Cymraeg

Cynulliad Cenedlaethol CymruNational Assembly for Wales · Cyfarfod llawnPlenary sitting

Dydd Iau 27 Mehefin 2002

Thursday 27 June 2002

DechreuoddMet 09:05 · Daeth i benRose 12:35

Gweld y Cofnod (PDF)View the Record (PDF)

Heb ei wirio â llaw etoNot yet checked by hand

CynnwysContents

  1. 3Cwestiynau ar Lywodraeth Leol i’r Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a ChymunedauQuestions on Local Government to the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities
    1. 3Gwella Mynediad i Orsafoedd PleidleisioImproving Access to Polling Stations
    2. 5Heddlu Gogledd CymruNorth Wales Police
    3. 7Rhoi Cymunedau’n GyntafCommunities First
    4. 9Rhoi Cymunedau’n GyntafCommunities First
    5. 11Cymryd Rhan mewn Prosesau EtholiadolParticipation in Electoral Processes
    6. 13Cymunedau’r Meysydd GloCoalfield Communities
    7. 15Diogelwch CymunedauCommunity Safety
  2. 16Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros yr AmgylcheddQuestions to the Minister for Environment
    1. 16Ffyrdd DeuolDual Carriageways
    2. 18Partneriaethau Bysiau o SafonQuality Bus Partnerships
    3. 20Nwy Petrolewm HylifedigLiquefied Petroleum Gas
    4. 22Proses Ymgynghori (A48)Consultation Process (A48)
    5. 23Llety i DwristiaidTourist Accommodation
    6. 25Tir HalogedigContaminated Land
  3. 27Datganiad ar Strategaeth Troseddwyr IfancStatement on the Youth Offending Strategy
  4. 39Pwynt o DrefnPoint of Order
  5. 40Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion 1 bleidlais1 vote
  6. 41Cymeradwyo’r Rheoliadau Hawliau Bridwyr Planhigion (Ffioedd) (Diwygio) 2002Approval of the Plant Breeders’ Rights (Fees) (Amendment) Regulations 2002 1 bleidlais1 vote
  7. 42Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Mordwyo Gwy 2002Approval of the Wye Navigation Order 2002 1 bleidlais1 vote
  8. 52Y Cynnydd a wnaed ar y Cynllun Datblygu GwledigThe Progress of the Rural Development Plan 5 o bleidleisiau5 votes
  9. 74Mabwysiadu’r Cynllun Cydraddoldeb HiliolAdoption of the Race Equality Scheme 1 bleidlais1 vote
  10. 93Dadl FerShort Debate
    1. 93Fferyllwyr CymunedolCommunity Pharmacists

PleidleisiauVotes

PleidlaisVoteO blaidForYmatalAbstainYn erbynAgainstCanlyniadResult
Cynnig TrefniadolProcedural Motion
Cynnig trefniadolProcedural motion4100DerbyniwydAdopted
Cymeradwyo’r Rheoliadau Hawliau Bridwyr Planhigion (Ffioedd) (Diwygio) 2002Approval of the Plant Breeders’ Rights (Fees) (Amendment) Regulations 2002
Cynnig NDM1095Motion NDM10954000DerbyniwydAdopted
Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Mordwyo Gwy 2002Approval of the Wye Navigation Order 2002
CynnigMotion4300DerbyniwydAdopted
Y Cynnydd a wnaed ar y Cynllun Datblygu GwledigThe Progress of the Rural Development Plan
Gwelliant 1Amendment 119025GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 2Amendment 219026GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 3Amendment 319026GwrthodwydRejected
Gwelliant 4Amendment 410826GwrthodwydRejected
Cynnig NDM1093Motion NDM109326019DerbyniwydAdopted
Mabwysiadu’r Cynllun Cydraddoldeb HiliolAdoption of the Race Equality Scheme
Cynnig NDM1094Motion NDM10944600DerbyniwydAdopted

TrafodionProceedings

Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 9.05 a.m. gyda’r Llywydd yn y Gadair.

The Assembly met at 9.05 a.m. with the Presiding Officer in the Chair.

Cwestiynau ar Lywodraeth Leol i’r Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau

Questions on Local Government to the Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities

Gwella Mynediad i Orsafoedd Pleidleisio

Improving Access to Polling Stations

Q1 Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 3

C1 Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

Will the Minister make a statement on improving access for disabled people to polling stations? (OAQ18584)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch peri iddi fod yn haws i bobl anabl gael mynediad i orsafoedd pleidleisio? (OAQ18584)

Edwina Hart The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities spoken in English p. 3

Edwina Hart Y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

I attach high importance to making elections accessible to all. I have recently written to returning officers asking them to conduct an audit of their polling stations for compliance with the checklist devised by the Disability Rights Commission and SCOPE. I have also asked them to consider improving polling cards to include information on access and the size of print. My officials will also work closely with the Lord Chancellor’s Department to ensure that sufficient supplies of ramps, large print notices and voting devices for the partially sighted are available.

Rhoddaf bwys mawr ar sicrhau bod pawb yn gallu cymryd rhan mewn etholiadau. Ysgrifennais at y swyddogion canlyniadau’n ddiweddar gan ofyn iddynt archwilio eu gorsafoedd pleidleisio i ganfod a ydynt yn cydymffurfio â’r rhestr wirio a luniwyd gan y Comisiwn Hawliau Anabledd a SCOPE. Yr wyf hefyd wedi gofyn iddynt ystyried gwella’r cardiau pleidleisio fel eu bod yn cynnwys gwybodaeth am fynediad a maint y print. Bydd fy swyddogion yn cydweithio’n agos hefyd ag Adran yr Arglwydd Ganghellor i sicrhau cyflenwad digonol o rampiau, rhybuddion print bras ac offer pleidleisio i’r rhai sydd â golwg rhannol.

Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 3

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

Given that Westminster provides 50 per cent of the funding for this, can you assure us that the Assembly will be able to provide local authorities with the other 50 per cent?

O wybod bod San Steffan yn darparu 50 y cant o’r cyllid ar gyfer hyn, a allwch roi sicrwydd i ni y bydd y Cynulliad yn gallu darparu’r 50 y cant arall ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 3

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 3

We will bring forward a draft Order later this year to cover returning officers’ costs. Subject to consultation, I hope that this will result in local authorities being able to reclaim the full cost of temporary ramps at polling stations from the UK Government and the Assembly. That should help to reverse the regrettable reduction in polling stations in some areas.

Byddwn yn cyflwyno Gorchymyn drafft yn ddiweddarach eleni i dalu costau’r swyddogion canlyniadau. Yn amodol ar ymgynghori, yr wyf yn gobeithio y bydd hyn yn golygu y gall awdurdodau lleol hawlio holl gostau rampiau dros dro mewn gorsafoedd pleidleisio oddi wrth Lywodraeth y DU a’r Cynulliad. Dylai hynny fod o gymorth i wrthdroi’r gostyngiad anffodus yn nifer y gorsafoedd pleidleisio mewn rhai ardaloedd.

David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 3

David Lloyd spoken in Welsh p. 3

Mae nifer o bobl anabl yn methu â mynychu gorsafoedd pleidleisio, ac yn dibynnu ar bleidleisio adref neu o’u cartref preswyl. Sut all y Gweinidog sicrhau bod y bobl hyn yn cadw eu hawl ddemocrataidd i bleidleisio?

Many disabled people cannot attend polling stations, and rely upon home voting or voting from residential homes. How can the Minister ensure that these people’s democratic right to a vote is safeguarded?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 4

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

I share your concern about these issues, including the right to complete forms confidentially. I am discussing these matters with the Electoral Commission, which is also concerned. If it would be helpful to Members, I will publish a written statement on this issue once certain matters are resolved.

Rhannaf eich pryder am y materion hyn, gan gynnwys yr hawl i gwblhau ffurflenni’n gyfrinachol. Yr wyf yn trafod y materion hyn gyda’r Comisiwn Etholiadaol, sydd hefyd yn bryderus. Os byddai o gymorth i’r Aelodau, cyhoeddaf ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ar y pwnc hwn ar ôl penderfynu ar rai materion.

Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 4

Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

Are you aware that correspondence has been circulated to Members in the South Wales West constituency region from a local authority on the reduction in its polling stations? Do you share my concern that some local authorities in Wales may be reducing the number of polling stations, using the Disability Discrimination Act 1995 as an excuse to do so?

A ydych yn ymwybodol bod awdurdod lleol wedi anfon gohebiaeth at Aelodau yn rhanbarth etholaeth Gorllewin De Cymru ynghylch gostwng nifer ei orsafoedd pleidleisio? A ydych yn rhannu fy mhryder ei bod yn bosibl bod rhai awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru’n gostwng nifer y gorsafoedd pleidleisio, gan ddefnyddio Deddf Gwahaniaethu ar Sail Anabledd 1995 fel esgus i wneud hynny?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 4

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 4

I am aware of this, because I have received a copy of the correspondence from Bridgend County Borough Council. Bridgend council has closed nearly 15 per cent of its polling stations, which is by far the biggest reduction in Wales. The numbers of people who will vote in these polling stations is now approaching 1,200 in Bridgend and almost 1,000 in Ogmore. These are among the highest numbers in Wales—neighbouring constituencies such as Neath and Aberavon have around 800 voters per polling station. I am pleased that Bridgend council intends to consult SCOPE on polling stations, but I am concerned that authorities are not considering this issue properly. The Disability Discrimination Act 1995 is about ensuring people’s rights; it should never be used as an excuse to close polling stations. We should consider other locations and how to ensure that suitable polling stations are available. Some large estates do not have anywhere for people to vote. That is unacceptable in a modern democracy.

Yr wyf yn ymwybodol o hynny, gan imi dderbyn copi o’r ohebiaeth oddi wrth Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr. Mae cyngor Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr wedi cau ymron i 15 y cant o’i orsafoedd pleidleisio, sef y gostyngiad mwyaf yng Nghymru o bell ffordd. Mae’r niferoedd a fydd yn pleidleisio yn y gorsafoedd pleidleisio hyn yn agosáu at 1,200 erbyn hyn ym Mhen-y-bont ar Ogwr ac ymron i 1,000 yn Ogwr. Maent ymysg y niferoedd mwyaf yng Nghymru—mae gan etholaethau cyfagos fel Castell-nedd ac Aberafan tua 800 o bleidleiswyr fesul gorsaf bleidleisio. Yr wyf yn falch bod cyngor Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr yn bwriadu ymgynghori â SCOPE ynghylch ei orsafoedd pleidleisio, ond yr wyf yn bryderus nad yw’r awdurdodau’n ystyried y pwnc hwn mewn modd priodol. Mae Deddf Gwahaniaethu ar sail Anabledd 1995 yn ymwneud â sicrhau hawliau pobl; ni ddylid byth ei defnyddio fel esgus i gau gorsafoedd pleidleisio. Dylem ystyried lleoliadau eraill a sut i sicrhau bod gorsafoedd pleidleisio addas ar gael. Ceir rhai ystadau mawr lle nad oes unman i bobl bleidleisio. Mae hynny’n annerbyniol mewn democratiaeth fodern.

Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 5

Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

You will be aware that in the recent local elections in England, an electronic voting system was used on a trial basis. Computers were taken into old people’s homes, hospitals and sheltered accommodation to help those who could not reach a polling station to vote. Will you advise your colleagues to consider the use of this method in the Assembly elections next year?

Byddwch yn ymwybodol bod system bleidleisio electronig wedi’i rhagbrofi yn yr etholiadau lleol diweddar yn Lloegr. Aethpwyd â chyfrifiaduron i gartrefi hen bobl, ysbytai a thai cysgodol i helpu’r rhai na allent gyrraedd gorsaf bleidleisio i fwrw eu pleidlais. A wnewch chi gynghori’ch cyd-Aelodau i ystyried defnyddio’r dull hwn yn etholiadau’r Cynulliad y flwyddyn nesaf?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 5

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

We discuss these issues with the Electoral Commission, which is responsible for finding innovative ways to make voting accessible. Local authorities can ask for such voting methods for their elections, but, unfortunately, we have been told that the National Assembly for Wales must use more traditional means in 2003. Further representations will be made on this issue. Voting should be made as easy as possible, and we need to consider options such as voting over several days, or voting on a different day of the week. These issues will be subject to future discussion.

Yr ydym yn trafod y materion hyn â’r Comisiwn Etholiadol, sy’n gyfrifol am ddod o hyd i ddulliau arloesol o hwyluso pleidleisio. Gall awdurdodau lleol ofyn am ddulliau pleidleisio o’r fath ar gyfer eu hetholiadau, ond, gwaetha’r modd, dywedwyd wrthym fod yn rhaid i Gynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru ddefnyddio dulliau mwy traddodiadol yn 2003. Cyflwynir sylwadau pellach ar y pwnc hwn. Dylai pleidleisio fod yn broses mor hwylus â phosibl, a rhaid inni ystyried dewisiadau fel pleidleisio dros sawl diwrnod, neu bleidleisio ar ddiwrnod gwahanol yn yr wythnos. Bydd y materion hyn yn destun trafodaeth yn y dyfodol.

Brian Gibbons spoken in English p. 5

Brian Gibbons siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

Neath Port Talbot access group has been in contact with me since the Assembly was established, to deal with the process in advance of the election. Election literature is also an important issue. If people are to partake in the democratic process, they need access to that literature. Is there a case for a central resource whereby election literature could be converted into more disability-friendly formats so that the electorate can be properly informed of the issues involved?

Mae grŵp mynediad Castell-nedd Port Talbot wedi bod mewn cysylltiad â mi ers sefydlu’r Cynulliad, ynglŷn â’r broses cyn yr etholiad. Mae gwybodaeth etholiadol yn fater pwysig hefyd. Os yw pobl i gymryd rhan yn y broses ddemocrataidd, rhaid i’r wybodaeth honno fod ar gael iddynt. A oes dadl dros gael adnodd canolog fel y gellid trosi gwybodaeth etholiadol i ffurfiau sy’n fwy ystyriol o anabledd fel y gellir hysbysu etholwyr yn briodol am y materion sydd dan sylw?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 5

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

I might raise that issue elsewhere. The accessibility of election literature in terms of how we produce it is also an issue for the four political parties in the Chamber. We should all be conscious of the needs of others during that period.

Gallwn godi’r mater hwnnw mewn man arall. Mae’r gallu i gael gwybodaeth etholiadol o ran sut caiff ei chynhyrchu yn fater hefyd i’r pedair plaid wleidyddol yn y Siambr. Dylem oll fod yn ymwybodol o anghenion eraill yn ystod y cyfnod hwnnw.

Heddlu Gogledd Cymru

North Wales Police

Q2 Alison Halford spoken in English p. 5

C2 Alison Halford siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 5

What discussions has the Minister had with the chief constable of North Wales Police concerning his decision to increase local taxes to pay for more police officers? (OAQ18517)

Pa drafodaethau y mae’r Gweinidog wedi’u cynnal â phrif gwnstabl Heddlu Gogledd Cymru ynghylch ei benderfyniad i godi trethi lleol er mwyn talu am fwy o blismyn? (OAQ18517)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 6

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

None. Decisions on the council tax precept are a matter for police authorities.

Ni fu trafodaethau rhyngom. Mae penderfyniadau ar y gyfran o’r dreth gyngor a hawlir yn fater i’r awdurdodau heddlu.

Alison Halford spoken in English p. 6

Alison Halford siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

Thank you for that succint reply. Will you comment on the chief constable’s decision to use taxpayers’ money to pay for security arrangements at Mostyn Dock, while all south Wales ports must make private security arrangements? Does the Minister consider that a suitable use of taxpayers’ money and, if so, is she prepared to increase the National Assembly grant to North Wales Police to cover that extra expenditure?

Diolch i chi am yr ateb cryno hwnnw. A wnewch chi sylw ar benderfyniad y prif gwnstabl i ddefnyddio arian y trethdalwyr i dalu am drefniadau diogelwch yn Noc Mostyn, tra bo’n rhaid i holl borthladdoedd y De wneud trefniadau diogelwch preifat? A yw’r Gweinidog yn ei ystyried yn ddefnydd addas o arian y trethdalwyr ac, os ydyw, a yw’n barod i gynyddu’r grant a dderbynia Heddlu Gogledd Cymru oddi wrth y Cynulliad i dalu am y gwariant ychwanegol hwnnw?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 6

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

That is a matter for North Wales Police and the police authority. However, in light of your concerns, I will write to clarify the position with the chief constable of North Wales Police. Although policing is not a devolved matter, it is of great interest to all Members. We are always supportive of the police and the measures that they want. I have made representations to the Home Office about the general levels of police funding in Wales, because Members and others have expressed concerns to me on that issue.

Mae hynny’n fater i Heddlu Gogledd Cymru a’r awdurdod heddlu. Fodd bynnag, yn wyneb eich pryderon, fe ysgrifennaf at brif gwnstabl Heddlu Gogledd Cymru i gael eglurhad ar y sefyllfa. Er nad yw’r heddlu’n fater a ddatganolwyd, mae o ddiddordeb mawr i bob Aelod. Yr ydym bob amser yn gefnogol i’r heddlu a’r mesurau y maent yn dymuno eu cael. Yr wyf wedi cyflwyno sylwadau i’r Swyddfa Gartref am lefelau cyffredinol y cyllid i’r heddlu yng Nghymru, gan fod Aelodau, ac eraill, wedi sôn am eu pryderon ynglŷn â’r mater hwnnw.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 6

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 6

I congratulate you on your recently added responsibilities for drugs and drug awareness, especially since it seems to answer our request, made in a debate in January 2002 on safer communities, for all aspects of community safety to be brought under the portfolio of one Minister. You only need responsibility for youth justice and domestic violence, Minister, and you will be responsible for the whole issue.

Fe’ch llongyfarchaf ar y cyfrifoldebau ychwanegol a gawsoch yn ddiweddar dros gyffuriau ac ymwybyddiaeth o gyffuriau, yn enwedig gan ei bod yn ymddangos bod hynny’n ateb i’n cais, a wnaed mewn dadl yn Ionawr 2002 ar gymunedau mwy diogel, am i bob agwedd ar ddiogelwch cymunedol ddod o dan bortffolio un Gweinidog. Nid oes ond rhaid ichi gael cyfrifoldeb dros gyfiawnder ieuenctid a thrais yn y cartref, Weinidog, ac fe fyddwch yn gyfrifol am yr holl faes.

On north Wales—Alison mentioned Mostyn Dock—at a Local Government and Housing Committee meeting a while ago we raised the issue of the anti-terrorism funding that has been made available for Wales. Holyhead, which is a major point of entry into Wales, will not receive any funding. Have you had time since that meeting to discuss with Westminster whether any money can be made available to increase anti-terrorism activities within the North Wales Police area?

Ynghylch y Gogledd—cyfeiriodd Alison at Ddoc Mostyn—mewn cyfarfod o’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai dro’n ôl bu inni godi mater y cyllid ar gyfer mesurau gwrthderfysgaeth a ddarparwyd ar gyfer Cymru. Ni fydd Caergybi, sy’n bwynt mynediad pwysig i Gymru, yn derbyn unrhyw gyllid. A gawsoch chi amser ers y cyfarfod hwnnw i holi San Steffan a ellir darparu unrhyw arian i gynyddu’r gweithgareddau gwrthderfysgaeth yn ardal Heddlu Gogledd Cymru?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 7

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

That matter was not raised in the Committee meeting yesterday. I have put in hand the necessary inquiries to establish the current position. As I indicated previously in Committee, I will then write to Members and advise them appropriately.

Ni chodwyd y mater hwnnw yng nghyfarfod y Pwyllgor ddoe. Yr wyf wedi cychwyn yr ymholiadau angenrheidiol i gadarnhau’r sefyllfa bresennol. Fel y dywedais o’r blaen yn y Pwyllgor, byddaf yn ysgrifennu at yr Aelodau wedyn i’w hysbysu fel y bo’n briodol.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 7

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

In a recent survey, people from north Wales were in favour of increasing local taxes to pay for extra police officers. Do you agree that this sends out the right message, that we, and our communities, are as responsible as the police and authorities for combating crime and other disturbances?

Mewn arolwg diweddar, nododd pobl o’r Gogledd eu bod o blaid cynyddu trethi lleol i dalu am heddweision ychwanegol. A ydych yn cytuno bod hynny’n cyfleu’r neges gywir, sef ein bod ni, a’n cymunedau, yr un mor gyfrifol â’r heddlu a’r awdurdodau am ymladd troseddu ac aflonyddwch arall?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 7

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

I know that a survey was undertaken, but I cannot comment on it or judge the statistical validity of its results. It is important that we recognise that there is strong public concern about law and order and drug issues. As politicians, we should be responsive in how we deal with these issues and how we manage our budgets. We should draw together the various strands to assist the police in every way.

Gwn fod arolwg wedi’i wneud, ond ni allaf wneud sylw arno neu ddyfarnu ynghylch dilysrwydd ystadegol ei ganlyniadau. Mae’n bwysig inni gydnabod bod pryder mawr ymysg y cyhoedd am faterion sy’n ymwneud â chyfraith a threfn a chyffuriau. Fel gwleidyddion, dylem fod yn ymatebol o ran y modd yr ydym yn delio â’r materion hyn a sut yr ydym yn cadw trefn ar ein cyllidebau. Dylem gyfuno’r gwahanol elfennau i helpu’r heddlu ym mhob ffordd bosibl.

Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf

Communities First

Q3 Phil Williams spoken in English p. 7

C3 Phil Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

Would the Minister make a statement on the relationship between local authorities and existing residents associations in the implementation of the Communities First programme? (OAQ18532)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch y berthynas rhwng awdurdodau lleol a’r cymdeithasau preswylwyr wrth roi’r rhaglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf ar waith? (OAQ18532)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 7

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 7

Local authorities and existing residents associations have potentially key roles to play in the programme and, in particular, the establishment and development of Communities First partnerships. I expect the partnerships to comprise representatives of the statutory sector, the business and voluntary sectors and the community sector, including local people. The make-up of each partnership should be determined locally and the community sector representation should be at least equal to that of any other group.

Gall awdurdodau lleol a chymdeithasau preswylwyr presennol chwarae rhan allweddol yn y rhaglen ac, yn benodol, wrth sefydlu a datblygu partneriaethau Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Disgwyliaf i’r partneriaethau gynnwys cynrychiolwyr o’r sector statudol, y sectorau busnes a gwirfoddol a’r sector cymunedol, gan gynnwys pobl leol. Dylid pennu cyfansoddiad pob partneriaeth yn lleol a dylai fod gan y sector cymunedol o leiaf gymaint o gynrychiolwyr ag unrhyw grŵp arall.

Phil Williams spoken in English p. 8

Phil Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

In order to ensure a bottom-up approach, the Communities First guidelines recommend that existing community organisations should be fully involved in the programme’s administration. Is the Minister aware of the deep concern felt by some long-standing residents associations, which claim that, as soon as large sums of money became available, they were brushed aside and the local authority took full control? Are you monitoring the involvement of effective residents associations in implementing Communities First?

Er mwyn sicrhau dull gweithredu o’r gwaelod i fyny, mae canllawiau Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn argymell y dylai’r cyrff cymunedol presennol gymryd rhan lawn yng ngweinyddiad y rhaglen. A yw’r Gweinidog yn ymwybodol o’r pryder mawr a deimlir gan rai cymdeithasau preswylwyr hirsefydlog, sy’n honni y cawsant eu gwthio i’r naill ochr, cyn gynted ag yr oedd symiau mawr o arian ar gael, a bod yr awdurdod lleol wedi ymgymryd â rheolaeth lawn? A ydych yn cadw golwg ar y rhan a gymerir gan gymdeithasau preswylwyr effeithiol wrth weithredu Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 8

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

I am not monitoring the involvement of residents associations, but I have heard anecdotally of the concerns that have been expressed by organisations that have been working for a long time in certain areas. Its impact on the Communities First programme has been a slight change of direction, perhaps. I discussed the Communities First programme with the Local Government and Housing Committee yesterday, when we considered how partnerships are developing, who is taking the lead and who is involved, and how the funding streams are coming together. If you wish, I will include this point in my report to the Local Government and Housing Committee, where we could discuss it in detail. If Members have further information on this, please write to me so that we can have a full discussion in the Committee.

Nid wyf yn cadw golwg ar y rhan a gymerir gan gymdeithasau preswylwyr, ond yr wyf wedi clywed yn anecdotaidd am y pryderon a fynegwyd gan gyrff a fu’n gweithio ers amser maith mewn rhai ardaloedd. Mae hynny wedi peri ychydig o newid yng nghyfeiriad Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf, efallai. Trafodais raglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf gyda’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai ddoe, pan wnaethom ystyried sut y mae’r partneriaethau’n datblygu, pwy sy’n arwain a phwy sy’n cymryd rhan, a sut y mae’r llifoedd arian yn dod at ei gilydd. Os dymunwch, yr wyf yn fodlon cynnwys y pwynt hwn yn fy adroddiad i’r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai, lle y gallem ei drafod yn fanwl. Os oes gan yr Aelodau wybodaeth bellach, ysgrifennwch ataf, os gwelwch yn dda, fel y gallwn gael trafodaeth lawn yn y Pwyllgor.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 8

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

It is acknowledged that we want to encourage relationships with the private sector through Communities First. How can we overcome the fact that our poorer areas tend to have the fewest private sector companies and how can we influence larger companies in more affluent areas to show social responsibility in the areas of most need?

Cydnabyddir ein bod yn dymuno hybu cysylltiadau â’r sector preifat drwy Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Sut y gallwn oresgyn y ffaith mai ein hardaloedd tlotaf sydd â’r nifer leiaf o gwmnïau preifat gan mwyaf a sut y gallwn ddylanwadu ar y cwmnïau mawr yn yr ardaloedd mwy llewyrchus i ddangos cyfrifoldeb cymdeithasol yn yr ardaloedd mwyaf anghenus?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 8

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 8

It is important that we recognise that we have valuable discussions with organisations such as Business in the Community, which encourages companies to take on social responsibilities and become involved in voluntary activities and assist voluntary organisations. That is the way forward. It would be useful if there were a discussion on Communities First in the Business Partnership Council, in order to consider the wider dimension. The private sector has a valuable role and it does a tremendous amount in the community in terms of the time that it is prepared to give of its employees, and how it uses voluntary work as part of employee development to show its commitment to working with the voluntary sector.

Mae’n bwysig inni gydnabod ein bod yn cael trafodaethau buddiol â chyrff fel Busnes yn y Gymuned, sy’n annog cwmnïau i ymgymryd â chyfrifoldebau cymdeithasol a dechrau cymryd rhan mewn gweithgareddau gwirfoddol a chynorthwyo cyrff gwirfoddol. Dyna’r ffordd ymlaen. Byddai’n fuddiol pe byddai trafodaeth ar Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn y Cyngor Partneriaeth Busnes, er mwyn ystyried y cyd-destun ehangach. Mae rôl werthfawr i’r sector preifat ac mae’n gwneud llawer yn y gymuned o ran yr amser y mae’n fodlon ei roi i’w weithwyr a’r modd y mae’n defnyddio gwaith gwirfoddol fel rhan o ddatblygiad gweithwyr er mwyn dangos ei ymrwymiad i weithio gyda’r sector gwirfoddol.

William Graham spoken in English p. 9

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

Will you give an assurance that the shortage of skilled community workers will not retard support and initiatives?

A wnewch chi ein sicrhau na fydd y prinder o weithwyr cymunedol medrus yn llesteirio’r cymorth a’r mentrau?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 9

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

We discussed this yesterday in the Local Government and Housing Committee. The Committee’s report highlights this as an issue in Wales. We have anecdotal evidence that people are poaching good community workers for other projects. We need more people to take up that work. I will need to consider that with some urgency when I respond to the Committee’s report.

Bu inni drafod hyn ddoe yn y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai. Mae adroddiad y Pwyllgor yn tynnu sylw at hyn fel mater sy’n codi yng Nghymru. Mae gennym dystiolaeth anecdotaidd bod pobl yn dwyn gweithwyr cymunedol da ar gyfer prosiectau eraill. Mae arnom angen rhagor o bobl i ymgymryd â’r gwaith hwnnw. Bydd yn rhaid imi ystyried hynny ar gryn frys pan ymatebaf i adroddiad y Pwyllgor.

Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf

Communities First

Q4 Val Lloyd spoken in English p. 9

C4 Val Lloyd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

Can you give an update on the Communities First initiative? (OAQ18475)

A all y Gweinidog roi adroddiad ar y diweddaraf ynghylch y rhaglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf? (OAQ18475)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 9

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 9

Good progress continues to be made, but it is not a perfect world in terms of Communities First. Since we issued guidance on Communities First last year more than £6.7 million has been released to support the programme’s implementation. I have also supported a consortium of organisations known as the Communities First support network. It provides professional advice to Communities First partnerships as they develop. Further guidance for local authorities and partnership co-ordinators has been developed and will be circulated in the near future.

Gwneir cynnydd da o hyd, ond nid yw popeth yn berffaith o ran Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Ers inni gyhoeddi’r canllawiau ar Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf y llynedd, rhyddhawyd dros £6.7 miliwn i gynnal y gwaith o weithredu’r rhaglen. Yr wyf wedi rhoi cymorth hefyd i gonsortiwm o gyrff a mudiadau a elwir yn rhwydwaith cymorth Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Mae’n darparu cyngor proffesiynol i bartneriaethau Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf wrth iddynt ddatblygu. Datblygwyd canllawiau pellach i awdurdodau lleol a chydlynwyr y partneriaethau a chânt eu dosbarthu yn y dyfodol agos.

Val Lloyd spoken in English p. 10

Val Lloyd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

I declare an interest as a councillor for the City and County of Swansea. Thank you for that helpful answer. Each Communities First initiative is different and develops according to local needs. However, much can be learned from every project. Do you intend to audit these projects and measure not only value for money but the added value they bring to communities and the social economy?

Datganaf fuddiant fel cynghorydd dros Ddinas a Sir Abertawe. Diolch ichi am yr ateb defnyddiol hwnnw. Mae pob menter Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn wahanol ac mae’n datblygu’n unol â’r anghenion lleol. Fodd bynnag, gellir dysgu llawer oddi wrth bob prosiect. A ydych yn bwriadu archwilio’r prosiectau hyn a mesur nid yn unig eu gwerth am arian ond hefyd y gwerth ychwanegol y maent yn ei ddwyn i gymunedau a’r economi gymdeithasol?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 10

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

I am exploring those issues with the board I have set up to advise me on Communities First. Considering what good practice has emerged and how we can audit it is invaluable. I am more concerned about how we audit best practice and how the money is working, than about some of the other issues. That is far more important in Communities First than anything else.

Yr wyf yn ymchwilio i’r materion hynny gyda’r bwrdd a sefydlais i’m cynghori ar Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Mae ystyried yr arfer da a ddatblygodd a sut y gallwn ei archwilio’n amhrisiadwy. Yr wyf yn fwy awyddus i archwilio’r arfer gorau a sut y mae’r arian yn gweithio na rhai o’r materion eraill. Mae hynny’n rhan bwysicach o lawer nag unrhyw elfen arall o Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf.

William Graham spoken in English p. 10

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

Will you outline how the lessons being learned from implementing Communities First are being applied to other deprived areas in Wales?

A wnewch ddisgrifio sut y mae’r gwersi a ddysgir o weithredu Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn cael eu cymhwyso at ardaloedd difreintiedig eraill yng Nghymru?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 10

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

That will be the programme’s next stage. If we see innovative work emerging from Communities First areas we can implement best practice elsewhere. It follows from Val Lloyd’s point that when we consider good practice we should consider how we can extend that across Wales. Some of the lessons that have been learned about drawing funding streams together are just as valuable to other areas, as in Communities First areas.

Dyna fydd y cam nesaf yn y rhaglen. Os gwelwn waith arloesol yn datblygu yn ardaloedd Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf, gallwn weithredu’r arfer gorau mewn mannau eraill. Mae’n dilyn o bwynt Val Lloyd y dylem, wrth ystyried arfer da, feddwl am y modd y gallwn ei ymestyn ledled Cymru. Mae rhai o’r gwersi a ddysgwyd am ddod â llifoedd ariannu at ei gilydd mor werthfawr i ardaloedd eraill ag y maent yn ardaloedd Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf.

Pauline Jarman spoken in English p. 10

Pauline Jarman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 10

I declare an interest as a member of Rhondda Cynon Taff County Borough Council. On 20 June, the deputy leader of Cardiff County Council stated bluntly that £83 million of Communities First funding is a derisory amount and described it as a national scandal, given the scale of the social and economic problems that the deprived electoral divisions in Wales face. We now know that only £65 million is available for the programme. How will you bridge the gap to avoid further criticism?

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf. Ar 20 Mehefin, dywedodd dirprwy arweinydd Cyngor Sir Caerdydd yn blwmp ac yn blaen fod £83 miliwn o gyllid Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn swm pitw ac fe’i galwodd yn sgandal genedlaethol, o ystyried maint y problemau cymdeithasol ac economaidd y mae’r adrannau etholiadol difreintiedig yng Nghymru’n eu hwynebu. Gwyddom mai dim ond £65 miliwn sydd ar gael i’r rhaglen. Sut y byddwch yn cau’r bwlch hwnnw er mwyn osgoi beirniadu pellach?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 11

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

I am afraid, Pauline, that you do not understand how budgets work. The allocation was made for year one of the Communities First programme. I gave the commitment that money not spent in year one will be reprofiled, and £83 million will still be available for the Communities First programme.

Mae arnaf ofn, Pauline, nad ydych yn deall sut y mae cyllidebau’n gweithio. Gwnaed y dyraniad ar gyfer blwyddyn gyntaf y rhaglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Rhoddais ymrwymiad y bydd yr arian na chaiff ei wario yn y flwyddyn gyntaf yn cael ei ailbroffilio, a bydd £83 miliwn yn dal i fod ar gael i’r rhaglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf.

As for the comments of the deputy leader of Cardiff council, I am aware of the full text of what she said. I have corresponded with her and look forward to a helpful meeting with her and the Lord Mayor on Communities First. I am ahead of the game.

Am sylwadau dirprwy arweinydd cyngor Caerdydd, yr wyf yn ymwybodol o’r cyfan a ddywedodd. Yr wyf wedi gohebu â hi ac edrychaf ymlaen at gael cyfarfod buddiol â hi a’r Arglwydd Faer ar Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Yr wyf ar y blaen ar hynny.

Cymryd Rhan mewn Prosesau Etholiadol

Participation in Electoral Processes

Q5 Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 11

C5 Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Will the Minister make a statement on the role of local authorities in promoting participation in electoral processes? (OAQ18538)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch rôl awdurdodau lleol o ran annog mwy o bobl i gymryd rhan mewn prosesau etholiadol? (OAQ18538)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 11

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Local authority officers, usually the chief executive, act as returning officers for all elections. They are responsible for ensuring that electors have readily available, accessible polling stations and that postal votes are catered for. As keepers of the electoral register, local authorities are also responsible for ensuring that all eligible adults are able to register. The Electoral Commission now has primary responsibility for encouraging people to participate in elections.

Mae swyddogion awdurdodau lleol, y prif weithredwr fel arfer, yn gweithredu fel swyddogion canlyniadau ar gyfer pob etholiad. Maent yn gyfrifol am sicrhau bod gorsafoedd pleidleisio hygyrch ar gael yn rhwydd i’r etholwyr a bod darpariaeth ar gyfer pleidleisiau post. Fel ceidwaid y gofrestr etholiadol, mae’r awdurdodau lleol yn gyfrifol hefyd am sicrhau bod pob oedolyn cymwys yn gallu cofrestru. Y Comisiwn Etholiadol sydd â’r prif gyfrifoldeb bellach am annog pobl i gymryd rhan mewn etholiadau.

Janice Gregory spoken in English p. 11

Janice Gregory siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

Thank you for that, Minister. Given your lengthy reply to Eleanor Burnham earlier, I will not ask a lengthy supplementary. Will you discuss with local authorities the increased uptake of postal votes? If possible, will you monitor local authorities’ attempts to reduce the numbers of polling stations in their areas?

Diolch i chi am hynny, Weinidog. Oherwydd eich ateb hir i Eleanor Burnham yn gynharach, ni ofynnaf gwestiwn atodol hir. A wnewch drafod gyda’r awdurdodau lleol y nifer gynyddol sy’n defnyddio pleidleisiau post? Os oes modd, a wnewch gadw golwg ar ymdrechion yr awdurdodau lleol i leihau nifer y gorsafoedd pleidleisio yn eu hardaloedd?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 11

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 11

The Committee on Equality of Opportunity was concerned about polling stations when I was Chair. I am sure that disabled access and such issues will be an ongoing matter for that Committee. We will obviously continue to monitor these issues for the National Assembly elections. I will pass on any concerns to the Electoral Commission, which has responsibility for these matters. It is aware of our concern, as it presented evidence and discussed matters in the Committee on Equality of Opportunity.

Yr oedd gorsafoedd pleidleisio’n destun pryder i’r Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal pan oeddwn yn Gadeirydd arno. Yr wyf yn sicr y bydd y Pwyllgor hwnnw’n parhau i roi sylw i fynediad i’r anabl a materion o’r fath. Wrth gwrs, byddwn yn parhau i gadw golwg ar y materion hynny ar gyfer etholiadau’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol. Trosglwyddaf unrhyw bryderon i’r Comisiwn Etholiadol, sy’n gyfrifol am y materion hyn. Mae’n ymwybodol o’n pryder, gan iddo gyflwyno tystiolaeth a thrafod y materion yn y Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal.

Nick Bourne The Leader of the Welsh Conservatives spoken in English p. 12

Nick Bourne Arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

Minister, you will be aware that, if enacted, the Disability Discrimination (Amendment) Bill—a private Member’s Bill, which is currently before the House of Lords—will oblige local authorities to prepare a comprehensive strategy to improve all aspects of access for disabled people in elections, not just access to polling stations. Will you ensure that the Government of Wales makes representations to the Government at Westminster to ensure that the Bill is given an easy passage? If it is not enacted, how will you ensure that the spirit of that Bill is implemented by local authorities in Wales?

Weinidog, byddwch yn ymwybodol y bydd y Mesur Gwahaniaethu ar sail Anabledd (Diwygio)—Mesur Aelod preifat, sydd gerbron Tŷ’r Arglwyddi ar hyn o bryd—os daw’n ddeddf, yn gorfodi awdurdodau lleol i baratoi strategaeth gynhwysfawr i wella pob agwedd ar fynediad i bobl anabl mewn etholiadau, nid yn unig i orsafoedd pleidleisio. A wnewch sicrhau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru’n cyflwyno sylwadau i’r Llywodraeth yn San Steffan i sicrhau y rhoddir rhwydd hynt i’r Mesur? Os na ddaw’n ddeddf, sut y gwnewch chi sicrhau y caiff ysbryd y Mesur hwnnw ei weithredu gan awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 12

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

The spirit of that Bill is important, as regards making everything accessible for people with disabilities. In light of your point, Nick, I will see what representations have been made on the Bill and, if it is enacted, how we could be of assistance in Wales.

Mae ysbryd y Mesur hwnnw’n bwysig, o ran sicrhau bod mynediad i bopeth i bobl sydd ag anableddau. Yn wyneb y pwynt a wnaethoch, Nick, gwnaf weld pa sylwadau a gyflwynwyd ar y Mesur ac, os daw’n ddeddf, sut y gallem fod o gymorth yng Nghymru.

Lorraine Barrett spoken in English p. 12

Lorraine Barrett siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

Will you encourage all local authorities to follow Cardiff council’s good lead in offering a postal vote to every elector in every election?

A wnewch annog pob awdurdod lleol i ddilyn arweiniad da cyngor Caerdydd wrth gynnig pleidlais bost i bob etholwr ym mhob etholiad?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 12

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

These are primarily issues for the Electoral Commission and local government, but many have noted Cardiff’s success and I understand that other local authorities are considering the issue.

Materion i’r Comisiwn Etholiadol a llywodraeth leol yw’r rhain yn bennaf, ond mae llawer wedi nodi llwyddiant Caerdydd ac yr wyf yn deall bod awdurdodau lleol eraill yn ystyried y mater.

Janet Davies spoken in English p. 12

Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 12

The most important participation issue is ensuring confidentiality and the absence of undue pressure on voters. That is far more important than electronic voting and such matters. What steps will you take, in combination with the Electoral Commission and local authorities, to ensure that postal voting is as confidential as voting in a polling station?

Y mater pwysicaf o ran cymryd rhan yw sicrhau cyfrinachedd ac nad oes unrhyw bwysau amhriodol ar bleidleiswyr. Mae hynny’n bwysicach o lawer na phleidleisio electronig a materion o’r fath. Pa gamau a gymerwch, ar y cyd â’r Comisiwn Etholiadol a’r awdurdodau lleol, i sicrhau bod pleidleisio drwy’r post mor gyfrinachol ag y mae pleidleisio mewn gorsaf bleidleisio?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 13

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

As I indicated earlier, I regard that issue with grave concern. It will have to be explored by the Electoral Commission. There is anecdotal evidence of instances in polling stations, when voters have had to consult the polling clerk, of them being left to get on with it, with other people around. It is possible to close a polling station until a particular person has cast their vote. There are several issues that must be firmed up by the time of the National Assembly elections.

Fel y dywedais yn gynharach, yr wyf yn bryderus iawn ynghylch y mater hwnnw. Bydd yn rhaid i’r Comisiwn Etholiadol ymchwilio iddo. Mae tystiolaeth anecdotaidd o achosion mewn gorsafoedd pleidleisio, pan fu’n rhaid i bleidleiswyr ymgynghori â’r clerc pleidleisio, lle na roddwyd cymorth iddynt, a phobl eraill o gwmpas. Mae’n bosibl cau gorsaf bleidleisio nes bydd rhywun penodol wedi bwrw ei bleidlais. Mae sawl mater y bydd yn rhaid ei wella erbyn etholiadau’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol.

Cymunedau’r Meysydd Glo

Coalfield Communities

Q6 Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 13

C6 Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

How has the Assembly contributed to regenerating coalfield communities in Wales? (OAQ18512)

Ym mha ffordd y mae’r Cynulliad wedi cyfrannu at adfywio cymunedau’r meysydd glo yng Nghymru? (OAQ18512)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 13

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

The European structural funds Objective 1 programme contributes significantly to the regeneration of former coalfield communities. About 92 per cent of the most deprived of such communities are in the area covered by the programme. Furthermore, 57 former coalfield areas are included in the Communities First programme. The Assembly Government’s local regeneration fund also contributes to regenerating coalfield communities by providing up to 100 per cent capital and revenue funding for projects in deprived areas. Finally, the Assembly provides funding for the Coalfields Regeneration Trust, which is a well-established body.

Mae rhaglen Amcan 1 cronfeydd strwythurol Ewrop yn cyfrannu’n helaeth at adfywio cymunedau’r cyn feysydd glo. Mae tua 92 y cant o’r cymunedau mwyaf difreintiedig o’r fath yn ardal y rhaglen. Yn ogystal â hynny, mae 57 o ardaloedd y cyn feysydd glo wedi’u cynnwys yn y rhaglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Mae cronfa adfywio lleol Llywodraeth y Cynulliad hefyd yn cyfrannu at adfywio cymunedau’r meysydd glo drwy ddarparu hyd at 100 y cant o’r cyllid cyfalaf a refeniw i brosiectau mewn ardaloedd difreintiedig. Yn olaf, mae’r Cynulliad yn darparu cyllid ar gyfer Ymddiriedolaeth Adfywio’r Meysydd Glo, sy’n gorff a sefydlwyd ers tro.

Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 13

Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

I declare an interest as a member of Rhondda Cynon Taff County Borough Council, whose financial situation has been transformed under the leadership of Pauline Jarman, who knows a great deal about budgets.

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf, y trawsnewidiwyd ei sefyllfa ariannol o dan arweinyddiaeth Pauline Jarman, sy’n gwybod llawer am gyllidebau.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 13

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 13

Order. While I share every other Member’s affection for Pauline Jarman, I would like you to ask a question.

Trefn. Er fy mod mor hoff o Pauline Jarman â phob Aelod arall, fe hoffwn ichi ofyn cwestiwn.

Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 14

Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

Minister, you are on record as saying that you wish to give more funding to the Coalfields Regeneration Trust next year. Given that you have underspent on last year’s Communities First programme to the tune of £18 million, why have you not allocated that desperately needed extra funding already?

Weinidog, yr ydych wedi dweud ar goedd eich bod yn dymuno rhoi rhagor o gyllid i Ymddiriedolaeth Adfywio’r Meysydd Glo y flwyddyn nesaf. O ystyried eich bod wedi tanwario £18 miliwn ar raglen Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf y llynedd, pam nad ydych eisoes wedi dyrannu’r cyllid ychwanegol hwnnw y mae taer angen amdano?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 14

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

I have not underspent the money for the Communities First regeneration programme. It was the first year of the programme, when one would expect difficulties. We have also experienced difficulties in moving the bids process forwards. Therefore, that money remains in the system. Do not try to score points on that.

Nid wyf wedi tanwario’r arian ar gyfer rhaglen adfywio Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf. Honno oedd blwyddyn gyntaf y rhaglen, pan fyddai rhywun yn disgwyl anawsterau. Yr ydym wedi profi anawsterau hefyd wrth symud y broses ceisiadau yn ei blaen. Felly, mae’r arian hwnnw yn y system o hyd. Peidiwch â cheisio ennill ar gorn hynny.

On the Coalfields Regeneration Trust, I make it clear that the Local Government and Housing Committee supported my bid for additional resources in its meeting yesterday. That will go into the pot, and I will deal with it when I put on my finance hat.

Ynghylch Ymddiriedolaeth Adfywio’r Meysydd Glo, rhoddaf ar ddeall bod y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai wedi cefnogi fy nghais am adnoddau ychwanegol yn ei gyfarfod ddoe. Aiff hynny i’r pot, ac ymdriniaf â hynny pan wisgaf fy het cyllid.

David Davies spoken in English p. 14

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

One coalfield community that desperately needs support and regeneration is Ebbw Vale. Will you support the Ebbw Vale to Newport rail link, which will deliver huge improvements to the economy at relatively little environmental and financial cost?

Un gymuned mewn maes glo y mae arni daer angen cymorth ac adfywio yw Glynebwy. A wnewch gefnogi’r cyswllt rheilffordd o Lynebwy i Gasnewydd, a ddaw â gwelliannau aruthrol i’r economi am gost amgylcheddol ac ariannol gymharol fach?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 14

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

My colleague, Sue Essex, fully supports setting up rail links between Ebbw Vale and the rest of Wales. It has been a major achievement to have come this far in our discussions. It is important that we use rail so that people have the opportunity to travel from Ebbw Vale to their places of work; it will also help to encourage the growth of industry there.

