegol? Y mater pwysicaf yw y gofynnir i awdurdodau lleol helpu busnesau a chymunedau ond, ar yr un pryd, yr ydych yn rhoi cyngor i fusnesau yr effeithiwyd arnynt i wneud cais am ostyngiad mewn trethi. Mae gennym y pŵer i roi gostyniad sylweddol mewn trethi—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 60
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 60
Order. I ask Members to adhere to the statement that I issued this morning. I would like succinct questions.
Trefn. Gofynnaf i’r Aelodau gadw at y datganiad a ddosbarthais y bore yma. Hoffwn gael cwestiynau cryno.
I have a specific question. I have looked carefully through the statement and they require extra budgets. In the light of the Corus crisis, you are already in discussions with Edwina Hart, the Treasury and the European Union to prepare the case for substantial additional resources. Have you discussed that during your ongoing discussions with those bodies?
Mae gennyf gwestiwn penodol. Edrychais yn ofalus drwy’r datganiad ac mae angen cyllidebau ychwanegol arnynt. O ystyried argyfwng Corus, yr ydych eisoes yn cael trafodaethau ag Edwina Hart, y Trysorlys a’r Undeb Ewropeaidd i baratoi’r ddadl dros gael adnoddau ychwanegol sylweddol. A ydych wedi trafod hynny yn ystod eich trafodaethau parhaus â’r cyrff hynny?
As I indicated earlier, alterations to the budget will be a matter for ongoing discussion within the Cabinet and with the UK Government. It is far too early to give an answer as to how we will fund them when we have not yet provided the answers to the problems. At this stage, we must plan for the recovery and seek to fund that appropriately. Discussions will continue. Your question is premature but you have my assurance that the plans for recovery will have top priority in the Cabinet.
Fel y nodais yn gynharach, bydd newidiadau i’r gyllideb yn fater ar gyfer trafodaeth barhaus o fewn y Cabinet ac â Llywodraeth y DU. Mae’n llawer rhy gynnar i roi ateb ar sut y byddwn yn eu hariannu pan nad ydym wedi darparu’r atebion i’r problemau eto. Ar hyn o bryd, rhaid inni gynllunio ar gyfer yr adferiad a cheisio ariannu hynny’n briodol. Bydd trafodaethau’n parhau. Mae eich cwestiwn yn un cynamserol ond gallaf eich sicrhau y caiff y cynlluniau ar gyfer adfer y flaenoriaeth uchaf yn y Cabinet.
Thank you for your statement and reassurances about how seriously this issue is being taken. Those of us who have talked to tourism businesses know how serious this matter is. I am told that—
Diolch am eich datganiad a’ch sicrhad ynglŷn â pha mor ddifrifol y caiff y mater ei gymryd. Mae’r rhai hynny sydd wedi siarad â busnesau twristiaeth yn gwybod pa mor ddifrifol yw’r mater hwn. Dywedir wrthyf—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 61
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61
Order. You are not ‘told’. With respect, I have asked Members to ask succinct questions—
Trefn. Ni ‘ddywedir’ wrthych. Gyda pharch, gofynnais i’r Aelodau ofyn cwestiynau cryno—
That was the start of my question.
Dyna oedd dechrau fy nghwestiwn.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 61
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61
Beginning a sentence with ‘I am told’ is a statement. I want a question.
Mae dechrau brawddeg gyda ‘dywedir’ yn ddatganiad. Cwestiwn yr hoffwn i ei gael.
I am told by tourism operators that the end of March is the critical period for Easter bookings. What steps will you take to assist these bookings? I also understand that the outdoor activities and walking centres need guidance. Will you keep in close contact with Carwyn and Sue Essex about the possibility of opening selected walks in national parks if they can be supervised? Finally, will you examine existing grant schemes, particularly European Commission funding and structural fund schemes, to see whether some of those can be rescheduled to assist people with their immediate priorities?
Dywed gweithredwyr twristiaeth wrthyf mai diwedd Mawrth yw’r cyfnod pwysig ar gyfer archebion y Pasg. Pa gamau a gymerwch i gynorthwyo’r archebion hyn? Deallaf hefyd fod angen cymorth ar y gweithgareddau awyr agored a chanolfannau cerdded. A gadwch mewn cysylltiad agos â Carwyn a Sue Essex ynglŷn â’r posibilrwydd o agor llwybrau cerdded dethol mewn parciau cenedlaethol os gellir eu goruchwylio? Yn olaf, a archwiliwch gynlluniau grant presennol, yn arbennig arian y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd a chynlluniau cronfeydd strwythurol, i weld a ellir ad-drefnu rhai ohonynt i gynorthwyo pobl â’u blaenoriaethau uniongyrchol?
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 61
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61
There were three questions there. That is unacceptable. My statement this morning was agreed by the business managers of all parties. The arrangement was that lead speakers for party groups would be allowed a preamble and that questions from other speakers should be succinct. I appreciate that you are Chair of the Economic Development Committee and as such you may wish to ask specific questions. However, I ask Members to adhere to this agreement otherwise, there is no point in making it.
Gofynnwyd tri chwestiwn. Mae hynny’n annerbyniol. Cytunodd rheolwyr busnes pob plaid â’m datganiad y bore yma. Y trefniant oedd y byddai prif lefarwyr grwpiau pleidiau yn cael rhagymadroddi ac y dylai cwestiynau gan lefarwyr eraill fod yn gryno. Gwerthfawrogaf mai chi yw Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd ac felly efallai y byddwch am ofyn cwestiynau penodol. Fodd bynnag, gofynnaf i’r Aelodau gadw at y cytundeb hwn neu, nid oes unrhyw bwynt ei wneud.
May I have clarification—
A allaf gael eglurhad—
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 61
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61
Order. This is not a point of clarification. I am ruling on a matter of order, which arose from my statement this morning.
Trefn. Nid pwynt o eglurhad yw hwn. Yr wyf yn dyfarnu ar bwynt o drefn, a gododd o’m datganiad y bore yma.
May we only ask one question?
Ai dim ond un cwestiwn y gallwn ei ofyn?
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 62
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 62
Succinct questions.
Cwestiynau cryno.
I will answer three points. I will examine the European funding schemes to see how they may be used to help. I will seek advice on that. The guidance for outdoor centres and scheduling opening walks is an issue on which we must have veterinary advice. That answers your question about how I link with Carwyn. I will be a member of the rural partnership sub-group that Carwyn mentioned and will be fully engaged with him in developing a recovery plan.
Atebaf dri phwynt. Archwiliaf y cynlluniau ariannu Ewropeaidd i weld sut y gellir eu defnyddio i helpu. Byddaf yn ceisio cael cyngor ar hynny. Mae’r canllaw ar gyfer canolfannau awyr agored a threfnu teithiau cerdded yn fater y mae’n rhaid inni gael cyngor milfeddygol arno. Mae hynny’n ateb eich cwestiwn ar sut y byddaf yn cysylltu â Carwyn. Byddaf yn aelod o’r is-grŵp partneriaeth wledig y soniodd Carwyn amdano a byddaf yn cysylltu ag ef wrth ddatblygu cynllun adfer.
The quarter day is crucial for the tourism industry, as that is when it traditionally pays its interest. It pays it on a quarterly basis, rather than a monthly loan basis. I am concerned that many businesses will be seeking the most support on that date. Easter bookings can only be dealt with on a day to day basis as the situation develops. This will hopefully become clearer tomorrow. The campaign that I mentioned earlier will be helpful, but it may not necessarily be all that is required on a day to day basis. We will not know how much of Wales will be reopened until we receive the veterinary advice.
Mae’r dydd pentymor yn hanfodol ar gyfer y diwydiant twristiaeth, gan mai dyma’r amser pan fydd yn draddodiadol yn talu ei log. Mae’n ei dalu ar sail chwarterol, yn hytrach nag ar sail benthyciad misol. Pryderaf y bydd sawl busnes yn chwilio am y gefnogaeth fwyaf ar y dyddiad hwnnw. Dim ond ar sail ddyddiol y gellir ymdrin ag archebion ar gyfer y Pasg wrth i’r sefyllfa ddatblygu. Gobeithio y daw hyn yn gliriach yfory. Bydd yr ymgyrch y soniais amdani’n gynharach yn ddefnyddiol, ond efallai nad hynny’n unig fydd ei angen ar sail ddyddiol. Ni fyddwn yn gwybod faint o Gymru a fydd yn ailagor nes inni gael cyngor milfeddygol.
In view of the fact that Montgomeryshire has been hit hard by foot and mouth disease and the closure of the KTH factory—as you are aware following your visit to Llanidloes—will you consider using the hardship fund to target areas such as Montgomeryshire, and Llanidloes in particular? It is not within an Objective 1 area and does not receive regional selective assistance. As these areas are in such deep competition, we are in danger of not being able to attract new businesses or retain the ones we have.
O gofio’r ffaith yr effeithiwyd yn gryf ar Sir Drefaldwyn gan glwy’r traed a’r genau a chau ffatri KTH—fel y gwyddoch yn dilyn eich ymweliad â Llanidloes—a fyddwch yn ystyried defnyddio’r gronfa caledi i dargedu ardaloedd fel Sir Drefaldwyn, a Llanidloes yn arbennig? Nid yw o fewn ardal Amcan 1 ac nid yw’n derbyn cymorth dethol rhanbarthol. Gan fod yr ardaloedd hyn yn wynebu cymaint o gystadleuaeth, yr ydym mewn perygl o beidio â gallu denu busnesau newydd neu gadw’r rhai sydd gennym.
As I announced in my statement, I have asked Finance Wales to consider the feasibility of setting up a hardship fund. It will take time to create a framework for that. We are currently discussing whether we can allow access to funding to companies that may wish to locate in Montgomeryshire. Regardless of the foot and mouth crisis, I hope that I can come forward with good news within a few weeks on giving support to companies that want to grow and invest in mid Wales.
Fel y cyhoeddais yn fy natganiad, gofynnais i Gyllid Cymru ystyried y posibilrwydd o sefydlu cronfa caledi. Bydd yn cymryd amser i greu fframwaith ar gyfer hynny. Ar hyn o bryd, yr ydym yn trafod sut y gallwn ganiatáu mynediad i arian ar gyfer cwmnïau sydd am sefydlu yn Sir Drefaldwyn efallai. Er gwaethaf argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau, gobeithio y gallaf gyflwyno newyddion da o fewn ychydig wythnosau ar roi cefnogaeth i gwmnïau sydd am dyfu a buddsoddi yng nghanolbarth Cymru.
Datganiad gan y Trefnydd
Statement by the Minister for Assembly Business
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 63
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 63
I understand that the Minister for Assembly Business has good news for me.
Deallaf fod gan y Trefnydd newyddion da imi.
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 63
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 63
I am tempted to ask what you mean by that. However, I inform Members that the First Minister’s statement on the progress of the partnership Government has been withdrawn. I will reschedule it as early as possible.
Caf fy nhemtio i ofyn beth a olygwch wrth hynny. Fodd bynnag, hysbysaf yr Aelodau bod datganiad y Prif Weinidog ar gynnydd y Llywodraeth bartneriaeth wedi’i dynnu’n ôl a byddaf yn ei aildrefnu cyn gynted â phosibl.
Datganiad ar Fenter Caffael Cymru
Statement on the Welsh Procurement Initiative
Edwina Hart The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities spoken in English p. 63
Edwina Hart Y Gweinidog Dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 63
My statement has been placed on the Chamberweb and, in the interest of time, I will not read it, but move straight to questions, provided that Members or the Presiding Officer do not object.
Rhoddwyd fy natganiad ar We’r Siambr ac, oherwydd cyfyngiadau amser, nis darllenaf, ond symudaf yn syth at gwestiynau, ar yr amod nad yw’r Aelodau neu’r Llywydd yn gwrthwynebu.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 63
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 63
I have no objection, although I am sure someone will object at a later stage.
Nid oes gennyf unrhyw wrthwynebiad, ond yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd rhywun yn gwrthwynebu yn ddiweddarach.
Y datganiad a ddarparwyd ar we’r Siambr: The statement provided on the Chamberweb:
In my statement to the Assembly last April, I announced the development of a national initiative to achieve better value for money from the expenditure on procurement by the Welsh public sector—that is, those public bodies in Wales funded or part funded by the Assembly. I can now announce that a fundamental review of procurement has been completed and the report, ‘Better Value Wales’, is available on the Assembly’s website.
Yn fy natganiad i’r Cynulliad fis Ebrill diwethaf, cyhoeddais ddatblygiad menter genedlaethol i gyflawni mwy o werth am arian o’r gwariant ar gaffael gan sector cyhoeddus Cymru—hynny yw, y cyrff cyhoeddus hynny yng Nghymru a ariennir neu a ariennir yn rhannol gan y Cynulliad. Gallaf yn awr gyhoeddi y cwblhawyd adolygiad sylfaenol o gaffael ac mae’r adroddiad, ‘Gwell Gwerth Cymru’ ar gael ar wefan y Cynulliad.
A steering group oversaw the review. This group consisted of senior representatives from the Welsh public sector including the Welsh Local Government Association, the health service, further and higher education, the National Audit Office and the Audit Commission. I would like to thank both the individuals and the organisations they represented for their considerable contribution to this review.
Goruchwyliwyd yr adolygiad gan grŵp llywio a oedd yn cynnwys uwch gynrychiolwyr o’r sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru gan gynnwys Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, y gwasanaeth iechyd, addysg bellach ac uwch, y Swyddfa Archwilio Genedlaethol a’r Comisiwn Archwilio. Hoffwn ddiolch i’r unigolion a’r sefydliadau a gynrychiolwyd ganddynt am eu cyfraniad sylweddol i’r adolygiad hwn.
The review team sought the maximum input from those involved in procurement in both the public and private sectors. The review has gathered evidence from a wide-ranging and large number of sources throughout Wales and beyond. This included a survey of every Welsh public body and numerous suppliers. Incorporated in this evidence gathering was a series of regional seminars for senior officers of public bodies throughout Wales. The views and experience of our public sector partners in Wales has provided a key element of the evidence base for the report’s findings and recommendations.
Gofynnodd y tîm adolygu am y cyfraniad mwyaf posibl gan y rheini sydd yn cymryd rhan mewn caffael yn y sector cyhoeddus a’r sector preifat. Casglodd yr adolygiad dystiolaeth o nifer o ffynonellau eang eu cwmpas ledled Cymru a thu hwnt. Yr oedd hyn yn cynnwys arolwg o bob corff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru a llu o gyflenwyr. Yn gynwysedig yn y dystiolaeth hon yr oedd cyfres o seminarau rhanbarthol ar gyfer uwch swyddogion cyrff cyhoeddus ledled Cymru. Mae barn a phrofiad ein partneriaid sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru wedi darparu elfen allweddol o sail tystiolaeth ar gyfer canfyddiadau ac argymhellion yr adroddiad.
It is worth pointing out that the scope of this review is unique. It is the first time that procurement as a cross-cutting issue has been reviewed across an entire public sector. The existence of the Assembly has meant that we have been able to adopt a truly joined-up approach to procurement in Wales.
Mae’n werth nodi fod cwmpas yr adolygiad yn unigryw. Dyma’r tro cyntaf i gaffael fel mater trawsbynciol gael ei adolygu ar draws sector cyhoeddus cyfan. Mae bodolaeth y Cynulliad wedi ein galluogi i fabwysiadu ymagwedd hollol gydlynus tuag at gaffael yng Nghymru.
The report estimates that expenditure on procurement by the Welsh public sector, in its broadest definition, totals £3 billion per annum. As a result of the significant increases in the Assembly’s budget, this is set to rise over the next three years. The expenditure covered by this report is equivalent to 40 per cent of the Assembly’s budget and represents 11 per cent of Wales’s gross domestic product. Consequently, the way in which this huge investment is spent is vitally important to Wales, its economy, and its environment.
Mae’r adroddiad yn amcangyfrif bod cyfanswm y gwariant ar gaffael gan y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru, o ran ei ddiffiniad ehangaf, yn £3 biliwn y flwyddyn. O ganlyniad i’r cynnydd sylweddol yng nghyllideb y Cynulliad, bydd hyn yn codi dros y tair blynedd nesaf. Mae’r gwariant a gwmpesir gan yr adroddiad hwn yn dod i gyfanswm o 40 y cant o gyllideb y Cynulliad ac yn cynrychioli 11 y cant o gynnyrch mewnwladol crynswth Cymru. O ganlyniad, mae’r ffordd y caiff y buddsoddiad enfawr hwn ei wario yn holl bwysig i Gymru, ei heconomi a’r amgylchedd.
The standard of procurement varies greatly across the Welsh public sector. There are a number of examples of good procurement practice, and the introduction of best value for local authorities in Wales has already highlighted some of these. However, the report also highlights that, within the Welsh public sector, considerable opportunities exist for quality enhancement and improved value for money through increased co-operation and a genuine partnership approach. The report also includes several recommendations to ensure that procurement policies are based on sustainable development objectives, simultaneously achieving value for money, strengthening local employment opportunities and providing environmental and efficiency benefits. The report’s recommendations, if implemented, would also make a significant contribution to other policy initiatives such as modernisation, equal opportunities and health and safety.
Mae safon y caffael yn amrywio’n fawr ar draws y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Mae nifer o enghreifftiau o arfer caffael da, ac mae cyflwyno gwerth gorau ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru eisoes wedi amlygu rhai o’r rhain. Fodd bynnag, mae’r adroddiad hefyd yn amlygu bod cryn gyfleodd yn bodoli ar gyfer gwella ansawdd a gwella gwerth am arian o fewn y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru, drwy fwy o gydweithredu ac ymagwedd bartneriaeth wirioneddol. Mae’r adroddiad hefyd yn cynnwys nifer o argymhellion i sicrhau bod polisïau caffael yn seiliedig ar amcanion datblygu cynaliadwy, gan gyflawni gwerth am arian ar yr un pryd â chryfhau cyfleoedd cyflogaeth lleol a darparu manteision amgylcheddol ac effeithlonrwydd. Byddai argymhellion yr adroddiad, os cânt eu gweithredu, hefyd yn gwneud cyfraniad sylweddol i fentrau polisi eraill fel moderneiddio, cyfle cyfartal ac iechyd a diogelwch.
Examples of some of the key recommendations in the report that will provide tangible benefits for the Welsh public sector are: the adoption of a gateway quality assurance review process to help ensure that major capital projects are completed on time and within budget; that the Assembly supports, with finance if necessary, innovative value for money projects that would have benefits across organisations and sectors; the undertaking of a scoping study for implementing an electronic commerce strategy for the Welsh public sector; a number of measures to improve supplier access, particularly Welsh supplier access, to public sector business via websites and electronic databases; and an increased investment in procurement training and professionalism.
Ymhlith yr enghreifftiau o rai o’r argymhellion allweddol yn yr adroddiad a fydd yn darparu manteision gwirioneddol i’r sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru mae: mabwysiadu proses adolygu sicrwydd ansawdd porth i helpu i sicrhau y cwblheir prosiectau cyfalaf mawr mewn pryd ac o fewn y gyllideb; bod y Cynulliad yn cefnogi prosiectau arloesol sydd yn rhoi gwerth am arian, ac yn eu hariannu os oes angen, a fyddai o fudd i sefydliadau a sectorau yn gyffredinol; ymgymryd ag astudiaeth cwmpas er mwyn gweithredu strategaeth masnach electronig ar gyfer y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru; nifer o fesurau i wella mynediad cyflenwyr, yn arbennig mynediad cyflenwr Cymreig, i fusnesau’r sector cyhoeddus drwy wefannau a chronfeydd data electronig; a mwy o fuddsoddiad mewn hyfforddiant caffael a phroffesiynoldeb.
The report concludes that, if its recommendations are implemented, potential value for money savings amounting to some £90 million per annum are achievable over time and across the public sector as a whole. My intention is that they would be retained by those public sector bodies that achieved them and reinvested to augment and improve front-line services. We must be realistic about this sum and recognise that savings will come through by different means, and it will take time to build up to them. But, the more efficient our procurement can be, the more we can devote to providing better services.
Daw’r adroddiad i’r casgliad y gellid cyflawni arbedion effeithlonrwydd o ryw £90 miliwn y flwyddyn dros amser ac ar draws y sector cyhoeddus yn gyffredinol, pe gweithredid ei argymhellion. Fy mwriad yw y caent eu cadw gan y cyrff hynny yn y sector cyhoeddus a’u cyflanwodd a’u hailfuddsoddi er mwyn ategu a gwella gwasanaethau llinell flaen. Rhaid inni fod yn realistig am y swm hwn a chydnabod y daw arbedion drwy wahanol ddulliau, ac y cymer amser i’w cronni. Ond, po fwyaf effeithlon fydd ein caffael, y mwyaf y gallwn ei ymroi i ddarparu gwasanaethau gwell.
It is important to understand that what is being proposed here is a collaborative approach across the public sector in Wales. It is not a takeover by the Assembly, nor am I proposing that we should set up some expensive and elaborate new group or body at the centre to run things. The bodies on the ground know their own businesses best and can do this for themselves. What we need to do is to put efficient procurement further up the agenda in Wales and make sure that we adopt a professional and co-ordinated approach to get the best value we can.
Mae’n bwysig deall mai’r hyn a gynigir yma yw ymagwedd gydweithredol ar draws y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Nid yw’r Cynulliad yn ei gymryd drosodd, ac nid wyf ychwaith yn awgrymu y dylem sefydlu rhyw grŵp neu gorff newydd drud a chymhleth yn y canol i redeg pethau. Y cyrff ar lawr gwlad sydd yn adnabod eu busnesau eu hunain orau a gallant wneud hyn eu hunain. Yr hyn sydd angen i ni ei wneud yw rhoi caffael effeithlon yn uwch ar yr agenda yng Nghymru a sicrhau ein bod yn mabwysiadu ymagwedd broffesiynol a chydlynus i gael y gwerth gorau posibl.
I believe that this represents an unparalleled opportunity for the Assembly and our public sector partners to work closer together to get better value from our procurement expenditure for the people of Wales.
Credaf fod hyn yn gyfle digyffelyb i’r Cynulliad a’n partneriaid yn y sector cyhoeddus gydweithio’n fwy clòs i gael gwell gwerth o’n gwariant caffael ar gyfer pobl Cymru.
I have asked my officials to consult formally with the Welsh public sector and other interested organisations on the report’s recommendations. To encourage the fullest possible response from our public sector partners, three secondees have joined the review team to represent the Welsh Local Government Association, the health service and further and higher education. This is a good example of the underlying theme of the review, namely partnership in action.
Yr wyf wedi gofyn i’m swyddogion ymgynghori’n swyddogol â’r sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru a sefydliadau eraill â diddordeb ynghylch argymhellion yr adroddiad. Er mwyn annog yr ymateb llawnaf posibl gan ein partneriaid yn y sector cyhoeddus, mae tri pherson ar secondiad wedi ymuno â’r tîm adolygu i gynrychioli Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, y gwasanaeth iechyd ac addysg bellach ac addysg uwch. Mae hyn yn enghraifft dda o’r thema sydd yn sail i’r adolygiad, sef partneriaeth ar waith.
The Business Partnership Council will also be considering at its meeting on Monday, 26 March a proposal for a joint working group of officers from local government and the Assembly specifically to examine the scope for further improvements to procurement practice from a local government perspective. This recognises once again that a partnership approach is essential, particularly when we are talking about local government, which has its own democratic accountability.
Bydd y Cyngor Partneriaeth Busnes hefyd yn ystyried yn ei gyfarfod ddydd Llun, 26 Mawrth, gynnig ar gyfer cyd-weithgor o swyddogion o lywodraeth leol a’r Cynulliad yn benodol i archwilio’r posibilrwydd ar gyfer gwelliannau pellach i arfer caffael o safbwynt llywodraeth leol. Mae hyn yn cydnabod unwaith eto bod ymagwedd partneriaeth yn hanfodol, yn arbennig pan drafodwn lywodraeth leol, sydd â’i atebolrwydd democrataidd ei hun.
Once I have considered the responses to this consultation, I will then report back on what action the Assembly should take to move this initiative forward.
Wedi i mi ystyried yr ymatebion i’r ymgynghoriad hwn, byddaf wedyn yn adrodd yn ôl ar ba gamau y dylai’r Cynulliad eu cymryd i ddatblygu’r fenter hon.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 66
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 66
I call Peter Law to speak.
Galwaf ar Peter Law i siarad.
Does that mean that I am regarded as the lead speaker for my party? If so, I will make a longer contribution than I otherwise might have.
A yw hynny’n golygu y caf fy ystyried fel prif siaradwr fy mhlaid? Os felly, gwnaf gyfraniad hwy nag y byddwn wedi gwneud fel arall.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 67
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 67
Yes, but you have had your preamble.
Cewch, ond yr ydych eisoes wedi rhoi eich rhagarweiniad.
All Members who have worked in local government, the health service or education, as I have, have wondered for many years why someone does not co-ordinate this centrally and grab it by the scruff of the neck. Immense savings could be made, from which public services in Wales could benefit. I was delighted to read this statement, which the Minister promised last April. I am pleased that there will be consultation on the opportunity for Better Value Wales. I am sure that health, education, local government and others will welcome the statement. Even those in the private sector will welcome it, as it gets to grip with this issue. I note that any savings made by these organisations will be reinvested to augment and improve front-line services. Improving front-line services for the people of Wales is central to this.
Mae pob Aelod sydd wedi gweithio mewn llywodraeth leol, y gwasanaeth iechyd neu addysg, fel y gwneuthum i, wedi pendroni ers blynyddoedd pam nad oes unrhyw un yn cydlynu hyn yn ganolog a gafael ynddo gerfydd ei war. Gellid gwneud arbedion sylweddol iawn, a gallai’r gwasanaethau cyhoeddus yng Nghymru elwa ohonynt. Yr oeddwn wrth fy modd yn darllen y datganiad hwn, a addawyd gan y Gweinidog fis Ebrill diwethaf. Yr wyf yn falch y bydd gwell ymgynghori ar y cyfle ar gyfer Gwell Gwerth Cymru. Yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd iechyd, addysg, llywodraeth leol ac eraill yn croesawu’r datganiad. Bydd hyd yn oed y rheini yn y sector preifat yn ei groesawu, gan ei fod yn mynd i’r afael â’r mater hwn. Nodaf y caiff unrhyw arbedion a wneir gan y sefydliadau hyn ei ailfuddsoddi i ategu a gwella gwasanaethau’r rheng flaen. Mae gwella gwasanaethau’r rheng flaen ar gyfer pobl Cymru yn ganolog i hyn.
Would any of the assistance and resources provided by the Assembly be chargeable to any organisations? I would not want anything to deter to our going forward to make as much saving as possible to reinvest in frontline services to the public.
A godir tâl ar unrhyw sefydliad am unrhyw gymorth ac adnoddau a ddarperir gan y Cynulliad? Ni fyddwn am i unrhyw beth ein rhwystro rhag mynd ati i arbed cymaint â phosibl i ailfuddsoddi mewn gwasanaethau llinell flaen ar gyfer y cyhoedd.
We want to get economies of scale, but creating a public sector central buying organisation will not be an option. That was discussed, but it was rejected. That gives the health sector, and others, security and knowledge that their expertise will continue to be used. On your particular point, this is an investor save opportunity for the Assembly and public sector partners. It is essential that no-one is charged for participating in it.