Mae fy nghyd-Weinidog, Sue Essex, yn llwyr o blaid sefydlu cysylltiadau rheilffordd rhwng Glynebwy a gweddill Cymru. Cyflawniad mawr oedd dod cyn belled â hyn yn ein trafodaethau. Mae’n bwysig inni ddefnyddio rheilffyrdd fel bod cyfle gan bobl i deithio o Lynebwy i’w mannau gwaith; bydd hefyd o gymorth i hybu twf diwydiant yno.

Kirsty Williams spoken in English p. 14

Kirsty Williams siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

Many former mining communities in my constituency do not qualify for Objective 1. While the Communities First initiative in Ystradgynlais is particularly welcome, what can you do to spread the benefits of Communities First in Ystradgynlais to the surrounding areas, such as Abercrave?

Mae llawer o gymunedau cyn lofaol yn fy etholaeth i nad ydynt yn gymwys ar gyfer Amcan 1. Tra bo’r fenter Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn Ystradgynlais yn arbennig o dderbyniol, beth y gallwch ei wneud i ledaenu manteision Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf yn Ystradgynlais i’r ardaloedd o’i chwmpas, fel Aber-craf?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 14

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 14

Powys County Council raised this matter with me and I have been discussing it with the council. I understand that even though Ystradgynlais benefits from the initiative, some areas on the periphery do not and also need help. We must consider imaginatively how to spread the benefits of Communities First and whether we could establish links between communities thereby allowing funds for projects in Ystradgynlais to flow across and benefit other areas. This matter is high on the agenda and I intend to address it.

Mae Cyngor Sir Powys wedi codi’r mater hwn gyda mi a bûm yn ei drafod gyda’r cyngor. Yr wyf yn deall, er bod Ystradgynlais yn cael budd o’r fenter, fod rhai o’r ardaloedd ar y cyrion nad ydynt a bod angen cymorth arnynt hwy hefyd. Rhaid inni ystyried yn ddyfeisgar sut y gallwn ledaenu buddion Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf a gweld a allem greu cysylltiadau rhwng cymunedau fel y gall cyllid i brosiectau yn Ystradgynlais lifo ar draws a dod â lles i ardaloedd eraill. Mae’r mater hwn yn flaenoriaeth a bwriadaf ymdrin ag ef.

Diogelwch Cymunedau

Community Safety

Q7 David Melding spoken in English p. 15

C7 David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 15

What measures is the Minister taking to improve community safety? (OAQ18502)

Pa fesurau y mae’r Gweinidog yn eu cymryd i beri bod cymunedau yn fwy diogel? (OAQ18502)

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 15

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 15

I have taken several measures. For example, I am ensuring that the crime reduction director for Wales and his team work closely with officials across the Assembly’s programme to ensure that community safety issues are taken into account in policy development.

Yr wyf wedi cymryd sawl cam. Er enghraifft, yr wyf yn sicrhau bod cyfarwyddwr Cymru dros ostwng troseddu a’i dîm yn cydweithio’n agos â swyddogion ym mhob rhan o raglen y Cynulliad i sicrhau y caiff materion diogelwch cymunedol eu hystyried wrth ddatblygu polisi.

I have secured a police secondee to provide advice and assistance to the Communities Directorate and I have arranged for a review of all community safety related actions across all the Assembly’s departments to establish how best we can contribute to the safer communities agenda and where funding could be most beneficial and effective. The First Minister’s recent decision to give me the policy lead on drugs and alcohol means that I can now make a more effective link between substance misuse, crime reduction and the social inclusion agenda.

Yr wyf wedi sicrhau bod swyddog o’r heddlu yn dod yma ar secondiad i ddarparu cyngor a chymorth i’r Gyfarwyddiaeth Gymunedau, ac yr wyf wedi trefnu adolygiad o’r holl gamau sy’n ymwneud â diogelwch cymunedol yn holl adrannau’r Cynulliad i ddarganfod sut y gallwn gyfrannu orau i’r agenda cymunedau mwy diogel ac ym mhle y gallai cyllid fod yn fwyaf buddiol ac effeithiol. Mae penderfyniad diweddar Prif Weinidog Cymru i roi imi’r arweiniad polisi ar gyffuriau ac alcohol yn golygu y gallaf greu cysylltiad mwy effeithiol rhwng camddefnyddio sylweddau, gostwng troseddu a’r agenda cynhwysiant cymdeithasol.

David Melding spoken in English p. 15

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 15

Do you agree that one of the best actions that we could take to promote safety in the community would be to abolish the national speed limit, so that county councillors could set speed limits on county roads? We currently assume a 60 miles per hour speed limit, which is grossly in excess of what is appropriate for safety on such roads.

A ydych yn cytuno mai un o’r camau gorau y gallem eu cymryd i hyrwyddo diogelwch yn y gymuned yw dileu’r cyfyngiad cyflymder cenedlaethol, fel y gallai cynghorwyr sir bennu cyfyngiadau cyflymder ar ffyrdd sirol? Ar hyn o bryd yr ydym yn derbyn cyfyngiad cyflymder o 60 milltir yr awr, sy’n fwy o lawer na’r hyn sy’n briodol er diogelwch ar ffyrdd o’r fath.

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 16

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Sue Essex, the Minister responsible for transport, also has views on this. As an individual, I support your comments.

Mae gan Sue Essex, y Gweinidog sy’n gyfrifol am drafnidiaeth, farn am hyn hefyd. Fel unigolyn, yr wyf yn cefnogi’ch sylwadau.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 16

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 16

Wrth gynnal yr arolwg o’r hyn sydd angen ei wneud ar draws bob pwnc yn y Cynulliad i sicrhau diogelwch cymunedau—

In conducting the review of what needs to be done across every subject area in the Assembly to ensure safety in our communities—

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 16

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Sorry, my translation headset is not working.

Mae’n ddrwg gennyf, nid yw fy nghlustffon cyfieithu’n gweithio.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in English p. 16

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

I will repeat what I said in English. In conducting a review across Assembly portfolios to see how we can encourage safety in communities, do you accept that priorities in rural areas are different and will you take that into consideration?

Gwnaf ailadrodd yr hyn a ddywedais yn Saesneg. Wrth gynnal adolygiad ar draws portffolios y Cynulliad i weld sut y gallwn hybu diogelwch mewn cymunedau, a dderbyniwch fod y blaenoriaethau mewn ardaloedd gwledig yn wahanol ac y dylid rhoi ystyriaeth i hynny?

Edwina Hart spoken in English p. 16

Edwina Hart siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

I am concerned about rural crime and drug abuse in rural areas, in particular. I am mindful that there are differences in approach and perhaps slight differences in priorities. However, our overall priority is to tackle crime, and we must use the best means possible to do that in both rural and urban areas.

Yr wyf yn bryderus ynghylch troseddu gwledig a chamddefnyddio cyffuriau mewn ardaloedd gwledig, yn benodol. Yr wyf yn ymwybodol bod yna ddulliau gweithredu gwahanol a gwahaniaethau bach o ran blaenoriaethau efallai. Fodd bynnag, ein blaenoriaeth yn gyffredinol yw mynd i’r afael â throseddu, a rhaid inni ddefnyddio’r dulliau gorau posibl i wneud hynny mewn ardaloedd gwledig a threfol.

Cwestiynau i’r Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd

Questions to the Minister for Environment

Ffyrdd Deuol

Dual Carriageways

Q1 Janet Davies spoken in English p. 16

C1 Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

Can the Minister make a statement on criteria used to justify dual carriageways? (OAQ18575)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch y meini prawf a ddefnyddir i gyfiawnhau ffyrdd deuol? (OAQ18575)

Sue Essex The Minister for Environment spoken in English p. 16

Sue Essex Y Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

The choice of carriageway standard for roads is based on consideration of several factors, including technical, operational, environmental, social and economic assessment, value for money and safety.

Mae dewis safon lôn gerbydau ar gyfer ffyrdd yn seiliedig ar sawl ffactor, gan gynnwys asesiad technegol, gweithredol, amgylcheddol, cymdeithasol ac economaidd, gwerth am arian a diogelwch.

Janet Davies spoken in English p. 16

Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 16

I understand that the estimated cost of dualling the A40, west from St Clears in particular, is between £60 million and £100 million. Media reports give the impression that that plan is going ahead, but road documents state that it is still being decided. What is the status of the A40 dualling?

Deallaf fod yr amcangyfrif o gost gwaith deuoli’r A40, i’r gorllewin o Sanclêr yn benodol, rhwng £60 miliwn a £100 miliwn. Mae adroddiadau ar y cyfryngau’n rhoi’r argraff bod y cynllun yn mynd yn ei flaen, ond mae’r dogfennau ffyrdd yn datgan ei fod yn aros penderfyniad o hyd. Beth yw statws gwaith deuoli’r A40?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 17

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

The status of the A40 dualling was expressed in the trunk road statement earlier this year, and so I refer you to that. We are working more on environmental considerations currently, and whichever process we take forward, statute requires an environmental statement to be attached to it.

Nodwyd statws gwaith deuoli’r A40 yn y datganiad ar gefnffyrdd yn gynharach eleni, ac felly fe’ch cyfeiriaf at hwnnw. Yr ydym yn gweithio i fwy o raddau ar sail ystyriaethau amgylcheddol ar hyn o bryd, a pha bynnag broses y penderfynwn arni, mae’r gyfraith yn mynnu y bydd datganiad amgylcheddol ynghlwm wrthi.

Mick Bates spoken in English p. 17

Mick Bates siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

I thank the Minister for her successful visit to Montgomeryshire yesterday.

Diolchaf i’r Gweinidog am ei hymweliad llwyddiannus â sir Drefaldwyn ddoe.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 17

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Order. This question is not about visiting Montgomeryshire; it is about dual carriageways.

Trefn. Nid yw’r cwestiwn hwn yn ymwneud ag ymweld â sir Drefaldwyn; mae’n ymwneud â ffyrdd deuol.

Mick Bates spoken in English p. 17

Mick Bates siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

I am sure that the Minister found the journey quite difficult, because of the poor quality of our roads.

Yr wyf yn siŵr bod y Gweinidog wedi cael y siwrnai’n un eithaf anodd, oherwydd ansawdd gwael ein ffyrdd.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 17

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Order. It is about time that we had sharp questions, rather than endless preambles to supplementary questions. Mick Bates, show us a lead.

Trefn. Mae’n hen bryd inni gael cwestiynau miniog, yn hytrach na rhagymadroddi diddiwedd i gwestiynau atodol. Mick Bates, dangoswch arweiniad i ni.

Mick Bates spoken in English p. 17

Mick Bates siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

Minister, will you consider bringing forward some of the proposals to improve the roads in mid Wales that were outlined in your 10-year road strategy?

Weinidog, a wnewch ystyried bwrw ymlaen yn gynharach â rhai o’r cynlluniau i wella’r ffyrdd yn y Canolbarth a amlinellwyd yn eich strategaeth ffyrdd 10 mlynedd?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 17

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 17

I had a pleasant journey to mid Wales yesterday, on the roads and by canal. [Laughter.] Sorry, Llywydd. It is the end-of-term mentality creeping in. If Brian Hancock can mention canals at every opportunity, so can I.

Cefais daith ddymunol i’r Canolbarth ddoe, ar y ffyrdd ac ar gamlas. [Chwerthin.] Mae’n ddrwg gennyf, Lywydd. Y meddylfryd pen tymor sy’n llithro i mewn. Os caiff Brian Hancock sôn am gamlesi bob cyfle a gaiff, caf finnau hefyd.

In terms of road improvements through mid Wales, a comprehensive programme is set out in the trunk road statement, to which I referred in response to Janet. That programme sets out a series of improvements and gives a likely timescale. However, statutory procedures and consultation will determine the timescale for many of those improvements. Overall, the people of mid Wales can be assured that we have taken their concerns seriously, and are giving them a way forward.

O ran gwelliannau i ffyrdd drwy’r Canolbarth, nodir rhaglen gynhwysfawr yn y datganiad ar gefnffyrdd, y cyfeiriais ato yn fy ateb i Janet. Mae’r rhaglen honno’n nodi cyfres o welliannau ac mae’n rhoi amserlen debygol. Fodd bynnag, y gweithdrefnau statudol a’r ymgynghori a fydd yn pennu’r amserlen ar gyfer llawer o’r gwelliannau hynny. Yn gyffredinol, caiff pobl y Canolbarth fod yn dawel eu meddwl ein bod wedi cymryd eu pryderon o ddifrif, a’n bod yn cynnig ffordd ymlaen iddynt.

David Davies spoken in English p. 18

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

Does the Minister agree that there will be far less pressure on dual carriageways in south Wales when the Ebbw Vale to Newport rail link is built?

A yw’r Gweinidog yn cytuno y bydd llai o lawer o bwysau ar ffyrdd deuol yn y De pan fydd y cyswllt rheilffordd o Lynebwy i Gasnewydd wedi’i adeiladu?

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 18

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

Order. This question is not about railways.

Trefn. Nid yw’r cwestiwn hwn yn ymwneud â rheilffyrdd.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 18

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

I was pleased that the First Minister announced the Ebbw Vale railway and that we have taken the lead on this matter. It responds to the needs of Ebbw Vale, and is also about modal shift. I will be delighted when it is in place, so that David can use it to get to the Assembly. It will enable him not to use his car for at least part of his journey.

Yr oeddwn yn falch bod Prif Weinidog Cymru wedi cyhoeddi adeiladu rheilffordd Glynebwy a’n bod ni wedi achub y blaen yn y mater hwn. Mae’n ymateb i anghenion Glynebwy, ac mae’n ymwneud hefyd â symudiad moddol. Byddaf wrth fy modd pan fydd ar waith, fel y gall David ei ddefnyddio i gyrraedd y Cynulliad. Bydd yn ei alluogi i beidio â defnyddio ei gar, am ran o’i daith o leiaf.

Ieuan Wyn Jones The Leader of the Opposition spoken in English p. 18

Ieuan Wyn Jones Arweinydd yr Wrthblaid siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

The A55 across north Wales is now a dual carriageway, apart from one section of single carriageway across to Anglesey, which is the Britannia bridge. Will the Minister confirm that she is considering a proposal to turn Britannia bridge into a three-lane carriageway at peak times? Will she also confirm that she is aware of the considerable public support for that proposal? I have a petition for her that has been signed by 8,000 supporters.

Mae’r A55 ar draws y Gogledd yn ffordd ddeuol bellach, ar wahân i un darn o ffordd sengl sy’n croesi i Ynys Môn, sef pont Britannia. A wnaiff y Gweinidog gadarnhau ei bod yn ystyried cynllun i droi pont Britannia’n ffordd dair lôn ar yr adegau brig? A wnaiff hefyd gadarnhau ei bod yn ymwybodol o’r gefnogaeth sylweddol gan y cyhoedd i’r cynllun hwnnw? Mae gennyf ddeiseb iddi a lofnodwyd gan 8,000 o gefnogwyr.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 18

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 18

We are considering the issue of congestion, and officials will advise me on the technical answers. One emerging point concerns stretches of the A55 and the M4, where we have a high standard dual, or wider, carriageway, with congestion occurring at the access points. We will also consider that element.

Yr ydym yn ystyried mater y tagfeydd, a bydd swyddogion yn fy nghynghori ynghylch yr atebion technegol. Daw un pwynt i’r amlwg sy’n ymwneud â rhannau o’r A55 a’r M4, lle y mae ffordd ddeuol, neu un lletach, o ansawdd da, a thagfeydd yn digwydd wrth y pwyntiau mynediad. Byddwn yn ystyried yr elfen honno hefyd.

Partneriaethau Bysiau o Safon

Quality Bus Partnerships

C2 David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 18

Q2 David Lloyd spoken in Welsh p. 18

A yw’r Gweinidog wedi cael unrhyw drafodaethau ag awdurdodau lleol ynghylch partneriaethau bysiau o safon? (OAQ18573)

Has the Minister had any discussions with local authorities regarding quality bus partnerships? (OAQ18573)

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 19

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

I have set up a working group to take forward the introduction of quality bus partnerships alongside the development of a kitemark for buses. This group includes representatives from the Welsh Local Government Association, bus operators and consumer groups. A quality bus partnership is a mechanism to improve bus provision, and I have asked local authorities to work toward introducing them as a condition of receiving capital funding as part of transport grant bids.

Yr wyf wedi sefydlu gweithgor i fwrw ymlaen â chyflwyno partneriaethau bysiau o safon ochr yn ochr â datblygu nod barcutan i fysiau. Mae’r gweithgor hwn yn cynnwys cynrychiolwyr o Gymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, gweithredwyr bysiau a grwpiau defnyddwyr. Mae partneriaeth bysiau o safon yn beirianwaith i wella’r ddarpariaeth o fysiau, ac yr wyf wedi gofyn i’r awdurdodau lleol symud ymlaen i’w cyflwyno fel amod ar dderbyn cyllid cyfalaf fel rhan o’r ceisiadau am grant trafnidiaeth.

David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 19

David Lloyd spoken in Welsh p. 19

A yw’r Gweinidog yn ymgorffori anghenion pobl anabl mewn mesurau partneriaethau bysiau o safon?

Is the Minister incorporating the needs of disabled people into the measures for quality bus partnerships?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 19

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

The needs of disabled people will certainly be considered. I am aware that people with all types of disabilities need better access to public transport. I am glad that we introduced concessionary fares for disabled people and their companions: it has shown that there was a real need and desire for it. We will have to consider the kinds of vehicles used, and—particularly for ambulatory problems—access to them. I am pleased that we used our transport grants over recent years to improve structural aspects.

Ystyrir anghenion pobl anabl, yn sicr. Yr wyf yn ymwybodol bod ar bobl â phob math o anabledd angen gwell mynediad i drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Yr wyf yn falch ein bod wedi cyflwyno tocynnau mantais i bobl anabl a’u cyd-deithwyr: dangosodd fod gwir angen a dymuniad am hynny. Bydd yn rhaid inni ystyried y mathau o gerbydau a ddefnyddir, ac—yn achos problemau cerdded yn enwedig—y mynediad iddynt. Yr wyf yn falch ein bod wedi defnyddio ein grantiau trafnidiaeth dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf hyn i wella agweddau ar adeiladwaith.

The regional bus strategies will include opportunities for improving disabled access, and local authorities can bid for improvements in this year’s transport grant.

Bydd y strategaethau bysiau rhanbarthol yn cynnwys cyfleoedd i wella mynediad i’r anabl, a chaiff awdurdodau lleol ymgeisio am welliannau yn y grant trafnidiaeth eleni.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 19

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

Will you comment on how bus companies in the south Wales Valleys that provide training for their drivers can retain them once they are qualified? Bus service management often cite the loss of newly-qualified drivers as the cause of the sporadic service.

A wnewch sylw am y modd y gall cwmnïau bysiau yng Nghymoedd y De sy’n darparu hyfforddiant i’w gyrwyr eu cadw wedi iddynt ymgymhwyso? Mae rheolwyr gwasanaethau bysiau’n dweud yn aml mai colli gyrwyr sydd newydd ymgymhwyso yw achos y gwasanaeth ysbeidiol.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 19

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 19

Train, bus and lorry drivers do an important skilled job, which has status. It is critical that we reflect that by improving their conditions of service and pay. We will not achieve the quality leap in public transport unless we recognise drivers’ valuable role.

Mae gyrwyr trenau, bysiau a lorïau’n gwneud gwaith medrus pwysig, sydd â statws. Mae’n hollbwysig ein bod yn adlewyrchu hynny drwy wella eu hamodau tâl a gwasanaeth. Ni wnawn sicrhau’r cam ymlaen yn ansawdd trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus os na fyddwn yn cydnabod rôl werthfawr y gyrwyr.

William Graham spoken in English p. 20

William Graham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

Minister, you will have scrutinised the effect that introducing free bus passes for pensioners has had on bus services. How will that scheme be applied to the quality bus partnerships in local authorities, and with the private companies that run the majority of bus services in Wales?

Weinidog, byddwch wedi archwilio effaith cyflwyno tocynnau bysiau am ddim i bensiynwyr ar wasanaethau bysiau. Sut y cymhwysir y cynllun hwnnw at y partneriaethau bysiau o safon yn yr awdurdodau lleol, a’r rhai gyda’r cwmnïau preifat sy’n rhedeg y rhan fwyaf o’r gwasanaethau bysiau yng Nghymru?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 20

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

The concessionary fares scheme is in action, and next year, we will extend it to include men aged 60. All public and private operators are part of that concessionary fares scheme, and it is a fundamental consideration in terms of developing bus services in Wales.

Mae’r cynllun tocynnau mantais ar waith, a’r flwyddyn nesaf, byddwn yn ei ymestyn i gynnwys dynion 60 oed. Mae’r holl weithredwyr cyhoeddus a phreifat yn rhan o’r cynllun tocynnau mantais hwnnw, ac mae’n ystyriaeth sylfaenol o ran datblygu gwasanaethau bysiau yng Nghymru.

Nwy Petrolewm Hylifedig

Liquefied Petroleum Gas

Q3 Brian Gibbons spoken in English p. 20

C3 Brian Gibbons siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

What plans are there to promote the uptake of liquefied petroleum gas in public service vehicles? (OAQ18579)

Pa gynlluniau sydd ar y gweill i hyrwyddo’r defnydd o nwy petrolewm hylifedig mewn cerbydau sy’n darparu gwasanaeth cyhoeddus? (OAQ18579)

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 20

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

I am keen to ensure that the Welsh Assembly Government encourages the greater uptake of clean fuels for all vehicles. The energy saving trust administers the UK Government Powershift programme, which provides grants towards the cost of converting vehicles to cleaner fuels such as LPG. This programme is suitable for public service vehicles up to 14 seats. For larger, diesel-powered buses and coaches, LPG is not presently a viable alternative fuel.

Yr wyf yn awyddus i sicrhau bod Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru’n hyrwyddo’r defnydd o danwyddau glân ym mhob math o gerbyd. Yr ymddiriedolaeth arbed ynni sy’n gweinyddu rhaglen Powershift Llywodraeth y DU, sy’n darparu grantiau tuag at gost addasu cerbydau i ddefnyddio tanwyddau glanach fel nwy petrolewm hylifedig. Mae’r rhaglen hon yn addas i gerbydau gwasanaeth cyhoeddus â hyd at 14 o seddau. Yn achos bysiau a choetsis mwy â motor diesel, ni ellir defnyddio nwy petrolewm hylifedig fel tanwydd amgen ar hyn o bryd.

Brian Gibbons spoken in English p. 20

Brian Gibbons siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

I am pleased that work is being done on this. Vehicle emissions are a major cause of air pollution and consequent health effects, in Wales like everywhere else. Do you envisage setting targets to achieve conversion for those vehicles that are suitable for conversion to cleaner fuels?

Yr wyf yn falch bod gwaith yn mynd rhagddo ar hyn. Gollyngiadau o gerbydau yw un o brif achosion difwyno aer a’r effeithiau ar iechyd sy’n dilyn hynny, yng Nghymru fel ym mhobman arall. A ydych yn rhagweld y byddwch yn gosod targedau i drosi’r cerbydau hynny sy’n addas i’w trosi i ddefnyddio tanwyddau glanach?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 20

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 20

That is a good point. I do not think that we have set targets. At present, only about 1 per cent of vehicles in Great Britain have been converted. Part of the problem is ensuring that the conversion facilities are in place. I believe that there is one in your constituency, Brian. We need to put all the foundations in place before moving to targets. We cannot say that we would not do that, because it is important. In the public sector too, good work is being done in health trusts. Snowdonia National Park Authority and others are taking this forward. We can try to lead by example here to encourage others.

Mae hynny’n bwynt da. Ni chredaf fod yn rhaid inni bennu targedau. Ar hyn o bryd, dim ond 1 y cant o’r cerbydau ym Mhrydain Fawr a addaswyd. Rhan o’r broblem yw sicrhau bod y cyfleusterau addasu ar waith. Credaf fod un yn eich etholaeth chi, Brian. Rhaid inni osod yr holl sylfeini cyn symud at dargedau. Ni allwn ddweud na wnaem hynny, gan ei fod yn bwysig. Yn y sector cyhoeddus hefyd, gwneir gwaith da yn yr ymddiriedolaethau iechyd. Mae Awdurdod Parc Cenedlaethol Eryri ac eraill yn bwrw ymlaen â hyn. Gallwn geisio arwain drwy gynnig esiampl yma i annog eraill.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 21

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

In launching this 12 months ago, you said that it was not yet fully sustainable in Wales. Has there been progress on that sustainability?

Wrth lansio hyn 12 mis yn ôl, dywedasoch nad oedd yn gwbl gynaliadwy eto yng Nghymru. A fu cynnydd ar y cynaliadwyedd hwnnw?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 21

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

To the best of my knowledge there has been progress. The financial incentive helped. As I have just said, if we can demonstrate leadership in the public sector it will encourage others to take that forward.

Hyd y gwn i, fe fu cynnydd. Yr oedd yr anogaeth ariannol o gymorth. Fel yr wyf newydd ddweud, os gallwn ddangos arweiniad yn y sector cyhoeddus bydd hynny’n annog eraill i fwrw ymlaen.

Val Lloyd spoken in English p. 21

Val Lloyd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

I declare an interest as a councillor for the City and County of Swansea Council. Will you join me in congratulating the City and County of Swansea Council in being judged this week as one of the greenest councils in Britain because of its use of LPG for council vehicles, and other measures that it has taken to reduce pollution? I was interested in your earlier replies. As an aid to improving air pollution, will you consider other incentives in addition to those that you have already discussed to encourage others to follow this example?

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Dinas a Sir Abertawe. A wnewch ymuno â mi i longyfarch Cyngor Dinas a Sir Abertawe ar gael ei ddyfarnu’r wythnos hon yn un o’r cynghorau gwyrddaf ym Mhrydain oherwydd ei ddefnydd o nwy petrolewm hylifedig yng ngherbydau’r cyngor, a chamau eraill a gymerodd i leihau llygredd? Ymddiddorais yn eich atebion cynharach. Er mwyn lleihau llygredd aer, a wnewch chi ystyried anogaethau eraill yn ogystal â’r rhai yr ydych wedi’u trafod eisoes i annog eraill i ddilyn yr esiampl hon?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 21

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

I congratulate Swansea council. It is an excellent initiative and approach. Going back to Brian’s questions, there are real environmental and health benefits to be gained from this. The Government is committed to considering all the options to securing cleaner air and better health. We will consider whatever comes forward that is feasible.

Llongyfarchaf gyngor Abertawe. Mae’n fenter ac yn ddull gweithredu rhagorol. Gan fynd yn ôl at gwestiynau Brian, mae manteision gwirioneddol yn deillio o hyn o ran iechyd a’r amgylchedd. Mae’r Llywodraeth wedi ymrwymo i ystyried yr holl ddewisiadau i sicrhau aer glanach a gwell iechyd. Gwnawn ystyried beth bynnag a welwn sy’n ddichonol.

Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 21

Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

Hydrogen fuel cells have been trialled in various cities throughout Europe. Have you approached the Department for Transport to see whether hydrogen cells could be trialled in Wales?

Mae celloedd tanwydd hydrogen wedi’u rhagbrofi mewn gwahanol ddinasoedd ledled Ewrop. A ydych wedi cysylltu â’r Adran Drafnidiaeth i weld a ellir rhagbrofi celloedd hydrogen yng Nghymru?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 21

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 21

I have not approached the Department for Transport, but that is not to say that there are no pilot projects here. I was interested to be at the presentation that Mick recently sponsored, although I could not unfortunately be there for the whole time. Looking to the future, it seems as if hydrogen is a real possibility. However, we are concentrating on LPG at present because we know that we can achieve substantial change in the short term in this area.

Nid wyf wedi cysylltu â’r Adran Drafnidiaeth, ond nid yw hynny’n gyfystyr â dweud nad oes prosiectau peilot yma. Yr oedd o ddiddordeb imi fod yn y cyflwyniad a noddwyd gan Mick yn ddiweddar, er na allwn fod yno drwy gydol yr amser, gwaetha’r modd. Gan edrych tua’r dyfodol, mae’n ymddangos bod hydrogen yn bosibiliad gwirioneddol. Fodd bynnag, yr ydym yn canolbwyntio ar hylif petrolewm hylifedig ar hyn o bryd gan ein bod yn gwybod y gallwn sicrhau newid sylweddol yn y tymor byr yn y maes hwn.

Proses Ymgynghori (A48)

Consultation Process (A48)

Q4 Helen Mary Jones spoken in English p. 22

C4 Helen Mary Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

Will the Minister make a statement about the A48 Carmarthen to Pont Abraham junction study consultation? (OAQ18568)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch y broses ymgynghori ar yr astudiaeth o’r A48 o Gaerfyrddin i gyffordd Pont Abraham? (OAQ18568)

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 22

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

The results from the A48 Carmarthen to Pont Abraham junction study consultation, which took place earlier this year, are being compiled into a report by the West Wales Trunk Road Agency. The report will be forwarded to the Welsh Assembly Government working group, which will reconsider the original junction proposals in the light of comments received from the public, and put forward revised proposals. A scheme showing the revised proposals for junction treatments will be the subject of an exhibition in the autumn, where the public will have a further opportunity to comment on the scheme.

Mae canlyniadau’r ymgynghori ar yr astudiaeth o’r A48 o Gaerfyrddin i gyffordd Pont Abraham, a gynhaliwyd yn gynharach eleni, yn cael eu llunio’n adroddiad gan Asiantaeth Cefnffyrdd Gorllewin Cymru. Anfonir yr adroddiad i weithgor Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru, a fydd yn ailystyried y cynigion gwreiddiol ar gyfer y gyffordd yng ngoleuni’r sylwadau a gafwyd gan y cyhoedd, ac yn cyflwyno cynigion diwygiedig. Bydd arddangosfa o gynllun sy’n dangos y cynigion diwygiedig ar gyfer trin cyffyrdd yn yr hydref, a chaiff y cyhoedd gyfle pellach yno i wneud sylwadau ar y cynllun.

Helen Mary Jones spoken in English p. 22

Helen Mary Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

You will be aware from the enormous amount of correspondence that you have no doubt received, as I have, that there are real concerns, particularly about the potential risk of putting more heavy traffic onto the small side roads. Will you meet me and Rhodri Glyn Thomas, whose constituency is also affected, to discuss specific proposals that some of our constituents have developed? These may be able to deal with those problems, as well as addressing the main road safety issues that the original junction study aims to address.

Byddwch yn ymwybodol oherwydd y swm anferth o ohebiaeth yr ydych yn sicr o fod wedi’i dderbyn, fel yr wyf fi, fod pryderon gwirioneddol, yn enwedig ynghylch y perygl posibl wrth roi mwy o draffig trwm ar y ffyrdd ochr bach. A wnewch gwrdd â mi a Rhodri Glyn Thomas, gan fod hyn yn effeithio ar ei etholaeth ef hefyd, i drafod y cynigion penodol y mae rhai o’n hetholwyr wedi’u datblygu? Mae’n bosibl y byddant yn gallu delio â rhai o’r problemau hynny, yn ogystal ag ymateb i’r prif faterion diogelwch ffyrdd y mae’r astudiaeth wreiddiol ar y gyffordd yn ceisio ymdrin â hwy.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 22

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 22

I know that alternative proposals have been suggested during the consultation. I will be happy to follow that up with officials. This is a technical issue.

Gwn fod cynigion eraill wedi’u hawgrymu yn ystod yr ymgynghoriad. Byddaf yn falch o fynd ar ôl hynny gyda’r swyddogion. Mater technegol yw hwn.

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 23

Glyn Davies spoken in Welsh p. 23

A gytunwch fod ffyrdd da yn bwysig i ddarparu mynediad i orllewin Cymru? A dderbyniwch fod y ffaith nad ydych yn hoffi buddsoddi mewn ffyrdd a’ch bod yn osgoi buddsoddi yn y system ffyrdd ar bob cyfle yn gwneud difrod tymor hir i economi’r Gymru wledig?

Do you agree that good road access is important for west Wales? Do you accept that your reluctance to invest in roads and your propensity to halt investment in the road system at every opportunity results in long-term damage to the economy of rural Wales?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 23

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

That is an extraordinary statement. Figures show that we have invested greatly in trunk roads and through our support to local authorities in the transport grant, which provides support for roads, not just public transport. We want a balanced strategy that improves road access and also improves public transport, which is important. The many questions asked by Members from all parties on this issue show that there is huge support for improving public transport throughout Wales. Improving roads, particularly in rural Wales, also helps public transport such as bus operations. This is a fundamental issue. The budget figures show that we have allocated a considerable amount of money for trunk roads and to support local authority road schemes.

Mae hwnnw’n ddatganiad rhyfeddol. Mae’r ffigurau’n dangos ein bod wedi buddsoddi’n helaeth mewn cefnffyrdd a thrwy ein cymorth i’r awdurdodau lleol yn y grant trafnidiaeth, sy’n darparu cymorth ar gyfer ffyrdd yn ogystal â thrafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Yr ydym am gael strategaeth gytbwys sy’n gwella’r mynediad ar ffyrdd a hefyd yn gwella trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, sy’n bwysig. Mae’r nifer fawr o gwestiynau a ofynnir gan Aelodau o’r holl bleidiau ar y mater hwn yn dangos bod cefnogaeth aruthrol i wella trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ledled Cymru. Mae gwella ffyrdd, yn enwedig yn y Gymru wledig, yn hwyluso trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus fel gweithrediadau bysiau hefyd. Mae hwn yn fater sylfaenol. Dengys ffigurau’r gyllideb ein bod wedi dyrannu swm sylweddol o arian ar gyfer cefnffyrdd ac i gynnal cynlluniau ffyrdd yr awdurdodau lleol.

Llety i Dwristiaid

Tourist Accommodation

Q5 David Melding spoken in English p. 23

C5 David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

Will the Minister make a statement on the conversion of former agricultural buildings for tourist accommodation? (OAQ18520)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch addasu hen adeiladau amaethyddol yn llety i dwristiaid? (OAQ18520)

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 23

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

‘Planning Policy Wales’, which was published in March 2002, encourages the conversion and re-use of existing agricultural buildings for economic uses, subject to certain provisos. This policy recognises that re-use for commercial, industrial, tourism, sport and recreation developments can assist both rural and farm diversification and, therefore, benefit the rural economy.

Mae ‘Polisi Cynllunio Cymru’, a gyhoeddwyd ym Mawrth 2002, yn annog addasu ac ailddefnyddio adeiladau amaethyddol i ddibenion economaidd, ar rai amodau. Mae’r polisi hwn yn cydnabod bod ailddefnyddio ar gyfer datblygiadau masnachol, diwydiannol, twristiaeth, chwaraeon ac adloniant yn gallu hwyluso arallgyfeirio mewn ardaloedd gwledig ac ar ffermydd gan ddod â manteision, felly, i’r economi wledig.

David Melding spoken in English p. 23

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 23

I am sure that you agree that Wales needs more quality accommodation and a greater range of accommodation. In countries such as the United States of America, tourist accommodation is plentiful and easy to access. All Government agencies, including local authorities, must stress this need and not put barriers in the way of farmers who want to convert their buildings.

Yr wyf yn siŵr y cytunwch fod ar Gymru angen rhagor o lety o ansawdd da ac amrediad ehangach o lety. Mewn gwledydd fel Unol Daleithiau America, mae digonedd o lety i dwristiaid a gellir cael ato’n rhwydd. Rhaid i holl asiantaethau’r Llywodraeth, gan gynnwys awdurdodau lleol, bwysleisio’r angen hwn a pheidio â chodi rhwystrau a fydd yn atal ffermwyr rhag addasu eu hadeiladau.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 24

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

It is for those reasons that we changed the planning guidance to allow for diversification. Paragraph 7.6.9 of ‘Planning Policy Wales’ states that,

Oherwydd hynny yr ydym wedi newid y canllawiau cynllunio i ddarparu ar gyfer arallgyfeirio. Dywed paragraff 7.6.9 o ‘Polisi Cynllunio Cymru’,

‘local planning authorities should adopt a positive approach to the conversion of rural buildings for business re-use, especially those buildings located within or adjoining farm building complexes’.

‘dylai awdurdodau cynllunio lleol gymryd agwedd gadarnhaol tuag at addasu adeiladau gwledig er mwyn eu hailddefnyddio at ddibenion busnes, yn enwedig yr adeiladau hynny a leolir mewn, neu gerllaw, clwstwr o adeiladau fferm’.

The guidance has been improved in response to rural need, and provides the basis for the further development that you mentioned.

Mae’r canllawiau hynny wedi’u gwella mewn ymateb i angen gwledig, ac maent yn cynnig y sylfaen i’r datblygu pellach y cyfeiriasoch ato.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 24

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 24

Mae’n bwysig bod rhagfarniad o blaid defnyddio hen adeiladau fferm i bwrpasau economaidd. Fodd bynnag, a yw’r Gweinidog yn derbyn bod angen ystyried y rhain mewn cyd-destun ehangach na llety ar gyfer ymwelwyr yn unig? Dylid ystyried a yw datblygu llety ar gyfer ymwelwyr yn gwneud mwy na dim ond tynnu busnes oddi ar ffermydd eraill sy’n cynnig y gwasanaeth eisoes. Rhaid ystyried mwy na llety yn unig.

It is important that there is a presumption in favour of using old farm buildings for economic purposes. However, does the Minister accept that these must be considered in a wider context than just tourist accommodation? Consideration should be given as to whether developing tourist accommodation does more than just take business away from other farms already offering the service. Consideration should be given to more than just accommodation.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 24

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 24

I am not sure what you are getting at, but I think that you are referring to displacement in terms of tourism. Please write to me with the details of specific cases. The planning guidance encourages local authorities to take a proactive stance on diversification. It is not for me to determine at a strategic level how local authorities should apply the policy in their localities. One way around this is to consider the wider context to which you referred, as part of developing sustainable communities. The issue that you raised should be part of local authorities’ holistic work on sustainable communities.

Nid wyf yn sicr beth sydd gennych dan sylw, ond tybiaf eich bod yn cyfeirio at ddisodli yng nghyd-destun twristiaeth. Ysgrifennwch ataf gan roi manylion am achosion penodol, os gwelwch yn dda. Mae’r canllawiau cynllunio’n annog yr awdurdodau lleol i fod yn rhagweithiol yn eu hagwedd at arallgyfeirio. Nid fy lle i yw penderfynu ar lefel strategol sut y dylai’r awdurdodau lleol gymhwyso’r polisi yn eu hardaloedd. Un ffordd o fynd ynghylch hyn yw ystyried y cyd-destun ehangach y cyfeiriasoch ato, fel rhan o ddatblygu cymunedau cynaliadwy. Dylai’r mater y gwnaethoch ei godi fod yn rhan o waith cyfannol yr awdurdodau lleol ar gymunedau cynaliadwy.

Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 25

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

Following on from Dafydd’s point, do you agree that we must identify the need more clearly? Do you also agree that we should do much more to assist farmers with the bureaucracy of filling forms and to support their cause in a more meaningful way?

Gan ddilyn pwynt Dafydd, a ydych yn cytuno bod yn rhaid inni nodi’r angen yn fwy pendant? A ydych hefyd yn cytuno y dylem wneud rhagor i gynorthwyo ffermwyr gyda’r fiwrocratiaeth o lenwi ffurflenni ac i gefnogi eu hachos mewn modd mwy ystyrlon?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 25

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

An emerging view from rural communities is that, if we want to fill some of the current gaps in terms of jobs to keep people in rural communities and give them a choice of staying there, we must do much more detailed work locally in terms of economic development. We must make linkages and make them work. That is why Farming Connect and Business Connect are so important because they are doing just that. When we carried out research on diversification and the planning system, I was pleased that planning was not seen as a block. However, providing local support for economic development was seen as an area where more work needs to be done on ground level.

Un farn sy’n datblygu yn y cymunedau gwledig yw, os ydym am lenwi rhai o’r bylchau a geir ar hyn o bryd o ran swyddi i gadw pobl mewn cymunedau gwledig a rhoi dewis iddynt aros yno, fod yn rhaid inni wneud gwaith llawer manylach yn lleol o ran datblygu economaidd. Rhaid inni greu cysylltiadau a pheri iddynt weithio. Dyna pam y mae Cyswllt Ffermio a Cyswllt Busnes mor bwysig gan eu bod yn gwneud yr union beth hwnnw. Pan wnaethom ymchwil i arallgyfeirio a’r system gynllunio, yr oeddwn yn falch nad oedd cynllunio’n cael ei ystyried yn rhwystr. Er hynny, barnwyd bod darparu cymorth lleol ar gyfer datblygu economaidd yn faes y mae angen gwneud mwy o waith ymarferol arno.

Tir Halogedig

Contaminated Land

Q6 Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 25

C6 Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

Will the Minister make a statement on the use of contaminated land for school buildings? (OAQ18523)

A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad ynghylch defnyddio tir llygredig ar gyfer adeiladau ysgol? (OAQ18523)

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 25

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

The Minister for Health and Social Services and I want to ensure that the relationship between health and the environment is given proper consideration. Work is in hand to examine ways of ensuring that the potential health implications of all proposed developments are fully and properly considered during the planning process. This work encompasses, but is not limited to, developments involving the use of contaminated land for school buildings. Current legislation and planning policy place a framework of duties on local authorities, which, if applied properly, will ensure that schools are not built on unsuitable sites.

Mae’r Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol a minnau am sicrhau y rhoddir ystyriaeth briodol i’r berthynas rhwng iechyd a’r amgylchedd. Mae gwaith ar y gweill i archwilio dulliau o sicrhau ystyriaeth lawn a phriodol o oblygiadau posibl yr holl ddatblygiadau arfaethedig i iechyd yn ystod y broses gynllunio. Mae’r gwaith hwn yn cynnwys, ymysg pethau eraill, ddatblygiadau sy’n golygu defnyddio tir halogedig ar gyfer adeiladau ysgol. Mae’r ddeddfwriaeth a’r polisi cynllunio presennol yn rhoi fframwaith o ddyletswyddau i’r awdurdodau lleol a fydd yn sicrhau, o’i weithredu’n briodol, na chodir ysgolion ar safleoedd anaddas.

Jonathan Morgan spoken in English p. 25

Jonathan Morgan siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 25

Thank you for that reply. In order to address the concerns of communities where proposals to build schools on contaminated land have been put forward, do you agree that a statutory public health assessment should be conducted?

Diolch i chi am yr ateb hwnnw. Er mwyn ymateb i bryderon y cymunedau lle y cyflwynwyd cynigion i godi ysgolion ar dir halogedig, a ydych yn cytuno y dylid cynnal asesiad iechyd cyhoeddus statudol?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 26

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

As I have already said, we are considering how to deal with this issue in the wider context of environmental health considerations and planning applications. I refer you to ‘Planning Policy Wales’ and the guidance it contains for local authorities. It states that only if local authorities are satisfied that remediation will eliminate unacceptable risk to health should they grant planning permission, subject to conditions framed, to ensure that the necessary remediation is achieved.

Fel y dywedais eisoes, yr ydym yn ystyried sut i ymdrin â’r mater hwn yng nghyd-destun ehangach yr ystyriaethau iechyd amgylcheddol a cheisiadau cynllunio. Fe’ch cyfeiriaf at ‘Polisi Cynllunio Cymru’ a’r canllawiau sydd ynddo i awdurdodau lleol. Dywed mai dim ond os yw’r awdurdodau lleol yn sicr y bydd adfer yn dileu perygl annerbyniol i iechyd y dylent roi caniatâd cynllunio, yn unol ag amodau a nodwyd, i sicrhau y cyflawnir y gwaith adfer sydd ei angen.

Another paragraph reminds local planning authorities that health considerations and public concern can, in principle, be material considerations in relation to individual planning applications.

Mae paragraff arall yn atgoffa’r awdurdodau cynllunio lleol y gall ystyriaethau iechyd a phryder cyhoeddus fod yn ystyriaethau perthnasol, mewn egwyddor, mewn cysylltiad â cheisiadau cynllunio unigol.

The guidance is there for local authorities. As I have said, this is not only about contaminated land and school buildings. After we have done the additional work over the whole range of issues, we can give interim guidance at the end of this year and push on with considering a full, complete and comprehensive process.

Mae’r canllawiau ar gael i’r awdurdodau lleol. Fel y dywedais, mae hyn yn ymwneud â mwy na thir halogedig ac adeiladau ysgol. Wedi inni wneud y gwaith ychwanegol ar holl amrediad y materion dan sylw, gallwn roi canllawiau dros dro ddiwedd y flwyddyn hon a bwrw ymlaen ag ystyried proses lawn, gyfan a chynhwysfawr.

Gareth Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 26

Gareth Jones spoken in Welsh p. 26

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Conwy. A ydych yn cytuno â mi, a chyda nifer sylweddol o rieni yn ardal Llandudno a Chasnewydd, na ddylid caniatáu adeiladu ysgolion ar dir halogedig heb fod yr awdurdod lleol wedi ymgymryd ag asesiad trylwyr o’r bygythiad i ddiogelwch ac iechyd plant? A atebwch ydwyf neu nac ydwyf?

I declare an interest as a member of Conwy County Borough Council. Do you agree with me and a significant number of parents living in Llandudno and Newport that building on contaminated sites should not be permitted unless the local authority has undertaken a thorough assessment of the risk to children’s health and safety? Will you answer yes or no?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 26

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 26

I cannot answer that because it depends on the degree of contamination. We use the term ‘contamination’ as if it was the same in every case. That term covers the whole range. As I said, it would be wrong to narrow this debate to two schools, although I appreciate that the schools to which you refer, Gareth, are causing extreme concern locally. However, we must take other issues and uses into account, which is what we are doing. We will issue letters to local authorities to draw their attention to current planning policy and technical advice on developing contaminated land. However, I will not give a specific answer on schools and contaminated land. It must be left to the discretion of local authorities until we have carried out additional work on evaluating the level of contamination. Local authorities must get the advice they need and take that forward.

Ni allaf ateb hynny gan ei fod yn dibynnu ar raddau’r halogi. Yr ydym yn defnyddio’r term ‘halogi’ fel pe bai’n golygu’r un peth ym mhob achos. Mae’r term hwnnw’n cynnwys yr holl amrediad. Fel y dywedais, byddai’n anghywir cyfyngu’r ddadl hon i ddwy ysgol, er fy mod yn sylweddoli bod yr ysgolion y cyfeiriwch atynt, Gareth, yn peri pryder difrifol yn lleol. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni ystyried materion a dibenion eraill, ac yr ydym yn gwneud hynny. Byddwn yn anfon llythyrau at yr awdurdodau lleol i dynnu eu sylw at y polisi cynllunio cyfredol a’r cyngor technegol ar ddatblygu tir halogedig. Fodd bynnag, ni wnaf roi ateb penodol ynghylch ysgolion a thir halogedig. Rhaid gadael hynny i’w benderfynu gan yr awdurdodau lleol hyd nes y byddwn wedi gwneud gwaith ychwanegol ar werthuso’r graddau o halogi. Rhaid i’r awdurdodau lleol gael y cyngor y mae arnynt ei angen a mynd ymlaen â hynny.

Datganiad ar Strategaeth Troseddwyr Ifanc

Statement on the Youth Offending Strategy

Jane Hutt The Minister for Health and Social Services spoken in English p. 27

Jane Hutt Y Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 27

I am glad to have this opportunity to make a statement on the work of the youth offending strategy group, and the responsibilities that it undertakes on behalf of this Assembly. Any child or young person who becomes involved in trouble with the law both faces and produces a series of difficulties.

Yr wyf yn falch o gael y cyfle hwn i wneud datganiad ar waith y grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc, a’r cyfrifoldebau y mae’n ymgymryd â hwy ar ran y Cynulliad hwn. Mae unrhyw blentyn neu berson ifanc sy’n mynd i helynt gyda’r gyfraith yn wynebu ac yn creu cyfres o anawsterau.

While most behaviour of this kind is relatively trivial and transient, it produces an immediate impact on local communities and individuals. It has a direct impact on the lives of the children themselves, and on their families. As many of you will know, children and young people who come to the attention of the police are, by a considerable majority, drawn from backgrounds where the basic ingredients of a law-abiding life—an education or a job, a decent home and someone to take a positive interest in you as an individual—are missing.

Er bod y rhan fwyaf o’r ymddygiad o’r math hwn yn gymharol ddibwys a byrhoedlog, caiff effaith uniongyrchol ar gymunedau lleol ac unigolion. Caiff effaith uniongyrchol ar fywydau’r plant eu hunain, ac ar eu teuluoedd. Fel y gŵyr llawer ohonoch, mae’r mwyafrif helaeth o’r plant a’r bobl ifanc a ddaw i sylw’r heddlu yn dod o gefndiroedd lle y mae cynhwysion sylfaenol bywyd sy’n barchus o’r gyfraith—addysg neu swydd, cartref gweddus a rhywun i ymddiddori’n gadarnhaol ynoch fel unigolyn—ar goll.

Repairing the damage that trouble brings has a double benefit: it helps prevent that damage from spreading further within the lives of children and, in doing so, provides the single most powerful crime prevention strategy available to us. Children and young people who go on to commit offences into adulthood face the substantial risk of becoming involved in an escalating number of crimes, and crimes of increasing seriousness. Whatever we can do at this stage in their lives is an investment on behalf of the whole community, and in the future safety of us all.

Ceir budd dwbl o adfer y niwed a ddaw yn sgîl yr helynt: mae’n helpu i atal y niwed hwnnw rhag ymledu ymhellach ym mywydau’r plant ac, wrth wneud hynny, mae’n cynnig y strategaeth atal troseddu gryfaf sydd ar gael i ni. Mae’r plant a’r bobl ifanc hynny sy’n mynd ymlaen i droseddu pan ydynt mewn oed mewn perygl mawr o fod yn gysylltiedig â nifer gynyddol o droseddau, a throseddau mwyfwy difrifol. Mae beth bynnag y gallwn ei wneud yn y cyfnod hwn o’u bywydau yn fuddsoddiad ar ran y gymuned gyfan, ac yn niogelwch pob un ohonom yn y dyfodol.

The Home Office and the Youth Justice Board for England and Wales have an important role to play in this effort. They are responsible for all legislation, advice and guidance relating to the criminal justice aspects of this subject. The Assembly however also has a vital interest from the perspective of giving young people the best possible start in life, and ensuring that they have a positive stake in society. That is why, at this early stage in their lives, the Welsh Assembly Government approaches this as a problem of children who have become caught up in crime, rather than one of criminals who happen to be children. While criminal justice is not a subject devolved to the Assembly, social welfare, health, education, training and community regeneration come within our field of responsibilities, and that is where our effort is best directed.

Mae rôl bwysig i’r Swyddfa Gartref a’r Bwrdd Cyfiawnder Ieuenctid i Gymru a Lloegr yn yr ymdrech hon. Hwy sydd yn gyfrifol am yr holl ddeddfwriaeth, cyngor a chyfarwyddyd sy’n ymwneud â’r agweddau ar gyfiawnder troseddol yn y mater hwn. Fodd bynnag, mae gan y Cynulliad fuddiant hollbwysig hefyd o ran rhoi’r dechrau gorau posibl mewn bywyd i bobl ifanc, a sicrhau bod ganddynt gyfran gadarnhaol mewn cymdeithas. Dyna pam bod Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru, yn y cyfnod cynnar hwn yn eu bywyd, yn ystyried hyn yn broblem sy’n ymwneud â phlant sydd wedi mynd i afael troseddu, yn hytrach nag un sy’n ymwneud â throseddwyr sy’n digwydd bod yn blant. Er nad yw cyfiawnder troseddol yn bwnc a ddatganolwyd i’r Cynulliad, mae lles cymdeithasol, iechyd, addysg, hyfforddiant ac adfywio cymunedol yn rhan o’n cyfrifoldebau, ac i’r cyfeiriad hwnnw y dylid cyfeirio ein hymdrechion.

The Welsh Assembly Government has introduced an impressive variety of new initiatives aimed at improving the lives of the children and young people of Wales and ensuring access to a universal range of services. Service planning will be improved through the establishment of local children and young people’s partnerships. Over the last 18 months, the Assembly has consulted widely on ‘Extending Entitlement: Supporting Young People in Wales’, which comes into effect in September this year and is designed to ensure that every young person in Wales aged 11 to 25 has access to a basic entitlement of services with support, where necessary, appropriate to their needs. Some specialist needs are being met through the child and adolescent mental health services strategy. From April 2003, Cymorth, a unified support fund, will be introduced to combine the existing programmes of Sure Start, the children and youth partnership fund, the national childcare strategy, the youth access initiative and the play grant.

Mae Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru wedi cyflwyno amrywiaeth drawiadol o fentrau newydd sydd â’r amcan o wella bywydau plant a phobl ifanc Cymru a sicrhau mynediad i amrediad o wasanaethau cyffredinol, Caiff gwasanaethau eu cynllunio’n well drwy sefydlu partneriaethau plant a phobl ifanc lleol. Mae’r Cynulliad wedi ymgynghori’n eang dros y 18 mis diwethaf ar ‘Ymestyn Hawliau: Cynorthwyo Pobl Ifanc yng Nghymru’, a ddaw i rym ym mis Medi eleni ac sydd wedi’i gynllunio i sicrhau y caiff pob person ifanc 11 i 25 oed yng Nghymru yr hawl sylfaenol i dderbyn gwasanaethau ynghyd â chymorth, os oes angen, sy’n addas i’w hanghenion. Diwellir rhai anghenion arbenigol drwy’r strategaeth gwasanaethau iechyd meddwl plant a’r glasoed. O Ebrill 2003 ymlaen, cyflwynir Cymorth, cronfa gymorth unedig, i gyfuno rhaglenni presennol Cychwyn Cadarn, y gronfa partneriaeth plant a phobl ifanc, y strategaeth gofal plant genedlaethol, y fenter mynediad ieuenctid a’r grant chwarae.

I have discussed the need for closer resonance between the youth justice board and the Welsh Assembly Government initiatives with Lord Warner, chair of the Youth Justice Board for England and Wales. To accomplish this, we have jointly agreed on the establishment of an all-Wales youth offending strategy group, which met on 9 January and 15 May this year, and has a combined membership of senior Assembly and youth justice board officials, together with representatives of chief officers of all the relevant local agencies, the judiciary, the prison service and the voluntary sector. I am grateful to all those who have agreed to serve on the strategy group for their valuable contributions. The all-Wales group has specific terms of reference and I am confident that the group can make rapid progress in achieving its objectives. It will mainly be advising on developing a potential youth offending strategy for Wales and supporting and overseeing its implementation.

Yr wyf wedi trafod yr angen am gyseiniant agosach rhwng y bwrdd cyfiawnder ieuenctid a mentrau Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru gyda’r Arglwydd Warner, cadeirydd y Bwrdd Cyfiawnder Ieuenctid i Gymru a Lloegr. Er mwyn cyflawni hynny, yr ydym wedi cytuno ar y cyd i sefydlu grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc i Gymru gyfan, a gyfarfu ar 9 Ionawr a 15 Mai eleni, ac sydd ag aelodaeth ar y cyd o uwch swyddogion y Cynulliad a’r bwrdd cyfiawnder ieuenctid, ynghyd â chynrychiolwyr prif swyddogion yr holl asiantaethau lleol perthnasol, y farnwriaeth, y gwasanaeth carchardai a’r sector gwirfoddol. Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i bawb a gytunodd i wasanaethu ar y grŵp strategaeth am eu cyfraniadau gwerthfawr. Mae cylch gorchwyl penodol gan y grŵp Cymru gyfan hwn ac yr wyf yn ffyddiog y bydd y grŵp yn gallu gwneud cynnydd cyflym ar gyflawni ei amcanion. Bydd yn cynghori’n bennaf ar ddatblygu strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc ddichonol i Gymru ac yn cynorthwyo ac yn goruchwylio yn y gwaith o’i gweithredu.

Unsurprisingly perhaps, the group has already emphasised the need for the strategy to address the diverse nature and complex needs of young offenders and those at risk of offending. It has also highlighted the availability of services for young people as the key to any strategy which has a likelihood of success. I expect the strategy to be produced by the end of the current financial year. This is a vitally important area, in which effective joint working within the Assembly and among outside agencies will be essential. The strategy group is also a valuable means of enabling discussion on issues of common interest to the Welsh Assembly Government, the Youth Justice Board and local agencies. The involvement of local youth offending teams and the local authorities who support them is essential to the success of the group and will remain so in any strategy which emerges from it.

Nid yw’n syndod efallai fod y grŵp eisoes wedi pwysleisio’r angen i’r strategaeth ymdrin â natur amrywiol ac anghenion cymhleth troseddwyr ifanc a’r rhai sydd mewn perygl o droseddu. Mae wedi tynnu sylw hefyd at y ffaith mai argaeledd gwasanaethau i bobl ifanc yw’r allwedd i unrhyw strategaeth sy’n debygol o lwyddo. Disgwyliaf y caiff y strategaeth ei chynhyrchu erbyn diwedd y flwyddyn ariannol hon. Mae hwn yn faes hollbwysig, lle y bydd yn rhaid cael gweithio effeithiol ar y cyd o fewn y Cynulliad ac ymysg yr asiantaethau allanol. Bydd y grŵp strategaeth yn gyfrwng gwerthfawr i hwyluso trafodaeth ar faterion sydd o ddiddordeb cyffredin i Lywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru, y Bwrdd Cyfiawnder Ieuenctid a’r asiantaethau lleol. Mae’r rhan a gymerir gan y timau troseddu ieuenctid lleol a’r awdurdodau lleol sy’n eu cynorthwyo’n hollbwysig i lwyddiant y grŵp a bydd yn parhau felly mewn unrhyw strategaeth sy’n deillio ohono.

I will keep Members informed of progress as the work of the strategy group develops. The Assembly has the opportunity to influence the Welsh youth crime prevention agenda, and to do so in a way that protects the interests of the wider public and opens up a more productive and worthwhile future for the children and young people concerned. I am determined that the strategy will have a real impact in joining up policies and encouraging the development of a cross-cutting approach throughout Wales to the benefit of all.

Rhoddaf wybod i’r Aelodau am y cynnydd wrth i waith y grŵp strategaeth ddatblygu. Mae cyfle gan y Cynulliad i ddylanwadu ar yr agenda i atal troseddu gan bobl ifanc yng Nghymru, gan wneud hynny mewn modd sy’n diogelu buddiannau’r cyhoedd yn gyffredinol ac yn arwain at ddyfodol mwy cynhyrchiol a buddiol i’r plant a’r bobl ifanc dan sylw. Yr wyf yn benderfynol y caiff y strategaeth effaith wirioneddol o ran cysylltu polisïau a hybu datblygiad dull trawsbynciol o weithredu ledled Cymru er lles pawb.

David Lloyd spoken in English p. 30

David Lloyd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 30

Criminal justice in not a devolved matter, and multi-agency youth offending teams are now the main means by which youth crime is tackled. Youth offending is an important subject to us all. A statement is all very well, but does the Minister agree that we need a debate on the issue? As this was a statement on the responsibilities of the youth offending strategy group, what are those responsibilities and what are its terms of reference? Does the Minister agree that the strategy should be integral to initiatives such as Communities First, social exclusion and community regeneration programmes, and mental health programmes for young people, particularly in light of the new Mental Health Bill? Does the Minister also agree that prevention is better than cure? Preventing youth crime must involve tackling the social factors that contribute to criminal behaviour. The emphasis must be on using community supervision programmes to divert young people from reoffending, which means focusing on education, vocational skills and the acquisition of social skills. The youth offending strategy group met in January and May, and is now in the middle of its deliberations. Therefore, I am intrigued as to why a statement has been made today, given that those deliberations are ongoing and that there is little to say about the process. We are still awaiting further details on the group’s responsibilities, terms of reference and future plans for the funding of initiatives.

Nid yw cyfiawnder troseddol yn fater a ddatganolwyd, a’r timau troseddu ieuenctid amlasiantaethol yw’r prif gyfrwng yn awr i fynd i’r afael â throseddu gan bobl ifanc. Mae troseddu gan bobl ifanc yn fater pwysig i bob un ohonom. Mae datganiad yn burion, ond a yw’r Gweinidog yn cytuno bod arnom angen dadl ar y pwnc hwn? Gan mai datganiad ar gyfrifoldebau’r grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc oedd hwn, beth yw’r cyfrifoldebau hynny a beth yw’r cylch gorchwyl? A yw’r Gweinidog yn cytuno y dylai’r strategaeth fod yn rhan annatod o fentrau fel Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf, rhaglenni allgáu cymdeithasol ac adfywio cymunedol, a rhaglenni iechyd meddwl i bobl ifanc, yn enwedig yn wyneb y Mesur Iechyd Meddwl newydd? A yw’r Gweinidog hefyd yn cytuno bod atal yn well na gwella? Rhaid i atal troseddu gan bobl ifanc gynnwys mynd i’r afael â’r ffactorau cymdeithasol sy’n cyfrannu at ymddygiad troseddol. Rhaid rhoi pwyslais ar ddefnyddio rhaglenni goruchwyliaeth gymunedol i droi pobl ifanc oddi wrth aildroseddu, sy’n golygu mwy o addysg, sgiliau galwedigaethol a dysgu sgiliau cymdeithasol. Cyfarfu’r grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc yn Ionawr a Mai, ac mae ar ganol ei drafodion yn awr. Felly, mae’n benbleth i mi pam y gwnaed datganiad heddiw, o ystyried bod y trafodion hynny’n parhau ac mai ychydig sydd i’w ddweud am y broses. Yr ydym yn dal i ddisgwyl manylion pellach am gyfrifoldebau’r grŵp, ei gylch gorchwyl a chynlluniau at y dyfodol i ariannu mentrau.

At a ministerial level, the Minister for Health and Social Services’ portfolio encompasses youth justice. She lost responsibility for drugs and alcohol last week to Edwina Hart, whose portfolio also includes community safety, and crime reduction. With responsibility for youth offending issues spread across two ministerial portfolios, can we be assured of a joined-up approach?

Ar lefel y Gweinidogion, mae portffolio’r Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol yn cwmpasu cyfiawnder ieuenctid. Collodd y cyfrifoldeb dros gyffuriau ac alcohol yr wythnos diwethaf i Edwina Hart, y mae ei phortffolio hefyd yn cynnwys diogelwch cymunedol, a gostwng troseddu. Gan fod y cyfrifoldeb dros faterion troseddu gan bobl ifanc wedi’i rhannu dros ddau bortffolio gweinidogol, a allwn fod yn sicr o gael dull gweithredu cydgysylltiedig?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 30

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 30

It is important that we examine the devolved universal services that will help young people who are at risk of offending, namely education, health, social welfare and employment and lifelong learning opportunities. Although it is not a devolved area of responsibility, we established a vital partnership with the Youth Justice Board to ensure that we had a youth offending strategy for Wales that meets the needs of children and young people who are most at risk of offending or running into trouble because of the lack of basic universal services and support that we would expect from their families and communities. It is important that the Assembly is seen to take its responsibilities seriously in this area, which is why we have brought all the partners together within the Wales youth offending strategy group. The group felt strongly that we should have our own strategy, and that is why I am giving this statement today.

Mae’n bwysig inni edrych ar y gwasanaethau cyffredinol a ddatganolwyd a fydd yn helpu pobl ifanc sydd mewn perygl o aildroseddu, sef addysg, iechyd, lles cymdeithasol a chyflogaeth a dysgu gydol oes. Er nad yw’n faes cyfrifoldeb a ddatganolwyd, gwnaethom sefydlu partneriaeth hollbwysig gyda’r Bwrdd Cyfiawnder Ieuenctid i sicrhau bod gennym strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc i Gymru sy’n diwallu anghenion plant a phobl ifanc sydd yn y perygl mwyaf o droseddu neu fynd i helynt oherwydd diffyg gwasanaethau cyffredinol sylfaenol a chymorth y byddem yn disgwyl iddynt ei gael gan eu teuluoedd a’u cymunedau. Mae’n bwysig bod y Cynulliad yn dangos ei fod yn cymryd ei gyfrifoldebau o ddifrif yn y maes hwn, a dyna pam yr ydym wedi dod â’r holl faterion hyn at ei gilydd o fewn grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc Cymru. Yr oedd y grŵp yn teimlo’n gryf y dylem gael ein strategaeth ein hunain, a dyna pam yr wyf yn rhoi’r datganiad hwn heddiw.

Members need to be aware of the importance of this strategy in order to ensure that we have a multidisciplinary approach, which requires the joined-up government that the Welsh Assembly Government can apply. The Minister for Finance, Local Government and Communities, Edwina Hart, has lead responsibility for crime issues, and we are working closely in this important area. My responsibility for the health and wellbeing of children and young people in Wales puts an emphasis on how we ensure that we reach those at risk of offending. We must also ensure that they are supported if they have already started to offend, are subject to community sentences or are on the brink of custody. The youth offending teams and their partners must be given all the support necessary to try to help young people avoid further difficulty and trouble. This is a shared agenda where the Assembly must take responsibility, and I am glad to be given this opportunity to discuss the issue with Members today.

Rhaid i’r Aelodau fod yn ymwybodol o bwysigrwydd y strategaeth hon er mwyn sicrhau bod gennym ddull gweithredu amlasiantaethol, sy’n galw am y llywodraeth gydgysylltiedig y gall Llywodraeth Cynulliad Cymru’i gweithredu. Gan y Gweinidog dros Gyllid, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau, Edwina Hart, y mae’r cyfrifoldeb arweiniol dros faterion troseddu, ac yr ydym yn cydweithio’n agos yn y maes pwysig hwn. Mae fy nghyfrifoldeb i am iechyd a lles plant a phobl ifanc yng Nghymru’n rhoi pwyslais ar y modd y gallwn sicrhau ein bod yn cyrraedd y rhai sydd mewn perygl o droseddu. Rhaid inni sicrhau hefyd eu bod yn cael cymorth os ydynt eisoes wedi dechrau troseddu, os ydynt wedi cael dedfryd gymunedol neu os ydynt ar fin cael eu cymryd i’r ddalfa. Rhaid i’r timau troseddu ieuenctid a’u partneriaid gael yr holl gymorth sydd ei angen i geisio helpu pobl ifanc i osgoi anhawster a helynt pellach. Agenda ar y cyd yw hon lle y mae’n rhaid i’r Cynulliad ymgymryd â chyfrifoldeb, ac yr wyf yn falch o gael y cyfle hwn i drafod y pwnc gyda’r Aelodau heddiw.

Christine Chapman spoken in English p. 31

Christine Chapman siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 31

I welcome today’s statement. As you rightly said, youth crime needs to be tackled on many fronts. We need measures to tackle poverty and deprivation in our communities and to target disaffected youth. Many young offenders in Wales are victims of the policies that were implemented in Wales over many years. Do you agree that any action to remedy the current problem must incorporate a strategy that addresses the issue at an early age, and that more guidance and support about positive parenting measures should be available to parents? I know that you are aware that the Children are Unbeatable campaign is keen to do that. If we tackle this problem at an early age, it will do a great deal to decrease the rate of youth offending later in life. Young people are the future of Wales and this must be one of the most important issues that the Assembly tackles. I look forward to the progress of this particular policy.

Croesawaf y datganiad hwn heddiw. Yr ydych yn gywir, rhaid mynd i’r afael â throseddu gan bobl ifanc o sawl cyfeiriad. Mae arnom angen mesurau i fynd i’r afael â thlodi ac amddifadedd yn ein cymundau ac i dargedu pobl ifanc sydd wedi ymddieithrio. Mae llawer o’r troseddwyr ifanc yng Nghymru’n dioddef gan y polisïau a weithredwyd yng Nghymru dros flynyddoedd lawer. A ydych yn cytuno bod yn rhaid i unrhyw gamau i gywiro’r broblem bresennol gynnwys strategaeth sy’n ymdrin â’r mater dan sylw mewn oedran cynnar, ac y dylid darparu mwy o gyfarwyddyd a chymorth i rieni am fesurau magu cadarnhaol? Gwn eich bod yn ymwybodol bod yr ymgyrch ’Sdim Curo Plant yn awyddus i wneud hynny. Os ymdriniwn â’r broblem hon mewn oedran cynnar, bydd hynny’n cyfrannu’n helaeth at leihau’r gyfradd o droseddu gan bobl ifanc yn ddiweddarach yn eu hoes. Pobl ifanc yw dyfodol Cymru ac mae’n sicr mai hwn yw un o’r materion pwysicaf y mae’r Cynulliad yn ymdrin ag ef. Edrychaf ymlaen at weld cynnydd y polisi penodol hwn.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 32

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

Many youth offending teams in Wales have been undertaking good work on effective parenting interventions, particularly in communities where families need support in order to ensure that they are helping their children to avoid trouble. We must also consider the causal factors of poverty and deprivation; that is why we must integrate this strategy with Communities First, Cymorth and Play 2000, and the work done by Sure Start and child and youth partnerships across Wales. Our child and adolescent mental health strategy, ‘Everybody’s Business’, has objectives for fundamental preventative work with children at an early age in schools and communities. We must make those links across all health, wellbeing, prevention and promotion agendas.

Mae llawer o dimau troseddu ieuenctid yng Nghymru wedi gwneud gwaith da ar ymyriadau magu effeithiol, yn enwedig mewn cymunedau lle y mae ar deuluoedd angen cymorth er mwyn sicrhau eu bod yn helpu eu plant i osgoi helynt. Rhaid inni hefyd ystyried y ffactorau sy’n achosi’r problemau, sef tlodi ac amddifadedd; dyna pam y mae’n rhaid inni integreiddio’r strategaeth hon â Rhoi Cymunedau’n Gyntaf, Cymorth a Chwarae 2000, a’r gwaith a wnaed gan Cychwyn Cadarn a’r partneriaethau plant a phobl ifanc ledled Cymru. Yn ein strategaeth iechyd meddwl plant a’r glasoed, ‘Busnes Pawb’, ceir amcanion ar gyfer gwaith ataliol sylfaenol gyda phlant mewn oedran cynnar mewn ysgolion a chymunedau. Rhaid inni greu’r cysylltiadau hynny rhwng yr holl agendâu iechyd, lles, atal a hybu.

David Melding spoken in English p. 32

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 32

I agree with Dai Lloyd that there is little detail in today’s statement on which to scrutinise you; I look forward to more detail in the strategy when it emerges. Given the lack of detail, I only have some abstract comments to make on the statement. Key skills are an important part of the development of children and young people. Many offenders have profound literacy and numeracy problems. That is one important aspect of the problem that does not inevitably make children and young people vulnerable to criminal behaviour, but it is an important issue that could contribute to it. We can identify that at an early stage in the school environment. It is linked to truancy because if children do not attend school, they will not acquire some of the key skills that they would learn if they attended. A preventative approach is important and can be positive as it does not concentrate on inadequate or inappropriate behaviour but tries to encourage the development of skills.

Cytunaf â Dai Lloyd mai ychydig o fanylion a geir yn y datganiad heddiw y gellir eich holi yn eu cylch; edrychaf ymlaen at weld mwy o fanylion yn y strategaeth pan ddaw i’r golwg. Yn wyneb y prinder manylion, nid oes gennyf ond rhai sylwadau haniaethol i’w gwneud am y datganiad. Mae sgiliau allweddol yn rhan bwysig o ddatblygiad plant a phobl ifanc. Mae gan lawer o droseddwyr broblemau difrifol o ran llythrennedd a rhifedd. Mae hynny’n agwedd bwysig ar y broblem nad yw’n peri’n anorfod fod plant a phobl ifanc yn agored i ymddygiad troseddol, ond mae’n fater pwysig a allai gyfrannu ato. Gallwn ganfod hynny mewn cyfnod cynnar yn amgylchedd yr ysgol. Mae’n gysylltiedig â thriwantiaeth oherwydd, os nad yw plant yn mynychu’r ysgol, ni fyddant yn dysgu’r sgiliau allweddol a ddysgent pe baent yn bresennol. Mae dull gweithredu ataliol yn bwysig a gall fod yn gadarnhaol gan nad yw’n canolbwyntio ar ymddygiad annigonol neu amhriodol ond yn ceisio hybu datblygu sgiliau.

Young people must occupy their time productively, which often requires supervision. Many young people in Wales are currently not well supervised when they are outside the school environment. One way to increase supervision is to improve parenting skills; another is to ensure that there are facilities for young people to attend. Instead of locking children up, tagging them or subjecting them to a curfew, it would sometimes be better to prescribe compulsory attendance at youth facilities or sports clubs so that they use their time more productively, which would boost their self-esteem. I am not talking about sending them yachting in the Caribbean—a rather elaborate suggestion—but about letting them play football, for example. We should concentrate on the skills that these young people lack rather than on their inadequate behaviour. If we fail, many young people will commit serious offences before they are 25 years old—many commit serious offences between the ages of 15 and 25. Once someone commits a serious offence, the prime objective is public protection and safety. That can often lead to custody, which is a much bleaker outcome for these young people at an early stage in their lives.

Rhaid i bobl ifanc ddefnyddio eu hamser yn gynhyrchiol, sy’n gofyn am oruchwyliaeth yn aml. Mae llawer o bobl ifanc yng Nghymru nad ydynt yn cael goruchwyliaeth dda ar hyn o bryd pan ydynt y tu allan i amgylchedd yr ysgol. Un modd i gynyddu goruchwyliaeth yw gwella sgiliau magu; un arall yw sicrhau bod cyfleusterau y gall pobl ifanc eu mynychu. Yn hytrach na rhoi plant dan glo, eu tagio neu roi cyrffyw arnynt, byddai’n well weithiau argymell presenoldeb gorfodol mewn cyfleusterau ieuenctid neu glybiau chwaraeon fel y gallant ddefnyddio eu hamser yn fwy cynhyrchiol, a byddai hynny’n hwb i’w hunanhyder. Nid wyf yn sôn am eu hanfon i hwylio i’r Caribî—awgrym gwirion braidd—ond am adael iddynt chwarae pêl droed, er enghraifft. Dylem ganolbwyntio ar y sgiliau y mae’r bobl ifanc hyn heb eu dysgu yn hytrach nag ar eu hymddygiad annigonol. Os methwn, bydd llawer o bobl ifanc yn cyflawni troseddau difrifol cyn iddynt gyrraedd 25 mlwydd oed—mae llawer yn cyflawni troseddau difrifol rhwng 15 a 25 oed. Wedi i rywun gyflawni trosedd difrifol, y prif amcan yw gwarchod a diogelu’r cyhoedd. Gall hynny arwain at ei gadw yn y ddalfa mewn llawer achos, sy’n ganlyniad llawer mwy digalon i’r bobl ifanc hyn yn gynnar yn eu hoes.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 33

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 33

I welcome Members’ comments on this statement because this strategy has not yet been fully discussed as it is only a starting point. This is a cross-cutting issue and the work that Jane Davidson is doing on the education and skills agenda is key to preventing young people from developing offending behaviour. The work of the Basic Skills Agency is having an impact in raising awareness of key skills, and we are rebuilding the youth service in Wales through the ‘Extending Entitlement: Supporting Young People in Wales’ agenda. The young people’s partnerships that are now being set up in every local authority area, alongside the children and youth partnerships, mean that people are coming together and recognising that we have an opportunity to rekindle the kind of imaginative and innovative youth work that we saw a few decades ago on our streets and in our communities. We must ensure that this work is up-to-date in terms of young people’s needs.

Croesawaf sylwadau’r Aelodau ar y datganiad hwn oherwydd nid yw’r strategaeth hon wedi’i thrafod yn llawn eto gan nad yw ond yn fan cychwyn. Mater trawsbynciol yw hwn ac mae’r gwaith y mae Jane Davidson yn ei wneud ar yr agenda addysg a sgiliau’n allweddol er mwyn atal pobl ifanc rhag datblygu ymddygiad troseddol. Mae gwaith yr Asiantaeth Sgiliau Sylfaenol yn cael effaith o ran hybu’r ymwybyddiaeth o sgiliau allweddol, ac yr ydym yn ailadeiladu’r gwasanaeth ieuenctid yng Nghymru drwy agenda ‘Ymestyn Hawliau: Cynorthwyo Pobl Ifanc yng Nghymru’. Mae’r partneriaethau pobl ifanc a sefydlir yn awr ym mhob ardal awdurdod lleol, ochr yn ochr â’r partneriaethau plant a phobl ifanc, yn golygu bod pobl yn dod at ei gilydd ac yn sylweddoli bod gennym gyfle i ailgychwyn y math o waith ieuenctid arloesol a llawn dychymyg a welem ychydig o ddegawdau’n ôl ar ein strydoedd ac yn ein cymunedau. Rhaid inni sicrhau bod y gwaith hwn yn gyfoes o ran anghenion pobl ifanc.

We must also recognise that part of the youth justice agenda and the youth offending strategy is to consider the kinds of services available to young people when they are sentenced and remanded, after having fallen into trouble. We must take an interest in and responsibility for the health and wellbeing of our young people in youth offending institutions. That will be a key responsibility in this youth offending strategy.

Rhaid inni sylweddoli hefyd mai rhan o’r agenda cyfiawnder ieuenctid a’r strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc yw ystyried y mathau o wasanaethau sydd ar gael i bobl ifanc pan gânt eu dedfrydu neu eu haildraddodi, ar ôl mynd i helynt. Rhaid inni ymddiddori ac ymgymryd â chyfrifoldeb dros iechyd a lles ein pobl ifanc mewn sefydliadau i droseddwyr ifanc. Bydd hynny’n gyfrifoldeb allweddol yn y strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc hon.

Peter Black spoken in English p. 34

Peter Black siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 34

I declare an interest as a member of Swansea City and County Council and chair of the NACRO Cymru advisory council. I welcome this statement and the development of the strategy. It is important that the strategy is developed to deal with the many threats to young people—and those posed by young people—particularly in relation to substance misuse, which has now been removed from your portfolio, but is still key to this strategy. This is clearly illustrated by the deaths of two young children in my region, in Sarn and in Swansea, at least one of which seems to have emanated from solvent abuse—the other is yet to be determined. We must also consider the need for suitable secure accommodation in Wales, which is currently scarce. This situation is less than satisfactory. We must also consider child protection issues in connection with that.

Datganaf fuddiant fel aelod o Gyngor Dinas a Sir Abertawe a chadeirydd cyngor ymgynghorol NACRO Cymru. Croesawaf y datganiad hwn a datblygu’r strategaeth. Mae’n bwysig i’r strategaeth gael ei datblygu i ddelio â’r nifer fawr o fygythiadau i bobl ifanc—a’r rhai oddi wrth bobl ifanc—mewn cysylltiad yn benodol â chamddefnyddio sylweddau, sydd wedi’i dynnu o’ch portffolio bellach, ond sy’n dal i fod yn allweddol i’r strategaeth hon. Dangosir hynny’n eglur gan farwolaethau dau blentyn ifanc yn fy rhanbarth i, yn Sarn ac yn Abertawe, y mae un ohonynt yn ymddangos ei bod yn ganlyniad i gamddefnyddio toddyddion—ni chanfuwyd achos y llall eto. Rhaid inni hefyd ystyried yr angen am lety cadw addas yng Nghymru, sy’n brin ar hyn o bryd. Nid yw’r sefyllfa hon yn foddhaol. Rhaid inni ystyried materion amddiffyn plant mewn cysylltiad â hynny hefyd.

It is also important that we link this agenda to that of youth homelessness, as well as the crime and disorder agenda. It is key that we remove the factors that lead young people into crime, one of which can be homelessness—although not all young homeless people indulge in crime. One of the key causes of homelessness among young people is the discrimination they face in the housing benefit system, and we must continue to make representations to the UK Government on that issue.

Mae’n bwysig hefyd ein bod yn cysylltu’r agenda hon ag agenda digartrefedd ymysg pobl ifanc, yn ogystal â’r agenda trosedd ac anhrefn. Mae’n hollbwysig ein bod yn dileu’r ffactorau sy’n arwain pobl ifanc i droseddu, a gall digartrefedd fod yn un ohonynt—er nad yw’r holl bobl ifanc ddigartref yn ymroi i droseddu. Un o brif achosion digartrefedd ymysg pobl ifanc yw’r gwahaniaethu yn eu herbyn yn y system budd-dal tai, a rhaid inni barhau i gyflwyno sylwadau i Lywodraeth y DU ar y mater hwnnw.

The youth offender teams cannot work in isolation, and neither should our strategy. I hope that when this strategy comes back to us, there will be evidence of joint working and links with other Assembly strategies.

Ni all y timau troseddu ieuenctid weithio ar eu pen eu hunain, ac ni ddylai ein strategaeth ychwaith. Yr wyf yn gobeithio y bydd tystiolaeth o gydweithio a chysylltiadau â strategaethau eraill y Cynulliad pan ddaw’r strategaeth hon yn ôl i ni.

I conclude by welcoming the unified support fund that you have announced as a means of simplifying the funding streams. Will you ensure that access to that money is fast-tracked and relatively free of bureaucracy?

Terfynaf drwy groesawu’r gronfa gymorth unedig yr ydych wedi’i chyhoeddi fel modd i symleiddio’r llifoedd ariannu. A wnewch sicrhau y bydd modd cael yr arian hwnnw drwy ddull carlam ac y bydd yn gymharol rydd oddi wrth fiwrocratiaeth?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 35

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 35

I welcome the tone of the contributions made so far. We are considering, particularly through my responsibilities, the health and wellbeing of young people, children and families, and the context in which we know that trouble is most likely to occur. Cymorth, namely Sure Start, the children-youth partnerships, the play grant scheme, and the childcare strategy, will play an important role, and is already having an impact on prevention. We hope that that will be taken forward in our young people’s partnerships.

Croesawaf oslef y cyfraniadau a gafwyd hyd yn hyn. Yr ydym yn ystyried, yn enwedig drwy fy nghyfrifoldebau i, iechyd a lles pobl ifanc, plant a theuluoedd, a’r cyd-destun y gwyddom fod trafferth yn fwyaf tebygol o ddigwydd ynddo. Bydd Cymorth, sef Cychwyn Cadarn, y partneriaethau plant-ieuenctid, y cynllun grant chwarae, a’r strategaeth gofal plant, yn chwarae rhan bwysig, ac mae eisoes yn cael effaith ar atal. Gobeithiwn y bydd hynny’n cael ei ddatblygu yn ein partneriaethau pobl ifanc.

The work done by Edwina Hart is also vital, not only in relation to substance misuse as part of the crime prevention agenda, but also in terms of homelessness among young people. You led that review, which will be a key factor in the strategy. The strategy will consider all aspects of this problem, including young people at risk of offending and those who are subject to custodial sentencing, and it will consider what universal services are available at each stage for children and young people. That follows David’s point about ensuring protection for families and communities, but the starting point, in terms of that prevention agenda, must be the children and young people.

Mae’r gwaith a wnaed gan Edwina Hart yn hollbwysig hefyd, nid yn unig mewn cysylltiad â chamddefnyddio sylweddau fel rhan o’r agenda atal troseddu, ond hefyd o ran digartrefedd ymysg pobl ifanc. Chi a arweiniodd yr adolygiad hwnnw, a fydd yn ffactor allweddol yn y strategaeth. Bydd y strategaeth yn ystyried pob agwedd ar y broblem hon, gan gynnwys y bobl ifanc sydd mewn perygl o droseddu a’r rhai sy’n cael dedfryd o garchariad, a bydd yn ystyried pa wasanaethau cyffredinol sydd ar gael ar bob cam i blant a phobl ifanc. Mae hynny’n dilyn pwynt David am sicrhau amddiffyniad i deuluoedd a chymunedau, ond y man cychwyn o reidrwydd, o ran yr agenda atal honno, yw’r plant a’r bobl ifanc.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 36

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

As many Members have pointed out, youth offending is a many-faceted issue. I am puzzled. You said that you wanted a fully informed discussion on this issue, yet that is constrained by the fact that this is a statement. Why was this not tabled as a debate? When can we expect a debate on this issue and what timescale are you working towards? You say that you expect this new strategy group to report by the end of the financial year. Presumably, that strategy will have to go out for public consultation. When will that strategy be debated in Plenary and be adopted as a National Assembly for Wales policy? When will we have a youth offending strategy for Wales? More specifically—

Fel y mae llawer o’r Aelodau wedi nodi, mae troseddu gan bobl ifanc yn bwnc amlweddog. Yr wyf mewn penbleth. Dywedasoch eich bod am gael trafodaeth gwbl hyddysg ar y mater hwn, ond fe gyfyngir ar hynny gan y ffaith mai datganiad yw hwn. Pam na chyflwynwyd hyn fel dadl? Pa bryd y cawn ddisgwyl dadl ar y mater hwn ac yn ôl pa amserlen yr ydych yn gweithio? Fe ddywedwch eich bod yn disgwyl y bydd y grŵp strategaeth newydd hwn yn adrodd erbyn diwedd y flwyddyn ariannol. Gellir cymryd y bydd yn rhaid cael ymgynghoriad cyhoeddus ar y strategaeth honno. Pa bryd y bydd dadl ar y strategaeth honno yn y Cyfarfod Llawn a pha bryd y caiff ei mabwysiadu’n bolisi gan Gynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru? Pa bryd y cawn strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc i Gymru? Yn fwy penodol—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 36

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

Order. This is a statement. Detailed questions have been asked by the lead spokespersons of the four parties. Other Members are now asking too many questions. I ask Members for short, sharp questions, so that everybody can contribute within the half an hour allowed for a statement.

Trefn. Datganiad yw hwn. Gofynnwyd cwestiynau manwl gan brif lefarwyr y pedair plaid. Mae’r Aelodau eraill yn gofyn gormod o gwestiynau’n awr. Gofynnaf i’r Aelodau am gwestiynau byr, miniog, fel y gall pawb gyfrannu o fewn yr hanner awr a ganiateir ar gyfer datganiad.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 36

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

Specifically on the pot of money, Sure Start—

Yn benodol ynghylch y pot arian, Cychwyn Cadarn—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 36

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

Order. You have asked four questions.

Trefn. Yr ydych wedi gofyn pedwar cwestiwn.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 36

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

I am surprised that you are being negative about something that you welcome. You want a youth offending strategy, and that is what I am announcing today. The timescale, as I have said, is March 2003. We will have consultation and a debate. It is important that I made the statement today and that we move forward on developing the strategy.

Yr wyf yn synnu eich bod yn negyddol ynghylch rhywbeth yr ydych yn ei groesawu. Yr ydych am gael strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc, a dyna’r hyn yr wyf yn ei gyhoeddi heddiw. Yr amserlen, fel y dywedais, yw Mawrth 2003. Fe gawn ymgynghoriad a dadl. Mae’n bwysig fy mod yn gwneud y datganiad heddiw a’n bod yn bwrw ymlaen i ddatblygu’r strategaeth.

David Davies spoken in English p. 36

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 36

Rather than dealing with the problem of repeat offenders, we have more excuses, more mollycoddling, more social workers and more initiatives. Is it not time that we started to deal with those who break the law repeatedly? Is it not time that we started to punish those who inflict misery? Rather than concentrate on criminals’ needs, is it not time that we concentrated on victims’ needs? Is it not time that you learned one simple fact that if you want to stop offenders from offending repeatedly, all you need to do is keep them under lock and key for longer?

Yn hytrach na delio â phroblem aildroseddu, cawn ragor o esgusion, rhagor o faldod, rhagor o weithwyr cymdeithasol a rhagor o fentrau. Onid yw’n bryd inni ddechrau delio â’r rhai sy’n torri’r gyfraith dro ar ôl tro? Onid yw’n bryd inni ddechrau cosbi’r rhai sy’n peri dioddefaint? Yn hytrach na chanolbwyntio ar anghenion y troseddwyr, onid yw’n bryd inni ganolbwyntio ar anghenion y dioddefwyr? Onid yw’n bryd ichi ddysgu un ffaith syml, sef, os ydych am atal troseddwyr rhag troseddu dro ar ôl tro, y cwbl y mae’n rhaid ichi ei wneud yw eu cadw dan glo’n hwy?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 37

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

The point of having statements in the Assembly is to reveal the comments of people such as David Davies. I saw colleagues behind him squirming in their seats because of his attitude—[Interruption.]

Y pwrpas o gael datganiadau yn y Cynulliad yw amlygu sylwadau rhai fel David Davies. Gwelais ei gyd-Aelodau y tu ôl iddo’n gwingo yn eu seddau oherwydd ei agwedd—[Torri ar draws.]

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 37

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

Order. The Minister is giving a fine response to this question; let us hear her.

Trefn. Mae’r Gweinidog yn rhoi ymateb penigamp i’r cwestiwn hwn; gadewch inni ei chlywed.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 37

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

I have given my response. That is all that David deserves.

Yr wyf wedi rhoi fy ymateb. Dyna’r cwbl y mae David yn ei haeddu.

John Griffiths spoken in English p. 37

John Griffiths siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

I welcome the strategy’s progressive, constructive and effective approach. Unfortunately, there is more heat than light in this area, as David Davies has just demonstrated—

Croesawaf ddull gweithredu blaengar, adeiladol ac effeithiol y strategaeth. Gwaetha’r modd, mae mwy o wres nag o oleuni yn y maes hwn, fel y mae David Davies newydd ddangos—

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 37

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

Order. It is not appropriate for Members to comment on previous Members’ questions. This is not a debate; it is a statement. I would like a short, sharp question.

Trefn. Nid yw’n briodol i Aelodau wneud sylwadau ar gwestiynau Aelodau eraill. Nid dadl yw hon; datganiad ydyw. Hoffwn gael cwestiwn byr, miniog.

John Griffiths spoken in English p. 37

John Griffiths siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 37

I appreciate the social welfare, health, education, training and community regeneration approach, Jane. However, can you, or the group, make any approaches at a UK level on the appropriateness of short sentences for young people? Such sentences do not allow for training, rehabilitation or education, and they have a negative effect in terms of not allowing young people to maintain family links. They also lead to employment and housing difficulties, and stigma and brutalisation is experienced upon release. They mean that prisons serve as universities of crime.

Yr wyf yn deall y dull o weithredu drwy les cymdeithasol, iechyd, addysg, hyfforddi ac adfywio cymunedol, Jane. Fodd bynnag, a allwch chi, neu’r grŵp, leisio barn ar lefel y DU ynghylch priodoldeb dedfrydau byr i bobl ifanc? Nid yw dedfrydau o’r fath yn darparu ar gyfer hyfforddi, ailsefydlu nac addysg, a chânt effaith negyddol o ran peidio â gadael i bobl ifanc gynnal eu cysylltiadau teuluol. Maent hefyd yn arwain at anawsterau o ran cyflogaeth a thai, ac mae’r bobl ifanc yn profi gwaradwydd a bwystfileiddio ar ôl eu rhyddhau. Golygant fod carchardai’n ymdebygu i brifysgolion troseddu.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 38

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 38

I have just visited Park Prison in Bridgend, where a 28-bed discrete juvenile facility has been opened. That unit, which admits 15 to 17-year-old remanded boys, provides a productive environment for those young people during their sentence. I talked to some of the young men about their experience and determination to leave the institution with skills and opportunities and get back into the community. I met those who were running technology and information technology courses, and who were trying to instil hope and ensure opportunities. That relates to David Melding’s point that, where there is a lack of skills, this offers an opportunity to provide them. We are influencing the agenda. However, it is the responsibility of the Youth Justice Board. We must ensure that there are facilities in Wales and that people do not have to go to Bristol or Kent—which many have done—or to adult prisons, which is worse. We must ensure that our juvenile facilities are robust and well supported in Wales. That must be a key part of this strategy.

Yr wyf newydd ymweld â Charchar y Parc ym Mhen-y-bont ar Ogwr, lle yr agorwyd cyfleuster ar wahân i bobl ifanc ac ynddo 28 o welyau. Mae’r uned honno, sy’n derbyn bechgyn 15 i 17 mlwydd oed a anfonwyd i’r ddalfa, yn darparu amgylchedd cynhyrchiol i’r bobl ifanc hynny yn ystod eu dedfryd. Siaredais â rhai o’r dynion ifanc am eu profiad a’u penderfyniad i adael y sefydliad gyda sgiliau a chyfleoedd ac i ddychwelyd i’r gymuned. Cyfarfûm â rhai a oedd yn cynnal cyrsiau technoleg a thechnoleg gwybodaeth, ac a oedd yn ceisio meithrin gobaith a sicrhau cyfleoedd. Mae hyn yn ymwneud â phwynt David Melding gan fod hyn yn cynnig cyfle i ddarparu sgiliau pan fo diffyg ohonynt. Yr ydym yn dylanwadu ar yr agenda. Er hynny, cyfrifoldeb y Bwrdd Cyfiawnder Ieuenctid ydyw. Rhaid inni sicrhau bod cyfleusterau yng Nghymru ac nad yw pobl yn gorfod mynd i Fryste neu Gaint—fel y gwnaeth llawer—neu i garchardai i oedolion, sy’n waeth. Rhaid inni sicrhau bod ein cyfleusterau i bobl ifanc yn gadarn a bod cefnogaeth dda iddynt yng Nghymru. Rhaid i hynny fod yn rhan allweddol o’r strategaeth hon.