Yr ydym am gael darbodusrwydd maint, ond ni fydd creu sefydliadau prynu canolog yn y sector cyhoeddus yn opsiwn. Trafodwyd hynny, ond fe’i gwrthodwyd. Rhydd hynny ddiogelwch a sicrwydd i’r sector iechyd, ac eraill, y parheir i ddefnyddio eu harbenigedd. O ran eich pwynt penodol, mae hwn yn gyfle i’r Cynulliad a phartneriaid y sector cyhoeddus fuddsoddi a chynilo. Mae’n hanfodol na chodir tâl ar unrhyw un am gyfranogi ynddo.
We welcome this statement. I would like clarification on two points. First, on the consultation, will this be available to all Members once you have received it? I ask that you safeguard it. Secondly, as a genuine safeguard, on this matter that cost savings, once identified, will be retained by public sector bodies. Is there a proper safeguard mechanism for this, so that these are achieved by genuine cost savings and not by simple cheeseparing, which may lead to jeopardising safety or design considerations? I assume that many of these cost savings will be brought about, hopefully, by local purchase. I await your comments on that with great interest.
Croesawn y datganiad hwn. Hoffwn gael eglurhad ar ddau bwynt. Yn gyntaf, o ran ymgynghori, a fydd hyn ar gael i bob Aelod wedi i chi ei dderbyn? Gofynnaf i chi ei ddiogelu. Yn ail, fel cam diogelu gwirioneddol, ar y mater hwn y caiff arbedion cost, wedi iddynt gael eu nodi, eu cadw gan gyrff sector cyhoeddus. A oes dull diogelu cywir ar gyfer hyn, fel y gellir cyflawni’r rhain drwy arbedion cost gwirioneddol ac nid drwy grintachrwydd, a allai arwain at beryglu ystyriaethau diogelwch neu gynllunio? Tybiaf y deillia llawer o’r arbedion cost hyn, gobeithio, o brynu’n lleol. Disgwyliaf yn awchus am eich sylwadau ar hynny.
It will be available to Members, and I would be delighted if Members or groups wish to comment on the consultation process. The necessary safeguards will be in place. These are genuine cost savings. We would not want that to impact on any elements of services, health and safety or anything. There are significant interests in local purchase, and there are some issues that we would need to consider in that regard, that can be taken into account in these discussions.
Bydd ar gael i’r Aelodau, a byddwn wrth fy modd pe bai’r Aelodau neu grwpiau am wneud sylwadau ar y broses ymgynghori. Bydd y camau diogelu angenrheidiol ar waith. Mae’r rhain yn arbedion cost gwirioneddol. Ni fyddem am i hynny effeithio ar elfennau o’r gwasanaethau, iechyd a diogelwch neu unrhyw beth. Mae buddiannau sylweddol mewn prynu’n lleol, ac mae rhai materion y byddai angen inni eu hystyried yn hynny o beth. Gellid eu hystyried yn y trafodaethau hyn.
I agree with everything that Peter Law has said about this. It shows how much buying power Assembly sponsored public bodies have, and what a difference an extra £90 million a year would make to frontline services. It also underlines the current need for local authorities to use their buying power to stimulate their local economies by buying local produce and sourcing locally, therefore helping local businesses. Can you clarify one thing regarding the gateway quality assurance review? If that timescale is too tight in light of any legal challenge, such as is currently happening at Rhydfelen and Gartholwg, how flexible is it so that investment opportunities will not be lost?
Cytunaf â phopeth a ddywedodd Peter Law am hyn. Dengys faint o bŵer prynu sydd gan gyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad, a pha wahaniaeth y byddai £90 miliwn ychwanegol y flwyddyn yn ei wneud i wasanaethau llinell flaen. Mae hefyd yn pwysleisio’r angen presennol i awdurdodau lleol ddefnyddio eu pŵer prynu i ysgogi eu heconomïau lleol drwy brynu cynnyrch lleol a ffynnonellu’n lleol, gan helpu busnesau lleol drwy hynny. A allwch egluro un peth ynghylch adolygiad sicrwydd ansawdd y porth? Os yw’r terfyn amser hwnnw’n rhy gyfyng yng ngoleuni unrhyw her gyfreithiol, fel sydd yn digwydd ar hyn o bryd yn Rhydfelen a Gartholwg, pa mor hyblyg ydyw er mwyn sicrhau na chollir cyfleoedd buddsoddi?
That point about flexibility has been raised earlier today. I will take it back and consider it.
Codwyd y pwynt hwnnw am hyblygrwydd yn gynharach heddiw. Fe’i nodaf a’i ystyried.
I welcome this statement, particularly the savings that are intended to be made from it. I also welcome the fact that the review team will include the Welsh Local Government Association, the health service, and the further and higher education sectors. What arrangements are being made to ensure that Assembly sponsored public bodies are fully included in this review, and are fully onboard in achieving the savings that are necessary in their departments also?
Croesawaf y datganiad hwn, yn arbennig yr arbedion y bwriedir eu cyflawni. Croesawaf hefyd y ffaith y bydd y tîm adolygu yn cynnwys Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, y gwasanaeth iechyd, a’r sectorau addysg bellach ac addysg uwch. Pa drefniadau a wneir i sicrhau y caiff cyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad eu cynnwys yn llawn yn yr adolygiad hwn, a’u bod yn cyflawni’r arbedion sydd eu hangen yn eu hadrannau hefyd?
We have initially included the key main players who have a great deal of expertise in procurement, particularly health and local government where there are examples of good procurement policies. As this project develops, we will try to get experience from Assembly sponsored public bodies. However, they do not have the same volume as the key players, but I hope that the best practice that emerges from this will be applicable to them.
I gychwyn yr ydym wedi cynnwys y prif sefydliadau allweddol sydd â chryn arbenigedd mewn caffael, yn arbennig iechyd a llywodraeth leol lle ceir enghreifftiau o bolisïau caffael da. Wrth i’r prosiect hwn ddatblygu, byddwn yn ceisio cael profiad gan gyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad. Fodd bynnag, nid oes yr un nifer â’r sefydliadau allweddol, ond gobeithiaf y bydd yr arfer gorau sydd yn deillio o hyn yn berthnasol iddynt hwy.
Cynnig Cyfansawdd: Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Addysg
Composite Motion: Approval of Education Order
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 69
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 69
Cyflwynir y cynnig hwn o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 22.25 ac felly nid yw’n destun dadl.
This motion is tabled under Standing Order No. 22.25 and is therefore not subject to debate.
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 69
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 69
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Cynnig cyfansawdd Andrew Davies t. 69
Composite motion Andrew Davies p. 69
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 35 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (35)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Peter Black
- Rosemary Butler
- Cynog Dafis
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Glyn Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Alison Halford
- Brian Hancock
- Edwina Hart
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Cynnig Trefniadol
Procedural Motion
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 70
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 70
I have agreed that the Minister for Assembly Business may propose a procedural motion, under Standing Order No. 6.16, to bring forward two motions tabled on 8 March. I call the Minister to propose the motion.
Yr wyf wedi cytuno y gall y Trefnydd gynnig cynnig trefniadol, o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 6.16, i ddwyn ymlaen ddau gynnig a gyflwynwyd ar 8 Mawrth. Galwaf ar y Gweinidog i gynnig y cynnig.
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 70
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 70
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Cynnig trefniadol Andrew Davies t. 70
Procedural motion Andrew Davies p. 70
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 36 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (36)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Rosemary Butler
- Christine Chapman
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Glyn Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Brian Hancock
- Edwina Hart
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Drafft Plaleiddiaid (Lefelau Uchaf y Gweddillion mewn Cnydau, Bwyd a Phorthiant) (Cymru a Lloegr) 2001
Approval of the Draft Pesticides (Maximum Residue Levels in Crops, Food and Feeding Stuffs) (England and Wales) Regulations 2001
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 71
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 38 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (38)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Rosemary Butler
- Christine Chapman
- Cynog Dafis
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Glyn Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Brian Hancock
- Edwina Hart
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Drafft Cynhyrchion Amddiffyn Planhigion (Diwygio) 2001
Approval of the Draft Plant Protection Products (Amendment) Regulations 2001
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 72
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 72
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 41 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (41)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Cynog Dafis
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Glyn Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Alison Halford
- Edwina Hart
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Cymeradwyo Adroddiadau Blynyddol Llywodraethwyr Ysgol (Cymru) (Diwygio) 2001
Approval of the School Governors’ Annual Reports (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2001
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning spoken in English p. 73
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 73
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning (continued) spoken in English p. 74
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 74
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning (continued) spoken in English p. 74
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 74
I am grateful for the opportunity to bring these new regulations before the Assembly. The changes that they introduce are, at first glance, quite small. However, they are important not because of what they introduce but how they were developed. The changes further enhance governors’ reports to schools and will ensure that in future parents will have a more focused picture of the work undertaken by the governing body, by the headteacher and of course by the teachers. From September 2001, annual reports will include details of what action has been taken to review school polices and what action has been taken to implement and review specific school strategies.
Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am y cyfle i ddod â’r rheoliadau newydd hyn gerbron y Cynulliad. Mae’r newidiadau a gyflwynant, ar yr olwg gyntaf, yn eithaf bach. Fodd bynnag, maent yn bwysig nid oherwydd yr hyn a gyflwynant ond y ffordd y cawsant eu datblygu. Mae’r newidiadau yn gwella adroddiadau llywodraethwyr i ysgolion ymhellach a bydd yn sicrhau y bydd rhieni, yn y dyfodol, yn cael darlun â mwy o ffocws iddo o’r gwaith a wneir gan y corff llywodraethol, gan y pennaeth ac wrth gwrs gan yr athrawon. O fis Medi 2001, bydd adroddiadau blynyddol yn cynnwys manylion pa gamau a gymerwyd i adolygu polisïau’r ysgolion a pha gamau a gymerwyd i weithredu ac adolygu strategaethau ysgol penodol.
Additionally, and perhaps more importantly, the changes will help reduce the administrative and financial burden placed on schools by giving governing bodies the option of producing better focused and more audience-specific reports. Schools have been concerned for a long time about the cost and distribution of the annual report. The new regulations will enable schools to produce a summary report and make a full report available to those who wish to see it.
Yn ogystal, ac efallai yn bwysicach, bydd y newidiadau yn helpu i leihau’r baich gweinyddol ac ariannol ar ysgolion drwy roi’r opsiwn i gyrff llywodraethol o gynhyrchu adroddiadau ag iddynt fwy o ffocws sydd wedi’u targedu’n fwy at y gynulleidfa. Mae ysgolion wedi bod yn pryderu ers peth amser ynghylch cost a dosbarthiad adroddiadau blynyddol. Bydd y rheoliadau newydd yn galluogi ysgolion i gynhyrchu crynodeb o’r adroddiad a sicrhau bod adroddiad llawn ar gael i’r rhai sydd yn dymuno ei weld.
I mentioned how these changes were developed. I am pleased to say that they are a good example of this administration working with and listening to professionals and practitioners. The initial proposals issued for consultation were drawn up by the Schools Information and Parents Working Group, the membership of which included representatives of primary and secondary schools, special schools, governors, parents, Estyn and the Qualifications, Curriculum and Assessment Authority for Wales, ACCAC. They all signed up and contributed towards the final proposals. The working group did not feel it necessary or appropriate to reduce the list of information currently included in annual reports, confirming that each section of information was relevant and of interest to parents.
Crybwyllais sut y datblygwyd y newidiadau hyn. Mae’n bleser gennyf ddweud eu bod yn enghraifft dda o’r weinyddiaeth hon yn gweithio gyda phobl broffesiynol ac ymarferwyr ac yn gwrando arnynt. Lluniwyd y cynigion gwreiddiol ar gyfer ymgynghori gyda’r Gweithgor Gwybodaeth Ysgolion a Rheini. Ymhlith yr aelodau yr oedd cynrychiolwyr ysgolion cynradd ac uwchradd, ysgolion arbennig, llywodraethwyr, rhieni, Estyn ac Awdurdod Cymwysterau, Cwricwlwm ac Asesu Cymru, ACCAC. Cymeradwyodd pob un ohonynt y cynigion terfynol a chyfrannu tuag atynt. Nid oedd y gweithgor o’r farn ei bod yn angenrheidiol nac yn briodol lleihau’r rhestr o wybodaeth a gynhwysir ar hyn o bryd mewn adroddiadau blynyddol, gan gadarnhau fod pob adran o wybodaeth yn berthnasol ac o ddiddordeb i rieni.
Responses to the consultation were positive and the proposals for changing the distribution arrangements drew a particularly enthusiastic response. Respondents saw the benefit of producing only sufficient reports to meet the demand from parents. However, it is paramount that all parents have the opportunity to attend the annual meeting and are aware of the recent performance of the school. The regulations make provision for this.
Yr oedd yr ymatebion i’r ymgynghoriad yn gadarnhaol a chafwyd ymateb arbennig o frwdfrydig i’r cynigion ar gyfer newid y trefniadau dosbarthu. Gwelodd yr ymatebwyr fanteision cynhyrchu dim ond digon o adroddiadau i gwrdd â’r galw gan rieni. Fodd bynnag, mae’n holl bwysig y caiff pob rhiant y cyfle i fynychu’r cyfarfod blynyddol a’u bod yn ymwybodol o berfformiad diweddar yr ysgol. Darpara’r rheoliadau ar gyfer hyn.
There is a statutory duty on governing bodies to send out, as a minimum, details of the annual meeting, the membership of the governing body and the most recent performance and target information. That will enable all parents to make a contribution not only to the running of the school but also to the continuing efforts to raise standards.
Mae dyletswydd statudol ar gyrff llywodraethol i anfon allan, fel isafswm, fanylion y cyfarfod blynyddol, enwau aelodau’r corff llywodraethol a’r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am berfformiad a thargedau. Bydd hynny’n galluogi pob rhiant i wneud cyfraniad, nid yn unig tuag at redeg yr ysgol, ond hefyd i’r ymdrechion parhaus i godi safonau.