Gwenda Thomas spoken in English p. 38

Gwenda Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 38

Dai Lloyd will know that, in my role as Chair of the Local Government and Housing Committee, I have written to the First Minister reflecting the Committee’s view on where responsibility for youth justice should lie. I welcome today’s statement and the establishment of the all-Wales youth offending strategy group. However, bearing in mind the problems with arson, particularly car arson, should not the fire service be involved in this group, particularly given that it has a network of excellent projects throughout Wales aimed at reducing these offences?

Fe ŵyr Dai Lloyd fy mod wedi ysgrifennu, yn fy rôl fel Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai, at Brif Weinidog Cymru gan adlewyrchu barn y Pwyllgor ynghylch pwy a ddylai fod yn gyfrifol am gyfiawnder ieuenctid. Croesawaf y datganiad heddiw a’r ffaith y sefydlir grŵp strategaeth troseddwyr ifanc Cymru-gyfan. Fodd bynnag, gan gofio’r problemau o ran llosgi bwriadol, yn enwedig llosgi ceir yn fwriadol, oni ddylai’r gwasanaeth tân fod yn gysylltiedig â’r grŵp hwn, yn enwedig gan fod ganddo rwydwaith o brosiectau rhagorol ledled Cymru sydd â’r amcan o leihau nifer y troseddau hyn?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 38

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 38

That is a useful proposal, and I will consider it. I was pleased that this week a new scheme, called Vale Wheels, was launched in my constituency. It was proposed by a young offender, who said that if offenders could be trained as car mechanics, they might not want to steal cars. A cohort of young men has already gone through this training programme. The fire service could also help.

Mae hynny’n awgrym buddiol, ac fe’i hystyriaf. Yr oeddwn yn falch bod cynllun newydd o’r enw Vale Wheels wedi’i lansio yr wythnos hon yn fy etholaeth i. Fe’i hawgrymwyd gan droseddwr ifanc, a ddywedodd na fyddai troseddwyr yn dymuno dwyn ceir, o bosibl, os gellid eu hyfforddi’n fecanyddion ceir. Mae carfan o ddynion ifanc wedi dilyn y rhaglen hyfforddi hon eisoes. Gallai’r gwasanaeth tân fod o gymorth hefyd.

Brian Hancock spoken in English p. 39

Brian Hancock siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39

Sue Essex referred to canals earlier. I know of young offenders who have been used to clean canals and towpaths. Will you support a proposed scheme, to be based in Crosskeys College in Islwyn, which is having difficulty obtaining funding? The scheme aims to train excluded youths in the repair and maintenance of motorcycles and to teach safe driving skills.

Cyfeiriodd Sue Essex at gamlesi’n gynharach. Gwn am droseddwyr ifanc a ddefnyddiwyd i lanhau camlesi a llwybrau tynnu. A wnewch gefnogi cynllun arfaethedig, sydd i’w leoli yng Ngholeg Crosskeys yn Islwyn, sy’n ei chael yn anodd sicrhau cyllid? Amcan y cynllun yw hyfforddi pobl ifanc a allgaewyd yn y gwaith o atgyweirio a chynnal beiciau modur a dysgu sgiliau gyrru diogel.

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 39

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39

I have just announced a similar scheme in Barry College, and I am sure that Crosskeys College can take that scheme forward with the funding available from Education and Learning Wales and other sources.

Yr wyf newydd gyhoeddi cynllun tebyg yng Ngholeg y Barri, ac yr wyf yn sicr y bydd Coleg Crosskeys yn gallu bwrw ymlaen â’r cynllun hwnnw gyda’r cyllid sydd ar gael oddi wrth Dysgu ac Addysgu Cymru a ffynonellau eraill.

Pwynt o Drefn

Point of Order

Nick Bourne spoken in English p. 39

Nick Bourne siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39

Point of order. This relates to Standing Order No. 5.3 and the weekly business statement. On Tuesday, when the Minister for Open Government presented the business statement, I asked him whether he would withdraw the election of the Chair of the Committee on European and External Affairs. He indicated that it would go ahead. I notice that a motion to that end has not been tabled as yet, and it would need to have been tabled by now if it is to be debated on Tuesday. Will the Minister indicate whether the item has been withdrawn and what the Government’s intention is in this regard?

Pwynt o drefn. Mae hyn yn ymwneud â Rheol Sefydlog Rhif 5.3 a’r datganiadau busnes wythnosol. Ddydd Mawrth, pan gyflwynodd y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored y datganiad busnes, gofynnais iddo a wnâi dynnu’n ôl yr etholiad ar gyfer Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Materion Ewropeaidd ac Allanol. Fe ddywedodd y byddai hynny’n mynd yn ei flaen. Sylwaf na chyflwynwyd cynnig i’r perwyl hwnnw eto, a buasai’n rhaid bod wedi ei gyflwyno erbyn hyn os oes dadl i fod arno ddydd Mawrth. A wnaiff y Gweinidog nodi a yw’r eitem wedi’i thynnu’n ôl a beth yw bwriad y Llywodraeth yn hyn o beth?

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government spoken in English p. 39

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 39

I confirm that a motion has not been tabled. Nick Bourne’s point of order, which was raised on Tuesday, deserves further consideration and that is what is currently being done.

Yr wyf yn cadarnhau na chyflwynwyd cynnig. Mae pwynt o drefn Nick Bourne, a godwyd ddydd Mawrth, yn teilyngu ei ystyried ymhellach ac yr ydym yn gwneud hynny ar hyn o bryd.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 40

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 40

It might also be helpful for me to respond to that. As the leader of the Welsh Conservatives said, under Standing Order No. 5.3, the Minister for Open Government makes a statement about the organisation of business under Standing Order No. 5.4, which

Gallai fod yn fuddiol i mi ymateb i hynny hefyd. Fel y dywedodd arweinydd Ceidwadwyr Cymru, o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 5.3, mae’r Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored yn gwneud datganiad am drefn busnes o dan Reol Sefydlog Rhif 5.4, a dyma

‘shall constitute the agreed timetable for business’

‘fydd yr amserlen gytûn ar gyfer busnes’

unless there is an objection to it and it is voted down. Notices of business, which are my responsibility, are drafted according to that statement. The election of the Chair of the Committee on European and External Affairs will figure on the notice of business for 2 July. However, a motion needs to be tabled for that business to go ahead, and five days’ notice is required for any motion. I understand that a motion to proceed with that election has not been tabled. Such a motion could therefore only be proposed next Tuesday if I were to allow a procedural motion to bring it forward, or if Standing Orders were to be suspended. It is only fair for me to make it known that I am not currently minded to allow a procedural motion in these circumstances.

oni bai fod gwrthwynebiad iddo a bod mwyafrif yr Aelodau’n pleidleisio’n ei erbyn. Mae’r hysbysiadau busnes, sy’n gyfrifoldeb i mi, yn cael eu drafftio’n unol â’r datganiad hwnnw. Bydd ethol Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Materion Ewropeaidd ac Allanol ar yr hysbys busnes ar gyfer 2 Gorffennaf. Fodd bynnag, rhaid cyflwyno cynnig i’r busnes hwnnw gael mynd yn ei flaen, ac mae angen pum niwrnod o rybudd ar gyfer unrhyw gynnig. Deallaf na chyflwynwyd cynnig i fynd ymlaen â’r etholiad hwnnw. Felly ni ellid cynnig cynnig o’r fath ddydd Mawrth nesaf oni bai fy mod yn caniatáu cynnig trefniadol i’w ddwyn ymlaen, neu oni chaiff y Rheolau Sefydlog eu hatal. Nid yw ond yn deg imi roi gwybod nad wyf yn bleidiol ar hyn o bryd i ganiatáu cynnig trefniadol dan yr amgylchiadau hyn.

Cynnig Trefniadol

Procedural Motion

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government spoken in English p. 40

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 40

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 41 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (41)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Sue Essex
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Brian Hancock
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Val Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • David Melding
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Janet Ryder
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams

Cymeradwyo’r Rheoliadau Hawliau Bridwyr Planhigion (Ffioedd) (Diwygio) 2002

Approval of the Plant Breeders’ Rights (Fees) (Amendment) Regulations 2002

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government spoken in English p. 41

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 41

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Cynnig NDM1095 Carwyn Jones t. 41

Motion NDM1095 Carwyn Jones p. 41

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 40 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (40)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Sue Essex
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Brian Hancock
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Val Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • David Melding
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Janet Ryder
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Kirsty Williams

Cymeradwyo Gorchymyn Mordwyo Gwy 2002

Approval of the Wye Navigation Order 2002

Sue Essex The Minister for Environment spoken in English p. 42

Sue Essex Y Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 42

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Sue Essex The Minister for Environment (continued) spoken in English p. 43

Sue Essex Y Gweinidog dros yr Amgylchedd (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 43

The draft Order is the result of a public process that has considered the Environment Agency’s application to become the navigation authority for the river Wye and its tributaries. A public inquiry took place between April and July 1997 which considered in considerable detail and at length all the formal objections to the agency’s application as well as representations in support. The inspector reported to the Secretary of State in 1998 recommending that the Order should be made. Further detailed representations were then received and there has been subsequent consideration in central Government.

Mae’r Gorchymyn drafft yn ganlyniad i broses gyhoeddus a ystyriodd gais Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd i ddod yn awdurdod mordwyo dros afon Gwy a’i hisafonydd. Bu ymchwiliad cyhoeddus rhwng Ebrill a Gorffennaf 1997 a ystyriodd yn hir ac mewn peth manylder yr holl wrthwynebiadau ffurfiol i gais yr asiantaeth yn ogystal â sylwadau o’i blaid. Adroddodd yr arolygydd i’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn 1998 gan argymell y dylid gwneud y Gorchymyn. Derbyniwyd sylwadau manwl pellach bryd hynny ac mae’r Llywodraeth ganolog wedi’i ystyried wedyn.

Briefly, the Order is intended to deal with the conflict between the different users of the rivers, such as canoeists and anglers, which has existed for many years. This conflict is largely brought about because there is a public right of navigation on the Wye but no effective navigational authority to regulate its use. The Order does not take away that right of navigation—indeed, it restates it—but it enables the agency to regulate the principal lengths of the Wye and Lugg by means of a range of controls, including bye-laws. The Order also gives the agency the power to make bye-laws covering the upper stretches of the rivers Wye and Lugg and their tributaries. They will allow the agency to prescribe navigational rules on the physically navigable stretches of these waters. All bye-laws will be subject to confirmation by the Assembly insofar as they affect areas in Wales.

Yn fyr, bwriad y Gorchymyn yw ymdrin â’r gwrthdaro rhwng gwahanol ddefnyddwyr yr afonydd, fel canŵ-wyr a physgotwyr, sy’n bod ers blynyddoedd lawer. Achosir y gwrthdaro hwn yn bennaf am fod hawl mordwyo gyhoeddus ar afon Gwy ond nad oes awdurdod mordwyo effeithiol i reoleiddio’r defnydd ohoni. Nid yw’r Gorchymyn yn dileu’r hawl mordwyo honno—yn wir, mae’n ei hailddatgan—ond mae’n galluogi’r asiantaeth i reoleiddio prif rannau afonydd Gwy a Llugwy drwy amrediad o reolaethau, gan gynnwys is-ddeddfau. Mae’r Gorchymyn yn rhoi hawl hefyd i’r asiantaeth wneud is-ddeddfau sy’n ymwneud â hydoedd uchaf afonydd Gwy a Llugwy a’u hisafonydd. Byddant yn caniatáu i’r asiantaeth ragnodi rheolau mordwyo ar yr hydoedd o’r afonydd hyn y gellir eu mordwyo. Bydd yn rhaid i’r Cynulliad gadarnhau’r holl is-ddeddfau sy’n effeithio ar ardaloedd yng Nghymru.

More details on the proposal have been available to Members prior to this debate in the explanatory memorandum, the draft Order, the inspector’s report and the draft decision letter. Subject to the Assembly’s agreement today, the Secretary of State intends to accept the inspector’s recommendation and to make the Order. Given the conflict between users that has existed for many years and the lack of an effective mechanism for regulating navigation, I accept the judgment of the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs that this is the best way forward.

Bu rhagor o fanylion ar gael i’r Aelodau am y cynnig cyn y ddadl hon yn y memorandwm eglurhaol, y Gorchymyn drafft, adroddiad yr arolygydd a’r llythyr penderfyniad drafft. Ar yr amod bod y Cynulliad yn cytuno heddiw, mae’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn bwriadu derbyn argymhelliad yr arolygydd a gwneud y Gorchymyn. O ystyried y gwrthdaro rhwng defnyddwyr a fu am flynyddoedd lawer a’r diffyg peirianwaith effeithiol i reoleiddio mordwyo, derbyniaf ddyfarniad yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros yr Amgylchedd, Bwyd a Materion Gwledig mai hon yw’r ffordd orau ymlaen.

We need to recognise the tourism potential of the navigation rights on these rivers. There is an equal need to ensure a balance with angling interests on one of Europe’s top game fishing rivers. The environmental and ecological importance of the rivers also need to be recognised. The currently voluntary arrangements for users of the rivers have failed to ensure that all the various interests are taken into account. I agree with the Secretary of State’s view, based on the inspector’s conclusions, that there is a need for an independent authority to manage the diverse and conflicting activities on the rivers in a co-ordinated and comprehensive way. I also accept the conclusion that the Environment Agency is the most suitable body to manage navigation on the rivers, particularly in the light of its existing powers in respect of flood defence and water management.

Rhaid inni gydnabod potensial yr hawliau mordwyo ar yr afonydd hyn i dwristiaeth. I’r un graddau, rhaid inni sicrhau cydbwysedd â buddiannau’r pysgotwyr ar afon sydd ymysg y goreuon yn Ewrop o ran pysgota gêm. Rhaid cydnabod pwysigrwydd amgylcheddol ac ecolegol yr afonydd hyn hefyd. Mae’r trefniadau gwirfoddol presennol i ddefnyddwyr yr afonydd wedi methu â sicrhau bod yr holl fuddiannau gwahanol yn cael eu hystyried. Cytunaf â barn yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol, sy’n seiliedig ar gasgliadau’r arolygydd, fod angen awdurdod annibynnol i gadw trefn ar y gweithgareddau amrywiol a chroestynnol ar yr afonydd mewn modd cydlynol a chynhwysfawr. Yr wyf hefyd yn derbyn y casgliad mai Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd yw’r corff mwyaf addas i reoli mordwyo ar yr afonydd, yn enwedig yng ngolwg ei phwerau presennol o ran amddiffyn rhag llifogydd a rheoli dŵr.

The Order will require the agency to establish a navigation advisory committee and to consult it about matters concerning navigation and use of the rivers. It also specifies its membership, which will include representatives of anglers, canoeists, rafters, rowers, conservation and environmental groups, plus riparian owners and local interests nominated by local authorities.

Bydd y Gorchymyn yn mynnu bod yr asiantaeth yn sefydlu pwyllgor ymgynghorol ar fordwyo ac yn ymgynghori ag ef ynghylch materion sy’n ymwneud â mordwyo a’r defnydd o’r afonydd. Mae hefyd yn nodi ei aelodaeth, a fydd yn cynnwys cynrychiolwyr pysgotwyr, canŵ-wyr, rafftwyr, rhwyfwyr, grwpiau cadwraeth ac amgylcheddol, ynghyd â pherchnogion glannau’r afonydd a buddiannau lleol a enwebir gan awdurdodau lleol.

The agency will also be required to produce and publish a navigation plan, after consulting the advisory committee on its content. Under Standing Orders, the Assembly may either agree to the Order or decline to do so; it cannot amend the detail of its provisions. I am satisfied that the proper processes have been undertaken and that where the provisions of the Order will affect Wales, the Assembly has been given appropriate functions. For example, any bye-laws made under the Order relating to Wales must be confirmed by the Assembly. On the substance of this application, I have no reason to take a different view from that of the inspector and the Secretary of State, and I therefore ask you to agree that the Secretary of State should make the Wye Navigation Order 2002.

Bydd yn ofynnol hefyd i’r asiantaeth gynhyrchu a chyhoeddi cynllun mordwyo, ar ôl ymgynghori â’r pwyllgor ymgynghorol ar ei gynnwys. O dan y Rheolau Sefydlog, caiff y Cynulliad naill ai gytuno ar wneud y Gorchymyn neu wrthod gwneud hynny; ni chaiff newid manylion y darpariaethau sydd ynddo. Yr wyf yn fodlon bod y prosesau priodol wedi’u cyflawni a, lle y bydd darpariaethau’r Gorchymyn yn effeithio ar Gymru, fod y Cynulliad wedi cael swyddogaethau priodol. Er enghraifft, rhaid i unrhyw is-ddeddfau a wneir o dan y Gorchymyn sy’n ymwneud â Chymru gael eu cadarnhau gan y Cynulliad. Ynghylch sylwedd y cais hwn, nid oes gennyf reswm dros farnu’n wahanol i’r arolygydd a’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol, ac felly gofynnaf ichi gytuno y dylai’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol wneud Gorchymyn Mordwyo Gwy 2002.

Janet Davies spoken in English p. 45

Janet Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 45

Plaid Cymru supports the proposals. The Wye valley is an area of outstanding natural beauty, a site of special scientific interest and a candidate for special area of conservation status. It is important that it is safeguarded by a central authority.

Mae Plaid Cymru’n cefnogi’r cynlluniau hyn. Mae dyffryn Gwy’n ardal o harddwch naturiol eithriadol, yn safle o ddiddordeb gwyddonol arbennig ac yn destun cais am statws ardal gadwraeth arbennig. Mae’n bwysig iddo gael ei ddiogelu gan awdurdod canolog.

The briefing that we received from the Environment Agency mentioned conflict between recreation users, such as canoeists and anglers. The Minister also raised that point. I understand that there have been problems between net and rod fishermen. Will that be resolved under this Order? Also, as the river flows between England and Wales, which part of the Environment Agency will have this responsibility? Promoting accountability and local user involvement in an advisory committee is worthwhile and I hope it happens.

Yr oedd y brîff a gawsom gan Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd yn sôn am wrthdaro rhwng defnyddwyr amser hamdden, fel canŵ-wyr a physgotwyr. Cododd y Gweinidog y pwynt hwnnw hefyd. Deallaf fod problemau wedi codi rhwng pysgotwyr genwair a physgotwyr â rhwyd. A gaiff hynny ei ddatrys o dan y Gorchymyn hwn? Hefyd, gan fod yr afon yn llifo rhwng Cymru a Lloegr, pa ran o Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd a gaiff y cyfrifoldeb hwn? Mae hyrwyddo atebolrwydd a rhoi rhan i ddefnyddwyr lleol mewn pwyllgor ymgynghorol yn fuddiol a gobeithiaf y bydd yn digwydd.

Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 45

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 45

This Order is long overdue, as the Minister said, but I am uncomfortable that the London Government may be perceived as not taking full account of local views. I sincerely hope that, in agreeing to this Order, we will have the Minister’s assurance that decision making by the Environment Agency will continue to involve and take full account of local interest groups.

Mae’n hen bryd cael y Gorchymyn hwn, fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog, ond yr wyf yn teimlo’n anesmwyth y gellid canfod nad yw Llywodraeth Llundain yn rhoi ystyriaeth lawn i’r farn leol. Yr wyf yn gwir obeithio y byddwn, wrth gytuno ar wneud y Gorchymyn hwn, yn cael sicrwydd gan y Gweinidog y bydd y penderfyniadau gan Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd yn dal i gynnwys a rhoi pob ystyriaeth i grwpiau buddiant lleol.

Dafydd Elis-Thomas The Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 46

Dafydd Elis-Thomas Y Llywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 46

Order. I heard the infelicitous expression ‘the London Government’. I suspect that you are not referring to the Greater London Authority, or to my friend, the Mayor of London.

Trefn. Clywais yr ymadrodd amhriodol ‘Llywodraeth Llundain’. Yr wyf yn amau nad ydych yn cyfeirio at Awdurdod Llundain Fwyaf, nac at fy ffrind, Maer Llundain.

Nick Bourne spoken in English p. 46

Nick Bourne siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 46

I have several issues, of which I have given Sue Essex prior notice, as they are mostly technical matters. The first relates to the consultation process. I understand, from what the Minister said, that there has been consultation, but will she confirm that all riparian owners have been involved in that consultation? Secondly, some of the provisions of the Order seem to be Wales-only provisions. I am not sure why the Westminster Government is involved in those. For example, article 32 only affects the upper stretches of the Wye, which are all within Wales. The third issue is one of process: how will today’s points be taken on board by the Minister in Westminster, and is there a further process by which we can express concerns so that they will be taken up by the Westminster Government?

Mae gennyf sawl mater i’w godi, y rhoddais rybudd amdanynt i Sue Essex ymlaen llaw, gan eu bod yn faterion technegol gan mwyaf. Mae’r cyntaf yn ymwneud â’r broses ymgynghori. Deallaf, o’r hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog, y bu ymgynghori, ond a wnaiff gadarnhau bod holl berchnogion glannau’r afonydd wedi’u cynnwys yn yr ymgynghoriad hwnnw? Yn ail, mae’n ymddangos bod rhai o’r darpariaethau yn y Gorchymyn yn ddarpariaethau i Gymru’n unig. Nid wyf yn sicr pam y mae Llywodraeth San Steffan yn ymwneud â hwy. Er enghraifft, nid yw erthygl 32 ond yn effeithio ar hydoedd uchaf afon Gwy, sydd i gyd o fewn Cymru. Mae’r trydydd mater yn ymwneud â phroses: sut y caiff y pwyntiau a wneir heddiw eu hystyried gan y Gweinidog yn San Steffan, ac a oes proses bellach y gallwn ei defnyddio i fynegi pryderon fel y bydd Llywodraeth San Steffan yn rhoi sylw iddynt?

The other issues relate to appeals against the Environment Agency. I understand that the agency acts on a cross-border basis, so there is no question of it being the Environment Agency for Wales or for England. However, in relation to article 19, there is no provision for appeals against the Environment Agency’s decisions in relation to regulations or restrictions on navigation. That seems strange. Similarly, under article 20, there does not seem to be provision to appeal against officers’ decisions made in relation to such matters. Why is that? In relation to article 21, the Environment Agency may decide to dredge or excavate any stretch of the river in Wales—or in England, but we are concerned with Wales here—and I am not certain why there is no provision to appeal against such decisions under article 21. Compensation is payable to those whose rights are affected, but such decisions can affect others who use the river. Why is there no provision to appeal against such decisions?

Mae’r materion eraill yn ymwneud ag apeliadau yn erbyn Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd. Deallaf fod yr asiantaeth honno yn gweithredu’n drawsffiniol, felly ni ddichon iddo fod yn Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd i Gymru neu i Loegr. Fodd bynnag, o ran erthygl 19, nid oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apeliadau yn erbyn penderfyniadau gan Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd sy’n ymwneud â rheoliadau neu gyfyngiadau ar fordwyo. Mae hynny’n ymddangos yn rhyfedd. Yn yr un modd, o dan erthygl 20, nid yw’n ymddangos bod darpariaeth ar gyfer apelio yn erbyn penderfyniadau gan swyddogion sy’n ymwneud â materion o’r fath. Pam hynny? O ran erthygl 21, caiff Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd benderfynu carthu neu gloddio unrhyw hyd o’r afon yng Nghymru—neu yn Lloegr, ond yr ydym yn ymwneud â Chymru yn y fan hon—ac nid wyf yn sicr pam nad oes darpariaeth i apelio yn erbyn penderfyniadau o’r fath o dan erthygl 21. Gellir talu iawndal i’r rhai yr effeithir ar eu hawliau, ond gall penderfyniadau o’r fath effeithio ar eraill sy’n defnyddio’r afon. Pam nad oes darpariaeth i apelio yn erbyn penderfyniadau o’r fath?

Similarly, there is no provision for appeal under article 22, as far as I can see, for those who are affected by the granting of licences. There is provision for those who have had an application for a licence refused to appeal, but not for those who may be affected by licences being granted elsewhere on the river, such as riparian owners, anglers or rowers.

Yn yr un modd, nid oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apelio o dan erthygl 22, hyd y gallaf fi weld, i’r rhai a effeithir yn sgîl rhoi trwyddedau. Mae darpariaeth i’r rhai y gwrthodwyd cais ganddynt am drwydded apelio, ond nid i’r rhai a allai gael eu heffeithio yn sgîl rhoi trwyddedau mewn mannau eraill ar yr afon, fel perchnogion glannau’r afonydd, pysgotwyr neu rwyfwyr.

The Environment Agency is obliged to list the charges that it may levy. However, there does not seem to be a sanction under article 25 if it fails to do so. Will the Minister comment on those specific points?

Mae Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd yn gorfod rhestru’r taliadau y gall eu codi. Fodd bynnag, nid yw’n ymddangos bod cosb o dan erthygl 25 os yw’n methu â gwneud hynny. A wnaiff y Gweinidog wneud sylw ar y pwyntiau penodol hynny?

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 47

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 47

I thank Janet for supporting the proposal. It makes sense and it has been a long time coming; this issue has been ongoing for around 16 years. The advisory committee will have an important role with regard to issues of conflict. It will have a wide membership and that is how, I guess, the Environment Agency sees it offering support and information going through, often on difficult decisions.

Diolchaf i Janet am gefnogi’r bwriad hwn. Mae’n gwneud synnwyr ac mae’n hirddisgwyliedig; mae’r mater hwn ar y gweill ers tua 16 mlynedd. Bydd rôl bwysig i’r pwyllgor ymgynghorol o ran materion o wrthdaro. Bydd ganddo aelodaeth eang a thrwy hynny, yr wyf yn tybio, y mae Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd yn credu y bydd yn cynnig cymorth a gwybodaeth wrth fynd ymlaen ac wrth drafod penderfyniadau a fydd yn aml yn rhai anodd.

Nick answered the point about the Environment Agency working on a cross-border basis. On Eleanor’s point—and I think that this also picks up your point, Janet—this has been resolved through a public inquiry. That is standard procedure in all sorts of circumstances to allow interested and affected parties, whether they are direct land owners or those who feel that their interests are affected, to put their views across. The inspector must then draw all those points together and make a recommendation. That is the basis of this Order. It is the way in which many decisions are made. Before the Assembly was established, this issue was primarily the Secretary of State’s responsibility. There is no need to worry that the Welsh voice has not been heard. There were opportunities for views to be expressed during the inquiry and now the Order is in front of the Assembly to agree.

Atebodd Nick y pwynt am weithredu trawsffiniol Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd. Ynghylch pwynt Eleanor—a chredaf fod hyn yn ateb eich pwynt chi hefyd, Janet—penderfynwyd ar hyn drwy ymchwiliad cyhoeddus. Mae honno’n weithdrefn arferol o dan bob math o amgylchiadau i ganiatáu i’r rhai sydd â buddiant a’r rhai yr effeithir arnynt, pa un a ydynt yn berchnogion tir eu hunain neu’n rhai sy’n teimlo bod effaith ar eu buddiannau, gyfleu eu barn. Wedyn rhaid i’r arolygydd dynnu’r holl bwyntiau hynny ynghyd a gwneud argymhelliad. Dyna sail y Gorchymyn hwn. Felly y gwneir llawer o benderfyniadau. Cyn sefydlu’r Cynulliad, yr oedd y mater hwn yn gyfrifoldeb i’r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn bennaf. Nid oes angen poeni na chlywyd llais Cymru. Bu cyfleoedd i fynegi barn yn ystod yr ymchwiliad a bellach mae’r Gorchymyn gerbron y Cynulliad iddo gael cytuno arno.

I thank Nick for giving me advanced warning of some of his technical points; that was helpful and should ensure, I hope, that I can give him the detailed answers he wants. I remind you that the Assembly can only approve or reject the Order. However, we can send the transcript of these proceedings to the Secretary of State so that the Government in London is aware of the views expressed today.

Diolchaf i Nick am roi rhybudd o flaen llaw i mi o rai o’i bwyntiau technegol; yr oedd hynny’n gymwynasgar a dylai sicrhau, yr wyf yn gobeithio, y gallaf roi iddo’r atebion manwl y mae am eu cael. Yr wyf yn eich atgoffa na chaiff y Cynulliad ond cymeradwyo neu wrthod y Gorchymyn. Fodd bynnag, gallwn anfon trawsgrifiad o’r trafodion hyn at yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol fel bod y Llywodraeth yn Llundain yn ymwybodol o’r safbwyntiau a fynegwyd heddiw.

An extensive consultation involving owners and other users has been undertaken. Prior to making its application, the agency published a consultation paper, including proposals on a draft Order, which was widely distributed to all interested parties. This matter was also subject to a public inquiry, as I have said. Further details of the agency’s proposals for the Wye river were published in February 1997 and a further draft Order was tabled at the inquiry in July 1997. Therefore a series of consultations have taken place and I hope that all those interested in the issue were able to obtain information.

Fe gynhaliwyd ymgynghoriad eang a oedd yn cynnwys perchnogion a defnyddwyr eraill. Cyn iddi wneud ei chais, cyhoeddodd yr asiantaeth bapur ymgynghorol ac ynddo gynigion ynghylch Gorchymyn drafft, a ddosbarthwyd yn eang ymysg pawb a oedd â buddiant. Bu ymchwiliad cyhoeddus ar y mater hwn hefyd, fel y dywedais. Cyhoeddwyd manylion pellach am gynigion yr asiantaeth ar gyfer afon Gwy yn Chwefror 1997 a chyflwynwyd Gorchymyn drafft pellach yn yr ymchwiliad yng Ngorffennaf 1997. Felly bu cyfres o ymgyngoriadau a gobeithiaf fod pawb a oedd â buddiant yn y mater wedi gallu cael gwybodaeth.

On Wales-only issues, the upper river tributaries, as described in the articles, are in Wales. I would be happy to give this information to Nick in writing if that would be helpful. Article 32 modifies existing legislation. Schedule 25 to the Water Resources Act 1991, which refers to the power to confirm bye-laws in respect of navigable waters in Wales, was devolved to the Assembly under the National Assembly for Wales (Transfer of Functions) Order 1999. The bye-laws provided for in article 7 of the draft Order are subject to confirmation by the Assembly alone when they relate to an area in Wales.

Ynghylch y materion i Gymru’n unig, mae’r isafonydd uchaf, fel y’u disgrifir yn yr erthyglau, yng Nghymru. Byddwn yn falch o roi’r wybodaeth hon i Nick mewn ysgrifen os byddai hynny o gymorth. Mae erthygl 32 yn addasu deddfwriaeth sy’n bodoli. Datganolwyd atodlen 25 i’r Ddeddf Adnoddau Dŵr 1991, sy’n cyfeirio at y pŵer i gadarnhau is-ddeddfau mewn cysylltiad â dyfroedd mordwyadwy yng Nghymru, i’r Cynulliad o dan Orchymyn Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru (Trosglwyddo Swyddogaethau) 1999. Mae’r is-ddeddfau y darperir ar eu cyfer yn erthygl 7 o’r Gorchymyn drafft i’w cadarnhau gan y Cynulliad yn unig os ydynt yn ymwneud ag ardal sydd yng Nghymru.

With regard to Nick’s question about how concerns will be taken on board at Westminster, under the provisions in the transfer of functions Order, the Secretary of State cannot make the Order unless the Assembly agrees to it being done. That is the situation today. If the Order were amended in any way as a consequence of views expressed today, or for any other reason, it would need to be referred to the Assembly again for further consideration before it could proceed. Any point of clarification not requiring an amendment to the Order can be taken up separately with the Secretary of State’s officials. We will forward those.

O ran cwestiwn Nick am y modd y bydd pryderon yn cael sylw yn San Steffan, o dan y darpariaethau yn y Gorchymyn trosglwyddo swyddogaethau, ni all yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol wneud y Gorchymyn oni bai fod y Cynulliad yn cytuno ar hynny. Dyna’r sefyllfa heddiw. Os câi’r Gorchymyn ei newid mewn rhyw fodd o ganlyniad i’r farn a fynegwyd heddiw, neu am unrhyw reswm arall, byddai’n rhaid ei ailgyfeirio i’r Cynulliad i’w ystyried ymhellach cyn y gallai fynd ymlaen. Gellir codi unrhyw bwynt o eglurhad nad yw’n gofyn am newid y Gorchymyn ar wahân gyda swyddogion yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol. Byddwn yn eu hanfon ymlaen.

I turn to Nick’s questions on provisions to appeal. First, there is no provision to appeal against the Environment Agency under article 19, because the power in this article is to close the river temporarily subject to several restrictions. A right of appeal would not be practicable in those circumstances and no representations were made on this matter during the inquiry. Secondly, there is no provision to appeal against decisions made by Environment Agency officers under article 20 because there is no precedent in law for a right of appeal under the circumstances detailed in the article. It accords with comparable tidal legislation, for example, that of the Severn estuary under the management of the Gloucester harbour trustees. The circumstances that invoke this power render an appeal unnecessary.

Trof at gwestiynau Nick am y darpariaethau ar gyfer apelio. Yn gyntaf, nid oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apeliadau yn erbyn Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd o dan erthygl 19, gan fod y pŵer sydd yn yr erthygl hon yn un i gau’r afon dros dro yn amodol ar sawl cyfyngiad. Ni fyddai hawl i apelio’n ymarferol dan yr amgylchiadau hynny ac ni chyflwynwyd unrhyw sylwadau ar y mater hwn yn ystod yr ymchwiliad. Yn ail, nid oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apelio yn erbyn penderfyniadau gan swyddogion Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd dan erthygl 20 gan nad oes cynsail yn y gyfraith i hawl i apelio dan yr amgylchiadau a ddisgrifir yn yr erthygl. Mae’n gyson â deddfwriaeth debyg sy’n ymwneud â’r llanw, er enghraifft, honno ar gyfer y rhan o aber Hafren sydd dan reolaeth ymddiriedolwyr harbwr Caerloyw. Mae’r amgylchiadau sy’n galw am y pŵer hwn yn peri nad oes angen apêl.

Thirdly, there is no provision to appeal against a decision by the Environment Agency to dredge or excavate under article 21 because, again, there is no precedent in law for a right of appeal in these circumstances. However, as a consequence of representations, articles 21(2) and 21(3) were added to allow, in the first instance, consultation with the relevant parties and, in the second instance, to provide compensation for damages sustained. Fourthly, on there being no provision to appeal under article 22 in relation to the granting of licences, the right to appeal to the appropriate national authority is provided for under article 22(7). In respect of a works licence applying to Wales, the appeal would be to the Assembly. Fifthly, on what sanctions apply to the Environment Agency should it fail to list charges as provided for under article 25, as is the case for all the agency’s statutory duties, the courts offer a recourse in respect of a failure by the agency to comply. I hope that that is helpful.

Yn drydydd, nid oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apelio yn erbyn penderfyniad gan Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd i garthu neu gloddio dan erthygl 21 gan nad oes cynsail yn y gyfraith, unwaith eto, i hawl i apelio dan yr amgylchiadau hynny. Fodd bynnag, o ganlyniad i sylwadau a gyflwynwyd, ychwanegwyd erthyglau 21(2) a 21(3) i ganiatáu, yn yr achos cyntaf, ymgynghori â phawb sy’n gysylltiedig ac, yn yr ail achos, i ddarparu iawndal am unrhyw ddifrod a gafwyd. Yn bedwerydd, ynghylch y ffaith nad oes darpariaeth ar gyfer apelio dan erthygl 22 mewn cysylltiad â rhoi trwyddedau, darperir ar gyfer yr hawl i apelio i’r awdurdod cenedlaethol priodol dan erthygl 22(7). Yn achos trwydded gwaith a oedd yn berthnasol i Gymru, i’r Cynulliad y byddai’r apêl. Yn bumed, ynghylch y cosbau a fyddai’n berthnasol i Asiantaeth yr Amgylchedd pe byddai’n methu â rhestru taliadau fel y rhagnodir o dan erthygl 25, fel y bo’n wir am holl ddyletswyddau statudol yr asiantaeth, mae’r llysoedd yn cynnig cymorth mewn cysylltiad â methiant i gydymffurfio gan yr asiantaeth. Gobeithiaf fod hynny o gymorth.

Nick Bourne spoken in English p. 50

Nick Bourne siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 50

I am grateful to the Minister for those responses, but I think there has been a misunderstanding about the right of appeal in relation to the fourth issue. The right of appeal is only for someone who has not been granted a licence. It does not extend to those who have been affected by a licence being granted. I appreciate that you may need time to consider that issue.

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i’r Gweinidog am yr atebion hynny, ond credaf fod camddealltwriaeth wedi bod ynghylch yr hawl i apelio mewn cysylltiad â’r pedwerydd mater. Mae’r hawl i apelio ar gyfer rhywun na roddwyd trwydded iddo’n unig. Nid yw’n cynnwys y rhai a effeithiwyd drwy roi trwydded. Sylweddolaf ei bod yn bosibl y bydd arnoch angen amser i ystyried y mater hwnnw.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 50

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 50

What you say may be true, and I will clarify that for you.

Mae’n bosibl bod yr hyn a ddywedwch yn wir, a rhoddaf eglurhad i chi am hynny.

Brian Hancock spoken in English p. 50

Brian Hancock siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 50

I listened intently to your response to Nick Bourne’s questions on appeals. I am interested in that matter, and I will need to come back to you on it.

Gwrandewais yn astud ar eich ymateb i gwestiynau Nick Bourne am apeliadau. Ymddiddoraf yn y mater hwnnw, a bydd yn rhaid imi ddod yn ôl atoch ar hynny.

I declare an interest as vice chair of the Islwyn Canal Association and vice president of the Brecon, Monmouthshire and Abergavenny Canal Trust and ask for your support for the inaugural meeting of the Assembly’s all-party group on waterways next Tuesday evening.

Datganaf fuddiant fel is-gadeirydd Cymdeithas Camlas Islwyn ac is-lywydd Ymddiriedolaeth Camlas Aberhonddu, Sir Fynwy a’r Fenni a gofynnaf am eich cefnogaeth i gyfarfod agoriadol grŵp trawsbleidiol y Cynulliad ar ddyfrffyrdd nos Fawrth nesaf.

Sue Essex spoken in English p. 50

Sue Essex siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 50

That is taking this debate on the Wye Navigation Order 2002 a stretch of water too far, Brian. However, I will try to attend that meeting to offer my support.

Mae hynny’n mynd â’r ddadl hon ar Orchymyn Mordwyo Gwy 2002 braidd yn rhy bell, Brian. Fodd bynnag, fe geisiaf ddod i’r cyfarfod hwnnw i gynnig fy nghefnogaeth.

Cynnig Sue Essex t. 51

Motion Sue Essex p. 51

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 43 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (43)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Sue Essex
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Brian Hancock
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Val Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • David Melding
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams
  • Phil Williams

Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd i’r Gadair am 10.44 a.m.

The Deputy Presiding Officer took the Chair at 10.44 a.m.

Y Cynnydd a wnaed ar y Cynllun Datblygu Gwledig

The Progress of the Rural Development Plan

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 52

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 52

I have selected amendment 1 in the name of Jonathan Morgan, and amendments 2, 3 and 4 in the name of Jocelyn Davies.

Yr wyf wedi dethol gwelliant 1 yn enw Jonathan Morgan, a gwelliannau 2, 3 a 4 yn enw Jocelyn Davies.

Before I call the Minister to open the debate, I remind Members that we have two important debates this morning as well as the short debate. More Members have asked to contribute than I can accommodate. I therefore appeal for brief speeches. I will not impose a three-minute limit; we will stick to five minutes, but shorter contributions would be much appreciated.

Cyn imi alw ar y Gweinidog i agor y ddadl, yr wyf yn atgoffa’r Aelodau bod gennym ddwy ddadl bwysig y bore yma yn ogystal â’r ddadl fer. Mae mwy o Aelodau wedi gofyn am gael cyfrannu nag y gallaf eu cynnwys. Gan hynny, apeliaf am areithiau byr. Ni osodaf gyfyngiad tair munud; cadwn at bum munud, ond tra gwerthfawrogir cyfraniadau byrrach.

Michael German The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Rural Development and Wales Abroad spoken in English p. 52

Michael German Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Gwledig a Chymru Dramor siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 52

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Michael German The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Rural Development and Wales Abroad (continued) spoken in English p. 52

Michael German Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Gwledig a Chymru Dramor (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 52

This is a progress report on the rural development plan and follows on from motions that came before the Assembly last year. It gives us a chance to assess the progress of our long-term plans for rural Wales, particularly in the aftermath of the foot and mouth disease outbreak last year. The rural development plan, which covers 2000-06, was approved by the European Commission last October. It was the first of the United Kingdom plans to be approved, and covers expenditure of £450 million over seven years. The totality of what we can do is restricted by the disappointingly small allocation of European resources to the United Kingdom, which translates into only £12.6 million a year for Wales. We have reduced that problem by injecting additional Assembly resources—far more than is strictly necessary to match the European money—and by introducing modulation of direct subsidy receipts, and match funding that as well.

Adroddiad ar y cynnydd a wnaed ar y cynllun datblygu gwledig yw hwn ac mae’n ganlyniad i gynigion a ddaeth gerbron y Cynulliad y llynedd. Mae’n rhoi cyfle inni asesu’r cynnydd a wnaed ar ein cynlluniau tymor hir ar gyfer y Gymru wledig, yn enwedig yn sgîl argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau y llynedd. Cymeradwywyd y cynllun datblygu gwledig, sy’n cynnwys 2000-06, gan y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd fis Hydref diwethaf. Hwn oedd y cyntaf o gynlluniau’r Deyrnas Unedig i’w gymeradwyo, ac mae’n cynnwys gwariant o £450 miliwn dros saith mlynedd. Cyfyngir ar faint yr hyn y gallwn ei wneud oherwydd y dyraniad siomedig o fach o adnoddau Ewropeaidd i’r Deyrnas Unedig, sy’n dod i ddim ond £12.6 miliwn y flwyddyn i Gymru. Yr ydym wedi lleihau’r broblem honno drwy ychwanegu adnoddau gan y Cynulliad—mwy o lawer na’r hyn sydd wir ei angen i gyfateb i’r arian Ewropeaidd—a thrwy gyflwyno modiwleiddio ar dderbynebion cymhorthdal uniongyrchol, a rhoi cyllid cyfatebol ar gyfer hynny hefyd.

The Assembly is implementing seven of the nine measures under the rural development regulation. These include, support for less-favoured areas, agri-environment schemes, afforestation and other forestry measures, processing and marketing, training as part of Farming Connect, and a raft of initiatives on wider rural development under article 33 of the rural development regulation. For less-favoured areas, Tir Mynydd is the Assembly’s new scheme for support in the hills. Gradually, that is moving from a headage payment to an area-based scheme with, importantly, extra cash available to farmers for environmentally beneficial practices on their holdings. In recognition of the effects of this significant change in the basis of payment, a safety net was negotiated to ease the transition to the new system, which has now been put into operation. This safety net, which protects those farmers disadvantaged by the new system, has been reduced from 90 per cent of previous entitlements in 2001 to 80 per cent for 2002. Payments of £36.1 million have already been made for 2002.

Mae’r Cynulliad yn gweithredu saith o’r naw mesur o dan y rheoliad datblygu gwledig. Mae’r rhain yn cynnwys cymorth i ardaloedd llai ffafriol, cynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd, fforestu a mesurau coedwigaeth eraill, prosesu a marchnata, hyfforddi fel rhan o Cyswllt Ffermio, a llu o fentrau datblygu gwledig mwy cyffredinol o dan erthygl 33 o’r rheoliad datblygu gwledig. Ar gyfer yr ardaloedd llai ffafriol, Tir Mynydd yw cynllun newydd y Cynulliad i roi cymorth yn y mynyddoedd. Mae’n symud yn raddol oddi wrth dâl y pen at gynllun ar sail arwynebedd ynghyd â darpariaeth bwysig o arian ychwanegol i ffermwyr ar gyfer arferion sydd o fudd i’r amgylchedd ar eu ffermydd. Er mwyn cydnabod effeithiau’r newid sylweddol hwn yn sail y taliadau, negodwyd rhwyd ddiogelwch i hwyluso’r newid at y system newydd sydd bellach ar waith. Mae’r rhwyd ddiogelwch hon, sy’n diogelu’r ffermwyr hynny a roddir dan anfantais gan y system newydd, wedi’i lleihau o 90 y cant o’r hawliau blaenorol yn 2001 i 80 y cant ar gyfer 2002. Gwnaed taliadau o £36.1 miliwn eisoes ar gyfer 2002.

The delivery of the agri-environmental schemes, Tir Gofal, and the organic farming scheme has been hampered severely by foot and mouth disease. It proved impossible to carry out any project officer visits between February and August 2001. As a result of that, only seven Tir Gofal agreements were signed during that period. However, since the resumption of visits, good progress has been made to address the backlog of agreements waiting to be signed.

Mae gweithrediad y cynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd, Tir Gofal, a’r cynllun ffermio organig wedi’i lesteirio’n ddifrifol gan glwy’r traed a’r genau. Cafwyd ei bod yn amhosibl cynnal unrhyw ymweliadau gan swyddogion prosiect rhwng Chwefror ac Awst 2001. O ganlyniad i hynny, dim ond saith cytundeb Tir Gofal a arwyddwyd yn ystod y cyfnod hwnnw. Fodd bynnag, ers ailddechrau’r ymweliadau, gwnaed cynnydd da ar ymdrin â’r ôl-groniad o gytundebau sy’n disgwyl eu harwyddo.

For Members’ information, I propose to take interventions when I respond to this debate. Anybody who has not been able to ask questions will be able to do so then.

Er gwybodaeth i’r Aelodau, bwriadaf dderbyn ymyriadau pan ymatebaf i’r ddadl hon. Bydd rhywun nad yw wedi gallu gofyn cwestiynau’n gallu gwneud bryd hynny.

Some 630 Tir Gofal agreements have been signed, bringing a total area of some 57,000 hectares into environmental management, and a further 200 agreements are close to being completed. Some 120 organic farming scheme agreements, covering 11,000 hectares of land, were signed in 2001-02. This brings the total number of holdings that have entered the scheme since its introduction in 1999 to 550.

Arwyddwyd tua 630 o gytundebau Tir Gofal, gan ddod â chyfanswm arwynebedd o tua 57,000 hectar o dan reolaeth amgylcheddol, ac mae 200 o gytundebau pellach ar fin eu cwblhau. Arwyddwyd tua 120 o gytundebau’r cynllun ffermio organig, sy’n cynnwys 11,000 hectar o dir, yn 2001-02. Daw hynny â chyfanswm y ffermydd a ymunodd â’r cynllun ers ei gyflwyno yn 1999 i 550.

On forestry, the woodland grant scheme continues to be the main tool for delivering new planting and woodland management. However, following the launch of the National Assembly’s ‘Woodlands for Wales’ strategy last summer, two reviews have been undertaken to evaluate grant aid in this sector. An examination of the results will be undertaken to see whether the grant delivery mechanism can be improved. The farm woodland premium scheme runs in conjunction with the woodland grant scheme, and has attracted some 650 farmers into the scheme, paying out approximately £365,000 in grant.

Ynghylch coedwigaeth, y cynllun grantiau coetir yw’r prif offeryn o hyd i sicrhau plannu newydd a rheolaeth ar goetir. Fodd bynnag, ar ôl lansio strategaeth ‘Coetiroedd i Gymru’ y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yr haf diwethaf, cynhaliwyd dau adolygiad i werthuso’r cymorth grant yn y sector hwn. Gwneir archwiliad o’r canlyniadau i weld a ellir gwella’r peirianwaith ar gyfer gweithredu’r grant. Mae’r cynllun premiwm coetir ffermydd yn rhedeg ar y cyd â’r cynllun grantiau coetir, ac mae wedi denu tua 650 o ffermwyr i’r cynllun, ac wedi talu tua £365,000 mewn grantiau.

Farming Connect continues to be a vital component of the rural development plan. This innovative scheme is designed to help farming families improve the viability of their businesses. Support is provided through initiatives such as free business plans, training, specialist advice, demonstration farms, and centres of excellence, to ensure that our industry is kept fully informed of, and is able to benefit from, the latest developments. The outbreak of foot and mouth disease delayed the launch of Farming Connect, which had been planned for spring 2001. It finally went ahead on 17 September 2001. The delay has restricted the extent to which consultants have been able to work up business plans with farmers and, therefore, initial progress has appeared at times to be limited. However, there has been high demand for business plans, with over 4,000 request coming in. Work on more than 1,800 of these plans is underway, and over 360 business plans have been completed. We are continually considering ways to streamline the service and reduce delays, and refinements to the business planning package are now being introduced. I am meeting shortly with the Welsh Development Agency, who progressed this matter, to ensure that we speed up the number of consultant visits and reduce the backlog.

Mae Cyswllt Ffermio’n parhau’n elfen hollbwysig yn y cynllun datblygu gwledig. Amcan y cynllun arloesol hwn yw helpu teuluoedd ffermio i wella hyfywedd eu busnesau. Darperir cymorth drwy fentrau fel cynlluniau busnes am ddim, hyfforddi, cyngor arbenigol, ffermydd arddangos, a chanolfannau rhagoriaeth, i sicrhau yr hysbysir ein diwydiant yn llawn am y datblygiadau diweddaraf a’i fod yn gallu elwa ohonynt. Gohiriwyd lansio Cyswllt Ffermio, a fwriadwyd ar gyfer gwanwyn 2001, gan argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau. Aeth ymlaen yn y diwedd ar 17 Medi 2001. Mae’r oedi wedi cyfyngu ar y graddau y gallai’r ymgynghorwyr baratoi cynlluniau busnes gyda’r ffermwyr ac, felly, mae’r cynnydd ar y dechrau wedi ymddangos yn gyfyngedig ar brydiau. Er hynny, bu galw mawr am gynlluniau busnes, a chafwyd dros 4,000 o geisiadau. Mae’r gwaith wedi dechrau ar fwy na 1,800 o’r cynlluniau hyn, a chwblhawyd dros 360 o gynlluniau busnes. Yr ydym yn ystyried dulliau o symleiddio’r gwasanaeth a lleihau oedi yn barhaus, ac mae gwelliannau i’r pecyn cynllunio busnes yn cael eu cyflwyno’n awr. Byddaf yn cwrdd cyn hir ag Awdurdod Datblygu Cymru, a ddatblygodd y mater hwn, i sicrhau ein bod yn cyflymu nifer yr ymweliadau gan ymgynghorwyr ac yn lleihau’r ôl-groniad.

Capital grants are also available through Farming Connect for farm improvement and diversification. These grants have been developed in partnership with other organisations such as the WDA, the Wales Tourist Board and the Forestry Commission, to provide a structured and co-ordinated service to farmers. The farm improvement and farm enterprise grants are dependent, of course, on the completion of a farm business plan. As a result, progress has initially been slow, but we have now received over 160 grant applications, resulting in 42 approvals. Processing and marketing grants are now available, and the WDA food directorate, which is administering the scheme on our behalf, is in active discussions with a considerable number of companies and has approved 20 applications across Wales, representing £17.3 million of new investment. A total of £3.2 million of this investment relates to non Objective 1 areas and represents three projects—in Deeside, Wrexham and Cardiff.

Mae grantiau cyfalaf ar gael hefyd drwy Cyswllt Ffermio ar gyfer gwelliannau i ffermydd ac arallgyfeirio. Datblygwyd y grantiau hyn mewn partneriaeth â chyrff eraill fel y WDA, Bwrdd Croeso Cymru a’r Comisiwn Coedwigaeth, i ddarparu gwasanaeth trefnus a chydlynol i ffermwyr. Mae’r grantiau gwella ffermydd a mentrau fferm yn ddibynnol, wrth gwrs, ar gwblhau cynllun busnes fferm. Oherwydd hynny, araf fu’r cynnydd ar y dechrau, ond erbyn hyn mae dros 160 o geisiadau am grant wedi dod i law, a chymeradwywyd 42 o ganlyniad. Mae grantiau prosesu a marchnata ar gael yn awr, ac mae cyfarwyddiaeth bwyd y WDA, sy’n gweinyddu’r cynllun ar ein rhan, yn cynnal trafodaethau gweithredol â nifer sylweddol o gwmnïau ac mae wedi cymeradwyo 20 o geisiadau ledled Cymru, sy’n golygu buddsoddi £17.3 miliwn o’r newydd. Mae cyfanswm o £3.2 miliwn o’r buddsoddiad hwn yn gysylltiedig ag ardaloedd nad ydynt yn y rhanbarth Amcan 1 ac mae ar gyfer tri phrosiect—yng Nglannau Dyfrdwy, Wrecsam a Chaerdydd.

Article 33 of the rural development regulation covers a total of 13 measures aimed at promoting wider rural development. Five of these measures are currently being implemented in Wales, and two of them are complementary to the capital grant scheme and Tir Gofal. For the other three measures, the Assembly is working with the WDA to develop proposals, and meetings will take place shortly. The emerging proposals will provide support for community partnerships for a range of activities. The aim is to enhance basic services for the rural economy and population, for the renovation and development of villages, for protection and conservation of rural heritage, and for the enhancement of the contribution that tourist and craft activities make to the rural economy, particularly those that will provide a high-value return from tourism or help to extend the tourist season in the area. I hope to be able to make a further announcement on my intention to assist in this area in the near future.

Mae erthygl 33 o’r rheoliad datblygu gwledig yn ymdrin â chyfanswm o 13 o fesurau sydd â’r amcan o hyrwyddo datblygu gwledig mwy cyffredinol. Gweithredir pump o’r mesurau hyn yng Nghymru ar hyn o bryd, ac mae dau ohonynt yn ategu’r cynllun grant cyfalaf a Tir Gofal. O ran y tri mesur arall, mae’r Cynulliad yn gweithio gyda’r WDA i ddatblygu cynigion, a chynhelir cyfarfodydd cyn hir. Bydd y cynigion sy’n datblygu’n rhoi cymorth i bartneriaethau cymunedol ar gyfer amryw o weithgareddau. Y nod yw gwella’r gwasanaethau sylfaenol i’r economi wledig a’r boblogaeth, i adnewyddu a datblygu pentrefi, i ddiogelu a chadw’r dreftadaeth wledig, ac i hybu cyfraniad gweithgareddau crefft a thwristaidd i’r economi wledig, yn enwedig y rhai a fydd yn rhoi adenillion o werth uchel o dwristiaeth neu’n helpu i ymestyn y tymor ymwelwyr yn yr ardal. Yr wyf yn gobeithio gallu gwneud cyhoeddiad pellach ar fy mwriad i roi cymorth yn y maes hwn yn y dyfodol agos.

In some aspects, progress in implementing the plan has not been as rapid as we would have liked, but no-one could have predicted the outbreak of foot and mouth disease and its effect on the plan’s progress. Nevertheless, total expenditure under the plan is close to our original forecasts for the first two years, with substantial spending on support for less-favoured areas and on agri-environment schemes, including Tir Gofal and the organic farming scheme. In total, public expenditure of over £90 million had been incurred by the end of 2001. For those measures most seriously affected by the consequential effects of foot and mouth disease, the momentum is increasing as a result of the substantial efforts made to make up for the five months lost as a result of the outbreak. I am confident that all the measures being implemented will see full delivery in the current financial year.

Mewn rhai agweddau, ni fu’r cynnydd a wnaed ar weithredu’r cynllun mor gyflym ag y byddem wedi dymuno, ond ni allai neb fod wedi rhagweld argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau a’i effaith ar gynnydd y cynllun. Er hynny, mae cyfanswm y gwariant dan y cynllun yn agos i’n rhagolygon gwreiddiol ar gyfer y ddwy flynedd cyntaf, gyda gwariant sylweddol ar gymorth i’r ardaloedd llai ffafriol ac ar gynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd, gan gynnwys Tir Gofal a’r cynllun ffermio organig. At ei gilydd, cafwyd dros £90 miliwn o wariant cyhoeddus erbyn diwedd 2001. Yn achos y mesurau hynny yr oedd canlyniadau clwy’r traed a’r genau wedi effeithio arnynt waethaf, mae’r momentwm yn cynyddu o ganlyniad i’r ymdrechion sylweddol i wneud iawn am y pum mis a gollwyd oherwydd yr argyfwng. Yr wyf yn ffyddiog y caiff yr holl fesurau sydd ar waith eu gweithredu’n llawn yn y flwyddyn ariannol gyfredol.

I now turn to the amendments, and start with Jonathan Morgan’s amendment 1. We should note the progress made to date with approval. This is a substantial programme with many benefits for rural Wales that has been subject to a difficult start. No-one could have foreseen the outbreak of foot and mouth disease or the extent of the problems that would arise as a consequence, yet we managed to commit and spend £90 million of the £100 million available in that financial year. As already stated, substantial efforts continue to be made to make up for the delays suffered by the programme. It is therefore correct to acknowledge the efforts of the agriculture industry in Wales, civil servants, agencies and others who have been helping to progress the development of this programme. Progress made in the light of these difficulties is the result of substantial effort by individuals across Wales. Therefore I reject amendment 1.

Trof yn awr at y gwelliannau gan ddechrau â gwelliant 1 Jonathan Morgan. Fe ddylem nodi â chymeradwyaeth y cynnydd a wnaed hyd yn hyn. Rhaglen sylweddol yw hon ac iddi lawer o fanteision i’r Gymru wledig a gafodd ddechrau anodd. Ni allasai neb ragweld argyfwng clwy’r traed a’r genau neu raddau’r problemau a godai o ganlyniad, eto llwyddasom i neilltuo a gwario £90 miliwn o’r £100 miliwn a oedd ar gael yn y flwyddyn ariannol honno. Fel y dywedais eisoes, gwneir ymdrechion mawr o hyd i wneud iawn am yr oedi a ddioddefodd y rhaglen. Gan hynny, mae’n gywir cydnabod ymdrechion y diwydiant amaethyddiaeth yng Nghymru, y gweision sifil, yr asiantaethau ac eraill a gynorthwyodd i hyrwyddo datblygiad y rhaglen hon. Mae’r cynnydd a wnaed yng ngolwg yr anawsterau hyn yn ganlyniad i gryn ymdrech gan unigolion ledled Cymru. Felly gwrthodaf welliant 1.

Amendment 2 takes no account of the difficulties the programme has experienced and the significant progress that has been made by the variety of agencies, bodies and individuals, despite the problems faced. Therefore I will reject amendment 2. I will also reject amendment 3, because there is substantial support for agri-environment provision. Tir Gofal is an all-Wales scheme and makes available some £12 million per annum—a budget that is steadily increasing. The organic farming scheme is also an all-Wales scheme and makes available a further £2.7 million per annum. In addition, there are ongoing agri-environment schemes worth a further £10 million per annum. These schemes encourage environmentally-friendly best practice. However, we continue to look for opportunities to further these aims.

Nid yw gwelliant 2 yn rhoi unrhyw ystyriaeth o gwbl i’r anawsterau a brofodd y rhaglen a’r cynnydd sylweddol a wnaed gan y gwahanol asiantaethau, cyrff ac unigolion, er gwaethaf y problemau a wynebwyd. Felly gwrthodaf welliant 2. Gwrthodaf hefyd welliant 3, gan fod cryn gefnogaeth i’r ddarpariaeth amaeth-amgylchedd. Mae Tir Gofal yn gynllun i Gymru gyfan ac mae’n darparu tua £12 miliwn y flwyddyn—cyllideb sy’n graddol gynyddu. Mae’r cynllun ffermio organig yn gynllun i Gymru gyfan hefyd ac mae’n darparu £2.7 miliwn bellach y flwyddyn. Yn ogystal â hynny, mae cynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd yn mynd rhagddynt sy’n werth £10 miliwn y flwyddyn ymhellach. Mae’r cynlluniau hyn yn hybu’r arfer gorau sy’n ystyriol o’r amgylchedd. Er hynny, parhawn i chwilio am gyfleoedd i hyrwyddo’r nodau hyn ymhellach.

I reject amendment 4 because it deals with a technical term used frequently and obviously in European Commission proposals. Just as we have ‘west Wales and the Valleys’, so we have ‘east Wales’. It is simply a matter of the way in which we phrase these matters.

Gwrthodaf welliant 4 gan ei fod yn trafod term technegol a arferir yn aml ac yn amlwg yng nghynlluniau’r Comisiwn Ewropeaidd. Yn union fel y mae gennym ‘gorllewin Cymru a’r Cymoedd’, felly hefyd y mae gennym ‘dwyrain Cymru’. Nid yw ond yn fater o’r modd yr ydym yn geirio’r materion hyn.

Finally, I am grateful for the efforts of all during this difficult period, in contributing to the plan’s progress and ensuring a successful outcome.

Yn olaf, yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am ymdrechion pawb yn ystod y cyfnod anodd hwn, wrth gyfrannu at gynnydd y cynllun a sicrhau canlyniad llwyddiannus.

Cynog Dafis siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 57

Cynog Dafis spoken in Welsh p. 57

Pwynt o drefn. Yr ydym wedi gweld rhywbeth am y tro cyntaf heddiw, gan fod Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Gwledig a Chymru Dramor wedi gosod ei reolau ei hun ar gymryd ymyriadau yn ystod ei araith. Fel arfer—

Point of order. The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Rural Development and Wales Abroad has set a precedent today as he set his own rules on taking interventions during his speech. Usually—

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 57

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 57

Order. It is up to the Minister whether or not he or she takes interventions. If you have anything additional to that point, you may raise it; otherwise, those are the rules, and you know them.

Trefn. Mater i’r Gweinidog yw a ydyw’n derbyn ymyriadau a’i peidio. Os oes gennych rywbeth yn ychwanegol at y pwynt hwnnw, cewch ei godi; fel arall, dyna’r rheolau, ac yr ydych yn eu gwybod.

Peter Rogers spoken in English p. 58

Peter Rogers siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I propose amendment 1 in the name of Jonathan Morgan. In paragraph 1, delete ‘notes, with approval, the progress’ and replace with ‘disapproves the inadequate progress’.

Cynigiaf welliant 1 yn enw Jonathan Morgan. Ym mharagraff 1, dileu ‘yn nodi, â chymeradwyaeth, y cynnydd’ a rhoi ‘yn siomedig gyda’r diffyg cynnydd’ yn ei le.

Peter Rogers (continued) spoken in English p. 58

Peter Rogers (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 58

I declare an interest as a partner in a farming business. I propose this amendment on the basis of commitment and solid facts. The switch to support agriculture in the form of environmental support is supposed to be the flagship of the coalition Government, and yet delivery on payment processing and scheme renewal is a shambles. Mike, how could you have read your speech with such a straight face? On your first day in office, you must have received a batch of correspondence from me concerning non-payment of environmentally sensitive area payments, amounting to many thousands of pounds owed to farmers. In addition to this, the majority of capital grant scheme claims, where farmers pay up-front and claim money back, are still outstanding. This further increases agricultural borrowing. Worse than that is the failure of officials to renew the five-year schemes, which means not only that standard payments will not be made, but that no more capital grant schemes can commence. This jeopardises rural jobs, in such areas as stone masonry, hedge laying, fencing, gate erection, hedge renovation, tree planting, and the creation of river corridors.

Datganaf fuddiant fel partner mewn busnes ffermio. Cynigiaf y gwelliant hwn ar sail ymrwymiad a ffeithiau cadarn. Mae’r newid i gynorthwyo amaethyddiaeth ar ffurf cymorth amgylcheddol i fod yn fater o bwys mawr i’r Llywodraeth glymblaid, ac eto mae’r gweithredu ar brosesu taliadau ac adnewyddu cynlluniau’n llanastr. Mike, sut y gallech ddarllen eich araith gan gadw wyneb syth? Ar eich diwrnod cyntaf yn eich swydd, mae’n rhaid eich bod wedi derbyn swp o ohebiaeth oddi wrthyf am daliadau ardal amgylchedd arbennig a oedd heb eu talu, a oedd yn dod i filoedd lawer o bunnoedd sy’n ddyledus i ffermwyr. Yn ogystal â hynny, mae’r rhan fwyaf o hawliadau’r cynllun grant cyfalaf, lle y mae ffermwyr yn talu’n gyntaf ac yn hawlio arian yn ôl, yn dal i fod yn ddyledus. Mae hyn yn ychwanegu eto at fenthyca amaethyddol. Gwaeth na hynny yw methiant y swyddogion i adnewyddu’r cynlluniau pum mlynedd, sy’n golygu na wneir y taliadau safonol, a hefyd nad oes modd i ragor o gynlluniau grant cyfalaf ddechrau. Mae hynny’n peryglu swyddi gwledig, mewn meysydd fel gwaith saer maen, gosod gwrychoedd, ffensio, gosod gatiau, adfer gwrychoedd, plannu coed, a chreu coridorau afonydd.

Over 12 months ago, I raised in the Assembly the issue of the serious problem at divisional office level regarding the processing and acceptance of these schemes and claims. No party, other than my own, supported my amendment calling for a review of the Assembly divisional offices. However, the following day, Mike, your spokesman on agriculture in the Assembly, Mick Bates, raised this very issue in The Western Mail. This is the same person who this week called for an inquiry into foot and mouth disease, yet voted against an inquiry in the Assembly. Clearly, the Liberal Democrats would rather prop up a Labour administration than make any principled stand for rural Wales, and you should all be ashamed of yourselves.

Dros 12 mis yn ôl, codais yn y Cynulliad fater y broblem ddifrifol ar lefel y swyddfeydd adrannol ynghylch prosesu a derbyn y cynlluniau a’r hawliadau hyn. Ni chefnogodd yr un blaid, heblaw fy un i, fy ngwelliant a alwai am adolygiad o swyddfeydd adrannol y Cynulliad. Er hynny, drannoeth, Mike, fe gododd eich llefarydd ar amaethyddiaeth yn y Cynulliad, Mick Bates, yr union fater hwn yn The Western Mail. Dyma’r un unigolyn a alwodd yr wythnos hon am ymchwiliad i glwy’r traed a’r genau, ond a bleidleisiodd yn erbyn ymchwiliad yn y Cynulliad. Mae’n amlwg ei bod yn well gan y Democratiaid Rhyddfrydol gynnal breichiau gweinyddiaeth Lafur na gwneud safiad egwyddorol o unrhyw fath dros y Gymru wledig, a dylai pob un ohonoch deimlo cywilydd.

I am not criticising the staff or working practices of divisional offices; I want the inadequate equipment and training to be improved so that it can cope with the extraordinary circumstances that staff must now deal with.

Nid wyf yn beirniadu’r staff neu arferion gweithio’r swyddfeydd adrannol; yr wyf am weld gwella’r offer a’r hyfforddiant annigonol fel y gallant ymdopi â’r amgylchiadau eithriadol y mae’r staff yn gorfod eu hwynebu ar hyn o bryd.

In the last few days, it has come to my attention that alpha numeric tagging in the cattle tracing system has changed. The letters have been replaced with numbers. Unfortunately, as the numbers no longer fit in the boxes provided, papers cannot be scanned and must be processed manually. That burden on staff is unacceptable, with the likely consequences that there will be a backlog in grant payments for the balance of the beef special premium and the suckler cow premium schemes.

Yn yr ychydig ddyddiau diwethaf, tynnwyd fy sylw at y ffaith bod y tagio llythyren-a-rhif yn y system olrhain gwartheg wedi newid. Rhoddwyd rhifau yn lle’r llythrennau. Gwaetha’r modd, gan nad yw’r rhifau’n ffitio’n awr i’r blychau a ddarparwyd, ni ellir sganio’r papurau a rhaid eu prosesu â llaw. Mae’r baich hwnnw ar staff yn annerbyniol, ac mae’n debygol y bydd y gwaith yn pentyrru ar daliadau grant ar gyfer gweddill y cynlluniau premiwm arbennig eidion a phremiwm buchod sugno o ganlyniad i hynny.

On Farming Connect, money is not getting through. I have heard how much money you are putting into the scheme but, as you know, it is bogged down with bureaucracy. The business advisers, in the main, are not up to the job. They do not understand the agricultural systems, and their only advice is either to go into Tir Gofal, with its two-year waiting list, or into organic conversions, which is causing disaster in the industry.

Ynghylch Cyswllt Ffermio, nid yw’r arian yn cyrraedd ffermwyr. Clywais faint o arian yr ydych yn ei roi i’r cynllun ond, fel y gwyddoch, mae’n mynd yn sownd mewn cors fiwrocrataidd. At ei gilydd, nid yw’r ymgynghorwyr busnes yn ateb y gofyn. Nid ydynt yn deall y systemau amaethyddol, a’u hunig gyngor yw y dylid naill ai ymuno â Thir Gofal, â’i restr aros o ddwy flynedd, neu’r newidiadau organig, sy’n achosi trychineb yn y diwydiant.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 59

Rhodri Glyn Thomas spoken in Welsh p. 59

Cynigiaf welliannau 2, 3 a 4 yn enw Jocelyn Davies. Gwelliant 2: yn llinell 1, dileu ‘, â chymeradwyaeth,’.

I propose amendments 2, 3 and 4 in the name of Jocelyn Davies. Amendment 2: In line 1, delete ‘, with approval,’.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 59

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 59

Cynigiaf welliant 3. Yn llinell 2, dileu ‘sy’n cynnwys darpariaeth’ a rhoi ‘ac yn galw am ddarpariaeth ddigonol’ yn ei le.

I propose amendment 3. In line 2 delete ‘which includes’ and replace with ‘and calls for adequate’.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 60

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 60

Cynigiaf welliant 4. Yn llinell 3, dileu ‘dwyrain Cymru’ a rhoi ‘y Dwyrain’ yn ei le.

I propose amendment 4. In line 3, delete ‘east Wales’ and replace with ‘the East’.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (parhad) siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 60

Rhodri Glyn Thomas (continued) spoken in Welsh p. 60

Ar ran grŵp Plaid Cymru, mynegaf ein siom fod y Gweinidog wedi gwrthod caniatáu ymyrraeth yn ystod ei araith agoriadol, a’i fod am gyfyngu hynny at ei araith gloi. Golyga hynny na chaiff y rheini ohonom sy’n siarad ar ei ôl y cyfle i fynegi barn ar ei ymateb i ambell ymyriad. Byddai hynny wedi bod yn ddiddorol a dadlennol.

On behalf of the Plaid Cymru group, I express our disappointment that the Minister refused to take interventions during his opening speech, and that he will confine them to his closing speech. As a result, those of us who will speak after him will not have the chance to express a view on his response to various interventions. That would have been interesting and informative.

O ran y cynllun datblygu gwledig, mae Cyswllt Ffermio yn cynnig tri chynllun cymhorthdal cyfalaf, gan gynnwys y grant menter ffermydd, a’r grant gwella ffermydd. Oherwydd clwy’r traed a’r genau, nid oedd yn bosibl i nifer o bobl geisio am y cymorthdaliadau yn 2001. Gyda’r cymhorthdal ar gyfer prosesu a marchnata, dim ond un cynllun, hyd y gwn i, sydd wedi’i gymeradwyo yn y sector hwnnw. Beth sy’n digwydd gyda’r arian a oedd ar gael ar gyfer y cymorthdaliadau sydd heb ei wario dros y flwyddyn ariannol ddiwethaf? A yw’r arian ar gael o hyd, neu a yw wedi’i golli?

In terms of the rural development plan, Farming Connect offers three capital subsidy schemes, including the farm enterprise grant and the farm improvement grant. It was not possible for many people to apply for the subsidies in 2001 because of foot and mouth disease. As for the grant for processing and marketing, to my knowledge only one scheme has been approved in that sector. What is being done with the money that was available for those grants, which was not spent during the last financial year? Is the money still available, or has it been decommitted?

O ran Tir Mynydd, yn 2003, fel y gŵyr y Gweinidog, bydd y rhwyd ddiogelwch yn gostwng i 50 y cant. Caiff hynny effaith fawr ar sawl fferm yng Nghymru yn yr ardaloedd llai ffafriol, yn enwedig y ffermydd hynny sydd wedi buddsoddi yn y tir, ac wedi’i feithrin i fod yn addas ar gyfer cadw da byw arno. Gyda’r newid hwnnw, bydd rhai o’r ffermydd cymharol fach, sydd wedi buddsoddi’n helaeth yn y tir, ar eu colled, tra bo ffermydd mwy, gyda thir anaddas ar gyfer pori, yn elwa o’r sefyllfa. A yw’r Gweinidog yn hapus gyda hynny?

On Tir Mynydd, in 2003, as the Minister knows, the safety net will fall to 50 per cent. That will have a great impact on many farms in less-favoured areas of Wales, especially those farms that have invested in the land, and have cultivated it so that it is suitable for livestock. As a result of that change, some relatively small farms that have invested heavily in their land will lose out, while larger farms, with land unsuitable for grazing, will benefit. Is the Minister happy with that?

A wnaiff ddweud wrthym a fydd elfen 2 Tir Mynydd yn diogelu ffermydd o ran y dwysedd stocio, i sicrhau bod diwydiant cynhyrchu Cymru yn parhau? Derbyniaf yr hyn a ddywed; wrth gwrs bod yn rhaid symud y pwyslais oddi ar gynhyrchu i’r amgylchedd a chynaliadwyedd. Fodd bynnag, wedi dweud hynny, hyderaf y bydd y Gweinidog yn cytuno bod yn rhaid cadw’r diwydiant cynhyrchu.

Will he tell us whether element 2 of Tir Mynydd will safeguard farms in terms of stock density, to ensure that Wales’s production industry continues? I accept what he says; of course we must shift the emphasis away from production and onto the environment and sustainability. However, having said that, I am confident that the Minister will agree that we must safeguard the production industry.

Cyfyd sawl cwestiwn o ran Tir Gofal. Fe’i disgrifiwyd i ddechrau fel cynllun Cymreig a oedd yn ymwneud ag anghenion Cymru. Fodd bynnag, gwyddom erbyn hyn nad oes modd derbyn pob fferm yng Nghymru i’r cynllun hwn. Fel y cyfaddefodd y Gweinidog ei hun, mae oedi mawr gyda phrosesu ceisiadau rhai o’r ffermydd hyn. Soniodd ei ragflaenydd, Carwyn Jones, y byddai ychwanegiad o £1.5 miliwn yn y gyllideb dros y tair blynedd nesaf, ond mae dwy flynedd o oedi o hyd o ran ymuno â’r cynllun.

Many questions arise in relation to Tir Gofal. It was initially described as a Welsh scheme responding to Welsh needs. However, we know by now that all farms in Wales cannot enter this scheme. As the Minister himself admitted, there are lengthy delays in processing some of these farms’ applications. His predecessor, Carwyn Jones, said that there would be an additional £1.5 million in the budget over the next three years, but there remains a two-year wait to enter this scheme.

A wnaiff dderbyn bod angen rhagor o gyllid ar y cynllun hwn, ac a wnaiff esbonio’r broblem sy’n bodoli, o ystyried bod gan Gymru’r gallu, yn enwedig o fewn ardaloedd Amcan 1, i gefnogi Tir Gofal i raddau llawer mwy, gyda chymorthdaliadau Ewropeaidd? Pam na allwn wneud hynny? Gellid sicrhau hyd at 75 y cant o gymorthdal Ewropeaidd ar gyfer Tir Gofal mewn ardaloedd Amcan 1. Pam nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn barod i fanteisio ar hynny?

Will he accept that further funding is needed for this scheme, and will he also explain the existing problem, given that Wales has the ability, particularly in Objective 1 areas, to support Tir Gofal to a far greater extent with European subsidies? Why can we not do that? It is possible to secure 75 per cent in European subsidy for Tir Gofal in the Objective 1 areas. Why is the Government of Wales unwilling to take advantage of that?

Cyfeiriaf yn fyr at fodiwleiddio. Yr wyf wedi clywed y Gweinidog yn gwarantu y daw arian cyfatebol llawn ar gyfer modiwleiddio o’r Trysorlys yn San Steffan. Gobeithiaf y gall gadarnhau hynny wrth iddo gloi’r ddadl. Cyfeiriaf yn gyflym at ffermio organig. Y nod yw sicrhau bod 10 y cant o gynnyrch Cymru yn organig erbyn 2005. Fis Ebrill eleni, dim ond 3 y cant o ffermydd Cymru a oedd yn cynhyrchu’n organig. Beth y mae’r Gweinidog am ei wneud i wireddu’r nod a osodwyd?

I will refer briefly to modulation. I have heard the Minister giving a guarantee that full match funding from the Treasury in Westminster will be available for modulation. I hope that he will be able to confirm that in his closing remarks. I will make a brief reference to organic farming. The aim is to ensure that 10 per cent of Welsh produce is organic by 2005. In April of this year, only 3 per cent of Welsh farms were producing organically. How will the Minister reach this target?

Alison Halford spoken in English p. 61

Alison Halford siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 61

Although Delyn is not the most rural constituency in Wales, I have paid close attention to the rural development plan. All schemes under this plan have brought great benefit to the people of Wales, and I welcome this opportunity to give my view on what is going well and what needs improvement. Farming Connect, although sadly delayed by foot and mouth disease until last September, has made a big impact. Diversification is the key to modern farming, and I am happy to see that more than 100 applications have been received for farm enterprise and improvement grants. Tying the promotion of diversification in with training has been essential. Today’s modern farmer must have business sense and husbandry skills. The key to further progress is advertising and communicating the benefits of diversification. Co-operatives and clustering are two good ways for the small farmer to boost production and reduce costs. In my constituency, I remember farm overstocking that led to many old sheep suffering badly as they were unable to eat because their teeth were falling out—reminiscent of what is happening with me—but it should never occur again.

Er nad Delyn yw’r etholaeth fwyaf gwledig yng Nghymru, yr wyf wedi talu sylw manwl ar y cynllun datblygu gwledig. Mae’r holl gynlluniau dan y cynllun hwn wedi dod â budd mawr i bobl Cymru, a chroesawaf y cyfle hwn i roi fy marn am yr hyn sy’n mynd yn dda a’r hyn y mae angen ei wella. Mae Cyswllt Ffermio, er iddo gael ei ohirio, gwaetha’r modd, oherwydd clwy’r traed a’r genau tan fis Medi diwethaf, wedi cael effaith fawr. Mae arallgyfeirio’n allweddol i ffermio cyfoes, ac yr wyf yn falch o weld bod mwy na 100 o geisiadau wedi dod i law am grantiau menter a gwella ffermydd. Mae wedi bod yn hollbwysig cysylltu’r gwaith o hyrwyddo arallgyfeirio â hyfforddiant. Rhaid i’r ffermwr cyfoes wrth synnwyr busnes a sgiliau hwsmona. Yr allwedd i gynnydd pellach yw hysbysebu a chyfleu buddion arallgyfeirio. Mae mentrau cydweithredol a chlystyru’n ddau ddull da i’r fferm fach hybu cynhyrchu a lleihau costau. Yn fy etholaeth i, cofiaf y gorstocio a fu ar ffermydd a barodd ddioddefaint mawr i lawer o hen ddefaid am na allent fwyta am eu bod yn colli eu dannedd—sy’n dwyn i gof yr hyn sy’n digwydd i mi—ond ni ddylai ddigwydd byth eto.

I am happy that Tir Gofal’s aims of improving and protecting our wildlife and heritage, and allowing more people access to the countryside, is being met. Two thousand additional heritage sites and over 700 kilometres of new pathways cannot be bad. I would have liked to have seen Delyn protect more habitats by now, but that is in the offing. However, the popularity of the scheme shows that there was a clear need, and I know that more money will have to go into the pot and that the need will be met.

Yr wyf yn hapus bod nodau Tir Gofal o wella a diogelu ein bywyd gwyllt a’n treftadaeth, a chaniatáu mynediad i fwy o bobl i gefn gwlad, yn cael eu cyflawni. Ni ellir cwyno am 2,000 o safleoedd treftadaeth ychwanegol a thros 700 cilomedr o lwybrau newydd. Byddwn wedi hoffi gweld Delyn yn diogelu mwy o gynefinoedd erbyn hyn, ond mae hynny mewn golwg. Fodd bynnag, mae poblogrwydd y cynllun yn dangos bod angen pendant, a gwn y bydd yn rhaid rhoi mwy o arian yn y pwrs ac y caiff yr angen ei ddiwallu.

Organic farming is commendable. Has the Minister made a decision on whether to provide annual assistance funding for those farmers who have only recently converted to organic farming? The organic farming scheme has made a difference, because, as has been said, over 550 farms have decided to go organic since its establishment. However, if we are to boost organic farming in Wales, there must be a way of increasing incentives further.

Mae ffermio organig yn ganmoladwy. A yw’r Gweinidog wedi penderfynu a fydd yn darparu cyllid i roi cymorth bob blwyddyn i’r ffermwyr sydd ond wedi troi at ffermio organig yn ddiweddar? Mae’r cynllun ffermio organig wedi gwneud gwahaniaeth, oherwydd, fel y dywedwyd, penderfynodd dros 550 o ffermydd fynd yn organig ers ei sefydlu. Er hynny, os ydym i hybu ffermio organig yng Nghymru, mae’n rhaid bod modd cynyddu’r anogaethau ymhellach.

A few months ago, I was delighted to invite Pren Cymru to make a presentation to the Economic Development Committee. It gave its views on making a business out of Welsh wood. Many of its ideas were innovative, especially with the newly reformed part L in housing building regulations that requires more use of wood. However, we have discovered that Welsh wood is unable to fully compete because it has too many knots in it, and therefore is undesirable. Creating more and more diverse woodlands is a popular objective, but how can such hurdles be overcome? I welcome the chance to comment on this plan. It makes a valuable and essential contribution to the future welfare of our rural communities, and enables our rural businesses to adapt and change in the face of challenges. Please listen to what is going on, and stop being negative.

Ychydig fisoedd yn ôl, yr oeddwn yn falch iawn o wahodd Pren Cymru i roi cyflwyniad i’r Pwyllgor Datblygu Economaidd. Rhoddodd ei farn ar sut i droi coed Cymru’n fusnes. Yr oedd llawer o’i syniadau’n arloesol, yn enwedig mewn cysylltiad â rhan L yn y rheoliadau adeiladu tai a ddiwygiwyd yn ddiweddar, sy’n mynnu mwy o ddefnydd o goed. Fodd bynnag, yr ydym wedi darganfod nad yw coed Cymru’n gallu cystadlu’n llawn am fod gormod o geinciau ynddo, a’i fod yn annerbyniol oherwydd hynny. Un nod boblogaidd yw creu mwy a mwy o goetiroedd amrywiol, ond sut y gellir goresgyn rhwystrau o’r fath? Croesawaf y cyfle i wneud sylw am y cynllun hwn. Mae’n gwneud cyfraniad gwerthfawr a hollbwysig i les ein cymunedau gwledig at y dyfodol, ac yn galluogi ein busnesau gwledig i addasu a newid yn wyneb yr heriau. Gwrandewch ar yr hyn sy’n digwydd a pheidiwch â bod yn negyddol.

Elin Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 63

Elin Jones spoken in Welsh p. 63

Siaradaf am ffermwyr ifanc. Nid oes cynnydd yn yr adroddiad hwn ynglŷn â throsglwyddo ffermydd o’r to hŷn i’r to ifanc, gan nad yw cynllun mynediad ffermwyr ifanc yn rhan o gynllun datblygu gwledig y Llywodraeth glymblaid. Dyma’r amser, o bosibl, i’r Gweinidog newydd roi stamp ar y cynllun datblygu gwledig a chyflwyno cynllun mynediad ar gyfer ffermwyr ifanc.

I will concentrate on young farmers. This report shows no progress on transferring farms from the older to the younger generation, because a young entrants’ scheme is not part of the coalition Government’s rural development plan. This might be the time for the new Minister to put his stamp on the rural development plan and introduce an entrants scheme for young farmers.

Mae’r cynllun presennol yn anfanteisio ambell ffermwr ifanc newydd. Er enghraifft, cymerodd ffermwr ifanc fferm drosodd yn ardal Tregaron, yn 1999 a oedd yn rhy hwyr i fod yn gymwys am lwfans iawndal da byw tir uchel yn y flwyddyn honno. Yn 2000 yr oedd yn gymwys am daliadau Tir Mynydd, ond, yn wahanol i’r ffermwyr eraill yn ardal Tregaron yn eu 50au a’u 60au—y rhan fwyaf ohonynt heb forgeisi o bosibl—nid oedd y ffermwr ifanc newydd hwn yn ei 30au yn gymwys am y rhwyd ddiogelwch o 90 y cant o daliadau lwfans iawndal da byw tir uchel y flwyddyn flaenorol. Felly, yr oedd yn derbyn sawl mil o bunnoedd yn llai o daliadau Tir Mynydd na ffermwyr a oedd yn y busnes ers sawl blwyddyn. Ysgrifennais at y cyn Weinidog dros Faterion Gwledig ynglŷn â’r annhegwch hwn yn y cynllun presennol, sy’n anfanteisio yr union bobl sydd fwyaf angen cymorth ariannol. Rhaid i’r Llywodraeth sicrhau y caiff pob cynllun o fewn y cynllun datblygu gwledig ei asesu i sicrhau na chaiff newydd-ddyfodiaid eu hanfanteisio.

The current plan puts some new young farmers at a disadvantage. For example, a young farmer took over a farm in the Tregaron area in 1999 and was too late to qualify for hill livestock compensatory allowance that year. In 2000 he was eligible for Tir Mynydd payments, but, in contrast to the other farmers in the Tregaron area in their 50s and 60s—most of whom probably do not have mortgages—this new young farmer in his 30s was not eligible for the safety net of 90 per cent of the previous year’s hill livestock compensatory allowance payments. Therefore, he received several thousand pounds less in Tir Mynydd payments than farmers who had been in the business for several years. I wrote to the former Minister for Rural Affairs about this inequity in the present scheme, which places the very people who most need financial assistance at a disadvantage. The Government must ensure that every scheme in the rural development plan is assessed to ensure that newcomers are not disadvantaged.

Mae trosglwyddo ffermydd o un genhedlaeth i’r nesaf yn bwysig am sawl rheswm. Un yw’r sefydlogrwydd a ddaw i’r iaith Gymraeg, yng nghymunedau’r Gorllewin yn benodol. Bu cryn drafod mewn sawl Pwyllgor ar ddyfodol yr iaith Gymraeg. Fodd bynnag, mae ffyniant amaethyddiaeth cyn bwysiced i’r Gymraeg yn y Gorllewin ag yw nifer o’r ffactorau eraill a drafodir. Mae canran uwch o siaradwyr Cymraeg mewn amaethyddiaeth nag mewn unrhyw ddiwydiant arall, ac, fel yr oedd cenedlaethau o lowyr yn trosglwyddo’r iaith yng nghymoedd y Gorllewin am flynyddoedd maith, felly hefyd mewn amaethyddiaeth. Mae sefydlogrwydd y Gymraeg yn ddibynnol ar sefydlogrwydd ambell ddiwydiant pwysig o un genhedlaeth i’r nesaf. Nid eistedd ar ben silff lyfrau yw dyfodol yr iaith Gymraeg, ond ymhlith pobl yn byw ac yn gweithio yn eu cymunedau.

The transfer of farms from one generation to the next is important for several reasons. One reason is the stability that it brings to the Welsh language, particularly in west Wales communities. There has been much discussion in several Committees about the future of the Welsh language. However, the viability of agriculture is as important to the Welsh language in west Wales as several other factors that are discussed. There is a higher percentage of Welsh speakers working in agriculture than in any other industry, and, just as generations of miners passed on the language in the valleys of west Wales, so it is with agriculture. The stability of the Welsh language is dependent on the stability, from one generation to the next, of a few important industries. The future of the Welsh language is not in lying on a bookshelf, but among people living and working in their communities.

Er bod y Llywodraeth glymblaid yn parhau i wrthod sefydlu cynllun mynediad i ffermwyr ifanc, cafwyd cyhoeddiad pur annisgwyl ond diddorol gan y cyn Weinidog dros Faterion Gwledig rai misoedd yn ôl. Nodwyd bod y Llywodraeth yn ystyried cynllun i brynu ffermydd gan ffermwyr sy’n ymddeol, ac yna’u gosod i ffermwyr iau. Ni roddwyd manylion, ond gobeithiaf y bydd y Gweinidog newydd, wrth ymateb heddiw, yn cadarnhau bwriad y Llywodraeth glymblaid i fod o gymorth gwirioneddol i ffermwyr ifanc. Gobeithio hefyd y gall roi rhywfaint o gig ar asgwrn yr hyn a gyflwynodd Carwyn Jones i’r Cynulliad ac ar deledu rai misoedd yn ôl, a oedd yn rhywfaint o gynnydd ym meddylfryd y Llywodraeth ar gefnogaeth i ffermwyr ifanc. Os mai cyflogi llai a llai o bobl mewn amaethyddiaeth yw nod y Llywodraeth, yna gwneud dim fel y mae ar hyn o bryd yw’r ffordd orau o wneud hynny. Os nad dyna’r bwriad, mae’n bryd i’r Gweinidog newydd gyflwyno gwelliant i’r cynllun datblygu gwledig, wedi’i gymeradwyo gan yr Undeb Ewropeaidd, a chynnwys cynllun mynediad i ffermwyr ifanc.

Although the coalition Government continues to refuse to establish a new entrants scheme for young farmers, an unexpected but interesting announcement was made by the former Minister for Rural Affairs some months ago. It noted that the Government was considering a scheme to buy farms from retiring farmers, and then let them to younger farmers. No details were given, but I hope that the new Minister will, in replying to today’s debate, confirm the coalition Government’s intent to be of real assistance to young farmers. I hope that he will also be able to put some meat on the bones of what Carwyn Jones presented to the Assembly and on television some months ago, which showed some progress in the Government’s thinking on supporting young farmers. If employing fewer and fewer people in agriculture is the Government’s aim, then doing nothing as it is at present is the best way to achieve that. If that is not the intention, it is time for the new Minister to introduce an amendment to the rural development plan, approved by the European Union, and include a new entrants scheme for young farmers.

Mick Bates spoken in English p. 65

Mick Bates siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 65

I declare an interest as a partner in a farm business.

Datganaf fuddiant fel partner mewn busnes ffermio.

For those of us who passionately believe in the need to regenerate our rural communities, this rural development plan is a fundamental part of the process. The vision is underpinned by our desire for a sustainable society, with the consequence of retaining the language and culture, which is fundamentally based in the agricultural economy. However, the vision needs a more integrated approach. The integrated vision in ‘Rural Scotland: A New Approach’ is an excellent model. I hope that the new cross-cutting rural regeneration group will examine that document and produce a fully integrated vision. Many of us still feel the loss of the Development Board for Rural Wales and sincerely hope that this rural regeneration group will bring an increasing focus on delivery.

I’r sawl ohonom sy’n credu’n angerddol yn yr angen i adfywio ein cymunedau gwledig, mae’r cynllun datblygu gwledig yn rhan annatod o’r broses. Ategir y weledigaeth gan ein hawydd am gymdeithas gynaliadwy, fel y cedwir yr iaith a’r diwylliant, sydd â’i gwreiddiau yn yr economi amaethyddol. Fodd bynnag, mae angen dull mwy integredig ar gyfer y weledigaeth. Mae’r dull gweithredu integredig yn ‘Rural Scotland: A New Approach’ yn fodel rhagorol. Gobeithiaf y bydd y grŵp adfywio gwledig trawsbynciol newydd yn archwilio’r ddogfen honno ac yn cynhyrchu gweledigaeth gwbl integredig. Mae nifer ohonom yn dal i weld colli Bwrdd Datblygu Cymru Wledig ac yr wyf yn gwir obeithio y bydd y grŵp adfywio gwledig hwn yn canolbwyntio’n fwyfwy ar weithredu.

In recent years farmers and the wider rural economy have suffered a succession of blows, from bovine spongiform encephalopathy to foot and mouth disease. Rural areas have also witnessed the closure of facilities and services, including post offices, petrol stations, village pubs and village schools. There is also an increasing problem with retaining young people in our communities. The rural development plan is therefore a vital part of the process of rejuvenating rural Wales. We desperately need to create a sustainable future for all people in rural areas and especially to open up vital opportunities for the young. I have great sympathy with Elin’s remarks about extra assistance for young farmers. Most people know that Farming Connect gives an extra 10 per cent to those aged under 40.