It is clear from the working group and the comments made by respondents that schools need to stimulate a greater participation of parents in the annual meeting. In response to these comments and a specific request from the working group, we will be issuing new guidance for schools and governing bodies that will aim to highlight examples of good practice and provide practical ideas for producing more engaging material. I hope the new guidance will provide ideas that will generate a higher level of interest and participation. It will be cast in terms that will not create additional burdens on schools and was welcomed by participants in the group.
Mae’n amlwg o’r gweithgor ac o’r sylwadau a wnaethpwyd gan ymatebwyr bod angen i ysgolion ysgogi mwy o gyfranogiad gan rieni yn y cyfarfod blynyddol. Mewn ymateb i’r sylwadau hyn a chais penodol gan y gweithgor, byddwn yn cyhoeddi canllawiau newydd i ysgolion a chyrff llywodraethol a fydd yn anelu at amlygu enghreifftiau o arfer da a darparu syniadau ymarferol ar gyfer cynhyrchu deunydd mwy diddorol. Gobeithiaf y bydd y canllawiau newydd yn darparu syniadau a fydd yn ysgogi mwy o ddiddordeb a chyfranogiad. Bydd wedi’i lunio fel na fydd yn creu baich ychwanegol ar ysgolion ac fe’i croesawyd gan gyfranogwyr y grŵp.
The guidance will seek to encourage flexibility in how schools produce their documents, not only in the way that they are presented, but also in the methods used to make them accessible to parents and members of the public. I am keen to see schools make more use of the internet as a method of presenting material in a way that can be easily updated, enabling them to make the full range of information available without incurring the significant and expensive burden of regularly updating a paper copy.
Bydd y canllawiau yn ceisio annog hyblygrwydd yn y ffordd y bydd ysgolion yn cynhyrchu eu dogfennau, nid yn unig y ffordd y cânt eu cyflwyno, ond hefyd y dulliau a ddefnyddir i sicrhau eu bod ar gael i rieni ac aelodau o’r cyhoedd. Yr wyf yn awyddus i weld ysgolion yn gwneud mwy o ddefnydd o’r rhyngrwyd fel modd o gyflwyno deunydd mewn ffordd na ellir ei ddiweddaru’n hawdd, fydd yn eu galluogi i sicrhau bod yr ystod lawn o wybodaeth ar gael heb y baich sylweddol a chostus o ddiweddaru copi papur yn rheolaidd.
I am confident that coupled with these new regulations, the accompanying guidance will result in more engaging and informative material being produced by schools. Governing bodies will now have greater flexibility in the way they prepare and distribute their reports and at the same time parents will have access to a full range of information in a format which may facilitate greater involvement in the annual meeting. Increased interest and participation can only benefit our schools and governing bodies through heightened contributions to the running of schools and a continuing commitment to raising standards.
Yr wyf yn hyderus y bydd y canllawiau atodol, ynghyd â’r rheoliadau newydd hyn, yn arwain at greu deunydd mwy diddorol a hyddysg gan ysgolion. Bydd gan gyrff llywodraethol yn awr fwy o hyblygrwydd yn y ffordd y maent yn paratoi ac yn dosbarthu eu hadroddiadau ac ar yr un pryd bydd gan rieni fynediad i ystod lawn o wybodaeth ar ffurf a all hwyluso mwy o gyfranogiad yn y cyfarfod blynyddol. Dim ond drwy fwy o gyfraniadau tuag at redeg ysgolion ac ymrwymiad parhaus i godi safonau y gall mwy o ddiddordeb a chyfranogiad fod o fudd i’n hysgolion a’n cyrff llywodraethol.
I look forward to Members’ comments.
Edrychaf ymlaen at sylwadau’r Aelodau.
Nid welais yr ymateb a’r ymgynghori o’r drafodaeth ar y mater hwn. Fodd bynnag, derbyniaf yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog fod galw o hyd am y math hwn o gyfarfod blynyddol ac adroddiad blynyddol. Mae’n anodd credu hynny wrth ystyried nifer y rhieni sydd yn mynychu’r cyfarfodydd hyn yn flynyddol. Ar eu ffurf bresennol, maent yn wastraff ar amser ac yn haen ychwanegol o fiwrocratiaeth i’n hysgolion.
I have not seen the response and the consultation from the discussion on this matter. However, I accept what the Minister said that there is still a demand for this kind of annual meeting and annual report. It is difficult to believe that, given the number of parents who attend these meetings annually. In their present form, they are a waste of time and an additional tier of bureaucracy for our schools.
Dywedodd y Gweinidog ei bod yn bwriadu lleihau biwrocratiaeth a gwaith papur yn ein hysgolion. Felly, teimlaf fod cyfle bendigedig wedi’i golli yma i leihau biwrocratiaeth. Derbyniaf fod angen cyfleu gwybodaeth drylwyr i rieni am yr ysgol a chynnydd disgyblion. Fodd bynnag, cynhelir y cyfarfodydd hyn fel arfer ar ddiwedd tymor yr haf ac maent yn cyfeirio at blant sydd eisoes wedi gadael yr ysgol. Felly, yn y cyd-destun hwnnw maent yn ddibwrpas.
The Minister said that she intends to reduce bureaucracy and paper work in our schools. Therefore, I feel that an excellent opportunity has been missed here to reduce bureaucracy. I accept that there is a need to convey detailed information to parents about the school and pupil progress. However, these meetings are usually held at the end of the summer term and refer to children that have already left the school. Therefore, in that context they serve no purpose.
Nid wyf yn bwriadu rhwystro’r rheoliadau hyn: rhaid iddynt gael eu cymeradwyo. Cefnogaf yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog. Fodd bynnag, gofynnaf i’r Gweinidog sicrhau bod y Pwyllgor Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes yn cael cyfle i drafod y rheoliadau hyn gyda’r bwriad o ddiddymu’r math hwn o fiwrocratiaeth yn ein hysgolion. Etifeddiaeth oes y Torïaid ydyw yn bennaf ac mae’n rhywbeth y gallwn wneud hebddo. Fodd bynnag, bydd cyfle efallai i ailystyried ac ailedrych ar hyn gyda’r bwriad o leihau gwaith gweinyddol ein llywodraethwyr a’n penaethiaid.
I do not intend to oppose these regulations: they must be approved. I support what the Minister has said. However, I ask the Minister to ensure that the Education and Lifelong Learning Committee has an opportunity to discuss these regulations with the intention of abolishing this kind of bureaucracy in our schools. It is mainly a relic from the days of the Conservatives and it is something that we can do without. However, there might be an opportunity to reconsider and revisit this with the intention of reducing the administrative workload of our governors and headteachers.
The Conservative group supports the Minister. It is important that we allow parents to question headteachers and governing bodies and the people who run their schools about the kind of service that they provide. I would prefer to see schools more accountable to parents than to local councillors. Parents, governors and teachers—as I have said before on countless occasions in this Chamber—are far better suited to arranging educational provision in our local communities. I would like to see a mechanism in place that makes a school senior management team and those people running the school more involved and accountable to the parents and children they are supposed to serve. These regulations go some way to helping with that. We should be considering reducing the bureaucratic measures, but what is important, Gareth, is that we allow as much information as possible to be made available to parents so that they can make their own minds up and judge the performance of our schools.
Mae grŵp y Ceidwadwyr yn cefnogi’r Gweinidog. Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn caniatáu i rieni holi penaethiaid a chyrff llywodraethol a’r bobl sydd yn rhedeg eu hysgolion ynghylch y math o wasanaeth a ddarparant. Hoffwn i ysgolion fod yn fwy atebol i rieni nag i gynghorwyr lleol. Mae rhieni, llywodraethwyr ac athrawon—fel y dywedais droeon yn y Siambr hon—yn llawer mwy addas i drefnu darpariaeth addysgol yn ein cymunedau lleol. Hoffwn weld dull a fyddai’n sicrhau bod uwch dîm rheoli mewn ysgol a’r bobl hynny sydd yn rhedeg yr ysgol yn cymryd mwy o ran ac yn fwy atebol i’r rheini a’r plant y dylent eu gwasanaethu. Aiff y rheoliadau hyn gam o’r ffordd tuag at helpu i gyflawni hynny. Dylem ystyried lleihau’r mesurau biwrocrataidd, ond yr hyn sydd yn bwyisg, Gareth, yw ein bod yn caniatáu i gymaint o wybodaeth â phosibl fod ar gael i rieni fel y gallant farnu drostynt eu hunain a barnu perfformiad ein hysglion.
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning spoken in English p. 77
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 77
I echo the point about robust information for parents. It is important that we provide parents with information about what goes on in their schools. However, you know—and I know that many Members of this Chamber have been governors or teachers in the profession—that the original annual reports were burdensome and did not succeed in giving the right information to parents in the correct form. That is what these regulations do. They allow schools much more latitude to ensure that the report to parents is a summary report that contains specific information, but can be put together in the way that the school and governing body wishes.
Adleisiaf y pwynt ynghylch gwybodaeth gadarn i rieni. Mae’n bwysig ein bod oll yn darparu gwybodaeth i rieni am yr hyn sydd yn digwydd yn eu hysgolion. Fodd bynnag, gwyddoch—a gwn fod sawl Aelod o’r Siambr hon wedi bod yn llywodraethwyr neu’n athrawon yn y proffesiwn—fod yr adroddiadau blynyddol gwreiddiol yn feichus ac nad oeddent yn llwyddo i gyfleu’r wybodaeth gywir i rieni ar y ffurf gywir. Dyna’r hyn a wna’r rheoliadau hyn. Rhoddant lawer mwy o ryddid i ysgolion sicrhau fod yr adroddiad i rieni yn grynodeb sydd yn cynnwys gwybodaeth benodol, ond y gellir ei roi at ei gilydd yn ôl dymuniad yr ysgol a’r corff llywodraethol.
Cydnabyddaf yr hyn a ddywedwch. A wnewch chi ganiatáu i’r Pwyllgor drafod y rheoliadau hyn gyda golwg ar y dyfodol? Ynglŷn â sylwadau Jonathan, mae prif athrawon yn atebol i rieni o ddydd i ddydd, nid unwaith y flwyddyn.
I acknowledge what you say. Will you allow the Committee to discuss these regulations with an eye to the future? On Jonathan’s comments, headteachers are accountable to parents from day to day, not just once a year.
You are correct about headteachers being accountable to parents from day to day. I must clarify, and I will clarify it to the Committee when I present my report next week, whether we have any latitude to amend the annual report, other than these regulations. We are dealing with annual report regulations. We have worked with people externally to consider making the regulations more appropriate for people in Wales. That is not happening in England. I did not want this to be voted upon without debate. I wanted Members to input and to recognise the important role that our governing bodies and our schools play in getting information right for parents, but not in a form that overburdens them.
Yr ydych yn gywir ynglŷn â’r ffaith bod penaethiaid yn atebol i rieni o ddydd i ddydd. Rhaid i mi egluro, ac fe’i egluraf i’r Pwyllgor pan gyflwynaf fy adroddaid yr wythnos nesaf, pa un a oes gennym unrhyw ryddid i ddiwygio’r adroddiad blynyddol, ar wahân i’r rheoliadau hyn. Yr ydym yn delio â rheoliadau adroddiad blynyddol. Yr ydym wedi gweithio gyda phobl allanol i ystyried gwneud y rheoliadau hyn yn fwy priodol i bobl yng Nghymru. Nid yw hynny’n digwydd yn Lloegr. Nid oeddwn am i hyn fynd i bleidlais heb gael dadl arno. Yr oeddwn am i’r Aelodau gyfrannu a chydnabod rôl bwysig ein cyrff llywodraethol a’n hysgolion wrth ddarparu gwybodaeth gywir i rieni, ond nid ar ffurf sydd yn eu gorlethu.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 78
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 78
Galwaf am bleidlais ar egwyddor y Gorchymyn.
I call for a vote on the principle of the Order
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 31 YmatalAbstain 9 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (31)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Jane Hutt
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Karen Sinclair
- Kirsty Williams
YmatalAbstain (9)
- Cynog Dafis
- Geraint Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Brian Hancock
- Pauline Jarman
- Gareth Jones
- Janet Ryder
- Owen John Thomas
- Phil Williams
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 79
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 79
Galwaf am bleidlais ar y cynnig i gymeradwyo’r Gorchymyn.
I call for a vote on the motion to approve the Order.
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 31 YmatalAbstain 9 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (31)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Jane Hutt
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Karen Sinclair
- Kirsty Williams
YmatalAbstain (9)
- Cynog Dafis
- Geraint Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Brian Hancock
- Pauline Jarman
- Gareth Jones
- Janet Ryder
- Owen John Thomas
- Phil Williams
Cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Addysg (Cofrestru Disgyblion) (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2001
Approval of the Education (Pupil Registration) (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2001
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning spoken in English p. 80
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 80
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning (continued) spoken in English p. 80
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 80
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Jane Davidson The Minister for Education and Lifelong Learning (continued) spoken in English p. 81
Jane Davidson Y Gweinidog dros Addysg a Dysgu Gydol Oes (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 81
The proposed amendment to the regulations was determined following representations from headteachers and local education authorities about the way pupils’ absence is recorded when they are registered at and attending more than one school. This situation is known as dual registration. For example, pupils can be registered at both a pupil referral unit and a mainstream school. That is common practice. The pupil might therefore be attending both the pupil referral unit and a mainstream school for two or three days each in an average week. However, currently a pupil who is absent due to dual registration is recorded as an authorised absence in the school attendance register. This is not fair. For performance table purposes, under the previous Government regulations, these absences have counted towards the school’s overall authorised absence level and are therefore perceived negatively. The Assembly has set targets to reduce overall absences to below 8 per cent by 2002-03. Recording a pupil as an authorised absence when they are dually registered can therefore skew the school’s overall absence level. In addition, it does not accurately reflect the fact that the pupil is still attending a school on that day. The proposed amendment to the Education (Pupil Registration) (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2001 will allow pupils in this situation to be recorded in the school register as attending an approved educational activity, rather than as an authorised absence. The category of approved educational activity counts as a presence rather than an absence in the school’s overall figures and in the performance table. This change would mean that dually registered pupils would not negatively affect schools’ attendance figures, when they are collected. This will be a much fairer system.