Yn y blynyddoedd diwethaf, mae ffermwyr a’r economi wledig ehangach wedi dioddef y naill ergyd ar ôl y llall, o enseffalopathi sbyngffurf buchol i glwy’r traed a’r genau. Yn ogystal â hynny, mae’r ardaloedd gwledig wedi gweld cau cyfleusterau a gwasanaethau, gan gynnwys swyddfeydd post, gorsafoedd petrol, tafarndai pentref ac ysgolion pentref. Mae problem gynyddol hefyd o ran cadw pobl ifanc yn ein cymunedau. Gan hynny, mae’r cynllun datblygu gwledig yn rhan hollbwysig o’r broses o adnewyddu’r Gymru wledig. Mae arnom daer angen creu dyfodol cynaliadwy i bawb yn yr ardaloedd gwledig ac, yn enwedig, datblygu cyfleoedd hollbwysig i bobl ifanc. Yr wyf yn cydymdeimlo’n fawr â sylwadau Elin am gymorth ychwanegol i ffermwyr ifanc. Gŵyr y rhan fwyaf fod Cyswllt Ffermio’n rhoi 10 y cant yn ychwanegol i’r rhai dan 40 oed.

We must accept that we are part of Europe and the global economy and we must make use of what makes Wales distinctive and use our strengths more positively. The processing and marketing grant scheme, for example, is aimed at improving the processing and marketing of products and increasing their competitiveness. Without commercial competitiveness, rural Wales does not have a sustainable economic future. The marketing and promotion of Welsh produce is crucial. I look forward to the Minister making proposals—in the autumn, I am sure—for greater local procurement in the public sector, because that will encourage greater co-operation among producers and a more business-like ethic. That will bring a much stronger commercial base to our rural businesses.

Rhaid inni dderbyn ein bod yn rhan o Ewrop ac o’r economi fyd-eang a rhaid inni ddefnyddio’r hyn sy’n gwneud Cymru’n wahanol ac arfer ein cryfderau’n fwy cadarnhaol. Amcan y cynllun grant prosesu a marchnata, er enghraifft, yw gwella’r prosesu a marchnata ar gynhyrchion a’u gwneud yn fwy cystadleuol. Os nad yw’n fasnachol gystadleuol, nid oes dyfodol economaidd cynaliadwy i’r Gymru wledig. Mae marchnata a hyrwyddo cynnyrch o Gymru’n hollbwysig. Edrychaf ymlaen at gynigion gan y Gweinidog—yn yr hydref, hyderaf—ar gyfer mwy o gaffael lleol yn y sector cyhoeddus, gan y bydd hynny’n hybu cydweithredu rhwng cynhyrchwyr ac etheg fusnes fwy effeithiol. Bydd hynny’n rhoi sylfaen fasnachol fwy cadarn i’n busnesau gwledig.

Agri-environmental schemes, such as Tir Gofal, are also central to achieving prosperity. However, Tir Gofal, despite its success and widespread approval, needs to be extended to allow more people to access agri-environmental schemes. That is crucial. I am pleased with the increased investment in Tir Gofal but we must allow another type of agri-environmental scheme to develop, which is accessible to all farmers. Tir Gofal is far too elitist.

Mae cynlluniau amaeth-amgylcheddol, fel Tir Gofal, yn hanfodol hefyd er mwyn sicrhau ffyniant. Fodd bynnag, er bod Tir Gofal yn llwyddiannus ac yn eang ei apêl, rhaid ei ymestyn fel y caiff mwy o bobl fynediad i gynlluniau amaeth-amgylcheddol. Mae hynny’n hollbwysig. Yr wyf yn falch o’r cynnydd yn y buddsoddiad yn Tir Gofal ond rhaid inni ganiatáu i fath arall o gynllun amaeth-amgylcheddol ddatblygu, y gall pob ffermwr ymuno ag ef. Mae Tir Gofal yn rhy elitaidd o lawer.

I think that all Members endorse the fundamental proposals to retain our great environment and rural heritage in Wales. We can all agree with those aims. I noted, Minister, that you said that you would make a further announcement about the partnership ethic in local communities. I look forward to that, because it will build on the great work done by the LEADER programmes. Community development is often at the heart of prosperity, which is borne of community regeneration.

Credaf fod yr holl Aelodau’n cefnogi’r cynigion sylfaenol i gadw ein hamgylchedd a’n treftadaeth wledig wych yng Nghymru. Gallwn oll gytuno ar y nodau hynny. Nodais, Weinidog, ichi ddweud y byddech yn gwneud datganiad pellach am etheg partneriaeth mewn cymunedau lleol. Edrychaf ymlaen at hynny, gan y bydd yn ychwanegu at y gwaith rhagorol a wnaed drwy’r rhaglenni LEADER. Mae datblygu cymunedol yn hanfodol i ffyniant yn aml, ac mae hynny’n deillio o adfywio cymunedol.

Farming Connect is also crucial to this process of bringing the business ethic to all our industries. It is an integral part of the plan and, as others have mentioned, it provides access to measures such as the farm improvement grant, the farm enterprise grant and the marketing and processing grant. However, as I have said to previous Ministers, those of us in east Wales are disadvantaged because we receive less support than farmers in the Objective 1 area.

Mae Cyswllt Ffermio yn hollbwysig hefyd i’r broses o ddod ag etheg busnes i’n holl ddiwydiannau. Mae’n rhan annatod o’r cynllun ac, fel y dywedodd eraill, mae’n fodd i gyrraedd mesurau fel y grant gwella ffermydd, y grant menter fferm a’r grant marchnata a phrosesu. Er hynny, fel yr wyf wedi dweud wrth Weinidogion blaenorol, mae’r sawl ohonom yn y Dwyrain o dan anfantais gan ein bod yn derbyn llai o gymorth na ffermwyr ardal Amcan 1.

There are also schemes supporting forestry and maintaining and developing forests. Our biomass strategy will be crucial in helping to develop renewable energy projects throughout Wales.

Mae cynlluniau hefyd i hybu coedwigaeth a chynnal a datblygu coedwigoedd. Bydd ein strategaeth fiomas yn hollbwysig o ran helpu i ddatblygu prosiectau ynni adnewyddadwy ledled Cymru.

The organic farming scheme is also welcome. However, we must encourage greater co-operation among producers to ensure investment in processing, so that Wales possesses the infrastructure to ensure added value. I also welcome the progress made in implementing the rural development plan; delays were caused by foot and mouth disease. The challenges are considerable, but we have a chance to create a prosperous rural Wales by working together, and, with a positive attitude, it can be done.

Mae’r cynllun ffermio organig i’w groesawu hefyd. Fodd bynnag, rhaid inni hybu mwy o gydweithredu ymysg y cynhyrchwyr i sicrhau buddsoddi mewn prosesu, fel bod Cymru’n meddu ar y seilwaith sydd ei angen i sicrhau gwerth ychwanegol. Yr wyf hefyd yn croesawu’r cynnydd a wnaed ar weithredu’r cynllun datblygu gwledig; bu oedi oherwydd clwy’r traed a’r genau. Mae heriau mawr, ond mae gennym gyfle i greu Cymru wledig lewyrchus drwy weithio gyda’n gilydd a gellir cyflawni hynny o gael agwedd gadarnhaol.

Glyn Davies spoken in English p. 67

Glyn Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 67

I declare an interest as my wife and I are partners in a farming business.

Datganaf fuddiant gan fod fy ngwraig a mi’n bartneriaid mewn busnes ffermio.

The rural development plan for Wales is a comprehensive strategy, based on many important aspects of rural development. However, for me, a central purpose of the plan is the development of agri-environmental policy. Wales is a beautiful country, with its mountains, rivers, coastlines and valleys, and we share it with a variety of other living creatures. We all survive—or do not survive—through a complex network of interdependence.

Mae’r cynllun datblygu gwledig i Gymru’n strategaeth gynhwysfawr, sy’n seiliedig ar sawl agwedd bwysig ar ddatblygu gwledig. Fodd bynnag, i mi, pwrpas canolog y cynllun yw datblygu polisi amaeth-amgylcheddol. Mae Cymru’n wlad brydferth, gyda’i mynyddoedd, ei hafonydd, ei harfordir a’i dyffrynnoedd, ac yr ydym yn ei rhannu ag amrywiaeth o greaduriaid eraill. Yr ydym oll yn goroesi—neu’n methu â goroesi—drwy rwydwaith cyd-ddibynnol cymhleth.

I was born on a hill farm in central Wales, and all my life I have lived off the land, in the sense that the countryside has been my living, home, sport and interest. Over the years, I have observed that many of the creatures with which I grew up have almost disappeared. When I was in my teens, working down ploughed land ready to sow oats, which was the standard crop at the time, I was invariably followed by a flock of lapwings, the most gymnastic flyers of the bird world. When I used to walk on the hills, the sky above would always have a skylark in full song, hovering frustratingly near the edge of my range of vision. We do not see skylarks or lapwings these days, nor do we see brown hares.

Fe’m ganed ar fferm yn y Canolbarth, a bûm yn byw ar y tir ar hyd fy oes, yn yr ystyr bod cefn gwlad yn fywoliaeth, yn gartref, yn ddifyrrwch ac yn ddiddordeb i mi. Dros y blynyddoedd, yr wyf wedi sylwi bod llawer o’r creaduriaid a oedd o’m cwmpas wrth imi dyfu bron â diflannu erbyn hyn. Pan oeddwn yn laslanc, yn gweithio ar dir âr yn barod i hau hadau ceirch, sef y cnwd arferol bryd hynny, fe’m dilynid yn ddieithriad gan haid o gornicyllod, y mwyaf chwim eu hehediad o’r holl adar. Pan arferwn gerdded y bryniau, byddai ehedydd bob amser yn yr awyr yn canu’n uchel, gan hofran yn bryfoclyd o agos i’m golwg. Ni welwn ehedyddion na chornicyllod y dyddiau hyn, nac ysgyfarnogod brown.

When I took over the family farm in 1976, I had never heard of an agri-environmental scheme, so I introduced my own version. It involved no fertilisers, minimum sprays, one late cut of harvest and lower stocking rates. My neighbours dismissed me as a bit of a crank. However, a decade later, agri-environmental schemes began to appear. In 1999, I saw the National Assembly’s rural development plan as a major step forward along the road towards my ultimate vision of all of rural Wales being managed under an agri-environment scheme. It will happen one day, but the rural development plan has not delivered the significant advance towards that vision for which I had hoped.

Pan gymerais drosodd fferm y teulu yn 1976, nid oeddwn erioed wedi clywed am gynllun amaeth-amgylcheddol, felly cyflwynais fy fersiwn fy hun. Yr oedd yn golygu dim gwrteithiau, y chwistrellu lleiaf posibl, un toriad hwyr o gynhaeaf a chyfraddau stocio is. Yr oedd fy nghymdogion yn fy wfftio gan fy ystyried yn dipyn o granc. Fodd bynnag, ddegawd yn ddiweddarach, dechreuodd y cynlluniau amaeth-amgylcheddol ymddangos. Yn 1999, barnais fod cynllun datblygu gwledig y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol yn gam mawr ymlaen tuag at fy ngweledigaeth sylfaenol o reoli Cymru wledig gyfan o dan gynllun amaeth-amgylchedd. Bydd yn digwydd ryw ddiwrnod, ond nid yw’r cynllun datblygu gwledig wedi dod â’r cynnydd mawr tuag at y weledigaeth honno yr oeddwn wedi gobeithio amdano.

Tir Gofal is potentially a good scheme. Perhaps there is too much bureaucracy, but that is how it is with public sector schemes. Agri-environment schemes give money to farmers for a specific purpose. They should be seen as schemes for everyone who lives in or wants to enjoy the Welsh countryside. Tir Gofal pays for the protection of the habitats of brown hares, skylarks, lapwings, marsh fritillaries, pearl-bordered fritillaries, and a host of other creatures. It ensures access for people who want to enjoy the countryside through agreement and goodwill, not by the deeply offensive right-to-roam legislation, which is the most shameful piece of bullying legislation passed by a British Government in peacetime. It promotes the protection of landscape, wildlife and historic features, and promotes the management of priority habitats and measures to improve other habitats. Most importantly, it brings together country people and townspeople, and promotes understanding between them. Nothing disappoints me more than when I hear deliberate attempts in the Assembly to create division between townspeople and country people. One AM did just that in the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee last week when we were discussing the difficult issue of hunting with dogs. Although scrupulously impartial as the Chair, I found his remarks about those who disagreed with him to be deeply offensive.

Gallai Tir Gofal fod yn gynllun da. Efallai fod gormod o fiwrocratiaeth, ond felly y mae yng nghynlluniau’r sector cyhoeddus. Mae cynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd yn rhoi arian i ffermwyr at ddiben penodol. Dylid eu hystyried yn gynlluniau i bawb sy’n byw yng nghefn gwlad Cymru neu’n dymuno’i mwynhau. Mae Tir Gofal yn talu am ddiogelu cynefinoedd ysgyfarnogod brown, ehedyddion, cornicyllod, brithion y gors, brithion perlog, a llu o greaduriaid eraill. Mae’n sicrhau mynediad i bobl sydd am fwynhau cefn gwlad drwy gytundeb ac ewyllys da, nid drwy’r ddeddfwriaeth hawl i grwydro dra annymunol, sef y ddeddf ormesol fwyaf cywilyddus a basiwyd gan Lywodraeth Brydeinig mewn amser heddwch. Mae’n hwb i ddiogelu’r tirlun, bywyd gwyllt a nodweddion hanesyddol, ac yn hyrwyddo’r gwaith o reoli cynefinoedd blaenoriaethol a mesurau i wella cynefinoedd eraill. Yn bwysicaf oll, daw â phobl y wlad a phobl y dref at ei gilydd gan hybu cyd-ddealltwriaeth. Nid oes dim yn fy siomi’n fwy na chlywed ymdrechion bwriadol yn y Cynulliad i greu rhaniad rhwng pobl y dref a phobl y wlad. Fe wnaeth un AC hynny yn y Pwyllgor Amaethyddiaeth a Datblygu Gwledig yr wythnos diwethaf pan oeddem yn trafod pwnc anodd hela â chŵn. Er imi fod yn hollol ddiduedd fel y Cadeirydd, yr oedd ei sylwadau am y rhai a anghytunai ag ef yn fy nhramgwyddo’n fawr.

It is time to recognise that Tir Gofal alone will not deliver an all-Wales agri-environment vision. In reality, it is an all-Wales scheme with a part-Wales budget. Neither is the scheme delivering the economic or environmental benefits it is meant, or has the potential, to deliver. Agri-environment schemes must be better funded if they are to succeed. The second change needed now is the rapid introduction of what is being called a broad and shallow scheme, to work alongside Tir Gofal.

Mae’n bryd cydnabod na fydd Tir Gofal yn unig yn cyflawni gweledigaeth amaeth-amgylchedd i Gymru gyfan. Mewn gwirionedd, mae’n gynllun i Gymru gyfan gyda chyllideb i ran o Gymru. At hynny, nid yw’r cynllun yn dod â’r buddion economaidd neu amgylcheddol a fwriadwyd, neu y gallai eu rhoi. Rhaid ariannu cynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd yn well os ydynt i lwyddo. Yr ail newid sydd ei angen yn awr yw cyflwyno’n gyflym yr hyn a elwir yn gynllun eang a bas, i weithio ochr yn ochr â Tir Gofal.

If the principle of modulation will ever be accepted by the farming community, there must be a hierarchy of agri-environment schemes accessible to all farmers. The ultimate vision that we should have for Wales, but which is unrealistic at present, is for all farmed land to be managed under Tir Gofal principles. A more realistic and acceptable stepping stone would be for the whole of Wales to be managed under a broad and shallow agri-environment scheme.

Os yw’r egwyddor modiwleiddio i’w derbyn byth gan y gymuned ffermio, rhaid cael hierarchiaeth o gynlluniau amaeth-amgylchedd y gall pob ffermwr ymuno â hwy. Y weledigaeth y dylem ei chael i Gymru yn y pen draw, er nad yw’n realistig ar hyn o bryd, yw y dylai’r holl dir sy’n cael ei ffermio gael ei reoli yn unol ag egwyddorion Tir Gofal. Cam ymlaen mwy realistig a derbyniol fyddai i Gymru gyfan gael ei rheoli o dan gynllun amaeth-amgylchedd eang a bas.

We are moving towards this vision, but too slowly. To that extent, the rural development plan has not delivered what we asked of it. The Welsh countryside is crying out for a Minister and Government with genuine vision. It has not had that vision for the first three years of the National Assembly; I hope to see an improvement in future.

Yr ydym yn symud tuag at y weledigaeth honno, ond yn rhy araf. I’r graddau hynny, nid yw’r cynllun datblygu gwledig wedi cyflawni ein gofynion. Mae ar gefn gwlad Cymru daer angen Gweinidog a Llywodraeth sydd â gwir weledigaeth. Ni chafodd y weledigaeth honno yn nhair blynedd cyntaf y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol; gobeithiaf weld gwelliant yn y dyfodol.

Michael German The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Rural Development and Wales Abroad spoken in English p. 70

Michael German Dirprwy Brif Weinidog Cymru a’r Gweinidog dros Ddatblygu Gwledig a Chymru Dramor siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 70

I will answer most of the questions that have been raised. Perhaps Members who did not have a chance to speak will wish to intervene. On Peter Rogers’s points, as you know, Peter, the figures must be absolutely accurate for European schemes, and if there are delays in submitting all the information needed, then payments will not be made until the figures are available. However, 82 per cent of all of the environmentally sensitive area payments were made within the charter standard target last year, which means that of 1,578 claims, 1,293 payments were made on target. I am not aware of any difficulties in renewing ESA agreements at the five-year break clause. I have not seen your correspondence, but if you send me the details, I will be pleased to consider the matter.

Atebaf y rhan fwyaf o’r cwestiynau a godwyd. Efallai y bydd yr Aelodau na chawsant gyfle i siarad yn dymuno ymyrryd. Ynghylch pwyntiau Peter Rogers, fel y gwyddoch, Peter, rhaid i’r ffigurau fod yn gwbl gywir ar gyfer cynlluniau Ewropeaidd, ac os oes oedi wrth gyflwyno’r holl wybodaeth sydd ei hangen, ni ellir talu nes bydd y ffigurau ar gael. Fodd bynnag, fe wnaed 82 y cant o’r holl daliadau ardal amgylchedd arbennig o fewn cyfnod targed y safon siarter y llynedd, sy’n golygu bod 1,293 o’r taliadau ar 1,578 o hawliadau wedi’u gwneud mewn pryd. Nid wyf yn ymwybodol o unrhyw anawsterau o ran adnewyddu cytundebau ardal amgylchedd arbennig yn unol â chymal y toriad pum mlynedd. Nid wyf wedi gweld eich gohebiaeth, ond os anfonwch y manylion ataf, byddaf yn falch o ystyried y mater.

I reject the suggestion that Farming Connect business advisers are not up to the job. They are all quality-assured, fully trained, and receive ongoing training. They are in demand in the private sector. You might want to reconsider your comments when you see their work at close hand. It is not true to say that these advisers only suggest going into the Tir Gofal or organic farming schemes—that is nonsense. They talk to farmers about capital grant applications, encourage the take-up of specialist advice, and offer specialist demonstration farm visits. They are engaged in a whole raft of activity.

Gwrthodaf yr awgrym nad yw ymgynghorwyr busnes Cyswllt Ffermio yn ateb y gofyn. Sicrhawyd safon pob un ohonynt, maent wedi’u hyfforddi’n llawn, ac yn derbyn hyfforddiant parhaus. Mae galw mawr amdanynt yn y sector preifat. Efallai y byddwch am ailystyried eich sylwadau pan welwch eu gwaith yn agos. Anghywir yw dweud nad yw’r ymgynghorwyr hyn ond yn awgrymu ymuno â’r cynllun Tir Gofal neu’r cynllun ffermio organig—nonsens yw hynny. Maent yn siarad â ffermwyr am geisiadau am grant cyfalaf, yn eu hannog i gymryd cyngor arbenigol, ac yn cynnig ymweliadau â ffermydd arddangos arbenigol. Maent yn ymwneud â gweithgarwch amrywiol iawn.

On processing and marketing grants, it is not true that only one scheme has been approved. I said in my opening speech that 20 schemes have been approved. That figure is steadily increasing and will continue to do so as we move forward with the farm consultancy visits.

Ynghylch grantiau prosesu a marchnata, nid yw’n wir mai dim ond un cynllun a gymeradwywyd. Dywedais yn fy araith agoriadol fod 20 o gynlluniau wedi’u cymeradwyo. Mae’r ffigur hwnnw’n codi’n raddol a bydd yn parhau i wneud hynny wrth inni fwrw ymlaen â’r ymweliadau ymgynghori ar ffermydd.

Rhodri Glyn Thomas raised the Tir Mynydd scheme. A safety net is in place. We did not want it but it was non-negotiable, as the European Commission wanted it and put it in place. It has led to difficulties but it was the best that could be done given the commission’s firm position. I know that the Assembly is awaiting the Tir Mynydd II with interest. It is under discussion at present, and we are talking to the farmers unions and so on. I will bring forward proposals on it shortly.

Cyfeiriodd Rhodri Glyn Thomas at gynllun Tir Mynydd. Mae rhwyd ddiogelwch ar waith. Nid oeddem am ei chael ond ni ellid ei gwrthod, gan fod y Comisiwn Ewropeaidd yn dymuno’i chael ac wedi’i rhoi ar waith. Mae wedi peri anawsterau ond dyna oedd y gorau y gellid ei wneud o ystyried safbwynt pendant y comisiwn. Gwn fod y Cynulliad yn disgwyl yn llawn diddordeb am Tir Mynydd II. Mae’n cael ei drafod ar hyn o bryd, ac yr ydym yn siarad ag undebau’r ffermwyr ac yn y blaen. Cyflwynaf gynigion arno cyn hir.

I note the issue that Glyn, Rhodri Glyn Thomas and others have raised, that Tir Gofal is—

Nodaf y mater a godwyd gan Glyn, Rhodri Glyn Thomas ac eraill, bod Tir Gofal yn—

Peter Roger a gododd—

Peter Roger rose—

Michael German spoken in English p. 71

Michael German siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71

I will finish these points first. Only a certain number of farmers have been able to join this programme because it is only supposed to serve a limited number of farmers. I note Glyn’s comments on the potential for a broad and shallow potential scheme with interest, and I look forward to discussions on this, following Franz Fischler’s announcement of his proposals next month, and to the continuing debate on modulation and how we should take forward those issues—

Gorffennaf y pwyntiau hyn yn gyntaf. Dim ond nifer penodol o ffermwyr sydd wedi gallu ymuno â’r rhaglen hon gan nad yw ond i fod i wasanaethu nifer cyfyngedig o ffermwyr. Nodaf sylwadau Glyn ar y posibiliadau o gael cynllun eang a bas gyda diddordeb, ac edrychaf ymlaen at gael trafodaethau ar hyn, wedi i Franz Fischler gyhoeddi ei gynigion y mis nesaf, ac at y ddadl sy’n parhau ar fodiwleiddio a sut y dylem fwrw ymlaen â’r materion hynny—

Phil Williams a gododd—

Phil Williams rose—

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 71

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71

Order. There is no time for interventions. The Minister only has 20 seconds left; he has already had 15 minutes of the 45 minutes available.

Trefn. Nid oes amser ar gyfer ymyriadau. Dim ond 20 eiliad sydd ar ôl gan y Gweinidog; mae eisoes wedi cael 15 munud o’r 45 munud a oedd ar gael.

Michael German spoken in English p. 71

Michael German siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 71

I was about to take an intervention, but I will conclude in that case. Those Members who are concerned about interventions through National Assembly measures can be assured that the rural development plan is the cornerstone for making progress. Working in partnership across the rural economy will be crucial to ensuring that agriculture and other parts of the rural economy have a real future.

Yr oeddwn ar fin derbyn ymyriad, ond fe derfynaf os mai felly y mae. Gall yr Aelodau hynny sy’n bryderus ynghylch ymyriadau drwy fesurau’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol fod yn dawel eu meddwl mai’r cynllun datblygu gwledig yw’r conglfaen i gynnydd. Bydd yn hollbwysig gweithio mewn partneriaeth ym mhob rhan o’r economi wledig i sicrhau dyfodol go iawn i amaethyddiaeth a rhannau eraill o’r economi wledig.

Gwelliant 1 Peter Rogers t. 71

Amendment 1 Peter Rogers p. 71

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 19 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 25

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment rejected.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (19)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • Brian Hancock
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (25)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Val Lloyd
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 2 Rhodri Glyn Thomas t. 72

Amendment 2 Rhodri Glyn Thomas p. 72

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 19 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 26

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment rejected.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (19)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • Brian Hancock
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (26)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Val Lloyd
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 3 Rhodri Glyn Thomas t. 73

Amendment 3 Rhodri Glyn Thomas p. 73

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 19 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 26

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment rejected.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (19)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • Brian Hancock
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (26)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Val Lloyd
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Gwelliant 4 Rhodri Glyn Thomas t. 73

Amendment 4 Rhodri Glyn Thomas p. 73

GwrthodwydRejected O blaidFor 10 YmatalAbstain 8 Yn erbynAgainst 26

Gwrthodwyd y gwelliant.

Amendment defeated.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (10)
  • Cynog Dafis
  • Brian Hancock
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Janet Ryder
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams
YmatalAbstain (8)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Peter Rogers
Yn erbynAgainst (26)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Val Lloyd
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams

Cynnig NDM1093 Michael German t. 74

Motion NDM1093 Michael German p. 74

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 26 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 19

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (26)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Christine Chapman
  • Jane Davidson
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • Michael German
  • Brian Gibbons
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Christine Gwyther
  • Alison Halford
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Peter Law
  • Val Lloyd
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Kirsty Williams
Yn erbynAgainst (19)
  • Nick Bourne
  • Alun Cairns
  • Cynog Dafis
  • David Davies
  • Glyn Davies
  • William Graham
  • Brian Hancock
  • Gareth Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • David Melding
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams

Mabwysiadu’r Cynllun Cydraddoldeb Hiliol

Adoption of the Race Equality Scheme

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government spoken in English p. 74

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 74

I propose that

Cynigiaf fod

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government (continued) spoken in English p. 75

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored (parhad) siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 75

I begin by expressing my admiration for the commitment and drive shown by Edwina Hart when she had responsibility for equality of opportunity. She has left us a strong legacy, and I will work tirelessly to take forward the work that she has begun.

Dechreuaf drwy fynegi fy edmygedd o’r ymrwymiad a’r penderfyniad a amlygodd Edwina Hart pan oedd yn gyfrifol am gyfle cyfartal. Yr ydym wedi etifeddu gwaith da ganddi, a gwnaf weithio’n ddiflino i fwrw ymlaen â’r hyn a gychwynnodd.

Racism is poison; there is no other way to describe it. It is an excuse for some people to blame others for their inadequacies, and to put forward unprincipled and unfounded racial theories. We know the reaches of racism in society; we have seen it throughout history, not only in the UK, but across Europe.

Mae hiliaeth yn wenwyn; dim ond felly y gellir ei disgrifio. Mae’n esgus i rai pobl fwrw’r bai ar eraill am eu diffygion eu hunain, ac i gyflwyno damcaniaethau hiliol diegwyddor a di-sail. Gwyddom mor bell y mae hiliaeth wedi ymledu mewn cymdeithas; gwelsom hynny drwy hanes, nid yn unig yn y DU, ond ledled Ewrop.

A strong scheme promoting anti-racism and racial equality must be the mark of a civilised society, in which people are free from all types of discrimination. It is also a mark of how imperfect we are—not only in Wales, but across the world—that we must continue to strive confidently and resolutely to ensure that every initiative possible is in place to promote race equality. That is a strong message from the National Assembly: we will always condemn those who seek to blame others, or discriminate against them, purely because they are not the same.

Cynllun cadarn sy’n hybu gwrth-hiliaeth a chydraddoldeb hiliol yw nod amgen cymdeithas wâr, lle y mae pobl yn rhydd oddi wrth bob math o wahaniaethu. Mae hefyd yn arwydd o’n hamherffeithrwydd—nid yn unig yng Nghymru, ond ledled y byd—fod rhaid inni barhau i ymdrechu’n hyderus ac yn benderfynol i sicrhau bod pob menter bosibl ar waith i hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb hiliol. Neges gryf yw hon oddi wrth y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol: collfarnwn bob amser y rhai sy’n ceisio bwrw’r bai ar eraill, neu wahaniaethu yn eu herbyn, dim ond am eu bod yn wahanol.

Edwina’s statement of 30 May announced the publication of the Assembly’s race equality scheme, as required by the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000. I know that Edwina was concerned that, due to the need to publish the scheme by 31 May, Members had not had the opportunity to contribute fully to the scheme’s preparation. This debate, therefore, is an opportunity for Members to contribute to the development of the scheme as part of the process of improvement that will take place over the next 12 months. I will also ensure that the Committee on Equality of Opportunity has the opportunity this autumn to discuss race equality in more detail, including a fuller discussion of this scheme. The results of the ongoing consultation process will be available during the autumn, and these will help the Committee to give meaningful consideration to the scheme. The Assembly has a legal obligation to review the scheme at least every three years. However, to reflect the contributions from the ongoing consultation, and for Members to be more involved in the review procedure, the first review of the scheme—in which the Committee will be fully involved—will take place in 12 months.

Yn natganiad Edwina ar 30 Mai cyhoeddwyd y câi cynllun cydraddoldeb hiliol y Cynulliad ei gyhoeddi, yn unol â gofynion y Ddeddf Cysylltiadau Hiliol (Diwygio) 2000. Gwn fod Edwina yn bryderus, oherwydd yr angen i gyhoeddi’r cynllun erbyn 31 Mai, nad oedd yr Aelodau wedi cael cyfle i gyfrannu’n llawn at baratoi’r cynllun. Mae’r ddadl hon yn gyfle, felly, i’r Aelodau gyfrannu at ddatblygu’r cynllun fel rhan o’r broses o’i wella a fydd yn digwydd dros y 12 mis nesaf. Sicrhaf hefyd y caiff y Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal gyfle yn yr hydref eleni i drafod cydraddoldeb hiliol yn fanylach, gan gynnwys trafodaeth lawnach ar y cynllun hwn. Bydd canlyniadau’r broses ymgynghori gyfredol ar gael yn ystod yr hydref, a byddant o gymorth i’r Pwyllgor ystyried y cynllun yn briodol. Mae’r Cynulliad dan rwymedigaeth gyfreithiol i adolygu’r cynllun bob tair blynedd o leiaf. Fodd bynnag, er mwyn adlewyrchu’r cyfraniadau o’r ymgynghoriad cyfredol, ac fel y gall yr Aelodau gymryd rhan lawnach yn y weithdrefn adolygu, bydd adolygiad cyntaf y cynllun—y bydd y Pwyllgor yn chwarae rhan lawn ynddo—yn digwydd ymhen 12 mis.

We will not be standing still in that period but, as I have mentioned, we will work proactively to improve the scheme by working in partnership with the Commission for Racial Equality, with partner organisations and with stakeholders in Wales, particularly, the all-Wales Ethnic Minority Association, the race equality councils and the Black Voluntary Sector Network. We will continue to develop the scheme as we learn from our initial projects and find fresh ideas, with which we can help to promote racial equality and eliminate discrimination. I cannot stress enough the importance of the involvement of these organisations and communities, and the importance of a clear understanding of the commitment that we have made to them. We must be accountable and visible to these communities through our commitments. The Act empowers the Commission for Racial Equality to consider our progress under the scheme.

Ni fyddwn yn sefyll yn stond yn y cyfnod hwnnw ond yn gweithio’n rhagweithiol, fel y dywedais, i wella’r cynllun drwy weithio mewn partneriaeth â’r Comisiwn Cydraddoldeb Hiliol, gyda phartner gyrff a chyda’r rhanddeiliaid yng Nghymru, yn benodol, Cymdeithas Lleiafrifoedd Ethnig Cymru Gyfan, y cynghorau cydraddoldeb hiliol a Rhwydwaith Sector Gwirfoddol Pobl Ddu. Byddwn yn parhau i ddatblygu’r cynllun wrth inni ddysgu oddi wrth ein prosiectau cychwynnol a chanfod syniadau newydd, y gallwn eu defnyddio i’n helpu i hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb hiliol a dileu gwahaniaethu. Ni allaf wneud digon i bwysleisio mor bwysig yw’r rhan a gymerir gan y cyrff a’r mudiadau hyn, ac mor bwysig yw deall yn glir yr ymrwymiad a wnaethom iddynt. Rhaid inni fod yn atebol ac yn weladwy i’r cymunedau hyn drwy ein hymrwymiadau. Mae’r Ddeddf yn awdurdodi’r Comisiwn Cydraddoldeb Hiliol i ystyried y cynnydd a wnawn o dan y cynllun.

This is groundbreaking legislation, imposing a clear duty on all public authorities to eliminate discrimination and to promote racial equality—a simple truism and the mark of a civilised society. However, it also applies to private sector organisations who work for such authorities. Although only those mentioned on the face of the Act must publish a race equality scheme, others are still subject to the general duty set out in the Act. I intend to ensure that we work to promote racial equality and that our Assembly sponsored public bodies and those that they do business with, also take the same approach. The Commission for Racial Equality has already provided invaluable advice and guidance to the Assembly in developing the scheme to this stage. I welcome the commission’s endorsement of our approach and its continued support and involvement as we develop the scheme. I know that Edwina has written to Gurbux Singh expressing her gratitude for the commission’s contribution, and I endorse that thanks. I am also grateful for the Committee on Equality of Opportunity’s contribution, under Edwina’s leadership, in the development of the scheme. The scheme builds on the other projects undertaken to promote equality across the Assembly’s work.

Deddfwriaeth arloesol yw hon sy’n ei gwneud yn ddyletswydd bendant i bob awdurdod cyhoeddus ddileu gwahaniaethu a hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb hiliol—gwireb syml a nod amgen cymdeithas wâr. Fodd bynnag, mae’n berthnasol hefyd i gyrff sector preifat sy’n gweithio i awdurdodau o’r fath. Er mai dim ond y rhai a enwir yn y Ddeddf sy’n gorfod cyhoeddi cynllun cydraddoldeb hiliol, mae eraill yn dal i fod dan y ddyletswydd gyffredinol a nodir yn y Ddeddf. Bwriadaf sicrhau ein bod yn gweithio i hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb hiliol a bod y cyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad a’r rhai a wnânt fusnes â hwy, yn mabwysiadu’r un dull gweithredu hefyd. Mae’r Comisiwn Cydraddoldeb Hiliol eisoes wedi rhoi cyngor a chyfarwyddyd amhrisiadwy i’r Cynulliad wrth ddatblygu’r cynllun hyd yma. Yr wyf yn croesawu cefnogaeth y comisiwn i’n dull gweithredu a’i gefnogaeth a’i gyfraniad parhaus wrth inni ddatblygu’r cynllun. Gwn fod Edwina wedi ysgrifennu at Gurbux Singh gan fynegi ei diolch am gyfraniad y comisiwn, ac ategaf y diolch hwnnw. Yr wyf hefyd yn ddiolchgar am gyfraniad y Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal, o dan arweinyddiaeth Edwina, wrth ddatblygu’r cynllun. Mae’r cynllun yn ategu’r prosiectau eraill a weithredwyd i hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb yn holl waith y Cynulliad.

Edwina and the Committee have set a high standard in terms of equality in Wales, as I have discovered over the past few days since I took responsibility for equality of opportunity and this particular scheme. I am fully committed to continuing with the work that has already been done and, in particular, to ensuring that this scheme at least matches the high standards set previously. The scheme appears complex at first reading, and I make no apology for that. The wide range of functions, for which we have responsibility, means that the development of an effective race equality scheme is challenging. We cannot expect to get it right the first time; the challenge will be to see how quickly and how much we can learn.

Mae Edwina a’r Pwyllgor wedi gosod safon uchel o ran cydraddoldeb yng Nghymru, fel y darganfûm dros y dyddiau diwethaf ers imi ymgymryd â’r cyfrifoldeb dros gyfle cyfartal a’r cynllun penodol hwn. Yr wyf wedi ymrwymo’n llwyr i barhau â’r gwaith a wnaed eisoes ac, yn benodol, i sicrhau bod y cynllun hwn gystal o leiaf â’r safonau uchel a osodwyd o’r blaen. Mae’r cynllun yn ymddangos yn gymhleth ar y darlleniad cyntaf, ac nid ymddiheuraf am hynny. Gan ein bod yn gyfrifol am amrediad eang o swyddogaethau, mae datblygu cynllun cydraddoldeb hiliol effeithiol yn her. Ni allwn ddisgwyl ei gael yn iawn y tro cyntaf; yr her fydd canfod faint y gallwn ei ddysgu a pha mor gyflym.

The scheme is another important step in the Assembly’s work in terms of promoting equality. While it specifically addresses issues related to race equality, I intend to take the same approach over time to all areas of equality for which the Government of Wales Act 1998 has given this institution a clear remit. We have embarked on a long journey. It will take continuing collective commitment and determination by the National Assembly to address some of the deep-seated, underlying problems, which mean that elements of our communities remain disadvantaged. In many ways, that is perhaps this institution’s greatest challenge in ensuring fairness, opportunity and social justice for those in our community who have yet to receive them. The majority of Members are supportive of what has been done so far, and I ask for your support and endorsement for our continued work in dealing with the important issue of inequality.

Mae’r cynllun hwn yn gam pwysig arall yng ngwaith y Cynulliad yng nghyd-destun hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb. Er ei fod yn ymdrin yn benodol â materion sy’n ymwneud â chydraddoldeb hiliol, bwriadaf ddilyn yr un dull gweithredu dros amser ym mhob un o’r meysydd cydraddoldeb y mae Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 1998 wedi rhoi cylch gwaith pendant i’r sefydliad hwn ar eu cyfer. Yr ydym wedi cychwyn ar daith hir. Bydd yn rhaid wrth gydymrwymiad a chydbenderfyniad parhaus gan y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol i ymdrin â rhai o’r problemau dwfn, sylfaenol, sy’n golygu bod rhai elfennau yn ein cymunedau’n dal i fod o dan anfantais. Ar lawer cyfrif, dyna’r her fwyaf o bosibl i’r sefydliad hwn wrth sicrhau tegwch, cyfle a chyfiawnder cymdeithasol i’r rhai yn ein cymuned sydd heb eu cael eto. Mae’r rhan fwyaf o’r Aelodau’n gefnogol i’r hyn a wnaed hyd yma, a gofynnaf ichi gefnogi a chymeradwyo’r gwaith yr ydym yn ei wneud wrth ymdrin â mater pwysig anghydraddoldeb.

Helen Mary Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 78

Helen Mary Jones spoken in Welsh p. 78

Yr wyf yn cytuno â phopeth a ddywedodd Carwyn Jones ynglŷn â gwaith Edwina Hart. Bydd y Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal ar ei golled hebddi, ond bydd yn parhau fel pwerdy wrth hyrwyddo cyfle cyfartal, yn enwedig yn ei gwaith fel y Gweinidog dros Gyllid. Serch hynny, gwelsom yng nghyfarfod y Pwyllgor ddoe fod Carwyn yn fwy na pharod i ymgymryd â’r gwaith ac y bydd yn olynydd effeithiol. Felly, croesawaf y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored i’w swydd newydd.

I agree with everything that Carwyn Jones said about Edwina Hart’s work. She will be a great loss to the Committee on Equality of Opportunity, but no doubt she will continue as an equal opportunity powerhouse, particularly in her work as Minister for Finance. However, during yesterday’s Committee meeting, Carwyn showed us that he is more than capable of taking on this work and that he will be an effective successor. Therefore I welcome the Minister for Open Government to his new post.

Bydd Plaid Cymru yn cefnogi’r cynnig hwn, ac yr ydym yn fodlon ar y cynllun fel ag y mae. Cytunaf â llawer o’r hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog am gyd-destun y cynllun.

Plaid Cymru will support this motion, and we are satisfied with the scheme as it stands. I agree with a great deal of what the Minister said regarding the context of the scheme.

Hoffwn sôn am y broses o ddatblygu’r cynllun a’r pryderon a fynegwyd ynglŷn â sgîl-effeithiau posibl dyletswyddau newydd cyrff cyhoeddus. O ran datblygiad y cynllun, credaf y byddai Carwyn Jones ac Edwina Hart yn cytuno y bu’n gawl potsh. Yr hyn a ddaeth gerbron y Pwyllgor oedd cynllun annigonol a oedd heb ei ddatblygu’n ddigonol ac a baratowyd ar y funud olaf. Disgrifiwyd y sefyllfa imi fel ‘undignified scramble’, wrth inni orfod gyflwyno cynllun newydd ar y funud olaf drwy ddatganiad yn hytrach na mewn dadl.

I wish to address the scheme’s development process and the concerns expressed about the possible side-effects of the new responsibilities placed on public bodies. In terms of the scheme’s development, I am sure that Carwyn Jones and Edwina Hart would agree that it was a complete mess. The scheme brought before the Committee was inadequate, had not been worked through sufficiently and was prepared at the last minute. The situation was described as an ‘undignified scramble’, as we had to bring forward a new scheme at the eleventh hour by means of a statement rather than a debate.

Drwy gydweithrediad, yr ydym wedi datrys y broblem hon, ac mae gennym gynllun da y gallwn i gyd gytuno ag ef, a hynny mewn dadl. Mae’n bwysig ein bod yn osgoi sefyllfa debyg yn y dyfodol. Gofynnaf, felly, i’r Gweinidog sicrhau bod uned polisi cydraddoldeb y Cynulliad yn derbyn mwy o adnoddau. Y rheswm a roddwyd i’r Pwyllgor am gyflwr gwreiddiol y cynllun oedd pwysau gwaith ar y staff, ac yr wyf yn fodlon derbyn hynny. Ni fyddai unrhyw wleidydd yn pwyso am fwy o weision sifil ond, yn yr achos hwn, mae angen mwy o bobl i wneud y gwaith. Mae staff hynod o dda yn yr uned, ond maent yn gweithio o dan bwysau aruthrol. Deallaf fod posibilrwydd secondiadau yn cael ei drafod â’r Comisiwn Cydraddoldeb Hiliol, er mwyn sicrhau bod y cynllun yn cael ei fonitro’n effeithiol. A wnaiff y Gweinidog sôn am unrhyw gynnydd a wnaed ar hynny? Mae’n bwysig bod y Gweinidog yn ymrwmyo i roi blaenoriaeth briodol i’r gwaith hwn yn y dyfodol, fel nad ydym yn yr un sefyllfa y flwyddyn nesaf yn rhuthro i gwblhau cynllun.

We resolved the problem through collaboration, and we now have before us, as the subject of a debate, a commendable scheme that we can all endorse. It is important that we avoid a similar situation in future. I therefore ask the Minister to ensure that more resources are made available to the Assembly’s equality policy unit. The explanation given to the Committee for the first version of the scheme was that the staff had excessive workloads. I am prepared to accept that. No politician would press for more civil servants but, in this case, more people are needed to carry out the work. The unit’s staff are very effective, but they are working under tremendous pressure. I am aware that the possibility of secondments is being discussed with the Commission for Racial Equality, to ensure that the scheme is monitored effectively. Will the Minister report on progress made in that regard? It is important that the Minister makes a commitment to give appropriate priority to this work in future, so that we do not find ourselves in the same situation next year of having to scramble to finalise a scheme.

Trof at fy ail bwynt. Croesawaf y ffaith fod Deddf Cysylltiadau Hiliol (Diwygio) 2000, ar lefel Brydeinig, yn rhoi dyletswydd newydd ar gyrff cyhoeddus i hyrwyddo cysylltiadau hiliol yn gadarnhaol ac yn rhagweithiol. Nid yw hynny yn newydd i ni yng Nghymru gan fod y ddyletswydd absoliwt sydd gennym dan Ddeddf Llywodraeth Cymru 1998 i hybu cyfle cyfartal yn ein gosod ar flaen y gad. Serch hynny, codwyd pryderon o ganlyniad i’r Ddeddf newydd ymysg, er enghraifft, grwpiau menywod a grwpiau sy’n cynrychioli pobl anabl. Gallai’r ddyletswydd newydd o dan y Ddeddf symud ffocws cyrff cyhoeddus a’u harwain i ganolbwyntio ar gydraddoldeb hiliol gan golli gafael ar feysydd eraill. Nid wyf o’r farn bod hynny’n anochel, ond rhaid inni sicrhau nad yw’n digwydd.

I turn to my second point. I welcome the fact that, at a British level, the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000 requires public bodies to promote race relations positively and proactively. This is nothing new to us in Wales because our absolute responsibility under the Government of Wales Act 1998 to promote equality of opportunity means that we are already leading the way. However, the new Act has led to concerns among, for example, women’s groups and groups representing disabled people. The new responsibility under the Act could lead public bodies to shift their focus and concentrate on racial equality while loosening their grip on other aspects. This is by no means inevitable, but we must ensure that it does not happen.

Mae gan y Cynulliad ddyletswydd absoliwt i hybu cyfle cyfartal ym mhob maes lle y mae gwahaniaethu annheg y gorffennol yn parhau. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ymrwymo i fonitro’r sefyllfa ac i roi cyngor i gyrff cyhoeddus er mwyn sicrhau eu bod yn deall ac yn derbyn bod y meysydd eraill yr un mor bwysig er nad oes goblygiadau statudol yn y meysydd hynny? Croesawaf yr hyn a ddywedodd eisoes ynglŷn â hynny. Dylid rhoi sylw hefyd i ganfod ffordd o fynnu bod cyrff statudol a llywodraeth leol yn llunio cynlluniau cyfle cyfartal mwy cyffredinol ac eang er mwyn cynnwys syniadau statudol ynglŷn â hil, ac i sicrhau y cânt eu gosod yn eu cyd-destun.

The Assembly has an absolute responsibility to promote equality of opportunity in every field where the unjust discrimination of the past can still be found. Will the Minister give a commitment to monitor the situation and advise public bodies in order to ensure that they understand and accept that other fields are just as important, even though those fields may not involve statutory obligations? I welcome what the Minister has already said in this regard. Attention should also be given to identifying a means of insisting that statutory bodies and local government draw up more general, wide-ranging equal opportunity schemes so that they include statutory concepts about race, and to ensure that they are put in context.

Mae’r Pwyllgor yn edrych ymlaen at fonitro sut y caiff y cynllun ei weithredu gan sicrhau y caiff ei argymhellion gwerthfawr eu gweithredu’n llawn, yn effeithiol ac yn brydlon, yng nghyd-destun ymrwymiad ehangach y Cynulliad i gyfle cyfartal.

The Committee looks forward to monitoring the scheme’s implementation and to ensuring that its laudable recommendations are implemented fully, effectively and promptly as part of the Assembly’s wider commitment to equality of opportunity.

Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 80

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 80

I echo the gratitude to Edwina and welcome Carwyn to the Committee. All parties agree that racial inequality and prejudice are unacceptable in a civilised society. In relation to other countries—including the other countries of the United Kingdom—Wales has a good record on racial equality. However, in absolute terms there is much to be done. Racial inequality is not only derived from racial prejudice. Wales has been a multi-racial country for generations, if not centuries, and Cardiff has the oldest black community in Britain. Whether the causes are racial or class-based, the fact remains that the level of racial inequality in Wales remains unacceptably high.

Ategaf y diolch i Edwina a chroesawaf Carwyn i’r Pwyllgor. Cytuna’r holl bleidiau bod anghydraddoldeb a rhagfarn hiliol yn annerbyniol mewn cymdeithas wâr. O’i chymharu â gwledydd eraill—gan gynnwys gwledydd eraill y Deyrnas Unedig—mae gan Gymru record dda o ran cydraddoldeb hiliol. Fodd bynnag, mewn termau absoliwt, mae llawer i’w wneud. Nid yw anghydraddoldeb hiliol yn deillio o ragfarn hiliol yn unig. Mae Cymru’n wlad amlhiliol ers cenedlaethau os nad canrifoedd, a chan Gaerdydd y mae’r gymuned ddu hynaf ym Mhrydain. Pa un a yw’r achosion yn deillio o hiliaeth neu ddosbarth, erys y ffaith fod graddau’r anghydraddoldeb hiliol yng Nghymru’n annerbyniol o uchel.

We also agree that the last census was inappropriate for gaining an understanding of Wales and its people. It was unacceptable that there was no Welsh tick box. However, the worst aspect of the census was the assumption that everyone who was Welsh or ‘other’—as noted on the form—was white. It was not possible for black, Asian, or mixed-race Welsh people to indicate their race. The proposed recommendations will redress those problems and we are confident that similar mistakes will not be repeated in the next census.

Yr ydym hefyd yn cytuno bod y cyfrifiad diwethaf yn anaddas o ran deall Cymru a’i phobl. Yr oedd yn annerbyniol nad oedd blwch ticio i’r Cymry. Er hynny, yr agwedd waethaf ar y cyfrifiad oedd y rhagdybiaeth bod pawb a oedd yn Gymry neu’n ‘arall’—fel y nodwyd ar y ffurflen—yn wyn. Nid oedd yn bosibl i Gymry du, Asiaidd neu gymysg eu hil nodi eu hil. Bydd yr argymhellion a gynigiwyd yn datrys y problemau hynny ac yr ydym yn ffyddiog na wneir camgymeriadau tebyg eto yn y cyfrifiad nesaf.

The scheme touches on the routine recording of ethnic differences in official statistics; for example, unemployment statistics include insufficient ethnic characteristic data. A good understanding of the diverse make-up of Wales is critical in order to appreciate and address the failures and successes of various issues in Wales and to create the society that we wish to achieve.

Mae’r cynllun yn cyffwrdd â’r cofnodi rheolaidd o wahaniaethau ethnig mewn ystadegau swyddogol; er enghraifft, nid oes digon o ddata yn yr ystadegau diweithdra am nodweddion ethnig. Mae’n hollbwysig cael dealltwriaeth dda o gyfansoddiad amrywiol Cymru er mwyn gwerthfawrogi ac ymateb i’r methiannau a’r llwyddiannau mewn gwahanol faterion yng Nghymru a chreu’r gymdeithas y dymunwn ei chael.

David Melding spoken in English p. 80

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 80

On behalf of the Welsh Conservative Party, I welcome the publication of this scheme. We endorse it, as have the other parties, and the Conservative group is committed to supporting it.

Ar ran Plaid Geidwadol Cymru, croesawaf gyhoeddi’r cynllun hwn. Yr ydym yn ei gymeradwyo, fel y gwnaeth y pleidiau eraill, ac mae’r grŵp Ceidwadol wedi ymrwymo i’w gefnogi.

It is important that all the assessments that we make of our policies also take account of the Assembly’s internal workings, as one of the largest employers in Wales. I was pleased that that was included in the scheme, and it is important that we ensure that it is put into practice.

Mae’n bwysig bod yr holl asesiadau a wnawn o’n polisïau hefyd yn ystyried prosesau mewnol y Cynulliad, fel un o’r cyflogwyr mwyaf yng Nghymru. Yr oeddwn yn falch bod hynny wedi’i gynnwys yn y cynllun, ac mae’n bwysig inni sicrhau y caiff hynny ei roi ar waith.

Conducting regular audits of policy areas is to be welcomed and is appropriate, because times change and something well-designed today, could face a different situation in a few years’ time. Will the Minister give an assurance that the five-year cycle in policy review will be a maximum time limit and that many policies may be reviewed on a shorter cycle, as is required? If circumstances change, a policy may have to be reviewed after two or three years. It appears at the moment that we will use a five-year cycle without much room for manoeuvre. I would like a response from the Minister on how he intends to put that into practice.

Dylid croesawu’r bwriad i gynnal archwiliadau rheolaidd o feysydd polisi ac mae hynny’n briodol, gan fod pethau’n newid gydag amser, a gallai rhywbeth sy’n bwrpasol heddiw wynebu sefyllfa wahanol ymhen ychydig flynyddoedd. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi sicrwydd mai’r cylch pum mlynedd wrth adolygu polisi fydd y cyfnod hwyaf ac y gellid adolygu llawer o bolisïau’n amlach, fel y bo’n briodol? Os yw’r amgylchiadau’n newid, mae’n bosibl y bydd yn rhaid adolygu polisi ar ôl dwy neu dair blynedd. Mae’n ymddangos ar hyn o bryd ein bod yn defnyddio cylch pum mlynedd heb fawr o gyfle i amrywio hynny. Hoffwn gael ymateb gan y Gweinidog ynghylch y modd y mae’n bwriadu rhoi hynny ar waith.

It is important that we monitor staff recruitment and promotion. The Assembly is a major employer, and our civil servant recruitment sends out an important signal. In addition, when a workforce is in place, it is possible for a glass ceiling to descend, keeping people in junior positions rather than allowing them to gain promotion. We need to be careful about that and ensure that we monitor promotion as well as recruitment. I know that the Minister is keen to do that, but the current data is not helpful in enabling us to make such analysis. Work needs to be done, and I wish the Minister well on that; I assure him that I will scrutinise its satisfactory completion.

Mae’n bwysig inni gadw golwg ar recriwtio a dyrchafu staff. Mae’r Cynulliad yn gyflogwr o bwys, ac mae’r math o weision sifil yr ydym yn eu recriwtio yn arwydd pwysig. Yn ogystal â hynny, pan fo gweithlu yn ei le, mae’n bosibl i nenfwd gwydr ddisgyn, gan gadw pobl mewn swyddi isel yn hytrach na chaniatáu iddynt ennill dyrchafiad. Rhaid inni fod yn ofalus ynghylch hynny a sicrhau ein bod yn cadw golwg ar ddyrchafiadau yn ogystal â recriwtio. Gwn fod y Gweinidog yn awyddus i wneud hynny, ond nid yw’r data presennol yn ein helpu i wneud dadansoddiad o’r fath. Mae gwaith i’w wneud, a dymunaf yn dda i’r Gweinidog ar hynny; yr wyf yn ei sicrhau y byddaf yn archwilio’r gwaith hwnnw i sicrhau ei fod wedi’i gwblhau’n foddhaol.

I was pleased to read about the important positive measures, one of which is related to outreach workers. We should not only be reactive and wait for members in communities to apply for positions in the civil service or, as the same principle applies, for public appointments. We need to take our stall out and actively engage with them, not just by an annual visit, but by showing interest and advising groups on how they can best apply for positions in a procedure that may be foreign to them. They may not be familiar with formal applications or may feel that they do not have the necessary combination of skills. They may need some help in addressing that. We need a much more active policy.

Yr oeddwn yn falch o ddarllen am y mesurau cadarnhaol pwysig, y mae un ohonynt yn ymwneud â gweithwyr allanol. Ni ddylem fod yn adweithiol yn unig a disgwyl i aelodau o gymunedau ymgeisio am swyddi yn y gwasanaeth sifil neu, gan fod yr un egwyddor yn berthnasol, am benodiadau cyhoeddus. Rhaid inni genhadu a chysylltu â hwy’n weithredol, nid yn unig drwy ymweliad blynyddol, ond drwy ymddiddori mewn grwpiau a’u cynghori ar y dull gorau o ymgeisio am swyddi mewn gweithdrefn a allai fod yn ddieithr iddynt. Efallai na fyddant yn gyfarwydd â cheisiadau ffurfiol neu gallent deimlo nad ydynt yn meddu ar y cyfuniad o sgiliau sydd ei angen. Efallai y bydd arnynt angen rhywfaint o gymorth i ymdrin â hynny. Mae arnom angen polisi mwy egnïol o lawer.

Finally, it is important to provide regular equal opportunities training for staff, not only for middle and senior-ranking staff, but for all staff. Many staff members, often at junior level, have contact with groups outside the Assembly and with the public. It is important that there is adequate equal opportunities training and that racial awareness is a vital aspect of that.

Yn olaf, mae’n bwysig darparu hyfforddiant cyfle cyfartal rheolaidd i’r staff, nid yn unig i’r staff yn y rhengoedd canolig ac uwch, ond i’r holl staff. Mae llawer o aelodau staff, ar y lefel is yn aml, yn dod i gysylltiad â grwpiau y tu allan i’r Cynulliad ac â’r cyhoedd. Mae’n bwysig bod hyfforddiant cyfle cyfartal digonol a bod ymwybyddiaeth hiliol yn agwedd hollbwysig ohono.

It is incumbent on us all to create and maintain a proper and civilised society with racial harmony as one of its natural features. However, we should not be fooled. The fact that it exists today does not guarantee that it will exist tomorrow. We must be constantly vigilant. Dark and ugly forces are out there, which extremists are happy to stir up. The Assembly will greatly benefit from the cross-party endorsement and enthusiasm for this scheme.

Mae dyletswydd ar bob un ohonom i greu a chynnal cymdeithas weddus a gwâr a chytgord hiliol yn un o’i nodweddion naturiol. Fodd bynnag, ni ddylem gymryd ein twyllo. Nid yw’r ffaith ei bod yn bodoli heddiw’n sicrwydd y bydd yn bodoli yfory. Rhaid inni fod yn wyliadwrus bob amser. Mae grymoedd cudd a chas i’w cael, y mae eithafwyr yn falch o’u corddi. Bydd y Cynulliad yn elwa’n fawr o gymeradwyaeth a brwdfrydedd yr holl bleidiau i’r cynllun hwn.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 82

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 82

Thank you, David for not taking up all of your time. Many Members still want to contribute and I want to include everyone. Therefore, I would appreciate succinct speeches.

Diolch, David am beidio â defnyddio’ch holl amser. Mae llawer o Aelodau am gyfrannu eto ac yr wyf am gynnwys pawb. Felly, byddwn yn falch o gael areithiau cryno.

Owen John Thomas spoken in English p. 82

Owen John Thomas siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 82

The opening sentences of the race equality scheme document are substantial, clear and appealing:

Mae brawddegau agoriadol dogfen y cynllun cydraddoldeb hiliol yn sylweddol, yn glir ac yn apelgar:

‘The National Assembly for Wales has set itself a fundamental aim of treating people fairly and equally in all it does. It is working to create a tolerant society in which diversity is valued.’

‘Mae Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru wedi rhoi nod sylfaenol iddo’i hun i drin pobl yn deg ac yn gyfartal ym mhobpeth a wna. Mae’n gweithio tuag at greu cymdeithas oddefol lle mae parch at amrywiaeth.’

The scheme is a worthy document and contains good intentions with which no-one could disagree. Sustainable development, social inclusion and equality of opportunity have been highlighted as the three guiding principles of the National Assembly’s work. In this case, these principles will inform the task of drawing up and implementing this institution’s race equality scheme.

Mae’r cynllun yn ddogfen fuddiol ac mae bwriadau da ynddo na allai neb anghydweld â hwy. Dynodwyd datblygu cynaliadwy, cynhwysiant cymdeithasol a chyfle cyfartal yn dair egwyddor sylfaenol yng ngwaith y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol. Yn yr achos hwn, bydd yr egwyddorion hyn yn goleuo’r gwaith o baratoi a gweithredu cynllun cydraddoldeb hiliol y sefydliad hwn.

I welcome the steps listed in the scheme for promoting equality within the Assembly and, I hope, by example, outside the Assembly. The scheme includes a considerable list of achievements, one of the most prominent of which is the influence that the Assembly’s racial equality policies has exerted on Assembly sponsored public bodies, and, through the voluntary code of practice, on suppliers of services to the National Assembly.

Croesawaf y camau a restrwyd yn y cynllun i hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb o fewn y Cynulliad ac, yr wyf yn gobeithio, drwy esiampl, y tu allan i’r Cynulliad. Mae’r cynllun yn cynnwys rhestr faith o gyflawniadau, ac un o’r amlycaf ohonynt yw’r dylanwad a gafodd polisïau cydraddoldeb hiliol y Cynulliad ar y cyrff cyhoeddus a noddir gan y Cynulliad, a, thrwy’r cod ymarfer gwirfoddol, ar gyflenwyr gwasanaethau i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol.

I am also pleased to see the plans for assessing the impact of policies that promote race equality and the intention to collect data in the process. Will the Minister issue a report in the near future on the Government’s reaction to data released last year, which showed that 95 per cent of young Somali males in Cardiff were unemployed?

Yr wyf hefyd yn falch o weld y cynlluniau i asesu effaith polisïau sy’n hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb hiliol a’r bwriad i gasglu data wrth wneud hynny. A wnaiff y Gweinidog gyhoeddi adroddiad yn y dyfodol agos ar ymateb y Llywodraeth i ddata a ryddhawyd y llynedd, a ddangosodd fod 95 y cant o’r dynion Somalïaidd ifanc yng Nghaerdydd yn ddi-waith?

In the section on employment, I note that the National Assembly is committed to a policy of equality of opportunity for all staff, regardless of ethnic origin, religious belief, gender, sexual orientation and disability. I also note the absence of a reference to language. Does this absence explain why only 3 per cent of staff in Cathays Park are bilingual in Welsh and English? Or did a fellow member of the Committee on Equality of Opportunity explain this discrimination when she suggested in Committee that the negative recruitment policy as regards bilingualism reflected the fact that the umbilical cord between Whitehall and Cathays Park has not been cut?

Yn yr adran ar gyflogaeth, sylwaf fod y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol wedi ymrwymo i bolisi o gyfle cyfartal i’r holl staff beth bynnag fo’u tarddiad ethnig, eu cred grefyddol, eu rhyw, eu tueddiad rhywiol a’u hanabledd. Sylwaf hefyd nad oes cyfeiriad at iaith. Ai’r diffyg hwnnw sy’n egluro pam mai dim ond 3 y cant o’r staff ym Mharc Cathays sy’n ddwyieithog yn y Gymraeg a’r Saesneg? Neu a wnaeth cyd-aelod o’r Pwyllgor Cyfle Cyfartal egluro’r gwahaniaethu hwn pan awgrymodd yn y Pwyllgor fod y polisi recriwtio negyddol o ran dwyieithrwydd yn adlewyrchu’r ffaith nad yw’r llinyn bogail rhwng Whitehall a Pharc Cathays wedi’i dorri?

However, I am neither cynical nor complacent on equality of opportunity or race equality. The Committee made great strides forward under Edwina Hart’s leadership and I am sure that we will do the same with Carwyn Jones at the helm. Progress will continue apace after May 2003 when Helen Mary Jones becomes Chair.

Er hynny, nid wyf yn sinigaidd nac yn ddifater ynghylch cyfle cyfartal na chydraddoldeb hiliol. Cymerodd y Pwyllgor gamau bras ymlaen dan arweinyddiaeth Edwina Hart ac yr wyf yn sicr y gwnawn yr un peth â Carwyn Jones wrth y llyw. Bydd y cynnydd buan yn parhau ar ôl Mai 2003 pan ddaw Helen Mary Jones yn Gadeirydd.

David Davies spoken in English p. 83

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 83

I represent a generation of people who have grown up and been educated with friends of various ethnic origin, without thinking that there was anything strange about that. My attitude towards race and race relations is possibly slightly different to that of those who belong to generations where overtly racist behaviour was considered acceptable. Perhaps that is what leads me to question the need for the endless plethora of publicly funded bodies that have sprung up, supposedly to eradicate racism in what must be one of the most tolerant countries in the world. If this country was anything other than a beacon of tolerance and good race relations, we would not be such an attractive destination for poor people from all corners of the world, who often come here via other European countries.

Yr wyf yn cynrychioli cenhedlaeth o bobl sydd wedi tyfu a chael ei haddysgu gyda ffrindiau o wahanol darddiadau ethnig, heb feddwl bod dim byd rhyfedd am hynny. Mae fy agwedd at hil a chysylltiadau hiliol ychydig yn wahanol o bosibl i’r rhai sy’n perthyn i genedlaethau lle yr ystyrid bod ymddygiad hiliol agored yn dderbyniol. Efallai mai hynny sy’n peri imi gwestiynu’r angen am y gormodedd di-ben-draw o gyrff a noddir yn gyhoeddus sydd wedi codi i ddileu hiliaeth, fel y tybir, mewn gwlad sy’n sicr o fod ymysg y rhai mwyaf goddefgar yn y byd. Pe bai’r wlad hon yn ddim heblaw esiampl o oddefgarwch a chysylltiadau hiliol da, ni fyddem yn gyrchfan mor ddeniadol i bobl dlawd o bedwar ban y byd, a ddaw yma’n aml drwy wledydd eraill yn Ewrop.

I do not suggest that problems do not exist. In fact, there has been a worrying rise in anti-Semitism recently. It is right that we should tackle those problems. However, I am afraid that the action of certain organisations, which should be tackling racism, are counter-productive. For example, the Minority Ethnic Women’s Network Cymru, which was set up partly with lottery funding and partly with Assembly funding. Its activities include taking black and Asian women on free trips to tourist attractions.

Nid wyf yn awgrymu nad oes problemau. Mewn gwirionedd, bu cynnydd gofidus mewn gwrth-Semitiaeth yn ddiweddar. Mae’n briodol inni fynd i’r afael â’r problemau hyn. Er hynny, mae arnaf ofn bod gweithredoedd rhai cyrff, a ddylai fod yn ymladd â hiliaeth, yn wrthgynhyrchiol. Er enghraifft, Rhwydwaith Menywod Lleiafrifoedd Ethnig Cymru, a sefydlwyd yn rhannol ag arian loteri ac yn rhannol ag arian y Cynulliad. Mae ei weithgareddau’n cynnwys mynd â menywod du ac Asiaidd ar deithiau am ddim i atyniadau twristaidd.

Peter Law spoken in English p. 84

Peter Law siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 84

I assume that this is a personal contribution. Your disgraceful comments on vulnerable people fleeing all kinds of oppression do not represent the view of the Welsh Conservative Party. Will someone disown them?

Cymeraf mai cyfraniad personol yw hwn. Nid yw’ch sylwadau gwarthus am bobl ddiamddiffyn sy’n ffoi rhag pob math o ormes yn cynrychioli barn Plaid Geidwadol Cymru. A wnaiff rhywun eu gwrthod?

David Davies spoken in English p. 84

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 84

I simply made the comment that many poor people come here from all corners of the world. That is a recognised fact with which your own Secretary of State for the Home Department would agree.

Dim ond dweud a wneuthum fod llawer o bobl dlawd yn dod yma o bedwar ban y byd. Mae honno’n ffaith gydnabyddedig y byddai’ch Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yr Adran Gartref yn ei derbyn.

I return to the subject of MEWN Cymru. Its motives are honourable and, in fairness, its organiser was happy to talk to me. However, she made it clear that white people were not wanted on its trips because its clients were not comfortable with that. That is sad. The whole idea about groups such as MEWN Cymru should be to break down barriers between ethnic groups, not perpetuate them by discouraging minorities from socialising with the rest of the population. I do not want to single out MEWN Cymru. Its attitude is a symptom of a general view, which, I am afraid, emanates from Government and is influenced by middle-class white professionals in public life. That view is that new arrivals to this country should not feel under any pressure to assimilate or fit in with the prevailing culture—

Af yn ôl at bwnc MEWN Cymru. Mae ei gymhellion yn anrhydeddus ac, er tegwch, yr oedd ei drefnydd yn barod iawn i siarad â mi. Fodd bynnag, fe roddodd ar ddeall nad oedd croeso i bobl wyn ar ei deithiau gan nad oedd ei gleientiaid yn teimlo’n esmwyth ynghylch hynny. Mae hynny’n drist. Holl amcan grwpiau fel MEWN Cymru yw dymchwel muriau rhwng grwpiau ethnig, nid eu parhau drwy annog lleiafrifoedd i beidio â chymdeithasu â gweddill y boblogaeth. Nid wyf yn dymuno sôn yn neilltuol am MEWN Cymru. Mae ei agwedd yn symptom o farn gyffredinol sydd, mae arnaf ofn, yn deillio o’r Llywodraeth ac sydd dan ddylanwad gweithwyr proffesiynol gwyn dosbarth canol mewn bywyd cyhoeddus. Y farn honno yw na ddylai’r rhai sy’n cyrraedd y wlad hon o’r newydd deimlo eu bod dan unrhyw bwysau i gymathu neu ymaddasu at y prif ddiwylliant—

Lorraine Barrett a gododd—

Lorraine Barrett rose—

David Davies spoken in English p. 85

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 85

I will give way in a second. I just want to make this point: if we take this view, we could be creating the kind of ghettos—or, even worse, a form of de facto apartheid, the results of which I saw in South Africa recently—where everyone lives among their own ethnic groups instead of everyone mingling and mixing with each other, which is my vision of Britain.

Ildiaf mewn eiliad. Nid wyf ond am wneud y pwynt hwn: os arddelwn y farn hon, gallem greu’r math o getoau—neu’n waeth byth, math o apartheid yn ôl y ffaith, y gwelais ei ganlyniadau yn Ne Affrica’n ddiweddar—lle y mae pawb yn byw ymysg eu grwpiau ethnig eu hunain yn hytrach na bod pawb yn cymysgu â’i gilydd, sef fy ngweledigaeth i o Brydain.

Lorraine Barrett spoken in English p. 85

Lorraine Barrett siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 85

You will be surprised to know that I have never had any problems in attending meetings or events organised by MEWN Cymru. I hope that there will be a time, and I ask you to share that hope, when we will not need these specialist groups that enable people to build confidence and become part of our society. However, until everyone is as tolerant as you are, David, we must provide funds and resources to help certain people gain that confidence in order to participate in our society.

Byddwch yn synnu o wybod na chefais erioed unrhyw broblemau o ran mynychu cyfarfodydd neu ddigwyddiadau a drefnwyd gan MEWN Cymru. Gobeithiaf y daw’r amser, a gofynnaf ichi rannu’r gobaith hwnnw, pan na fydd arnom angen y grwpiau arbenigol hyn sy’n galluogi pobl i fagu hyder a dod yn rhan o’n cymdeithas. Fodd bynnag, hyd nes y bydd pawb mor oddefgar ag yr ydych chi, David, rhaid inni ddarparu cyllid ac adnoddau i helpu rhai pobl i fagu’r hyder hwnnw er mwyn cymryd rhan yn ein cymdeithas.

David Davies spoken in English p. 85

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 85

As regards attending MEWN Cymru’s meetings, I am only repeating what its organiser told me. She said that its clients would not feel comfortable if white people went on its trips. However, I agree that we would be much better off if groups such as MEWN Cymru were not needed. I agree that we need groups to combat racism but I am concerned about the attitude of some of these groups and whether they are combating racism or making it worse.

O ran mynychu cyfarfodydd MEWN Cymru, nid wyf ond yn ailadrodd yr hyn a ddywedodd ei drefnydd wrthyf. Dywedodd na fyddai ei gleientiaid yn teimlo’n esmwyth ped âi pobl wyn ar ei deithiau. Fodd bynnag, yr wyf yn cytuno y byddai’n llawer gwell arnom pe na bai angen grwpiau fel MEWN Cymru. Cytunaf fod arnom angen grwpiau i ymladd â hiliaeth ond yr wyf yn bryderus ynghylch agwedd rhai o’r grwpiau hyn ac a ydynt yn ymladd â hiliaeth neu’n ei gwaethygu.

There is a further danger. You are British regardless of your skin colour; I do not want any of my fellow citizens to be treated any more, or less, favourably because they are black, brown, white, male or female. I do not want to live in a country in which communities see themselves as being in Britain, but are not British in any way.

Mae perygl pellach. Prydeiniwr ydych beth bynnag fo lliw eich croen; nid wyf am i unrhyw un o’m cyd-ddinasyddion gael ei drin yn ddim mwy, neu lai, ffafriol am ei fod yn ddu, yn frown, yn wyn, yn wryw neu’n fenyw. Nid wyf am fyw mewn gwlad lle y mae cymunedau sy’n ystyried eu bod ym Mhrydain, ond heb fod yn Brydeinig o gwbl.

Helen Mary Jones spoken in English p. 86

Helen Mary Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86

We all know that your aspirations in that regard are honourable, David, but will you explain that directly to the sheikh of a mosque in Llanelli who was spat at, had beer poured over him and whose mosque was attacked because he had brown skin and was a Muslim? Do you acknowledge that, as long as people face such pressures and dangers, they will need safe spaces, such as in MEWN Cymru, where they can come together and become part of our society and not assimilate. I loathe the word ‘assimilate’. As a Welsh-speaking Welshwoman, I refuse to assimilate into English culture. People need safe places, because society simply is not safe.

Yr ydym oll yn gwybod bod eich dyheadau yn hynny o beth yn anrhydeddus, David, ond a wnewch egluro hynny’n uniongyrchol i’r shîc mewn mosg yn Llanelli y poerwyd arno, yr arllwyswyd cwrw drosto ac yr ymosodwyd ar ei fosg am fod ei groen yn frown ac am ei fod yn Foslem? A ydych yn cytuno, cyhyd ag y bo pobl yn wynebu pwysau a pheryglon o’r fath, y bydd arnynt angen lleoedd diogel, fel a geir yn MEWN Cymru, lle y gallant ddod at ei gilydd a dod yn rhan o’n cymdeithas a pheidio â chymathu. Mae gas gennyf y gair ‘cymathu’. Fel Cymraes Gymraeg, gwrthodaf gymathu â’r diwylliant Saesneg. Mae ar bobl angen lleoedd diogel, a hynny am nad yw cymdeithas yn ddiogel.

David Davies spoken in English p. 86

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86

Of course that is disgraceful, but I am afraid that I also detect—and I hate to say this—hypocrisy. Whenever Asian people are attacked by whites, the issue is raised publicly, and rightly so. However, whenever white people are attacked by Asians, it is not. That is not acceptable either.

Mae hynny’n warthus, wrth gwrs, ond mae arnaf ofn fy mod hefyd yn synhwyro—ac mae’n gas gennyf ddweud hyn—ragrith. Pryd bynnag yr ymosodir ar bobl Asiaidd gan bobl wyn, codir y mater yn gyhoeddus, ac mae hynny’n briodol. Fodd bynnag, pryd bynnag yr ymosodir ar bobl wyn gan Asiaid, ni ddigwydd hynny. Nid yw hynny’n dderbyniol ychwaith.

I accept that this is a sensitive matter, and I hope that those who disagree will see my concerns for what they are. I am concerned about Government policies and agencies, and I am not in any way criticising any ethnic group. Contrary to the recent disgraceful comments of the chairman of the Crown Prosecution Service, the majority of people in this country are not racist, but a small minority of black, white and Asian people are. That is wrong and we should tackle it.

Derbyniaf fod hyn yn fater sensitif, ac yr wyf yn gobeithio y bydd y rhai sy’n anghytuno’n gweld fy mhryderon am yr hyn ydynt. Yr wyf yn bryderus ynghylch polisïau ac asiantaethau Llywodraeth, ac nid wyf yn beirniadu unrhyw grŵp ethnig o gwbl. Yn groes i sylwadau gwarthus cadeirydd Gwasanaeth Erlyn y Goron yn ddiweddar, nid yw’r mwyafrif o bobl y wlad hon yn hiliol, ond y mae lleiafrif bach o bobl ddu, gwyn ac Asiaidd. Mae hynny’n beth drwg a dylem fynd i’r afael ag ef.

There is also a tendency to throw accusations of racism at anyone who dares to speak out against the race relations sector. If those who express divergent views are not allowed a fair hearing, then I fear for the future of race relations in this country.

Mae tuedd hefyd i daflu cyhuddiadau o hiliaeth at rywun sy’n meiddio codi’i lais yn erbyn y sector cysylltiadau hiliol. Os na chaniateir gwrandawiad teg i rai sy’n mynegi barn wahanol, yr wyf yn poeni ynghylch cysylltiadau hiliol yn y dyfodol yn y wlad hon.

Janet Ryder spoken in English p. 86

Janet Ryder siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 86

David has just said that the majority of people are not racist. However, it is difficult to change the public face of statutory bodies, and if schemes such as this are to succeed, they must be led from the top down. This scheme has been strongly directed, and it has benefited from that. As Edwina Hart always said, she wants these schemes to influence the bodies with which we work. Local government forms a major part of these bodies, and authorities have signed up to the leadership challenge. They realise that there are problems that must be faced and addressed.

Mae David newydd ddweud nad yw mwyafrif y bobl yn hiliol. Er hynny, mae’n anodd newid wyneb cyhoeddus y cyrff statudol, ac os yw cynlluniau fel hwn i lwyddo, rhaid eu harwain o’r pen i’r gwaelod. Mae’r cynllun hwn wedi’i lywio’n gadarn, ac mae ar ei ennill oherwydd hynny. Fel y dywedai Edwina Hart bob amser, mae’n dymuno i’r cynlluniau hyn ddylanwadu ar y cyrff yr ydym yn gweithio â hwy. Mae llywodraeth leol yn gyfran fawr o’r cyrff hynny, ac mae’r awdurdodau wedi ymuno â’r her arweinyddiaeth. Maent yn sylweddoli bod problemau y mae’n rhaid eu hwynebu a’u trin.

It is interesting to read statistics such as those recently published in the National Census of Local Authority Councillors in England and Wales 2001. Syniad has analysed the statistics pertaining to Wales. Many councillors responded to the census and, unfortunately, it still shows that 99 per cent of them are white, only 19 per cent are female, and 15.3 per cent have a disability. There remains a long way to go to change that overriding image of our council chambers as being dominated by white males with an average age of 59. As we develop our scheme, we must influence the bodies that we work with to develop their own schemes. They are doing that, but we must ensure that they are implemented. That survey also shows other interesting statistics, as it makes comparisons with the 1997 survey. Since then, more councillors have a caring responsibility for dependants. They are also more likely to represent Plaid Cymru, whereas they are less likely to be unemployed, and less likely to represent the Labour Party. Therefore, 99 per cent of councillors are white. This Chamber is 100 per cent white. We have a long way to go in changing our elected representatives. We must play our part in that. This scheme must lead by example. It must play its part by influencing other bodies and changing the face of all of our elected bodies in Wales.

Mae’n ddiddorol darllen ystadegau fel y rhai a gyhoeddwyd yn ddiweddar yng Nghyfrifiad Cenedlaethol Cynghorwyr Awdurdod Lleol yng Nghymru a Lloegr 2001. Mae Syniad wedi dadansoddi’r ystadegau sy’n ymwneud â Chymru. Ymatebodd llawer o gynghorwyr i’r cyfrifiad ac mae’n dal i ddangos, gwaetha’r modd, fod 99 y cant ohonynt yn wyn, mai dim ond 19 y cant sy’n fenywod, ac mai 15.3 y cant sydd ag anabledd. Mae llawer iawn i’w wneud eto i newid y ddelwedd gyffredinol o’n siambrau cyngor o rai lle y mae dynion gwyn ag oedran cyfartalog o 59 yn dal yr awenau. Wrth inni ddatblygu ein cynllun, rhaid inni ddylanwadu ar y cyrff yr ydym yn gweithio â hwy fel eu bod yn datblygu eu cynlluniau eu hunain. Maent yn gwneud hynny, ond rhaid inni sicrhau y cânt eu gweithredu. Mae’r arolwg hwnnw’n dangos ystadegau diddorol eraill hefyd, gan ei fod yn tynnu cymariaethau â’r arolwg yn 1997. Ers hynny, mae mwy o gynghorwyr â chyfrifoldeb gofalu am ddibynyddion. Maent hefyd yn fwy tebygol o gynrychioli Plaid Cymru, tra byddont yn llai tebygol o fod yn ddi-waith, ac yn llai tebygol o gynrychioli’r Blaid Lafur. Felly, mae 99 y cant o’r cynghorwyr yn wyn. Mae’r Siambr hon yn 100 y cant yn wyn. Mae gennym lawer iawn i’w wneud o ran newid ein cynrychiolwyr etholedig. Rhaid inni chwarae ein rhan yn hynny. Rhaid i’r cynllun hwn arwain drwy esiampl. Rhaid iddo chwarae’i ran drwy ddylanwadu ar gyrff eraill a newid wyneb ein cyrff etholedig yng Nghymru.

Carwyn Jones Y Gweinidog dros Lywodraeth Agored siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 87

Carwyn Jones The Minister for Open Government spoken in Welsh p. 87

Hoffwn ateb pwyntiau Helen Mary yn gyntaf, a chroesawu ei chefnogaeth i’r cynllun hwn.

I will respond to Helen Mary’s points first, and welcome her support for this scheme.

Y mae’n wir i ddweud y bu problemau yn y gorffennol o ran rhoi’r cynllun ar waith. Cafodd y problemau hynny eu datrys erbyn hyn, a’r rhaid inni sicrhau y caiff gwersi eu dysgu yn y dyfodol. Yr ydym yn awyddus i wneud hynny.

It is true that there have been problems in the past in terms of implementing the scheme. Those problems have since been resolved, and we must ensure that lessons are learned in future. We are anxious to do that.

Mae staffio a’r gefnogaeth sydd ar gael i’r Pwyllgor a’r Gweinidog yn cael eu hystyried, er mwyn cryfhau’r uned polisi cydraddoldeb drwy gyflogi mwy o staff. Derbyniaf hynny.

Staffing and background support for the Committee and the Minister are currently being considered to strengthen the equality policy unit by bringing in more staff. I accept that.

Soniodd David Melding am gael adolygiad cyn pen pum mlynedd, a gallwn ystyried hynny’n fanwl os bydd angen. Bydd adolygiad ar ôl blwyddyn beth bynnag. Ynglŷn â sylw Owen John Thomas mai dim ond 3 y cant o staff Parc Cathays sydd yn siarad Cymraeg, ni chredaf y bu polisi i sicrhau bod neb yn siarad Cymraeg ym Mharc Cathays. Os oes angen cynyddu’r nifer o staff sy’n siarad Cymraeg yno, rhaid inni ystyried hynny. Mewn rhai o swyddfeydd eraill y Cynulliad, megis swyddfa Caernarfon, mae bron pawb yn siarad Cymraeg. Mae dros hanner staff swyddfa Caerfyrddin yn siarad Cymraeg ac mae nifer yn siarad Cymraeg yn swyddfa Llandrindod. Nid yw’n wir bod polisi a wnaed ers tro i rwystro siaradwyr Cymraeg rhag ymuno â’r gwasanaeth sifil.

David Melding mentioned conducting a pre-quinquennial review, and we can consider that in more detail if necessary. A review is already due to be undertaken at the end of the first year. On Owen John Thomas’s comment that only 3 per cent of Cathays Park staff are Welsh speakers, I do not believe that there was a policy to ensure that there were no Welsh-speaking staff in Cathays Park. If there is a need to increase the number of Welsh-speaking staff there, we must consider that. In some other Assembly offices, such as the Caernarfon office, nearly everyone speaks Welsh. Over half the staff at the Carmarthen office speak Welsh and there are many Welsh speakers in the Llandrindod office. It is not true that there has been a longstanding policy to prevent Welsh speakers from being appointed to the civil service.

Dafydd Wigley siaradwyd yn Gymraeg t. 88

Dafydd Wigley spoken in Welsh p. 88

A ydych yn fodlon mai dim ond 3 y cant o’r staff ym Mharc Cathays sydd yn siarad Cymraeg?

Are you content that only 3 per cent of Cathays Park staff are Welsh speakers?

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Gymraeg ac yn Saesneg t. 88

Carwyn Jones spoken in Welsh and English p. 88

Os yw’r ffigur hwnnw’n gywir rhaid inni ystyried sut y gallwn gynyddu’r nifer o’r staff ym Mharc Cathays sy’n siarad Cymraeg. Nid wyf yn dweud ein bod yn derbyn hyn, ond gwrthwynebaf unrhyw honiadau y bu polisi bwriadol i atal siaradwyr Cymraeg rhag ymuno â’r gwasanaeth sifil. Mae hynny’n dwp.

in Welsh If that figure is correct we must consider how we can increase the number of Welsh speakers among Cathays Park staff. I am not saying that we believe that this is acceptable, but I reject any claims that there has been a deliberate policy to dissuade Welsh speakers from joining the civil service. That is nonsense.

I will deal with David Davies’s comments. It is not right to say that the United Kingdom is based on tolerance. You only need to study the history of the UK to see that. The Jews were expelled from England in 1216. There were penal laws against the Welsh from 1536 onwards, and it is still possible to get shot with a bow and arrow in Chester or Shrewsbury if you are Welsh and are found there after 12 o’clock at night. There were penal laws against Catholics in Ireland for many years and it is still not possible for a Roman Catholic to inherit the throne of the United Kingdom. There were penal laws against the people in the Highlands after the Highland risings. Apartheid was effectively invented by the British wherever they went in the world and it was taken up by the Afrikaners in South Africa and made law in 1948. What you see in South Africa is not de facto apartheid, it is de jure apartheid. It is the most poisonous form of society that is possible to construct. You must accept that. It is not right to say that racial laws and laws that promote racism are the inventions of others because, in many cases, they have been the inventions of Britain. It is not right to say that we do not have communities who do not want to be British. That is the case in Northern Ireland, where at least 40 per cent of the population do not want to be British. There are communities there where people do not regard themselves as British in any way—

yn Saesneg Ymdriniaf â sylwadau David Davies. Nid yw’n gywir dweud bod y Deyrnas Unedig yn seiliedig ar oddefgarwch. Nid oes ond rhaid ichi astudio hanes y DU i weld hynny. Bwriwyd yr Iddewon allan o Loegr yn 1216. Bu deddfau cosb yn erbyn y Cymry o 1536 ymlaen, ac mae’n dal i fod yn bosibl cael eich saethu â bwa saeth yng Nghaer neu yn Amwythig os ydych yn Gymro a chithau wedi’ch darganfod yno ar ôl 12 o’r gloch y nos. Bu deddfau cosb yn erbyn Catholigion yn Iwerddon am flynyddoedd lawer ac mae’n dal i fod yn amhosibl i Gatholig etifeddu gorsedd y Deyrnas Unedig. Bu deddfau cosb yn erbyn y bobl yn Ucheldiroedd yr Alban ar ôl gwrthryfeloedd yr Ucheldiroedd. Y Prydeinwyr a ddyfeisodd apartheid i bob pwrpas ym mha le bynnag yr aent yn y byd ac fe’i harddelwyd gan yr Affricaneriaid yn Ne Affrica a’i wneud yn ddeddf yn 1948. Nid apartheid yn ôl y ffaith yw’r hyn a welwch yn Ne Affrica, ond apartheid yn ôl y gyfraith. Dyna’r math mwyaf gwenwynig o gymdeithas y mae modd ei greu. Rhaid ichi dderbyn hynny. Nid yw’n gywir dweud mai eraill a ddyfeisiodd ddeddfau hiliol a deddfau sy’n hyrwyddo hiliaeth oherwydd, mewn llawer achos, Prydain a’u dyfeisiodd. Nid yw’n gywir dweud nad oes gennym gymunedau nad ydynt am fod yn Brydeinig. Mae hynny’n wir yng Ngogledd Iwerddon, lle y mae o leiaf 40 y cant o’r boblogaeth nad ydynt am fod yn Brydeinig. Mae cymunedau yno lle nad yw’r bobl yn eu hystyried eu hunain yn Brydeinwyr o gwbl—

David Davies spoken in English p. 89

David Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 89

That was my point. I made the point about Northern Ireland in a previous speech. If you have a situation where a large number of people feel no loyalty towards the idea or the state of Britain, it is a recipe for urban disaster. If we are not careful, we will see that happening in certain communities across England and possibly in Wales. That is why it is so important that we encourage people to feel proud of Britain. I am disappointed that a Minister of your knowledge and learning is so ashamed of this country’s history. You have highlighted one or two bad points, but there is so much in this country of which we can be proud.

Dyna’r pwynt a oedd gennyf. Gwneuthum y pwynt hwnnw am Ogledd Iwerddon mewn araith flaenorol. Os oes gennych sefyllfa lle y mae nifer fawr o bobl nad ydynt yn teimlo unrhyw deyrngarwch at y syniad o Brydain neu wladwriaeth Prydain, yr ydych yn sicr o gael trychineb yn y trefi. Os na fyddwn yn ofalus, fe welwn hynny’n digwydd mewn rhai cymunedau ledled Lloegr ac yng Nghymru o bosibl. Dyna pam y mae mor bwysig inni annog pobl i ymfalchïo ym Mhrydain. Yr wyf yn siomedig bod Gweinidog mor wybodus a dysgedig â chi’n teimlo’r fath gywilydd o hanes y wlad hon. Yr ydych wedi tynnu sylw at un neu ddau o bwyntiau drwg, ond mae cymaint yn y wlad hon y gallwn ymfalchïo ynddo.

Carwyn Jones spoken in English p. 89

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 89

There is much that this country has contributed to the world, but much of it has been negative. There is no point trying to gloss over the facts. A sign of a mature nation state is its ability to realise the mistakes of the past and revel in the achievements of the past. To gloss over what has happened is not right. You raised the point, David, by suggesting that this country has always been a beacon of tolerance. Yes, there are many examples of good practice in this country, but let us not forget what has happened in our history, the penal laws, the discrimination and the racism that existed throughout the history of the United Kingdom, of which Welsh people have been a part. Let us not think that we are outside all this and that our genetic make-up means that somehow we are not primarily racist. We have been part of it. In 1888, Welsh people rioted against the Irish in Tredegar. That was a long time ago, but let us not think that we in Wales are superior when it comes to racism or anti-racism.

Mae’r wlad hon wedi cyfrannu llawer i’r byd, ond bu llawer ohono’n negyddol. Ofer yw ceisio celu’r ffeithiau. Nod cenedl-wladwriaeth aeddfed yw ei gallu i sylweddoli’r camgymeriadau a wnaed yn y gorffennol ac ymfalchïo yn llwyddiannau’r gorffennol. Nid yw’n iawn celu’r hyn a ddigwyddodd. Chi a gododd y pwynt, David, drwy awgrymu bod y wlad hon yn batrwm o oddefgarwch erioed. Oes, mae llawer o enghreifftiau o arfer da yn y wlad hon, ond na foed inni anghofio’r hyn a ddigwyddodd yn ein hanes, y deddfau cosb, y gwahaniaethu a’r hiliaeth a fodolai drwy hanes y Deyrnas Unedig, y bu pobl Cymru’n rhan ohonynt. Na foed inni dybio ein bod y tu allan i hyn i gyd a bod ein gwneuthuriad genetig yn golygu nad ydym rywsut yn hiliol yn bennaf. Buom yn rhan ohono. Yn 1888, bu terfysg ymysg y Cymry yn erbyn y Gwyddelod yn Nhredegar. Yr oedd hynny amser maith yn ôl, ond na foed inni dybio ein bod ni yng Nghymru’n well o ran hiliaeth neu wrth-hiliaeth.

John Griffiths spoken in English p. 90

John Griffiths siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 90

David Davies said that there is racism in all communities, which is the case, but is it not the case that in democracies through the ages, it has been necessary to protect minorities because they are in a potentially vulnerable situation. In that respect, black minorities are particularly vulnerable because they are visibly in a minority. Do you accept that?

Dywedodd David Davies fod hiliaeth ym mhob cymuned, ac mae hynny’n wir, ond onid yw’n wir y bu angen mewn democratiaethau drwy’r oesoedd i amddiffyn lleiafrifoedd gan y gallent fod yn agored i niwed. Yn hynny o beth, mae lleiafrifoedd du’n arbennig o agored i niwed gan y gellir gweld eu bod yn lleiafrif. A ydych yn derbyn hynny?

Carwyn Jones spoken in English p. 90

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 90

That must be right. It is not just correct in the UK; it is correct in other countries. The USA prides itself on freedom. However, in the past, it has had some of the most discriminatory laws imaginable and there was also, in effect, a policy of genocide against the native American population, especially during the nineteenth century, when the concept of manifest destiny—that people with red skins were doomed to die out—was part of official Government thinking in America. I suggest that no country in the world is completely free of the taint of racism. We must accept that and move on. The difficulty in Northern Ireland is that one part of the community will never accept that it is Irish and another will never accept that it is British. There is no common ground, so it is particularly difficult.

Mae hynny’n sicr o fod yn wir. Nid yw’n wir am y DU yn unig; mae’n wir am wledydd eraill. Mae UDA yn ymffrostio mewn rhyddid. Fodd bynnag, yn y gorffennol, meddai ar rai o’r deddfau mwyaf gwahaniaethol y gellid eu dychmygu ac yr oedd yno hefyd, i bob pwrpas, bolisi o hil-laddiad yn erbyn y boblogaeth Americanaidd frodorol, yn enwedig yn ystod y bedwaredd ganrif ar bymtheg, pan oedd y cysyniad o dynged amlwg—bod pobl â chroen coch wedi’u tynghedu i ddarfod o’r tir—yn rhan o feddwl swyddogol y Llywodraeth yn America. Awgrymaf nad oes yr un wlad yn y byd sy’n gwbl rydd oddi wrth staen hiliaeth. Rhaid inni dderbyn hynny a symud ymlaen. Yr anhawster a geir yng Ngogledd Iwerddon yw bod un rhan o’r gymuned na wnaiff byth dderbyn ei bod yn Wyddelig a rhan arall na wnaiff byth dderbyn ei bod yn Brydeinig. Nid oes tir cyffredin, felly mae’n arbennig o anodd.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 90

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 90

I regret the antagonistic way in which the Minister addressed David Davies’s contribution. [ASSEMBLY MEMBERS: ‘Oh.’] I would be grateful if I could make my contribution without heckling. [Laughter.]