Penderfynwyd ar y gwelliant a gynigir i’r rheoliadau yn dilyn sylwadau gan benaethiaid ac awdurdodau addysg lleol ynghylch y ffordd y cofnodir absenoldeb disgyblion sydd wedi eu cofrestru mewn mwy nag un ysgol ac sydd yn mynychu mwy nag un ysgol. Gelwir hyn yn gofrestru deublyg. Er enghraifft, gellir cofrestru disgyblion mewn uned cyfeirio disgyblion ac mewn ysgol prif ffrwd. Mae hynny’n arfer cyffredin. Felly, efallai y bydd y disgybl yn mynychu uned cyfeirio disgyblion ac ysgol prif ffrwd am ddau neu dri diwrnod yr un mewn wythnos gyffredin. Fodd bynnag, ar hyn o bryd caiff disgybl sydd yn absennol oherwydd cofrestru deublyg ei gofnodi fel ei fod yn absennol yn awdurdodedig yng nghofrestr presenoldeb yr ysgol. Nid yw hynny’n deg. At ddibenion tablau perfformiad, o dan reoliadau’r Llywodraeth flaenorol, mae’r absenoldebau hyn wedi cyfrif tuag at lefel gyffredinol absenoldeb awdurdodedig yr ysgol ac felly cânt eu hystyried yn negyddol. Mae’r Cynulliad wedi gosod targedau er mwyn gostwng absenoldebau cyffredinol islaw 8 y cant erbyn 2002-03. Gall cofnodi disgybl fel ei fod yn absennol yn awdurdodedig pan fyddant wedi’u cofrestru’n ddeublyg gamliwio lefel absenoldeb cyffredinol yr ysgol. Yn ogystal, nid adlewyrcha’n gywir y ffaith fod y disgybl yn dal i fynychu ysgol ar y diwrnod hwnnw. Bydd y gwelliant arfaethedig i’r Rheoliadau Addysg (Cofrestru Disgyblion) (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2001 yn caniatáu i ddisgyblion yn y sefyllfa hon gael eu cofnodi ar gofrestr yr ysgol fel mynychu gweithgaredd addysgol cymeradwy, yn hytrach nag fel absenoldeb awdurdodedig. Mae’r categori o weithgaredd addysgol cymeradwy yn cyfrif fel presenoldeb yn hytrach nag absenoldeb o fewn ffigurau cyffredinol yr ysgol ac yn y tabl perfformiad. Byddai’r newid hwn yn golygu na fyddai disgyblion a gofrestrir yn ddeublyg yn cael effaith negyddol ar ffigurau presenoldeb yr ysgol pan gânt eu casglu. Bydd hon yn system llawer tecach.
The amendments also take account of provisions in the School Standards and Framework Act 1998, regarding the permanent exclusion of a pupil. This will also help accuracy. It is important for our own targets of reducing exclusions by a third by March 2003 from the 1996-97 baseline that we have accurate information. In 1996-97 the baseline was 473 permanently excluded pupils. This morning I announced that this year we are down to 337 excluded pupils, which means that we are well on our way to achieving our target of 316 by 2003. It is important that these regulations enable us to have accurate information on which to have evidence-based policies. Once again they are the Assembly’s response to representations from local education authorities, Assembly Members and school teachers.
Mae’r gwelliannau hefyd yn ystyried darpariaethau yn Neddf Safonau a Fframwaith Ysgolion 1998, ynghylch gwahardd disgybl yn barhaol. Bydd hyn hefyd yn helpu cywirdeb. Mae’n bwysig bod gennym wybodaeth gywir ar gyfer ein targedau o leihau gwaharddiadau draean erbyn Mawrth 2003 o waelodlin 1996-97. Yn 1996-97 y gwaelodlin oedd 473 o ddisgyblion wedi’u gwahardd yn barhaol. Y bore yma cyhoeddais ein bod eleni i lawr i 337 o ddisgyblion wedi’u gwahardd, sydd yn golygu ein bod yn prysur gyrraedd ein targed o 316 erbyn 2003. Mae’n bwysig bod y rheoliadau hyn yn ein galluogi i gael gwybodaeth gywir ar gyfer polisïau yn seiliedig ar dystiolaeth. Unwaith eto ymateb y Cynulliad i sylwadau gan awdurdodau addysg lleol, Aelodau’r Cynulliad ac athrawon yw’r rheoliadau.
I declare an interest as a member of Rhondda Cynon Taff Local Education Authority and a school governor. This amendment goes a significant way to regularising a long-standing anomaly. The challenge for the Assembly is to address the issue of absenteeism by ensuring that we raise the morale and aspirations of school pupils and young people in Wales and that the days of us having to refer dually to pupil referral units and mainstream schools should, in the short term, be less regular than it is now.
Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Awdurdod Addysg Lleol Rhondda Cynon Taf a llywodraethwr ysgol. Mae’r gwelliant hwn yn gam sylweddol tuag at unioni amryfusedd a fu’n bodoli ers peth amser. Yr her i’r Cynulliad yw mynd i’r afael â’r mater o absenoldeb drwy sicrhau ein bod yn codi morâl a dyheadau disgyblion ysgol a phobl ifanc yng Nghymru a sicrhau bod y dyddiau o orfod cyfeirio’n ddeublyg i unedau cyfeirio disgyblion ac ysgolion prif ffrwd, yn y byr dymor, yn llai rheolaidd nag ydyw ar hyn o bryd.
There is surprisingly low morale in our schools and the need to lift aspirations is a great concern. Will the Minister rule out any plans to create specialist schools along the lines proposed in England by the Secretary of State for Education and Employment, which would be selection by another name? That would do little to raise standards across the board, which should be the Assembly’s aim. However, is it surprising that morale is low and aspirations are dented when we hear the Prime Minister’s spokesperson referring to ‘bog standard comprehensives’?
Mae morâl yn syndod o isel yn ein hysgolion ac mae’r angen i godi dyheadau yn bryder mawr. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddiystyru unrhyw gynlluniau i greu ysgolion arbenigol tebyg i’r rhai a fwriedir yn Lloegr gan yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Addysg a Chyflogaeth, sef dethol o dan enw arall? Ni wnâi hynny fawr ddim i godi safonau yn gyffredinol. Dylai hynny fod yn nod gan y Cynulliad. Fodd bynnag, pa ryfedd fod morâl yn isel a bod diffyg dyheadau pan glywn lefarydd y Prif Weinidog yn cyfeirio at ysgolion cyfun ‘bog standard’?
The Conservatives support these regulation, with a view to providing accurate information. We do not see them as an opportunity to massage the figures in relation to exclusion targets. On that subject, the Minister is aware of my opposition to the exclusion targets reduction scheme that the Government is pursuing, only because we do not believe that unruly children should be kept in the classroom. We believe that unruly children cause a great deal of disruption and that alternative provision should be made available for them. We will support the regulation, but with that caveat.
Mae’r Ceidwadwyr yn cefnogi’r rheoliadau hyn, gyda’r nod o ddarparu gwybodaeth gywir. Nid ystyriwn eu bod yn gyfle i gamliwio’r ffigurau o ran targedau gwahardd. Ar y pwnc hwnnw, mae’r Gweinidog yn ymwybodol o’m gwrthwynebiad i’r cynllun lleihau targedau gwahardd y mae’r Llywodraeth yn mynd ar eu trywydd, am y rheswm na chredwn y dylid cadw plant anystywallt yn yr ystafell ddosbarth. Credwn fod plant anystywallt yn achosi cryn amhariaeth ac y dylid sicrhau bod darpariaeth arall ar gael iddynt. Byddwn yn cefnogi’r rheoliadau, ond gyda’r cafeat hwnnw.
To respond to Pauline’s comments, I am delighted to restate, for the third time—perhaps Pauline was not in the Chamber on the other occasions—that I am not in favour of specialist schools. I believe in excellence across the board, and in all our comprehensive schools being excellent. The policy that the Assembly is pursuing and our strategic relationship with local government—if local government rises to the challenge on education—will enable us to do that.
I ymateb i sylwadau Pauline, mae’n bleser gennyf ddatgan eto, am y trydydd tro—efallai nad oedd Pauline yn y Siambr ar yr adegau eraill—nad wyf o blaid ysgolion arbenigol. Credaf mewn rhagoriaeth yn gyffredinol, a rhagoriaeth ym mhob un o’n hysgolion cyfun. Bydd y polisi a ddilynir gan y Cynulliad a’n perthynas strategol gyda llywodraeth leol—os bydd llywodraeth leol yn codi i’r her ar addysg—yn ein galluogi i wneud hynny.
I thank Jonathan for the point about accurate information. He mentioned unruly children not being in our schools. We need to ensure that pupil referral units are available, to provide special treatment for pupils who are causing problems. Ironically, therefore, the previous system did not allow this to be recognised as part of educational activity. These regulations will address the issues raised by Jonathan—they will give us accurate information and reflect where pupils are properly involved in an alternate educational activity.
Diolchaf i Jonathan am y pwynt ynghylch gwybodaeth gywir. Soniodd am beidio â chynnwys plant anystywallt yn ein hysgolion. Rhaid inni sicrhau bod unedau cyfeirio disgyblion ar gael, i ddarparu triniaeth arbennig i ddisgyblion sydd yn achosi problemau. Yn eironig, felly, nid oedd y system flaenorol yn caniatáu i hyn gael ei gydnabod fel rhan o weithgaredd addysgol. Bydd y rheoliadau hyn yn mynd i’r afael â’r materion a godwyd gan Jonathan—byddant yn rhoi gwybodaeth gywir i ni ac yn adlewyrchu lle caiff disgyblion eu cynnwys mewn gweithgaredd addysgol amgen.
Cyn pleidleisio, hoffwn ddatgan buddiant fel cynghorydd sir, llywodraethwr ysgol ac athro cofrestredig.
Before voting, I declare an interest as a county councillor, school governor and registered teacher.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 83
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 83
Mae’r Canllawiau ar Gofrestr Buddiannau’r Aelodau yn ei gwneud yn glir ym mha achos y mae’n briodol datgan buddiant. Byddwn yn falch pe bai Aelodau yn adolygu’r canllawiau hynny dros y penwythnos.
The Guidance on the Register of Members’ Interests makes it clear in which cases it is appropriate to declare an interest. I would appreciate it if Members reviewed the guidance over the weekend.
Galwaf am bleidlais ar egwyddor y Gorchymyn.
I call for a vote on the principle of the Order.
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 40 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (40)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Cynog Dafis
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Brian Hancock
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 84
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 84
Galwaf am bleidlais ar y cynnig i gymeradwyo’r Gorchymyn.
I call for a vote on the motion to approve the Order.
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 44 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (44)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Cynog Dafis
- Jane Davidson
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Jocelyn Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Brian Hancock
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Elin Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Helen Mary Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Gwenda Thomas
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Pwynt o Drefn
Point of Order
Point of order. I request, with your indulgence, Presiding Officer, that my vote on the principle of the Order be recorded. I was distracted from voting by a request for my notes.
Pwynt o drefn. Gofynnaf, gyda’ch caniatâd, Lywydd, i’m pleidlais ar egwyddor y Gorchymyn gael ei chofnodi. Tynnwyd fy sylw ar adeg pleidleisio oherwydd cais am fy nodiadau.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 85
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 85
This is highly irregular. However, in view of your previous post as Deputy Presiding Officer, I will concede on this occasion. Your vote will be recorded in the Official Record.
Mae hyn yn anarferol iawn. Fodd bynnag, yng ngoleuni eich swydd flaenorol fel Dirprwy Lywydd, fe’i caniatâf ar yr achlysur hwn. Caiff eich pleidlais ei chofnodi yn y Cofnod Swyddogol.
Further to that point of order, was that the action of an unruly Minister?
Ymhellach i’r pwynt hwnnw o drefn, onid oedd hynny’n weithred gan Weinidog anystywallt?
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 85
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 85
I will ignore that comment.
Anwybyddaf y sylw hwnnw.
Further to that point of order, I was about to cast my vote on the motion to approve the Order, when the deputy chief whip engaged me in conversation. Is it the case that the generosity that you extended to the Minister now sets a precedent and, provided we have a good enough excuse, we can rewrite our vote?
Ymhellach i’r pwynt hwnnw o drefn, yr oeddwn ar fin pleidleisio ar y cynnig i gymeradwyo’r Gorchymyn, pan ddechreuodd y dirprwy brif chwip sgwrs â mi. A yw’n wir bod yr haelioni a ddangoswyd gennych tuag at y Gweinidog yn awr yn gosod cynsail ac, ar yr amod bod gennym esgus digon da, y gallwn ailysgrifennu ein pleidlais?
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 86
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86
No. Had you given me a good enough excuse, I might have conceded in your case but in no-one else’s. We will now move on.
Nac ydyw. Pe baech wedi rhoi esgus digon da i mi, efallai y byddwn wedi caniatáu hynny yn eich achos chi ond nid yn achos unrhyw un arall. Symudwn ymlaen yn awr.
Dirprwyo Swyddogaethau Deddf Diogelu Anifeiliaid (Diwygio) 2000 i Brif Weinidog Cymru
Delegation of Functions of the Protection of Animals (Amendment) Act 2000 to the First Minister
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 86
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86
I have selected amendment 1in the name of Andrew Davies.
Yr wyf wedi dethol gwelliant 1 yn enw Andrew Davies.