Yr oedd modd gelyniaethus y Gweinidog o ymateb i gyfraniad David Davies yn ofid i mi. [AELODAU CYNULLIAD: ‘O.’] Byddwn yn ddiolchgar o gael gwneud fy nghyfraniad heb i neb weiddi ar draws. [Chwerthin.]

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 91

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

Order. You are quite right, Alun. You have the right to be heard and you have my protection. However, we are short of time.

Trefn. Yr ydych yn llygad eich lle, Alun. Mae gennych hawl i gael gwrandawiad a gwnaf eich amddiffyn. Fodd bynnag, yr ydym yn brin o amser.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 91

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

Was not the thrust of David Davies’s speech sensitive and sensible, when he stated that we all have an obligation in this? We have an obligation, as primarily middle-class white people, to safeguard the interests of minority groups, but those groups also have an obligation to integrate within society to ensure that racism is completely dissipated.

Onid oedd byrdwn araith David Davies yn sensitif ac yn synhwyrol, pan ddywedodd fod rheidrwydd arnom i gyd yn hyn o beth? Mae rheidrwydd arnom, fel pobl wyn ddosbarth canol gan mwyaf, i ddiogelu buddiannau grwpiau lleiafrifol, ond mae rheidrwydd ar y grwpiau hynny i integreiddio â chymdeithas er mwyn sicrhau bod hiliaeth yn cael ei chwalu’n llwyr.

Carwyn Jones spoken in English p. 91

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

My response to David was based on what he said. I attempted to highlight the facts of the situation, rather than sling mud at him. I have been careful to explain the history of this country and where we are coming from. We are not in a situation where we can claim to be completely free of past events. David feels that he belongs to a generation where multi-racialism is standard. I am only four years older than David. Even so, it is not enough for us to say that that means that everything is alright. We must continue to make progress on this. We saw racial tension last year, particularly in Oldham, stirred up by the British National Party. That shows that racism can still come to the fore, and it must always be beaten back. This scheme is aimed at ensuring that we never forget that.

Ymatebais i David ar sail yr hyn a ddywedodd. Ceisiais dynnu sylw at ffeithiau’r sefyllfa, yn hytrach na thaflu baw ato. Cymerais ofal i egluro hanes y wlad hon a beth yw ein cefndir. Nid ydym mewn sefyllfa lle y gallwn honni ein bod yn gwbl rydd oddi wrth ddigwyddiadau’r gorffennol. Mae David yn teimlo ei fod yn perthyn i genhedlaeth lle y mae amlhiliaeth yn arferol. Nid wyf ond yn bedair blynedd yn hŷn na David. Er hynny, nid yw hynny’n ddigon inni allu dweud bod popeth yn iawn. Rhaid inni barhau i wneud cynnydd ar hynny. Gwelsom dyndra hiliol y llynedd, yn enwedig yn Oldham, a ysgogwyd gan y Blaid Genedlaethol Brydeinig. Mae hynny’n dangos y gall hiliaeth ddod i’r blaen o hyd, a rhaid inni ei churo i lawr bob amser. Amcan y cynllun hwn yw sicrhau na wnawn byth anghofio hynny.

Alun Cairns spoken in English p. 91

Alun Cairns siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

Will you address the comments raised by David Davies about some of the state-sponsored bodies that could better integrate with society? Will you express your views on that?

A wnewch ymdrin â’r sylwadau gan David Davies am rai o’r cyrff a noddir gan y wladwriaeth a allai integreiddio â chymdeithas yn well? A wnewch fynegi’ch barn am hynny?

Carwyn Jones spoken in English p. 91

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 91

The experience of people who come to this country has always been that they form part of the mainstream of society. Where they have been prevented from doing so, we have sought to tackle that. There is no-one in our society who does not want to feel part of the United Kingdom. However, people legitimately want to preserve their culture and traditions. We are fighting to ensure that in Wales. There is nothing wrong with that. To suggest that people who keep their own culture and traditions cannot be properly British is to suggest that people cannot be Welsh and British. I reject that, as I know that people want to be Welsh and British. [Interruption.]

Profiad y bobl a ddaw i’r wlad hon erioed yw eu bod yn dod yn rhan o brif ffrwd cymdeithas. Pan rwystrwyd hwy rhag gwneud hynny, gwnaethom geisio mynd i’r afael â hynny. Nid oes neb yn ein cymdeithas nad yw’n dymuno teimlo ei fod yn rhan o’r Deyrnas Unedig. Fodd bynnag, mae pobl yn dymuno cadw eu diwylliant a’u traddodiadau, a hynny’n gwbl gyfiawn. Yr ydym yn ymladd i sicrhau hynny yng Nghymru. Nid oes dim o’i le ar hynny. Mae awgrymu nad yw rhai sy’n cadw eu diwylliant a’u traddodiadau eu hunain yn gallu bod yn wir Brydeinwyr yn gyfystyr ag awgrymu na all pobl fod yn Gymry ac yn Brydeinwyr. Gwrthodaf hynny, gan fy mod yn gwybod bod pobl am fod yn Gymry ac yn Brydeinwyr. [Torri ar draws.]

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 92

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 92

Order. There is no time for interventions. The Minister is coming to a close.

Trefn. Nid oes amser ar gyfer ymyriadau. Mae’r Gweinidog yn dod i’r diwedd.

Carwyn Jones spoken in English p. 92

Carwyn Jones siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 92

I am grateful for the comments made today, and I ask the National Assembly to support the motion.

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar am y sylwadau a wnaed heddiw, a gofynnaf i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol gefnogi’r cynnig.

Cynnig NDM1094 Carwyn Jones t. 92

Motion NDM1094 Carwyn Jones p. 92

DerbyniwydAdopted O blaidFor 46 YmatalAbstain 0 Yn erbynAgainst 0

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Motion carried.

Sut y pleidleisiodd yr AelodauHow Members voted
O blaidFor (46)
  • Lorraine Barrett
  • Mick Bates
  • Peter Black
  • Nick Bourne
  • Eleanor Burnham
  • Alun Cairns
  • Christine Chapman
  • Cynog Dafis
  • Jane Davidson
  • David Davies
  • Geraint Davies
  • Ron Davies
  • Janet Davies
  • Sue Essex
  • Delyth Evans
  • William Graham
  • Janice Gregory
  • John Griffiths
  • Michael German
  • Alison Halford
  • Brian Hancock
  • Edwina Hart
  • Jane Hutt
  • Pauline Jarman
  • Ann Jones
  • Carwyn Jones
  • Elin Jones
  • Gareth Jones
  • Ieuan Wyn Jones
  • Helen Mary Jones
  • David Lloyd
  • Val Lloyd
  • Peter Law
  • David Melding
  • Tom Middlehurst
  • Jonathan Morgan
  • Rhodri Morgan
  • Alun Pugh
  • Jenny Randerson
  • Peter Rogers
  • Janet Ryder
  • Gwenda Thomas
  • Owen John Thomas
  • Rhodri Glyn Thomas
  • Dafydd Wigley
  • Phil Williams

Dadl Fer

Short Debate

Fferyllwyr Cymunedol

Community Pharmacists

Eleanor Burnham spoken in English p. 93

Eleanor Burnham siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 93

Lorraine Barrett, Geraint Davies and David Melding have asked to contribute to this debate. I begin by thanking Community Pharmacy Wales for its assistance in drafting this speech; Colleen Forse, its secretary, is present for today’s short debate.

Mae Lorraine Barrett, Geraint Davies a David Melding wedi gofyn am gael cyfrannu i’r ddadl hon. Dechreuaf drwy ddiolch i Fferylliaeth Gymunedol Cymru am ei gymorth wrth ddrafftio’r araith hon; mae Colleen Forse, yr ysgrifennydd, yn bresennol ar gyfer y ddadl fer heddiw.

Community pharmacists are essential in improving the health of the people of Wales. They have great expertise that is not being used to its full potential at present. There is huge scope for extending and expanding their role to relieve the pressure on other parts of the health service.

Mae fferyllwyr cymunedol yn hollbwysig yn y gwaith o wella iechyd pobl Cymru. Meddant ar arbenigedd helaeth nas defnyddir i’w eithaf ar hyn o bryd. Mae cyfle mawr i ymestyn ac ehangu eu rôl i leddfu’r pwysau ar rannau eraill o’r gwasanaeth iechyd.

According to the latest figures, there are 708 community pharmacies in Wales, and three out of five pharmacists practice in a community pharmacy. Community pharmacists deliver an important service and provide a vital point of contact for local people. They provide healthcare on the high street, dispensing medicines, counselling patients on the correct use of medicines, ensuring correct dosages and checking medicines against other drugs patients may be taking. Pharmacists are experts on drugs. They spend three years at university learning about their effects on the body. They are not just people behind a counter who count out pills into a bottle. They have expert knowledge and training, which is not being made the most of at present.

Yn ôl y ffigurau diweddaraf, mae 708 o fferyllfeydd cymunedol yng Nghymru, ac mae tri o bob pump o fferyllwyr yn ymarfer mewn fferyllfa gymunedol. Mae fferyllwyr cymunedol yn darparu gwasanaeth pwysig ac maent yn bwynt cyswllt hollbwysig i bobl leol. Darparant ofal iechyd ar y stryd fawr, gan ddosbarthu meddyginiaethau, cynghori cleifion ynghylch defnyddio meddyginiaethau’n gywir, sicrhau bod y dognau’n gywir a gwirio meddyginiaethau yn erbyn y cyffuriau eraill y gallai cleifion fod yn eu cymryd. Mae fferyllwyr yn arbenigwyr ar gyffuriau. Treuliant dair blynedd yn y brifysgol yn dysgu am eu heffeithiau ar y corff. Nid rhai y tu ôl i’r cownter sy’n cyfrif tabledi wrth eu rhoi mewn potel yn unig ydynt. Cawsant ddysg a hyfforddiant arbenigol nas defnyddir yn llawn ar hyn o bryd.

Community pharmacists also supply advice on medicines, symptoms and general health issues. They are involved in supporting promotional campaigns and performing screening tests such as those for blood pressure and measuring cholesterol levels.

Mae fferyllwyr cymunedol yn rhoi cyngor hefyd ar feddyginiaethau, symptomau a materion iechyd cyffredinol. Maent yn ymwneud â hybu ymgyrchoedd hysbysebol a chyflawni profion sgrinio fel y rhai ar gyfer pwysau gwaed a mesur lefelau colesterol.

However, community pharmacists do more than this. They advise on healthcare issues such as giving up smoking, healthy eating, exercise and family planning. This role should be expanded, so that health problems can be combated before they become serious and an issue for NHS treatment. The partnership Government’s emphasis on preventative medicine must be maintained and expanded. The lifestyle clinics run by community pharmacists could develop this. Such a clinic has been piloted in Neyland in Pembrokeshire over the last two years, and it is a great success. An article in The Western Mail on Tuesday noted how it had helped, among others, a 31-stone man who smoked and was a type 2 diabetic. Having attended the clinic for 14 months, his weight has halved—which is terrific—he has given up smoking and his diabetes is under control. That success story shows the important role of community pharmacists in reducing health problems before they reach the stage of NHS treatment.

Fodd bynnag, mae fferyllwyr cymunedol yn gwneud mwy na hynny. Maent yn cynghori ar faterion gofal iechyd fel rhoi’r gorau i ysmygu, bwyta’n iach, ymarfer a chynllunio teuluol. Dylid ehangu’r rôl hon, fel y gellir mynd i’r afael â phroblemau iechyd cyn iddynt fynd yn ddifrifol ac yn fater i’w trin gan y GIG. Rhaid parhau ac ehangu pwyslais y Llywodraeth bartneriaeth ar feddygaeth ataliol. Gellid datblygu hynny drwy’r clinigau ffordd o fyw sy’n cael eu rhedeg gan fferyllwyr cymunedol. Rhagbrofwyd clinig o’r fath yn Neyland yn sir Benfro dros y ddwy flynedd diwethaf, ac mae’n llwyddiant mawr. Nododd erthygl yn The Western Mail ddydd Mawrth sut yr oedd wedi helpu, ymysg eraill, ddyn 31 stôn a ysmygai ac a oedd yn ddiabetig math 2. Ar ôl mynychu’r clinig am 14 mis, mae ei bwysau wedi’u haneru—ac mae hynny’n wych—mae wedi rhoi’r gorau i ysmygu ac mae’r clefyd siwgwr dan reolaeth. Mae’r llwyddiant hwnnw’n amlygu rôl bwysig y fferyllwyr cymunedol yn y gwaith o leihau problemau iechyd cyn iddynt gyrraedd cyfnod pan fo angen eu trin gan y GIG.

Lifestyle clinics run by community pharmacists should be rolled out across Wales. It would be of great benefit if there were a lifestyle clinic to accompany every community pharmacy. Community Pharmacy Wales is making a bid for 40 more lifestyle clinics in Wales. I urge the Minister to support that bid, as it would be an excellent first step towards the vision of having lifestyle clinics in all communities.

Dylid ymestyn y clinigau ffordd o fyw sy’n cael eu rhedeg gan fferyllwyr cymunedol ledled Cymru. Byddai o fudd mawr pe bai clinig ffordd o fyw ochr yn ochr â phob fferyllfa gymunedol. Mae Fferylliaeth Gymunedol Cymru’n gwneud cais am 40 yn rhagor o glinigau ffordd o fyw yng Nghymru. Anogaf y Gweinidog i gefnogi’r cais hwnnw, gan y byddai’n gam cyntaf rhagorol tuag at y weledigaeth o gael clinig ffordd o fyw ym mhob cymuned.

It is not only overweight people or smokers who should be treated in lifestyle clinics. They should also cater for fit people, so that possible problems can be combated before they arise. Wales has one of the highest rates of heart disease in the western world. That is shameful. Community pharmacists could play a major role in combating this through their community expertise and links. They are key to ensuring the success of health promotion campaigns. They are also crucial in the distribution of promotional literature and they offer advice on healthcare issues. Many people feel far more comfortable seeking advice on general healthcare matters from their local pharmacist first, rather than going straight to their general practitioner. I remember thinking when my two children were young, that it was amazing how many people sought advice from the pharmacist. That is to be commended. Community pharmacists are also accessible, and people have regular contact with them. Approximately 100,000 people a day visit a community pharmacy in Wales. That statistic reveals the potential of community pharmacists in tackling communities’ lifestyle concerns, preventing ill health, saving resources in the long term and relieving the pressure on an already overloaded health service, particularly GPs.

Nid rhai rhy drwm neu ysmygwyr yw’r unig bobl y dylid eu trin mewn clinigau ffordd o fyw. Dylent ddarparu hefyd ar gyfer pobl heini, fel y gellir gwrthweithio problemau posibl cyn iddynt godi. Gan Gymru y mae un o’r cyfraddau uchaf o glefyd y galon yn y byd gorllewinol. Mae hynny’n gywilyddus. Gallai fferyllwyr cymunedol chwarae rhan o bwys wrth ymladd hynny drwy eu harbenigedd a’u cysylltiadau cymunedol. Maent yn hollbwysig hefyd wrth sicrhau llwyddiant ymgyrchoedd hybu iechyd. Maent yn hanfodol hefyd o ran dosbarthu deunydd darllen hysbysebol ac maent yn cynnig cyngor ar faterion gofal iechyd. Mae llawer o bobl yn teimlo’n fwy esmwyth o lawer yn ceisio cyngor ar faterion gofal iechyd cyffredinol gan eu fferyllydd lleol yn gyntaf, yn hytrach na mynd yn syth at eu hymarferwr cyffredinol. Cofiaf ryfeddu, pan oedd fy nau blentyn yn ifanc, at y nifer a geisiai gyngor gan y fferyllydd. Mae hynny i’w ganmol. Gellir cyrraedd fferyllwyr cymunedol yn rhwydd hefyd, ac mae pobl mewn cysylltiad â hwy’n rheolaidd. Mae tua 100,000 o bobl yn ymweld â fferyllfa gymunedol bob diwrnod yng Nghymru. Mae’r ystadegyn hwnnw’n amlygu potensial fferyllwyr cymunedol o ran trafod pryderon am ffyrdd o fyw mewn cymunedau, atal afiechyd, arbed adnoddau yn y tymor hir a lliniaru’r pwysau ar wasanaeth iechyd sydd eisoes dan ormod o faich, yn enwedig y meddygon teulu.

Community pharmacists’ skills and expertise are also underused in other ways. They are perfectly positioned to act as a bridge in pharmaceutical care between doctors and patients, and they are essential for the effective implementation of medicine management systems. Community pharmacists’ role in medicine management should be extended. That would benefit patients and the NHS. Community pharmacists have the expertise and access to patients to ensure more effective management of medicines. Patients would benefit from improved and more effective treatment, health and quality of life. They would also be more involved with their own treatment, with community pharmacists undertaking a regular review of medicines, thereby reducing unnecessary medicines and ensuring the dosage that best fulfils the patient’s requirements. Patients would have an improved understanding of their prescribed medicines and community pharmacists would support patients in taking their medicines correctly. When I was a domiciliary care manager in the social services, many elderly people in their own homes took multiple medications—often up to seven or eight medications. If community pharmacists were to take on a greater role in medicine management, those patients would be offered better assistance to take their medication correctly and more effectively. Also, the different dosages would be reviewed regularly and adjusted if necessary.

Defnyddir rhy ychydig ar sgiliau ac arbenigedd fferyllwyr cymunedol mewn pethau eraill. Maent mewn sefyllfa ddelfrydol i weithredu fel pont mewn gofal fferyllol rhwng y meddygon a’r cleifion, ac maent yn hollbwysig er mwyn gweithredu systemau rheoli meddyginiaethau’n effeithiol. Dylid ymestyn rôl y fferyllwyr cymunedol mewn rheoli meddyginiaethau. Byddai hynny o fudd i gleifion ac i’r GIG. Oherwydd eu harbenigedd a’u cysylltiad â chleifion, gall fferyllwyr cymunedol sicrhau rheolaeth fwy effeithiol ar feddyginiaethau. Byddai’r cleifion ar eu hennill o gael triniaeth well a mwy effeithiol o ran eu hiechyd ac ansawdd eu bywyd. Byddai iddynt fwy o ran hefyd yn eu triniaeth eu hunain, a byddai fferyllwyr cymunedol yn adolygu meddyginiaethau’n rheolaidd, gan leihau nifer y meddyginiaethau diangen a gofalu mai’r dogniad a nodir yw’r un sy’n diwallu anghenion y claf orau. Byddai’r cleifion yn cael gwell dealltwriaeth o’r meddyginiaethau a ragnodwyd ar eu cyfer a byddai’r fferyllwyr cymunedol yn helpu’r cleifion i gymryd eu meddyginiaethau’n gywir. Pan oeddwn yn rheolwr gofal yn y cartref yn y gwasanaethau cymdeithasol, yr oedd llawer o bobl oedrannus yn cymryd meddyginiaethau lluosol yn eu cartrefi—hyd at saith neu wyth meddyginiaeth mewn rhai achosion. Pe bai’r fferyllwyr cymunedol yn ymgymryd â rôl ehangach mewn rheoli meddyginiaethau, byddai’r cleifion hynny’n cael cynnig gwell cymorth i gymryd eu meddyginiaeth yn gywir ac yn fwy effeithiol. Hefyd, byddid yn adolygu’r gwahanol ddogniadau’n rheolaidd a’u newid os oedd angen.

If community pharmacists were given an extended role in medicine management, it would improve patient safety through the removal of discontinued medicines; the supply of matched quantities thus preventing hoarding; the provision of appropriate quantities, and the prevention of the mixing of drugs. All this would help to avoid medicines having adverse effects on patients. Pharmacists’ formal training should also encompass alternative medicine, including homeopathy and aromatherapy. My local pharmacist has been an expert homeopathist for many years. She has also been trained in aromatherapy. As a qualified aromatherapist, I believe that these two areas should be encompassed in training.

Pe câi’r fferyllwyr cymunedol rôl ehangach mewn rheoli meddyginiaethau, byddai hynny’n gwella diogelwch cleifion drwy gael gwared â meddyginiaethau y rhoddwyd y gorau i’w cymryd; cyflenwi niferoedd cyfatebol gan atal celcian; darparu niferoedd priodol, ac atal cymysgu cyffuriau. Byddai hyn i gyd o gymorth i osgoi effeithiau niweidiol gan feddyginiaethau ar gleifion. Dylai hyfforddiant ffurfiol y fferyllwyr gynnwys meddygaeth ddewisol hefyd, gan gynnwys homeopathi ac aromatherapi. Mae fy fferyllydd lleol yn homeopath arbenigol ers blynyddoedd lawer. Fe’i hyfforddwyd mewn aromatherapi hefyd. Fel aromatherapydd cymwysedig, credaf y dylid cynnwys y ddau faes hyn yn yr hyfforddiant.

The benefits to the NHS of extending the role of community pharmacists are as numerous as for patients. It would lead to happier, healthier patients receiving treatment in their community with their community pharmacist on hand to offer advice and regularly review the medicine being taken. There would be improved, more effective treatment and a better, more efficient use of national health service prescribing budgets. It would also mean the minimisation of costs, less wastage and improved repeat prescribing systems designed to suit the needs of the patient. The professional relationship between pharmacists and doctors would be improved. Furthermore, it would assist in meeting National Assembly targets and would connect our health policies with patients through better emphasis on delivering healthcare at the local community level.

Mae’r manteision i’r GIG o ymestyn rôl y fferyllwyr cymunedol yr un mor niferus â’r rhai i’r cleifion. O ganlyniad i hynny byddai’r cleifion yn hapusach ac yn iachach gan dderbyn triniaeth yn eu cymuned, a’u fferyllydd cymunedol wrth law i gynnig cyngor ac adolygu’r feddyginiaeth a gymerir yn rheolaidd. Byddai triniaeth well a mwy effeithiol a defnydd gwell a mwy effeithiol o gyllidebau rhagnodi’r gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol. Byddai hefyd yn golygu lleihau costau, llai o wastraff a gwell systemau ailragnodi a addaswyd yn unol ag anghenion y claf. Byddai gwell perthynas broffesiynol rhwng fferyllwyr a meddygon. Yn ogystal â hynny, byddai o gymorth i gyrraedd targedau’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol a byddai’n cysylltu ein polisïau iechyd â’r cleifion drwy roi gwell pwyslais ar ddarparu gofal iechyd ar lefel y gymuned leol.

Community pharmacy medicine management pilots are already in place, and will target coronary heart disease in the first instance. These must be taken forward and extended. Medicine management systems led by community pharmacists will keep down secondary care admissions and reduce waiting times.

Mae cynlluniau rheoli meddyginiaeth peilot ar waith eisoes mewn fferyllfeydd cymunedol, a byddant yn targedu clefyd coronaidd y galon yn y lle cyntaf. Rhaid bwrw ymlaen â’r rhain a’u hymestyn. Bydd systemau rheoli meddyginiaeth dan arweiniad fferyllwyr cymunedol yn gostwng nifer y derbyniadau i ofal eilaidd ac yn lleihau amseroedd aros.

Another area where community pharmacists can assist is in helping to reduce GPs paperwork. While GPs would continue to do the initial paperwork on patient treatment, the ongoing paperwork could be transferred to pharmacists.

Maes arall lle y gall fferyllwyr cymunedol fod o gymorth yw wrth helpu i leihau swm y gwaith papur sydd gan feddygon teulu. Er y byddai meddygon teulu’n parhau i wneud y gwaith papur dechreuol ar drin cleifion, gellid trosglwyddo’r gwaith papur dilynol i’r fferyllwyr.

When patients are issued with a prescription by a GP, the electronic prescribing system whereby the information is communicated electronically to community pharmacists is a way of increasing the effectiveness of patient treatment and communication between pharmacists and doctors. This would also improve the shared record keeping and ensure correct repeat prescriptions, as the necessary information would be on record. As GPs have notoriously bad handwriting, it could also reduce the eyestrain on pharmacists.

Mae’r system rhagnodi electronig, sy’n trosglwyddo gwybodaeth yn electronig i fferyllwyr cymunedol pan yw meddyg teulu’n rhoi presgripsiwn i gleifion, yn fodd i hybu effeithiolrwydd y driniaeth i gleifion a’r cyfathrebu rhwng fferyllwyr a meddygon. Byddai hyn yn fodd hefyd i gadw cofnodion ar y cyd yn well ac yn sicrhau bod ail bresgripsiynau’n gywir, gan y byddai’r wybodaeth angenrheidiol ar gofnod. Gan fod ysgrifen meddygon teulu’n ddiarhebol o wael, gallai leihau’r straen ar lygaid fferyllwyr hefyd.

The Liberal Democrat and Labour partnership Government is already working with community pharmacists to increase the uptake in prescriptions. In Wales, prescription charges have been frozen for the last two years and under 25-year-olds are exempt from charges. These policies are a result of the implementation of pledges in our partnership agreement. They are constructive, practical policies designed to assist the less well-off and achieve equal access for all to healthcare. They are also an example of the partnership Government pursuing a distinctively Welsh agenda.

Mae Llywodraeth bartneriaeth y Democratiaid Rhyddfrydol a Llafur eisoes yn gweithio gyda fferyllwyr cymunedol i gynyddu’r derbyniad o bresgripsiynau. Yng Nghymru, mae taliadau presgripsiwn wedi’u rhewi ers dwy flynedd ac mae rhai dan 25 mlwydd oed wedi’u heithrio rhag taliadau. Mae’r polisïau hyn yn ganlyniad i weithredu ar sail addewidion yn ein cytundeb partneriaeth. Maent yn bolisïau adeiladol, ymarferol sydd â’r amcan o gynorthwyo rhai llai cefnog a sicrhau mynediad cyfartal i bawb i ofal iechyd. Maent yn enghraifft hefyd o ddilyn agenda neilltuol Gymreig gan y Llywodraeth bartneriaeth.

The role of community pharmacists is of great importance to all our communities and can reduce the burden on an already overloaded national health service. Their role in promoting preventative health policies such as the development of lifestyle clinics and involvement in health promotion campaigns should be expanded and extended. Their skills, expertise and access to patients should be utilised in medicine management to improve patient treatment and take the pressure off other parts of the health service.

Mae rôl y fferyllwyr cymunedol yn bwysig iawn i’n holl gymunedau a gall ysgafnhau’r baich ar y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol, sydd dan ormod o bwysau eisoes. Dylid ehangu ac ymestyn eu rôl wrth hyrwyddo polisïau iechyd ataliol fel datblygu clinigau ffordd o fyw a chymryd rhan mewn ymgyrchoedd hybu iechyd. Dylid defnyddio eu sgiliau, eu harbenigedd a’u cysylltiad â chleifion wrth reoli meddyginiaeth er mwyn gwella’r driniaeth i gleifion ac ysgafnhau’r pwysau ar rannau eraill o’r gwasanaeth iechyd.

Lorraine Barrett spoken in English p. 97

Lorraine Barrett siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 97

I am grateful to Eleanor for allowing me to contribute. I should declare an interest as someone who needs to see a pharmacist—my eyes and my nose are suffering because of the air conditioning, so I apologise for sniffing. I have visited many pharmacies in my constituency, and I thank Community Pharmacy Wales for helping me to undertake that tour. I also congratulate it on its work in promoting the services provided by community pharmacists. I thank Eleanor for choosing this topic for her short debate, and I endorse all her comments. I welcome any moves to encourage and support pharmacists in playing a key role in the delivery of primary healthcare and health promotion, which is equally important. Like Eleanor, I make increasing use of pharmacists and I have complete confidence in the advice that they provide to me and my family. I have nothing further to add, as Eleanor has covered all aspects of this issue.

Yr wyf yn ddiolchgar i Eleanor am ganiatáu imi gyfrannu. Dylwn ddatgan buddiant fel un y mae arni angen mynd at fferyllydd—mae fy llygaid a’m trwyn yn dioddef oherwydd y system dymheru, felly ymddiheuraf am sniffian. Yr wyf wedi ymweld â llawer o fferyllfeydd yn fy etholaeth, a diolchaf i Fferylliaeth Gymunedol Cymru am fy helpu i ymgymryd â’r daith honno. Yr wyf finnau’n ei longyfarch ar ei waith yn hyrwyddo’r gwasanaethau a ddarperir gan fferyllwyr cymunedol. Diolchaf i Eleanor am ddewis y pwnc hwn i’w dadl fer, ac ategaf ei holl sylwadau. Croesawaf unrhyw gamau i annog a chynorthwyo fferyllwyr i chwarae rhan allweddol wrth ddarparu gofal iechyd sylfaenol a hybu iechyd, sydd yr un mor bwysig. Fel Eleanor, yr wyf yn defnyddio fferyllwyr fwyfwy ac mae gennyf bob hyder yn y cyngor a ddarparant i mi a’m teulu. Nid oes gennyf ddim pellach i’w ychwanegu, gan fod Eleanor wedi ymdrin â phob agwedd ar y mater hwn.

Geraint Davies spoken in English p. 98

Geraint Davies siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 98

I declare an interest as a pharmacist. I thank Eleanor for the opportunity to contribute to the debate and for acknowledging the important role of pharmacy in healthcare in the past and for the future. Pharmacists are ideally placed to address the health needs of communities. They are accessible, they are trusted by people and they know the patients and their needs. Unfortunately, as Eleanor said, they are not currently being used to their full potential. Pharmacy is a largely untapped expertise and there is great potential to expand it.

Datganaf fuddiant fel fferyllydd. Diolchaf i Eleanor am y cyfle i gyfrannu i’r ddadl ac am gydnabod rôl bwysig fferylliaeth mewn gofal iechyd yn y gorffennol ac ar gyfer y dyfodol. Mae fferyllwyr mewn sefyllfa ddelfrydol i allu ymdrin ag anghenion iechyd cymunedau. Gellir eu cyrraedd yn rhwydd, mae pobl yn ymddiried ynddynt ac maent yn adnabod y cleifion ac yn gwybod am eu hanghenion. Gwaetha’r modd, fel y dywedodd Eleanor, ni ddefnyddir hwy hyd eithaf eu potensial ar hyn o bryd. Mae fferylliaeth yn arbenigedd sydd heb ei gyffwrdd i raddau helaeth ac mae cyfle mawr i’w ehangu.

Medicines management is an important part of how we can improve the use of medicines to reduce the adverse effects of drugs, which is important. It would also save a tremendous amount of money. Another important element of medicine management is repeat prescriptions. Pharmacies are in an ideal situation to provide that service. It would reduce a great deal of the pressure placed on doctors. There is great concern in the profession about proposals to delay the legislation that would allow pharmacists to provide repeat prescriptions. Will the Minister reconsider those proposals, because it is important that the Assembly sends out a positive message that pharmacists should be members of the primary care team?

Mae rheoli meddyginiaethau’n rhan bwysig o’r modd y gallwn ddefnyddio meddyginiaethau’n well er mwyn lleihau effeithiau niweidiol cyffuriau, sy’n beth pwysig. Byddai hefyd yn arbed swm enfawr o arian. Elfen bwysig arall mewn rheoli meddyginiaeth yw ail bresgripsiynau. Mae fferyllfeydd mewn sefyllfa ddelfrydol i allu darparu’r gwasanaeth hwnnw. Gwnâi lawer i leihau’r pwysau ar feddygon. Mae pryder mawr yn y proffesiwn ynghylch cynigion i ohirio’r ddeddfwriaeth a fyddai’n caniatáu i fferyllwyr ddarparu ail bresgripsiynau. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ailystyried y cynigion hynny, gan ei bod yn bwysig bod y Cynulliad yn dweud yn bendant y dylai fferyllwyr fod yn aelodau o’r tîm gofal sylfaenol?

David Melding spoken in English p. 99

David Melding siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 99

I enjoyed Eleanor’s speech. I congratulate the Liberal Democrat press department because it got the speech into yesterday’s gallery report of Chamber proceedings: either the gallery service has been immensely prescient or it had an early lead.

Gwneuthum fwynhau araith Eleanor. Llongyfarchaf adran y wasg y Democratiaid Rhyddfrydol oherwydd llwyddodd i gael sylw i’r araith yn adroddiad yr oriel ar drafodion y Siambr ddoe: un ai yr oedd gwasanaeth yr oriel yn hynod o ragwybodol neu fe gafodd ei roi ar ben ffordd.

From my experience working in the voluntary sector, particularly for the Carers National Association, getting information distributed through pharmacies was helpful. It was also helpful if we needed to contact social workers, doctors and nurses. Most people applied for information leaflets through pharmacies. That is important when we consider improving preventative measures and getting people to take an interest in their condition or be aware of what help might be available to them. Pharmacists are often skilled at providing information and take a great deal of time to do so. Although they are not paid directly for that, it is an important public service, which they perform with enthusiasm.

Gwn o’m profiad o weithio yn y sector gwirfoddol, yn enwedig i Gymdeithas y Cynhalwyr, ei bod o gymorth cael dosbarthu gwybodaeth drwy fferyllfeydd. Yr oedd o gymorth hefyd os oedd arnom angen cysylltu â gweithwyr cymdeithasol, meddygon a nyrsys. Ymgeisiai’r rhan fwyaf o bobl am daflenni gwybodaeth drwy’r fferyllfeydd. Mae hynny’n bwysig pan ystyriwn wella mesurau ataliol a pheri i bobl ymddiddori yng nghyflwr eu hiechyd neu fod yn ymwybodol o’r hyn a allai fod ar gael iddynt. Mae fferyllwyr yn fedrus yn aml wrth ddarparu gwybodaeth a threuliant lawer iawn o amser yn gwneud hynny. Er na chânt eu talu’n uniongyrchol am hynny, mae’n wasanaeth cyhoeddus pwysig a gyflawnant yn frwdfrydig.

Jane Hutt The Minister for Health and Social Services spoken in English p. 99

Jane Hutt Y Gweinidog dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 99

I am delighted that Eleanor has given us the opportunity to discuss this important subject. Our plan, ‘Improving Health in Wales’, has set the direction for the health service in Wales over the next 10 years. Pharmacists have a key role to play. Like other health professionals, they are committed to ensuring that their services put the public, and patients who seek their help, at the forefront of healthcare delivery. My recognition of pharmacists and their role is reflected in the fact that I have appointed them to local health groups and the new local health boards. The chairs of two new local health boards in Wales are pharmacists. That shows the strength of our support for their role.

Yr wyf yn falch iawn bod Eleanor wedi rhoi cyfle inni drafod y pwnc pwysig hwn. Mae ein cynllun, ‘Gwella Iechyd yng Nghymru’, wedi pennu cyfeiriad y gwasanaeth iechyd yng Nghymru dros y 10 mlynedd nesaf. Mae rôl allweddol i’w chwarae gan fferyllwyr. Fel y gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol eraill, maent wedi ymrwymo i sicrhau bod eu gwasanaethau’n rhoi’r lle blaenaf i’r cyhoedd, a’r cleifion sy’n ceisio cymorth ganddynt, wrth ddarparu gofal iechyd. Adlewyrchir fy nghydnabyddiaeth o’r fferyllwyr a’u rôl gan y ffaith fy mod wedi’u penodi i’r grwpiau iechyd lleol ac i’r byrddau iechyd lleol newydd. Fferyllwyr yw dau o gadeiryddion y byrddau iechyd newydd yng Nghymru. Mae hynny’n dangos mor gryf yw ein cefnogaeth i’w rôl.

The future of pharmacy in primary care will depend on its ability to make the best use of pharmacists’ skills across the NHS, including community pharmacy. Community pharmacists play an important part in promoting health and preventing ill-health, medicines management, which was mentioned by Geraint, and the wider strategic issues of how we will take forward a pharmacy strategy for Wales. Our task is to work with the profession to develop its contribution to primary care. I agree that we need to take a more strategic approach to medicines management in Wales. Effective medicines management systems are essential to ensure that the NHS makes the best use of its medicines. Community pharmacists can play a key role in that, as was suggested in the task and finish group’s recommendations, which we are currently implementing. There are many examples across Wales of the effectiveness of advisory support services for general practitioners, such as prescribing advice, quality assurance and audit.

Bydd dyfodol fferylliaeth mewn gofal sylfaenol yn dibynnu ar ei gallu i wneud y defnydd gorau o sgiliau fferyllwyr ym mhob rhan o’r GIG, gan gynnwys fferylliaeth gymunedol. Mae fferyllwyr cymunedol yn chwarae rhan bwysig wrth hybu iechyd ac atal afiechyd, rheoli meddyginiaethau, y cyfeiriodd Geraint ato, a’r materion strategol ehangach sy’n ymwneud â’n dull o ddatblygu strategaeth fferylliaeth i Gymru. Y dasg i ni yw gweithio gyda’r proffesiwn i ddatblygu ei gyfraniad i ofal sylfaenol. Cytunaf fod angen inni ymdrin yn fwy strategol â rheoli meddyginiaethau yng Nghymru. Rhaid wrth systemau rheoli meddyginiaethau effeithiol i sicrhau bod y GIG yn gwneud y defnydd gorau o’i feddyginiaethau. Gall fferyllwyr cymunedol chwarae rhan allweddol yn hynny, fel yr awgrymwyd yn argymhellion y grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen, yr ydym yn eu gweithredu’n awr. Mae llawer o enghreifftiau ledled Cymru o effeithiolrwydd y gwasanaethau cymorth ymgynghorol i ymarferwyr cyffredinol, fel cyngor ar ragnodi, sicrwydd ansawdd ac archwilio.

As Lorraine and David said, pharmacists can directly support patients and carers by providing information about the use of medicines and the treatment of minor ailments. As Geraint said, developing repeat dispensing services could reduce the need for people to visit their GP on every occasion. I am sure that that is your experience in your practice, Geraint. I am pleased that the Cabinet Office’s Regulatory Impact Unit has been thinking along the same lines in the report that it published on Tuesday. We are moving in the right direction. As Eleanor said, the use of patient medication profiles can help to reduce the risk of adverse effects and interactions.

Fel y dywedodd Lorraine a David, gall fferyllwyr roi cymorth uniongyrchol i gleifion a gofalwyr drwy ddarparu gwybodaeth am ddefnyddio meddyginiaethau a thrin mân anhwylderau. Fel y dywedodd Geraint, byddai datblygu gwasanaethau ailweinyddu’n fodd i leihau’r angen i bobl fynd at eu meddyg teulu bob tro. Yr wyf yn sicr mai dyna’ch profiad yn eich practis chi, Geraint. Yr wyf yn falch bod Uned Effaith Reoliadol Swyddfa’r Cabinet yn cynnig syniadau tebyg yn yr adroddiad a gyhoeddodd ddydd Mawrth. Yr ydym yn symud i’r cyfeiriad iawn. Fel y dywedodd Eleanor, mae defnyddio proffiliau meddyginiaeth cleifion yn gallu bod o gymorth i leihau’r perygl o effeithiau a rhyngweithiadau niweidiol.

Many patients in residential and care homes could benefit from the support of pharmacists working more closely with social services and other health professionals. There are many examples of how pharmacists can help to promote health and wellbeing, which we have experienced ourselves by using local pharmacies. Many initiatives, such as smoking cessation and substance misuse schemes, and others to tackle weight problems, which was mentioned, are supported by local health groups and the local health boards, which will take them forward. We will progress with those initiatives. Work is also in hand to develop a prescribing role for pharmacists. Developing local pharmaceutical services can provide opportunities for local innovation in the provision of new services for patients, such as monitored dosage systems and delivering existing services in better ways.

Mae llawer o gleifion mewn cartrefi preswyl a gofal a allai gael budd o gymorth gan fferyllwyr a weithiai’n agosach â’r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol a gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol eraill. Mae llawer o enghreifftiau o’r modd y gall fferyllwyr helpu i hybu iechyd a lles, a brofasom ein hunain wrth ddefnyddio fferyllfeydd lleol. Cefnogir llawer o fentrau, fel cynlluniau rhoi’r gorau i ysmygu a chamddefnyddio sylweddau, ac eraill sy’n mynd i’r afael â phroblemau pwysau, y cyfeiriwyd atynt, gan y grwpiau iechyd lleol a’r byrddau iechyd lleol, a byddant yn parhau â hwy. Gwnawn gynnydd gyda’r mentrau hynny. Mae gwaith ar y gweill hefyd i ddatblygu rôl rhagnodi i fferyllwyr. Drwy ddatblygu gwasanaethau fferyllol lleol, gellir cynnig cyfleoedd i arloesi’n lleol wrth ddarparu gwasanaethau newydd i gleifion, fel systemau dogni dan arolygiaeth a dulliau gwell o ddarparu’r gwasanaethau presennol.

Brian Hancock spoken in English p. 101

Brian Hancock siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 101

On innovation and the service that community pharmacies provide, have you considered using rural post offices as centres where pharmacies can be set up?

Ynghylch arloesedd a’r gwasanaethau y mae fferyllfeydd cymunedol yn eu darparu, a ydych wedi ystyried defnyddio swyddfeydd post gwledig fel canolfannau i sefydlu fferyllfeydd?

Jane Hutt spoken in English p. 101

Jane Hutt siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 101

I recently opened a new pharmacy in Barry, which was on the same premises as a post office. Through partnership with Tesco, we managed to save a post office and a pharmacy by locating them in one building. It is an excellent community facility and I think that there are only one or two others in Wales. That is a good model for the rest of the country.

Agorais fferyllfa newydd yn y Barri’n ddiweddar, a oedd yn yr un adeilad â swyddfa bost. Drwy bartneriaeth â Tesco, llwyddasom i achub swyddfa bost a fferyllfa drwy eu lleoli mewn un adeilad. Mae’n gyfleuster cymunedol rhagorol a chredaf nad oes ond un neu ddau arall yng Nghymru. Mae hynny’n fodel da i weddill y wlad.

We must take this issue forward at a local and national level so that we can recognise the full potential of community pharmacy. We must consider issues such as joint training, accreditation, continuous professional development of pharmacists, and developing pharmacy premises, as Brian mentioned, to enable the provision of a wider range of services that provide confidentiality. That can include services such as advice and guidance, blood pressure and cholesterol testing and other diagnostic services.

Rhaid inni fwrw ymlaen â’r mater hwn ar lefel leol a chenedlaethol fel y gallwn gydnabod potensial llawn fferylliaeth gymunedol. Rhaid inni ystyried materion fel hyfforddi ar y cyd, achredu, datblygiad proffesiynol parhaus i fferyllwyr, a datblygu adeiladau ar gyfer fferyllfeydd, fel y dywedodd Brian, fel y gellir darparu amrediad ehangach o wasanaethau sy’n sicrhau cyfrinachedd. Gall hynny gynnwys gwasanaethau fel cyngor a chyfarwyddyd, profi pwysau gwaed a cholesterol a gwasanaethau diagnostig eraill.

We must also harness the potential of e-pharmacy to support the provision of pharmaceutical services. There is great enthusiasm for our scoping study on electronic prescribing, which we expect to be completed in the autumn. I am committed to that. There are long-standing issues on connecting community pharmacy to NHS networks, which I hope will be resolved.

Rhaid inni hefyd harneisio potensial e-fferylliaeth i helpu i ddarparu gwasanaethau fferyllol. Mae brwdfrydedd mawr ynghylch ein hastudiaeth gwmpasu ar ragnodi electronig, yr ydym yn disgwyl ei chwblhau yn yr hydref. Yr wyf wedi ymrwymo i hynny. Mae materion o dan ystyriaeth ers talwm ynghylch cysylltu fferylliaeth gymunedol â rhwydweithiau’r GIG, yr wyf yn gobeithio y cânt eu datrys.

We have a cordial and constructive relationship with the profession in Wales and with contractors’ representatives through Community Pharmacy Wales, whom I meet regularly. We do not agree on all issues, which is right. I expect them to represent their customers’ views robustly in negotiations. However, there is a great deal of common ground with regard to strategic vision. I acknowledge Community Pharmacy Wales’s contribution to our draft pharmacy strategy in Wales. It is at an advanced stage and I plan to publish it as a consultation document next month. This is the first attempt to produce an integrated strategy for all branches of the profession that make up the pharmacy family. The document will focus on the pharmaceutical needs of the individual and how they can be met. We will distribute the document widely in all fields of health and social care and to the users of pharmacy services. Many of Eleanor’s points pave the way for that consultation. The comments from the consultation will inform the final document and help shape the future of pharmacy in Wales over the next 10 years. Thank you, Eleanor, for starting the process and putting this issue on the agenda.

Mae gennym berthynas gyfeillgar ac adeiladol â’r proffesiwn yng Nghymru a chyda chynrychiolwyr y contractwyr drwy Fferylliaeth Gymunedol Cymru, yr wyf yn cyfarfod ag ef yn rheolaidd. Nid ydym yn cytuno ar bob mater, sy’n briodol. Disgwyliaf iddo sefyll yn gadarn dros farn ei gwsmeriaid mewn negodiadau. Er hynny, mae llawer iawn o dir cyffredin o ran y weledigaeth strategol. Cydnabyddaf gyfraniad Fferylliaeth Gymunedol Cymru i’n strategaeth fferylliaeth ddrafft yng Nghymru. Mae’n mynd rhagddi’n dda a bwriadaf ei chyhoeddi fel dogfen ymgynghorol y mis nesaf. Hon yw’r ymgais gyntaf i gynhyrchu strategaeth integredig i holl ganghennau’r proffesiwn yn y teulu fferyllol. Bydd y ddogfen yn canolbwyntio ar anghenion fferyllol yr unigolyn a’r modd y gellir eu diwallu. Byddwn yn dosbarthu’r ddogfen yn eang ym mhob maes iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol ac i ddefnyddwyr gwasanaethau fferyllol. Mae llawer o bwyntiau Eleanor yn paratoi’r ffordd ar gyfer yr ymgynghoriad hwnnw. Bydd y sylwadau o’r ymgynghoriad yn goleuo’r gwaith o baratoi’r ddogfen derfynol ac yn gymorth i lunio dyfodol fferylliaeth yng Nghymru dros y 10 mlynedd nesaf. Diolch i chi, Eleanor, am gychwyn y broses a rhoi’r mater hwn ar yr agenda.

John Marek The Deputy Presiding Officer spoken in English p. 102

John Marek Y Dirprwy Lywydd siaradwyd yn Saesneg t. 102

That brings today’s proceedings to a close.

Daw hynny â thrafodion heddiw i ben.

Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 12.35 p.m.

The session ended at 12.35 p.m.