Carwyn Jones The Minister for Rural Affairs spoken in English p. 86
Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86
I propose that
Cynigiaf fod
Carwyn Jones The Minister for Rural Affairs (continued) spoken in English p. 86
Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86
I also propose amendment 1 in the name of Andrew Davies. Add at the end of the motion:
Cynigiaf welliant 1 yn enw Andrew Davies. Ychwaneger ar ddiwedd y cynnig:
Carwyn Jones The Minister for Rural Affairs (continued) spoken in English p. 86
Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86
This delegation of functions will be made in the knowledge that they will be further delegated by the First Minister to the appropriate Assembly Minister and officials. This Act supplements the Protection of Animals Act 1911, by allowing a court to make an Order relating to the care, disposal or slaughter of animals kept for commercial purposes that are the subject of a prosecution brought under the 1911 Act. Under section 1 (3) (f) of the Act, the Assembly, among others, has the power to nominate a prosecutor. The prosecutor is defined to include certain public bodies that conduct prosecutions. Assembly officials have already consulted the industry about the Protection of Animals (Amendment) Act 2000, and will seek to consult once more on the model agreement to be signed up to by nominated prosecutors.
Dirprwyir y swyddogaethau hyn gan wybod y cânt eu dirprwyo ymhellach gan y Prif Weinidog i’r Gweinidog a’r swyddogion priodol yn y Cynulliad. Mae’r Ddeddf hon yn ategu Deddf Diogelu Anifeiliaid 1911, drwy ganiatáu i lys wneud Gorchymyn yn ymwneud â gofal, gwaredu neu ladd anifeiliaid a gedwir at ddibenion masnachol sydd yn destun erlyniad a ddygwyd o dan Ddeddf 1911. O dan adran 1 (3) (f) o’r Ddeddf, mae gan y Cynulliad, ymysg eraill, y pŵer i enwebu erlynydd. Diffinnir erlynydd i gynnwys rhai cyrff cyhoeddus sydd yn cynnal erlyniadau. Mae swyddogion y Cynulliad eisoes wedi ymgynghori â’r diwydiant ynghylch Deddf Diogelu Anifeiliaid (Diwygio) 2000, a byddant yn ceisio ymgynghori eto ar y cytundeb model y dylai’r erlynwyr enwebedig ei gymeradwyo.
I have a brief comment. Were it not for the amendment, which we welcome, we would have had difficulty in approving the motion. I would ask the Minister for Assembly Business and the First Minister to take this on board when they table similar motions in future.
Mae gennyf sylw byr. Oni bai am y gwelliant, a groesawn, byddem wedi cael anhawster i gymeradwyo’r cynnig. Gofynnaf i’r Trefnydd a’r Prif Weinidog ystyried hyn pan fyddant yn cyflwyno cynigion tebyg yn y dyfodol.
Andrew Davies The Minister for Assembly Business spoken in English p. 87
Andrew Davies Y Trefnydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 87
That was an oversight on our part and we will ensure that the wording of the amendment will be included automatically in future motions to delegate functions.
Yr oedd hynny’n gamgymeriad ar ein rhan ni a byddwn yn sicrhau y caiff geiriad y gwelliant ei gynnwys yn awtomatig mewn cynigion i ddirprwyo swyddogaethau yn y dyfodol.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 87
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 87
Does the Minister for Rural Affairs wish to respond?
A yw’r Gweinidog dros Faterion Gwledig yn dymuno ymateb?
If I had known that two Members wished to contribute, I would have prepared a formal response. However, it is not necessary in this case.
Pe gwyddwn fod dau Aelod yn dymuno cyfrannu, byddwn wedi paratoi ymateb ffurfiol. Fodd bynnag, nid oes angen gwneud hynny yn yr achos hwn.
Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 87
Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in Welsh p. 87
Diolch. Dyma’r math o ddadl sydd yn addas ar fore fel heddiw, gan y bu inni dreulio amser gwerthfawr ar y datganiadau ynghynt.
Thank you. This is the kind of debate that is appropriate on such a morning, as we spent valuable time on the earlier statements.
Gwelliant 1 Carwyn Jones t. 87
Amendment 1 Carwyn Jones p. 87
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 41 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y gwelliant.
Amendment adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (41)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Alison Halford
- Brian Hancock
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Helen Mary Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Cynnig wedi’i ddiwygio Carwyn Jones t. 89
Amended motion Carwyn Jones p. 89
DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 43 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0
Derbyniwyd y cynnig wedi’i ddiwygio.
Amended motion adopted.
Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (43)
- Lorraine Barrett
- Mick Bates
- Peter Black
- Nick Bourne
- Rosemary Butler
- Alun Cairns
- Christine Chapman
- Andrew Davies
- David Davies
- Geraint Davies
- Ron Davies
- Sue Essex
- Delyth Evans
- Val Feld
- Michael German
- Brian Gibbons
- William Graham
- Janice Gregory
- John Griffiths
- Christine Gwyther
- Alison Halford
- Brian Hancock
- Jane Hutt
- Pauline Jarman
- Ann Jones
- Carwyn Jones
- Gareth Jones
- Helen Mary Jones
- Ieuan Wyn Jones
- Peter Law
- Huw Lewis
- David Melding
- Jonathan Morgan
- Rhodri Morgan
- Alun Pugh
- Jenny Randerson
- Rod Richards
- Janet Ryder
- Karen Sinclair
- Gwenda Thomas
- Owen John Thomas
- Kirsty Williams
- Phil Williams
Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd i’r Gadair am 11.57 p.m.
The Deputy Presiding Officer took the Chair at 11.57 p.m.
Dadl Fer
Short Debate
Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd
Cardiff International Airport
I will allow Jonathan Morgan, Helen Mary Jones and Mick Bates to contribute to this debate, and I thank them for their interest in this subject.
Caniataf i Jonathan Morgan, Helen Mary Jones a Mick Bates gyfrannu at y ddadl hon, a diolchaf iddynt am eu diddordeb yn y pwnc hwn.
I have chosen Cardiff International Airport as the subject of my short debate because I believe that the Assembly should aim to make it the premier airport of western Britain. This bold strategic aim would greatly strengthen the economy of Wales. That would require an airport with efficient road and rail links, a more extensive scheduled flights network and business growth in Barry and the airport vicinity. In this respect, I pay tribute to the statutory agencies involved in promoting business growth in the area, particularly the Vale of Glamorgan Council, and its leader, Councillor Jeffrey James.
Yr wyf wedi dewis Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd fel testun fy nadl fer oherwydd credaf y dylai’r Cynulliad anelu at sicrhau mai dyma yw prif faes awyr gorllewin Prydain. Byddai’r nod strategol beiddgar hwn yn atgyfnerthu economi Cymru’n fawr. Byddai hynny’n gofyn am faes awyr gyda chysylltiadau ffordd a rheilffordd effeithlon, rhwydwaith helaethach o hediadau rheolaidd a thwf busnes yn y Barri a chyffiniau’r maes awyr. Yn hyn o beth, hoffwn dalu teyrnged i’r asiantaethau statudol sydd yn ymwneud â hyrwyddo twf busnes yn yr ardal, yn arbennig Cyngor Bro Morgannwg, a’i arweinydd, y Cynghorydd Jeffrey James.
The airport has had considerable success to date and is, therefore, an excellent base on which to build. Cardiff International Airport has already achieved much. Since privatisation in 1995 business passenger traffic has increased by 96 per cent, and now constitutes 30 per cent of the airport’s customers. Passenger numbers are growing robustly. One and a half million passengers used the airport in the year 2000, which represents an increase of 17 per cent on the previous year. Cardiff International Airport is one of the UK’s top five airports in terms of growth. The airport has 1,900 employees on site, and a further 750 staff are employed at the British Airways heavy aircraft maintenance plant. That plant has been a success and a boost to the south Wales economy, and has further potential for the future.
Bu’r maes awyr yn gryn lwyddiant hyd yma ac, felly, mae’n sail wych i adeiladu arni. Mae Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd eisoes wedi cyflawni cymaint. Ers ei breifateiddio yn 1995, mae nifer y teithwyr busnes wedi cynyddu 96 y cant, ac erbyn hyn cynrychiola 30 y cant o gwsmeriaid y maes awyr. Mae nifer y teithwyr yn cynyddu’n gyson. Defnyddiodd miliwn a hanner o deithwyr y maes awyr yn y flwyddyn 2000, sydd yn cynrychioli cynnydd o 17 y cant ar y flwyddyn flaenorol. Mae Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yn un o’r pum maes awyr amlycaf yn y DU yn nhermau twf. Mae’r maes awyr yn cyflogi 1,900 o weithwyr ar y safle a chyflogir 750 o staff eraill yng ngwaith cynnal a chadw awyrennau trwm British Airways. Profodd y gwaith hwn yn llwyddiant ac yn hwb i economi de Cymru, ac mae ganddo botensial ar gyfer y dyfodol.
Without doubt, Cardiff International Airport is a successful regional airport. However, we must now aim to make it an international airport of significance. Current traffic forecasts indicate a secure future—from 1.5 million passengers in 2001 to a projected figure of 2.3 million passengers by 2005. Substantial increases beyond that figure have also been projected. This growth could lead to the creation of up to 2,500 jobs. Congestion in south-east England will continue to make Cardiff International Airport an attractive alternative. Another factor that is often overlooked is that Cardiff International Airport has the best climate of any UK airport, with the exception of Prestwick. I am told that that airport is closer to the gulf stream and, despite its Scottish location, has even better climatic conditions than Cardiff.
Nid oes amheuaeth bod Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yn faes awyr rhanbarthol llwyddiannus. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni anelu yn awr i’w wneud yn faes awyr rhyngwladol pwysig. Dengys y rhagolygon traffig presennol ddyfodol cadarn—o 1.5 miliwn o deithwyr yn 2001 i ffigur amcangyfrifedig o 2.3 miliwn o deithwyr erbyn 2005. Amcangyfrifwyd cynnydd sylweddol y tu hwnt i’r ffigur hwnnw hefyd. Gallai’r twf hwn arwain at greu hyd at 2,500 o swyddi. Bydd tagfeydd yn ne-ddwyrain Lloegr yn parhau i sicrhau bod Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yn ddewis deniadol. Ffactor arall a anwybyddir yn aml yw bod gan Faes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yr hinsawdd orau o blith holl feysydd awyr y DU, ac eithrio Prestwick. Dywedir wrthyf fod y maes awyr hwnnw’n agosach at lif y gwlff ac, er gwaethaf y ffaith ei fod yn yr Alban, mae ganddo amodau hinsoddol sydd hyd yn oed yn well na Chaerdydd.
This is all encouraging. However, it is fair to say that it has been mostly based on the airport as a charter flight destination. The Assembly must consider the airport as an economic asset, and stress the place of aviation in a successful twenty-first century economy.
Mae hynny oll yn galonogol. Fodd bynnag, mae’n deg dweud bod hynny wedi’i seilio’n bennaf ar y maes awyr fel lleoliad hediadau wedi’u trefnu. Rhaid i’r Cynulliad ystyried y maes awyr fel ased economaidd, a phwysleisio pwysigrwydd awyrennu mewn economi lwyddiannus yn yr unfed ganrif ar hugain.
What makes a truly international airport? In the United Kingdom, 92 per cent of passengers arrive at airports by road. It is essential that Cardiff International Airport is linked by a modern, direct trunk road. Unless this link is established between the airport and the motorway, it is unlikely to succeed to its maximum potential. The Confederation of British Industry, at a UK level, considers the airport link road to be a major strategic requirement for the UK economy. It is significant that the CBI sees a premier airport in western Britain as having a UK significance. It also has a great significance for the south Wales economy, even though the airport’s catchment includes parts of south-west England.
Beth sydd yn gwneud maes awyr gwirioneddol ryngwladol? Yn y Deyrnas Unedig, mae 92 y cant o deithwyr yn teithio i feysydd awyr ar y ffyrdd. Mae’n holl bwysig cael priffordd fodern uniongyrchol wedi’i chysylltu â Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd. Oni sefydlir y cyswllt hwn rhwng y maes awyr a’r draffordd, mae’n annhebygol o lwyddo i’w lawn botensial. Mae Cydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain, ar lefel y DU, yn ystyried bod y ffordd gyswllt â’r maes awyr yn ofyniad strategol amlwg i economi’r DU. Mae’n arwyddocaol bod Cydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain yn ystyried bod maes awyr amlwg yng ngorllewin Prydain yn arwyddocaol i’r DU gyfan. Mae hefyd yn arwyddocaol iawn i economi de Cymru, er bod dalgylch y maes awyr yn cynnwys rhannau o dde-orllewin Lloegr.
However, we must face the fact that the link road is only viable if the Assembly secures funding. That is why it is essential that the scheme is given trunk road status. It is not enough to turn to the local authority, which has been making great strides, to try to secure a scheme that could be funded. This also requires considerable input from the Assembly. A modern link road would make the airport attractive for business passengers and, crucially, for air freight traffic. At present, little air freight traffic is attracted to the airport, which is a weakness in its potential future growth.
Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni wynebu’r ffaith na fydd ffordd gyswllt yn ymarferol oni fydd y Cynulliad yn sicrhau arian ar ei chyfer. Dyna pam ei bod yn hanfodol y rhoddir statws priffordd i’r cynllun. Nid yw’n ddigon troi at yr awdurdod lleol, sydd wedi gwneud cynnydd mawr, i geisio sicrhau cynllun y gellid ei ariannu. Mae hyn hefyd yn gofyn am fewnbwn sylweddol gan y Cynulliad. Byddai ffordd gyswllt fodern yn gwneud y maes awyr yn ddeniadol i deithwyr busnes ac, yn holl bwysig, i draffig cludo llwythi awyr. Ar hyn o bryd, ni wneir llawer o waith cludo llwythi awyr yn y maes awyr, sydd yn wendid o ran ei dwf posibl ar gyfer y dyfodol.
A key outcome of a link road would be the added attraction of Cardiff International Airport as a destination for scheduled flights. At present, non-UK scheduled flights are limited to Dublin, Paris, Amsterdam and Brussels. However, significant demand has been demonstrated for routes to Germany, Spain, Italy and additional routes to France. These hubs could also provide links to intercontinental destinations and, indeed, a modest prospect of having direct intercontinental links to Cardiff. However, were improved links to be agreed strategically today, it would take several years to complete such a major operation. The airport needs support and development in the meantime. The Assembly Minister could make a start by considering, as part of the transport strategy and in meetings with key players in the Vale of Glamorgan and at the airport, the question of securing scheduled slots for Cardiff International Airport in other European airports. There is great demand, in what is a highly regulated area. It needs the Assembly’s backing because, if we are to emphasise Cardiff as a cultural and political centre within the modern European network and Europe of the regions, we need more direct flights. The existing flights have been successful, but the network needs to be expanded.
Un o ganlyniadau allweddol ffordd gyswllt fyddai’r atyniad ychwanegol o statws Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd fel cyrchfan ar gyfer hediadau rheolaidd. Ar hyn o bryd, mae’r hediadau rheolaidd nad ydynt yn hediadau’r DU wedi’u cyfyngu i Ddulyn, Paris, Amsterdam a Brwsel. Fodd bynnag, cafwyd galw sylweddol am lwybrau i’r Almaen, Sbaen, yr Eidal a llwybrau ychwanegol i Ffrainc. Gallai’r canolfannau hyn ddarparu cysylltiadau hefyd i gyrchfannau rhyng-gyfandirol ac, yn wir, y posibilrwydd rhesymol o gael cysylltiadau rhyng-gyfandirol i Gaerdydd. Fodd bynnag, pe cytunir yn strategol ar gysylltiadau gwell heddiw, byddai’n cymryd blynyddoedd lawer i gwblhau prosiect mor fawr â hwn. Mae angen cymorth a datblygiad ar y maes awyr yn y cyfamser. Gallai Gweinidog y Cynulliad ddechrau drwy ystyried, fel rhan o’r strategaeth drafnidiaeth ac mewn cyfarfodydd â chyfranwyr allweddol ym Mro Morgannwg ac yn y maes awyr, y mater o sicrhau amseroedd wedi’u trefnu i Faes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd mewn meysydd awyr Ewropeaidd eraill. Mae galw mawr am hynny, mewn maes a reoleiddir yn llym. Mae angen cefnogaeth y Cynulliad oherwydd, os ydym am bwysleisio Caerdydd fel canolfan ddiwylliannol a gwleidyddol o fewn y rhwydwaith Ewropeaidd fodern ac Ewrop y rhanbarthau, mae angen mwy o hediadau uniongyrchol arnom. Bu’r hediadau presennol yn llwyddiannus, ond mae angen ehangu’r rhwydwaith.
If we were to achieve that, we would have moved closer to securing a greater vision for Cardiff International Airport, including making it one of the UK’s premier airports, not only in terms of substantial growth—which is already happening—but in terms of business and freight traffic and the attraction of major business to locate in south Wales. It would also be a part of the world and European network. Let us have no doubt that air travel is crucial to the modern economy. It is like canal, rail, and road building after the Second World War. Air destination links are now crucial to the success of any modern, regional economy. They also provide a gateway for world trade, which is essential if we want a turn-around in our manufacturing hopes and want Cardiff and the south Wales economy to be a centre for commercial and business excellence. To attract major inward investment, and the second or third phase of that investment, we must realise how important air travel is for international business people.
Pe cyflawnem hynny, byddem wedi symud yn agosach at sicrhau gweledigaeth well ar gyfer Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd, yn cynnwys ei wneud yn un o brif feysydd awyr y DU, nid yn unig yn nhermau twf sylweddol—sydd yn digwydd eisoes—ond yn nhermau traffig busnes a chludo llwythi a denu busnesau mawr i dde Cymru. Byddai hefyd yn rhan o rwydwaith y byd ac Ewrop. Nid oes amheuaeth bod teithio awyr yn holl bwysig i’r economi fodern. Mae’n debyg i’r camlesi, rheilffyrdd a’r ffyrdd a adeiladwyd ar ôl yr Ail Ryfel Byd. Mae cysylltiadau cyrchfannau awyr yn holl bwysig i lwyddiant unrhyw economi fodern, ranbarthol. Maent hefyd yn darparu porth i fasnachu rhyngwladol, sydd yn holl bwysig os ydym am wyrdroi ein gobeithion gweithgynhyrchu ac am i economi Caerdydd a de Cymru fod yn ganolfan rhagoriaeth fasnachol a busnes. I ddenu mewnfuddsoddiadau mawr, ac ail neu drydydd cam y buddsoddiad hwnnw, rhaid inni sylweddoli pa mor bwysig yw teithio awyr i bobl fusnes rhyngwladol.
In a recent survey of multinational companies, the first stated priority was a direct and easy link to an international airport. If Cardiff can offer that, it will be a substantial inducement for companies to continue to locate in south Wales. Finally, improved flight links will benefit the Welsh economy and those who export from south Wales by establishing key export markets with Europe and the wider world. If we make that a vision for Cardiff International Airport, we will secure its place as an international airport, and not only as a highly successful charter airport but is an airport with an interesting, though limited, provision of scheduled flights.
Mewn arolwg diweddar o gwmnïau amlwladol, y flaenoriaeth gyntaf a nodwyd oedd cyswllt uniongyrchol a hawdd â maes awyr rhyngwladol. Os gall Caerdydd gynnig hynny, bydd yn atyniad sylweddol i gwmnïau barhau i ymsefydlu yn ne Cymru. Yn olaf, bydd cysylltiadau hedfan gwell o fudd i economi Cymru a’r rhai sydd yn allforio o dde Cymru drwy sefydlu marchnadoedd allforio allweddol gydag Ewrop a gweddill y byd. Os gwnawn hyn yn weledigaeth i Faes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd, byddwn yn sicrhau ei statws fel maes awyr rhyngwladol, ac nid dim ond fel maes awyr hediadau wedi’u trefnu llwyddiannus iawn, ond yn faes awyr sydd yn cynnig nifer gyfyngedig, diddorol o hediadau rheolaidd.
Today’s short debate could be the start of the process to secure a strategic commitment from the Assembly to invest time and political will in Cardiff International Airport. I welcome the interest of other speakers who will follow me, and I look forward to hearing the Minister’s reply. We must send out a firm signal that our airport is Cardiff International Airport and that we are not looking for an alternative location, but want to exploit the wonderful site at Rhoose to our maximum benefit. If we do so, we will achieve great success for the whole of south Wales.
Gallai’r ddadl fer heddiw fod yn ddechrau proses i sicrhau ymrwymiad strategol gan y Cynulliad i fuddsoddi amser ac ewyllys wleidyddol ym Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd. Croesawaf y diddordeb a fynegwyd gan y siaradwyr eraill a fydd yn fy nilyn, ac edrychaf ymlaen at glywed ateb y Gweinidog. Rhaid inni gyfleu neges gadarn mai Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yw ein maes awyr ni ac nad ydym yn chwilio am leoliad arall, ond ein bod am fanteisio i’r eithaf ar y safle gwych yn y Rhws. Pe gwnawn hynny, byddwn yn sicrhau llwyddiant mawr i dde Cymru gyfan.
I thank David for bringing this matter to the attention of Members today. There is no doubt that Cardiff International Airport is a tremendous resource, not only for Cardiff, as the capital city of Wales, but also for south Wales and beyond. It is significant in providing a gateway to Europe and beyond, and is truly an international airport. That international perspective has tremendous growth potential. An Assembly vision for the growth of the airport’s international capacity will put Cardiff firmly on the map. Cardiff has become an international centre for politics and culture; it is a place to visit and in which to live and work. Growth in the airport’s capacity will add to the wonderful events held here and to Cardiff’s status, not only as a great city within the UK, but as a great European capital.
Diolchaf i David am ddwyn y mater hwn i sylw’r Aelodau heddiw. Nid oes amheuaeth fod Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd yn adnodd aruthrol, nid yn unig i Gaerdydd, fel prifddinas Cymru, ond hefyd i dde Cymru a thu hwnt. Mae’n arwyddocaol am ei fod yn darparu porth i Ewrop a thu hwnt, ac mae’n faes awyr gwirioneddol ryngwladol. Mae potensial ar gyfer twf aruthrol ynghlwm â’r perspectif rhyngwladol. Bydd gweledigaeth y Cynulliad ar gyfer cynyddu gallu’r maes awyr rhyngwladol yn rhoi Caerdydd yn gadarn ar y map. Mae Caerdydd wedi datblygu i fod yn ganolfan ryngwladol ar gyfer gwleidyddiaeth a diwylliant; mae’n ddinas i ymweld â hi ac i fyw a gweithio ynddi. Bydd twf yng ngallu’r maes awyr yn ychwanegu at y digwyddiadau gwych a gynhelir yma ac i statws Caerdydd, nid yn unig fel dinas wych o fewn y DU, ond hefyd fel prifddinas Ewropeaidd wych.
I echo Jonathan’s thanks to David for putting this important issue on the agenda and for allowing me to contribute to the debate. I support everything that David said about the importance of Cardiff airport, not only for south Wales, but also for Wales as a nation. Nations need to communicate with other nations and air travel is a crucial way of doing so.
Adleisiaf ddiolchiadau Jonathan i David am roi’r mater pwysig hwn ar yr agenda ac am ganiatáu imi gyfrannu i’r ddadl. Cefnogaf bopeth a ddywedodd David am bwysigrwydd maes awyr Caerdydd, nid yn unig i dde Cymru, ond hefyd i Gymru fel gwlad. Mae angen i wledydd gyfathrebu â gwledydd eraill ac mae teithio awyr yn ffordd hanfodol o wneud hynny.
I am not entirely convinced of David’s case for a link road, but I am sure that the Minister will consider that in detail. I mention again our concerns, which were voiced elsewhere, about the fact that the new rail link to Rhoose will not go all the way to the airport. If we are seeking an alternative to road transport, it is useless to assume that business travellers who have little time, or holidaymakers who have enormous amounts of luggage, will be prepared to get on a train and then a bus to reach the airport. That will not work and we must consider a long-term solution.
Nid wyf yn hollol argyhoeddedig o achos David dros gael ffordd gyswllt, ond yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog yn ystyried hynny’n fanwl. Soniaf eto am ein pryderon, a leisiwyd gan eraill, am y ffaith na fydd y cyswllt rheilffordd newydd i’r Rhws yn mynd yr holl ffordd i’r maes awyr. Os ydym am geisio dewis amgen i deithio ar ffyrdd, bydd yn gwbl ddiwerth tybio y bydd teithwyr busnes nad oes ganddynt lawer o amser, neu deithwyr ar eu gwyliau sydd â llawer iawn o fagiau, yn barod i fynd ar drên ac yna ar fws i gyrraedd y maes awyr. Ni fydd hynny’n llwyddo a rhaid inni ystyried ateb tymor hir.
I urge the Minister to look closely at the Welsh Consumer Council’s recent research on air services for passengers in Wales, particularly in relation to Cardiff International Airport. I urge her to begin negotiations with colleagues at Westminster to overcome the regulatory difficulties that the report identifies as an obstacle to the development of scheduled services.
Pwysaf ar y Gweinidog i edrych yn ofalus ar ymchwil diweddar Cyngor Defnyddwyr Cymru i wasanaethau awyr i deithwyr yng Nghymru, yn arbennig mewn cysylltiad â Maes Awyr Rhyngwladol Caerdydd. Pwysaf arni i ddechrau negodi gyda’i chydweithwyr yn San Steffan i oresgyn yr anawsterau rheoliadol a nodir yn yr adroddiad fel rhwystr i ddatblygu gwasanaethau wedi’u trefnu.
I echo the thanks to you, David, for raising this issue. The airport, as you rightly said, is expanding and is a growing economic asset to Wales. It is also part of developing Cardiff as a capital city.
Adleisiaf y diolchiadau i chi, David, am godi’r mater hwn. Mae’r maes awyr, fel y dywedasoch, a hynny’n gywir, yn ehangu ac yn datblygu’n gynyddol i fod yn ased economaidd i Gymru. Mae hefyd yn rhan o’r broses o ddatblygu Caerdydd fel prifddinas.
The background to making this a truly international airport raises an argument that is finely balanced between economic and environmental issues. If the goal is to develop an air network in Wales and Cardiff airport as an international access point, then access to the airport must be improved. It is important to note that the vast majority of passengers who use Cardiff airport are local and travel less than 25 miles to reach it. The ideal solution would be a regular, reliable train connection from the city centre and other parts of Wales. That would be part of our overall aim to integrate transport in Wales.
Mae’r cefndir ar gyfer gwneud y maes awyr hwn yn un cwbl ryngwladol yn codi dadl lle ceir gwrthdaro rhwng materion economaidd ac amgylcheddol. Os mai’r nod yw datblygu rhwydwaith awyr yng Nghymru a maes awyr Caerdydd fel pwynt mynediad rhyngwladol, mae’n rhaid gwella mynediad i’r maes awyr. Mae’n bwysig nodi fod y mwyafrif helaeth o deithwyr sydd yn defnyddio maes awyr Caerdydd yn bobl leol sydd yn teithio llai na 25 milltir i gyrraedd yno. Yr ateb delfrydol fyddai cyswllt trên rheolaidd a dibynadwy o ganol y ddinas ac o rannau eraill o Gymru. Byddai hynny’n rhan o’n nod gyffredinol i integreiddio trafnidiaeth yng Nghymru.
Will the Minister clarify whether the proposed rail link will extend to the edge of the airport? I have some recollection that it will. I believe that there are also existing provisions to upgrade the road so that some of the difficulties of all the roundabouts can be overcome. Will the Minister clarify that? I believe that it is accounted for in the budget.
A wnaiff y Gweinidog egluro a fydd y cyswllt rheilffordd arfaethedig yn cyrraedd cyrion y maes awyr? Mae gennyf frith gof y bydd. Credaf fod darpariaethau cyfredol hefyd i uwchraddio’r ffordd er mwyn gallu goresgyn rhai o anawsterau’r holl gylchfannau. A wnaiff y Gweinidog egluro hynny? Credaf fod hynny wedi’i gynnwys yn y gyllideb.
Otherwise, I commend the debate and, particularly, the view that we must consider the international aspect of transport in Wales. We must develop all parts of our transport system. I am sure that the Minister will emphasise that that is part of our vision for developing Wales and its place in the world. It is particularly important to export Welsh goods by freight across the world.
Fel arall, cymeradwyaf y ddadl ac, yn arbennig, y safbwynt y dylem ystyried yr agwedd ryngwladol ar drafnidiaeth yng Nghymru. Rhaid inni ddatblygu pob rhan o’n system drafnidiaeth. Yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog yn pwysleisio bod hyn yn rhan o’n gweledigaeth ar gyfer datblygu Cymru a’i statws yn y byd. Mae’n arbennig o bwysig allforio nwyddau o Gymru drwy gludwyr i bob cwr o’r byd.
Sue Essex The Minister for Environment spoken in English p. 95
Sue Essex Y Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 95
Thank you, David, for raising this issue. Some interesting points have been raised. However, I want to clarify the basic point that David made at the beginning of his speech. I think that I heard him say that we should aspire to make this the premier airport in western Europe—
Diolch ichi David, am godi’r mater hwn. Codwyd rhai pwyntiau diddorol. Fodd bynnag, hoffwn egluro’r pwynt sylfaenol a wnaeth David ar ddechrau ei araith. Credaf i mi ei glywed yn dweud y dylem anelu at sicrhau mai dyma fydd y prif faes awyr yng ngorllewin Ewrop—
Western Britain.
Gorllewin Prydain.
Sorry, in western Britain. I am going deaf. I panicked slightly when I heard that. The thought of the Vale of Glamorgan turning into Schiphol or Heathrow airport would not please many of its residents. I am glad that we have clarified that.
Mae’n ddrwg gennyf, yng ngorllewin Prydain. Yr wyf yn siŵr fy mod yn mynd yn fyddar. Teimlais ychydig o banig pan glywais hynny. Ni fyddai’r syniad o weld Bro Morgannwg yn troi i fod yn faes awyr Schiphol neu Heathrow yn plesio llawer o’i thrigolion. Yr wyf yn falch ein bod wedi egluro hynny.
As many of the speakers said there are huge opportunities here to do something more imaginative and important for Wales as a whole. There are environmental considerations, as Mick rightly said, and that is why we have given priority to the rail link. However, anyone arriving or departing from this international airport would understand the comment of a Frenchman who got off the plane behind me and read ‘international’ very slowly, because he had just left Brussels airport.
Fel y dywedodd nifer o’r siaradwyr, mae cyfleoedd aruthrol yma i wneud rhywbeth mwy dyfeisgar a phwysig i Gymru gyfan. Mae ystyriaethau amgylcheddol, fel y dywedodd Mick yn gywir, a dyna pam yr ydym wedi rhoi blaenoriaeth i’r cyswllt rheilffordd. Fodd bynnag, byddai unrhyw un sydd yn cyrraedd neu’n gadael y maes awyr rhyngwladol hwn yn deall sylw’r gŵr o Ffrainc a ddaeth oddi ar yr awyren y tu ôl imi ac a ddarllenodd ‘rhyngwladol’ yn araf iawn, am ei fod newydd adael maes awyr Brwsel.
This airport is important not only to us, but in bringing visitors into Wales. This debate is useful. It is not that we have not taken any action on this, and I will discuss some of the points raised later. However, I thank David for bringing this debate to the Assembly, because it gives us, as he said, a focus for transport and economic development.
Mae’r maes awyr nid yn unig yn bwysig i ni, ond mae hefyd yn denu ymwelwyr i Gymru. Mae’r ddadl hon yn ddefnyddiol. Ond rhaid pwysleisio ein bod wedi cymryd rhai camau yn hyn o beth, a thrafodaf rai o’r pwyntiau a godwyd yn ddiweddarach. Fodd bynnag, diolchaf i David am gyflwyno’r ddadl hon yn y Cynulliad, oherwydd, fel y dywedodd, rhydd ffocws inni ar drafnidiaeth a datblygu economaidd.
It is important to say that the airport is a commercial operation. It is run by a private company, which makes commercial decisions. In fact, I heard the managing director, on Good Morning Wales yesterday, making that point and saying how the airport has expanded. While taking the aspirations of Assembly Members into consideration, we must remember that this is a private operation.
Mae’n bwysig dweud bod y maes awyr yn weithrediad masnachol. Caiff ei redeg gan gwmni preifat, sydd yn gwneud penderfyniadau masnachol. Yn wir, clywais y rheolwr gyfarwyddwr yn codi’r pwynt hwnnw ar Good Morning Wales ddoe, ac yn dweud sut mae’r maes awyr wedi ehangu. Er y dylid ystyried dyheadau Aelodau’r Cynulliad, rhaid inni gofio mai gweithrediad preifat yw hwn.
I welcome the progress that has been made. The Wales regional air studies, which I hope will be published soon, will form the basis of a conference. Once they have been published, I want that information to be disseminated. I have guaranteed that a conference or seminar, whichever is appropriate, will be held so that people can contribute on this.
Croesawaf y cynnydd a wnaethpwyd. Bydd astudiaethau awyr rhanbarthol Cymru, y gobeithiaf y cânt eu cyhoeddi’n fuan, yn sail i gynhadledd. Ar ôl eu cyhoeddi, yr wyf am i’r wybodaeth honno gael ei dosbarthu. Yr wyf wedi sicrhau y caiff cynhadledd neu seminar, pa un bynnag sydd yn briodol, ei chynnal yn fuan er mwyn i bobl allu cyfrannu eu sylwadau ar hyn.
My primary consideration is the transport aspects. We have made money available for the rail link—which was widely welcomed—as a connection for people in the Vale of Glamorgan, as well as serving the airport. That makes economic sense in terms of its wider social benefits. I accept Helen Mary’s point that it does not actually reach the airport. Initially we envisage a shuttle service, but I think that she is right to point out that in the medium term, and no longer than that, we can put in an improved rail connection.
Fy mhrif ystyriaeth yw’r agweddau trafnidiaeth. Yr ydym wedi sicrhau bod arian ar gael ar gyfer y cyswllt rheilffordd—a groesawyd yn gyffredinol—fel cyswllt i bobl ym Mro Morgannwg, yn ogsytal â gwasanaethu’r maes awyr. Gwna hynny synnwyr economaidd o ran y manteision cymdeithasol ehangach. Derbyniaf bwynt Helen Mary nad yw’n cyrraedd y maes awyr ei hun. I ddechrau, rhagwelwn wasanaeth gwennol, ond credaf ei bod yn briodol iddi nodi y gallwn, yn y tymor canolig, ond heb fod yn hwy na hynny, sefydlu cyswllt rheilffordd gwell.
There are different points of view on the road, which we need to take into account. The authorities did not put in a bid for a road through the Vale. However, we are funding a joint study with the Vale of Glamorgan and Cardiff councils to look at the connections around Culverhouse Cross. As everyone knows, that is not the best-planned settlement in the world. It has caused enormous problems. The first decision was made, on appeal, against Cardiff council’s recommendations. However, we can see the problem at Culverhouse Cross. We are looking to that study to illustrate points to deal with that, but also to remove some of the notorious roundabout obstacles on the road. That may be a useful way forward.
Ceir safbwyntiau gwahanol ynglŷn â’r ffordd, a dylem eu hystyried. Ni chyflwynodd yr awdurdodau gynnig am ffordd drwy’r Fro. Fodd bynnag, yr ydym yn ariannu astudiaeth ar y cyd gyda chynghorau Bro Morgannwg a Chaerdydd i edrych ar y cysylltiadau yng Nghroes Cwrlwys. Fel y gŵyr pawb, nid dyna’r anheddiad a gynlluniwyd orau yn y byd. Mae wedi creu problemau anferthol. Gwnaethpwyd y penderfyniad cyntaf, ar apêl, yn erbyn argymhellion cyngor Caerdydd. Fodd bynnag, gallwn weld y broblem yng Nghroes Cwrlwys. Yr ydym yn defnyddio’r astudiaeth honno i ddangos pwyntiau i ddelio â hynny, ond hefyd i ddiddymu rhai o’r cylchfannau ofnadwy sydd yn rhwystrau ar y ffordd. Gallai hynny fod yn ffordd ymlaen ddefnyddiol.
You appreciate, David, that there are difficulties in finding a clear route through valuable agricultural and environmental land. The Welsh Consumer Council report that Helen Mary alluded to did not consider that to be the prime consideration. There is a difference of opinion between those who think it is important and others, who think that there are other major commercial considerations that may be dominant factors in the expansion of the airport. Bearing that in mind we have given priority to the rail link, which is generally welcomed. I assure you that we are looking at roads, and part of that will be the feedback from the study, which I hope will be published shortly.
Fe werthfawrogwch, David, fod anawsterau o ran ceisio cael llwybr clir drwy dir amaethyddol ac amgylcheddol werthfawr. Ni wnaeth adroddiad Cyngor Defnyddwyr Cymru y cyfeiriodd Helen Mary ato ystyried fod hynny’n un o’r prif ystyriaethau. Ceir gwahaniaeth barn rhwng y rhai sydd yn credu fod hyn yn bwysig ac eraill, sydd yn ystyried bod ystyriaethau masnachol mawr a allai fod yn ffactorau amlwg wrth ehangu’r maes awyr. Gan gadw hynny mewn cof, yr ydym wedi rhoi blaenoriaeth i’r cyswllt rheilffordd, a groesewir yn gyffredinol. Yr wyf am eich sicrhau ein bod yn ystyried ffyrdd, a rhan o hynny fydd yr adborth o’r astudiaeth, a gaiff ei chyhoeddi’n fuan, gobeithio.
How do we do what everybody wants, and take this forward? I know that the First Minister has had a meeting at the airport—I think with Jane Hutt. Mike German and I will have a meeting there in a few weeks’ time at Jane’s request. That will be a good opportunity to discuss the airport’s commercial operation and its capacity. I agree completely with you about the scheduled links. Many business people approach me about that—in particular about scheduled links to Germany. That is a particular frustration in south-west Wales.
Sut y gwnawn yr hyn y mae pawb ei eisiau, a datblygu’r gwaith hwn? Gwn fod y Prif Weinidog wedi cael cyfarfod yn y maes awyr—gyda Jane Hutt fe gredaf. Byddaf fi a Mike German yn cael cyfarfod yno ymhen ychydig wythnosau ar gais Jane. Bydd hynny’n gyfle da i drafod gweithrediad masnachol y maes awyr a’i allu. Cytunaf yn llwyr â chi ynglŷn â’r cysylltiadau hediadau wedi’u trefnu. Mae llawer o bobl fusnes wedi codi’r mater hwn â mi—yn arbennig y cysylltiadau wedi’u trefnu i’r Almaen. Mae hynny’n rhwystredigaeth arbennig yn ne orllewin Cymru.
We can consider the physical expansion, bearing in mind that that is in the control of the local authority, through its local transport plan and unitary development plan. We will put that in place. Val Feld led a small group from the Economic Development Committee that examined the future of the airport and recommended a summit. I would be pleased to take that forward, because it could include potential operators, as well as us, the airport operators and the local authorities. I would be happy to do that. I have a meeting scheduled, I think, for the beginning of April, with Lord Macdonald, the Minster of State for Transport, where we will examine all the transport issues. That will include Cardiff’s role within the total airport provision in the UK, and the regulatory problems that may be impeding it. I should also plug Cardiff’s chamber of trade and commerce, which is organising a seminar in a few weeks’ time on the airport’s future.
Gallwn ystyried yr ehangu ffisegol, gan gofio mai’r awdurdod lleol sydd yn rheoli hynny, drwy ei gynllun trafnidiaeth lleol a’i gynllun datblygu unedol. Byddwn yn rhoi hynny ar waith. Arweiniodd Val Feld grŵp bach o’r Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd a archwiliodd ddyfodol y maes awyr ac argymhellwyd uwchgynhadledd. Byddwn yn awyddus iawn i ddatblygu hynny, oherwydd gallai gynnwys darpar weithredwyr, yn ogystal â ni, gweithredwyr y maes awyr a’r awdurdodau lleol. Byddwn yn fwy na pharod i wneud hynny. Yr wyf wedi trefnu cyfarfod, fe gredaf, ar gyfer dechrau mis Ebrill, gyda’r Arglwydd Macdonald, y Gweinidog Gwladol dros Drafnidiaeth, lle byddwn yn archwilio’r holl faterion trafnidiaeth. Bydd hynny’n cynnwys rôl Caerdydd o fewn y ddarpariaeth maes awyr gyffredinol yn y DU, a’r problemau rheoliadaol a allai fod yn ei rwystro. Dylwn hefyd roi hysbyseb i siambr fasnach Caerdydd, sydd yn trefnu seminar ymhen ychydig wythnosau ar ddyfodol y maes awyr.
I assure you that matters are in hand. I welcome today’s debate, because it affects many people, whether they have local interests, or wider economic or transport interests. We can achieve a degree of agreement and consensus on this, working with the operators, and our key partners, to develop the airport in the way that most of us want.
Yr wyf am eich sicrhau bod y materion yn cael eu hystyried ar hyn o bryd. Croesawaf y ddadl heddiw, am fod hyn yn effeithio ar lawer o bobl, pa un a oes ganddynt ddiddordebau lleol, neu ddiddordebau economaidd neu drafnidiaeth ehangach. Gallwn sicrhau rhyw fath o gytundeb ar hyn, gan weithio gyda gweithredwyr a’n partneriaid allweddol i ddatblygu’r maes awyr yn y ffordd a ddymunir gan y rhan fwyaf ohonom.
Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 12.19 p.m.
The session ended at 12.19 p.m.